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 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 282
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!Page 6 of 32    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32)
What you said has absolutely nothing to do with the question I asked you, so I will explain it to you again.

MY profile is FAR SUPERIORLY WRITTEN to IG's profile. We may quibble over what a "good profile" is (though I've been told by several people in the forums that I have a good one), but at the moment, it is not even a question of whose is better, because all he has written in his profile is: "I am here ONLY for the forums. I am in a relationship with the most awesome woman in the world and I am here simply for the forums. So I am sorry ladies, I am not interested in meeting you. Please, please, do not contact me. Ladies I AM NOT INTERESTED IN YOU." Etc.

The reason why he had to write all that? It's because his original declaration that he was "not single/not looking" wasn't strong enough because he was still getting first contact emails from women interested in dating him.

So if the reason I have failed on this site is because I can't take advice and have a bad profile, bad attitude, no confidence, I'm a whiner and griper, then explain to me why my profile, constructed with forum advice, with no hints of bad attitude, lack of confidence, whining or griping gets 1 unsolicited view a month and 1 message a year, while his "leave me alone" profile got so many views and messages that he had to start being mean about it?

You (or anyone else on your side) explain that to me like I'm a 5-year-old (without going off on unrelated tangents), then I will shut up about it.
 VolkanoKing
Joined: 8/1/2014
Msg: 283
WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/28/2014 12:16:44 PM
It's not my job to explain anything to you. Either you take our slant on it or you dont, and you dont, and wont, so, around you'll spin, down the drain until you do something different. Maybe online dating isnt for you. Maybe it just isnt clicking. You're spending way WAY too much time trying to dissect this, struggling over why why why??!! Clearly SOMETHING is not hooking people. We're not mind readers here, we cant solve all your problems. That part is up to you.

Remember, our advice here is free. If you think it sucks, go pay a professional. And since you tell us what we are saying is all BS, and you keep coming back and writing us long LONG responses, it seems to me you really HAVE mastered the art of wasting your time.
 basilisk123
Joined: 12/17/2011
Msg: 284
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/28/2014 12:28:03 PM
It is that attitude that keeps your results low dude. You feel you "deserve" attention because you have a "great" profile made with the best of the best. It comes down to the fact you feel entitled. That feeling of entitlement is going to screw you up every time. You are not IG and IG is not you. Don't compare yourself to anyone, even if other people do. You are a completely different person and have a totally unique set of circumstances and experiences. It is a totally pointless excersise.
 Halcyon_Skies
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 287
WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/28/2014 12:57:46 PM
MY profile is FAR SUPERIORLY WRITTEN to IG's profile. We may quibble over what a "good profile" is (though I've been told by several people in the forums that I have a good one), but at the moment, it is not even a question of whose is better, because all he has written in his profile is: "I am here ONLY for the forums. I am in a relationship with the most awesome woman in the world and I am here simply for the forums. So I am sorry ladies, I am not interested in meeting you. Please, please, do not contact me. Ladies I AM NOT INTERESTED IN YOU." Etc.

The reason why he had to write all that? It's because his original declaration that he was "not single/not looking" wasn't strong enough because he was still getting first contact emails from women interested in dating him.


Sorry, but I don't agree that your profile is far superior to his. You do have a few things working against you that negate any superior writing skills you might possess. Some women won't want to date you because you don't drink. Others may pass you by because they want to have children.

There is also something to be said for the psychology behind people wanting something more when they're told they can't have it. It raises your perceived "value" in their eyes if you tell people you're unavailable---some will try to get you to change your mind. I'm not single/not looking, and I had this same situation happen to me before I hid my profile.

