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 Ave Caesar
Joined: 11/11/2007
Msg: 69
Gentlemen can be BORING! Although, there is...Page 6 of 7    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7)
AceOfSpace:
Simply grabbing a girl's butt without her consent _is_ sexual assault.


You have never been in Italy, obviously.

 Love_on_Fire
Joined: 11/18/2007
Msg: 78
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Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 2/3/2008 9:06:15 AM
OP I am so sorry to hear this. It's horrible when guys get so nice and I know deep down in your hearts it's a turn off and you really deserved someone way better. It's unfortunate to see guys being nice, that ussually is a bad sign and they are bound to loose and loose miserably like this dude did with you. I guesse he got what he asked, he was a nice guy and a gentlement (even worse) and he got the reprocutions for that!!

Again I am very sorry that this happened, I wish guys would stop being the sleezy nice guys and bring back that masculine spirit again!!!!!!!!
 Showstopper80
Joined: 10/6/2006
Msg: 79
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 2/3/2008 9:10:03 AM
He wasn’t rite for you move on. Don’t go judging every tom****and Harry and make a thread to bash good men.... LOL since your new to internet dating let me give you a heads up your in for a Treat :)~ Its free you get the best of both worlds people lie allot on here just to get attention or to get into someone’s pants, you have to weed those people out.
 Zeanah59
Joined: 9/25/2007
Msg: 80
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 2/3/2008 9:43:31 AM
I never had this problem...lol I am also a red head and much older. To me, he is just being 19 and probably trying to figure it all out. Hid inexperience is showing and his hormones are also showing. Not an excuse for him to be this way because he was not being a gentleman to ask if he could touch you all over on a first date.

No man ever asked me if he could "do this or that", they just try it. If the man is coming on to strong, I simply tell him and he has backed off. I know there are creeps out there that take NO for an answer, but it has not been my experience...yet. Safety is always a concern and just not in internet dating. I do understand a mans concern of being accused of something not intended. I will admit, as a woman, I do like the man to take charge of the intial intimacy issue. I also wouldn't want to be a man because of it either. I have a 20 yr old son and I worry about him dating and how he is treating a woman or how he is preceived as such. I know I would not want a woman to accuse him wrongly or for him to pressure a woman into anything. It is just the age old human nature factor of courtship, dating, whatever you want to call it.

I do like a man to be a gentleman, but there are many ways to show you are a gentleman other than when it comes to intimacy. No one can be the judge of others if one should or should not engage in intimacy on the first date. Every date is different and every dating partner is different. I, myself, have boundaries, but I also may be tempted to cross those boundaries also. I like to think of myself as human and not to rigid. I do as I please, with judging only myself and not caring what others think.

Men who say they would not respect a woman if she "gave it up to soon"??? Ummm...if you were the one she gave it up to, then what does that make you? A little double standard BS...men can ,but a woman cannot. Ohhhh how self righteous are we now?

Red...don't allow others to make you feel weird about your motives and yourself. People cannot "make" you feel anything. You feel the way you do all by yourself. You are young and will make mistakes, have tons of questions about this whole man / woman issue, just like everyone else in this world. It never truly gets easier, so don't sweat it, just go with what makes you happy and does not hurt others. When it is a pleasant experience, then be glad it was. Never regret a great, pleasurable time, if only for a day! Who knows about life tomorrow?
Good Luck Red! Happy Fishing!
 crayonzz
Joined: 11/14/2007
Msg: 81
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 2/15/2008 2:43:15 PM
It's a bit of an ego bruiser isn't it readhead

Your fragile ego likes to think that no guy could keep his dirty mitts off you no matter how personally revolted you are by such creeps. So the gentleman and the gays a real blow to that ego.
 carolann0308
Joined: 12/9/2006
Msg: 82
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Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 2/15/2008 2:50:01 PM
You're 22 OP. You aren't mature enough yet to appreciate good manners, steady employment and dependability. Some girls your age are, but the one's that aren't are gals like you that will post threads about how some guy treated you poorly or was boring.
 Droleci
Joined: 4/21/2004
Msg: 87
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Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/13/2008 2:08:11 PM

... He was a gentleman...



"Can I touch your butt?"...


A gentleman would NEVER ask a question like that. For the kiss, MAYBE, but never anything else.

The guy was a 21 horny perv who thought the best way to get into your pants was to put on this little act. He gives true gentleman a bad name.

