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 funchesf
Joined: 6/27/2014
Msg: 51
Las Vegas Carnage QuestionsPage 3 of 7    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7)

such as that in the U K, it is being presented as an instance of how gun-keeping conservatives or the National Rifle Association may be responsible for it.

those conservatives are better known as the "Founding Fathers" that included within the Constitution "The Second Amendment" that "endowed or perhaps cursed" Americans with a Constitutional Right to bear arms


Posted By: gtomustang
Morons too psychotic to make it into the military, or too scared to serve their country in an actual war, can now get their Rambo on.

remember...Rambo can eat stuff that would make a billy goat puke


Posted By: gtomustang
For some, gun bans are really about individual freedom.

especially if you have to go to the Outhouse in Bear country and a big old Grizzly comes "a knocking'


Posted By: gtomustang
What do we legally need armor-piercing rounds for? But Republicans wanted to vote this week to let "Copkiller" rounds be for sale again

the citizens (if needed) should be able to protect itself at the least with equal force from a tyrannical government ...(Founding Fathers)


Posted By: daynadaze
If she knew about his guns and didn't turn it in, yes she's part of what happened.

that bordering on McCarthyism ..... guilty by association


I realize the sheriff himself is claiming Paddock must have had an accomplice

since he was Christian ...perhaps God was his accomplice ....it's odd that no one is questioning if Christianity played a part in any of this


Posted By: Kj521
Where has been the outrage.....4,000 shooting victims in Chicago in 2016 ? Where was the Gun Grabbing Brigade last year? Don't those lives matter?

there's always been outrage ....but let an angry white privileged Chicagoan (other than the police) shoot and kill 59 people in less than 15 minutes then the outrage will always extend beyond the local news and onto the World News


Posted By: Kj521
Why does nobody care about Detroit...Chicago....and Baltimore???

now you understand the purpose of "Black Lives Matter"


Posted By: gtomustang
Gun owners say there's enough laws. That's true, so why restrict government ability to enforce the laws that exist?

because those laws are in violation of the Constitution ... the only way to Constitutionally impose gun laws is to first get rid of the 2 amendment and that action within itself would be in violation of The Constitution

you could try and circumvent the Constitution by making gun control a mental health issue which the NRA did agree to this but later recant because all the government would have to do is impose "Funchism"

FUNCHISM
the first rule of society is acknowledge that all it's citizens (except me) are insane and in need of protection .... from themselves ... funches 3:16
 daynadaze
Joined: 2/11/2008
Msg: 52
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Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/6/2017 10:29:24 AM
Yeah right, if you suppect some is hording arms, has a hot temper, a father who pulled something shady too, yeah you could very well be legally involved. This man didn't act normal then one day become a crazy, murdering monster, there were signs.
 from site to sight
Joined: 11/30/2007
Msg: 53
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/6/2017 11:20:23 AM
"This man didn't act normal then one day become a crazy, murdering monster, there were signs."

Signs-like what? If he wasn't doing anything illegal prior to the shooting, what could anyone do? If people can be locked up just for acting weird or out of the ordinary, half of the people in the U.S. would be locked up.
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 54
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/6/2017 1:41:05 PM
"the citizens (if needed) should be able to protect itself at the least with equal force from a tyrannical government ...(Founding Fathers)"

>>>with all due respect, the Tyrannical government has drones, has donated armored cars to your local police dept, which may or may not have experimented with robots killing a suspect this summer. Your AK-47 replica is going to work as well as it did for members of ISIS and Al Queda killed in Yemen, Iraq, Afganistan...

"where has been the outrage, 4.000 victims in Chicago?"

>>the outrage was channeled and directed at BLM, which expressed its own outrage at it, and recently the outrage was diverted at football players taking a knee in outrage. Indeed, where is the outrage? Like the country music singer said, "now that they're shooting at me, I regret my efforts against gun control"

"the only way to constitutionally impose gun laws is to get rid of the amendment"

>>>so how do we get to restrict the First Amendment when someone shouts fire in a crowded theatre? :) How do we decide that corporations are people and have Free Speech rights? The Supreme Court is allowed to interpret.

"that action itself would be in violation of the Constitution"

>>>Actually, we can vote to adjust things, we made alcohol illegal and then made it legal again.

as for any signs this guy gave, its interesting how many witnesses who dealt with him in prior weeks can't agree if he was a great provider or standoffish. Maybe he was seriously bipolar.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 55
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Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/6/2017 2:19:35 PM
Today I discovered that along with being an accountant, real estate investor and professional gambler, he also worked for the post office at some point. That pretty much explains it all. Remember back when "Going Postal" was a regular event? He's just old school.

