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Show ALL Forums  > Off Topic  > 20 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack      Home login  
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 overunity
Joined: 8/16/2014
Msg: 126
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20 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attackPage 6 of 16    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16)
For some reason I'm reminded of the ending of the 1977 movie Looking For Mr. Goodbar.
 memtoo
Joined: 6/2/2016
Msg: 127
20 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 9:37:15 AM

A lot of people, namely younger people, who go bat-sh!t p!ssed about that stuff tend to have homosexual tendencies they're struggling with while coming from a conservative background


All due respect, but this is just more evidence of people talking out of their ****oles.



Another anonymous source?


Who has more anonymous sources but your boy . . . what with his always hearing things he brings to our attention.
 kj521
Joined: 9/20/2015
Msg: 128
20 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 9:40:21 AM

"^^ Sorry Ms. KJ, said tongue in cheek. We can't and we shouldn't and we never will. "We" need to just quit blaming ALL for the actions of some."


I quite agree, Red. As I have quite a few Persian friends (don't quite know if they identify as Muslim or not ) I feel it is important to distinguish between radical Islamic extremists and Muslims.
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 129
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50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 9:41:53 AM
It's not just mere anonymous heresay about him being gay. This stuff is coming out. Sure, the NY Post likes excitement, but they're a conservative paper. Also, lots of other places showing this out.

http://nypost.com/2016/06/13/shooter-used-to-visit-orlando-gay-club-use-gay-dating-apps/

http://abcnews.go.com/US/witnesses-orlando-shooter-regular-gay-clubs/story?id=39839464

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen-was-gay-former-classma/nrfwW/

And much of this is early. This sheds light on the whys/hows -- him struggling with is identity and coming from a conservative household and by accounts of others he was an a-hole.

Of course this is only the first couple days into it -- we'll learn a lot more as time comes.
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 130
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 9:45:52 AM
Amaze

The brilliance of this latest propaganda and counter - it is not islam- innuendo is it doesn't matter what is discovered or said about him.

He didn't like gay people? He was gay.

He had gay friend? He was gay.

The brilliance of a good propaganda game. Not to mention the "glob on" effect.
Again, why does it matter except to remove attention from the real issue.

Having Maddow, Levin, Roberts, Lemon, , Cooper,etc helps disseminate the "news"
Simple fact.

In any event, his being gay, if proven, doesn't negate the extreme Islamist fact and circumstances.

Whether he was gay or not is irrelevant except to change the subject.
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 131
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50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 9:53:32 AM

The brilliance of this latest propaganda and counter - it is not islam- innuendo is it doesn't matter what is discovered or said about him.

Oh no, it definitely wouldn't be there if not for his religious views -- otherwise no struggle of being gay in the first place. Coming from a conservative background that's anti-gay -- and then cranking it up trying to find his identity and reading/writing online to ISIS crap which goes beyond just merely conservative Islam -- to then carry out something in his life to give himself purpose -- projecting it toward where he hung out for years and what is sin and what he struggled with, to make up for it in the name of Allah.

But if he wasn't struggling with being gay? Yeah, it wouldn't have happened either for him to go down the road. Everything's not necessarily simpleton stuff. :)
 memtoo
Joined: 6/2/2016
Msg: 132
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 10:04:34 AM
What's the fu^king difference why this guy did what he did. Psycho, gay, terrorist . . . the point is that our Congress sucks the teets of the NRA:

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/5946127/ns/politics/t/congress-lets-assault-weapons-ban-expire/#.V2A4Y7srKM8
 villabolos
Joined: 7/24/2015
Msg: 133
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 10:08:33 AM
Exactly to the above posts.

Whenever something does not go along with their playbook, they attempt to twist and turn it until it feels right in their heads.
They want to hang Bill Cosby, but they are going to vote for Hillary in November...
Just read the drunken fool irish's posts. He does things like ask questions...then when you give him an answer he can't deal with, he twists and turns it in his head to try and cover up for what he asked about.(Obama couldn't work with people to get it done -he was not good enough at it - he could not make it happen)


They will never,ever,ever admit that they may even be slightly wrong.
They are obsessed with trying to bring down Trump(one fool on here went on about how he hates his red hair), all the while they are accepting of everything Hillary.

