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 halcyon_skies
Joined: 7/27/2015
Msg: 26
Las Vegas Carnage QuestionsPage 2 of 7    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7)
This article says Paddock probably did not act alone. Several witnesses and video show shooters much lower than 32nd floor.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-10-04/16-unanswered-questions-about-las-vegas-shooting-mainstream-media-doesnt-want-talk-a
 John252817
Joined: 8/24/2016
Msg: 27
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 8:52:18 AM
" Even if she knew something was up, I'm sure she's not going to say anything because there's no way of proving she knew what he was about to do. The only other person who would know what she knows about the plan is dead. Dead people make lousy witnesses."

^^^^^from site to sight.....YIKES, looks like you are making excuses if she did know anything. Well sherlock, she said.... “He never said anything to me or took any action that I was aware of that I understood in any way to be a warning that something horrible like this was going to happen.” So sherlock, if this turns out to be she lied, will you still say it was "ok" for her to not say anything, even if it was talked about and she knew but she had no proof according to you???? YIKES!!!
 poppata
Joined: 8/6/2017
Msg: 28
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 8:55:31 AM

This article says Paddock probably did not act alone. Several witnesses and video show shooters much lower than 32nd floor.


I like Zero Hedge, but many of its authors are sensationalists full of sh^t. Did those on lower floors shoot through closed windows without breaking the glass?

I watched the news conference, and they are essentially speculating he did not work alone, because he had too many arms, etc.. it was too big a job for one man...somebody had to help him...nothing about other areas where shooting was taking place.
 poppata
Joined: 8/6/2017
Msg: 29
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 9:00:08 AM

So sherlock, if this turns out to be she lied, will you still say it was "ok" for her to not say anything, even if it was talked about and she knew but she had no proof according to you????


Do you believe any reasonable person would think it "ok" if she knew and said nothing. On the other hand, would that be a crime? Do you have an answer?
 DDSearle
Joined: 5/20/2017
Msg: 30
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 9:40:14 AM
I believe that Paddock went on a marathon gambling spree in the days-next-the-shooting. If so, couldn't he have been trying to recoup the moneys needed to refund his crumbling business arrangements? I take it that he was unsuccessful. And did 'Marilou Danley' (of the expired pig's eyes and improbable brows) know of this? Steve's dame is fine & dandy
 halcyon_skies
Joined: 7/27/2015
Msg: 31
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 10:22:12 AM

I like Zero Hedge, but many of its authors are sensationalists full of sh^t. Did those on lower floors shoot through closed windows without breaking the glass?


A second shooter could have fired shots from another location on the property other than a broken window. I've viewed several videos, including one made by a cab driver, where one could hear that the shots weren't all coming from the same location. Some shots were loud and close to her, while others were coming from much farther away.

Also, an employee who works for Mandalay Bay claims that he delivered food to Paddock's room that was ordered for two people - two drinks, two entrees, etc. He produced the receipts. A second person could have left long before the swat team arrived. The employee also claimed that Paddock checked in on the 25th, not the 28th.

https://www.infowars.com/receipt-shows-paddock-had-another-guest-in-his-room-before-shooting/
 chameleonf
Joined: 12/22/2008
Msg: 32
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 10:36:00 AM
^^^Pretty much anything is possible at this point (at least to all of us who aren't privy to all the info those actively investigating are).

Re more shots heard from other locations, it is also possible that what was being heard were echo reverberations, given the height and proximity of other buildings, as well as ricochet sounds. I doubt the cab driver would know to distinguish the difference.

Re ordering two meals and two drinks at a time wouldn't be unusual if someone was not wanting to be disturbed for a period of time, but knows they'd likely be hungry over that same period of time. Who knows, this nutbar may have even wanted to throw an investigation running with that theory as part of some plan he had.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 33
view profile
History
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 11:00:05 AM
I realize the sheriff himself is claiming Paddock must have had an accomplice, but it’s absurd to make that insinuation based on the amount of artillery found in the room. Sure, he wasn’t a young man like I was, but I don’t know how many times I lugged a ton of large luggage and bags into a hotel room for a hotel party back in the day by myself – all those drinks and food and music players and instruments and what have you easily took up close to the same amount of room and weighed close to the same amount as 23 guns and ammo. Now mind you, it took a lot of trips, sometimes spread over hours, but it was accomplished. (You may ask: where was your help, because surely you weren’t throwing a party by yourself? Yes, that is a very good question: WHERE WAS MY HELP? But I digress.) Furthermore, I have no recollection of hotel employees batting an eye while I was doing so. (Now pounding on the door and telling us to shut up after the party started is another thing altogether.)