“If so....why was it approved during Obama admin wilh Hillary SOS?”

I’m not sure what the hell the Secretary of State has to do with bump stocks other than you hate her and it’s just an automatic reflex to blame everything on her, but bump stocks were approved by the ATF *during* the Obama administration (but not by Obama himself) because the legal minds there determined bump stocks were not covered by the firearms laws that powered their organization, since they were accessories and not actual firearms. Had they banned them, you and other conservative mutants would have complained about executive overreach – even now, the hard right (such as GOA) is clamoring that for the ATF to do anything about them without Congress passing a new law explicitly aimed at them would be overreach, despite the fact that that philosophy is actually running counter to the NRA’s philosophy, as they don’t want Congress to pass a law (fearful of what all else could be attached to it) and want the ATF to reinterpret the law and therefore ruling. What a mess.

“Why does nobody care about Detroit...Chicago....and Baltimore???”

Maybe because most of those “victims” are gangsters? Yeah, sure, some true innocents get caught up in it every now and then, but most inner city murder victims have been criminals with long rap sheets. Chicago has 100,000 gang members – more than there are Cook County NRA members. It’s a family culture that’s damn near impossible to undo. The father was a gang banger, the grandfather was a gang banger, the son is a gang banger – the only life most of them know from birth is gang banging, just like the only life you know is rich white conservative Christian socialite. The only ways to fix this problem is to either let them kill each other into extinction (as happened to some extent in Juarez) or take some seriously drastic and undoubtedly highly questionable legal methods. I’m not so sure Chicago isn’t over-hyped anyway – it had far more killings in the 70s, 80s and 90s than it had last year. Yeah, there was a “surge” from 2015 to 2016 that isn’t completely understood, but seems likely the gangs got themselves into a runaway greenhouse effect with revenge murder schemes. It happens. Besides setting off a nuke in the middle of the Southside, there’s no quick and easy way to fix this problem.

Although, in all likelihood, fixing it will be easier than stopping another Paddock, for whom there is no understanding other than sociopathia at this point. But again Paddock is the exception of all exceptions – he is THE MAN – most other mass murderers had plenty of red flags that could have tripped them up if those around them had been paying attention or the proper procedures or laws were in place. It's becoming more and more apparent that Paddock is not one of those. Even the somewhat negative behavior being described of him by prostitutes and neighbors and whatnot sounds like many people I know that never mow down hundreds of people. Heck, he sounds quite a bit like the typical Trump supporting bully! But it does seem extremely likely at this point he had no agenda, political or otherwise -- just finally decided it was time to kill a lot of people, and a country music concert in Vegas came up snake eyes.
 Kj521
Joined: 11/16/2016
Msg: 56
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/6/2017 2:59:44 PM
"Maybe because most of those “victims” are gangsters? Yeah, sure, some true innocents get caught up in it every now and then, but most inner city murder victims have been criminals with long rap sheets. Chicago has 100,000 gang members"


That is a disgusting answer and far from acceptable.
 funchesf
Joined: 6/27/2014
Msg: 57
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/6/2017 3:05:25 PM

Posted By: Daynadaze
Yeah right, if you suppect some is hording arms, has a hot temper, a father who pulled something shady too,

you just described President Trump ...


Posted By: Daynadaze
yeah you could very well be legally involved

not informing that a crime is about to be committed might at the least be morally reprehensible but not illegal


Posted By: Daynadaze
This man didn't act normal then one day become a crazy, murdering monster,.

as Morpheus would say to Neo ....What is acting normal? ... ..other than "me" can you name anyone else in this forum that act normal?


Posted By: Daynadaze
there were signs

perhaps the gambling? ...it could be as simple as if he didn't win a bundle at the casino...that he would carry out that plan ...it could be that he did win at the casino near Chicago and/or other cities and forfeited the plan


Posted By: gtomustang
with all due respect, the Tyrannical government has drones, has donated armored cars to your local police dept,

if anything The Vietnam War taught that it's not the equipment you have...but how you use it


Posted By: gtomustang
Your AK-47 replica is going to work as well as it did for members of ISIS and Al Queda killed in Yemen, Iraq, Afganistan...

