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 Strings6
Joined: 7/14/2007
Msg: 759
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?Page 15 of 69    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41)
Passionat Gent, a cop in a bad mood could beat you sensless and then say you were resisting arrest...who's the judge going to beleive.....you ...how much "whinning" would you do about that ?
 Singleinlewistonidaho
Joined: 8/25/2009
Msg: 764
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/21/2010 11:55:34 AM
Wow first I am amazed this thread was allowed to run it's course. Too long to read every reply.

I will articulate why I don't like law enforcement agencies but to start I don't hate cops I've only had problems with individuals.

Growing up in Poway CA, a place where they sent the rookies to train in San Diego CA because Poway had the lowest crime rates in the area I have had a lot of encounters with police. I used to drive a van and have long hair. I was in a band. And I got pulled over about every two to three weeks over the span of some 7 years. NOT once did I ever get a ticket. And only a small % of the stops were reasonable. Following will be some of my observations and by no means does this apply to all just too many:

1. Cops are not used to disagreements. Because of this fact in the field I find them to be jackasses on internet forums and in their personal lives. They take their I am always right attitude with them everywhere. Because of their line of work they develope personality disorders.

2. Cops are lazy. People want to get a lot of pay for what I consider a cushy job so they go into police work. But I've worked hard labor for years. I knew guys who worked alone side me who are now cops. Trust me the work is easy in comparison. They told me.

3. Police do not serve the citizens they exist to serve the local business community. I learned this after considering where all the stops were made that wasted my time.

4. Cops make far too many threats during stops.

5. Cops lie. They will lie to you to get you to submit to a search or about their motivations. In a double standard you better not lie to them.

6. Far too many get into the line of work because they get a power trip on control.

7. Far too many seem to not respect human life.

8. My dad was police auxillery in Co. He quit after 5 years saying "cops are Ass****'s"

9. Most up setting to me is when a bad cop gets busted on camera cops line up to defend them. There are police and there are criminals and you cannot be both at the same time. Like the cop who punched the black teen at the gas station. The other cops should have pulled him off but they did not. And they made an excuse saying the kid kicked the cop in the balls. Even if true the law does not allow summary punishment by the police. They know better then that. Is it ok if I beat a cop because he accidently or purposley hurt me? No there are protocalls.

10. Tazer use. It kills me when people are tazed because they did not comply fast enough. Guy on ground complying. Tased because they can. We see this crap. The whole world is waching.

11. Pepper spray. Spraying student protestors who won't move. Gotta love that. Spraying protesors who are not doing one thing wrong. Gotta love that too.

12. Selective enforcment.

13. Cowards. Look at the Littleton Shootng. Refused to go in over officer safty while kids blead out. An infantry officer told me he and a company could have arrived on scene and started to go withing 30 minutes of less. Taken out the bad guys and secured the school. All without fancey body armor. They only have flack vests. Protect and serve unless it's too risky. Protect and serve so long as we can be the hero's who go home at night.



That is some of what I see. I love the people who say "you hate cops till you need one". Short sighted BS. Consider it is illegal to take the law into your own hands. Otherwise there have been situations I'd have gladly delt with if i could have.

Mike
 FL CO
Joined: 12/23/2008
Msg: 766
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/21/2010 3:16:13 PM

1. Cops are not used to disagreements. Because of this fact in the field I find them to be jackasses on internet forums and in their personal lives. They take their I am always right attitude with them everywhere. Because of their line of work they develope personality disorders.

2. Cops are lazy. People want to get a lot of pay for what I consider a cushy job so they go into police work. But I've worked hard labor for years. I knew guys who worked alone side me who are now cops. Trust me the work is easy in comparison. They told me.

3. Police do not serve the citizens they exist to serve the local business community. I learned this after considering where all the stops were made that wasted my time.

4. Cops make far too many threats during stops.

5. Cops lie. They will lie to you to get you to submit to a search or about their motivations. In a double standard you better not lie to them.

6. Far too many get into the line of work because they get a power trip on control.

7. Far too many seem to not respect human life.

8. My dad was police auxillery in Co. He quit after 5 years saying "cops are Ass****'s"

9. Most up setting to me is when a bad cop gets busted on camera cops line up to defend them. There are police and there are criminals and you cannot be both at the same time. Like the cop who punched the black teen at the gas station. The other cops should have pulled him off but they did not. And they made an excuse saying the kid kicked the cop in the balls. Even if true the law does not allow summary punishment by the police. They know better then that. Is it ok if I beat a cop because he accidently or purposley hurt me? No there are protocalls.

10. Tazer use. It kills me when people are tazed because they did not comply fast enough. Guy on ground complying. Tased because they can. We see this crap. The whole world is waching.

11. Pepper spray. Spraying student protestors who won't move. Gotta love that. Spraying protesors who are not doing one thing wrong. Gotta love that too.

12. Selective enforcment.

13. Cowards. Look at the Littleton Shootng. Refused to go in over officer safty while kids blead out. An infantry officer told me he and a company could have arrived on scene and started to go withing 30 minutes of less. Taken out the bad guys and secured the school. All without fancey body armor. They only have flack vests. Protect and serve unless it's too risky. Protect and serve so long as we can be the hero's who go home at night.


1) So other people don't have an attitude? You're displaying one in this post.

2)Its not hard (most of the time), but its not all fun and games either. You labor buddies are less likely to get shot at, or get sued than an officer is. They probably don't have near the paperwork or the chance that they could end up in court of something job related.

3) A lot of criminal get caught during stops, its also a safety issue. They're needed

4) I've never been threatened and can't think of anyone I know of off hand that has been. You act as if it happens all of the time. Of course it could be simply threatening to arrest you for being disorderly

5)Lie or know what to say to get cooroperation? What do you think will get better results? "Do you mind if I search your car? I think I smell some pot in there", or "Do you mind if I do a quick search of your vechicle?"

