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 Confident-Realist
Joined: 2/8/2004
Msg: 2
When science proves that religion is truePage 2 of 3    (1, 2, 3)
First, on a one-dimensional scale of what we see as the universe, yes, most scientists, and most people (religious or not) believe in general that there was a Big Bang that dispursed all the energy and matter we see in our surrounding universe as we know it. It has nothing to do with religious matters.

The Big Bang Theory doesn't say what happened right beforehand -- it just points out that the universe seems to be expanding, therefore, it seems to make sense that it all exploded from one central point. Whether that be a single God creator, magical elves, an output result of other universes, and a million other possibilities is unknown.

Many scientists don't believe the beginning of all time in every dimensional fashion came from the Big Bang.


This lack of new objects further away has had some scientists speculating that the Universe is much smaller than they had originally estimated. Which would mean it was much younger too.

Actually, the age of the universe always gets changed, and yes, has even done so implying older, too. There are conflicting results on findings, as VERY distant galaxies are billions of years older than what was originally thought of when the Big Bang roughly occured.

Essentially, nobody knows, and various scientists argue about it, along with the concept of time itself. Regardless, what the hell does that have to do with religion??

Some religions require the Big Bang. Some don't. I guess any findings that would bring up questions could question a religion. Everything from "pork is found to be REALLY good for you!" to mysterious functionality within quantum physics.

Don't hold your breath that any interesting findings, on the tip of an iceberg of grand knowledge that won't reveal a ton of solid information for many decades or centuries to come, are going to come even close to proving or disproving any religion more or less.
 Confident-Realist
Joined: 2/8/2004
Msg: 4
When science proves that religion is true
Posted: 4/4/2006 3:12:27 PM
Zentral,

Valid scientific observations and validations can disprove specific religions (or types of religions) that have strict divine assertions in reference to the natural world. If for instance, say a religion says that God has said that he made masturbation cause blindness for all mankind, and that religion asserts that all messages from God are infallible -- well, then that religion has just been disproven as being divine.

blueberry,

Science is a means that man uses to better understand the world/universe around him.

Well, science is the means that man uses to understand the world/universe, as it is the means of validating and accurately determining how things really work.

It is by far it is not perfect

"Science" isn't perfect or imperfect -- that's a misnomer. Scientists are imperfect... scientific communities are imperfect... scientific theories can be imperfect. "Science" is just the method that we all (at least attempt to) use in our every day lives -- from validating whether someone gave you correct change, to whether the earth revolves around the sun. "Science" is not people, it's the method which defines the word 'accurate' and 'valid'. I've seen too many times people equate the same thing ("scientists"="science"), much like some people equate their religious preacher himself with God himself.

science cannot determine or measure anything spiritual

Yeah, nobody can measure anything spiritual on a rational basis, if one defines something spiritual which does not exist in the world or universe, or is so beyond our knowledge right now, that not even valid scraps of evidence of it is apparent. I understand that as time rolls on, we learn more and more through scientific discoveries, which reveal that things we thought were not exactly true are, and vice versa.

My problem is though, any idea or feeling which someone has that doesn't lend substantiated evidence to its possible existence in the real universe, can be comforted by believing that some day that there will be at least some evidence or that it can't and we'll know when we die -- and as such, ANY idea about ANYTHING that has zero evidence for its real existence is fair game.
 Ratero-park-man
Joined: 2/2/2006
Msg: 9
When science proves that religion is true
Posted: 4/7/2006 10:44:19 AM
Science has ALOT of catching up to do, and is really behind whaty the Bible says. Many atempts by science to prove that the Bible is false have failed miserably and some are becomming a laughing stock in my view. The stuff some people make up and try to put together into a logical conformity is just hilarious and not to mention laughable. It is very obvious that what the Bible says is true. When science makes up some theoy about creation or what not, it is for some people a good laugh and read soemtimes , thats all. But there is little truth to a science created proposition and when science is right in this context, they are just proving that the Bible is right which many believe it is.
 Confident-Realist
Joined: 2/8/2004
Msg: 10
When science proves that religion is true
Posted: 4/7/2006 11:52:08 AM
Angel,

Science can never prove religion to be true.

Well, we can always strive to avoid miscommunication. "Science" -- meaning the method which defines accuracy and validation, can prove a specific religion to be untrue. It's the same method we attempt to use every day, from determining whether we got correct change, to observing that the earth rotates around the sun, to justifying how and why we're right about any subject (even if we mistakenly use the method). Through logical reasoning and observations that are validly evident, one can invalidate a specific religion.


Religion is in the realm of the psyche and science can not mesure that.

Sure it can. Religion can be expressed, and religion can make claims. Of course you can't validate or invalidate any ideas that are only inside someone's head if they aren't expressed -- there's nothing to validate or invalidate. But when religious claims or non-religious claims about the world, history, etc. are made, many can be falsified, validated, or even judged to be unworthy due to lack of evidence.


Science is only a method we use to objectivly mesure the world around us and explain the phenomena we see.

