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 Tomfiend
Joined: 10/3/2016
Msg: 126
Fake News is the point - its the new truthPage 6 of 15    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15)
You guys need to look up the meaning of the word sardonic. It should be obvious that nuclear war in the mideast means the deaths of tens of millions. You think oil is the issue if nuclear war breaks out?

Happy new year all. With Trump as prez, it may be the last one.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 127
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 5:04:16 AM

Jovan, I can't be bothered to look at whether the purported Ben Gurion quote is true or leftist trash fabrication because it doesn't matter.

There are thousands of such quotes 'on-record', going back to when the original idea was first seriously considered.
(Late 1800s)
They completely contradict the 'public' narrative.
The plan was always to reestablish the whole of "eretz israel", without any Palestinians left there.
700,000 Palestinians were evicted or fled their homes, as the "israelis" carried out massacres in nearby villages.
The following year (1949), 700,000 "jewish" immigrants arrived.
They were 'given' the 'abandoned' land and homes.

Ironically, the Palestinians who were exiled from their own land, have never been accorded any sort of "right of return", but Europeans, and European American "jews", who had never lived there, were.

The establishment of "israel" was a straightforward theft, " justified" by a religious belief, and mythology.


The UN granted the land to Israel. Your opinion of whether it should have or not or the opinions of other leftist trash is of no moment whatsoever.


See, it's this attitude which has condemned "israelis" to the paranoid, 'fortified' existence, which they have, and will always have, unless they reconsider, and admit past mistakes.

-Because they have the same attitude of "denial", when it comes to their neighbours, most of whom, they have stolen land from.
They don't care about their "opinions" either, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt, and other Arab or Muslim States, as far afield as Pakistan, also oppose it.
They never wanted it, they said "no", and they've remained consistently opposed to it, ever since.
Do you really think, that with the passage of time, they will eventually, simply 'accept' this injustice?

"Zionists" are hated and disliked, because of their arrogance, and denial.
The same kind of arrogance and denial which you use, when trying to justify it.

Nobody has the "right" to treat other people appallingly, just because they themselves had been treated appallingly, by someone else.

You'd think that people who claim to be religious, and claimed to believe in "god", and claimed to have the highest standards of morality, would know that, without having to be told. (By an atheist too!)


the Palestinians have nothing to complain about. They made their own beds.....

I call Fake News
The Palestinians had their 'own beds' stolen from them, by 'zionists'.

They didn't ask for any of this, it was inflicted on them, by the west,
-and about 3.5 million western immigrants, with delusions of "entitlement".


So many opportunities to have had their own country and they blew it, and that's israel's fault?

Fake News
They already had their own country, until a load of religious extremists, who were armed, funded, and assisted by the western powers, stole it from them.

More and more people are becoming aware of what has happened there.
Your propaganda; that the Arabs are just "crazy", and belligerent, is the pure "fake news", which has been historically disseminated to the western public, by a compliant media.

It's why I didn't know about it, for about the first 40 years of my life.
What you see on the news, doesn't tell you about what happened before.
I would encourage anyone to do their own research.

"israel" was forced upon a middle-eastern, "muslim" population, by the west, when we still had 'colonies', and apartheid.

"We" stole their land, "we" massacred thousands, and bulldozed entire villages, some with the people still inside, "we" forced the terrified, and unarmed survivors, who fled, into the desert, or neighbouring countries.

The west decided to create "israel", and we made it happen.

"Israel" is as much a current and ongoing 'stain on the conscience' of the west, as slavery and apartheid were, before they were abolished.

Nobody who looks into it, (without any religious bias) can reasonably come to any other conclusion.

In order to make any kind of progress towards peace in the middle east, "we" will have to first admit "our" past mistakes.

Your remaining "in denial" about it, will not help.

