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 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 251
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20 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attackPage 11 of 16    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16)

The feds felt he was cognizant enough to label him a self radicalized ISIS inspired terrorist. Go argue with them.

I agree. That pretty much sums it up. I roll my eyes when folks are So geared to argue that he's not a "lone wolf". Yeah, he was a lone wolf. Was he as lone-wolf as the Unabomber, living in the woods, not even talking to relatives? No. But that's rare. Did he alone plan it out and act on his own to the place He Hung out At? Yeah.

He was about as lone-wolf as McVeigh. He talked to people about it -- and heck, needed more insight on how to deal with bombs, transport, etc -- rather than just buying a gun and walking in a place mowing down people.

Being inspired online by a fundamentalist group promoting a 'holiday' of doing terrorist attacks around that time, and carrying out oneself -- it's as lone-wolf as that. People can carry out lone-wolf attacks inspired by fundamentalist groups -- whether it's bombing an abortion clinic, or opening fire on a crowded gay bar.

I don't see why there's this inspiration to Not call it a lone-wolf thing -- even at the risk of skewing the real story behind it. Is it because one thinks saying "lone wolf" = "not radicalized muslim attack"? IMO, it's both. Certainly one doesn't negate the other. ISIS gets credit for inspiring him, sure. But a person or group can inspire lone-wolf attacks.
 _babblefish
Joined: 9/23/2011
Msg: 252
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/20/2016 10:26:41 AM

Can somebody explain to me why it matters what the motivation of this guy was?


“There is a strong impulse, particularly in America, to ‘do something’ after a tragedy like this,” said Will McCants, a terrorism expert at the Brookings Institution in Washington. “If we know why the tragedy happened, we’ll know what to do.”

to live in a world where these questions have identifiable answers, and politicians are happy to tell you that they do, so that they can present themselves as the solution . .

"The “radical Islam” narrative, of all those available, offers perhaps the clearest appeal. It portrays attackers and potential attackers as a monolith, identifiable by common features that are alien to America’s non-Muslim majority. And it frames terrorism within the familiar context of a war — something that can be won."
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 253
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49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/20/2016 2:02:49 PM
This guy...

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-orlando-clubgoers-guns-nra-000000619.html

“When I said that if, within the Orlando club, you had some people with guns, I was obviously talking about additional guards or employees,” Trump tweeted on Monday.

But what did he say LAST Monday?

“It’s too bad some of the people killed over the weekend didn’t have guns attached to their hips, where bullets could have thrown in the opposite direction,” Trump said on Howie Carr’s conservative syndicated radio show the day after the shootings. “Had people been able to fire back, it would have been a much different outcome.”

After somehow getting chastised by the NRA for advocating too *little* gun control, Trump changed his story. Well, he didn’t so much as change his story, but tell *us* (all of us) that we were “obviously” misinterpreting his remarks. He’s never wrong. 95% of the country (you know, all but the 5% that voted for him in the primaries) is just continuously hearing him wrong. He’s a piece of work, I tell ya. And he’s obviously just spouting out whatever he thinks is going to play well to his “base,” but in this case, not realizing that even the NRA thinks it’s a bad idea for drinkers to have guns:

“No one thinks that people should go into a nightclub drinking and carrying firearms,” Chris Cox, executive director of the NRA’s Institute for Legislative Action, told ABC’s “This Week” Sunday. “That defies common sense.”

Trump defying common sense? Say it ain’t so! (BTW, the nightclub did have a sober armed security, an off-duty police officer who apparently lost a shootout with Mateen on his way into the club – of course, Mateen had an AR-15 vs. the cop’s pistol... anyway, on Trump’s revision, bartenders and DJs are too likely to be drinking on the job to be packing heat, and there’s a question of how many guards does your typical bar or club need anyway, but I am somewhat surprised the manager or the club’s own private security didn’t have guns, because that’s pretty standard. Shooting in the dark with customers all around the murderer is easier said than done, obviously.)

“Can somebody explain to me why it matters what the motivation of this guy was?”

In addition to repeating what I said in my previous post, I agree with babblefish’s last post.