The guy had 3 days to carry all that stuff in. THREE DAYS. I could move an entire house into a hotel room in 3 days.

I’m not saying he didn’t have an accomplice, but suggesting such without any proof whatsoever beyond “that was too much for one man to carry” or "he ordered enough food for two people" is nothing more than conjecture, and I was surprised to see the sheriff engaging in it (the FBI deputy director at the same press conference wisely refused to play that game).

“Several witnesses and video show shooters much lower than 32nd floor.”

Besides the unbroken window issues, there’s actually quite a bit of inaccurate information at that link, such as claiming he had 42 guns in the room, and several other questions that have been answered since it was posted, such as why it took so long for law enforcement to get into the room.

I don’t know why our country has become so conspiracy-theory oriented – I suppose it doesn’t help when the NSA actually was involved with a disturbing conspiracy that once seemed absurd. But there’s almost always a more logical explanation than a conspiracy theory, and usually it’s the obvious. The obvious in this case is that Stephen Paddock hid sociopathic tendencies deep down inside him for years, then one day they overtook him and he decided to kill a bunch of people, by himself – it’s “obvious” because that’s exactly what all the evidence is pointing to. It only seems illogical to us (and law enforcement) because it almost never happens without certain "signs." But if we want some insight to his mind, I seriously suggest someone have a talk with Dennis Rader. He’s probably watching the news right now in his prison cell and is like, wow, there were TWO of me in this world. Anyway, now that we have a conspiracy-theory-commander-in-chief, I can only naturally assume this sickness is going to get even worse, because now people think, hey, if the president thinks that way, it must be normal behavior.

“Part and parcel of living in the USA?”

You know, like most of your ilk, you’re just quite a bit more cavalier about Paddock than you were about Mateen. There’s nothing politically to gain from Paddock’s rampage because he doesn’t fit any narrative you’ve been trying to preach, so you just shrug him right off. Which, admittedly, I’m doing, too, but that’s because he was unquestionably a sociopath, and society’s always going to have some sociopaths that fly under everyone’s radar. But to suggest America cannot be improved to prevent or reduce tragedies UNLESS those tragedies are committed by brown-skinned people, non-Christian people, or foreign people tells us just about all we need to know about you.

*

Paul Ryan and several other Republicans in Congress now claim they're interested in considering a ban on bumpstocks. Apparently, at least partially because the sale of bumpstocks were approved during the Obama administration (but not directly by Obama) so they look upon this as rescinding another Obama initiative. And apparently the NRA has decided it will not hit back too hard on this attempt, because they're starting to look a little ridiculous in opposition to all gun control and this will show they are "reasonable," plus bumpstocks are just an accessory, not an actual gun. Politics are quite ridiculous. Apparently all it took was shooting up a bunch of conservative Republican country music fans by a non-Muslim/black to move the needle on gun control -- Congress didn't care about a bunch of gays in an Orlando dance club or moviegoers in Colorado watching Hollywood elites on the big screen or some 6-year-olds in a solid blue state, but by God, have a white enigma shoot up some key constituents and suddenly it's "Maybe we oughta look into this." Uh-huh.
 from site to sight
Joined: 11/30/2007
Msg: 34
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 11:49:05 AM
Maybe Paddock was originally planning to make the shooting rampage a 2 or 3 day event-thinking nobody would be able to pinpoint the exact location where the shots are coming from, since the hotels are huge walls of glass, and it would be like trying to find a needle in a hay stack. That might explain the excess ammo, firepower and extra food ordered. But it's impossible to know if he had an exit plan, where he would try to slip back into a "normal" life without any suspicion, or if he knew it would be a suicide mission. If I was on a suicide mission, I don't think ordering extra food would be on my mind.
 halcyon_skies
Joined: 7/27/2015
Msg: 35
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 12:07:10 PM

Maybe Paddock was originally planning to make the shooting rampage a 2 or 3 day event-thinking nobody would be able to pinpoint the exact location where the shots are coming from, since the hotels are huge walls of glass, and it would be like trying to find a needle in a hay stack. That might explain the excess ammo, firepower and extra food ordered. But it's impossible to know if he had an exit plan, where he would try to slip back into a "normal" life without any suspicion, or if he knew it would be a suicide mission. If I was on a suicide mission, I don't think ordering extra food would be on my mind.


