Notice: Forums will be shutdown by June 2019

To focus on better serving our members, we've decided to shut down the POF forums.

While regular posting is now disabled, you can continue to view all threads until the end of June 2019. Event Hosts can still create and promote events while we work on a new and improved event creation service for you.

Thank you!

Plentyoffish dating forums are a place to meet singles and get dating advice or share dating experiences etc. Hopefully you will all have fun meeting singles and try out this online dating thing... Remember that we are the largest free online dating service, so you will never have to pay a dime to meet your soulmate.
     
Show ALL Forums  > Relationships  > borderline personality disorder-any info?      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 101
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?Page 5 of 16    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16)
I unknowingly opened a can of worms for myself, mentally, with my last post....so I'm going to finish (hopefully) what I started.

When I was old enough to start "devaluing" people (I lived with another BPD....it wasn't wise to "talk back" to her...endeavouring to be the "perfect child" didn't do much good either...) I was used to taking, and accepting blame for things that were total "nonsense" to me...meaning I didn't even necessarily know what she was talking about....at all.

I am now "old enough" to "speak my mind" to the general public....not Mom...I was never old enough to do that......and I encounter "normal" people. "Normal" people would say "normal" things, that I would perceive as a "threat" of some kind....for example.....a friend would be having a bad day, and say...."I'm ready to jump off a bridge".....and I would take it literally...classic black and white thinking.....or....an "accusation"....."I can't find my good pen".....I would wonder if they thought I had stolen it.....or "Susie said she missed you the other night at the party"...would end in me feeling guilty for not going, not good that I had been missed.

These are examples of things that could evoke rage, and resentment, because of how I perceived that had been said. This is when the "borderline misunderstanding" comes in.

And at this point, we've had about enough of being blamed, and threatened, and accused (by our abuser)....about real or imagined things, that we start to yell, even though there's a real possiblilty that the BPD perception of the situation might be wrong....normal people don't get a free ride here....they have perception glitches too.

After being born to dysfunctional people...with mental illness....the chances of my thinking being even close to "normal" is was remote.
 Chazz44
Joined: 6/3/2009
Msg: 102
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 4/29/2010 9:44:15 AM
Quazi 100... I find your posts helpful and filled with personal insight. It's clear you have done a great deal of recovery work. Good for you!

Your post about being constantly, and irrationally, blamed was particularly interesting. I'm so sorry you had to go through that.

I'm dating someone with NPD/BPD. It's been a difficult ride.... My partner has difficulty distinguishing between responsibility-taking and blame, so your reflections on blame were particularly helpful. My partner has a wacko, Fundamentalist mother (a BPD for sure) who blamed her for the craziest things, including being sexually molested by her much older brother. She was 8-11 years of age at the time. (Her Mom needs to be air dropped over Montana without a parachute, in MHO.)

Albino's comments about benign vs. malignant interpretations were also good.

Thanks to you both.
 Chazz44
Joined: 6/3/2009
Msg: 103
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 4/29/2010 3:00:30 PM

I agree that this is what is projected as part of the pathology of the illness....


I agree, projection is a primary trait of BPD.... Other traits include: Splitting (all good/all bad thinking), paranoia, mirroring, dissociation, unstable self-image, loose associations, micro-breaks, a lack of empathy, a fear of abandonment or engulfment, and rapid cycling (not of the bipolar kind), etc..


....Borderlines spend a lot of energy propping up this false sense of self as a way of surviving....


In some cases, this "propping up this false sense of self" can reach grandiose proportions, thereby, being more accurately diagnosed as Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD).

Yes, I am saying that NPD is, likely, a presentation of Borderline Personality Disorder.

There are core, unifying features of Cluster A, B and C Personality Disorders that suggest they are likely different presentations of the same "disorder" - BPD. More and more, many mental health professionals are seeing BPD as a cluster disorder. Research, particularly brain imaging, tends to validate this view.

BPD "symptoms/traits" fall within a spectrum, and reside along a continuum, depending on the functioning level of a client at a given time, but not necessarily another time. Periods of dysregulation (typical to BPDs) can change the diagnostic picture from one session to the next.