Islam and western civilization are not compatible. As Fullmoonguy also said, they have been fighting(killing) amongst themselves for 1,300 years as well.
But when they take over Great Britain,it will all suddenly be different.
 Sweet_Danimal
Joined: 10/31/2015
Msg: 134
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50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 10:09:35 AM

Whether he was gay or not is irrelevant except to change the subject.

Bullsh1t. The motivating factors for the Columbine shooters had nothing to do with extremist Islam. Nothing. It was a combination of a LOT of factors - ignorant parents, goth culture, video games, music, bullying, access to weapons - fingers have been pointed in a bajillion different directions. Bottom line is that a SERIES of events led to two boys taking bombs and guns to their school and killing a bunch of people. A 'perfect storm' of dysfunctionality, if you will. Any one of a number of things could have gone better to change the outcome - but it didn't.

How is this ANY different? Why do people insist on finding ONE specific factor that made ALL the difference - and crucifying it? If this dude had maybe one or two things in his life go positive instead of negative, he very well have been another VICTIM dancing at the club when someone ELSE decided to shoot it up.

Go ahead and keep pointing fingers. Go ahead and keep finding OTHER things to blame. This dude was a combination of several dysfunctional factors, and chose extreme violence to solve it. Any one of those factors that could have been blocked or changed or regulated or modified may have prevented this tragedy - but may very well have created a worse one somewhere else. We don't really know. We can never really know. We don't have the ability to travel into the future and use hindsight on events that haven't yet happened. Imagine a car bomb at the same location, leveling the building in one huge blast. 300 people inside. Would that have been better?

We can't always be prepared for the worst, no matter how careful we may be. Finding sole causes, singular motivations for why people do crazy sh1t is really caveman thinking at it's best. Club something over the head and will all be happy again. Crimony!
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 135
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50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 10:13:28 AM
“Point being it doesn't matter if you have 10K people say he was gay. He's dead....other than speculation and hearsay you'll never know what motive he may have had other than his implied allegiance to an ISIS commander in the 911 call. An attack of consciousness? Guilt? Based on his beliefs? The 911 call is the only substantiated fact attributable to his senseless act.”

You know what that sounds like? “I have my own beliefs and only want to know about evidence that supports my beliefs and any other evidence to the contrary is worthless and any investigation that doesn’t focus only on what I believe is pointless.” Don’t open your mind and keep sticking your head in the sand. I understand – it’s got to be entirely the narrative you subscribe to or else it isn’t true.

“The brilliance of a good propaganda game.”

Okay, Dee – who exactly is heading this “propaganda game”? The reporters being told this? The survivors and acquaintances who experienced this? The FBI and police investigating this? At this point, it would have be a gigantic conspiracy of the absurd that somehow snowballed in 24 hours.

“In any event, his being gay, if proven, doesn't negate the extreme Islamist fact and circumstances. Whether he was gay or not is irrelevant except to change the subject.”

So a repressed gay man with serious psychological issues mowing down people (some of which he might have known) at a gay nightclub he frequented is “irrelevant” to the investigation of this crime and the murderer’s motivations? The only way it could possibly be “irrelevant” is if a murderer is only allowed to have one motivation, and it has to be a motivation approved by YOU. Do you not want the authorities to investigate every angle of this case? Do you not want to know exactly what motivated this born-and-raised American to do this so we can take steps toward it not happening again?