This is pretty interesting (yeah, I know what conservatives will say about the source, but this source is getting its sources from LEO investigators):

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/06/18/482621690/investigators-say-orlando-shooter-showed-few-warning-signs-of-radicalization
 daynadaze
Joined: 2/11/2008
Msg: 254
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49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/20/2016 2:42:42 PM
Which leads to the question...what exactly is it that his base is hearing & voting for?
 kj521
Joined: 9/20/2015
Msg: 255
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/20/2016 4:33:10 PM
^^^^^^^Traitor!!! Get back to painting the roses red! ;)
 softwinds45
Joined: 6/9/2016
Msg: 256
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/20/2016 4:33:12 PM
^^^ What about the carnage from the Bush family and the republicans?

If you wanted a breath of fresh air, why get a lying windbag egotist like Trump?
 daynadaze
Joined: 2/11/2008
Msg: 257
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49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/20/2016 5:48:58 PM
And what would that wreckage be? What was ruined, after being built up (I'll assume by a republican) then built up again and wrecked again?
 Sweet_Danimal
Joined: 10/31/2015
Msg: 258
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49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/20/2016 10:35:37 PM
It take no talent whatsoever to be on a wrecking crew. Any moron with a sledge hammer can tear stuff down in minutes. What takes talent is doing so in a way that doesn't create a lasting mess, disturb the neighbors, or cause damage like leaky pipes that will cost a fortune to fix later down the line. Elections in general are so much about bashing the competition, without any regard for what might actually get done. It's pathetic.

Same goes for a 'terrorist'. Anyone can learn how to operate an assault rifle in minutes. It doesn't take talent to enter a crowded venue and mow people down. Special kind of crazy, maybe - but not skill, or training or much planning. We now have a massive mess of dead bodies, legal matters, and a business that will never recover. Blame other parties if you want. Blame history, blame parents, blame religion, ethnicity or moral values - it doesn't matter. It was one guy swinging a very large hammer. It may have been a specific group of people that paid with their lives, but the mess is still there, and it still needs to be cleaned up. And it's our tax dollars that end up doing it.
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 259
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49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 12:00:52 AM

Donald Trump's base is fed up with the lies and falsehoods that have come out of the Obama administration.

Like where Obama was born? :) Look, we can point out to purposeful bending-the-truths and lying and all that in all administrations. I wouldn't put Obama on top #1 -- as the complaints about him are his policies and the direction that conflicts with what conservatives want, and him not cooperating enough with the Republicans (and complaints about Republicans not cooperating and playing political games, etc etc).

So Trump comes in. Lies and falsehoods -- he's racking up a million yard list. And he actually has people believe he's not some "elite" politician (whatever the hell that means), while he's running for office as a politician -- and he thinks of himself as the most Elite person on God's green earth. I've had conversations with some friends who are going to vote for Trump. And they don't deny that, and they know how he is -- but they want things to shake up and to change for their reason, and understand there's risks but that's a whole other story. Point is, the scary part is people are actually Looking Up to him as a man of integrity. Not that that's so much required for politicians these days or in yesteryear, but my warning is not to get snowed that he is an honest straight-shooter. Never fall for someone who "shoots from the hip" in how they talk and "says it like it is" in the way they come across and do to some extent -- with someone who doesn't lie and make stuff up. His lie-list is enormous, even by politician standards.

I think his supporters see him as refreshing after the wreckage of the Obama/Clinton years.

... and Bush, too. To Republicans, ANY Republican candidate would be refreshing over the last two Dem presidents. The reason Trump's gotten a lot of support is because he's refreshing over Republicans, too. Heck, you had wacko-bird Cruz running and that'd be a big change, and even he wasn't wanted. Part of the reason his voters have been bigger than expected is that it includes people who chuckle & roll their eyes at him -- BUT do want change for the sake of it (while not wanting Cruz by any means), and yes, he brings that. Much the same reason many people voted for Sanders who goes by the beat of his own drum, too.
 AgentNinety9
Joined: 6/9/2016
Msg: 260
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 5:08:15 AM

Donald Trump's base is fed up with the lies and falsehoods that have come out of the Obama administration. Hillary Clinton is an extension of Obama's policies.