According to BPD Cluster theory, a BPD typically presents with predominantly Cluster A, B or C traits.... Instead of a trait based diagnosis (i.e. Dependent or Narcissistic Personality Disorder), an individual would be diagnosed as BPD w/dependent traits, or BPD w/narcissistic traits. (When specific traits are not discernible, BPD-NOS would do pending further assessment). This would make "diagnosis", always an inexact science, less arbitrary and fragmented. Besides, a particular "diagnoses" says as much about a practitioner as it does a client.

As currently configured, Axis II diagnoses say as much about insurance companies as they do clinical realities. Insurance companies typically require discreet diagnoses for each round of treatment. If you are given only one diagnosis, you may only get 7 sessions. If you are diagnosed with more than one "disorder", you tend to get more sessions. As written, the DSM IV-TR is a balm to insurance companies. It assigns tidy, unique codes that set claim adjusters' hearts a flutter. Personality Disorders, especially BPD, aren't tidy.
 VivaciousVixen2010
Joined: 7/12/2008
Msg: 104
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/3/2010 1:15:57 AM
B P disorder falls into the narcissistic personality which is a sociopath and self serving.
@@@@@@bipolar
is just that
@@@@@@@@bi polar

simple

nobody can make a narcissist or a sociopath have a concious
borderline personality people pretend to have a conscience but don't have any

the truth is dished cold
 junipermoon
Joined: 3/1/2006
Msg: 105
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/3/2010 4:05:35 AM

In some cases, this "propping up this false sense of self" can reach grandiose proportions


this was one of the most prominent aspect of the disorder as presented in the one i knew. i wonder if anyone has more information about it. how should one react to it? i just kind of went along with it, while not exactly encouraging it, i didn't call them out on it either. i just kind of listened to the delusions and the fantasies and said things like ' right' and 'oh, really? wow!'
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 106
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/4/2010 12:05:07 PM

nobody can make a narcissist or a sociopath have a concious
borderline personality people pretend to have a conscience but don't have any


Do you have any "relevant" information whatsoever to back up this claim? I have tried to be very specific about pointing out the fact that BPD actions "appear" very different than the "real" reason behind the actions. You are viewing the "action" through "normal" eyes, therefore judging the "action" by "normal" standards....the "action" isn't "normal" therefore, can't be judged by "normal" criteria.......


I assume, but am not sure, that cycling for bipolar refers to the ups and downs. I'm interested in knowing what kind of cycling BPDs have. Quazi, can you give some insight?


Being borderline is literally like living on a roller coaster.....

The whole "self image" "false" self image thing is based primarily on the fact that as children (I'm speaking in general terms, now) we will go to any lengths to behave in the manner our "abuser" wants us to behave.....we "scope" for the attitude, and try to match it. Alot of times, we guess wrong, and trouble ensues. Because we spend so much time trying to "anticipate" the abusers mood and behaviour, we don't get a chance to figure out how "we" feel about lots of stuff.

What happens is that we don't develop an identity, our "social" growth is stunted, and remains at a young age (mine is around age 7), and we follow the lead of others, and try to make it look good.

So, when cycling, if we don't know the appropriate way to "act" or "react" we go back to the fearful "child" who is trying to please. If we catch on to the situation, and become more comfortable, we can interact fairly normally....if we return to the not knowing how to "act" scenario (this can be minutes later), we're back to the child. If we get into a situation where someone hits a sore spot, we will fight to the death to get our point across....to anyone, we don't care who it is.

This is pretty much how our days run....bouncing back and forth between these different states (there are others as well, but for me these are the main ones)

I have overcome my "lability" (unstable moods) by taking responsibility for my life, and what happens to me, and not relying on others to make decisions for me when I'm in the "child" state. If the "child" state creeps in, I realize what's happening by how I feel, and I ignore it, and ride it out....something has triggered it....could be ANYTHING. Sometimes I try to figure it out, but mostly now, it isn't that important...riding it out, and ignoring it are the important things......

The "false" self would be attributable to someone feeling "threatened" in some way....and using a "defense" as an "offense".
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 107
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/7/2010 12:40:34 PM

Thanks for the insight Quazi. Very well explained and informative as usual. I'm impressed by the way you've taken control over BPD. Your healing process should be very encouraging to everyone who has the disorder. Have you ever looked into ways to help raise awareness or help other people who have BPD understand their disorder and how to cope with it? I think you'd be a very positive force in that area.