I'm not exactly sure why IG doesn't hide his profile, since he's not single/not looking.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 288
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/28/2014 1:27:20 PM
The thing is, IG (since those other responses weren't worth replying to since they went off on tangents), the only example of my "attitude" a woman has when deciding what men to make first contact with IS my profile. If the attitude you people claim I exhibit in the forums doesn't exist in my profile, then how the heck are these women who look at my profile being affected by that attitude? Or an even better question: how are the women who are not even looking at my profile being affected by that attitude? The only possibility within that theory is that they are doing searches that include me, come across my main profile picture and sense that "bad attitude" in it and decide not to even click on it.

Or is it more reasonable that women simply are not including someone with my characteristics in their searches while they are including someone with your characteristics in their searches and these decisions of theirs to do so have nothing to do with our attitudes or even anything we've written in our profiles?

I'm starting to realize there is a substantial lack of logical thinking and belief in scientific methods in these forums. It's almost like being in rural Alabama again.

"one, that I tend to prefer women with children"

This is the only logical statement anyone's made in the last several posts. And I honestly didn't realize it at first, because why would that fact have any effect on women's searches? But I just suddenly realized that is not only a (sorta) searchable characteristic, but my overall attitude on that matter has probably substantially limited the number of women who are exposed to my profile by the system:

1) Childless women in their 30s and 40s who are certain they want to have children probably leave me out of their searches because I answered "undecided" to the "Do you want children question?"

2) Women with children who prefer to date men that also have children probably leave me out of their searches because I don't have children.

3) Women with children never see me in their matches because I answered "No" to "Would you date someone who has kids?"

#3 I obviously expected, but I hadn't thought much about #2, and #1 I had never thought about before now -- suddenly, I am realizing that my profile is probably not reaching 90% of women on this site in my area for the kid reason alone. Which is also close to the same percentage of women who choose not to include me in their searches because of my height/ethnicity combination. Combine all those things together and, heck, I guess I should be happy with 1 view a month! I mean, who is this childless-and-wants-to-remain-that-way woman in her 30s that isn't opposed to dating a short man with some African ancestry and features and likes Radiohead, Alice in Chains and the Orwells? Hell if I know. Hell if I know.

Well done, IG. You've done what no one else could (although I will give props to Dragonbits for continuously bringing this issue up -- for some reason all aspects of that issue in relation to the site's search feature never occurred to me during any of those episodes). I imagine I could get more views (and maybe some messages) if I change my answer to #1 to "Yes" but that would be a lie, wouldn't it? Isn't that the worst sin of all in OLD?

NBF/HS: I wasn't including you in my first sentence -- your posts came up after I had already written everything above this and was proofreading it. Full of myself? Isn't that "confidence"? Where's that fine line? Note taken, though. As for the teeth, I have a gap that I'm self-conscious about -- the last woman I met from Match actually mentioned that to me during our pre-meeting dialogue ("Why don't any of your pictures have teeth?") but she met me anyway and she was the most attractive woman and most professionally successful woman I have ever met through OLD, so I figure, how bad can not showing teeth hurt me? "You do have a few things working against you that negate any superior writing skills you might possess." Yeah, but, are those things changeable? I will admit, not wanting kids and not drinking are not as difficult to change as my height or ethnicity, but how easily would YOU be able to change your drinking habits or parental calling just to improve your dating opportunities? Yeah, I get what you're saying -- in fact, I kinda just said as much in my response to IG -- people can find detrimental things in my profile beyond my words. In my defense, I did say "far superiorly written," not that I had a "far superior profile."
 basilisk123
Joined: 12/17/2011
Msg: 290
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/28/2014 5:54:49 PM
"You are a vagina person..."-NDTfan

I am just gonna tuck this saying away for later use, thanks.

"Dude, I'm a single mother who went to university while working a full time job and a part time job ( while breastfeeding)."-NDTfan

Just imagining it....yeah...thats nice...

Seriously though, I think the horse is pretty dead here.
He is just arguing for arguments sake. Some people just need to fall on their face one, two, maybe five hundred times before they learn.
 south_city
Joined: 10/12/2013
Msg: 291
WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/28/2014 7:13:21 PM

So what's your point? Why would I waste even a second of my life worried about what some man ( that I don't even know exists ) thinks of me? Do you really think a woman's number one worry in life is how to get men interested in her?