Not just what we can see with our own eyes, but anything that shows evidence of anything existing or happening outside of our own eyes. It's not "a" method, that is closed to only averages and things 5 feet in front of us. "Science" is the method of validating or invalidating something. Once someone justifies their religious claim in reference to the world around us -- it can be considered.


religion requires faith, proof dose not, if you need proof, then you must not have enought faith.

If you have faith, you will want evidence to back it up with. "Blind faith" is where you have absolutely no reason why to believe other than you already do, with no evidence. Many religions claim that it's not just faith, but it's Truth (captial T). Many fundamentalists don't take it on faith in their own minds, they use a different definition of aith -- they claim it to be a fact.

If it was just faith to all Christians, then all Christians would have no problem with someone not "accepting Jesus Christ as their Lord". Some understand it's a faith and thus, understand that some people won't have the same beliefs, and have absolutely no problem with that... and here in the US, many won't see it as just faith -- they get riled up, feel sorry for you, bark at you for not "accepting Jesus Christ in your life". They see mounds of proof and evidence that Jesus IS the son of God, died for everyone's sins, and you will burn in Hell if you don't have the extremely similar beliefs (and buy the latest episode of Left Behind).

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence -- why is it that religion gets a free pass? Because that's our culture. Because there is no absolute knowledge about the formation of the universe, if there is any purpose, so any idea is "equal" and "doesn't need proof" (or evidence). I guess I'll believe that green child-molesting aliens live on the moon, watching Spike TV 24/7, as they are the sons of the 12th God, and have commanded that those who do not harm other people will be burned on Saturn -- I don't need proof!
 MIC_1974
Joined: 3/26/2006
Msg: 11
You know nothing about science at all!
Posted: 4/7/2006 7:01:51 PM
Science can only prove false.
That's how human beings improve themselves. That's how our society advances.
 CountIbli
Joined: 6/1/2005
Msg: 12
When science proves that religion is true
Posted: 4/8/2006 6:02:57 PM


It is very obvious that what the Bible says is true.


You mean things like a talking snake, Samson killing 1000 Philistines with the jawbone of an ass, Samson having superhuman strength because of his long hair, stars falling to the Earth, God worrying because some primitive humans almost built a tower into Heaven, a race of giants, a farmer building a gigantic boat big enough to fit two (or seven) of every kind of animal in the world, etc.?
 LilNikki
Joined: 2/4/2006
Msg: 13
When science proves that religion is true
Posted: 4/8/2006 7:06:29 PM
Count,
You forgot the talking donkey who turned to his rider, opened his mouth and VERBALLY reprimanded him. Oh boy...what can ya do? It takes all types, I suppose.
 dud
Joined: 9/9/2005
Msg: 16
When science proves that religion is true
Posted: 4/9/2006 9:32:25 AM
i would say this is far from proof
 dud
Joined: 9/9/2005
Msg: 17
When science proves that religion is true
Posted: 4/9/2006 9:46:38 AM
oh ok, NOW we have proof. thank you
 susan_cd
Joined: 5/16/2007
Msg: 30
Running into a Wall Headlong without a helmet is fun.
Posted: 2/5/2010 10:55:21 AM
When science proves religion is true ????

Exactly WHICH "religion" is meant? Ancient Egyptian ( Anubis, Osiris, etc )? Ancient Norse ( Odin, Thor, Balder, etc )? Roman or Greek mythology? Which?

And if science could in fact prove religion is true ( ie: there was a "god" as described in the book of Genesis in the Bible) then it would just make the scientists start asking & searching for the answer to the puzzle of "who created God" ?
 susan_cd
Joined: 5/16/2007
Msg: 31
When science proves that religion is true
Posted: 2/12/2010 6:06:03 PM

What about metaphysics? What about the instruments and methodology developed to measure the presence of poltergeists?


There's no proof of poltergeists either.
 susan_cd
Joined: 5/16/2007
Msg: 32
When science proves that religion is true
Posted: 2/12/2010 6:09:26 PM

such as stated in Matthew 14 verses 15 to 30 , not only was the terrain nearby a DESERT, the ship was being tossed about in the WAVES, and when Peter left the ship to go to Jesus, he walked on the water but lacking faith and being fearful, subsequently SANK into the WATER........doesn't sound too frozen to me........maybe the scientists need to get THEIR facts straight.


You're saying that simply because something is written in a book it's a fact? Other books of mythology talk of a snake-headed woman whose gaze can turn people to stone, but I doubt anyone believes in the Medusa. And mythologys of various cultures have gods impregnating women, the story of Mary giving birth to the son of God is simply a variation of a theme.
 susan_cd
Joined: 5/16/2007
Msg: 33
When science proves that religion is true
Posted: 2/12/2010 6:12:08 PM

As for mosquitoes, the only thing they need to survive is other blood producing species and water.


In fact they don't even need the blood of other species, they can get by without it. But if they have access to it it allows them to produce more eggs than if they went without.
 worldtraveller74
Joined: 5/10/2011
Msg: 34
When science proves that religion is true
Posted: 7/9/2011 12:46:40 PM
Science always proves that your abrahamic religions are false. Get real.
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