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Show ALL Forums  > Relationships  > What ever happened to committment and chivalry?      Home login  
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 Agreatukk
Joined: 7/22/2007
Msg: 169
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?Page 9 of 10    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10)
^ Just an old fashioned romantic I suppose?
 10of6
Joined: 8/27/2008
Msg: 170
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 10:00:26 AM

^ Just an old fashioned romantic I suppose?
You've summarized the misconception in a nutshell there, FH. They're talking "romantic," more than "chivalrous." The word chivalry derives from French "chevalier" or Spanish "caballero" meaning in essence a knight.

My concept of true chivalry is what brought on excoriation--if others think I'm going to change my position just because it [the meaning of the pure form of chivalry] does not contort with cultural and political manipulation, well, I wouldn't suggest holding your breaths. Nothing I said was insulting, it was merely a statement of acceptable behavior in knightly times.

In feudal Europe there existed a standard of behavior among knights and how they were to relate to the general public, most of whom were sharecroppers. It would have been fully imaginable that a knight would take "corrective" action for those who disrespected his position, the position of their lords, as well as for those who abused theirs, or took advantage a situation due to their sex, irrespective of their position in society (with the exception of royalty).

I say again, with respect to chivalry it wasn't even back then a one-way street. And today, as I would expect for myself, I would get preferential or deferential treatment only if I earned it. I don't view it as something that is extended merely because of sex; that concept is antiquated. It would be nice if people could treat each other "civilly" or "romantically" these days, but until cultural and political dynamics change, there's little or no motivation/inspiration for it.
 Seriouslytaken
Joined: 6/23/2008
Msg: 171
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 10:16:42 AM
Message 207: we want an aggressive man?
No never, I want a man at peace with himself, who isn't a whiner and knows what he is doing. This is why I don't date young men, I find them unrealiable and unaware of what makes a woman thick: these kind of men will not protect and guard my heart. It's more a matter of nobility of purpose. If I have to train a man to be my protector, the man is not for me. See....the antonym of chivalrous is cowardly. Old chivalry was not a matter of romance but a matter of honor, values and respect in the tough way. The function of the man who served his sovereign or lord as a mounted soldier in armor was to protect, to liberate, to guard. And his woman was a certain kind of woman: with an old fashioned regal beauty, deserving of his chivalrous conduct.
Men seem to be at a loss these days and women seem to have lost their 'regality'. And I prefer to be alone than with somebody who is afraid to wear his armor/self-confidence. Now, in private the knight takes his armor off. Clear now?
If a woman lost her dignity-regality, why would a man want to commit?