if only that was True with the Las Vegas shooter's equipment


so how do we get to restrict the First Amendment when someone shouts fire in a crowded theatre? :) How do we decide that corporations are people and have Free Speech rights? The Supreme Court is allowed to interpret

the fact that you can get sued for Slander and/or Libel is why Freedom of Speech is an illusion ...

if you have to "pay" consequences ...then it's not Free ..... funches 3:16


Posted By: gtomustang
Actually, we can vote to adjust things, we made alcohol illegal and then made it legal again.

although some wish it so ....drinking alcohol is not a Constitutional Right
 ThroatLozenge
Joined: 3/2/2016
Msg: 58
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/6/2017 3:20:02 PM
I don't see Buddhists shooting people.
 woobytoodsday
Joined: 12/13/2006
Msg: 59
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/6/2017 8:38:25 PM
I don't see Buddhists shooting people.

Myanmar. . . .
 forever_live_and_die
Joined: 10/3/2017
Msg: 60
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/6/2017 9:17:29 PM
11 L_LuuLuu "He did attract a crowd that would have included a lot of persons from the Right."

Really! How does a man who by all reports barely interacted with his neighbors attract any kind of crowd. You've been talking with halcyon haven't you.

11 " Was she herself, too crazy to identify a problem?"

He owned guns and acted pretty much normal. Where's the problem to identify?

11 "So here's a hypothetical question for you all: IF authorities question Marilou, and it is determined that she knew, but was afraid to speak -- Should she be prosecuted?"

Knew what? Mass murderers in order to be successful tend to keep their plans to themselves.

20 deetristate " such a law were on the books, it’s not clear the Las Vegas massacre would qualify as an act of domestic terrorism. There is a federal definition of the term ? yes, even though there isn’t a charge. An act of domestic terrorism must be intended to intimidate or coerce a civilian population, to influence a government policy by intimidation or coercion, or to affect the conduct of government by mass destruction, assassination or kidnapping."

Actually applies to any type of terrorism in the world. You shared the American version.
 halcyon_skies
Joined: 7/27/2015
Msg: 61
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/6/2017 11:07:25 PM

Really! How does a man who by all reports barely interacted with his neighbors attract any kind of crowd. You've been talking with halcyon haven't you.


I haven't talked to anyone, but I'm pretty sure she meant to say "attack" rather than "attract".
 daynadaze
Joined: 2/11/2008
Msg: 62
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Posted: 10/6/2017 11:25:13 PM
Both of you can go on about what you want to make what I said, twisting, but you know what I said and what I meant. Good gawd, I do not know if his girlfriend was involved or not, but we all know that many times the partner does know something is very wrong and often they are involved and can be arrested too. Good grief, how hard is that to understand?
 congupnaroad
Joined: 7/22/2015
Msg: 63
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Posted: 10/7/2017 1:16:22 AM
Why the hell are bump stocks legal to buy and own, but illegal to use? That is about as dumb as saying to a dope head, yes you can buy a bong but it is illegal to use it to smoke dope.

The gun nutters, err I mean NRA are saying they would not oppose the banning of bump stocks! No doubt they will do a big back flip when the gun nutters in the US get all sulky about it.
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 64
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/7/2017 5:58:12 AM
"why are bumpstocks legal to buy and own, but illegal to use?"

>>so that owners can be...collectors. "For Display Purposes Only" and all that crap.
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 65
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/7/2017 1:42:43 PM
coming soon to a reality near you...what happens when "good guys with guns" just can't keep their gun in their pants, er, holsters.

Seems like a joke, but it will occur one of these days...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4T41M7cCqsU

Hopefully not while Chump is shooting someone on Fifth Avenue and getting away with it. "you're fired!"
 DDSearle
Joined: 5/20/2017
Msg: 66
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Posted: 10/7/2017 2:56:35 PM
Focusing on the 'Nth Amendment' or 'bump stocks' may be deflecting us from finding why this massacre occurred. Stephen Craig Paddock & 'Marilou Danley' may have been acting strangely since August (this year). And the shooter's brother, Eric H Paddock, when interviewed, displays more grimaces and shrugs than a Frenchman. For me, he seems suspicious too. There are other reports that Eric (the other brother) Paddock may be a 'drug' dealer. What a family!
 Yule_liquor
Joined: 12/7/2011
Msg: 67
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/8/2017 7:13:55 PM
The NRA "shoots down" Bump stock ban

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/nra-opposes-outright-us-ban-on-bump-stocks-used-by-las-vegas-killer/ar-AAt5znr?li=BBnb7Kz

The NRA Pres states (paraphrase) that bans "don't do anything".
Unfortunately this may be true because there are so many in the hands of gun owners that a "ban" may have little effect for the portion of owners who are NOT law-abiding, to begin with....such as the Vegas shooter

However, the NRA contunues to resist any form of gun control regardless of what effects any such law may have, and as long as they have the GOP in both houses, little will change.
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 68
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/9/2017 5:35:22 AM
"""""The NRA said, "The Obama administration approved the sale of bump fire stocks on at least two occasions."