HNY
 Tomfiend
Joined: 10/3/2016
Msg: 128
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 7:33:25 AM
Jovan, all of the mideast countries are an artificial construct. The land and resources allocated the arabs huge...that allocated the jews virtually nothing by comparison. It is impossible for you to get it. It is an antisemitic world that created the absolute necessity for a Jewish homeland in the historical jewish home. Before the holocaust it was only a dream. The holocaust proved the absolute necessity for that dream to become a reality.

You keep inflicting your values on others...but you completely misapprehended the Jewish faith. If jews did not believe as strongly in their faith as they do, the religion would have died out long ago. That you don't believe and don't think they should believe is totally irrelevant. That you have no faith and believe in nothing is meaningless.

The holocausts against the jews, over and over...absolutely justified, on all moral grounds, the necessity of israel. The West abandoned the jews to the nazis. The arabs aligned themselves with Hitler. Too fuking bad for the squatters living in that land. 700,000 arab refugees with other countries to go to vs 6,000,000 jewish dead and nowhere for the european jewish survivors to go. Even the US closed its doors to them. Remember Exodus? The arabs could have accepted the UN deal and didn't. If they truly believed they were in the right, Israel could never have defeated the the combined Arab armies against them. The jews had right and morality on their side which is why they fought so valiantly and won. The squatters had nothing to fight for which is why they so readily abandoned the land.

The jews have survived 5000 years...including 2000 years of non stop christian antisemitic pogroms and holocausts against them. Do you think that what you believe should matter to them? Do you think the antisemitic leftist, lying trash represented by you and cotter on this board are atypical?

The only thing that will do in Israel is when the jews lose their faith and no longer believe the land worth fighting for? But even there...for survival among those who would attempt to massacre them, they have no choice but to fight on. The arabs obviously want the jews in Israel dead...just like the leftist trash wants them dead. That gives israel the moral justification to fight on for its survival. For you scum who want them dead...go kill yourselves.

 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 129
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 7:56:53 AM
"With Trump as prez, it may be the last one"

>>>If the George Bush gang of idiots could keep Israel from joining the war against Iraq, and ISIS in Syria could keep itself from attacking Israel, you can sleep at night, safeties will remain on.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 130
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 8:55:11 AM

Jovan, all of the mideast countries are an artificial construct.

Westerners constructed them, when we still thought colonial conquest was somehow "sanctioned by god".

"israel" is the only example where "we" (the west) "shipped-in" an entire population, and gave all the land to them.
If we'd done that anywhere else too, we would have encountered the same resistance.

The land and resources allocated the arabs huge...that allocated the jews virtually nothing by comparison.

They already lived there.
You have to stop thinking that they needed our permission to do so.
They didn't.
That's a 'colonial mindset'.

It is an antisemitic world that created the absolute necessity for a Jewish homeland in the historical jewish home. Before the holocaust it was only a dream. The holocaust proved the absolute necessity for that dream to become a reality.

Disingenuous Bull Shit.
The "dream" was born long before.
The plan to establish "israel", and the mass immigration towards that end, had already begun, by the time of the Balfour Declaration, of 1917.

You keep inflicting your values on others...but you completely misapprehended the Jewish faith. If jews did not believe as strongly in their faith as they do, the religion would have died out long ago. That you don't believe and don't think they should believe is totally irrelevant. That you have no faith and believe in nothing is meaningless.

"Belief" itself, proves nothing.
"Scientologists", "Branch Davidians", The Taliban, ISIS, and the "Moonies" are ALL also "believers".
You "buy into" "belief" being some sort of indicator of moral superiority.
I don't.
Especially when that belief is in primitive drivel.



The West abandoned the jews to the nazis.

Erm... The nazis were from, and in "the west"!
WWII was a purely "western war", but we dragged the rest of the world into it, largely because they were still our "colonies".

The arabs aligned themselves with Hitler.

Fake news.

Too fuking bad for the squatters living in that land.

Fake news.

700,000 arab refugees with other countries to go to

Fake news.
The "israelis" bulldozed hundreds of ancient villages.

vs 6,000,000 jewish dead and nowhere for the european jewish survivors to go.