 Blk_Archangel7
Joined: 12/21/2007
Msg: 172
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 10:46:38 AM
SeriouslyTaken, you nailed it! very true chivalry has died because of what you just said and the fact that society (world) has replaced values with sex, money, materialistic things, all the negative a like. And I believe chivalry is not just for men as well. Women also have to learn to fight and pick up the Armour as well or else some next lady is going to take away her knight in shining armour as well she because she did not put up a fight for him cuz these days people have to protect there values and if you care about someone you better fight for them or else they will be taken away.
 Seriouslytaken
Joined: 6/23/2008
Msg: 173
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 11:13:37 AM
blk_archangel7 sweetheart:
you don't fight for your woman, you fight for your values. In doing so, you respect the woman who has chosen you because of it ( because of your values and your honor to them).
The fight is of an internal nature. No need for aggressive outward behavior.......we are not in feudal Europe anymore.
Young men have a difficult time understanding this; must be the generational gap and the stupidity of american feminism.
No wonder I don't date below 50 and no wonder I prefer europeans.
 Blk_Archangel7
Joined: 12/21/2007
Msg: 174
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 11:18:27 AM
^^ haha :-D thank you for the correction
 ichi-bon
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 175
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 11:26:47 AM
seaga:
You have a LOT to learn,,,,,and it makes no sense to repost so much about my husband on here....or my son............or many of the other men that know how instinctively how to be one because they were brought up with basic moral fiber and consideration for others......if you don't get it by now...
...but a whiner..............for ..............big difference between a whiner and a soft hearted man secure enough to let tears flow when he's happy, when something touches his heart.... .when those little ones wrap there arms around his neck, and he is filled with emotion at the wonder of it all...... Show me a man that don't cry and I'll show you a man with no heart.
And to he that said we don't like lovey dovey..........oh we love that..we just don't like " touchy , feely" Big difference and soooooooooo many men can't figure that out.
 Theodocius
Joined: 11/12/2008
Msg: 176
view profile
History
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 11:27:14 AM
I agree with you 100% truefiannawolf, I was raised differently then most of the people around me in my life, bought up as a nice guy and my dad did teach me about chivalry and how to always be a gentlemen and treat women right. However, it becomes extra hard for me to meet new people and such because every woman I run into, either is looking for a guy who is a jerk because they dig those kind of tough guys or they hate guys in general for one guy or a few being jerks to them. I think the reason that chivalry is dead is because people let the bad behavior around them to influence them because its like going with the crowd, if enough people start wearing something, then a lot of people will want to wear it too. The problem is that bad traits can be spread like that. It stops becoming a relationship and it starts becoming about personal needs being fulfilled and sometimes our personal needs get influenced by the wrong kind of thinking, which is why I think chivalry stopped being spread because people began seeing how negative traits were getting others places for half the care and work but ehhh, I dunno, thinking about it at times kind of frustrates me because its like a good thing that stopped being passed out when it shouldn't have never stopped being passed out in the first place.
 ichi-bon
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 177
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 11:32:46 AM
21, and so much wisdom from one so young!
hang in there...you don't want the one that that is influenced by what the crowd does, but the one that responds to you being who you are and valueing you as a person with honor
 zrythm8
Joined: 9/21/2008
Msg: 178
view profile
History
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 12:47:02 PM
I was brought up in different countries - british - and taught that manners maketh man. I have lived by this and have to say most men are still chivalrous. I usually find the young college aged kids are not. To me manners and respect come from feeling that way about yourself and giving that off. We teach people how to treat us.
Zee
 1AmazinGentleman
Joined: 6/27/2008
Msg: 179
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 1:03:31 PM
As a chivalrous male, I agree wholeheartedly. My late Mother, taught me to be a real man, a chivalrous man, opening doors, listening intently, standing whenever a female left the table, or when she arrived, or came back, picking up the check, complimenting her on real things, not just you look nice, but your hair looks amazing, or that outfit looks great on you, or thank you for spending a few moments getting ready to see me.

My best friend and housemate, another chivalrous and appropriate male, hate how most men make us look to women. Our female friends (platonic only, and many more of them of them then male friends for the reasons listed above), call us the "straight gay guy" duo, and the last chivalrous men in their galaxy.

Come on men, straighten up, stop making all men look bad, and making it harder for the good ones.
 compleat_man
Joined: 10/3/2008
Msg: 180
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 1:03:52 PM
yes yes,..

"Religion aside.........Jesus said it best when HE said" love thy neighbor as thyself."


and then the Crusaders used 'the teachings of Jesus' to justify slaughtering tens of thousands of 'non-believers' or 'infidels' or whatever other label you wish to use..(mostly Muslims) ncluding men, women and small children, chopping their heads off til the streets ran red with blood..

no doubt they were 'chivalrous' to 'believers' when they got back home though..

are Iraq/Afghanistan modern "Crusades" ? today men drop bombs that kill hundreds or thousands of civilians including women and children, (but they are only 'foreign' people, so not too important I guess..) and are chivalrous heroes when they return..

or should we all deny history & reality yet again?
 Theodocius
Joined: 11/12/2008
Msg: 181
view profile
History
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 1:28:18 PM
"Come on men, straighten up, stop making all men look bad, and making it harder for the good ones."

I agree 100% =)
 ichi-bon
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 182
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 1:46:06 PM
and then the Crusaders used 'the teachings of Jesus' to justify slaughtering tens of thousands of 'non-believers' or 'infidels' or whatever other label you wish to use..(mostly Muslims) ncluding men, women and small children, chopping their heads off til the streets ran red with blood..