You and other women claim very few men read the profiles. I presented a counterexample. The fact that you don't care about these men is not relevant.


LMAO, you act like it's some sort of "fault", and that you're scoring some sort of point with this? BWAHAHAHAHAHA....


Really. I never claimed that it was somehow a woman's fault. It simply means that 2 people in these circumstances aren't a match.
 FullMoonGuy
Joined: 3/7/2014
Msg: 292
WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/28/2014 9:24:49 PM
I'm starting to realize there is a substantial lack of logical thinking and belief in scientific methods in these forums.


BINGO !

(you're just STARTING to realize that?)


In my defense, I did say "far superiorly written," not that I had a "far superior profile."


There's also a lack of reading comprehension. I understood what you meant.


Full of myself? Isn't that "confidence"? Where's that fine line?


There is no universal fine line. It moves with every different woman. Which renders the often seen statement, "I'm looking for a guy who's confident, not co-cky" meaningless, because one woman's "confidence" is another woman's "co-ckiness".
 rockin-trucker82
Joined: 1/4/2014
Msg: 293
WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/28/2014 10:07:52 PM
Of course it would be a no. You keep asking questions, then dismiss the answers and tell us how we really think. What kind of a moron would go out with someone who does something so disrespectful?

"Oh no, you're wrong. You are a vagina person, and that makes you suspect because I think everything you say has a hidden meaning. Here, let me give you the only answer I'll accept; based on nothing but what I've deluded myself into thinking because it's easy. And don't you dare tell me that you really meant it, because you're intentionally being contrary; only doing that to make me think that I'm not right . See that equally deluded guy who can't relate to women either? Well, he agrees with me which obviously makes him right and every woman in the world and all the men who agree with them wrong. Now tell me I'm right"

Sexy.....


I purposely make sure I use key words like "some" or "a lot of", but the problem with WAY too many of you in here is that everything has to be one of two extremes. There's a huge gray area in the middle. But what did that rant have to do with what I was talking about. I used that as an example to prove the point that the WHEN I get rejected by someone doesn't matter. The answer would have been "no" both before and after asking, so what's the damage in a preemptive no? And rants like that are what devalues what you say so much. Instead of addressing the painfully obvious point of that, you resort immediately to just making personal attacks. Let's keep some of these threads open. Just because I disagree with YOU doesn't mean any of what you said. There's a lot of women, who I agree and understand their side, I even sometimes understand yours, but before resorting to saying that we're saying we're not worth your effort, or that we're not trying, I'm giving a pretty common perspective of what's happening on the the other side. Us guys are humans too. We think, and have reasons for a lot of our actions. Just like there's reasons that you immediately assume that any guy who pays attention to you is just trying to get laid, we have reasons for short first messages, and sometimes for being that guy that really is only trying to get laid. Women aren't immune to the blame for the way everything is working. They have their equal share of the cause as men. But instead of only focusing on what the men do, why not also look at what the women are also doing? We're never going to know which gender started it, and it's irrelevant anyway, but the reality is both sides are causing a lot of their complaints about the other side, but neither wants to accept their share of the blame.

And which guy are you talking about? The one who's out in left field, or the one you used you as anecdotal evidence?

And that guy that likes mudding and all of that messaging the girl who likes opera... It might sound weird to you, but a lot of us are actually more attracted to our opposite than someone who's almost identical. You still need to have SOME stuff together, but there's a reason they started saying opposites attract... because it was true enough times. Nobody here is a mind reader, the only way to really know you're not what someone wants is for them to tell you... Otherwise, explain the fit girls that date fat guys who have never stepped into a gym. Clearly there's way more to it than you claim.

And I know I'm sexy, we all do. Thanks for pointing it out.