LET ME BE CLEAR ABOUT THIS: I am in no way shape or form suggesting that Mateen’s motivations have anything to do with whether what he did was wrong. Whether he was 100% radical Islamic terrorist or a spurned gay trying to take out his lover and everyone around him (pure speculation) or just your typical run-of-the-mill psychotic mass murderer who finally snapped or some combination of all that, none of these things are justification. But if we don’t get to the bottom of his actual motivations, then we can’t do anything to prevent it from happening again. There may in fact be nothing to prevent it from happening again (certainly banning Muslims from immigrating here wouldn’t do it in this case), but acting like you know exactly what was going on in his mind barely a day after it happened isn’t remotely helpful in the pursuit of truth. Something tells me had this been a seemingly run-of-the-mill white American and everybody just thought he was another psycho that went nuts, then suddenly a day later it came to light that he had been in contact with ISIS, I bet you’d be like “Woah, wait a minute – don't close that case book 'cause we need to further investigate this!”
 memtoo
Joined: 6/2/2016
Msg: 136
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 10:14:10 AM

We can't always be prepared for the worst, no matter how careful we may be


We can at least again ban assault weapons from legal ownership and hope to prevent the worst . . at least sometimes.
 UtterAmazement
Joined: 5/15/2016
Msg: 137
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 10:19:26 AM

“Point being it doesn't matter if you have 10K people say he was gay. He's dead....other than speculation and hearsay you'll never know what motive he may have had other than his implied allegiance to an ISIS commander in the 911 call. An attack of consciousness? Guilt? Based on his beliefs? The 911 call is the only substantiated fact attributable to his senseless act.”

You know what that sounds like? “I have my own beliefs and only want to know about evidence that supports my beliefs and any other evidence to the contrary is worthless and any investigation that doesn’t focus only on what I believe is pointless.”


Really? You pompous ass. I base my opinion on what the facts are. You have any FACTS other than the 911 call that substantiates his motives? Post them...if not f'k you Hawkings .
 Walts
Joined: 5/7/2005
Msg: 138
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 10:20:19 AM

Whether he was gay or not is irrelevant except to change the subject.


Dee.

Enough of your simplified "answers" or "solutions".

Do you actually understand that humans are complex beings? That everyone of us deals with things in our minds that only each of us can try to come to terms with? You, yourself are one of us. And your posts show it. You are back and forth in your words, explanations, solutions and problems. You are conflicted, yet, you probably will never admit it.

It's hard to explain certain things. As I said before, wouldn't it be nice to have simplified answers to the "stuff" that we all deal with in this world? I mean, wouldn't be nice just to lay blame on a extremist religion/belief? But, an intelligent and thoughtful person will easily see that there is more to this puzzle than one piece. We have no idea how this young man was brought up. Who was trying to install his beliefs, morals. Who he actually was listening to, and believing.

So ONE piece of the puzzle is NOT IRRELEVANT. It's all relevant. It's just going to take time to figure out, maybe, what set this man off to do what he just did. More than likely it was soooooo many things it could take almost to forever to figure it all out. Or not.

I know you WANT to place the blame on something that YOU believe is the "problem". Do yourself a favour, and quite the generic finger pointing until YOU actually KNOW. Guess, if you want. But, explain to us that YOU KNOW it's a guess, not a fact. That way, we could possibly place a little value on the words that you type.

Remember, YOU are the one that said YOU believe all gays should get professional help for their mental state. YOU. So, by your own words, shouldn't YOU actually admit, that the possibility that he could have been facing a conflict with his sexual orientation could have been a piece of this puzzle? Or, are your words, just words, without any true meaning at all?

Edit to add: Typing as MSG 135 was getting posted. Almost a copy cat aren't I?????
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 139
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 10:25:41 AM
It is really not fair to everyone else that you make every thread about me
Really, it isn't.

"""""""/You have any FACTS other than the 911 call that substantiates his motives? Post them...""""""""/


That.
 _babblefish
Joined: 9/23/2011
Msg: 140
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 10:44:19 AM

Really? You pompous ass. I base my opinion on what the facts are. You have any FACTS other than the 911 call that substantiates his motives? Post them...if not f'k you Hawkings .


oh dear. . you need to calm down, have a shave, go knit yourself a sweater and think outside your complicit media
box

* GTO . . the CIA and FBI fully admit to using false flag op's in the past, do you think they've quit ?

i don't
 Walts
Joined: 5/7/2005
Msg: 141
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 10:47:31 AM

You have any FACTS other than the 911 call that substantiates his motives? Post them...""""""""/


FACTS.