6)A small percentage does. Concidering the number of officers out there the number may be high, but percentage wise it isnt.

7)How so? Should they respect the child molester, drug dealer, murderer?

8)So your dad got to see a small portion of what LE life was like. Maybe he didn't like/understand their style of humor, maybe he had a bad supervisor. Someone that works a couple days a month can't really understand the ins and outs of everything. I've got a co-worker that if people saw us passing the hall would probably think that we hate each other, but we get along great. We just like giving each other a hardtime.

9)LEOs are humans, they may make mistakes. Film doesn't catch every detail. Heck even those involved don't always catch every detail. There's also people natural reaction. Just because you're a LEO doesn't mean that natural reactions go away. We were taught that a hit to the groin with a baton was concidered lethal force (for that agency anyway), why wouldn't a kick be considered a threat?

10)Not complying fast enough, can also be viewed as non compliance. Someone on the ground could apprear to be reaching for a weapon or as if they're about to jump up to run.

11)Spraying is a way to gain compliance. Not all protest are peaceful. Some protesters try to start trouble just to get the 5 minutes of fame.

12)Where are you trying to go with this one? The white collar guy getting out of a ticket because he was going a little too fast, but was polite and didn't give the officer any trouble while the guy who looks like a pot head who the officer a hard time getting a ticket?

13)So one life is worth more than another? Your soldier friend can talk all he wants. Its easy to do when you're not there and have all of the information.
 Strings6
Joined: 7/14/2007
Msg: 768
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/22/2010 3:00:54 PM
FLCO,you seem to be saying that cops are like everybody else..are they supposed to be like everybody else or are they trained and paid to be different ? considering the power they have is it unreasonable to expect them to be an example of the law and order thay are charged with enforcing ? The fact is all of us are just one traffic stop away from a bad experience with a cop who should not have the job...but we both know they will have the job don't we...with many excuses and things to hide behind they have nothing to worry about....this is your idea of a public servant.
 Singleinlewistonidaho
Joined: 8/25/2009
Msg: 769
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/22/2010 3:31:22 PM
1. This post is not about me. It's about paid servants. The Orginal poster asked some questions I gave my answers. If that is an attitude to you I don't knwo what to tell you.

2. Your argument here falls back to, if they don't like the job then quit. I have quit jobs I did not like. If a paid servant is taking out his dis satisfaction with the job out on the public even more reason to get a new job.

3. I am not saying police stops are not needed. The abuse that goes with some of them are not and I am sure the OP of the topic who ID'ed himself as a police trainer does not train a single cop to be anything but polite unless it's otherwise called for.

4. That's funny. Because you were never threatend by the police it must never happen. How do I respond that that? I'll just say never mind for now and suggest you read the entire thread. I saw plenty of poster here talk about the threats and abuse they faced.

5. As I stated initially I cooperated fully to satisfy the police. But after a time it gets un reasonable. They kept telling me they wanted to get to know me. Well that is impossibe when the police are rotated in and out. I stopped playing the game. I would be pulled over for no probable cause or trumpted up cause and it got to be a waste of time and what I considered a security risk to my person.

6. Your observaion does not disprove my opinion.

7. Apples and oranges. I am not a criminal period. Innocent till proven guilty.

8. Out of line comments. You know nothing if the situation my dad was in. Needless to say he worked every week not twice a month. Further some of his opinions were formed not on the job but at the backyard BBQ's with members of the department and their families.

9. What on earth are you talking about? The Black kid in cuffs being punched by the officer who said the kid kicked him on the balls? He's in cuffs. Don't defend police abuse. The kid was not resisting. I doubt he ever had. Leo's can be human all they want to be. The public are human too. Don't forget it.

10. So someone is confused and does not comply fast enough. But when he or she does then gets tazed? So it's ok to tase someone because they did not comply fast enough. I don't agree with that and if you do I feel sorry for you.

Then there are cases where complience gets you shot anyway. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fb9ktN1Xf2s

Why did that cop shoot the military police man? His dad was the Cheif of police and he probably thought he could.

11. I am not taling about the protestors you are obviously. The ones I saw get sprayed where just sitting there and I saw no one ask them to move. Even the British had the decencey to read the riot act before anyone was fired on.

12. Where am i going with this? Cops being let go when DUI or traffic violations while the public would get a ticket. Read the post where a police officer was told by a fellow cop to let the state police know who he was and he might get out of a ticket. It's right here in this thread. He does not like double standards nor do I.

13. Fail: The infantry officver told me they don't need to know all the facts before they move in. are trained to rapidly assess the situation and go. I am simply comparing what the military would have done vs. cops. There is so much critisim for that action by the families I need not add to it here.

Mike
 FL CO
Joined: 12/23/2008
Msg: 770
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/23/2010 8:53:31 AM
FLCO,you seem to be saying that cops are like everybody else..are they supposed to be like everybody else or are they trained and paid to be different ? considering the power they have is it unreasonable to expect them to be an example of the law and order thay are charged with enforcing ? The fact is all of us are just one traffic stop away from a bad experience with a cop who should not have the job...but we both know they will have the job don't we...with many excuses and things to hide behind they have nothing to worry about....this is your idea of a public servant


LEOs are human. No one is perfect all of the time. Everyone is quick to point out when they have a bad experience with an officer. What about the good? People completely forget about the good that officers do and only focus on the few negative things that happen like its something that only occurs with LEOs


In response to Singleinlewistonidaho. We can go back and forth all day. You obviously don't understand how LE works, and are set in your views. You're suggesting a bad double standard and I know that nothing I say will change your mind.
 Strings6
Joined: 7/14/2007
Msg: 773
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/23/2010 2:08:22 PM
FLCO,you obviously don't understand the difference between LEO's and citizens,catch a fellow citizen on a bad day and you may get an attitude,catch a cop on a bad day and you can get your head caved in....big difference...you are set in your veiws and obviously beleive in an absolute power structure where the citizen has none,as well as a double standard in conduct and obedience to the law.
 christ on a crutch
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 774
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/23/2010 4:57:20 PM
i'm glad cops are here to do the job they do. but i am not disposed to trust any individual cop.

cops lie on the stand as a matter of course. i dated a cop's ex. she told me the shit he and his buddies made up in court.

if you want respect, then show respect!

it'd be nice if it were that simple. i have only one anecdote this way. a friend picked me up at an airport, a matronly grandmother. we were not getting my gear squared away fast enough to suit the orange county, ca., deputy watching. he came over, demanded her docs and berated her in the most rude sarcastic terms, even though she was painfully polite, and in tears at the end.

