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 bulldog1966
Joined: 6/21/2006
Msg: 114
How good mother's lose custody todays?Page 3 of 14    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14)
Here's a little example of Canadian family law, at least as applied in Ontario. My son was born Oct 17, 1985. On Jan 3, 1986, my twentieth birthday, as a matter of fact, his mother went to Sears, supposedly to buy me a birthday present. The next time my son or I saw or heard from her was Oct. 17, 2001, my son's 16th birthday. In spite of three convictions for prostitution, one for breaking and entering, and four for various drug offences, coupled with the fact that she was living in a homeless shelter, she was able to get legal aid, and initiated a custody battle. In Sept. 2002, she called me at home, approximately 3:30 am. She informed me at that time that she was willing to drop the custody case the very next morning, if I would give her $10,000 in cash, and that we would never see her again. I refused, and reported the incident to my attorney. In spite of the fact that I had the whole conversation on tape, he told me it would not be allowed.
During the years my son's mother was gone, he spent nearly five years in foster homes, starting within a week of my reporting his mother missing to the police, while I jumped through every hoop imaginable trying to prove I was not an unfit parent. 50% of my income was garnisheed to pay for support, while the Children's Aid Society kept telling me I didn't make enough money to support a child. This was out of an income of $70,000 per year.
I'm not sure where the support money went, every time I saw him he was chronically under-nourished and wearing worn out clothing. The only skinny kid in my family in 5 generations. My attorney informed me that this was normal for a single man in a custody case. He told me that in common practice of CAS, men were considered a paycheque, with no rights at all.
In April of 1992, I was granted TEMPORARY custody, subject to CAS review at any time.
That order was terminated Aug. 6, 2004, along with his mother's custody application, two months short of my son's 19th birthday, and the day after he was inducted into the army.
The Children's Aid Society is still pursuing a claim against me for court costs.
 JumpingRaindrops
Joined: 2/2/2006
Msg: 116
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/12/2006 11:15:00 AM
Lotus 35, thank you for posting that. I was horrified to see how quickly this thread turned into another ex-bashingfest. The simple, horrible, truth is that sometime, good mothers DO lose their kids. I've seen it happen to good friends of mine. Usually it's a case of an abusive ex-husband with a lot of extra money looking for a way to continue to control and manipulate the mom. In one notable case, the dad was driving under the influence at 9 a.m. with the daughter in the car, and instead of sending the child to her mother (who has no history whatsoever of substance abuse,) the judge decided that the father's girlfriend could drive the girl. The "father's rights" groups out there are all too willing to step in a help the guy in a case like this, including calling the mother's character into question for "failing to protect" the kids from the very guy who is now suing for custody. According to an APA study cited by Ariel Gore in The HipMama Survival Guide, the majority of men who seek fulltime custody have some history of abuse. That book is several years old, so I have no idea if it holds true any more, but the fact is, the court system is not necessarily weighted in favor of women. A lot depends on the political climate where the case is being heard and the personal inclinations of the judge.

YES, there are great dads who get screwed over by the system. That does not mean that every mother out there who loses custody of her kids is a huge feckup. It means the system screws people over, period.
 JumpingRaindrops
Joined: 2/2/2006
Msg: 117
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/12/2006 11:16:30 AM
Lotus 35, thank you for posting that. I was horrified to see how quickly this thread turned into another ex-bashingfest. The simple, horrible, truth is that sometime, good mothers DO lose their kids. I've seen it happen to good friends of mine. Usually it's a case of an abusive ex-husband with a lot of extra money looking for a way to continue to control and manipulate the mom. In one notable case, the dad was driving under the influence at 9 a.m. with the daughter in the car, and instead of sending the child to her mother (who has no history whatsoever of substance abuse,) the judge decided that the father's girlfriend could drive the girl. The "father's rights" groups out there are all too willing to step in a help the guy in a case like this, including calling the mother's character into question for "failing to protect" the kids from the very guy who is now suing for custody. According to an APA study cited by Ariel Gore in The HipMama Survival Guide, the majority of men who seek fulltime custody have some history of abuse. That book is several years old, so I have no idea if it holds true any more, but the fact is, the court system is not necessarily weighted in favor of women. A lot depends on the political climate where the case is being heard and the personal inclinations of the judge.