But yes... you'd probably find a true gentleman boring as well, cause he would treat you with the upmost respect and dignity.
 MelloDLyn
Joined: 10/25/2004
Msg: 90
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Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/13/2008 8:29:03 PM
Well first of all for a short first date he should not of been asking about your butt or his wandering hands. That usually is a sign he is looking for sex. He didn't want to upset u because he thought he would get some. Most men do not ask permisson for every move they make unless they live with their mom still.
 AceOfSpace
Joined: 5/28/2007
Msg: 93
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/13/2008 9:13:21 PM
You know, friends, there is a difference between being awkward and being creepy. He could just be a sweet inhbited kid who doesn't know how to break out of his shell.

Late-blooming nerdy types don't need to be "molded." They do need to be coached, and if your sense of him is that he's a sweetie-pie who doesn't know the ropes, what's the harm in telling him: "no, but if you'd asked me this way or just done it that way ... here ... like this ..." Then you both might have had a lot more fun.

If someone is romantically slow for his age, it's not like a mental defect or something. What's the harm in bringing him up to speed a little bit?
 Vannili
Joined: 7/8/2008
Msg: 96
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Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/13/2008 10:22:29 PM
Your date is not a Gentleman, a gentleman is from upper class , an educated guy and knows his way in a polite society,he is refined ,courteous,chivalrous, generous and kind. he is not violent,harsh and rough. A gentleman doesn't touch your butt,wander his hands on you, or ask permission ( in public to touch your butt, wander his hands?) A gentleman knows how to score on dating, he will not ask permission to kiss you, but wait if you will give him a hug or peck in the cheek and thank him for the dinner/time with him. If you don't give him a hug or a peck on the cheek it's okay with him. If a gentleman touch you it is on the lower back to guide you to the dining table . Your date is just a lowly wise guy, he thinks he can charmed you by asking permission to paw on you, or he is saving his a$$ that you might hit him on rape or something....
 Vannili
Joined: 7/8/2008
Msg: 97
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Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/13/2008 10:25:31 PM
I agree with ejesq ,your date sounds like a "creepy" guy...
 GEOSCH
Joined: 8/9/2008
Msg: 100
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/23/2008 12:08:46 PM
I dont believe how you women are acting. A guy asks if he can kiss you and he is wierd and boring. But if he dont than he ends up in the slammer fighting bubba for the soap.
 grkboy
Joined: 3/20/2008
Msg: 102
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 12/23/2008 11:43:36 AM

Just wanted to share this to see if I am alone...

So I took the plunge and met someone from POF. He was a local guy and we decided to meet for a quick bite to eat between my two jobs. Fortunately, he wasn't a creepy stalkerish old man like most warnings say, but he still did lie. He was two years younger than me which is a major thing when you are in my age bracket. And it showed! But that wasn't even the worst part of this "date"... He was a gentleman... And to the extent of the word which was weird! He asked permission for everything! When his hand was on my waiste it was "Can I touch your butt?"... When we were in the car it was "Can I kiss you?"... When we were kissing it was "Can my hands wander?"... I mean, I guess it's ok to ask and what not but this completely turned me off to this guy. You can take some control can't you?


Like it seems some have stated, that guy wasn't a gentleman as much as he was a DOORMAT.

I consider myself a gentleman. The respectfulness and good manners come from doing things like opening doors, pulling chairs, helping with coats on, and especially SHOWING RESTRAINT.

A gentleman doesn't try to get into making out or sex on the first few dates. He takes the woman out, shows her a good time, but he's not actively seeking to "seal the deal" as soon as possible.

HOWEVER, he's not going to fear or ask permission when he sees an opening. So when a girl I'm out on a date with is getting touchy, clingy, or even just looking into my eyes with a "kiss me" look on her face, I won't ask her permission, I'll just do it. The worst thing that could happen is she pushes me away and says "no". Same deal with the hands. If we're making out, I'll caress her back. If I feel her hands exploring me more sexually, then I'll do the same. If I caress her butt thinking it's ok, and she stops me, then I'll go from there and not freak out. 9 out of 10 times she'll just keep making out and I won't touch anywhere outside of the back.

Real gentlemen aren't afraid of rejection, but they won't give up their honor, dignity, or integrity for sex. If a woman is going to reject me or men like me because we're treating them well, then it speaks loudly just how much we men shouldn't mess with this woman.

In RedHead's case (I didn't closely read all 5 pages), she just thinks his fear of making a move is a bit creepy and cowardly.