My thanks go out to you for your protection, your service and the risk you take every day in your job, which by the way people.........doesnt pay a whole lot!

if i made the rules, we'd be paying cops about three times what we do now, so we could get better people than what we have now - there are so many thugs and bullies in uniform. purge the ranks, make every single one reapply for his or her job. kind of a pipe dream, though, since the dominant bunker mentality would mean the managers would simply rehire their favorites regardless of competence.

we give cops extraordinary powers. that means they should be held to extraordinary standards.
 FL CO
Joined: 12/23/2008
Msg: 775
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/23/2010 5:54:33 PM

FLCO,you obviously don't understand the difference between LEO's and citizens,catch a fellow citizen on a bad day and you may get an attitude,catch a cop on a bad day and you can get your head caved in....big difference...you are set in your veiws and obviously beleive in an absolute power structure where the citizen has none,as well as a double standard in conduct and obedience to the law


So a citizen having a bad day can't hit you? You act as if LEO using force without cause happen all the time. It doesn't. Sure you could pull up dozens of stories of it happening. Now concider that there's hundreds of thousands of officers out there. (Over 800k not counting parttime or reserve). Citizens have rights, but they need to understand those rights and how the criminal justice system works. There is no double standard. The problem that several people in this forum seem to have is looking at things small scale. They don't seem capable of looking at the big picture
 Singleinlewistonidaho
Joined: 8/25/2009
Msg: 776
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/24/2010 2:28:03 AM
Whatever man. I could relate a few good police encounters I have had but the topic here is why people dislike the police not why they like them. Feel free to start another thread if it makes you happy and I'll tell my stories there. I think the consensus here and I believe you would find it anywhere is that, police encounters are normally of the bad variety. You have good ones that I have only had a hand full to relate, normal ones where the cop is neither a great guy or a jerk and then you have either the really bad kind that results in abusive treatment or the other bad kind that is not as bad but is bad from a verbal standpoint.

Just one example, people will ask the cop why they were pulled over almost 100% of the time unless they are first informed. I asked that question once in as much of a respectful way as cold be asked, I'll quote myself, "Is this a rutine stop officer"?" (Never mind i know there is no such stop I was just giving him a chance to communicae with me about it.) I was yelled at, the officer saying we don't make rutine stops but his tone was frightening and totally un called for. I was just a 22 year old kid. My DL and insurance was demaded. He ran a check and handed it back to me with not another word other then "you're done". I've had many stops that were not the most friendly but when you never forget it, someone needs some more training or needs to hang it up.

Mike
 Singleinlewistonidaho
Joined: 8/25/2009
Msg: 777
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/24/2010 2:37:17 AM
I'd like to add for the record a few choice reasons why.

1. Cops who detain and ticket men driving to the hospital with wife in contractions. (Ok he broke the law, give an escort, get the wife into the hospital THEN square up on the ticket.

2. Cops who ticket DR's on the way to the ER in a life and death race against the clock. Again give escort then ticket or just forget about it. I know any police officer would if the DR was racing to save the life of a cop shot in the line of duty. Does anyone doubt that?

3. As someone already said, tazing grandmothers.

Mike
 MrLove45
Joined: 1/31/2010
Msg: 779
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/24/2010 8:58:45 AM
[A New York City police officer accused of sodomising a drug suspect with a baton was acquitted yesterday after defence lawyers chipped away at the credibility of the accuser, a self-professed gang member who admitted smoking pot regularly.

Two colleagues were acquitted of a cover-up.

Michael Mineo, 25, has filed a US$440 million lawsuit against the city, claiming he was assaulted in a Brooklyn subway station on an October afternoon in 2008.

Mineo was hospitalised for days with a small non-penetrating wound, then returned for more medical care for an internal abscess.]
[A judge has acquitted three NYPD detectives of all charges in the shooting death of 23-year-old Sean Bell on Friday. Bell was gunned down in a hail of 50 bullets outside a Queens strip club on what would have been his wedding day in November 2006. The highly anticipated ]

and one wonder why so many people hate cops....
 MrLove45
Joined: 1/31/2010
Msg: 780
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/24/2010 7:06:02 PM
New Orleans, Louisiana (CNN) -- A former New Orleans police lieutenant pleaded guilty Wednesday to obstruction of justice in connection with the police shootings of civilians in the days after Hurricane Katrina.

Two civilians were killed and four others were injured in the shootings on the Danziger Bridge.

Former Lt. Michael Lohman conspired with other police officers to cover up how the shootings occurred, even though he believed them to be "legally unjustified," according to a federal indictment unsealed Wednesday.

The indictment charges Lohman with conspiring to obstruct justice.

Read the criminal complaint

The shooting happened on September 4, 2005, just days after Hurricane Katrina roared ashore on the Gulf Coast.

Responding to a call for assistance, several officers drove to the bridge and encountered six civilians who were walking across the bridge to get food and supplies, the indictment says. The officers opened fire, killing one person -- later identified as 19-year-old James Brissette -- and injuring four others, according to the indictment.



Video: Danziger Bridge revisited
RELATED TOPICS
Hurricane Katrina
Police
Shootings
New Orleans
They started shooting again on the other side of the bridge, killing Ronald Madison, a 40-year-old severely disabled man, the indictment says.