To recap for the TLDR crowd: I'm not interested in him. He does not believe that any woman wouldn't be interested in him, and believes it's far more likely that I'm a devious b*tch that will give it up eventually, and have spent an inordinate amount of time playing hard to get.

You and Hawking, you remind me of him.


The irony in us reminding you of this guy is that BOTH of us have said, and accepted that not every woman is going to be interested in us. For both of us, yeah, it's a lot that aren't interested. We think it sucks, like anyone would, but we're not whining about it or blaming MOST women (some, their reasoning behind the lack of interest is just way too stupid to not assume that she has serious issues), we state it as part of our arguments. He had to do it for his arument against the claim "make your profile better and girls will answer". But that's something that happens all the time here too. If I say girls rarely respond to me on this site, I'm whining. But when you say guys rarely send you a well thought out message, you're not whining?


I recommend you read some books on Evolutionary Psychology. You'll be surprise to see why people act the way they act.


I'd start with just a basic psychology textbook. We seem to, on these forums, forget that our entire past, shaped who we are today. Our rejection, whether it's from girls, or getting picked for the teams in gym class, that's going to affect you later in life. To expect the kid always picked last to have the same confidence as the captain of the football team is insane. The same ideas are going to carry into dating. And it's one of the reasons OLD is such a dangerous thing when you depend on it. The nature of these sites, if you're a guy, is that you're not getting answered most of the time. Now, if you were the kid always picked last, and now you're the one depending on this site for your hopes of maybe FINALLY having your first date, and then realizing 99% of the women on here don't want to talk to you... What's going to make you feel confident about your dating life?

We all complain about what guys and girls do, but nobody wants to stop and try to look at WHY these common gender habits exist on here.
 daysleeper5
Joined: 11/6/2009
Msg: 294
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/28/2014 11:12:56 PM

Dude, I'm a single mother who went to university while working a full time job and a part time job ( while breastfeeding). I had no family support, or financial support from their father up until they were teenagers. I walked an hour and a half to work each way when it came down to diapers or a bus pass. I taught myself how to do wiring, drywall, painting, woodworking, appliance repair, flooring installation, sewing, knitting, quilting, decorating, etc. because I had no help and no money.

I put more effort into "doing" this morning before I got out of my bed than you'd have to spend typing more than "hi". I consider any man who believes that typing 3 sentences as being "too much effort" or "exhausting" completely f*cking useless. What the hell would they be like if I were in a relationship with them and something catastrophic happened?


How's that chip you're carrying around?

What I said was in response to your vague generalization that men only do the bare minimum. I gave legitimate examples of how women skirt by with the bare minimum that wouldn't even work for most men. If you're going to make a blanket accusation, you should at least be able to prove it sufficiently. What is the bare minimum in your eyes, anyway? I imagine it must be quite "exhausting" for a guy to try to impress you, given your disdain towards most of them. Is it possible that you never let go of the anger towards your children's father? You know, since you had to refine all your nifty home improvement skills. None of which are relevant to this thread. It's like you're trying to say, "I once used a trowel so you better write me a soliloquy."
 patchjoker13
Joined: 8/24/2014
Msg: 295
WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 12:31:02 AM
To put in another two cents, I will go back to the "chance" thing. I am not saying that ladies should answer every guy who messages them or go on a date with every guy who sends a decent message. I am saying though that if women on these sites maybe agreed to meet a few more guys than they would normally meet, they might have a better chance at finding the right guy. You could look at the date as a free sample of food, you may not like the taste or you may find it delicious, but you will never know if you don't try. In this thread I see a lot of "the guys need to try harder", "these guys are not doing enough to improve their chances or themselves", and stuff like that. This may be true but do you think that it is right that some women posting here have taken the attitude that almost no guys are worth their time and that guys who have little success are automatically losers. I think that the "all women are too picky", and the "guys are all dumb" groups are both the same. They are both looking at the opposite sex as the root of their problems. Guys are bitter because of the lack or success and the ladies are bitter because of bad past experiences.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 296
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 6:11:19 AM
“To recap for the TLDR crowd: I'm not interested in him. He does not believe that any woman wouldn't be interested in him, and believes it's far more likely that I'm a devious b*tch that will give it up eventually, and have spent an inordinate amount of time playing hard to get.