Fake news.
Most "european jewish survivors" carried on living exactly where they'd lived before.
Once Hitler was defeated, they were safer almost anywhere, than they'd ever been before.
Most still live outside "israel". (60% ish?)
"israel" isn't the "safe haven", because they stole the land, and killed people.
It's probably safer for "jews", almost anywhere else.

The arabs could have accepted the UN deal and didn't.

Fake news.
The Arabs were being dispossessed of the lands which they'd inhabited for centuries, and they were being given to complete European outsiders.
That wasn't a "deal", or an "offer", it was a straight-out theft.
Why would anyone ever simply "accept" that?

If they truly believed they were in the right, Israel could never have defeated the the combined Arab armies against them. The jews had right and morality on their side which is why they fought so valiantly and won. The squatters had nothing to fight for which is why they so readily abandoned the land.

Fake news.
By that twisted "logic", then the 6 million "jews" also "deserved" to die,
and Hitler must have had morality on his side, when he did that too.
You do talk some shit.
They "readily abandoned the land", because the people with tanks, and gun, and bulldozers, ("zionists") drove them away.
Those who didn't "readily abandoned the land" were killed, or the houses were bulldozed with them still inside.
It's all on record. Even in Wiki.

You do know that the expression "might is right", is usually said with sarcasm, don't you?

The jews have survived 5000 years...including 2000 years of non stop christian antisemitic pogroms and holocausts against them. Do you think that what you believe should matter to them? Do you think the antisemitic leftist trash represented by you and cotter on this board are atypical?

I don't believe in "semites", other than as a completely meaningless, linguistic-origins definition, which "jews" also share with Arabs, now that they've resurrected "hebrew", which had been all but extinct, as a language, before "israel".

"Judaism" is just a collection of old beliefs.
It will inevitably go the way of other erroneous old beliefs.
Both epilepsy, and schizophrenia were still thought to be "demonic possessions", as recently as just 50 years ago.

One more century, and there'll be about as many people left, still "worshiping" your "god", as there are people worshiping Odin, now.
Times change.

The only thing that will do in Israel is when the jews lose their faith and no longer believe the land worth fighting for? But even there...for survival among those who would attempt to massacre them, they have no choice but to fight on. The arabs obviously want the jews in Israel dead...just like the leftist trash wants them dead. That gives israel the moral justification to fight on for its survival. For you scuM who want them dead...go kill yourselves. You are no loss to society imho.


I don't know if you've got any children, Marilyn? I have.
If you had some, and I offered you some land, - maybe lots of land, in return for the death of one or more, of your children, would you take that deal?
I'm not sure that ANY land is worth dying for.

The "jews" killed other people, to acquire the land.
-That's the only reason, that the people who were there, now want to kill them.
That's just 'karma'.
They aren't the "victims" in "israel", they're the perpetrators.
 _mungojoe_
Joined: 10/1/2014
Msg: 131
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 12:45:07 PM

Remember Exodus?

I remember "Exodus"... I watched it again just the other night...

Do you remember "Exodus"...? Do you remember how EVERY Jewish character from the Middle East in the movie... referred to themselves as... Palestinian...? Not Israeli... but Palestinian...

Don't you consider that odd... if there never was a Palestine... and there never were Palestinians...?

Did you also know that the book it was based on... was commissioned by a public relations firm... hired to influence American perceptions of Israel...?

Did you know that NONE of what happened after the British blockaded the boat... actually REALLY happened in real life...? That is was ALL made up...? (the real Exodus passengers were sent back to Europe)

Did you know that even David Ben Gurion is quoted as saying: "As a literary work, it isn’t much. But as a piece of propaganda, it’s the greatest thing ever written about Israel."...?

Did you want to bring up any other "fake news"...?
 LLove2LaughToo
Joined: 6/6/2016
Msg: 132
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 1:35:50 PM

Msg: 130
The "jews" killed other people, to acquire the land.
That's the only reason, that the people who were there, now want to kill them.