Actually, because I have "connected the dots" to the degree that I have, at this point, thought about becoming a "lay" advisor. I would love to raise awareness on a "broader" scale, and also advocate for BPD's in the judicial, and mental health systems. BPD is not a "get out of jail free" card, and in some cases, that's where the person belongs. Sometimes they can be ill enough, that jail wouldn't be a good place for them. Consequences in my life, smartened me up, rather than making me become more of a "victim" than I already thought I was. I decided to avoid more consequences by controlling my behaviour and emotions, than cause more consequences by upping the "intensity" of the emotions.

Thank you for the kind words, I really would love to heighten awareness with BPD, and non-BPD.
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 108
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/14/2010 10:04:19 AM
From the tone of your post, it's clear to me that you believe that BPD is "brought on" by the person suffering from it.

Psychology says, that the human brain isn't fully developed until one reaches their early 20's. The frontal lobe, which controls logic and reasoning is the last to develop.

Logic tells me, that as a child of, say 5, if I suspect that I'm in danger, I will "instinctively" try to protect myself. If the "danger" continues until well into my 20's (I was 24) I have missed the boat, on development of logic and reasoning haven't I? Instinct surrounded by bad judgment, impulsiveness, and recklessness rule the roost.

My Mother was an alcoholic, and BPD who drank heavily while she was pregnant with me. I have a "few" cognitive deficits (thinking) that have shown up on IQ tests. (Done at very well known facilities)

My Mother was BPD....and an alcoholic. Not a good role model, to say the least.

There's more, I could go on, but I think I've said it all previously.

This is where the misunderstandings come into play, and I may be wrong....I get the impression that you believe that we "choose" to be BPD. I'm going to make a generalization here, and say that nobody "chooses" to be BPD. I've seen BPD wreak havoc on my Mom's generation, and my generation (I have halted my havoc), and I have a couple of friends who are BPD.....the lifetime prognosis isn't very good... and I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

It's much more than an "identity crisis".

Again I sense, but I could be wrong, that you have had a lengthy encounter with a BPD. You sound very bitter about this encounter. I'm gonna say to you what any therapist HAS said to me in the past.....why did you stay?
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 109
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/14/2010 8:40:14 PM

I applaud your attempt to make this about "me". A classic BPD move. LOL


If you read my previous post, I stated that when I stayed in a "difficult" relationship, my therapist would ask me why I stayed. I am responsible for my 50% of what happens in/to the relationship. As far as I know, my therapist wasn't BPD....it is a logical question.



It makes me sad to know the kind of mental anguish people with this disorder go through, and even more so that it happens to a person I care about. It makes me sad that there is nothing I can do to "fix" her. It makes me sad that for the sake of my own sanity, I had to do the one thing she fears most (and that I told her at one time I would never do)...abandon her. It makes me sad that for her to deal with it, she must devalue me and continue on her self-destructive path. It makes me sad to think something very bad may very likely happen to her.


For about the last year, my ex-husband has been having a difficult time. He has several undiagnosed "problems" that he will not confront.
I have been sympathetic, offered resources that I know of....but unfortunately, the problem lies with his thinking...it's very unrealistic, mostly financially. He has been a victim of the economy, and has just about run out of resources. He is threatening to harm himself unless he comes upon some miraculous "windfall".

His thinking is seriously distorted, and I know that I can't help him. I have told him that he needs to go to Emergency, and speak to someone there about his options. His Mother taught him that people who go to therapists are"crazy", and he is resisting this option vehemently. He prefers the alternative.

I have told him that I can't help him, and not to contact me again. I have run out of options and solutions.

I understand being sad to think that something very bad may happen to someone.
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 110
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/15/2010 7:00:31 AM

Hey, albinosquirtz, your posts are sounding bitter where I come from too. Quazi's
posts have been upfront and helpful and it seems like you're picking at her for nothing. I think the shot you gave her about pulling a BPD move was confrontational and unwarranted.
She's got a good handle on her BPD and probably doesn't need any help, especially of the of passive-aggressive kind that I see in your posts. Not only that, her posts don't contradict each other, but some of yours do. I think she's got the information down better than you do. She's been suffering all of her life with it and had to educate herself and work through it, and probably practices coping skills every day, while you only had a brief romance with a woman with BPD.