The Mandalay Bay has gold-tinted mirrored windows, so the two broken ones made it pretty obvious as to the exact location of the shots.

If I were on a suicide mission, I'd order plenty of my favorite foods before I died. I probably wouldn't gamble, though. What the point of winning money if I wouldn't be around to enjoy it?
 Kj521
Joined: 11/16/2016
Msg: 36
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 12:13:43 PM
You know, like most of your ilk, you’re just quite a bit more cavalier about Paddock than you were about Mateen.


I suppose that is a step above "you people" completely ignoring the church shooting in Antioch, Tennessee. Was it the shooter, Emanuel Kidega Samson, or the hero, Caleb Engle or both that didn't fit into your narrative? :)


Let me be clear. I speak only for myself...no "ilk" necessary. I think the actions and behaviors of Mateen....Roof....Samson...and Paddock...et al......are horrific and evil. I don't view one worse than the other based upon the number of lives they took, skin color, religious or political motivation or death weapons they chose to use. They are all simply evil and should not ever be able to walk freely in our society.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 37
view profile
History
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 1:21:10 PM
Wow, Fox News goes ANTI-conspiracy theorist for once – go Fox go!:

http://insider.foxnews.com/2017/10/05/police-unlikely-las-vegas-shooter-targeted-airport-fuel-tanks

“In addition, he said police body camera footage shows flashes coming off of different parts of the mirrored Mandalay Bay hotel during the attack. Those images have sparked conspiracy theories about shooters on other floors. ‘That would help explain why people think they saw stuff on different levels and floors, because of the mirrored buildings,’ said Housley. He said it also explains why it took them longer to figure out the location of gunman and rule out a second shooter.”

Like I said, there is almost always a LOGICAL reason for everything. Logic, people. LOGIC!

“I suppose that is a step above ‘you people’ completely ignoring the church shooting in Antioch, Tennessee. Was it the shooter, Emanuel Kidega Samson, or the hero, Caleb Engle or both that didn't fit into your narrative? :)”

I wasn’t even in POF land when that happened – I was dealing with post Irma, the Badlands, cancer, etc. Was there a discussion about it? Of course, there is a LOGICAL reason why it probably got much less media coverage than Las Vegas: Samson only killed one person, not 58. One person gets killed all the time – hey, it happens with us darkie thugs every night in Chicago, am I right? (I was actually in Chicago for several days during my latest misadventure – seemed pretty safe to me. But I’m not stupid enough to go into the Southside.) Mateen was as much a poster child for your cause as Samson, and he got BUNDLES of MSM coverage, so quit acting like Muslims killing Americans automatically gets swept under the rug. Now the alt-right (and the president) most certainly tried to sweep Charlottesville under the rug and I suppose you could argue because only one person was killed there that it got far more coverage than it deserved. You could argue all kinds of things to fit your narrative, but like most people, you try to sweep things under the rug that don’t fit your narrative. It is just human nature.

“I don't view one worse than the other based upon the number of lives they took, skin color, religious or political motivation or death weapons they chose to use.”

So you say, but you had like 5 million more things to say about Mateen and how future Mateens could be prevented than Roof or Paddock. (Though to be fair, even I have said no future Paddocks can probably be prevented... just carnage reduced.)
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 38
Oh no, the shooter isn't Muslim! therefore it must be Dealey Plaza!
Posted: 10/5/2017 1:28:10 PM
Wait, conspiracy theorist Chump is in government, so it must be a conspiracy by the government. No wait, it must be the Russians! Oh wait, they're the good guys. It must be the Deep State guys we trust to kill Muslim terrorists! But wait, what would they have to gain, how would they get gun control past a Republican government? Oh, our head hurts...

unbelievable. Its 9/11 truthers and JFK conspiracy all over again. Paddock looked at Boston and Chicago as possible targets before this. He had multiple weapons b/c he knew the barrels would get hot and lose accuracy. I did youtube links here before about bumpfire, how people could do it without even buying the product. You'd be amazed at what's out there on the net, and I don't mean the Dark Web, for information. He was a video poker player, his hand-eye corroridination may have been decent. OKBombing originally looked for a JohnDoe 2, b/c guess what, things are confused and sometimes witness reports are wrong. I loved how the article asks, "how can a rich guy go crazy? why does a rich guy move around so much?" Duh! And "why would a concert have exits blocked off?" Uh, so people don't sneak in for free? "gee, I called 911 and they didn't send the cops exactly where I told them to go!" Yeah, they might have been busy with all the other calls, and pulling wounded out of the killzone.