What you have been told is true?

Or what you know is true?

You do know he used a gun?

Do you want to start on that subject? Or do we just throw that in the mix? Or just leave it out?

There will be all kinds of facts but, it will take time. Until then we are just ranting, venting, guessing, wishing, hoping, and very, very confused. Myself included.
 FullMoonGuy
Joined: 3/7/2014
Msg: 142
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 11:24:23 AM

Why do people insist on finding ONE specific factor that made ALL the difference - and crucifying it?


Because then they can comfort themselves with the idea that if they just get rid of that one specific factor for the future (like Trump's banning all Muslims from entering the US or building a wall along the Mexican border), then everything will be OK and it won't happen again.

Which is a false assumption and a false comfort.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 143
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50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 11:31:58 AM
“Really? You pompous ass. I base my opinion on what the facts are. You have any FACTS other than the 911 call that substantiates his motives? Post them...if not f'k you Hawkings .”

Angry male white Trump voter in the house!

Even Fox News is going with the “closet homosexual” angle (I mean, between all the Islamic terrorist hysteria):

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/06/14/orlando-gunman-made-multiple-visits-to-nightclub-attacked-reports-say.html?intcmp=hpbt1

And sounds like his wife might have known about the plot and let it unfold. Yet another person who has blood on his/her hands.

Of course, even though it’s on Fox News, the (conservatives’) most trusted news source, we don’t know if any of this is true. Bunch of anonymous sources and all.

“It is really not fair to everyone else that you make every thread about me. Really, it isn't.”

How is anything I said in that last post about YOU? You (among others) posted in this thread about this topic, I responded to your posts (among others). If you don’t want people debating you, don’t get into a debate. Though I will say, it's interesting that you stopped your supportive quote of UtterAmazement just short of his angry profanity -- you know, the very thing you despise the most in the forums.

I obviously agree with NG, SD and Walts about how it’s impossible to boil anyone’s motivations down to a single point. We are human beings with extremely complex minds. Few things are black and white when it comes to human minds – most everything is grey (literally and figuratively).

“Remember, YOU are the one that said YOU believe all gays should get professional help for their mental state. YOU. So, by your own words, shouldn't YOU actually admit, that the possibility that he could have been facing a conflict with his sexual orientation could have been a piece of this puzzle? Or, are your words, just words, without any true meaning at all?”

This is a very good point – which is not to say I believe “all gays should get professional help for their mental state” AT ALL but if you are a person that believes that, then how can a mass murderer’s possible homosexuality not be a major contributing factor to his actions?

“We can at least again ban assault weapons from legal ownership and hope to prevent the worst . . at least sometimes.”

I doubt a majority of people, much less Congressmen, will be agreeing on that any time soon, but I do believe there is near universal support for people on the terrorist watch list being disallowed to purchase assault weapons, yet Republicans in Congress voted against that multiple times. Would any Republicans in this thread care to defend that action? Especially in light of the fact that had that law been in place, it could have triggered surveillance on Mateen if nothing else after he attempted to purchase those weapons.
 HalftimeDad
Joined: 5/29/2005
Msg: 144
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 11:33:24 AM
Man. Some people aren't just clinging to the "radical Islam" narrative, they get really, really angry when the facts don't fit.
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 145
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 11:39:07 AM
Present some facts, not conjecture and I'll concede.

Will check later.

He visited Disney land. Doesn't mean that he is mickey mouse. Casing?

Again, I await your facts.
 memtoo
Joined: 6/2/2016
Msg: 146
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 11:39:45 AM

but I do believe there is near universal support for people on the terrorist watch list being disallowed to purchase assault weapons, yet Republicans in Congress voted against that multiple times. Would any Republicans in this thread care to defend that action? Especially in light of the fact that had that law been in place, it could have triggered surveillance on Mateen if nothing else after he attempted to purchase those weapons.


