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 vlad dracul
Joined: 4/30/2009
Msg: 176
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Random Musings - Talk About EverthingPage 8 of 26    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26)
Any one watch that Patrick Keilty thing on bbc 1 the other night? I just watched it on the iplayer thing. What a cracking programme.

His auld man was murdered by the uvf. He speaks to arlene foster who's dad just escaped with his life from an ira attack. She also escaped an ira attack.

He speaks to former uvf man billy hutchinson in north belfast who is now a community politico.

Former ira jail commander (whis name ive forgot) who runs the felons club for former provos.

The most telling is the geezer who was blinded by a plastic bullet when he was 10. He eventually meets the squaddie who fired said bullet.

Very moving.

Well worth a watch folks.
 vlad dracul
Joined: 4/30/2009
Msg: 177
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Posted: 4/8/2018 7:35:10 AM
et non

"Warrant sales are a good example of what I mean, I knew they happened because I remeber seeing it on the news so I know the information has to be out there, cannot find it though, all I find is legal jargon. The legal jargon doesn't tell the whole story about how the practice played out in real terms.
I agrre with you, warrant sales made this country look bad. We didn't have them but as I understand it that's how it worked, the courts listed a person's personal details in the press and sent bailiffs around on the appointed day to put a person's possessions out in the street and let the public take what they want."


From memory i shall give you a rough example. Using myself as the poor fvcker........

Warrant Sales
Dracul.

Thursday 12th May at 3* Crai***r Aven** Edinburgh
By order of Sheriffs Officers
For Sale
3 piece suite, wardrobe, television set

Sale starts at 2.30

et non
Thursday etc etc

Now i am not going to lie and say folk did not rush to see WHO was the victim of the sale because they did. But no one i knew ever attended a warrant sale or bought anything from them.

Only maggots did. And all goods were SOLD (often for sweetie money) for just enough to cover a debt. I doubt you will find a citizens warrant sale online as the poor fvckers name would have to be shown.
 RoxyMoronic
Joined: 6/7/2016
Msg: 178
Random Musings - Talk About Everthing
Posted: 4/10/2018 4:29:21 AM
Google honours Omar Sharif on what would have been his 86th birthday today.
‘The Noble’
What a handsome chap.
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 179
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Posted: 4/10/2018 8:32:52 AM
Has your facebook information been improperly harvested. Mine has. Go here to find out.............

https://www.facebook.com/help/1873665312923476?helpref=search&sr=1&query=cambridge%20analytica
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 180
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Posted: 4/10/2018 8:37:31 AM
I did see the Patrick Keilty thingy. He also met the head of the DUP , Arlene Foster. She too came from a town where the troubles caused so many deaths. They visited the graveyard together and Patrick commented on how many graves there are from that not so long ago era.

Could I forgive s he has done? So many he interviewed couldn't and one guy had absolutely no remorse for his part in the killings.
 vlad dracul
Joined: 4/30/2009
Msg: 181
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Posted: 4/10/2018 10:10:11 AM
Chapster

"I did see the Patrick Keilty thingy. He also met the head of the DUP , Arlene Foster. She too came from a town where the troubles caused so many deaths. They visited the graveyard together and Patrick commented on how many graves there are from that not so long ago era.

Could I forgive s he has done? So many he interviewed couldn't and one guy had absolutely no remorse for his part in the killings."


Did you notice an awful lot of the gravestones in the cemetery he visited with Arlene Foster were of UDR or RUC men?

Being up here and involved with football all my days ive met supporters/apologists for both sides from over the water. There were 'loyalist' pubs and 'republican' pubs in Edinburgh at one time. And there still are in the weege and lanarkshire.

Could you forgive? Very hard question. The catholic cab driver who took us on the murals tour in belfast was optimistic for the future. But i think if you went into the heart of the housing schemes in northern ireland i think the views and mistrusts would be different.

Part of the reason sinn fein/ ira came to the peace talks was because they could not protect the nationalist community from harm.

Billy wright, johnny adair and michael stone brought terror to ordinary catholics. And provo ASU's could not target the loyalist/protestant communities because they justified THEIR war as being against the state.

Did you notice when asked IF a united ireland came about what would arlene foster do? She replied she could not live in a united ireland. I think IF a united ireland happened then Scotland would get many many ulster loyalists moving here.

If you pm me with an email addy i can send you a couple of books of killers and murderers giving their reasons for what they did.