Thanks for the vote of confidence.....I have learned not to take things personally, but support is always welcome!



I hate being the one to point out the pink elephant in the room...but the man was married to a Borderline wasn't he? That in itself is enough to cause very serious emotional as well as physical damage. Hey...I don't know you or him, so I don't have a clue about anyone's personal issues. But I do know Borderlines have a knack for gaslighting...trying to take the focus off the fact that they are the one with the mental illness, and trying to convince people that it is everybody else that's "crazy".


My ex-husband's problems right now are almost strictly financial....nothing to do with me. He has a gambling problem....that's mostly the reason I left. Borderline or not, I didn't want to be responsible for his bills any longer.

We have been separated for over eight years, and we have both had our share of difficulties.

As I improved, his difficulties increased.

These difficulties don't even involve me.
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 111
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/15/2010 1:24:40 PM

The major flaw in your logic, is that you fail to understand there are two perspectives to the topic here...those who have BPD...and those who are the victims of abuse by people who have BPD. I'm not claiming to understand what it's like to "have" BPD, because I don't have it. But I do understand what it's like to be the victim of abuse from someone with BPD.


I am a victim of abuse by BPD....my Mother. For 42 years. And the last 6 months of her life might have been the worst abuse of all. I frequented the Emergency room at the Clarke Institute of Psychiatry in Toronto, on a regular basis during that period.

You want to be abused, be called every kind of bit*h and c*** that ever lived, by your own Mother, and see how that feels. She was wayyy overmedicated, and had to be restrained, because she was hitting people, and getting into bed with strange men.....

I was TRYING to commisserate with you, with the post about my ex-husband. I understand how it feels to worry about someone, but be totally helpless to do anything about it.

But now you have pissed me off....I do understand your pain, believe it or not....but I didn't cause it....so, please back off!
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 112
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/15/2010 4:21:21 PM

Let's see...you butt your nose into what I'm saying to another poster, tell me how I'm supposed to word my posts to suit "you" and insinuate I have a mental problem by projecting things on me you couldn't possibly know. Then when I don't validate your "I'm the victim" routine, you get pissed off at me...accuse me of blaming "you" for pain caused by someone else, then pretend anything I have to say about my experience with BPD is somehow a personal attack on "you". You say you don't take anything personally...then take it personally (what you say and what you do are the opposite).

Yep...you don't need to convince me you have BPD.


You are making statements now, that my perception of is so different, that I am not going to address them.

I get the distinct impression, but I could be wrong, that anything I say is going to be "borderline", and without beneficial merit.

That is my opinion, and I am choosing to end this discussion. I don't believe that anything beneficial will be gained by carrying on.....
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 113
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/16/2010 1:49:13 AM

I don't agree that she's trying to run the thread at all, nor does she try to correct people or argue a man's opinion. If she disagrees with someone, she usually says something very polite like, " I may be wrong, but..". She's been very polite and considerate.


Thank you again, for your support vicavictor, and your insightful assessment of the situation.

My "job" on this board....and it is a job, I've been doing it for over two years, is to try to help people understand what happened in their relationships, explain how BPD comes about, try to explain that sometimes...only sometimes malicious intent is not involved in things that happen, and most of all try to convince anyone who has been recently diagnosed with BPD to get help! It's hard work, but it's very worth the effort put in.

The thing that does bother me, is when people read the self help books....which are written my a Non BPD about BPD....this information is being filtered through two people's throught processes, and perspectives....and I will say something, and they will tell me I'm wrong. What I'm saying may not be right for everyone, but that's how it works for me.

I will not be leaving this board as long as there are BPD that may be watching.
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 114
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/18/2010 8:57:26 AM
Now that hopefully the dust has settled....

Thank you again vicavictor for your support.

While I am in fact "tuff", there is nothing wrong with support. Support builds confidence.

Ripping someone you don't even know apart, on a website, because they are "similar" but different from someone who ripped you apart doesn't really make you much better than them, does it.

I have a feeling that vicavictor can offer support, but maintain his boundaries. He offered me support, and defended me, without trying to FIX anything. And he checked in regularly. This is a perfect recipe for dealing with a BPD......or anyone who decides that they want to take out their lousy day on you.