You seem to miss the whole point of these discussions:..........you are classing all Christians. all chivarous men, .all Crusaders as you call them in one group. If you didn't know..........it was in fact Jesus' own that crucified HIM, but that did not make HIM any less than HE was.
So much of everything including the Bible are taken out of context. and only convenient parts used, that man can justify his behavior by doing that. However this discussion is not about our faith, but about common decency, committment and chivalry. Let me ask this of those that are against it or only believe it should be given to those "worthy". How do you treat your mother ? How do you feel if someone mistreats your mother?
Do you expect a man to treat your sister the same way you view treating women?
Chivalry is NOT dead, and using any history from the PAST or PRESENT is not an excuse for bad manners, and or the lack of chivary and committment.
My neighbor may beat his dog, slap his wife and not take care of his children...but that does not give me the excuse to lower my standards and follow him. I choose to be upright and not follow the crowd, but rather what I know is right. I would rather be misjudged for doing right, than to go with what goes against my grain, and treat people as I may in my stupidity perceive THEY DESERVE to be treated. Thank God I have ran into wonderful people in my life that have treated me like a queen, when I may have felt because of my lack of social standing, finances, lack of education, my shyness......etc that I myself did not deserve it myself. Those people stand tallest in my heart and mind..and always will.
You are so young to be so bitter!
 10of6
Joined: 8/27/2008
Msg: 183
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/16/2008 5:25:09 PM
"Come on men, straighten up, stop making all men look bad, and making it harder for the good ones."
I don't understand this line of thought at all. No one put me on earth to "represent." I act out of respect for myself and for others who have earned it. I can't imagine your pleading will even have much effect on impressing women, either, since millions of them have bought into the anti-male propaganda that permeates western cultures. If that was the intent of your plea, it was naive; if it was to inspire men, I dare say that you don't know what inspires men.
 verygreeneyez
Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 184
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/17/2008 12:35:23 PM

Most women unless they are ready to marry - find it boring unless it is johnny depp being chivalrous. And an awful lot of women are doing the "we grew apart" thing, and grabbing the house and kids, leaving the knight in shining armor hocking his armor to cover child support.


Ahhhh ~ how frickin' sad. I don't know if this was composed by a man or woman, really makes no difference. The rays of sunshine just pour of out this quote. For all of you who think differently, you are the reason I still believe(d). I don't care what anyone on a "dating" site states, if you deserve it, you get it. If you don't ~ so sorry. I heard this really alarming story from someone I thought was a "friend" once. He had a date ~ dinner. She refused to open her own door, so he left her in his truck until his meal was done (I doubt he even tipped, but that's just my guess) and she just sat there waiting. That to me, is a clear example of why/how things have become so skewed. Guys ~ it's not about money. (At least not to some of us.) It's about "thought" and gentleness/kindness. The man in my life went on vacation to Mexico without me not long ago ~ I got shells from the beach. He got a "welcome home" card. That is, to me, what this is about. And he would NEVER leave me in the truck because my door didn't open on it's own. Common courtesy rings a bell (and YES, I'm more than capable of opening my own damn door ~ it's just nice when it's not expected.) Wow, today ~ I'm so happy for those in my life male or female, who feel ecards, snail-mail, simple gifts and impromtu phone calls mean something. It doesn't cost a penny to let someone know they are special. (In fact, the free stuff means much more than the other, at least to me.) Good luck to you all who think it's about something else ~ what a rough road that must be to travel. (To the rest of you? ) JMO
 ladyc4
Joined: 2/14/2006
Msg: 185
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/17/2008 1:12:30 PM

Honor above all, death before dishonor
- Respect yourself and others
- Your word is your bond
- Courage at all time.
- Honest in your mind and in your heart.
- Faith in your convictions in front of adversity.
- Your duty is to protect who can't
- Uphold justice even before law or power.
- Help anyone in need.