It is hard to say that you would not have joined them if you witnessed what they had witnessed.
 duracell_bunny_one
Joined: 1/21/2015
Msg: 182
Random Musings - Talk About Everthing
Posted: 4/10/2018 1:29:02 PM
>>>>>>>>>I've been idly/disinterestedly watching the Senate Committee
trying to skewer Mark Z -
He's good, but we'd expect that- one thing he stated has massive implications
for Google et al - he (paraphrased) that 'they' had responsibility for the content that they carried.
(just take a minute & think about that)...........
it's been a long day, g'night y'all.......

 Squareslice
Joined: 10/17/2016
Msg: 183
Random Musings - Talk About Everthing
Posted: 4/10/2018 4:12:34 PM
Patrick Kielty had a superb chat show years ago in which he was presented by bikini lassies wearing balaclavas.... superb fella that flies in the face of adversity. Mair power to him!
Witty dude


Almost Live it was called, I think

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38uItIk6Jys
 et_non
Joined: 1/26/2018
Msg: 184
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Posted: 4/11/2018 3:19:09 PM

From memory i shall give you a rough example. Using myself as the poor fvcker........

Warrant Sales
Dracul.

Thursday 12th May at 3* Crai***r Aven** Edinburgh
By order of Sheriffs Officers
For Sale
3 piece suite, wardrobe, television set

Sale starts at 2.30

et non
Thursday etc etc

Now i am not going to lie and say folk did not rush to see WHO was the victim of the sale because they did. But no one i knew ever attended a warrant sale or bought anything from them.

Only maggots did. And all goods were SOLD (often for sweetie money) for just enough to cover a debt. I doubt you will find a citizens warrant sale online as the poor fvckers name would have to be shown.

That's how I thought it would have worked. The problem with a city, the ratbags who took your stuff, you wouldn't know who they are, you'd never see them again and they'd never have to face you.
Up our way, we'd probably have bought your stuff paying peanuts for it and gave it back to you.
 Wrightbus71
Joined: 11/26/2017
Msg: 185
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Posted: 4/11/2018 4:06:31 PM
Hey there young Chappy - MSG 173

We had a good turn out of around 50 people and yes I can now post my future adverts and they go straight into the Events section on here, I still need 10 people to sign up though for the next couple of events then I`ll be classed as a veteran as it were and wont need anyone to sign up - That will save me some valuable time and I can get the word via event invite out faster.

Bryan
 vlad dracul
Joined: 4/30/2009
Msg: 186
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Posted: 4/12/2018 12:49:37 AM
et non
I found this mate but you may have already read it. I wasn't a big liker of suntan tommy but the boy done good regarding warrant sales.

Of course the hated poll tax brought civil disobedience to Scotlands streets. My family were paying the same amount of poll tax for a prefab as malcolm rifkind was paying for a listed building in duddingston village.

But the poll tax warrants were on a different level compared to the 70's when warrant sales were carried out if you fell behind with rent or goods on the chucky..............


"Poll tax protest 1990: When Strathclyde council issued 250,000 warrants

Areas such as Pollok were a veritable no-go for sheriff officers, who often faced intimidation and harassment from angry locals. Local man George McNeilage made the headlines during the crisis by becoming the first person in the UK to be jailed for avoidance of poll tax."

https://www.scotsman.com/regions/glasgow-strathclyde/poll-tax-protest-1990-when-strathclyde-council-issued-250-000-warrants-1-4002406

And yes i shall mention the FACT that strathclyde council was labour run.




"Mike Dailly asks why Scotland tolerates the lawful ransacking of family homes as part of an ineffective debt recovery system

SHOULD poindings and warrant sales be abolished in Scotland? If so, who stands to gain and who stands to lose?

There is a popular myth that poindings and warrant sales never happen - or at least when they do they are too rare to worry about. And, as the argument goes, people who get into debt should take what's coming to them. Such views are not only small-minded - they are downright ill-informed.

Last year there were 23,067 poindings in Scotland, the bulk at the instance of Scottish local authorities for council tax, poll tax, and the like.

Of these cases, 513 proceeded to a warrant sale. The great scandal of warrant sales is that they represent a legalised form of cruelty.

A bunch of strangers bursting into a family's home and lawfully ransacking it might be a scene from the movie, Braveheart. But it goes on today in Scotland.

While important work is on-going to tackle social exclusion, poor people in this country are being de-humanised by a barbaric legal procedure. The unpeople who are easy to forget.

Make no mistake, poindings and warrant sales are by definition ''harsh'' - it says so in the Debtors (Scotland) Act 1987. So why do we tolerate them?

Creditors will say warrant sales are a last, necessary resort to ensure people pay their debts. Without them, there will be no carrot and stick to ensure re-payment.