As if voting for anyone anywhere on the ticket will stop the FBI from giving clearances to the weirdos on their watch list. Isitislam/anti-gay/automatic weapons. We hit the mothereffing trifecta for handwringing, wag-the-dog political rhetoric and pretend solutions to controlled narratives. Which candidate do you suppose will begin the proper culling of the corrupt (or, to be more charitable, incompetent) body of federal law enforcement that we have in this country? That's right none of them.
 chinook1111
Joined: 4/1/2016
Msg: 261
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 5:25:18 AM

All the wreckage that supporting Saudi Arabia in their quest to unseat Assad has brought. The wreckage of human misery spreading all over Europe and Canada seeking refuge.

Don't forget the destruction of Libya,now a prime candidate for radicals to populate if they get pushed out of Syria and Iraq.

Is that enough wreckage?

@Danimal

And you are right,it takes no talent to be part of a wrecking crew.
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 262
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 7:48:06 AM
as babble pointed out, the reason the Trumpets want to consider motive, is they want a solution to future issues. But their "solution" merely creates a false sense of security. And speaking of security, as Hawking pointed out, the NRA's "good guy with a gun" WAS THERE to stop things, and golly gosh gee, a cop trained to shoot was outgunned. Hmm, there goes that argument, too.

what is the Chump base hearing and voting for? Simplistic solutions. Doesn't matter if they work, we just wanna feel good. And lashing out doesn't feel bad, either. give us emotion, not policy. And that's what concerns both sides of the political process. We need smart solutions to the problems of this powerful nation, not rabble rousing. not catering to the lowest common denominator. The White House should not be a Jerry Springer show.

Chump's fanbase is annoyed with what's coming out of the Obama administration? They seem to be disgusted with what's coming out of their own GOP and landing on their heads. Wreckage of the past democratic administrations, indeed, Chump has blasted Bush for going into Iraq! Could you imagine five years ago, any Republican candidate doing that?The Bush family is so tied into Saudi Arabia, sponsor of so many of these groups, they nicknamed one of the big cheeses "Bandar Bush", I think that's the reference Chinook was making. Try to interview a Republican congressman about Chump, and the representative ducks into a room to avoid going on record. Its just funny as hell they are scared of the Frankenstein they've worked so hard to create since the days of Rush Windbag. The GOP wanted an anti-establishment candidate, they just never recognized they ARE the establishment. Oops, yet again.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 263
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49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 8:20:22 AM
“Donald Trump's base is fed up with the lies and falsehoods that have come out of the Obama administration. Hillary Clinton is an extension of Obama's policies. Trump's base is also tired of some Republicans not showing a backbone in standing up to Obama's rhetoric and divisiveness. I think his supporters see him as refreshing after the wreckage of the Obama/Clinton years.”

In other words, Trump’s is the base of anger. If you are angry (about pretty much anything), then you are for the man who is angry about everything.

Yet most people aren’t angry about their own lives. They’re pretty darn satisfied with their lives. They’re just angry about OTHER people’s lives and what might BECOME of their own lives. There is a weird disconnect between self-satisfaction and what people perceive as the direction of the country:

http://time.com/4296805/american-anger-poll-donald-trump/

“Republicans are more likely than Democrats to be angry with the government, and those Republicans who are angry are more supportive of GOP front-runner Donald Trump, the poll found. A majority of Americans (71%) said they think the country is headed in the wrong direction. Nearly 8 in 10 Americans (78%) said they are dissatisfied or angry with the federal government, an Associated Press–GfK poll found. But at the same time, a greater percentage (84%) of respondents said they are enthusiastic or satisfied with their personal relationships, and 77% said the same about their career. Sixty-four percent said they are satisfied with their financial situation.”

So exactly why is it that these people are so angry if their lives are hunky-dory? Some people just aren’t happy unless they are angry. During the couple of years preceding the Great Recession, dissatisfaction was regularly as high as now, despite the fact that Republicans were in control of government – 70% dissatisfaction even though approximately 50% of people supported Republicans. Interestingly, the most satisfied the country has been in recent years was while Bill Clinton was being impeached! 70% satisfied in 1998/1999. Which helps you to understand why so many Democrats think it would be a good idea to have another Clinton in office. Back in those days, the electorate wasn’t quite so partisan as now – if life was good, then government was good, even if you were supportive of the opposition party. Now life can’t be good enough, no matter who is in office.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/1669/general-mood-country.aspx

