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Show ALL Forums  > Relationships  > Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the      Home login  
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 PennyAnte
Joined: 4/17/2016
Msg: 26
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Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!Page 2 of 3    (1, 2, 3)
"What product would he be selling, based on his post?"

He probably will come back with an 800 # to call to order his book

"Are You Failing In Relationships?"

or " Why Are You Attracted to Low Life Guys?"

or "Ten Ways To Find the Most Dreamy Guy Ever"
 __TEXASCHICK__
Joined: 11/9/2011
Msg: 27
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 imanorangetiger
Joined: 12/29/2011
Msg: 28
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Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/3/2017 4:24:29 AM
Isn't this just another "please please please date me" post? If he was really a 'number 1' guy, he wouldn't be posting about it at all. In fact, he'd be happy in a relationship already. This is the problem with some who think they're MWGTOW, but really aren't. A real man doesn't need MWGTOW; they're happy in their own skin already and embrace life for what it is.
 Cynderella
Joined: 3/8/2007
Msg: 29
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Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/3/2017 5:41:14 AM
I learn something new everyday
from these forms...
MWGTOW I never heard of this before.
Time to Google...
 ThePigOfYourDreams
Joined: 6/30/2017
Msg: 30
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/3/2017 6:32:59 AM
I'm not sure how you would classify the idea of walking away from or abandoning a concept as a "movement". To my knowledge, MGTOW isn't rallying to push any sort of political agenda.

Furthermore, if a man wants nothing to do with relationships or marriage, why does anyone care? Your focus might be better placed on the men who *do* involve themselves with them and are abusive.
 9Pluto
Joined: 10/15/2007
Msg: 31
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Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/3/2017 8:37:35 AM

Sounds to me as though you don't even like women very much.

I did not draw this conclusion from any specific evidence I could find in the OP's disjunctive ramble.

WTF? The most dreamy guy ever vs low life scum sucking bottom dwellers... Ok. Is that all there is? Nothing in between?
I agree with PennyAnte on this one, that the OP erroneously fits people into the binary labels of "dreamy" and "scum-sucking", based on a series of non-sequiturs, excluding any middle ground.

Furthermore, if a man wants nothing to do with relationships or marriage, why does anyone care?
This is at odds with the tradition espoused in the Abrahamic religions, so there is a moral stigma attached.

The original post just sounds to me like someone who went insane reading innumerable variants on "Are there any good men left?" (a.k.a., Are there any good women left?") one time too many.
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 32
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/3/2017 9:53:43 AM
MWGTOW seem to sit between "methinks he doth protest too much" and "stop me before I kill again". If you are withdrawing from something, then go ahead and good luck. Some, however, aren't hoping to hear "oh, but you're too attractive, please don't deny women your brazen manhood", but wish to sell the movement for some reason. But as we men all know. you can't tell any man what he's doing wrong in his search for pleasure :)

if a man who has nothing individual to offer to a relationship (ie, a characteristic a woman could get from another man), and he wants nothing to do with relationships...trust me, no one cares. That man becomes part of the background.
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 33
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Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/3/2017 12:59:15 PM

I did not draw this conclusion from any specific evidence I could find in the OP's disjunctive ramble.

I could see him not liking dating very much, from it -- and to question whether he has issue with women in general. I think he does to some degree, but I think it's a dual frustration with women & the guys they choose over him all the time. :)

I agree with PennyAnte on this one, that the OP erroneously fits people into the binary labels of "dreamy" and "scum-sucking"

While painting the picture that almost all guys are "scum-sucking", and very few are "dreamy" -- where He himself is one of those rarities, but very easy to spot. :)

This is at odds with the tradition espoused in the Abrahamic religions, so there is a moral stigma attached.

I think it's more at odds with the basics of human social nature If he's Never wanting to be in a Relationship Ever (reinforced by just about any religion or particular family lifestyle). However, I think that's pretty uncommon, but unfortunately falsely labeled when the guy just doesn't want "you".

If a guy wants nothing to do with being in a Relationship, this crosses my mind: He doesn't want to be in a Relationship with a particular gal (big difference), but is willing to hang-out, date a bit, play around, etc. Being open to that isn't at odds with anything (sans the sexual-relations part if included, for conservative traditions), as long as he isn't leading anyone on. And it doesn't mean he's not open to being in a Relationship with an idealistic gal. In fact, it's always assumed he will/can be -- hence the frustration of the particular gal he's willing to hang-out with or only lightly date. He can, just not with her. Hence the back-of-mind feeling, "I'm not good enough."