Yet all of the evidence refutes this line of argument. Scottish Office research, published earlier this year, revealed that where warrant sales were carried out against individuals, not one single case recovered the debt.

In 82% of cases the warrant sales only partly met the expenses of the sheriff officers - and nothing else.

In short, poindings and warrant sales are an inefficient and ineffective way to recover money.

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/12213195.Everyone_gains_by_ending_warrant_sales/

et non
"That's how I thought it would have worked. The problem with a city, the ratbags who took your stuff, you wouldn't know who they are, you'd never see them again and they'd never have to face you. Up our way, we'd probably have bought your stuff paying peanuts for it and gave it back to you."

I believe those who 'purchased' folks possessions back in the 70's were property owners and second hand shops. I have never heard of any normal citizens buying their neighbours good.

Although i have no doubt in my mind that these days neighbours WOULD purchase poor folks goods.

As for neighbours buying your goods back for you then you need to take into account that everyone was in the same boat. No one had spare money.
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 187
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Posted: 4/12/2018 2:45:24 AM
Why was the Poll Tax so hated? Seems to me that everyone should contribute to local taxes not just homeowners. next door but 2 to me is a family with 4 adults all earning, three new cars on the driveway. They pay 100% council tax on their house. As a singleton, I get a 25% discount. So effectively I am paying almost 4 times as much in tax per person as they are. What is fair about that?
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 188
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Posted: 4/12/2018 2:46:21 AM
Hi Byan,

Well done again. Do you need us to sign up to help out?

In order to maintain the highest quality forums you are restricted to having no more then 2 of the last 10 posts on a thread.
Since 2 of the last 10 posts are yours you can not post to this thread.
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 189
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Posted: 4/12/2018 2:46:30 AM
Hi Byan,

Well done again. Do you need us to sign up to help out?

In order to maintain the highest quality forums you are restricted to having no more then 2 of the last 10 posts on a thread.
Since 2 of the last 10 posts are yours you can not post to this thread.
 vlad dracul
Joined: 4/30/2009
Msg: 190
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Posted: 4/12/2018 4:59:02 AM
Chapster
"Why was the Poll Tax so hated? Seems to me that everyone should contribute to local taxes not just homeowners. next door but 2 to me is a family with 4 adults all earning, three new cars on the driveway. They pay 100% council tax on their house. As a singleton, I get a 25% discount. So effectively I am paying almost 4 times as much in tax per person as they are. What is fair about that?"

I shall get to why the poll tax was hated later.

We had the poll tax first up here. No one disputes that EVERYONE should contribute something to local tax. It was the way it was implemented. Just using todays house prices as an example..........


"Dick Place in the Grange area of Edinburgh has been named the most expensive street in Scotland for the second year in a row.

Bank of Scotland research found the average price of a property there over the past five years was nearly £1.7m.

The capital accounted for half of the 20 most expensive streets."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-20851999


Under the poll tax citizens in a £1.7 million home payed THE EXACT SAME poll tax as someone living in a damp riddled council house. If you were working you paid 100% of the poll tax.

So myself, who was working in the building trade earning just under £200 per week paid THE EXACT same poll tax as politicians and the greedy bank rodents...........


"SCOTLAND was used for an “experiment” and “trail blazer” with the poll tax by the Thatcher government, newly released papers have indicated."

https://www.scotsman.com/news/uk/tories-used-scotland-as-poll-tax-guinea-pig-1-3646489


Thatcher hated us up here. The tories decimated our heavy industries. We mainly returned labour mp's to westmonster.

So lets try it out on us.

Can you HONESTLY say it was a fair tax? Malcolm the **stard rifkind payed the exact same amount of poll tax as i did.

I lived in a pre fab built to last 10 years after the war. A metal house with no heating, metal crittle windows and metal walls and roof, ice on the inside of the bedroom walls in winter (i know i sound like the four Yorkshire men).

Craigour prefabs..........

"Craigour Drive and Craigour Avenue. 'AIROH', prefabricated aluminium bungalow, Moredun area, Edinburgh (built 1949). The Moredun High Rise blocks of flats in the background."

https://canmore.org.uk/site/151550/edinburgh-moredun-craigour-drive?display=collection


Rifkind lived in duddingston village.

Duddingston village..........

Duddingston Loch has been used for ice-skating and curling, even boasting a curling house, for several centuries. In the 17th and 18th century the village was primarily a centre for the coal and salt mining industry, but was also known for its weaving industry, in particular for a cloth known as Duddingston Hardings.