Madison was shot seven times -- five times in the back, the coroner has said.

Lohman arrived after the shooting, learned that his police colleagues "planned to provide false stories about what had precipitated the shooting" and "encouraged them to do so," according to the indictment.

Among other things, Lohman did not make sure police collected evidence, suggested that colleagues get rid of some shell casings the shooters left behind, and went along with a plan to plant a gun near the bridge, according to the indictment.

State prosecutors pursued criminal charges against several police officers without success.

In August 2008, a judge quashed indictments against Sgts. Kenneth Bowen and Robert Gisevius Jr., Officer Anthony Villavaso II and former Officer Robert Faulcon Jr., who were all facing first-degree murder and attempted murder charges.

In addition, he threw out attempted first-degree murder charges against Officers Mike Hunter Jr. and Robert Barrios, and attempted second-degree murder charges against Officer Ignatius Hills.

Federal prosecutors opened an investigation after the judge's actions.

****************

and yet some wonder why so many people hate cops.....
 Singleinlewistonidaho
Joined: 8/25/2009
Msg: 781
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/25/2010 4:23:30 AM
I wanted to post some You Tube headlines for you all to enjoy. I've heard some of you say not all cops are bad but so what? People need to hear about the bad ones and they need to be dealt with. I've seen so many threads removed just because cops get up set when people start to talk freely.

I've said it before and will say it again, police have a public image problem and only they can fix it by punishing the thugs in their ranks. NOT by pretending it does not happen and NOT by trying to sweep it under the rug and NOT by standing up for the bad apples in the ranks.
Some of these below just kill me. Cop arresting a firefighter on duty. Cops tazer a kid 19 times who had a broken back. Don't wonder anymore why cops are not the most loved people. What most of the video's below show you is that police officers cannot deal with disagreements in an adult manner. Most people have to suck it up but they have a gun so always get their way even when sometimes they should be arrested for being such a little child throwing a tantrum.

Search these headlines on you tube.

Cops taser 16 Year Old Boy Into Coma as he laid on the ground with broken back.

Legless man Cops tasered me just to be downright nasty

Fight with Officer Brings No Charges

Cop Arrests Fire Fighter for Helping Injured Person

COP PUSHED WOMAN DOWNSTAIRS FOR NO REASON-

EMT assaulted by State Trooper Sunday near Paden OK

Baltimore cops V.S. skateboarder

Skateboard-Hating Baltimore Cop at it Again

I CANT BREATHE

Teen Gets Beaten By Sheriff's Deputy <---Watch this guy, you can kill someone doing this.

LAX Police Repeatedly TASER Unarmed Senior Citizen

Bay Area Rapid Transit Shooting - Shorter and Stabalized <--Hand cuffed so they could shoot him.

Dash Cam: Mom tasered in front of her kids in New York <--- no need to have made this arrest.

Cop shoots man SCARY <---Cop tells military policeman to get up, he complies and gets shot.
 FL CO
Joined: 12/23/2008
Msg: 782
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/25/2010 8:24:58 AM
What I gather from this thread is people just want to wine and complain about how evil they think LEOs are. However, if someone wants to have a discussion to the contrary. A civil debate if you will. Then suddenly we can't discuss that because thats not what this thread is about. When it comes to officers trying to help other officers out instead of that person losing their job, everyone wants to scream about it. Instead of concidering is maybe that officer is just going through something and needs help getting through it. You can apply this to almost any profession.

People want to complain about getting pulled over. However if it didn't happen there would be more accidents because people wouldn't fear about getting ticketed for such things. Taxes would also have to be raised to cover the difference that a lack of ticketing would cause. Not to mention people getting caught from a simple traffic stop. Anything from a DUI, drugs, warrent, weapons, etc. The idea that a redlight camera causing someone to get rearende is absurd. The person behind the one thats already had his picture taken would have had to run the light as well for that to happen.

People want to claim that they've never had a good experience or very few when dealing with officers. To that I ask what was their attitude like? That can make a big difference in how the stop goes. Of course no one will admit to having a bad attitude. It could be as simple as something such as a tone of voice. They also seem to fail to realize that no stop is going to be fun. Maybe they don't realize what a good stop is.

As far as the videos go, I don't have time to watch them all. A lot of videos that I've seen posted in the past though can easily be explained by anyone who has any experience, or is capable of looking at it from the officers point of view. Maybe there should be a requirement in school for everyone to do a ride-a-long to see what happens in day to day life and can witness encourters first hand from a 3rd party view
 MrLove45
Joined: 1/31/2010
Msg: 783
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/25/2010 8:57:53 AM
hum! once again dennyden is in here praising the police and I assume that they have always provided quality service for him so he is also assuming that they work that way for all americans but I hate to be the bearer of bad news to this guy but that's not always the case. Of course dennyden choose to play the race card that the most crooked cops use as their standard operating procedure. Now do I paint all cops with the same brush? You damn straight I do til the good cops expose and weed out the bad cops instead of silently looking the other way .....
 FL CO
Joined: 12/23/2008
Msg: 784
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Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/25/2010 9:39:24 AM
Cops taser 16 Year Old Boy Into Coma as he laid on the ground with broken back.

Legless man Cops tasered me just to be downright nasty

Fight with Officer Brings No Charges

Cop Arrests Fire Fighter for Helping Injured Person

COP PUSHED WOMAN DOWNSTAIRS FOR NO REASON-

EMT assaulted by State Trooper Sunday near Paden OK

Baltimore cops V.S. skateboarder

Skateboard-Hating Baltimore Cop at it Again

I CANT BREATHE

Teen Gets Beaten By Sheriff's Deputy <---Watch this guy, you can kill someone doing this.

LAX Police Repeatedly TASER Unarmed Senior Citizen

Bay Area Rapid Transit Shooting - Shorter and Stabalized <--Hand cuffed so they could shoot him.

