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Show ALL Forums  > Current Events  > There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 call me J
Joined: 12/13/2005
Msg: 76
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15Page 4 of 20    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20)
RK, Simmons has made his money on OIL, and he's telling everyone that it's going away. He would far prefer oil production to continue to grow and never run out...

How about the Army engineers report ? Let me guess, conspiracy or something ?

No alternative energy source comes close to providing as much energy with as little expenditure, as Oil. The only reason to replace it is because there's a problem.

Do you think that oil companies would like the general public's widespread acceptance that oil has a poor future, that every facet of our society which relates to it is in jeopardy to one degree or another ? No, they want everything is fine, we have lots and lots, to be the words you hear, and believe.

The GAO report was buried for months when it should have been released.

Every country that has done a study has come to the conclusion that oil will peak, the only issue is when. Nobody believed that the USA production would peak when Hubbert said it would years before. But turned out he was exactly right and all those that laughed at his conclusion were the fools...
 pokey
Joined: 3/17/2004
Msg: 77
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/2/2007 2:12:49 PM
damn! i guess i'll just have to cook up a batch of biodiesel on the 14th.
made from the same stuff your french fries are and costs me 86 cents a gallon.
diesel smoke that smell like fries,,,mmmmmmmmm!!! i don't depend on nonrenewable sources and big oil makes nothing from it.
 call me J
Joined: 12/13/2005
Msg: 78
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/2/2007 2:16:01 PM
RK, Oil production is in DECLINE in 33 out of the 48 largest oil producing countries.

Most of the giant fields are in decline, despite more advanced recovery techniques being applied. These new techniques are reducing the rates of decline in production due to being more efficient, but nothing can reverse the decline.

1. Demand is rising steadily.

2. Production is declining in many places, and globally has plateaued.

3. New discoveries have not been even close to keeping pace with replacing what is used.


Peaking means just that, the peak of production. Demand continues to rise, but the output doesn't...
 spacemonkeymafia
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 79
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/2/2007 2:31:59 PM
There is no gas strike!!!
 wvwaterfall
Joined: 1/17/2007
Msg: 80
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History
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/2/2007 7:09:23 PM
Just a quick data point to add to the discussion.

Just got home from a conference that included presentations by a number of energy experts, one of whom was Charles Bayless, past CEO of Illinova Corporation and current board member of Patina Oil and Gas, among many others. Google him to learn about his energy expertise if you want.

Anyway, one of the many powerpoint slides he showed fits right in to this discussion. For the past thirty years global oil consumption has been greater than global oil discoveries. We've been living on the oil discovered before then all that time, which fortunately was enough to meet demand, but if you look at the demand and discovery lines on the graph they're headed in opposite directions.

So assuming that somehow we'll find vast oil reserves that have eluded us for the past thirty years is more than a stretch....

Dave
 pokey
Joined: 3/17/2004
Msg: 81
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/2/2007 8:48:26 PM
how about some simple math? if crude oil was costing more to produce,
then the oil companies would be paying more for the raw product, thus
costing them more, but the big companies are making record proffits!
oh oh, something doesn't add up
the problem is with refinery production. how did this happen?
oil companies have shut down over 200 refineries right here in the united states.
oops! damn the luck! there is a production shortage.
the price of fuel went up without raising production costs.
that's why the biggies are making record profits.

by the way, no new refineries have been built for 30 years.
class dismissed.
 pokey
Joined: 3/17/2004
Msg: 82
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/2/2007 8:53:01 PM
i don't fill up at KFC.

but by doing a little work, i expect to save over $5,000 on fuel this year.
besides, bio runs smoother, less poluting than petroleum based..
no modifications are needed to run a diesel engine on bio.
educate yourselves, kiddies.
 call me J
Joined: 12/13/2005
Msg: 83
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/2/2007 11:03:33 PM

I have no doubt that the existing fields have to be declining, or whatever some people say. It can't last forever.

But unless those same people have an oil sniffer in their ass, they don't know what is yet to be tapped, or whats left or yet to be discovered in the world.


Considering that with better technology, to a spectacular degree actually, they still have failed to find any significant oil fields to replace what is declining, do you not think it's just a little bit likely it's because there isn't much of that great oil left to find ?

Yes, there is oil around, that costs more to extract and refine, and all to produce lower EROI than the oil we were previously thriving on. If there was tons of the good/cheap oil, the alberta tar sands wouldn't be an investment worth approaching right now, nor would Venezuela have come into prominence with their own previously too expensive to want, oil.
 call me J
Joined: 12/13/2005
Msg: 85
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 8:19:42 AM

For every person that says its here and its declining, there are just as many , just as educated in the field that says its not and there is much more to be found and pumped.


Yup, just like when Hubbert was wrong when his formula said the USA would peak around 1969-1970, and the other experts made him a laughing stock.

Oh wait, he was the one who was dead on, and they were wrong...

And his formula has been successful on field after field...

I guess you probably also haven't read Saudi Aramco's 2006 report where they state (and this is the Saudi's who have always said there is way more than enough oil there) that misconceptions about the adequacy of supply will play a major role in the near future. As will refineries which are not prepared to deal with the type of crude available. And coincidentally said they don't see a need to break 12.5 mbd, which is the exact number Simmons said would be the Saudi's peak production capability.