You and Hawking, you remind me of him”

There is something seriously wrong with your reading comprehension skills, which is concerning because you are actually a skillful writer. I’d like you to find, somewhere in the hundreds of posts I’ve made on this site, some example of me behaving or describing a story befitting “He does not believe that any woman wouldn’t be interested in him.” I am in fact so opposite of this that IG constantly badgers me about NOT contacting women for which I believe there is overwhelming evidence that they will not respond. I don’t contact women multiple times on this site or any other after they’ve rejected me (no response = rejection). I don’t badger women into dating me in real life. I haven’t even asked a woman out in real life in the past two years, because I have not met a single woman during that period of time that displayed any romantic interest in me whatsoever. Heck, half of my posts in this thread are championing a system that would vastly reduce the amount of behavior you just described for most women!

What is wrong with you?

“I consider any man who believes that typing 3 sentences as being ‘too much effort’ or ‘exhausting’ completely f*cking useless.”

I realize this is a completely f*cking useless waste of effort, but 3 sentences X 1 = very little effort; 3 sentences X thousands = A WHOLE LOT OF EFFORT.

“If I were to write a 30 page dissertation backed up with verifiable data from thousands of sources, you'd still believe all that is wrong.”

That may be true, if I can come up with 30 pages of verifiable data from thousands of other sources to refute it. But this seems like a scenario of little concern to me considering most of your arguments consist of heavily skewed personal observations (and a few delusions).

“But I can tell you that a well thought out message has tipped the scales for guys I was ‘meh’ about.”

You know, you could have said that in your initial response to me, because that is an ACTUAL ARGUMENT against the Tinder system. It is in fact the only one you (or anyone else) has made in the last 10,000 words of this discussion. (BTW, VolkanoKing: “ you keep coming back and writing us long LONG responses, it seems to me you really HAVE mastered the art of wasting your time.” – I’m going to give you NDTFAn’s last post as “Exhibit A” – actually more characters than any post I’ve made in this thread.)

The only counter-argument I have to that is that is personally I’m willing to lose out on some possibilities in which a woman thinks I’m “meh” that I apparently (according to you) might have had a chance to “tip the scales” with if it means a substantial reduction in the amount of time I waste on this site sending “well thought out” emails to women that I could never “tip the scales” with. I have seen some men disagree with me on that, though. In fact, I’m sure IG would disagree with me. But the irony of your position on that is you just accused me of being the type of guy who thinks he can “tip the scales” on any woman.

“Yeah, I think you should know that if you're a guy who only likes muddin' and huntin' and fishin' and scratchin' ya balls, then you should know better than to message women who like opera and reading and keeping up with current events. And if you waste your time ‘exhausting’ yourself by sending 3 sentences her only to have her ignore you because she KNOWS you only messaged her for a bit of skin (because what else COULD it be in that situation) , then you have only yourself to blame.”

Now we’re back to you responding to me while writing examples of what other men do. I don’t know how many times in these forums I’ve said I will not waste my time writing women who have “muddin’” and “huntin’” and “fishin’” in their profiles, because I know I have very little in common with them (besides growing up in a place where those activities are actual standard recreation!) and they would almost certainly not be attracted to someone like me (because based on my experience growing up with many such women, they’re probably racist). If you’re going to respond to me, I would appreciate you actually FOCUSING on me. Because I don’t do the things you’re using as examples. And what’s really annoying is that you know that.