Dash Cam: Mom tasered in front of her kids in New York <--- no need to have made this arrest.

Cop shoots man SCARY <---Cop tells military policeman to get up, he complies and gets shot


Ok, I actually watched these, so lets break them down.

The first 3 I didn't see any actual footage. Granted I didn't let the 2nd run the full 9 minutes, but after about 3 minutes, I figured he didn't have one to show.

The next one, I can ese both sides. However, I think that the officer was right, because shutting down a 3 lane highway to 1 would most likely result in another accident. I think the best option was to move the firetruck in the same lane the officer was in but in front of the accident, so that people couldnt cut back across right away. We don't know the extent of the persons injuries to be able to tell if the lack of 1 firefighter would make a difference in their care.

This women appears to be giving the officer a hard time so he gave her what looks to be a small push (the arm was barely extended). The fact that she went down the stairs could be she lostt her balance or she was playing it up. Either way he's beind disciplined which you act as if never happens.

I've seen this video before. I'd like to see the troopers report on this one. It didn't appear as if the EMT was making a threat at the time the officer began trying to use wrist control on him. However the EMT clearly resisted. "Mama" must not been to bad off or the Paramedic would have kept driving. I like how the son is more concerned about trying to catch the officer doing something than for his mom.

The kid with the skateboard did sound like he was giving the officer a little attitude, but the audio in the beginning isn't the best. It sounded like that initial contact the officer was being decent. He needs to work on his communication skills some, but thats about all I saw. The kid probably does need to learn how to speak to adults, so it should end up with a lesson learned by all. They are supposed to be looking into this one as well.

The guy with the box should be smarted than to drive it around out in the street. Thats an accident waiting to happen.

The "I can't breathe" Brought up a bunch of songs. Post a link to the video you're referring to

We don't know what happened just before filming or what the suspect was doing on the ground. It could be partially justified depending on the details, which we do not know. This one was being looked into as well. (An example of being justified is the kid was biting or something like that. It would be justified in hitting him until the kid stopped. After that it would be excessive)

The guy was resisting. You can't really tell when he was tasered. Parts of it are off screen, but it does look like they were trying to ease him to the floor. Unless a search has been done, you don't know if a person is armed or not.

This is a low quality video. Can't really tell whats going on.

This lady was resisting and apparently isn't a quick learner.

This is another low quality video. There may have been something that we can't see, or it could have been someone that was too jumpy with the trigger. This one is also being reviewed.




A bad attitude should have no relevant connection to the outcome of a traffic stop. I mean, seriously, grow the F(_)ck up, if you're a cop, you pull somebody over and expect them to have a good attitude, get a reality check, write the F(_)cking ticket then go home and cry to your daddy


So its not natural human reaction to react accordingly to our interactions with others. A good attitude being met with a good attitude and a bad with bad? Do you expect someone to have to deal with a bad attitude and verbal abuse with no kind of reaction to that?
 FL CO
Joined: 12/23/2008
Msg: 785
view profile
History
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/25/2010 10:05:06 AM

fl co. you're the epitomy of why there are 63 pgs on this thread. not all cops are bad, true. but such a high % are. your constant whines about the other side not being shown is laughable. people are supposed to do their jobs. when citizens break the law, they're criminals, when cops do it, they're having a bad day and should be understood. "cops" shows cops abusing citizens that are already in control. the fact that there is so much material for the show certainly disproves your assertion that these episodes are rare.
the concept of looking at these episodes "from the officers point of view" shows the typical cop mentality. cops have no problem abusing the law because they don't feel that the law applies to them. they're the ultimate marxists. the end justifies the means is obviously the mantra of these "officers".


Of course there's going to be lots of videos showing abuse or things that may be questionable. There's over 800k full time officers in the US. If only 1% had one incident a year thats still over 8k incidents a year or about 22 a day. So while it may seem like the percentage is high, it isn't. If it was there would be many more stories of stuff happening. When it comes from looking at it from the officers point of view its the same thing as MMQBing. Looking at things after the fact when you have all of the information is easy. Dealing with it as it happens without all of the facts is the hard part. Personal stresses in life can cause people to do things that they normally wouldn't.This goes for all people. Officers, blue collar, white collar and no collar. The selection process for big departments is very involved, unless someone is good at fooling the system they most likely aren't going to get in, so a lot of people who would be a problem get weeded out. As mentioned, its hard to understand from the outside looking in, especially when an effort isn't made to understand the other point of view.
 Strings6
Joined: 7/14/2007
Msg: 786
view profile
History
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/25/2010 2:46:24 PM
FLCO,the fact that you use the words whine and complain to describe people's veiws on police behaviour shows that you have no respect for any other veiw other than that of LEO''s....just those whinny tax paying citizens again complaining about poor police behaviour,double standards and crooked cops...boy....those tax paying citizens can be such a pain in the ass...this is what i gather from your post.I beleive in the rule of law,not the rule of priviledge based on whatever position of priviledge you have...where your priviledge trumps the law and you get to do as you please, because you are special and have a tough job and nobody understasnds you....cry me a river already...it'as no peice of cake being an average citizen these days either.I and others pay these people's salaries and have every right to complain and whine if you want to call it that.
 Singleinlewistonidaho
Joined: 8/25/2009
Msg: 787
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/25/2010 3:40:31 PM
To FL CO's first post on this page:

1. We are having a civil discussion on this. No one is shutting it down because you want to praise cops. If you want to see the other side go play devils advocate and argue the opposite side of what you agree with on other forums and you will then see what un civilness looks like. You are the one whining about the bad reputation cops have. People have pointed out the thread topic nothing more. By all means keep on truckin. The more you defend the more you prove my point. I have yet to see you condemn any cop for any reason.