'Bonnie Prince Charlie House'

Bonnie Prince Charlie held a council of war in a house[14] in the village, shortly before the Battle of Prestonpans in 1745. In the same year, James Hamilton, 8th Earl of Abercorn purchased the Duddingston Estate from the Duke of Argyll. Lord Abercorn commissioned the architect Sir William Chambers to design Duddingston House in the Palladian style, and this was completed by 1768.[15]

The loch provided the setting for Henry Raeburn's painting of The Skating Minister, painted in the 1790s, as well as the less famous but very atmospheric painting by Charles Lees called Skaters on Duddingston Loch by Moonlight.[16][17]


And that my friend is why the poll tax was hated.

The community charge is a wee bit better because the tax is now based on house values.
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 191
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Posted: 4/12/2018 5:36:12 AM
Well I thought rates as they were called were always based on house values? My tax in Norway when I worked there was set by the local communities as well as the central government. I don't remember any house tax. It may have changed of course but I doubt it. I very much doubt we are ever going to have a huge change in that direction but there should be some sort of recognition of how many people are resident in the house more than just a 25% reduction for single people.
 duracell_bunny_one
Joined: 1/21/2015
Msg: 192
Random Musings - Talk About Everthing
Posted: 4/12/2018 5:38:27 AM
Mourners of Henry Vincent 'not to be intimidated,' says Met
(BBC News website)

Nothing to add, really..............

 billybonds
Joined: 8/8/2014
Msg: 193
Random Musings - Talk About Everthing
Posted: 4/12/2018 6:08:34 AM
I think only 40 % of council tax is raised locally. It's probably a lot less. Billy' guess 5% council tax 20 % central government 75% those to come especially the next empire's helots. I think some of those kids are alive today.
How do we know with quadrillions of derivatives obscuring price.


Well I don't think Thatcher hated Scotland. There are people who do hate Scotland as there are etc etc...bored now.. I don't in my opinion think Thatcher was one. I also don't believe in property taxes it's either someone's castle or it's not. Mind I don't believe in income tax or the income tax they call national insurance. A sales tax on luxury non essential goods would be all they should get . This would have to be voluntairily worldwide too. I'm for 8 billion sovereign individuals. We don't need guns and butter given to us by parasites. We should provide the butter for ourselves and a world worth inheriting for those who come next. The power of the example.

The lost of heavy industry had very little to do with Margaret Thatcher. And everything to do with America stitching up the monetary system in their favour. And an inexhaustible supply of cheap labour brought on in an unsound monetary system by Asia sterilising their currencies by buying u.s. treasuries. Monetary deformation. As Tony Benn might have said it's not the personalities it's the mechanics.
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 194
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Posted: 4/12/2018 6:53:31 AM
Well, Henry Vincent was a lovely chap apparently according to the cards left on his fence. And who would argue with a bunch of gypsies although apparently, again they aren't Gypsies but just part of the traveller community (corrected today by the Beeb). His mate (another lovely man) is still on the run after setting fire to his van.

In January, Mr Vincent was named and pictured by Kent Police investigating a distraction burglary on a man in his 70s.
 Wrightbus71
Joined: 11/26/2017
Msg: 195
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Posted: 4/12/2018 7:16:08 AM
Hi Chappy,

Hows ya day going?

Any help I can get to kick start this event would as always be gratefully welcomed.

Feel free to sign up..

Bryan
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 196
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Posted: 4/12/2018 8:13:13 AM
done - Bryan needs another 6 people to help out here https://forums.plentyoffish.com/threadlevel.aspx?signup=1&postid=16697718

In order to maintain the highest quality forums you are restricted to having no more then 2 of the last 10 posts on a thread.
Since 2 of the last 10 posts are yours you can not post to this thread.In order to maintain the highest quality forums you are restricted to having no more then 2 of the last 10 posts on a thread.
Since 2 of the last 10 posts are yours you can not post to this thread.
 vlad dracul
Joined: 4/30/2009
Msg: 197
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Posted: 4/12/2018 8:28:01 AM
Chapster
"Well I thought rates as they were called were always based on house values? My tax in Norway when I worked there was set by the local communities as well as the central government. I don't remember any house tax."

Yep some local revenue was collected through rates which were added along with your rent...........

"The rateable value was calculated on the value of your property, so larger and more expensive properties paid much more than smaller, cheaper properties.

Margaret Thatcher and her supporters felt this was unfair, and used arguments such as it costs the same to collect the bins from a mansion as from a council house, and that it was unfair households of the same value with many working occupants should pay the same as a same value house with only one occupant."

https://forums.digitalspy.com/discussion/1901413/how-did-we-pay-for-public-services-before-poll-tax-and-council-tax

The only problem with that theory was that Scotland's working folk were earning sweetie money compared to those further "up the ladder".