It's crazy how right wing zionists can't understand such a simple and truthful statement.
 Tomfiend
Joined: 10/3/2016
Msg: 133
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 3:12:29 PM
In the end....you all don't know facts from fiction. The world is antisemitic to its core....and no matter how you all try to spin it, even the US denied jews safe passage in their attempt to escape war time europe...thus why I mentioned Exodus...because it was based on facts.

What the antisemitic leftist trash on this board hates is that the jews finally, after a millenium of being victims. .have been fighting back. The scum here applauds arabs killing jews with non discriminate rocket attacks and terrorism but despises the jews retaliating and defending themselves. The vile, antisemitic Cotter rails against the wall israel built to protect itself from terrorism. She would rather the terrorists have free reign.

Guess what leftists. Israel is now almost 70 years old. No matter what you think of its creation, it's not going anywhere. It will not disappear simply because you disapprove the world powers of the day returned the Jewish historical homeland to the jews. Whine, batch, complain..but that is fact. The combined Arab armies didn't care enough about the palestinians to either fight for them or work with them in giving them an independent state. Even Jordan turned its back on the Palestinians when it annexed the presently "occupied" territories.

Now it's too late. 200 plus nuclear weapons. Some of the best pilots in the world. Stealth class nuclear submarines. Israel can thumb it's nose at the entire world if it chooses. But it doesn't have to. It has one of the most supportive US Presidents ever about to take power. You leftists are besides yourself. As dee would say...I get it. Too bad guys...you are nothing but voices in a loud wind incapable of changing anything.
 Tomfiend
Joined: 10/3/2016
Msg: 134
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 3:21:51 PM
"The "jews" killed other people, to acquire the land.
-That's the only reason, that the people who were there, now want to kill them."

False equivalency. Arabs were aligning with Hitler to kill jews. Jews were defending their rights to their legally sanctioned territory. Jews and arabs were killed.

The arabs have been attempting to kill jews forever. They have created a right wing mindset in Israel resulting in Israel electing warriors as its leaders. The arabs never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity. It didn't have to be this way. They have destroyed their own opportunities for an independent State. They are where they are because they chose Ararat to lead them. He led them astray.
 Doubleknotspy7
Joined: 8/10/2016
Msg: 135
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 3:45:34 PM
The Palestinians were always the people who lived in the Palestine territory so named by the Romans.
Jew, Arab, Christian they were all Palestinians. The name Palestine for the area now know as Israel, first appears in the 2nd century when the Romans put down the 2nd Jewish revolt. The name comes from the Philistines who were not Arab.
The biggest fake news is that Israel stole the land.
What land are you speaking of?
Are you speaking of Judea, Samaria or Galilee?
Which were the three Jewish regions in the first century.
So the Jews were chased out in the 2nd through 7th centuries and there fore have no historic claim.
By that logic then the New Palestinians forced out during the Arab wars of the 20th century have no claim to Israeli land today... eh.

Again you can't have a two state solution until both sides recognize the other.
One side has... care to guess which one?
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 136
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 5:21:15 PM

The biggest fake news is that Israel stole the land.
What land are you speaking of?
Are you speaking of Judea, Samaria or Galilee?
Which were the three Jewish regions in the first century.

In the "First century", the Romans owned most of what we now call the western world, or Europe, anyway, and much of the Middle East.
Does that give present-day Italians some sort of "claim"; to be able to go and live in any of those countries, and force the current inhabitants out?

So the Jews were chased out in the 2nd through 7th centuries and there fore have no historic claim.
By that logic then the New Palestinians forced out during the Arab wars of the 20th century have no claim to Israeli land today... eh.