2. I don't think anyone has argued that police work is not needed. You are engaging in hyperbowl. Camera on red lights do cause accidents. Studies have been done for crissakes. Google the words,
"Red light camera cause accidents." Several cities have banned then to date.

3. I don't claim I have not had any good experiences with cops I have and have stated so. One guy bets I won't post a thread about good cops but I have been planning to just not got around to it.
As for attitude I don't cop them when I get pulled over. I learned how in many stops what not to do or say. How else do you think I got pulled over twice a month over the span of 7 years and never got arrested or a single ticket? One point you need to consider is something due to no fault of your own you can have a hot head cop pissed at you over a mis understanding and then you will be lucky not to be arrested because cops are never wrong.
I'll relates one case. I was put one night on foot putting out hand bills for my band to advertise a gig. I was in the vicinity of a phone company and being observed un known to me. I was on public streets. I stepped over a small border fence not a security fence to place a flyer. The call went in and when the cop got there he was under the impression I had jumped a security fence on the other side of the street where the phone company was located. So the cop naturally asks me if I crossed a fence. I told him no because I knew what context he was talking in and I only stepped over a fence but it was such a minor detail I totally forgot and did it without any thought. So he gets pissed at me believing me to be a liar. He raised his voice and I had to get defensive to present my case. He was not a total****but the cop was the reason voices got raised and I felt threatened.
So with the light bulb going off in my head and I explained it to his satisfaction. Told him no way was I anywhere near the security fence and I was just putting up hand bills. Probably was an ordinance against that but.... he was not there for that matter and never wrote me up for it. So with no evidence to suggest a crime was committed or would be he took down my info in case anything was broken into. Then for 24 hours I was told I'd be the suspect and subject to arrest.
So someone calls in a report and exaggerates and I could have been arrested. This is how things go downhill due to no fault of your own. One of the few times I did cop an attitude was I got pulled over by a cop to check me for DUI since I was a new stick shift driver and stalled at a light with cop behind me. Ya I was pissed because here we go again. I told him I was pissed cause I get pulled over every other week and I was getting tired of it. Well he told me he was not the other cops and just wanted to make sure I was not drunk and let me go. But he was a nice cop and did not make an issue out of it but I explained to him the reason why. We both understood and it was cool. But anything could have happened. The only other time I had an attitude was when some female cop wanted to pat me down walking in my own damn neighborhood! No one called on me and I was a mere 200 yards or less from my house. I put up with that crap in town I drew the line in my own neighborhood and I told her so. Still I let her pat me down. Contrast with a much wiser cop I was riding my bike in a business park. I was stopped and as soon as I told him I was just out for a ride and I related my address that was close by he said have a good night and left me alone. Now that is a good cop. He know I was local and needed not suspect anything after that. Cops that start fishing start to piss people off. It's petty.

As the other poster said bad attitude should not matter. So long as the driver gives license and registration or insurance and other wise cooperates. The cop should not worry about any insults or attitude he faces. Cops make a mistake when they engage in petty one-upmanship with people they pull over. They let their emotions get the better of then and turn a stop into a federal case all because they want to punish you for your dis respect. People hate cops well it's a self fulfilling prophesy. POLICE OFFICER: Think before you act, threat others as you would want to be treated. Would solve so many problems.

FL CO comments on Videos: Your points one by one.

1. First three videos, news reports. The Kid with broken back was not filmed that I know of. The news story still sticks. It made the news because of the Doctors report.

2. It boggles the mind that you would defend the arrest of a fire Captain doing his job. The highway was a 4 lane road from what heard by the way but no matter. The Fire department's policies and training call for the truck to be parked where it was. Once the Fire people go there the job of the police was to direct traffic and not much else while the fire crews did the rescue. By doing their job the police would have prevented any accidents. Rather the cop got into a pissing match with the fire Capt. If the cop did not like what the fire department was doing they should have packed it up and gotten out of the way. Since it would have been negligence for the fire crew to have refused to work under the circumstances the police desired they should have NO authority to make such arrests. Now if I was the drive I would have refused to move it on anyone's order but the fire Captain and demanded he be released. The Driver would then be arrested but the more the cop arrests the more stupid he looks to his bosses. Obviously this police man cannot work with others. He should have been fired. I don't know what the outcome was.

3. There was no excuse to push the woman. You first detain someone if you want to address them. The officer was fired so your assumption are wrong. Also wrong that I don't want to admit some of them are punished but the really sad part of this is this, and everyone knows it, if they were not caught on film then no one would be in trouble even if dozens of witness's say the cop did wrong. ONLY WHEN IT GETS OVER THE MEDIA and is an embarrassment is anything done. Citizens REALLY hate this fact for what it is. There are now efforts to make recordings of this nature illegal. DON'T GO THERE, you do that and remove any means to address such abuse within the legal system you will see more police killings like you saw in the State of Washington not too long ago.

4. The EMT scuffle. It's clear to me the whole problem stems from the EMT screw daring to disagree with the Trooper. A sad little man with a complex.

5. Your observations on the skateboard kid are short sighted. Yes the kid needs to learn how to speak. The Cop needs to learn to communicate better. But if you really study the video you can see that the cop is too hot too soon and then starts yelling at the kid. I can tell you that everytime you yell at a good kid like him you are going to get what you saw. You cannot tell at a kid and then expect him to act just as you would like him to. He was scared! GET IT? NOTHING the kid could have said was going to help. The officer was there to berate him nothing more because he's a prick no other reason. There are so many things wrong with the cops statements. He says the kids friends know how to shut their mouths but then the dumb ass does not consider he's addressing the kid, not the friends and is demanding the boy speak and shut up at the same time. I hope he lost his damn job. He's nothing more then a narcissist.

6. The Guy with the box, LOL I don't think any laws were broken there. Nuff said. Even if so the jerk had no right to kick the remote controlled car. Totally un called for. And again you are here to defend it proving what some of us say about police.