More people should use this strategy....it works.
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 115
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/18/2010 10:44:41 AM
Anyone here can point a finger at me, and be "right".

I don't have the same "privilege" by virtue of my illness.

I am BPD, but to a large degree, I was in the same shoes as YOU for 42 years! Just because it wasn't with an SO, doesn't mean it was a walk in the park. But nobody seems to see that part. They just wanna take shots at the BPD.

Professionals get their knowledge about BPD from BPD's. And it's been filtered, and tilted in a little different direction before it gets to them, unless it's an actual discussion with a BPD.

Do I out and out lie? Not anymore. Although my perception of something may be totally opposite to yours, and it seems like a lie to you. I ended the discussion with squirt, because his perspective was so different than mine, there was no point in addressing it....it would have turned into a flame war, with me on the flame side.....

I don't see any other BPD's stepping up, and offering any information, so does it LOOK like I'm trying to control the thread.....I guess it does. I see it, as I'm pretty much the only source of "genuine" information. Is it "my" information....yes, but it's legitimate 2nd generation information.

I've said before, this is almost like a job for me....I try to answer questions that make no sense whatsoever....because I know there have been many times that I was bowled over by what my Mom did.

I have no obligation to explain my intent to anyone....so if anyone wants to flame....flame away, I can't stop you.

 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 116
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/18/2010 1:51:39 PM
Spagett

You are taking nearly every word I post, and dissecting it according to the criteria of BPD.

I am "recovered" (meaning my thinking and behaviour have been 'deemed' acceptable to pass for "normal" in society) You are giving me much to much credit for "maliciously" using BPD behaviour. Has my thinking been re-vamped 100%....no....that's not possible. Will I come out with a black and white statement.....yes....as do normal people, just not as often.

Ummmm, not really, means just that....in my opinion, that's not REALLY how it works. If I mean "Nope", I will write NOPE. I don't beat arount the bush! And that's why I don't like people splicing my posts.....because it changes the MEANING of what I've said!


<div class="quote">All the blame and devaluation they throw at everyone around them, is just projected feelings about themselves which they go to great lengths to hide from themselves....

The reason I disagreed about devaluation being projected feelings about myself, which I explained in my post, is that when I devalue, it's RESENTMENT I feel. RESENTMENT because I've been triggered by something that may have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH THE PERSON I'M DEVALUING. I'll say this again. FOR ME, devaluation happens when I RESENT how I'm being treated.

That is as far as I'm willing to go to equalize what it looks like I'm doing. You have obviously become so entrenched with what you have already read, it seems to me, that when you read something DIFFERENT, FROM THE HORSES MOUTH, you don't believe it.

So be it.

Trying to make sense out of BPD is like trying to make sense out of nonsense.
 Quazi 100
Joined: 3/2/2008
Msg: 117
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/18/2010 3:44:32 PM

BPD is a learned behavior, and can (and HAS) been un-learned. Unfortunately, you have to talk to non's to do it, and the BPD person has to want to do it.

I pointed out that you are still very much acting in a BPD manner, and that your "advice" is not very reliable because of that. You have just admitted that in the post above this, thank you.

Readers, look at the links I have provided. My opinion is just as bias as Quazi, or Albinosquirlz, the links are not. They have real answers, real options, not "opinions" or "feelings" or classic BPD behavior as exhibited in this thread.


Spagett!

You will not chase me off this thread....let people read your posts, and my posts....and decide for themselves.....I'm good with that.
 junipermoon
Joined: 3/1/2006
Msg: 118
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/18/2010 5:20:00 PM

You will not chase me off this thread....let people read your posts, and my posts....and decide for themselves.....I'm good with that.


glad to see that. because i know that i, and others, have learned a great deal
from the insight shared in this thread.

i had a 2-year 'friendship' with a bpd. i couldn't for the life of me
figure out what the hell went on with the bizarre conversations,
accusations, temper tantrums, lies, delusions and so on.
i had no clue how to handle someone like that. i did the best
i could, but got to the point where i just couldn't deal with
the craziness.

what quazi shared throughout this thread helped me to
understand the incident. she helped me to understand the reasoning
behind the behaviors i witnessed. and her words have encouraged me
to believe that, should i encounter another bpd, that i will have
more resources at my disposal to better comprehend what i might
experience from them.

so, thanks! and keep up the good work.
 bucsgirl
Joined: 5/13/2006
Msg: 119
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/21/2010 3:10:03 PM
"Actually one cue may be if she mentions having being raped, molested and/or beaten; many times these victims develop personality disorders. :( "

Whaaa?????? That is one of the more ignorant things I've read in awhile. Personality disorders, from my understanding, are "developed" in early childhood. Some are chemical imbalances, no more the result of an event than being a diabetic. I've read a lot about different personality disorders, I suggest you do the same.