And you know this isn’t even about common interests either. Women are not rejecting *my* first contact emails because we don’t have any common interests. They are not rejecting them because I’m a fat unemployed couch slob with no friends, they’re not rejecting them because I’m a grey old man preying on little girls, they’re not rejecting them because I’m asking for ass in my first email. You know exactly why they’re rejecting me, and it’s the same reason YOU would be rejecting me if you knew absolutely nothing about me other than what’s in my profile. You know how I know you know this? Because you’ve said it to me before, in some long deleted thread. Why you want to dance around the subject and throw out a thousand extreme (but perhaps common) examples of why other men get rejected on this site, I have no idea. Your head is definitely a puzzlebox.

basilisk123: We’re pulling your man card. I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of men on this site that came out as NDTFan... fans.
 basilisk123
Joined: 12/17/2011
Msg: 297
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 6:50:29 AM
"basilisk123: We’re pulling your man card. I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of men on this site that came out as NDTFan... fans."


Lol, Like I actually give a shit what you think. And no, I am not a fan of anyone. Just here having alittle fun reading about the tantrum you're having. I am bored at work and I got nothing better to do.
 jessebunnies
Joined: 2/18/2013
Msg: 298
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 7:23:55 AM

So if the reason I have failed on this site is because I can't take advice and have a bad profile, bad attitude, no confidence, I'm a whiner and griper, then explain to me why my profile, constructed with forum advice, with no hints of bad attitude, lack of confidence, whining or griping gets 1 unsolicited view a month and 1 message a year, while his "leave me alone" profile got so many views and messages that he had to start being mean about it?

Look I'm going to be straight up with you and this is not meant to be offensive, it's your height that is likely a huge portion of your failure on here. Just as there's a "kid in a candy store mentality" with online dating for men such a mentality exists for women as well. Online women can afford to be choosy there's an inbox full of men to choose from. In real life those same women who rejected you online, who said they would never date a man shorter than 5'10" would likely give you more of chance because 1) there isn't 8000 other sausages your competing with at that very moment most of which are taller than yourself 2) they get to see your behavior which will heavily influence your attractiveness.

I've said this to you before.... get offline and meet women in real life. Your young and attractive there's no reason why your using a system that's failing you. Going offline doesn't mean your a failure. It means you took a different road to get where your going (we all do this). However getting offline will require you to try, to socialize with real human beings instead of computer screen picture, it's a reality you might have to face.
 patchjoker13
Joined: 8/24/2014
Msg: 300
WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 7:54:08 AM
^^^^^^^
This is a great honest answer. It is good that it's coming from a female point of view because if a guy wrote this he would be considered a wimpy loser. I have been on this forum before and when I or other men mentioned these types of things, we were kicked around and told that our opinions were delusional. It is good to see there is a bit more honesty now, at least from some people.
 strings1043
Joined: 6/14/2012
Msg: 304
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 8:36:00 AM
Yeah I started a thread about how only women get to pick and message men instead of us men bombarding you women with messages. Messaging women shouldn't be an option on dating sites. The way I see it is that we are scaring you off.
 Deadliest_Snatch
Joined: 10/25/2012
Msg: 306
WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 9:03:22 AM

Yeah I started a thread about how only women get to pick and message men instead of us men bombarding you women with messages.


Cricket … Cricket … Cricket … Cricket … Cricket … Cricket … Cricket … Cricket … Cricket …
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 307
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 11:12:10 AM
Jesse: I knew the answer to that question. As sunsetsam suggests, I was just trying to get any of those claiming my attitude and my supposed dismissal of POF advice was the reason for my POF failures to answer it. I knew none of them would, because doing so would completely destroy their argument.

Although, as I went along in this epic (and if you ask me, entertaining) debate, I did actually come to learn something new: the kids question is likely a bigger contributor to my failures than I previously realized. Might also explain why I got many more views when I was 5 years younger [though still far fewer than most “normal” men] than I do now, although POF’s decline in popularity because of all their idiot moves over the past couple of years probably has something to do with that, too. It’s a number of things. But because of the way this system works, it is impossible that my “attitude” is a contributor to my current low number of views (especially compared to IG), and having a dozen people heap on that bandwagon was really starting to get under my skin.