The guys who seemingly never want to be in a Relationship -- I think they are Potentially open to it, but just not chasing it and also calling it off as an option.... because it'd take a rare catch for them, thus kind of a depressing thought... especially when the women he Can realistically find/catch are better as friends, FWB, or just to lightly date with no strings/expectations attached.
 forumslady
Joined: 12/7/2016
Msg: 34
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/3/2017 9:49:49 PM
PennyAnte- "What product would he be selling, based on his post?"

He probably will come back with an 800 # to call to order his book

"Are You Failing In Relationships?"

or " Why Are You Attracted to Low Life Guys?"

or "Ten Ways To Find the Most Dreamy Guy Ever"

That is all hilarious and painfully accurate, at that. ;)
 cooldog65
Joined: 6/27/2011
Msg: 35
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Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/3/2017 11:16:59 PM
Number 2 guys are full of crap...

Scum bag guys should be number 0 (zero) guys.
 ThePigOfYourDreams
Joined: 6/30/2017
Msg: 36
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 5:19:07 AM

but wish to sell the movement for some reason.


But take a look at what the rest of the world is selling. Pure bullshit. Silly notions that relationships and marriages are the only true way to find happiness. Let's be honest and cut the shit. Most marriages and long-term relationships are miserable, lifeless, mundane, and the only reason why most bother to stay in them is because they don't want to go through the hassle of starting all over again, they can't do any better, or for financial reasons. Things like MGTOW need to exist to counter the ridiculous media driven fairy tales and idiots who are out to shame anyone who questions or doubts any of it.


trust me, no one cares.


Then there should be no commentary or criticism whatsoever from anyone when they hear of someone who has chosen not to buy into the relationship and marriage nonsense, but that's almost never the case. Instead, they bombard the person with guilt trip crap like "that's just not normal" or ''oh, you just haven't found the right one, you'll change your mind."
 zsuzsa62
Joined: 1/31/2016
Msg: 37
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 5:32:37 AM
"But take a look at what the rest of the world is selling. Pure bullshit. Silly notions that relationships and marriages are the only true way to find happiness. Let's be honest and cut the shit. Most marriages and long-term relationships are miserable, lifeless, mundane, and the only reason why most bother to stay in them is because they don't want to go through the hassle of starting all over again, they can't do any better, or for financial reasons. Things like MGTOW need to exist to counter the ridiculous media driven fairy tales and idiots who are out to shame anyone who questions or doubts any of it. "

^^^^ this sounds so cynical but even when I try NOT to think like that I can't help it because it's what I see so very much of the time. Over and over. It's like the rule, rather than the exception.
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 38
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 5:57:44 AM
"But somewhere along the way MGTOW became what it is now. Guys being obnoxious towards women. Believing that they are entitled and that women are low life scum....(think of) Feminists gone wrong, totally over board, and you will see the other side...Its just grim thinking for either sex to blame an entire gender. Foolish and unattractive. Its not what either movement was set up for."

>>>good points!

"but look at what the rest of the world is selling--silly notions that relationships and marriages are the only true way to find happiness"

>>>Disney is great for this. They get help from everyone invested in making relationships. Still...homosapians are social animals, descended from social animals. Some who don't teach that relationships are the answer, sell material wealth as the solution to happiness :) Half of marriages end in divorce, its true. Of course, children also bring "the highest of highs, the lowest of lows". and people still have children, tho alas, it does seem too many have children in order to get some unconditional love into their lives.

i'll go out on a limb, and suggest a good portion of people seeking happiness in another human being, or in material wealth...lack what they need to find happiness inside themselves. They're too insecure to appreciate what they see in the mirror. Or they lack an ability to enjoy the simple things in life and be entertained by things that are not shiny or loud or brand new to them. Or the old saying, "success isn't achieving more, its enjoying what you already have" doesn't work for them b/c they need to constantly employ retail therapy.
 ThePigOfYourDreams
Joined: 6/30/2017
Msg: 39
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 6:02:25 AM

^^^^ this sounds so cynical but even when I try NOT to think like that I can't help it because it's what I see so very much of the time. Over and over. It's like the rule, rather than the exception.