[sarcasm]"Yeah, because that's like, the exact same thing..."[/sarcasm]

Britain was originally something like 12 or so (?) different "lands", or "tribes". It was invaded by the Romans, the Vikings, The Normans, and more recently, parts of Earl's Court, by the Australians.
AFAIK., that doesn't entitle me to go to any of the places they came from, nor does it entitle their present-day ancestors, to return here, and "claim back" their land, hundreds of years later!!
What happened in living memory, is entirely different.
Justice can, and should be served.
We can't bring back the dead, but they could make reparations, at the values of land today,
to a 'dirt-poor' people, who were entirely innocent, but were robbed, and killed.
In order to do that "zionists" must admit their mistakes.
The whole idea was a big mistake.

"jewish" is just a religion.
Trump's daughter just became "jewish".
Does that give her the "right" to go and live where that religion originated too
Do "christians" also have the right to go and live in "the holy" land, because their grandparents were also "christians"?

This really is some primitive shit.
It shouldn't need explaining.

If someone stole your house, but were then somehow "protected" by the army and police, and you couldn't get it back, and no-one would listen to you.
Would you then be prepared to enter into "peace negotiations" with them, after 60 years of living in a tent
Would you 'graciously accept' their "kind" offer, to rent you back a small part of the garage

~I know I fvcking wouldn't.
Goodnight
 woobytoodsday
Joined: 12/13/2006
Msg: 137
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 5:45:33 PM
Would you then be prepared to enter into "peace negotiations" with them, after 60 years of living in a tent

I remember very clearly, seeing a TV Special on Arabs in Israel during the early fifties. Especially one man, living in a tent with his family, who was refusing resettlement help from another Arab country. He expressed his intent to be miserable, and make his family miserable forever, rather than accept the Jews. I didn't think that reasonable when I was 13; I don't consider it reasonable now.

As a white, I live on land that was stolen, by force, from my other ancestors--First Nations. It's not fair, and it's not going to be fixed. I am glad everyone stopped fighting about it, and decided to make a go of their lives.
 Yule_liquor
Joined: 12/7/2011
Msg: 138
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 5:48:51 PM
#134 Tomfiend (aka: Marylin; Hondo, etc)


They are where they are because they chose Ararat {sic} to lead them. He led them astray.


Actually Arafat was their best hope for a 2 state peace solution; of any Palestinian Arab leaders, he was by far the most respected.

The problem with the Palestinian Arabs is that they are NOT a monolithic (one) pple. They are comprised of many "clans" emanating from various parts of the Arabian states, each with their own culture, local laws, etc. Each of these clans control different sections of the West Bank, and do not mingle much with each other. The only thing they share is disdain for Israel.

These clans do not favor a 2 state peace solution simply because they would have to give up local power and governance, to a central head of state. Also, some clan-states would have had to give up more than some others. What you have now in Abbas, is a farce leadership, a figure head only. He must kow-tow to local Clanships, otherwise he is toast! Arafat had greater latitude with these clans, but he too was unable to sway them to accept a formal 2 state treaty (for the above reasons) as was tried by the Clinton admin, but he came closest of anyone in this attempt for peace.

Israel does not (privately) want a formal peace either, because it would require them to dismantle much of the settlements, and greatly complicate security matters, in that they would have to devise other ways to secure intelligence. They would also have to pay a "ground rent" (which would not be cheap) to palestinian Arabs for their Military presence on the West bank; which is something they have for "free" right now.