The things that present after being victimized are different altogether and not even in the same category.
 bucsgirl
Joined: 5/13/2006
Msg: 120
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 5/22/2010 7:45:17 AM
"As for people who have been victimized, who hasn't been?"

The post mentioning victimization was talking about physically assaulted. People are victimized by having things stolen from their house, being fired unfairly from a job....sure almost anyone has been victimized by situations, but physically assaulted and brutalized?!! Hardly a comparison...boohoo waaa yeah we've all been victimized...sheesh.
 Chazz44
Joined: 6/3/2009
Msg: 121
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 9/27/2010 10:50:30 AM
Ummm, no Phredly....

Bucsgirl and Peppermint Petunias are correct. Rape, molestation, physical abuse do NOT cause a personality disorder.... PTSD, or Generalized PTSD, would be a more likely diagnoses.... Except to the extent that a personality disorder, or worse, is predictable in those committing such offenses. (According to the FBI, 92 percent of rape reports are NOT false.... )


Quazi 100, your advice has been amazingly helpful and on point.

vicavictor, you are my "knight in shining armor", even though you never applied for the job for anyone.


Here's what I think - and, I'm speaking from a great deal of professional and personal experience.

No one definitively know the causes of BPD. There are a number of theories, some overlap, but no one knows the genesis of BPD for sure. It's likely that there are a confluence of causes depending on the individual. Temperament, brain chemistry, neurological factors, life events, are bound to be factors, but that can be said about any disorder. Psychiatry is NOT an exact science; it's doubtful it ever will be in the foreseeable future.

It is possible for individuals with BPD to live relatively stable, productive lives - IF - they are treated.

If you are going to partner with a TREATED BPD person, it's in your best interest to educate yourself. I had a partner with multiple sclerosis (MS). I needed to understand that my partner's "mood swings" were a predictable feature of chronic ill-health, fatigue, frustration over the loss of mobility/self-sufficiency, etc. ~ not reactions directed at me, personally.

I've been a member of several well known and highly trafficked sites for NON-BPDs for some time. Such sites are invaluable; they serve a much needed purpose. People need to vent, garner support, heal and be educated about BPD. They need a community of healing.

However, it's been my experience that such sites are peopled by angry, bitter individuals who remain stuck in their experiences wth a BPD partner. Not everyone at these sites is like this, but some few are. I've also been surprised by the sexism and homophobia that goes unexamined at these sites. Some people cannot (?) objectively see their own part in a relational dynamic, let alone a BPD one. They are blinded by codependency, a sense of entitlement, and/or their own emotional/mental health issues.

I've also been struck by how many non-professionals presume to diagnose their partners with BPD simply because their relationships didn't work.

Claiming the label of NON-BPD, does NOT automatically confer a clean bill of mental/emotional health.
 Molly Maude
Joined: 9/11/2008
Msg: 122
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 9/28/2010 11:14:48 AM
it's been four months since 5/21/10 when Phredly wrote:

"Actually one cue may be if she mentions having been raped, molested and/or beaten; many times these victims develop personality disorders. :( "

I would love to hear that, in these four months, Phredly has had an opportunity to re-evaluate his opinion ... and he has come to see that being raped, molested and/or beaten will NOT CREATE a "personality disorder" ...

these are SITUATIONAL events ... acts of violence perpetrated upon an innocent ... and I believe the victim's emotional well-being can be greatly improved with a sympathetic listener ... love, patience and understanding can go a long way to improving the victim's transition back to her previous state of well-being ...

IMHO ... shunning a victim and/or treating her as though she has a mental illness probably won't help her at all ...