we find comfort in conspiracy theories, b/c then we think someone besides God is to blame for people meeting their maker when its their time to do so.

 poppata
Joined: 8/6/2017
Msg: 39
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/5/2017 1:37:25 PM
^^^ if possible, Paddocks takes evil to a new level....he used his brain to scheme to kill the largest number of people he could...indiscriminately, and its unlikely he suffered from the same level of mental illness say the Sandy Points shooter suffered from. Evil can and should be ranked by the number of victims of that evil, the level of premeditation, and the purpose for the carnage. At least terrorists, for better or worse, believe there is a reason for their madness. What reason did Paddocks have other to kill hundreds or even thousands if he could have? It also looks like he had contingency plans to escape in his car, and to blow it up, blowing up his pursuers and other innocent bystanders. He knew he was going to die... it was just a question of killing as many as possible before he did.
 DDSearle
Joined: 5/20/2017
Msg: 40
I'm No Gnome Of Grassy Knoll
Posted: 10/5/2017 1:50:50 PM
Having herded-in those firearms, Paddock may have ordered copious cold drinks to be served to his hotel-pen in the intention that some of them could be used to cool overheating guns. After all, the armed services of the Third Reich used cooling trays in which they'd dunk their Flugabwehrkanonen (flak guns). And I wonder at whether he settled the drinks bill &c
 Sandbyday
Joined: 7/25/2017
Msg: 41
I'm No Gnome Of Grassy Knoll
Posted: 10/5/2017 3:29:39 PM
His room service order was a burger, a bagel and a soup. Hardly evidence of more than one person in the room.
Ditto the drink order - one water and two sodas.
If I was in the desert at the Mandalay for four days I would have ordered up a case of beer and a large pizza or two. Doesn't mean I would have anyone else in the room.
A priority in his situation wouldn't have been about whether to waste anything or not.
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 42
I'm No Gnome Of Grassy Knoll
Posted: 10/5/2017 3:48:34 PM
"Paddock may have ordered copious cold drinks to be served to his hotel-pen in the intention that some of them could be used to cool overheating guns."

>>>in order to not distort those barrels so they could maintain accuracy over that distance, I do believe there would have to be uniform cooling, like say the water cooled barrel of a Browning 1917.

http://weaponsman.com/?p=9946

don't know if Las Vegas serves soda in a glass that tall :)

"Congress didn't care about a bunch of gays in an Orlando dance club or moviegoers in Colorado watching Hollywood elites on the big screen or some 6-year-olds in a solid blue state, but by God, have a white enigma shoot up some key constituents and suddenly it's "Maybe we oughta look into this." Uh-huh."

>>>yeah, that's the problem with conspiracy theory...who in a Republican government wants to sponsor a conspiracy to get rid of something they never wanted to get rid of? I guess they'll have to blame Obama for it again. somehow a secret cabal of liberal gun experts got a Faux News demographic to be a patsy so they could get a Republican congress to do what a Democrat congress never could. Yep.

or we could just apply Occum's Razor. Maybe, just maybe, now stay with me here, maybe...angry white men with arsenals are...um...well....dangerous?

don't worry...i'll give you an hour to swallow that amazing concept. after all the other examples of it, I realize its really hard to rain on the wetdream of "Good guy with a gun" and that people afraid to join the military could become Rambo someday and save the world...and instead wonder if the white man with an arsenal might just, oh boy, be someone to keep an eye on.
 Kj521
Joined: 11/16/2016
Msg: 43
I'm No Gnome Of Grassy Knoll
Posted: 10/5/2017 4:30:24 PM
"or we could just apply Occum's Razor. Maybe, just maybe, now stay with me here, maybe...angry white men with arsenals are...um...well....dangerous?"



Where has been the outrage.....4,000 shooting victims in Chicago in 2016 ? Where was the Gun Grabbing Brigade last year? Don't those lives matter?

Why this shooting ? Why such outrage for the GGB to ride out on it's high horse?

White shooter....(mostly) white victims <----- evidence of White Privilege to garner such attention?

Or is it the bumpstock mod? If so....why was it approved during Obama admin wilh Hillary SOS?