Thus, a 2 state peace solution is not workable (probably never was), and NOT because they don't recognize each other, but because of what each side would have to give up.

```````````````````````````````````````

#135 Spy-Zero


Jew, Arab, Christian they were all Palestinians.


The name Palestine was an artificial political designation. You are correct that it was devised by the Romans, but none of the pple named above regarded themselves as being a "palestinian" surely not Jews!

The name "stuck" because Jews were sparse and had no political power after the Islamic occupation, and the Muslims favored a non Jewish name for the region so it was kept.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 139
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 6:31:13 PM

I remember very clearly, seeing a TV Special on Arabs in Israel during the early fifties. Especially one man, living in a tent with his family, who was refusing resettlement help from another Arab country. He expressed his intent to be miserable, and make his family miserable forever, rather than accept the Jews. I didn't think that reasonable when I was 13; I don't consider it reasonable now.

Well, we'll just have to agree to disagree there.
Maybe some people just don't have the ability to accept injustice.
I tend to sympathise with them. Maybe it's 'genetic'?
I can't imagine I'd ever admit to any crime, which I didn't commit, to get a lighter sentence.

I once fought a big bank, for 12 years. Everyone told me to give up. But I just couldn't, because I knew they were wrong. (long story). It cost me my career, my marriage, and my sanity.
But I won in the end.
I'd probably do the same again, even knowing how hard it would be.

If there's no right, and no wrong, what is there?

I like to think that I'm the sort of person who'd have probably been killed, in pre-war Germany, for not "going with the flow".
I think we all know what's right, and what's wrong, and more people should say so.

We've made lots of mistakes, in the past. The Native Americans were just one.
But we don't still think that "might is right".

What "we" did in "israel", was just wrong.
(not just the "zionists", but all the "christian" western people, and their governments, who armed and supported them, in the creation of some sort of a theological "disneyland-for-the -religious").

We didn't think that what the natives thought about it, mattered.
That was also wrong, IMO.
If I'm ever wrong, I'll (probably ) have no problem in admitting it.

"Israel's" continued "playing the victim", is just another lie, and just makes the whole thing, even worse.
 Kj521
Joined: 11/16/2016
Msg: 140
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/1/2017 6:39:51 PM
"(not just the "zionists", but all the "christian" western people, and their governments, who armed and supported them, in the creation of some sort of a theological "disneyland-for-the -religious")."


Generalization and over-simplication. Please.....Mr. Jovan.....do not speak for groups you do not represent.

Happy New Year. :)
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 141
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/2/2017 5:01:50 AM

Generalization and over-simplication. Please.....Mr. Jovan.....do not speak for groups you do not represent.


I'm not speaking for anybody but myself.
I'm speaking about some groups, based on documented history.
I can make it even simpler:
(not just the "zionists", but all who armed and supported them, in the creation of some sort of a theological "disneyland-for-the-religious", including: the majority of "christian" western people, and their governments).

The point I was making, was that it was the west, in general, who forced the creation of a "new israel" on the Arab populations, and completely against their wishes.
The "right" to do that, was entirely fictitious.
Mainly because "christians" also "bought into" the biblical fairy stories which it's based on.
Don't forget that "jesus" was also allegedly "jewish".

It amuses me that religions, who always claim the moral 'high ground', should need to be told that the way we treated other people was unacceptable.

But their "gods" have always been very specific, in their instructions about how to treat "non-believers", or believers in "other gods".
Consequently, religions have been killing each other, in the "holy lands", since before they were even "holy".

HNY to you too.
 Tomfiend
Joined: 10/3/2016
Msg: 142
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/2/2017 6:23:52 AM
It cost you your career and marriage...but fighting that bank for 12 years was worth it to you? Rational and reasonable people learn there are battles not worth fighting. The costs are simply too high. The arabs in 48 concluded this was the case with israel. They chose not to die fighting for the palestinians. LBJ did not learn this when he squandered so much in Vietnam, nor did GWB in Iraq.

No matter....says lots about you that you don't see it.....and why you can't let it go when it comes to what you perceive to be an injustice. That my friend is mental illness.

Happy new year kj521.
 benartflick
Joined: 3/8/2012
Msg: 143
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/2/2017 7:32:28 AM

I think we all know what's right, and what's wrong,


I disagree! No doubt we all should agree on what should be obviously wrong - but people don't.