One of my favorite episodes from the 2008 election was this one:

http://www.politico.com/story/2008/10/mccain-obama-not-an-arab-crowd-boos-014479

>>>“Come on, John!” one audience member yelled out as the Republican crowd expressed dismay at their nominee. Others yelled "liar," and "terrorist," referring to Obama.
McCain passed his wireless microphone to one woman who said, "I can't trust Obama. I have read about him and he's not, he's not uh — he's an Arab. He's not — " before McCain retook the microphone and replied: "No, ma'am. He's a decent family man [and] citizen that I just happen to have disagreements with on fundamental issues and that's what this campaign's all about. He's not [an Arab]." Each time he tried to cool the crowd, he was rewarded with a round of boos. "I have to tell you. Sen. Obama is a decent person and a person you don’t have to be scared of as president of the United States," McCain told a supporter at a town hall meeting in Minnesota who said he was “scared” of the prospect of an Obama presidency and of who the Democrat would appoint to the Supreme Court<<<

See the difference between McCain and Trump? Can you even imagine Trump saying anything at all positive about any opponent? People like that woman are what have powered Trump to his current status, and he has been feeding them raw meat along the way. A woman speaks a lie about the Democratic nominee and McCain tells her she’s a liar – THAT is a statesman, THAT is presidential, THAT is doing the right thing, even though it got him booed and called a “RINO.” Trump doesn’t even wait for somebody to lie about the Democratic nominee – he just makes up it up himself. See how far the GOP has fallen in 8 years? From anger and hatred within the party being condemned to anger and hatred ruling the party. Heck, even McCain got sucked into it. Blame Obama all you want, but sooner or later the GOP is going to have to look in the mirror. And remember: that Politico story was from BEFORE Obama was elected. These Republicans were angry and crazy long before he got into office. They just weren’t in control of the party. Is that Obama’s fault that they’re now in charge or is it because moderates have been fleeing the GOP as it has gotten angrier, madder and more hateful?
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 264
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 9:37:17 AM
Left learners think that anger is a bad word and throw it at people who have expressed no anger because they view it as an insult.

Trump supporters don't really care if you call them angry, phobic, racist, stupid, etc, etc. The more that is done the more desperate Trump haters seem. And the low level nicknames for Trump also smells of desperation

No one is planning to stop or stopped and fought with supporters of Hillary like left learners have stopped, fought with and harassed Trump supporters.

People who support Trump don't want more of the same policies or more of the same Supreme Court appointees. That is what they will get with Clinton. It is that simple.
 daynadaze
Joined: 2/11/2008
Msg: 265
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49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 10:02:55 AM
They don't want more of the same...so they want what?
 memtoo
Joined: 6/2/2016
Msg: 266
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 10:05:05 AM

People who support Trump don't want more of the same policies or more of the same Supreme Court appointees. That is what they will get with Clinton. It is that simple.


People who support Trump are people who want an authoritarian father figure to tell them everything is okay and he will protect them. Its that simple.

Many people who do not support Trump see him for what he is, a vile man, a Grifter, a demagogue, an authoritarian, a divider, a mean-spirited, vindictive piece of crap who does not deserve to be a dog-catcher let alone President.
 memtoo
Joined: 6/2/2016
Msg: 267
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 10:08:58 AM
Bill Maher this past Friday . . New Rules. He has this guy down cold:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQ8on8s0Hfk
 Walts
Joined: 5/7/2005
Msg: 268
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 10:14:54 AM

They don't want more of the same...so they want what?


Just something different.

That's it.

Only problem is there is not enough of actual thinking to come up with that "difference". Though, I guess building a wall is different. And I guess pointing fingers at everyone except themselves is okay to. And I guess, yelling at the top of your lungs spewing shiat, is kinda different to. Yeah, I can see why the supporters of Trump are actually supporting. They seem to see the "difference".
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 269
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49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 10:45:03 AM
“Trump supporters don't really care if you call them angry, phobic, racist, stupid, etc, etc.”

Exactly – why argue with something you are?

“Left learners think that anger is a bad word and throw it at people who have expressed no anger because they view it as an insult.”