Yup, I knew it! and people wonder why I'm a "jerk" and not a gentalmen. I recommend this post to all the guys who think being nice or a gentlemen will get them results, because it wont I've tried that back in high school. Better to be exciting and spontaneous.


All I've seen of guys who follow the "jerk" or "playa" lifestyle is they wake up one day wondering why every girl they hook up with is either a whore or a nagging ****. They complain then wondering where all the hot classy women are, and why they can't get one (although they tend to belittle women who reject them).

Big difference between being a confident man and being a jerk.
 scorpiomover
Joined: 4/19/2007
Msg: 103
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Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 12/23/2008 2:53:26 PM
Sounds like he's just trying to be a gentleman, and he's only 19, and hasn't been doing the gentleman thing long enough to learn how to do it well. After all, we all start off not very good at stuff, and we only learn to be good at things by practice.
 OutMind
Joined: 2/13/2007
Msg: 104
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 12/23/2008 3:01:26 PM
Can I please stick my finger inside your pocket?

Wait, this is not my pocket, it's my vagina.

That's okay, this is not my finger either.
 jonash2007
Joined: 7/11/2007
Msg: 108
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 12/23/2008 11:05:13 PM
You were doing all that on a first date? You naughty girl! lol....he was probably trying not to get accused of rape...There is a fine line between taking a woman the way she wants to be 'taken' and overstepping the line. And nowadays if a guy oversteps that line, there is a short path to getting accused of rape or other such unsavory things...it is risky for the man. Just look at what happened to the Duke lacrosse team guys...luckily they were smart enough to fight back, but you can't be too careful these days...there are a LOT of crazy chics out there who will say ANYthing (and cops tend to side with the woman first and almost always)...so you BETTER ask first..at least in the beginning.

The bigger question is why are you turned off by a considerate guy? What does that say about you? Do you WANT someone to treat you like crap? There are plenty out there who will...especially if that is what you seem to like.
 PsychDoctor
Joined: 8/21/2008
Msg: 109
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Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 12/24/2008 7:57:00 AM
"Also, don't come at me and tell me that I do not respect myself for getting in a car or kissing...... Plus, I don't know how you date, but I didn't know it was trashy to take the same car. A guy has never picked you up for a date?"

Dear FieryRedhead85 -

What you do on a date is your business. No one else's opinion matters. You are responsible and accountable for your own behavior.

My concern reading your post was for your SAFETY. You let a man that you had never met pick you up in his car??? Didn't your mother ever teach you about internet dating safety? Meet in a public place. Don't give him your home or work address. Take your own car or have enough cash to get home on your own. Let someone know where you're going.

You're very lucky that he was nothing more than a socially inexperienced 19-year-old boy who lied about his age. What if he had turned out to be a 50 year old homicidal deviant or sexual predator? Instead of reading your post, we might be reading about your mutilated corpse being found in a ditch.

You are very young, cute, and far more trusting than you should be in this day and age. Please pay more attention to your own safety. Please.
 ColonelIngus
Joined: 9/16/2007
Msg: 116
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Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/3/2009 11:52:42 AM
Ok, very old thread (and all other things aside), but I did read all the way through and was somewhat surprised no one mentioned the notorious Antioch Code, which was instituted at the insistence of women. It formulated a set of rules for the conduct of sexual relationships which required the male to secure explicit verbal consent prior to each escalation of physical intimacy leading to sex. "Can I touch your breast now?" "Can I put my hand inside your panties now?" "Can I put my finger inside you now?" Sound familiar?

From wikipedia:
The Sexual Offense Prevention Policy

In 1993 Antioch became the focus of national attention with its "Sexual Offense Prevention Policy." This policy was initiated after two date rapes reportedly occurred on the Antioch College campus during the 1990-91 academic year. A group of students formed under the name "Womyn of Antioch" to address their concern that sexual offenses in general were not being taken seriously enough by the administration or some in the campus community. Advocates of the policy explain that the original "Sexual Offense Policy," as it was then called, was created during a couple of late-night meetings in the campus Womyn's Center, and that "this original policy was quite questionable. It was not legally binding, no rights were given to the accused, and it called for immediate expulsion of the accused with no formal process." The policy, both as it then stood and as revised, uniquely viewed any sexual offense as not simply a violation of the victim's rights, but as an offense against the entire campus community. It was revised to focus more on education and less on punishment and clarified in a series of community meetings during the 1991-92 academic year. Once revised, it was endorsed by the entire campus and the Board of Trustees, and thus became the official policy of the college that year.