7. I can't breath. You have to watch it all. It shows the police subduing the suspects arms just to get a clear shot to punch his face over and over. In the nose. You see you can drive a nose into the brain and kill or severely main a person doing that. They were not trying to roll him over to cuff him. Why? Probably because they wanted to show him who's boss and punish him. But you see that is illegal. And if someone were to have shot the officer doing it to save the person from being killed it would be legal HOWEVER the law is not blind justice as it should be. The person doing that would do time for stopping the criminal beating of someone. Sometimes people do deserve it but that is true in SO VERY FEW CASES. (Google Segan Penn San Diego, he killed a cop or two when he feared they were trying to kill him and he won. )

8. What you say is true HOWEVER the kid was clearly in cuffs with no fight left in him as the other officer administered hard kicks to the kids rib cage. The one punching him was fired. If he was punching to the nose he could have killed the kid and should have been charged with attempted murder. Joe citizen would have been.

9. The Senior was resisting? When someone wants to force you to the floor and you don't want to hit your head that is what you do. Resist. Why force an old man to the ground? Yer right we don't know all the facts. There is no audio. The point is of course that you need not force every suspect to the ground. If they have not shown any resistance just ask them to turn and place hands behind the back. I don't know when it became SOP to "take down" every suspect but you did not see the fire captain taken down and you don't see that done to public officials when they are arrested. Want people to stop hating cops don't use such a heavy hand when it's not necessary.

10. It may be low quality but there are more on the net and two or three different cameras took footage. The Police tried to confiscate it all too but failed. I can see what went on. The guy was beaten to the ground. He may have resisted out of fear or maybe he was just a punk. Maybe he did not resist at all until they started to inflict pain. Here is a clue for all wood be cops. Pain will cause resistance. Don't inflect it then cry that you were resisted. Grow up.
That said here is what happened. They got him cuffed and as soon as that was done you can see the officer jump up as fast as he could, draw and fire a round into the man cuffed on the floor. I have yet to hear of any police officers on the news or on the net condemn it. NOT a one! Don't wonder why cops are hated.

11. You have a point. She was not doing what she was told. She was not a quick learner but police have to realize they sometimes pull over people with no prior experience being pulled over.
I can tell you the cop was wrong about the Cell phone use so he made up the story about the speeding. She was not. Cop knows this but it's a cover your ass tactic. Police have to have a reason to pull you over so if they do they either have one or make one up. This lady does not know that and wants to challenge obvious lies. Had she shut her mouth and allowed the cop to run her info he'd have sent her on her way. But she did not know the game and that is not her fault. So mister police boy lets the situation escalate into a media event. Way to go. She asked him not to do this in front of her kids. She appealed to his human side and he resorted to I am right and I will show you who's boss.
Again don't wonder why people dislike police. When they are wrong they cannot admit it and do the right thing. If they did not have a gun and badge they would pack up their ball and go home then wonder why no one wants to play with them.

12. The Video and audio proves the cop ordered the MP to get up and then fired at him. That is pretty clear. before this you can hear the pissing match the cop gets into with the MP. It's another case of I am the boss do what I say. I am however shocked that the MP did not make a better arrest subject since he should know better. Should know that it does not matter who he is or what side he's on. It will all be sorted out at the station.

Kudos to Bugsbro and his observation about all the evidence that says the problems are not a rarity. Only a fraction of the abuse is caught on film! Hundreds have been murdered by police before Cameras were installed in cars or cell phone cameras were invented.

Thorb's advice, listen and learn. Try it it's excellent advice. I am going to start a police appreciation thread now. Lets see how many have good things to say. Unfortunately 9 out of every ten encounters are not good when I am stopped.

Mike
 Singleinlewistonidaho
Joined: 8/25/2009
Msg: 788
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/25/2010 5:32:32 PM
Here is another great example. Search this on you tube and watch.

Seach you tube---> Cops rape woman caught on tape

They took the victim to jail. The Victim!

Mike
 MrLove45
Joined: 1/31/2010
Msg: 789
view profile
History
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/25/2010 5:38:30 PM
nevermind your ghetto reference, lets do better than that....lets say there's a shooting involving say the vice president and say some lawyer and there's no one willing to charge him of any crime because they are in his back pocket....everyone from the sherriff to the da..... or say some woman shoots her brother and somehow she's not arrested and her files magically disappear ......and of course we will just overlook any type of unreported crimes involving black folks or brown folks because in your amercia they dont really matter do they.....but they dont hold no monoploly on crime, just your media only gets a hard- on reporting crimes involving the 'economically disadvantaged and cops get a hard-on enforcing the law on them but they sure as heck will look the other way for their higher ups and those that have money to throw at it....
 FL CO
Joined: 12/23/2008
Msg: 791
view profile
History
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/26/2010 8:45:57 AM

you should take your own advice.
this thread is about why you have a bad rep ... and people hate you
we don't really hate you ... but do disrespect you for your lack of empathy and your own breaking of the law with very little consequence.

stop whining and start working on weeding out the scumbags and corrupt ***holes.
the psychotic and powerhungry bullies.

this is not a debate about good cop bad cop ...
this thread is an explanation as to why you don't get the respect you want.


I do follow my own advice. I try to look at things from all points of views. Things such as videos that get posted, I'll replay trying to look at all of the details to make sure I didn't miss something. As far I go, I stay within the law other than a little speeding or maybe rolling a stop sign. Two things that I wouldn't be very strick about enforcing depending on the circumstances. Weeding out people has to come from someone with a higher rank. I'm not in a position to fire anybody, and its not as if nothing ever gets said.