YES, there are great dads who get screwed over by the system. That does not mean that every mother out there who loses custody of her kids is a huge feckup. It means the system screws people over, period.
 TimPommell
Joined: 1/13/2005
Msg: 118
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How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/13/2006 7:07:21 AM
Interesting thread... probably should have been how good PARENTS lose custody...
I did not need court approval to father my children, nor was it required to parent them ... that is until after I was divorced. The "fathers rights" groups are in existance because they need to be. Prior to DADI, Dad's Against the Divorce Industry, 90% of all custody cases were decided in favor of the mother based solely on the assumption that women were more nurturing simply because of gentalia. I know people who's former spouses have been in jail for extended periods for domestic violence, theft, fraud, and drug usage who still cannot obtain even temporary custody. Do the courts act in the best interest of the children? I think not! Few people know that the federal government actually pays each state an annual "grant" based on the amount of money collected from Child Support. The more money each state collects, the more revenue provided by the Feds to operate. There is are studies about PAS (Parent Alienation Syndrome) that identify staggering differences in children raised with the guidance of a single parent vs. those raised in a shared custody environment. Children are 80% more likely to fail in school, use drugs, commit crimes, and commit suicide when one parent excludes the other (with the aid of the courts) from contributing to their emotional development. The simple fact is, it's all about the money, and while the government is making a windfall, our children are paying the ultimate price!
 JumpingRaindrops
Joined: 2/2/2006
Msg: 119
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/13/2006 7:23:53 AM
Well, Tim, we may actually agree on something....

I don't know about the viability of the PAS thing, eprsonally, seeing as every single new "syndrome" to come down the proverbial pike gets credited with almost identical statistics re: substance abuse, promiscuity, etc etc. I worked in family services for YEARS, and believe me, we heard the same exact thing about oppositional-defiant disorder, obssesive-compulsive disorder, attachment disorders, ADD/ADHD, etcetcetc. Show me the diagnosis du jour, and I'll show you someone who says, "These kids have increased risk-taking behaviors and are more likely to fail." I'm not saying it's not real, just it's worth being wary of the latest thing to blame for kids' behaviors.

And the father's rights groups - I think you're right, SOMETHING needed to be done. Unfortunately those groups can be manipulated by abusers, as well. I used to work for a child abuse crisis hotline, and the false reports we got outnumbered actual abuse reports in huge numbers. I think the father's rights groups as a whole are getting better about ferreting out the abusers who are just looking for another avenue to maintain power and control over their children's mothers, which they need to if they're going to maintain their integrity, so they can help men who truly need the help.

As for the "divorce industry" - I wish it were as hard to get married as it is to get divorced. I do think divorce needs to be accessable when it's wanted and needed; I don't see any sense in forcing two people to stay together if they don't want to be. And I think if people had to think a lot longer and harder about their marriage before it happens, there'd be a lot fewer divorces.