This revised policy attracted renewed national publicity two years later, during the fall semester of the 1993-94 academic year, allegedly when a student doing a co-op on the west coast mentioned the policy to a California campus newspaper reporter. An Associated Press reporter picked up the story in the early days of the term, and a media frenzy ensued, one that arguably garnered more attention to Antioch than anything since the student strike of 1973. The policy was often ridiculed by the mainstream American news media that fall, even becoming the butt of a Saturday Night Live sketch, entitled "Is It Date Rape?" Some media outlets voiced support for the policy. For example, syndicated columnist Ellen Goodman asserted that most "sexual policy makers write like lawyers in love," and that, likewise, "at Antioch the authors could use some poetry, and passion." But, she was ultimately sympathetic to their goals of leveling the sexual playing field and making students think about what consent means, saying that the Antioch campus "has the plot line just about right."


So maybe the guy in the OPost was just culturally aware and sensitive to some of these issues, which haven't exactly gone away -- though Antioch College has. Of course if he'd really been smart he would have gotten it in writing, and notarized.
 kpooks
Joined: 12/23/2008
Msg: 123
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Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/4/2009 7:22:43 AM
I think fieryredhead has answered the age-old question of why girls prefer A-holes over so-called "nice guys"-!
 _jay_see_
Joined: 11/24/2007
Msg: 124
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/4/2009 7:48:24 AM
He probably wasn't that hot for you... I mean you're kinda fat.
 Sabrosura
Joined: 1/7/2009
Msg: 125
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/4/2009 7:48:59 AM
OP: So in your mind a guy that asks permission (during your FIRST DATE) to touch your ass/hands wander is a "gentleman/boring"?

He's definitely NOT a gentleman, was probably nervous/lacked experience.
 OpenMindedDiver
Joined: 7/31/2009
Msg: 131
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/9/2009 10:50:01 AM
Sounds like a young guy, trying to compensate for lack of experience by making an attempt at being sensitive to your feelings.

In a few years, he may be a much better date, if he accumulates some experience and self-confidence. It's hard for guys, because they get so many mixed signals from women, from the media, etc. Follow your arousal instincts and you're labeled a neanderthal. Try to second guess your date's desires and you'll be labeled a closet gay. With time, men learn how to read a woman's unspoken assent to their advances, learn to lead and give you enough space to follow at your own pace, and learn to anticipate the things that will leave you feel like a woman and guide you both in those directions.

As a southern man, with a bit of breeding, I've been labelled genteel a few times, but I can promise you, I've never asked for permission before kissing or touching a woman. And when she says, "no", which sometimes happens, I respect that too and back away a bit.

Good luck finding a man who's figured it out. It's a difficult balance to maintain these days.

On the other hand, if you'd like to meet a man who doesn't have those issues, well just click "View Profile" and go from there...

;--)
 misszmsz
Joined: 5/31/2008
Msg: 132
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/9/2009 3:44:20 PM
You were not on a date with a gentleman.

Just because he needed your assurance/permission to molest you on the first meeting makes him an insecure cad.

American Heritage Dictionary : A well-mannered and considerate man with high standards of proper behavior. See Usage Note at lady.
 El_Mariachi
Joined: 4/21/2007
Msg: 133
Gentlemen can be BORING! Although, there is...
Posted: 8/9/2009 8:19:58 PM

You can take some control can't you?


So he should've just assumed he could kiss you and grab your butt? Come on.

I can understand being put off by the age lie, but boring people are boring.. gentlemen or not.

I imagine this thread being far different had he just felt you up at his whim.

Geez.


So I take it the a**hole types are still in the running?


No.. not with women who've got even a smidge of common sense.

 mthomjmark
Joined: 2/27/2008
Msg: 135
Gentlemen can be BORING!
Posted: 8/9/2009 11:04:11 PM
LOL; fiery redhead if you dont' want honesty, then don't post.

Within hours of meeting a guy, you let him make out with you and feel you up? and you are mad because he didn't take control? Are you kidding me? lol; you can't make this stuff up.

You think it's class and appropriate to do this? unreal; no wonder the STD rate is the highest in history.

he wasnt' being a gentleman; a gentleman wouldn 't act like an idiot and make out like a horny 14 year old to someone he just met, even if the girl was loose and wild.

You need to be more careful; there are a lot of creeps out there and I know 2 women who have been raped from being so loose on online dating sites; not this one but on 2 others; start being smart. I know sleazy and easy is in, but you are better than that; girls gone wild isn 't cool. good luck.
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