What are you talking about? MANY Trump supporters have declared themselves to be angry. Again: “Republicans are more likely than Democrats to be angry with the government, and those Republicans who are angry are more supportive of GOP front-runner Donald Trump, the poll found.” You’re trying to tell me that YOU are not angry about what you think Obama’s done to this country and what you think Clinton’s going to do to this country? Frankly, I don’t think most Trump supporters’ anger has anything to do with what Obama has done, because, as evidenced by what happened to McCain, they were angry long before Obama was elected.

To be fair there are those on the left who are also angry about the thought of what Trump could do to this country, though I would suggest that’s more fear than true anger. Most of the people who are creating issues at Trump rallies are young people who don’t know any better – they don’t yet understand that protesting of that sort won’t change a damn thing and if anything makes their cause look questionable. Most of Trump’s angry supporters are older people who SHOULD know better, but they have been angry their whole lives about their lots in life and always need someone to blame, so they will never change.

I actually think Trump supporters (and I’m talking about those who voted for him in the primary, not the ones currently feeling forced to support him as the lesser of two evils, particularly as it relates to the Supreme Court) are worse than terrorists. There are at most 2.6 million radical Islamic terrorists in this country (and we all know it is FAR lower than that), but there are about 13 million angry Trump supporters and they are currently driving the national agenda. They are fueling a massive amount of hate, from Hispanics, from blacks, from gays, and, yes, from Muslims – they are turning this country into a powder keg, so it shouldn’t be surprising when somebody snaps every now and then on either side and mows down a bunch of people or tries to take out Trump with a policeman’s gun. You really think they can say all those negative things about ethnic groups and them not have consequences? You think YOU can say negative things about Hispanics, Muslims and gays and it not upset those people? You think what you’re saying is not from a place of anger? There’s a way to discuss controversial policies and not fuel anger – Bush knew how to do it, McCain knew how to do it, Romney knew how to do it – Trump does not know how to do it, which I know is a positive point to his supporters, but it does not benefit a peace-desiring society.

*

Interesting article from the Orlando Sentinel:

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/pulse-orlando-nightclub-shooting/ct-omar-mateen-muslims-donald-trump-0160620-story.html

The FBI verifies that it was a non-radical Muslim immigrant who brought Mateen to their attention to the second time (in relation to Moner). He sounds a little bothered that he is being thrown out with the bathwater. Just keep fanning the flames, Trump, and we’ll see if you end up with different results than Obama from the Muslim community. (This article also gives you an interesting insight to Mateen's life prior to the massacre.)
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 270
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 11:14:23 AM
The field was shifted again.

So now angry is OK.
Fine. Whatever.

They don't care, whether angry or not, that you call them angry.

"Worse than terrorists" just put the exclamation point on "smells like trump hater desperation."

And Trump haters can say that they don't want Trump but people can't say that they don't want Hillary. Semantics. Again, desparation.

And to what ethnic group, that you give license to use violence in response to words, did that chap from england belong? Or does he not count?

Also, were the 9-11 terrorists simply troubled souls and not terrorists? What about that man and his wife who killed people in California?

How do you distinguish them from Orlando? Just wondering.

Below
Back to liberal debate tactic number 52- "I don't understand what you are saying, i. e.., you have no valid reply."

Fine.
 _babblefish
Joined: 9/23/2011
Msg: 271
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 11:16:59 AM

“Left learners think that anger is a bad word and throw it at people who have expressed no anger because they view it as an insult.”



What are you talking about?


who knows, if you blow the guano dust off dee's past postings y'all will see she actively accuses everyone that doesn't
agree with her . . .angry, anger good? anger bad?

*i wanna know why some entrepreneurial conservative hasn't thought of selling (your name here) stamped bricks for the wall, yanno boost those campaign funds
 memtoo
Joined: 6/2/2016
Msg: 272
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 11:24:01 AM
^^^^ they are selling Trump Toilet Paper to wipe your ***. I may have to pick up a few rolls myself.

https://www.amazon.com/Donald-Trump-Toilet-Paper-Collectible/dp/B0163B2FBG

Trump is so bad, I really do wonder how gets any support at all.
 memtoo
Joined: 6/2/2016
Msg: 273
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 11:46:44 AM
Trump deserves all of the protests he gets. He is a terrible man and would be a terrible President. We cannot give this pathologicaly ill man the nuclear codes. He would possibly be worse than George W Bush, perhaps the worst President EVER to date.