Sadly, my experience with the court system has been that many judges are on power trips and are more interested in promoting their own personal agenda than in the cause of justice.
 TimPommell
Joined: 1/13/2005
Msg: 120
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How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/13/2006 7:58:26 AM
Anything good can and will be manipulated by unscrupulous people for their own personal gain. The only way to eliminate those scoundrels from this is to remove the possibility of financial gain. I have first hand knowledge of someone who had to get a second job in order to pay child support AND cover the marital debt. When his ex heard of the second job she filed for an increase in CS because of the increased income and won! The guy had to take a third job just so that he could afford to buy the gas to drive to his first two jobs!
Most of the horror stories you'll hear about displaced parents are of women abusing the system for one simple fact, it is women who most frequently abuse it. Not because women are more vicious than men, but because the system puts them in the drivers seat in disproportionate numbers, and instills an entitlement mentality, i.e. the more women that receive child support, the more that will abuse the system. After a period of time, the non-custodial parental role becomes more of an ATM machine than that of a parent, in fact my own children have referred to me as the First Bank-o-Dad...
I'm not saying that children don't need to be supported, I'm saying that there has to be equal accountability. If a non-custodial parent is accused of not paying support they can be jailed and have their DL suspended until they can prove they did pay it, or pay it again. However, there is no accountability for the child support received; is it actually used to support the children? If a non custodial parent chooses to have a second family, there is no recalculation for the distribution of income, but if a custodial parent has additional children, no proof of increased income to offset the increase in costs is required... in short, some children are providing support for their half siblings, while their estranged parent is footing the bill! The system is broken on every level, but as long as it's profitable for the states, the status quo will stay in place until enough people scream loud enough that we're mad as hell and we're not going to take it anymore!
 chrissyfit
Joined: 4/7/2004
Msg: 122
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/13/2006 8:41:16 PM
this question has arisen before, and my answer will most likely resemble, verbatim, my last answer (sorry in advance for the redundancy).
'good mothers' can lose custody if they are caught in a lie in court...little thing called perjury. this happened to a friend of a friend of mine.
'good mothers' can lose custody if they appear totally unreasonable in granting visitation to the ncp. judges typically grant custody to the parent who is MOST LIKELY to fascilitate visitation with the ncp (a solid family attorney, or any book on custody will tell you this).
'good mothers' can lose custody if they totally fly off the handle in court. if the 'good father' has an EQUALLY or more solid attorney, he will advise his client to try to intentionally rattle the 'good mother's' cage (and, let's face it, folks...our ex's know PRECISELY how to push our buttons, especially when the most important matter in life is at stake). the judge will sit back and think, "hm...the woman who cannot remain measured during court proceedings probably can't deal with 2 screaming toddlers/hormonal teens very well on a regular basis.
'good mothers' can lose custody if the 'good father's' attorney happens to play golf with the presiding judge, if the 'good mother' dresses inappropriately for court proceedings, if the children in question are boys (the "same sex" parent argument), or if the judge is making his once-yearly, "token" gesture of awarding a father custody, which is SUPPOSEDLY happening more these days, but I'm sure not seeing it. Custody awards deserve to be in the best interest of the child/ren, regardless of the gender of the parent. dads have been getting the bum rapp in this department for ages...
 SassySiamese
Joined: 7/29/2005
Msg: 124
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How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/14/2006 9:40:44 PM

I would say, impossible.
I would also say, appeal. The judge would be breaking the law (precedent IS law) in the matter and it would be overturned on appeal.
I just don't believe it. I good stay at home mom NEVER loses custody over a father, period.


Apparently you don't live in my State, more importantly, my county. I have been fighting this issue since last year. I won't go into details but it has not been pretty. And saddest of all, my youngest daughter has gotten stuck in the middle of this mess. This man, was also a prominent father figure to my oldest child... funny how he likened himself to just cut her out of his life and pretend she doesn't exist anymore. Sad that she still refers to him as her "daddy" when it's painfully clear that he doesn't give a rats ass about her in the least.

Oh well... another discussion for another time.
 JumpingRaindrops
Joined: 2/2/2006
Msg: 126
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/15/2006 12:16:20 PM
So, Karl, you've just accused a whole lot of people on this site of being liars. Way to go..... buhbye.
 ilovebali
Joined: 8/15/2006
Msg: 130
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/19/2006 9:40:52 AM
Is there any attorney/lawyer in PoF? I need a consultations lol.... the postings here scared me!!!
 bechimera
Joined: 9/17/2006
Msg: 131
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/22/2006 2:26:17 PM
The Texas court system is not as biased as it once was, as a matter of fact there is significant lobbying for father's rights that has made great strides and the good ol' boy system has strong roots. And of course don't forget that men make (on average) a higher income and can afford to push a bit harder, hire a more experienced attorney, hire more experts, and put more pressure into the litigation process. And typically men have the added incentive to avoid child support.