Unfortunately we live in a world where our Government is filled with sell-out narcissists and me first attitudes, because the ONLY POSSIBLE REASON is NRA resistance . . . on the slippery slope argument. . . Allow one gun regulation and there will be a slew of them".

Our Congress has proven itself an enemy of the people. Revolution, either at the ballot box or otherwise, is the only way to change things . . . but the Repubs latched on to a fu^king mentally ill Sociopath as their nominee instead of somebody who actually deserved the job.

Very, very distressing to me that the only real choice out there is Hillary. Heck I would vote for Romney or McCain at this point (so long as the Alaskan Bimbo was not on the ticket) over Hillary.. But a Psychopath as President. Just can't go there.
 UtterAmazement
Joined: 5/15/2016
Msg: 147
50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 12:40:43 PM

Angry male white Trump voter in the house!


Thanks for finally letting yourself show up. I've never mentioned race or political affiliation.

You're the one that made this supposition.


You know what that sounds like? “I have my own beliefs and only want to know about evidence that supports my beliefs and any other evidence to the contrary is worthless and any investigation that doesn’t focus only on what I believe is pointless.” Don’t open your mind and keep sticking your head in the sand. I understand – it’s got to be entirely the narrative you subscribe to or else it isn’t true.



The only belief I have at the moment is a mentally disturbed individual killed a lot of people. Whether terror based...gay based ..makes no difference. The only fact I know of is that he claimed alligence to an ISIS commander. That's the only thing I know. .that's the only thing you know. Your propensity to speculate negatively on my beliefs concerning additional investigation certainly illustrates your narrative.

I'll say again...you can have 10K people say he was gay, it won't support in and of itself the motivation behind the shooting. But I digress...

I'll base my opinion on what is currently the only known fact which is the 911 call (s). They find "proof" that his motivation was gay based that's fine, it won't negate the horrific act. But you can come on here and say "I told you so".
 Sweet_Danimal
Joined: 10/31/2015
Msg: 148
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50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 12:42:05 PM
I think the reason he went crazy is because of his irrational fear of anything colored Smurf Blue.
Present some facts, not conjecture, and I'll concede.
Furthermore, his allergy to dark chocolate caused several uncontrolled episodes of rage.
Again, I await your facts.
Not that even care if someone proves or disproves anything - but I'm glad to have wasted your time dealing with it.

Spouting conjecture and demanding facts to DISPROVE isn't clever - it's hypocrisy.

Prove your own hypothesis - with FACTS, not conjecture. The rants of a man in the middle of a murderous rampage can't even remotely be taken as 'fact' - he can say anything he wants, and will. How many ramblings of an institutionalized schizophrenic are verifiable truth? How many drooling babbles from a drunk person are factual? How many people tell 'honest' stories when being pulled over by law enforcement? C'mon, people will say anything to be famous - or infamous.
 chinook1111
Joined: 4/1/2016
Msg: 149
20 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 1:06:31 PM
Redryder you are losing your mind to threaten to block your dad.And quit comparing radical Islam to nice people in church on Sunday.And the radical part of Islam seems fairly large when you consider the attitudes of these guys to women and gays.
 BBEisBack
Joined: 9/16/2015
Msg: 150
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50 feared dead after Florida nightclub terror attack
Posted: 6/14/2016 1:07:19 PM

I doubt a majority of people, much less Congressmen, will be agreeing on that any time soon, but I do believe there is near universal support for people on the terrorist watch list being disallowed to purchase assault weapons, yet Republicans in Congress voted against that multiple times.


I'm not a Republican, but I'll just leave this here...
You want to take away people's Rights, because of a Secret List, without Due Process....

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/07/politics/no-fly-mistakes-cat-stevens-ted-kennedy-john-lewis/

No-fly nightmares: The program's most embarrassing mistakes
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