As for getting offline: I’m not really that young. The majority of people my age are married and many more besides that are engaged/long-term involved or have young children (I mean, we’re close to the same age – that isn’t also true in your circles?). Because of my jobs and hobbies and friends, I’m “out there” a lot. I meet many new women every week. But I almost never meet any SINGLE women older than college age. My female friends talk about setting me up all the time (never has happened), but then qualify that with “As soon as I make a single friend,” because all their friends are married (or the equivalent). The only place single women seem to exist at this age is in OLD. But I do realize POF is probably the worst OLD site for someone with my characteristics: it’s free, so the competition is brutal, and it has the worst matching features of any site of its type. It’s just hard to argue with “free” – I can’t always be on eH or Match, and Tinder/HON seems to be a young person's game, so instead of just giving up on POF, I keep hoping I will either luck out on it one day or it will become more efficient from market pressures. That, I will admit, is very stupid false hope. I'm just trapped here, really.

But thank-you for your post. I agree with the others – it was excellent.
 VolkanoKing
Joined: 8/1/2014
Msg: 309
WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 12:31:44 PM
"Online dating is not for the short man"

That's too bad. I like short guys. If I see 5'6" listed, cool.
 sddude
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 310
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 12:50:02 PM
I am short 5FT 5IN

Hahaha VK, it is true, women reject a short guy completely on most every dating sites without even caring about the profile or pics, education etc..., in all the site forums it is the same subject most women have the same feeling about it. Even on this site answers to my responses and to other in the forums from wome were " eeeew, I would feel rediculous standing next to a short date" or " even if I am a 5 ft 1 in woman their is no way i would date a guy shorter than average perceived hieght of 5ft 8 in" or "would not be caught dead with one" or " hate them, they have the short man napolean syndrom, violent tempers..." or i dated a short man once..."
Read the short man threads, some shocking reading, hahaha

To women, a short guy is 5ft 7 in is the threshold even if they temselves are 4ft 11 in..

I have absolutely no success on any internet dating sites but in person, I have absolutely no problems like I used to, in the past I had no mojo, now the only issue is to find someone who does not overwhelm me with personal problems. In person I got it together.
 sddude
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 311
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 12:52:43 PM
for the grammer NAZIs,sorry about not proofreading my posts.
 jessebunnies
Joined: 2/18/2013
Msg: 314
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 3:33:55 PM

But because of the way this system works, it is impossible that my “attitude” is a contributor to my current low number of views (especially compared to IG),

In addition to the height difference your both fishing in very different age ponds I would imagine. IG is in his 50's, I'm going to guess when he was dating his range was 42-58 ish. Your 36, I'm guessing your age range is 26-38 ish. Women in their prime are going to always be alot more sought after than those above 40. Additionally the older you get the less opportunities you have to socialize therefore the resilience of online dating becomes more of a factor.



As for getting offline: I’m not really that young.

You are still young. You can still go to bars and clubs without looking like the 50 year old child molester.


The majority of people my age are married and many more besides that are engaged/long-term involved or have young children (I mean, we’re close to the same age – that isn’t also true in your circles?). Because of my jobs and hobbies and friends, I’m “out there” a lot. I meet many new women every week.

But are you really out there? I used to think this too back when I just came out of a relationship and I was using online as a crutch. The truth was there were single people every where (after all they were emailing me online why would they not be single in real life?). I had grown accustomed to being in a relationship so I didn't really know how to interact with single men. I was used to fending them off not flashing the "I'm single smile come talk to me". It was an adjustment. I also had to think in terms of what attracted the opposite sex and really work on those aspects of myself my appearance, my dress style and my personality. Do I date less in RL than OLD? yes but my dates were far better quality than I was getting online. What I found was that OLD was not able to showcase my strengths. It's kind of the same with you.