I know this sounds like I am anti-male parent, but the truth is I am not an activist for either gender...

Being a good parent is not gender related nor is it finacially related, it is simply providing to our children all that we have to offer; time, patience, love, discipline, smiles, giggles, respect, forgiveness, encouragement, etc.

The reality is (in most circumstances) that our children will best be served with the love and attention of BOTH parents, where the children are NEVER put in a position where they feel they need to choose and/or protect one parent over the other. Custody battles do exactly THIS. Ultimately... one parent may "win custody" but often they lose in the eyes of their children because the children have become pawns as often the parents/attorneys/courts have lost site of "the best interest of the child" and ran with the battle instead. We can always point out the "negatives" of our ex's... and build a case against him/her if we work hard enough because there is no such thing as a skeleton free closet....

This is not to say that when there is abuse --alcohol, drug, mental, physical, etc... or if there is neglect that custody should not be questioned, as it definitely should!

The reality is that a "good" parent can lose custody of his/her child.... but a good parent will never lose the love/respect of his/her child and that is ultimately what a good parent seeks.
 SassySiamese
Joined: 7/29/2005
Msg: 132
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How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/22/2006 8:01:49 PM

The question is a lie and of course a lot of people will also lie and claim otherwise (no evidence, just what they claim to have seen themselves), but a snowball in hell has a better chance of surviving the hottest day in August than any mother that wants custody does to not get custody.


well first of all, I'm not lying about my particular situation. I AM a D-A-M-N good mother!! I PROUDLY displayed that by going through two days of custody trial. I have an older child with Down syndrome who happens to be fully included in her school. That daughter has had extensive medical issues that I have dealt with for the first 9 years of her life. Four surgeries in 9 years and I remained tough and strong for her through out all of the therapies, numerous specialists and countless doctor appointments and hospitalizations. Her biological father wasn't even around. I put my daughter's health and well being first in my life so that she could have a chance to survive. I provide a stable and loving environment for BOTH of my kids and will offer them no less than that. After all my oldest daughter has been through, knowing this, not even THAT convinced the judge that I should get full custody of my youngest child. All the while, the judge KNEW that this whole custody situation was because of my EX not wanting to pay what he should have in child support.

Who are YOU kidding?
 Nevaehs_mom
Joined: 8/4/2006
Msg: 133
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 10/15/2006 4:05:04 PM
Hi intriguing77

I noticed that you were willing to help another mother on here with legal recarch I was just wondering if you would maybe be willing to help me as well. I am at this time going through a custody battle with my ex regarding our 13 month old daughter. Everything with him is his father's right's but yet has done nothing with his child since the day she was concieved let alone born. In her 13 months of being here he has spent a total of 2 months off and on to see her by his choice but now that he was served with papers he wants her every second weekend and I am scared for this because he has never done anything to take care of her at all. most people do it for the money but I could care less about the money, I care about the safty of my child. He right from day one said that he did not want to be a father, and he walked out on us almost 4 months ago. This is more his mothers doing and I just am so confused about this whole father's rights thing and it scares me. I know that he would never be able to take her from me because I am one of them good mothers but even for the every second weekend thing I am not comfy with that, and I do know that is not about me it is about the child but she is not comfy with him and his family and she never has been since the day she was born. If you would please help me. I am in canada as well so..

Thanks
 Nevaehs_mom
Joined: 8/4/2006
Msg: 135
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 10/26/2006 5:33:02 PM
AMEN to that Sexy-in-the-city......