It's just the reality. How many people can honestly say the vast majority of couples they know who are in a long-term relationship or marriage are still in it because they are truly happy and genuine love is what's holding it all together? Even if they claimed this to be true, I would never believe it. As I said, reality needs fair representation in all of this. Fantasy has ruled for far too long.
 Manofsubstance1970
Joined: 7/8/2017
Msg: 40
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Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 8:55:40 AM
Clearly a few people are pretty ignorant about MTGOW and they really do need to get themselves educated. Of course feminists don't like MGTOW, because it exposes the double standards in western society and highlights the attacks by feminists on the white western male's human rights. I have seen SJWs rant and I see in their eyes the fear and hatred of men. Look at Canada, Look at sweden. look at Germany and you will see how toxic feminism really is. These feminists want a society, without male masculinity, without boys doing well in education and without gender labels, well biology separates male from female.

No society can ever attempt to play god with someone's biology, but feminists already have in Canada, A male baby boy was born this year and the parents refused to name the gender? Why? because they want to manipulate, that innocent child into what they want him to be. What a sick world we live when people are allowed to invade our human rights at birth and dictate to us, who we are and what gender we are, but that really does highlight the sickness of feminism.

MGTOW - Men Going Their Own Way and seeing the light, after decades of feminist brainwashing and shaming of good men..."I am proud to be a masculine white western man and will never be anything else".
 ohenryx
Joined: 3/12/2010
Msg: 41
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Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 10:21:40 AM


Think Feminists gone wrong, totally over board, and you will see the other side...

Its just grim thinking for either sex to blame an entire gender. Foolish and unattractive. Its not what either movement was set up for.

I think the feminists went start raving mad when they came up with “A woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle”. And these days, MGTOW seems equally crazy.

We each need the other or the species is going to die out, and rather quickly! And before anyone says it, I do think that women are useful for a lot more than procreation.



Silly notions that relationships and marriages are the only true way to find happiness. Let's be honest and cut the shit. Most marriages and long-term relationships are miserable, lifeless, mundane, and the only reason why most bother to stay in them is because they don't want to go through the hassle of starting all over again, they can't do any better, or for financial reasons.

I really can’t argue with this point. I do know people who really are in love, and are very happy with their relationship (married or otherwise). But they are the minority. Most married people I know are not that happy with their relationship.

We can argue all day about why, and what needs to be different, but … It is what it is.
 ohenryx
Joined: 3/12/2010
Msg: 42
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Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 10:30:01 AM

norwegianguy456
If a guy wants nothing to do with being in a Relationship, this crosses my mind: He doesn't want to be in a Relationship with a particular gal (big difference), but is willing to hang-out, date a bit, play around, etc. Being open to that isn't at odds with anything (sans the sexual-relations part if included, for conservative traditions), as long as he isn't leading anyone on. And it doesn't mean he's not open to being in a Relationship with an idealistic gal. In fact, it's always assumed he will/can be -- hence the frustration of the particular gal he's willing to hang-out with or only lightly date. He can, just not with her. Hence the back-of-mind feeling, "I'm not good enough."

I have had conversations with 2 different women recently who accused me of being a player. And it boiled down to exactly what NG stated, above.

But … you really can’t say that to the woman who’s just called you a player. You just smile ruefully and say something like, “I’m sorry you feel that way.”
 ThroatLozenge
Joined: 3/2/2016
Msg: 43
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 10:53:43 AM
Blue collar sex is amazing but won’t typically result in a cohabiting thingy
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 44
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Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 12:15:31 PM

^^^^ this sounds so cynical but even when I try NOT to think like that I can't help it because it's what I see so very much of the time. Over and over. It's like the rule, rather than the exception.

It sounds cynical, but that's only to draw attention to the silliness of culture that pushes what isn't really true. It's not an anti-woman or anti-guy statement he made -- just anti-what-culture-says-and-culture-doesn't-really-question, for both genders. You could rephrase it where it doesn't have a WTH tone to it -- but doesn't change it from being factual (just would capture one's attention less to truly question what they've been conditioned about).

How many people can honestly say the vast majority of couples they know who are in a long-term relationship or marriage are still in it because they are truly happy and genuine love is what's holding it all together? Even if they claimed this to be true, I would never believe it.

They exist, but I think it's Attachment that holds them together, once already established. You throw kids in there, you just poured some extra glue (although also more potential stress for opp direction; ymmv overall). And of course, the Cultural concept that also keeps it retained, Emotionally. That's fine for people in Survival Mode, but in the 21st century, well, it's sort of laughable. But conditioned that way? That's how people just Are around you in life? Won't be laughing.

Fantasy has ruled for far too long.