As for Obama, nobody can articulate why he was a bad President. He did a decent job despite the most dysfunctional Congress ever.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 274
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49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 12:21:13 PM
“And Trump haters can say that they don't want Trump but people can't say that they don't want Hillary.”

Again, what are you talking about? Who said you can’t be anti-Hillary? Nobody here said that. In fact, a lot of likely Clinton voters here have said they DON’T want to do it but consider her the lesser of two evils, like many likely Trump voters are saying about voting for him.

“And to what ethnic group, that you give license to use violence in response to words, did that chap from england belong?”

Trump is EXTREMELY anti-immigrant. The England chap is an illegal immigrant. That’s about as direct cause-reaction as you can get.

“Also, were the 9-11 terrorists simply troubled souls and not terrorists? What about that man and his wife who killed people in California? How do you distinguish them from Orlando?”

Are you reading anything I’ve written? I said multiple times Farook is by far the best example of your American-born radical Islamic terrorist bogeyman that we’ve had so far. But I also said he was quite atypical and currently the exception, not the rule, with far greater concerns in this country at the moment than a repeat of that scenario.

The 9-11 hijackers were part of a major terrorist cell and are a completely different discussion. But it’s important to note that nothing of this sort has repeated itself – I don’t mean simply the scope of it, but the means by which they accomplished their act of terror has not been repeated, because the country took sufficient safeguards to prevent it from happening. That said, Paris was obviously a very similar occurrence in many ways and no doubt the French were doing many of the same things we’re now doing, yet that one slipped through, as did the Madrid bombings a few years before. So I’m not about to sit here and pretend like we’re completely safe from ISIS or Al-Qaida sending diehard terrorists into this country and committing another such atrocity. But I do think both the Bush administration and the Obama administration have done a good job of ferreting out such activity since 9/11.

The bigger question on this subject continues to be what we're going to about ISIS the "country," because poll-after-poll on the subject shows there's very little stomach in this country to get back into another hot war -- the Republicans have been in control of both houses for almost two years and could have declared war or authorized ground troops anytime during that period. So why haven't they?

“I doubt that quote(the second half) sank McCain's chances, but it didn't help.”

So let me get this straight: some people decided to vote for Obama instead of McCain because they were upset that McCain called Obama a “decent person”? Or are you suggesting those people decided to sit out that election because McCain wasn’t angry and partisan enough for them but now they’re back in the voting game because Trump is angry and partisan enough? Did you vote for McCain and Romney? Did all of your Republican friends vote for McCain and Romney? Just how many friends do you have that didn’t vote for either of them but will be voting for Trump?

“And Trump supporters don't deserve the violence and hatred directed at them just because of their views.”

I don’t disagree, but when you preach hatred and violence, what do you think is going to happen?

“Many in this country had concern that electing a leftist to the highest office would be detrimental. As the last seven and a half years have shown, those concerns were well founded.”

Explain how Obama was re-elected in the middle of that seven-and-a-half years? Surely with all the leftist stuff that happened in the first four years, the country would have shifted in the other direction in 2012 if there were that many concerned.

Here’s the thing: many people are highly misinterpreting Clinton barely edging out Trump in the polls. That’s not a repudiation of leftist policies, liberalism or the Obama administration. That’s a repudiation of Clinton herself. Bernie Sanders is a self-declared socialist and far to the left of even Clinton and he’s often beating Trump and basically any other GOP contender nearly 2 to 1 in the polls. This country has gone “left” and it’s probably not coming back – the majority of the people are satisfied with Obama and his left-of-center policies. If Clinton somehow loses, it will be because of her legal problems, her Wall Street connections, her personality, her husband's issues, the dynasty concern – and maybe because she isn’t even far enough to the left for this country anymore. A very good liberal candidate would almost certainly beat the hell out of a very good conservative candidate. But that will have to wait for 2020 or 2024 because right now we have a very bad liberal candidate against a very very bad (supposedly) conservative candidate, and God knows what that’s going to result in.
 woobytoodsday
Joined: 12/13/2006
Msg: 275
49 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/21/2016 1:19:34 PM
I don't think that a protest actually means anger. Though it certainly may. But reading that guy's tweets from the Greensboro rally, the anger, the hate, and the violence seem directed AT the protesters, rather than the other way 'round. The children of the Trump-ets didn't seem to fare all that well, either.
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