We indeed found two occasions in which ATF, a bureau within the executive branch, decided it could not regulate bump stocks during the Obama administration.

These decisions allowed two companies to sell bump stocks. It’s important to note this was not a statement of Obama’s preferred policy, which called for more regulation of guns, but was what the agency determined it had to do under the language of current law.

We rate this statement Mostly True.""""


So what should be done with this problem left behind for Trump to deal with?

Outlaw them.

Won't stop real gun enthusiasts or bringing them in from Mexico ( that border thing) from making their own

but it is something.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 69
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Posted: 10/9/2017 2:13:25 PM
“That is a disgusting answer and far from acceptable.”

Is it now?

http://www.wnd.com/2013/03/most-murder-victims-in-big-cities-have-criminal-record/

“A review of murder statistics across America shows that in many large cities, up to 90 percent of the victims have criminal records…Of the victims of murder in Chicago from 2003 to 2011, an average of 77 percent had a prior arrest history, with a high of 79 percent of the 436 murdered in Chicago in 2010 having arrest histories.”

Although apparently no such study has been done for 2016 (and obviously we’re still in 2017), it seems pretty likely the percentage is even higher with the murder surge. And no doubt the vast majority of the likely 10-15% of innocent victims were associates of criminals or in an overwhelmingly criminal neighborhood – not blaming them for being there (especially the babies), but just saying, gang warfare is the reason why this is happening. Gang warfare in a gang culture. A very difficult cycle of poverty to break. It’s just a fact of life: most people end up in the environment they were born into – a handful of the privileged fall into the ghettos, a handful of the ghetto babies escape to become the privileged, but the vast majority of us will die just like we were born. If I was born in a Chicago ghetto, I’d probably be dead or in jail right now after living a life of criminality, just like my parents, my friends and everybody I knew. Instead I was born in lily white rural Alabama to highly educated, extremely moral middle-class parents. Which kept me out of criminality, led to a strong education and a successful legitimate career, but messed me up something good in other ways – you can’t grow up a person of color in the most racist place on earth during one of the most racist times in history and there not be some negative side effects. Point is, nurture is a lot more important than nature in most cases. Being smart in the ghetto usually just means you end up being a better criminal than the average idiot in the ghetto. Didn’t “Trading Places” teach you guys anything?

BTW, less you think that link is “fake news” I’ve dug up to shoot down your response, it does come from a conservative right wing site. Which normally might make me question the article’s integrity, except the studies it cites are in legitimate peer-reviewed publications – plus, whether you believe it or not, what they say is just common sense. I don’t even understand what you’re whining about in this case – I’m pretty much agreeing with your party’s platform, which is: THUGS BAD. The vast majority of conservative Republicans would be happy to see the inner cities burn to the ground, and I’ve never seen anything out of you that would suggest you’re any different. In fact, I swear my answer seemed like it normally would have been YOUR answer, except I said it before you did, so instead it "disgusts" you.

“Outlaw them. Won't stop real gun enthusiasts or bringing them in from Mexico ( that border thing) from making their own. but it is something.”

Obviously I was gone for a LONG time when I come back to discover you’re almost making sense.
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 70
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/9/2017 4:18:23 PM
"the NRA said the Obama administration approved the sale of bumpstocks "

>>>so why was there such a slander about Obama wanting to take away guns?

"NRA’s lobbying arm, the Institute for Legislative Action, called the plan “the largest gun grab in American history” and an “egregious case of bureaucratic over-reach.”

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jul/27/obama-pushing-for-largest-gun-grab-in-american-his/?cache

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/01/05/congress-quickly-end-obamas-gun-grab/

were the NRA and the Republicans exaggerating about Obama's relationship with gun laws?
 Yule_liquor
Joined: 12/7/2011
Msg: 71
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/9/2017 4:20:25 PM
@ Hawk ^

But didn't you know that KJ works for the DOJJ....and she is (of course) soooo blessedly knowledgeable on these life matters more than those who experience it directly!
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 72
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/10/2017 3:40:46 AM
when people in "inner cities" get arrested for walking or standing as well as for other things for which Buffy and Brad's parents would be called instrad of an arrest, OF COURSE a large percentage have arrest records.
Doesn't make them criminals or guilty of anything at the time shot.
It also doesn't make the killing of kids playing or grandmas sitting near a window acceptable.