It's a fantasy for some when in Young adulthood (many females), culturally to get hitched, have babies, be on Christmas cards -- "Look at me, ma!" That sort of thing is one of the main driving forces. But what helps perpetuate that? Parents. And past young adulthood, it's still there as many have hopped on that boat, for better or worse... where in older adulthood, it's no so much a fantasy... but avoiding an Anti-fantasy of being single as a Way of Life and "sticking out". It doesn't matter if the low-key shunning/criticism has true objective merit -- it can be totally void of merit -- but we're communal beings, that doesn't matter.

And putting myself in parental shoes with kids who are young-adults... *I* want them to get hitched, get married, have a couple kids -- and live that lifestyle. Kind of like me wanting them to have a nice Prom Date. What? Be a weird loner? No way! Okay, you're not? What, be a party animal? Heck no! You're missing something in Life Itself if you don't, because *I'm* missing something for you not doing so. And you're going to stick out, and you know it -- for what? How self-minded are you to be so... self-only? I can't imagine not being in a married/settled-down lifestyle, as it has been for years and years and years -- I don't know what that's actually like. Look at all the unhappy people who aren't. Sure, if I was in a hellish marriage, I understand, but I'm not. But this is what We Should Want -- otherwise YOU have the problem, not me! Go ahead, measure it up against society -- see who's on the weird side of the line! That's you, buddy! --- That's the POV.

I have had conversations with 2 different women recently who accused me of being a player. And it boiled down to exactly what NG stated, above.

I have, too, but I didn't limit it to smiling and saying I'm Sorry You Feel That Way. In my nature, when a gal who I've dated some is laying out all the cards on the table -- I'll let it be known. It also makes her realize in Actuality, "It's not you, it's me." Yes, of course I can be in an LTR off in the sunset, indefinitely. Yep. But the concept itself doesn't draw me in, hence, I'm going to be more "picky". I'm actually emotionally independent, where many people aren't. The concept itself, which IS the Same as being in love with being in love, has no force on me. Things are more clear -- and it's not LTR-or-bust. So why is me willing to date lightly-only a slap, when a guy over there won't even want to date you at all?

And thru dating experiences for many years, many gals out there Are in the same boat as I am -- notably when on the rebound still -- and that's OK, but not for a guy, notably when he's not on the rebound? Want me to make it up that I'm still swooning over an Ex? Is that going to make ya feel better? It shouldn't -- but ahhh, for your ego it can. That's what it's all about. :)
 zsuzsa62
Joined: 1/31/2016
Msg: 45
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 12:26:39 PM
"It sounds cynical, but that's only to draw attention to the silliness of culture that pushes what isn't really true. It's not an anti-woman or anti-guy statement he made -- just anti-what-culture-says-and-culture-doesn't-really-question, for both genders. You could rephrase it where it doesn't have a WTH tone to it -- but doesn't change it from being factual (just would capture one's attention less to truly question what they've been conditioned about)."

I didn't find his statement anti-woman or anti-guy at all and so doesn't need re-phrasing... as I originally said ...my observation is that...it's like the rule, not the exception. I know lots of people that question it.
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 6/16/2017
Msg: 46
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 2:55:25 PM

(randyhollywood) So whats a number 1 guy???


Me.


(randyhollywood) So whats a number 2 guy???


Not me.


(randyhollywood) Thats easy!


You're right, it was.

Arlo T.
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 6/16/2017
Msg: 47
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 3:14:25 PM
The MGTOW needs to... just stop.

Whenever a movement gets labelled, it's past its effective phase. Its adherents just want the glitz-n-glamour that goes with the label, almost always without understanding *WHY*.

The Greeks had a saying (the, "Hey, let's build sh!t out of marble!" Greeks, not the, "Hey, let's trash our economy, then beg the EU to bail us out!" Greeks):

"The deed is everything; the glory, nothing."
 halcyon_skies
Joined: 7/27/2015
Msg: 48
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 3:17:34 PM


(randyhollywood) So whats a number 1 guy???


Me.


I prefer to use the terms, "alpha" and "beta" as opposed to "number 1" and "number 2"---which conjure up images of toilet training a toddler.
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 6/16/2017
Msg: 49
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 3:36:13 PM



(randyhollywood) So whats a number 1 guy???


(AT) Me.


(halcyon_skies) I prefer to use the terms, "alpha" and "beta" as opposed to "number 1" and "number 2"---which conjure up images of toilet training a toddler.


Meh, keep it simple: category #1 is Arlo. Category #2 is every other chap in the world..
 Dinno76
Joined: 11/2/2017
Msg: 50
Are you failing in relationships/dating all the time??? Consider the number 1 and number 2 theory!
Posted: 12/4/2017 6:24:26 PM
Most ladies find number 2 more exciting . That is why they always pick door number 2
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