One example (of many): recently I was on Grand Jury duty. For 4 straight months we were indicting people without any deliberation. I made an attempt to discuss two cases and was completely ignored by the jury foreman. Shortly after my second attempt, in an elevator, I said to the jury foreman we weren't doing our job. She thought my comment was extremely offensive and told the main prosecutor.

Two weeks later at my trial for saying something that offensive, the most incompetent judge I ever had the displeasure of standing in front of implied I was wrong for saying such a thing. Followed by he would hold me in contempt (jail time) if I ever did it again.

Clearly a federal prosecutor, a jury foreman and a federal judge thought I did something wrong by saying such a thing. I strongly disagree. To me it's like a Twilight Zone episode. WTF am I missing? Those people aren't mentally ill - I think.

I believe it's wrong to indict people without evidence. The majority of 23 Grand Jurors apparently believe it's more important to get out of the courthouse as soon as possible - let the regular juries decide if the scumbags are guilty or not. I think that's wrong. Many think it isn't wrong. Really!

(Believing I would end up in jail, I won my motion to get off jury duty. Some might say I was a coward and wrong for doing that. I don't think so.)
 Whisky_River
Joined: 12/2/2015
Msg: 144
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/2/2017 7:46:52 AM
Wow....bizarre story Ben!
Jurors that didn't discuss any evidence and then because you wanted to....you got charged.!
Yes....talk about a Twilight Zone episode....I bet!
 Tomfiend
Joined: 10/3/2016
Msg: 145
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/2/2017 8:08:24 AM
Ben is just providing an extreme example of fake news. That's the theme after all and lots of made up stuff in this thread and any anti-Israel thread. Cotter et al are experts at extreme fake news after all.
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 146
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/2/2017 8:32:57 AM
Ben -
I absolutely believe every word that you wrote.
I know people who work in the "justice" system who can tell you in advance how a case will come out depending upon which judge is assigned.

As far as a grand jury, that is why there is the joke about a "Prosecutor can get a grand jury to indict a ham sandwich."

But what do we do about it? People who want change are called names ( ahem) by the people who are too lazy and scared and complacent to do anything about it or who fear change and then threatened with prosecution or worse. In the "justice" system.

You did the best thing. Leave them to their own devices and not be a part of such ridiculousness.
 Walts
Joined: 5/7/2005
Msg: 147
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/2/2017 8:37:27 AM

People who want change are called names ( ahem) by the people who are too lazy and scared and complacent to do anything about it or who fear change and then threatened with prosecution or worse. In the "justice" system.


Actually, when some voice their displeasure of what they see, they are told to shut up and quite whining by those that don't see the same as those voicing their displeasure. People are funny that way.

They want to be heard but, they don't want to listen.
 Tomfiend
Joined: 10/3/2016
Msg: 148
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/2/2017 9:12:00 AM
Dee, therein lies the problem. Many people are very uncritical in believing what somebody else says without question. Ben says he was "prosecuted" for complaining and you believe every word. Cotter and Jovan constantly lie on here, intentionally or not...but how many simply uncritically accept what they say? Plenty of fake news out there...plenty who uncritically accept and plenty who take advantage of the naivety of others.

An entire industry has been created with one purpose..to slander and defame and lie about Israel. Leftist trash like Cotter and Jovan are part victim...part perpetrators of the false information. That's the world we live in today.
 Walts
Joined: 5/7/2005
Msg: 149
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/2/2017 9:21:09 AM

Many people are very uncritical in believing what somebody else says without question.


Oh, you must have missed the questions posed towards you and your words of "wisdom"(truths) in the last couple of weeks. Is that ignorance, arrogance, or both?
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 150
Fake News is the point - its the new truth
Posted: 1/2/2017 9:32:28 AM
"I know people who work in the "justice" system who can tell you in advance how a case will come out depending upon which judge is assigned."

>>>fictional TV show Law & Order, which likes to pattern itself off real issues at times, brings up the topic more than once. Logically, it passes the sniff test, b/c we're talking about human nature here, and human nature always makes its way out.

"But what do we do about it?"

ignore *cough* Obama's Supreme Court nomination *ahem* after saying they'd *cough* vote for the guy. But hey, human nature will always exist, and our justice system may just be like democracy--terrible except in comparison to every other alternative. And I guess i'll learn a lesson from Ben's story, and next time i'm in jury duty, i'm fighting to be foreman. Best way to survive a kangaroo court is to work for it :)
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