I've lived with family members with mental illnesses ... and I've interacted with friends/family members who have been victims of violent crimes ... HUGE DIFFERENCE ... not at all the same ...



I'm sending out thoughts of love and well-being to all victims everywhere ...
 Chazz44
Joined: 6/3/2009
Msg: 123
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 9/28/2010 9:47:56 PM
Molly Maude , there are all sorts of ways to blame a victim. This has been one of them.
 WaywardWynde
Joined: 5/19/2007
Msg: 124
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 9/29/2010 8:41:41 AM

" **** me get out "


I literally heard those exact words mid-stroke.

It took me way too long to learn to keep an emotional distance, but I did learn. Sometimes the emotional cost far exceeded the emotional gain, so the feet needed to do their walking. Other times, things were incredible. Yet, in the end, nothing worked like keeping a long emotional distance. I didn't cause the problem, and I couldn't fix it.
 matchlight
Joined: 1/31/2009
Msg: 125
view profile
History
borderline personality disorder-any info?
Posted: 1/9/2011 12:34:28 AM
Some people really are monsters who don't deserve anyone's sympathy. Death rows are full of them. But people can also do some horrible things for reasons that are just not within their control.

The paranoid schizophrenic who kills a person thinking he's a demon God's ordered him to eliminate. The person with a brain tumor in the wrong place, or with temporal lobe epilepsy, who flies into a rage and beats someone senseless just for glancing at him. The sleepwalker who does something dangerous. There are all sorts of reasons not to hold people fully accountable for the harm they do.

So-called "borderline personality disorder" (the name itself is to be changed to something more accurate and less judgmental in the next DSM) can also cause people to do some very cruel things. But no one should forget that this problem is cruelest of all to the person who has it. I doubt anyone who makes fun of these people would like to be on the receiving end of that, if fate had happened to inflict this godawful disorder on them, instead.

They may secretly feel awful about hurting someone's feelings, and yet angrily justify it as self-defense against the person they think provoked them. It's not so much that they won't admit blame--it's almost as if they *can't.* And they'll probably do the same thing the next time, gradually making themselves even more lonely than the disorder itself makes them feel. About 10% of them eventually despair and kill themselves.

They get to spend much of their lives feeling depressed, worthless, anxious, angry, wired, and frustrated--or sometimes feel some or all these things in a day, or an hour, or even at once. They also live with certain typical delusions and sometimes even mild hallucinations. And it can hardly be fun to have very little solid, consistent sense of what makes you uniquely you--your own personality. So it's not as if these people sat up one night and decided to give themselves all these ungodly problems, just for the he!! of it.

Very similar symptoms are seen in some types of bipolar disorder. It's not exaggerating that much to say people diagnosed as bipolar get medication and--more and more--public acceptance; while a "borderline" diagnosis (75% of which go to females) gets you, if you're very lucky, some medication and some skillfully done "dialectic behavior therapy." This has worked well. But more often, people diagnosed as "borderline personality" have gotten interminable and largely ineffective talk therapy, no useful meds, and very little sympathy either from the public, OR from many medical specialists.

Even *they* often may come to view the typical "borderline personality" as an angry, unpleasant, uber-drama queen, often pretty, but uncooperative, manipulative, self-aggrandizing, and generally a royal PITA. And these doctors may think patients like this are sort of a sinkhole for medical resources that could be going to people who'd actually be grateful for the help. It's an understandable reaction, I guess--but it's also wrong.

That is changing very fast now, though. Some of the top medical authorities on bipolar disorder in the world don't believe there is such a thing as "borderline personality disorder." It seems to overlap the rapid-cycling types of bipolar which are now being recognized. And this overlap's so great that it's not clear just what reliably distinguishes the two disorders, except for a tendency to feel more "empty" or "hollow" than guilty, or worthless, which people with bipolar disorder tend to feel when they're depressed.

Some of the evidence these are the same disorder (or very nearly so) has come from experiments that show the core symptoms of people diagnosed as "borderline" tend to respond to some of the same drugs that work for people diagnosed as bipolar. I understand this is one of the hottest areas of research into emotional disorders, with big advances expected during the next several years. New drugs already being developed will probably be part of this.
Show ALL Forums  > Relationships  > borderline personality disorder-any info?