FLCO,the fact that you use the words whine and complain to describe people's veiws on police behaviour shows that you have no respect for any other veiw other than that of LEO''s....just those whinny tax paying citizens again complaining about poor police behaviour,double standards and crooked cops...boy....those tax paying citizens can be such a pain in the ass...this is what i gather from your post.I beleive in the rule of law,not the rule of priviledge based on whatever position of priviledge you have...where your priviledge trumps the law and you get to do as you please, because you are special and have a tough job and nobody understasnds you....cry me a river already...it'as no peice of cake being an average citizen these days either.I and others pay these people's salaries and have every right to complain and whine if you want to call it that


Whining and complaining doesn't apply to everyone. Some people do have a reason to be upset. Others just want to cry about it, and they're normally the ones who are part of the problem. As mentioned, I try to look at all points of view. As far as double standards go, there is. LEOs are held to a higher standard. You go out to a bar, get drunk and act like a fool your might get asked to leave. There's a good chance that an officer can get written up for that, because even off duty they are supposed to be representing the dept. I don't know where everyone keeps coming up with officers being so priviledged. If an officer asks for it he'll probably get in trouble. If he's lucky enough to get out of a ticket because he happens to be an LEO than whats the problem? You can't say that no one else gets cut a break for whatever reason. I'd like to hear the hardships you have to endure as a "average citizen" that don't also affect LEOs.
 FL CO
Joined: 12/23/2008
Msg: 792
view profile
History
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/26/2010 10:18:25 AM
Here is another great example. Search this on you tube and watch.

Seach you tube---> Cops rape woman caught on tape

They took the victim to jail. The Victim


They said why she was arrested. Her answer to their questions is why she ended up getting strip searched. All policies that I'm aware of state that it must be the same sex and atleast 2 people. Some of them state if there are not enough officers of that sex, that one same sex and one oppisite sex can be used (additional officers as needed, but at least one same sex). This is for liablity reasons. With her resisting, they probably needed additional help in conducting the strip search. It looked as if the male officers were trying to look away from her private areas as much as possible. I am surprised however that they didn't offer her paper clothes (like the disposible ones that OR drs wear) or a safety blanket (a blanket that has velcro attached in certain spots to that it can attached around the person like a large vest or robe). I'm also surprized that she wasn't seen by medical staff. Due to her behavior and her answer to the self harm question should would be in lockdown and thats why she was denied access to a phone. I don't know on the medical part. I don't know if they had a Dr or nurse come and look in on her during the strip search or later on and she was asleep. If she truly was denied medical care that could defiately cause problems for the SO.


About the other videos. I'll address it from the other side this time or what I would have done.

The fire capt one was a messed up sitution. I stand by with what I said about the placement of the firetruck. Shutting down that many lanes would highly increase the risk of another accident. The place I mentioned he could have parked would still provide a safe area for them to work in without shutting down another lane. Even with police directing traffic the odds are still high due to the way that peopel are when they drive. That said if I was the officer I would have waited until after the incident to deal with it.

Should the officer have pushed her at that point? Probably not. We don't know for sure why he did. It doesn't appear to be a hard push, and I seriously doubt his intentions where to push the lady down the stairs.

The EMT got his arm twisted from raising it toward the ST and then it escalated when he fought back. I don't think the trooper should have used force at the point, but the EMT was definately wrong in fighting back. The son is still a piece of crap for worrying more about filming than his mom.

I didn't hear it in the video, but I'm curious if the officer and the skateboarders have talked before. It looked like it was a good place (from a boarders point of view) to ride, but also looks like its front of a office or government building. The officer does need to work on his communication skills.

Driving the box around in what looks to be a city intersection can cause an accident. I'd guess that the "artist" was trying to see what kind of reactions he would get. Kind of like the "invisible rope", though I think the odds of an accident increase with the box. He should have talked to the guy first. I'd have to go back and watch the video again, but I wonder if he asked him not to do it, and the artist refused before he went to kicking at it.

I didn't see the I can't breathe one. The links I saw where to music videos.

This one could easily be excessive use of force. As mentioned a few punches can be justified depending on circumstances. While a hit to the nose can cause major problems, I've never see or have heard about someone being charged with attempted murder for it.

You'll be surprized how much old people can put up a fight. My DT (defensive tactics) instructor was in his 70s and I saw him drop a man a good foot taller and probably 25 years younger than him twice in training with one blow each time. It looks as if the guy turned away and thats why I think he was being taken down. I watched the video again, looking at the 2 other customers and looking at their reactions they didn't seem to bent out of shape about what was going on. Working on the ground is also going to be safer than fighting with a guy who is standing. A controled take down, which in this cae looks they tried to do in gently by slowing taking him down is a lot better than a fast and violent take down. Without a better camera angle or audio this is a tough call.

If done properly, when a suspect is experiencing pain and trys to resist it increases the pain that they feel. By relaxing and not fight it'll decrease the pain due to the suspection taking pressure off of the area thats hurting. Without better quality video I can't really say on this one about the shooting for or agaisnt.

I didn't see where it said the phone or the speeding was made up. She's not going to admit to it on tape that she did anything wrong. If the women didn't resist as much as she did she would have never been tasesed. Kids or not, she messed up. If someone has a warrent out and gets pulled over and has his kids in the car, and is resisting should the officer just let him go? The taser is the best option in this one. Someone might bring up OC spray, but personally, and most people that I've talked to agree, I'd take the taser before getting sprayed again.

Again, with the low quality video, some details may be missed. The same things that apply to LE apply to the military. You've got some bad apples. Thats why he wasn't a better arrest subject and how he ended up in a highspeed chase. Even if he wasn't the driver. Without better quality video I can't say one way or the other on this one.



Dino is right about the socialeconomic classes. Part of it has to due with the amount of crime that actually incurs in each class and part of it is money. Education also plays a role as well.
 Strings6
Joined: 7/14/2007
Msg: 793
view profile
History
Why do so many people seem to hate cops?
Posted: 2/26/2010 2:11:40 PM
FLCO,you are a brown shirt elitist at heart and i'm sure if it comes to that in America you will be front and center in the ranks,just think how much fun you will have cracking the skulls of those whinny citizens then.
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