Additionally I had to let go of some of my requirements like dating guys without kids (not going to happen almost everyone over the age of 25 has kids these days), my age range I was willing to date had to expand (dating 10 yrs younger/older) and I had to really evaluate letting go some of the physical qualities I wanted and be willing to date other races.

Putting yourself out there requires more than just showing up and being present. Sometimes it requires you to figure out what the positive qualities are in your that might initially attract women to you and really developing those. It appears that you are educated, well read and financial stable. Those are all important things for women hence those are some of your strengths but most of those things will not be noticed online, they can only really be showcased in real life unless you plan on becoming a Sugar Daddy.

Some of the most successful guys I've seen date don't even need online. One of my friends is in his 50's and he had tons of dates with women in their 40's. He did what most guys weren't doing, placing himself right in the middle of groups of women. He would go to Yoga class and at the gym he'd be talking with women on the machines while working out. He joined Meetup groups which, at least in this area are primarily composed of single women where he eventually met his now girlfriend. Karma and I did a Meetup hiking group and it was ALL single women doing the same thing we were doing, doing what we love and hoping to meet an eligible single guy. It's not possible that there are no single ate 20's mid 30's women in Tampa Florida.

The problem with online is that so much of what goes into initially attracting someone is based on physical looks alone and availability that it creates an unnatural superficial way to connect with others. Again in real life a woman will over look your height if she see's other qualities in you that are rarely able to be expressed online.


but I do realize POF is probably the worst OLD site for someone with my characteristics: it’s free, so the competition is brutal, and it has the worst matching features of any site of its type. It’s just hard to argue with “free” – I can’t always be on eH or Match, and Tinder/HON seems to be a young person's game, s

Their all the same for the most part. Women on E-Harmony are not going to be any more inclined to over look the height issue than women on Match or POF.

keep hoping I will either luck out on it one day or it will become more efficient from market pressures. That, I will admit, is very stupid false hope. I'm just trapped here, really.

I'm not saying stop online dating, what I am saying is start putting emphasis on what really matters and where you'll likely be more successful. You can run on the hamster wheel and go round and round or you can get off do something different and work towards your success. The choice is ultimately yours.
 daysleeper5
Joined: 11/6/2009
Msg: 315
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WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/29/2014 6:40:11 PM

The problem with online is that so much of what goes into initially attracting someone is based on physical looks alone and availability that it creates an unnatural superficial way to connect with others.


Jessie gets it. She gets two high-fives for her last post. Meaningful, sensible, practical, and without any acrimony. Listen to her. There's some valuable insight in there.
 south_city
Joined: 10/12/2013
Msg: 316
WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/30/2014 6:47:14 AM
I also agree with many of JesseBunnies's comments. The amount of possible options with OLD is a double edged sword. The good thing is people that possibly find someone that they otherwise probably wouldn't have seen in their daily normal routine. The bad thing is people can develop the "grass is greener on the other side" mentality. If someone doesn't exactly match a list of requirements or doesn't have extremely attractive photos or there isn't instant chemistry on the first date / meeting, the other person often won't be interested.
 rockin-trucker82
Joined: 1/4/2014
Msg: 317
WOMEN have a VERY DIFFERENT EXPERIENCE on POF then MEN !!!
Posted: 8/30/2014 8:16:56 AM

This is very interesting because I just got back from LA from having our National Sales Conference over there. After the meetings and presentations, I had drinks with the guys from the field. Many of them love to boast about all the women that they are seeing on the side, some of them, even though they are married. Anyway, the interesting thing is that many of them are rather short. Yet that has not stopped them at all.

So go figure.


Girls that will date shorter do exist. Nobody is denying that. But do a search. Probably on another site where you can search for younger. Look at how many women demand that you're tall.

"I like to wear heels, so you have to be at least 6'0"

I'm lucky with this, I'm exactly at the most common minimum height. But the amount of times I see that minimum, it has to be torture for shorter guys.
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