Anyway the thatch decided to bring the poll tax to a nation where the gap between rich and poor was staggering............


"By any standard, the poll tax was a fiscal disaster. Brought in to replace the unpopular but well-run system of domestic rates, it was meant to be a fairer approach because everybody who used a council's services had to pay for them. A widowed pensioner would no longer be required to pay the same as a family of five in which all were contributing to the household income.

However, the levy was painted as the most retrograde step in taxation since introduction of the original poll tax in 1380. Lords and ladies living in mansions were to pay the same as nurses, receptionists, roadsweepers and labourers. And the link to the original tax was that all who were entitled to vote would have to pay an equal share."

https://www.theguardian.com/society/1999/apr/14/guardiansocietysupplement4

So because i get rubbish bins collected the same as malcolm rifkind we were seen as both sharing the poll tax burden. Except that speccy cvnt got more in expenses than i earned in a year.

So we now have council tax. Payable by the house value. Much like the rate system.

Bondsy
We have an inbuilt dislike of tories in lots of Scotland. They were always seen as the party of the bosses and the well off.

So we got rid of them. Only to get 'new' labour who carried on from the tories as being the party of the bosses and the well off.

The tory resurgence is mainly down to the independence debate..........

"State-sponsored and heavy industry was allowed to fail.

British Steel's mill at Gartcosh, the Invergordon aluminium smelter and the Corpach pulp mill were all swept away.

"Miners were proud people. Proud to work in the industry and she took that from us, her and her government, during that period," says Nicky Wilson of the National Union of Mineworkers.

"I personally don't think anybody involved in that time will ever forgive her."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-22068402

The decline of our industrial base MAY have been driven by other factors but the fact is when countless thousands are thrown out of work the knock on effect is immense.

Thatcher put global capitalism and neo liberalism without a care for the disaster that befell citizens. So i reserve my right to shed no tears when she died.
 Wrightbus71
Joined: 11/26/2017
Msg: 198
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Posted: 4/12/2018 8:38:48 AM
Thanks for your help Chappy, only need another 5 or 6 now. I`ve noticed today that someone has already bailed out after signing up...Mebbe they know summat I don't??

Oh and apologies for interrupting the Poll Tax/Council Tax debate..
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 199
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Posted: 4/12/2018 9:14:31 AM
You're welcome Bryan, hopefully a few people on here will click on the link for you.

Back to the fun knockabout world of the UK forums...................

I agree with everything you say Vlad although de-industrialisation was not limited to Scotland. Merseyside where I hail from had similar problems not helped by the bolshie unions. I don't believe it is beyond the wit of man to ome up ith something fairer especially now as the council tax isn't really much about bins and more about social services for the old and homeless.
 vlad dracul
Joined: 4/30/2009
Msg: 200
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Posted: 4/12/2018 9:40:25 AM
Chapster

"I agree with everything you say Vlad although de-industrialisation was not limited to Scotland. Merseyside where I hail from had similar problems not helped by the bolshie unions. I don't believe it is beyond the wit of man to ome up ith something fairer especially now as the council tax isn't really much about bins and more about social services for the old and homeless."

Exactly. Some northern englandshire towns and many welsh wales towns have never recovered from when the main source of income for a town was steel, coal, ship building and manufacturing in general.

When the thousands were put out of work then local shops suffered. Families who had worked in an industry then got their laddies (mainly) a job there as well.

Masses of places know nothing but meaningless low paid work. Drugs and alcohol run rampant.

It was seen by many citizens in northern englandshire, welsh wales and Scotland as if only londonistan and the south east mattered. Rightly or wrongly that was how it appeared.

And now those who have a comfortable income, a half decent house and an inability to see why so many of us took great delight in the brexit vote.

For once WE at the shite end of existence rammed it right up the guardian reading cvnts. They expect us to listen to them and their pleas. Well fvck you. Yous never gave a toss about us and our pleas.

Maybe londonistan should piss off and become an independent eu slave city.

You have failed labour politician neil (socialist firebrand) kinnock and his family telling us that neo liberalism is good now. Well it was for that cvnt and his family.

£10 million they have sucked out of the eu nightmare. Maybe he can tell long term unemployed workers how you can earn money like that if you betray every principal you ever had.

As for council tax being used for care for the elderly that is a cruel joke then. I see many stories sometimes where some useless arsehole messes up some public service and they get pay outs worth £100,000's of thousands in compensation.

They got sacked because they were crap at the job. They should get nothing.
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