Why does nobody care about Detroit...Chicago....and Baltimore???



vvvvv Those kids in Chicago....Detroit...and Baltimore are innocent.
 poppata
Joined: 8/6/2017
Msg: 44
I'm No Gnome Of Grassy Knoll
Posted: 10/5/2017 4:53:34 PM
""""Why does nobody care about Detroit...Chicago....and Baltimore???"""

What more can be done that isn't being done, and more importantly, what has Trump, after all his big talk..tried to do about it? Besides they are at war in Chicago at. al. ...soldiers in the gangs are the victims. They are choosing their fate in many cases. Part of their macho culture. These were totally innocents in Las Vegas.
 Yule_liquor
Joined: 12/7/2011
Msg: 45
I'm No Gnome Of Grassy Knoll
Posted: 10/5/2017 5:26:10 PM
#43 says


Why does nobody care about Detroit...Chicago....and Baltimore???


when you stop watching right wing media..then maybe you might start to realize what logical fallacies are

https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/97/Faulty_Comparison
 Kj521
Joined: 11/16/2016
Msg: 46
I'm No Gnome Of Grassy Knoll
Posted: 10/5/2017 5:34:16 PM
^^^^^And when you have worked with the DOJJ....you might understand what is going on with our youth.


Oh! And Mr. Yule?

You can take your logical fellatio and talk to your fire and brimstone preacher about it. :)




 Yule_liquor
Joined: 12/7/2011
Msg: 47
I'm No Gnome Of Grassy Knoll
Posted: 10/5/2017 6:50:25 PM
^


....you might understand what is going on with our youth.


well, since you have apparently been "enlightened" about inner city society, what is stopping you from going into Chicago's or detroit's mean streets...and sharing your revelations with the pple there, so that the violence will miraculously come to a stop!


talk to your fire and brimstone preacher about it.


Ummm, well,.. the original fire & brimstone preacher was Jesus (you know,.... that dude with the long hair, beard & blue eyes); where unlike the Hebrew Bible...spoke of Hell quite frequently in the NT, as the fate of those who spoke from both sides of their mouths

...back at ya!
 Kj521
Joined: 11/16/2016
Msg: 48
I'm No Gnome Of Grassy Knoll
Posted: 10/5/2017 7:04:18 PM
^^^^guaranteed I know and have done and do more "about inner city society" than you have ever even have had a passing thought of.


You sir, are the typical liberal bible thumping do nothing SJW wannabe....pfft!

Practice what you preach....or rather type.

You have nothing but limited time...do something constructive for society with it. :)
 woobytoodsday
Joined: 12/13/2006
Msg: 49
I'm No Gnome Of Grassy Knoll
Posted: 10/5/2017 8:13:14 PM
I've worked with accountants, and they are some of the angriest people I've ever met. And they're angry at *you*--because you laugh at them, and their concerns endlessly.

And then, of course, and evidently on no one's radar is Area 51. Assisted by grays, any number of awful things could be accomplished right before the public's eyes, and they wouldn't see a thing. For instance, it's well known amongst the grays that he used an anti-gravity sled to get all those guns up to his room. There were actually more than the police have reported due to the use of a cloak of invisibility. What we need to worry about is when the pods burst and millions of more angry gun nuts come pouring out.

Apologies to Potter fans.
 Yule_liquor
Joined: 12/7/2011
Msg: 50
I'm No Gnome Of Grassy Knoll
Posted: 10/5/2017 9:38:48 PM
@kj


guaranteed I know and have done and do more "about inner city society" than you


evidently, what you know (and do)...hasn't cut the mustard one bit, considering all the unmitigated violence that's been taking place!


You sir, are the typical liberal bible thumping


News flash!...there is no such thing as a liberal Bible thumper...try again!


do nothing SJW wannabe....pfft!


me, a SJW 'wannabe" LOL!...now I know I hit a nerve.


Practice what you preach


and as your clergy-person would say..."do as I say, not as I do"


You have nothing but limited time.


not as long as I keep putting quarters in the meter!


do something constructive for society with it.


hey, I was in construction, it ain't easy work yanno...unless you are Donald Trump, then you can rip-off pple with impunity and accomplish greatness "for society", as he has been known to do, eh?

aw, thanx for the smiley face (and the late nite laff)...I thought ya wuz mad at me.................hey, who stole my MAGA cap!
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