If you find one let me know the name as well ok lol..... I see my lawyer for the first time tommrow afternoon..
 .Atticus.Finch.
Joined: 12/27/2006
Msg: 137
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 6/8/2007 4:36:10 AM
Good Lawyers screw up and bad lawyers get lucky. Take that into account with the fact that THEN the justice ( Judge ) could be having a bad day, THEN take into account as to what is best for the kids. I have seen it personally 11 to 15 times and researched well over one thousand cases of custody.

If I hire a guy to build my deck I let him go at it, if ( and when I had to ) hire a lawyer for my custody case(s) regarding the most important aspect in my life, you can bet I jumped in and made sure they were doing / saying / writing on behalf of me and my children's best interests. Anyone who says that Divorce, seperation or custodial litigation is not fair to the kids is correct, and that's if everything goes GOOD, it is a travesty when those who were judged or deemed competent to represent us prove otherwise. That is why I actually like the fact that custody is never binding, appeals can happen as often as that party wishes, now a Judge or court may tire of hearing them but only ( usually ) if all likely reasons have been exhausted.
 upnorthmama
Joined: 8/23/2007
Msg: 141
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/12/2007 6:02:43 AM
OP
I was one of those good mothers! My son was removed because of a hospital social worker called CPS. I was charged with Medical Neglect and my son was legally stolen from me. I faught it and I won it, they had no proof nor could any physician say that I caused my son's medical history. I fed my son well balanced meals, I bathed him and read him stories every night, on Wednesdays I would take him to the park. They said that his schedule was too elaborate and that I was making it up. I contacted the other mothers that I went with, his pediatrician, and people who have watched my son, I was a great mother, according to these people, yet the state took my son. I left a big paper trail right to the senator and I won my son back, I am a single mother!
They don't need a good reason to take your child, just some jerk off the street can call and report and your whole world can crumble in one day at least in Michigan!
 A Moment in Time
Joined: 7/19/2007
Msg: 147
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 9/13/2007 8:03:09 AM
I guess each case is different, I had no trouble as the ex said first he agreed to me to have sole custody then changed it that he wanted sole custody but my lawyer started the meeting with his lawyer and said "are the girls happy - yes, are they doing well in school - yes, well so much for sole custody for him.

I was surprised on tv when I saw David Hasselhoff won custody of his girls, apparently the wife had a drug problem, but look at him drunk on that tape I saw on t.v.

I think possibly why they give the women custody especially when the children are young and she is at home with them is because if the man had them, he has to work for at least 8 hours a day and who will look after the kids?

Sometimes it is just a matter of which lawyer is good at what he does and how it is presented in court.
 haywood8080
Joined: 5/1/2009
Msg: 150
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 5/5/2009 8:38:30 AM
It shouldn't happen. My childrens' father always threatened that he would take the kids if I ever left him and that whoever had the most money always won. He was a felon, a drug addict, pathological liar, absent father, etc. He didn't even want them, he just wanted to hurt me. Thank God he wasn't able to take my babie from me, they are 1 & 3, but I was terrified. I was told point blank that I needed to settle out of court because, you never knew what would happen in court. My ex had nothing on me but continued to try to set me up through the entire divorce. I admire good fathers and would hope they WOULD get custody if the mothers are anything like my ex.
 barbee1970
Joined: 12/29/2008
Msg: 151
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 5/6/2009 5:59:42 AM
Moms don't automatically get custody anymore. Courts are looking for what is in the child's best interest. The courts would like to discourage children growing up on welfare.