Police know who has the guns and who the drug supppliers and gun providers are and they do not live in the inner city and people in the inner city are not bringing guns and drugs to town or across the border.

they don't want to do anything.
they are not interested enough to make the schools less than terrible
and are not interested in requiring landlords to provide decent housing.
why i am no longer a democrat or leftist.

Dems are fine with all sorts of debauchery and spending funds on rainbow flags and removing statues rather than education, road repair, law enforcement, recreation center updates, after school programs or in the case of new orleans, repairing pumps that the city needs, requires.
 poppata
Joined: 8/6/2017
Msg: 73
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/10/2017 6:00:18 AM
^^^ perhaps if you accepted the actual problems...parents and inner city culture, perhaps if you accepted the blame and realized you were the only solution...perhaps if you stopped blaming everybody else and put the blame where it really belongs, then and only then would things get better.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 74
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Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/10/2017 6:16:49 AM
Dee: Most of those studies differentiated between misdemeanors and felonies and didn’t include misdemeanor arrests or citations as “criminal activity.” Most of the Chicago murder victims specifically had violent and/or narcotic trafficking felonies on their record. Again, largely gangs killing each other. Nevertheless, I agree that police are far more likely to arrest (and shoot) black and Hispanic people for doing the same things white people get away with – that’s been statistically proven numerous times as well. My main argument with our own Buffy is that she’s shedding a bunch of crocodile tears over something she otherwise doesn’t give a damn about, and you’re well aware of that. The second a major mass murder happens, it’s “But what about Chicago???” when not a single Buffy could have cared less about Chicago at any other point in time except when it suits them in an argument with “libtards.” I guarantee you more truly innocent people were murdered in Las Vegas last Sunday night than have been murdered in Chicago this year.

“Dems are fine with all sorts of debauchery and spending funds on rainbow flags and removing statues rather than education, road repair, law enforcement, recreation center updates, after school programs or in the case of new orleans, repairing pumps that the city needs, requires.”

That’s not a Democrat thing – that’s a politician thing. When was the last time you saw a Republican vote to raise taxes for infrastructure? Politics is a weird business – it takes an ambitious personality to want to do it, and ambitious personalities are always concerned with winning the next election, which means avoiding politically dangerous actions, yet nearly all great accomplishments were politically dangerous. If Democrats aren’t spending for infrastructure, that means they either don’t have the money or they’re not in power. If Republicans aren’t spending for infrastructure, it means they’re being Republicans. Where you got this idea that Republicans want to build things up instead of tear things down is beyond me, considering that’s basically their motto: tearing government down. When the hell have you ever heard Republicans talk about recreation center updates, after school programs or city pumps? The only time they talk about road repair is when they hit a pothole in their neighborhood. Certainly they talk about law enforcement all the time – including about hassling inner city people for walking or standing, because as Giuliani pointed out, you gotta “get tough” on the little crimes and stop-and-frisk the innocent in order to conquer the bigger crimes, right? Now Trump’s main man (when he’s not betraying him on Russia) Sessions wants to make even more small time “criminals” pay big time, including arresting marijuana smokers who are obeying state law. How can you not see how this completely contradicts your concern about the reputations of some Chicago murder victims?

None of this is to suggest I think it is in any way okay for inner city kids to be killed while playing or for grandmas to die while sitting next to a window. Or for that matter even a felon who’s served his time to be mowed down in gang crossfire on his way to work or while trying to help a friend in trouble. But I’m pretty damn sick and tired of members of the racist wing of the conservative movement like Head Cheerleader trying to have it both ways on Chicago. You sit over there crying about Chicago every time some white person infamously kills some people but celebrate every time a black “thug” gets knocked off by the police. That’s some of that razzle-dazzle sh*t and all that jazz.
 Yule_liquor
Joined: 12/7/2011
Msg: 75
Las Vegas Carnage Questions
Posted: 10/10/2017 6:34:32 AM
@Dee


...rather than education, road repair, law enforcement, recreation center updates, after school programs or in the case of new orleans, repairing pumps that the city needs, requires.


how much is the GOP paying you to be their troll?
I'm sure that even you can't that stupid to believe that the GOP is for what you wrote ^ above
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