And this applies to BOTH genders. And people who truly GET what honesty and "your word is your bond" means,don't usually have a whole lot of trouble with the concept of committment, be it to a life partner, a cause, a family, a career, a friend or even a pet.
The "manners" part simply arises from LIVING the stated tenents.
Why does everyone have to keep trying to make this way harder than it needs to be?
Cindy O
 carebear133
Joined: 10/15/2008
Msg: 186
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/17/2008 2:16:31 PM
They are good words. To add to your comment about a woman has to live by those words to well there are some out there I should know cause I am one. We may be few and far between but we are out there. I was in a relationship with a chivalis man and he was appreciated very much. I do agree that if men are not appreciated for this then they will discontinue to do it.
 silversailor
Joined: 7/19/2007
Msg: 187
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/17/2008 4:35:02 PM
you put the nail on the coffin... and as such it is what it is to some, most ladies will wait, not been the issue if you can or can't open the door, but is the person with you care about you/respect you to open it for you.. my Castillian heritage still gives me pleasure to open a door / pull a chair for my date... my .2c
 Ben_Raines
Joined: 8/15/2006
Msg: 188
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/18/2008 4:02:26 PM
Chivalry, many would say this is an outdated term and concept. In our "New Age" world of "sexual equality" it has no place.. I say WRONG!! Chivalry is but a term used to describe the concept of doing what is RIGHT. It has nothing to do with knights or The Crusades, it has everything to do with following the Golden Rule of treating others as you wish to be treated. It transcends age and gender, it is timeless. It is behaving as a Gentleman or Lady and doing so ALL the time, not just for show, not just when someone is looking. It is not being a wimp or a doormat, it is not doing something for someone else because it is required, but rather because you want to, because it is the right thing TO DO. It is being Honest, Kind, respectful, truthful, helpful and courageous in the face of adversity. It is protecting those who can't (not won't) protect themselves, as I stated above it is doing the right thing. It is being nice simply because that is what one should be. It is being compassionate, but with a firmness that does not confuse compassion with weakness. It is calm, quiet strength, it's "manners" that hopefully you were taught by your parents(????). It is recognizing, considering and respecting the rights (and feelings) of others and realizing their opinions are as valid as yours. It is living up to commitments that you have made be they personal or business. Chivalry should not be confused with religion although many of the precepts thereof are based in virtually all major religions. Honesty, Kindness, Compassion and Respect will never be outdated concepts nor will Strength, Resolution and Commitment.

Men, if you treat a woman like a LADY, Most (though sadly not all) will act like a LADY.

Ladies, if you expect (and require) that a man act like a GENTLEMAN while in your company, Most (though sadly not all) will behave in that manner.

Men, if after you've treated a woman like a LADY, she does not behave in that manner, DO NOT allow her your company again, in fact end the date soonest.

Ladies, Most men will behave as well as you require or as badly as you allow.

Respect for one's self and others is the cornerstone of all relationships and chivalry is but a set of guidlines for our behavior within those relationships.
 ichi-bon
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 189
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/18/2008 4:34:53 PM
Ben_Raines

WOW, you hit it all right on the head ! AWESOME>...............and what a woman you have!!! I am so happy for both of YOU!!!!!!!!
 cheryls place
Joined: 8/10/2008
Msg: 190
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/18/2008 6:10:52 PM
It went the way of the Friends with Benifits bullshit. Why should we expect the man to respect us , when we can't respect ourselves. ANd will take anything that comes along. Not me though, I am willing to wait for my prince.
 LeagueCtyLdy
Joined: 9/21/2008
Msg: 191
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/18/2008 7:56:12 PM
AGAIN, I attribute this to being the women's fault. WE have allowed men to become romantically lazy and disrespectful. Men will seek the path of least resistance. Don't be easy and they will stop expecting us to have sex with them on the second date! IF all we women would decide to be more old-fashion, the men would have to abide by our rules, instead of us cowtowing to their demands.
 10of6
Joined: 8/27/2008
Msg: 192
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/19/2008 7:11:36 PM
^^^^^ I have a list of demands...and if you don't meet them, I'll...I'lll....I'll....go abroad and find a foreign woman.
 Ladytabor
Joined: 6/4/2008
Msg: 193
What ever happened to committment and chivalry?
Posted: 11/19/2008 8:57:06 PM
It's nice to know there are still some chivalrious men out there. I love for a man to open the door for me, makes me feel special. It actually makes a big impression on me if it is a first date with him and I do notice if he doesn't open the doors for me. Another quality I notice is his language. My late husband never cussed around me even when he was angry and he would quickly call down any man who did cuss in my presence. This made me not only feel loved but respected by him.
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