I let my ex have my youngest son, as I only made $7 a hour. I thought he was a good Dad, just as huband and wife, we did not seem to agree on anything.
 Cegana
Joined: 10/31/2008
Msg: 152
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 5/6/2009 6:10:59 PM
It is sad, but it is also sad that there are mothers on this very site, who meet married men here. Give them the address and lock the children in the rooms while they are screwing in the next room. You know who you are!!! These are the skanks who ruin it for the Real Moms out there.......
 BlondMomma
Joined: 5/19/2008
Msg: 153
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History
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 5/20/2010 9:52:54 PM
I just lost custody ,of my 16 year old son myself!
I thought i was going to court for him violating his probation (by not fallowing my rules) and custody was given to his grandmother! i only get him for 6 hrs a wk (on Sundays) and there is no plan to reunite our family! i never broke the law and actually,cps came here to see if my home was fit (as well as i) for my son to return! cps said i in fact was fit ,as well as my home and only reason my son came up with not to return was...he didn't like my rules! like cps worker said...what kid does like rules?,but still i don't have rites to see my son,but for 6 hrs,ordered by the court? the probation department is very rude to me and accused me of manipulating the court,harassing my son by calling him(even son said it wasn't true),and told me i actually had no rites to see my son! little do they know...i recorded these conversations! all visitation was left up to probation and they refuse to give me more than the 6 hrs! i think it is just because i would call them,when my son was in violation and they don't want to work! grandma is in fear of my son going into state custody and tells probation he is doing well w/her,when in fact,she tells me,she is having problems with him! When i need help,i ask for it (like calling probation,when he was violating it),but for the fact i ask for help...i lost my son? so unfair!!!
 freetime2bme
Joined: 1/16/2006
Msg: 154
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How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 5/21/2010 4:52:59 AM
One more time:

Q: How do good mother's lose custody today?
A: As can be seen over and over, a good mother does not lose custody. Some good mothers might get joint custody and it might not even be primary, but they will still have some custody. Good fathers can and do, but not a good mother or at least I have not seem it happen or an real examples of it happening. Now bad mothers, this is a different thing, but lets stay on topic this thread is about good mothers. If any good mothers could post here that have lost custody please tell us about it. As of yet I have not seen any of them posting here. For the bad mothers out there that lost custody, I think they need to start a new thread on "How bad mothers lose custody today" because even that is hard. It is kind of like a train accident it is interesting to see or read about, but it should be in the correct thread.
 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 155
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How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 5/21/2010 10:45:37 PM
Despite what many think, a good mother can lose custody merely by the fact that a father files. So many state that custody automatically goes to a woman, but, from I can glean, when a father files for full custody, more often than not, he prevails. My personal belief is that he likely has more money for an attorney. I have long held the belief that, whether it be divorce or custody dispute, the one with the most cash for a lawyer will prevail, and I have yet to see evidence to the contrary.

I tend to think that bad mothers don't lose custody because the fathers of the children of bad mothers don't often file for full custody. Winning or losing custody is not the same as having custody. The vast majority of custody is not contested, whatever the reason. Lest we forget, the legal basis for determining custody isn't the test of " good" or "bad", for the most part. Let's not make this into something it isn't.
 My I
Joined: 1/23/2007
Msg: 156
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 5/22/2010 4:55:10 AM

Let's not make this into something it isn't.

Yes, let's not.
From what I've read in the brief moment of checking this thread, it appears good moms make poor decisions. As a result of those poor decisions they are being questioned and labelled (correctly and/or incorrectly).

There are many women posting that the ex was a drunk, users, angry, a convict and irresponsible. With that being said I can understand why government agencies question how a woman claims the ex is unfit/unreliable but then he was OK as long as you were all living together.... and in love

Bottom line is that some of you had your kid in dangerious situations. It's also reasonable to believe that the mom supported and/or was part of that lifestyle or she wouldn't have been there with the child(ren). In many cases the mom was in that environment before getting pregnant.

You're guilty by association. The environment the ex created was OK for the child until divorce or seperation was an issue.... hence the credibility issues for some of you "godd moms".
 lynaudio
Joined: 2/11/2007
Msg: 157
How good mother's lose custody todays?
Posted: 5/22/2010 6:57:40 AM
There are many women posting that the ex was a drunk, users, angry, a convict and irresponsible. With that being said I can understand why government agencies question how a woman claims the ex is unfit/unreliable


Maybe these women should follow your example and abandon the children in an unfit environment until they are mature enough to figure out that they have to ask for help.

Then they can pat themselves on the back for being the hero.
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