What kind of crude are 90% + of refineries set to handle ? Light, sweet oil. So if the oil that will be available is not that good oil, it means it is heavy sour crude, which, in case you're not following, means that peak has been reached or is closing in.
 NotaClone
Joined: 11/24/2005
Msg: 86
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 8:40:18 AM
"So who is this hack, who obviously doesn't know what he's talking about either? His bio:


Dr. Mike Walden is a William Neal Reynolds Professor and extension
economist in the Department of Agricultural and Resource Economics of North
Carolina State University's College of Agriculture and Life Sciences. He
teaches and writes on personal finance, economic outlook and public policy. "


OH COME ON , bookworm!!
fachrissakes, EVERYONE knows that internet know-it-alls who apparently have limitless time to post on the internet..(not busy at real careers/jobs?)

are the REAL SOURCE OF ALL TRUE KNOWLEDGE!!

if it's posted on the internet by some stranger you never heard of , it's gotta be TRUE!
 phine_likker
Joined: 10/25/2006
Msg: 87
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 8:53:21 AM
^^^

you seem to focus on the 'supply' side..

How about the "demand" side.?

A billion + Chineseand close to a billion Indians who now mostly walk and cycle, but yearn to be fat and lazy and drive everywhere just like 300 million or so North Americans..

Can't you see DEMAND spiking up violently past previous markers when the majority of Chinese, Indians, Asians, Africans etc. are driving gas hogs also (more than 10 X the population of North America..)
 phine_likker
Joined: 10/25/2006
Msg: 88
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 9:09:04 AM
don't pump gas, lay back and have a dozen donuts and a quart of Jim Beam
 call me J
Joined: 12/13/2005
Msg: 91
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 10:59:45 AM
Dorion, the current theories take into account the high returns from existing wells. And despite you saying so, not all the old wells have more in them now.

But plenty of wells have had improvements with advanced techniques, and as I mentioned, this has reduced the rate of their decline, not restored them to former glory. In some isolated instances, it's caused a short lived spike, which then dropped exceptionally fast.

Did you know that Russia had to order a large quantity of oil from Venezuela to cover it's own contracts that it didn't produce enough to meet ? That they are pushing hard for a bizarre plan to try mining a rare element from the moon, that there isn't even a definite refining process for yet?

Why do we not have effective alternate energy sources right now ? Because it wasn't needed.

When you see big pushes for alternates, it sure as hell isn't because the oil companies have gotten tired of making money off oil...
 Internetdatingpariah
Joined: 10/17/2004
Msg: 92
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 12:42:07 PM
I should be down to about 1/4 tank by the 15th.
Should I fill up before or after when the price drops $0.75?

Saw windmills getting a bum wrap this morning on the news.
Apparently the props are killing a lot of migratory birds.
 Ottawa_Chicklet
Joined: 8/5/2006
Msg: 93
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There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 12:50:29 PM
rk... ethanol cannot replace oil. It requires too much energy to produce. Do you seriously think there's enough crop land in this world to feed our stomachs and today's energy needs?

BTW, justcallmej, you've made some great points and provided some excellent links... so thanks. BTW, how long has our fuel had a 10% (or so) ethanol content? Why has ethanol been added to our gas? Does it have anything to do with the preservation of our supply?
 call me J
Joined: 12/13/2005
Msg: 94
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 1:17:19 PM
RK, NOWHERE did I say the Oil companies are the ones producing the alternative energy.

Do you know anything at all about the ethanol ? really ? Corn based ethanol is not a suitable oil substitute, it's energy return is far lower than oil. Brazil's sugarcane ethanol is a suitable alternative because it produces higher energy than the corn. Wow, you're lucky to have those ethanol plants...

Have you read this ?
http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/

"What about Ethanol?"


Ethanol, methanol etc. are great, but only in small doses. Like all other biofuels it is grown with massive fossil fuel inputs (pesticides and fertilizers) and suffer from horribly low, sometimes negative, EROEIs. The production of ethanol, for instance, requires six units of energy to produce just one. That means it consumes more energy than it produces and thus will only serve to compound our energy deficit.

In addition, there is the problem of where to grow the stuff, as we are rapidly running out of arable land on which to grow food, let alone fuel. This is no small problem as the amount of land it takes to grow even a small amount of biofuel is quite staggering. As journalist Lee Dye points out in a July 2004 article entitled "Old Policies Make Shift From Foreign Oil Tough:"

* . . . relying on corn for our future energy needs would devastate the nation's food production. It takes 11 acres to grow enough corn to fuel one automobile with ethanol for 10,000 miles, or about a year's driving, Pimentel says. That's the amount of land needed to feed seven persons for the same period of time. And if we decided to power all of our automobiles with ethanol, we would need to cover 97 percent of our land with corn, he adds.


According to a Fortune Magazine article entitled "Ethanol Could Leave the World Hungry", emphasis added:

* The growing myth that corn is a cure-all for our energy woes is leading us toward a potentially dangerous global fight for food. While crop-based ethanol -the latest craze in alternative energy - promises a guilt-free way to keep our gas tanks full, the reality is that overuse of our agricultural resources could have consequences even more drastic than, say, being deprived of our SUVs. It could leave much of the world hungry. One tankful of [ethanol] could feed one person for a year.


Finally, geologist Byron King explains how small the nation's ethanol production is when compared to its collosal petroleum consumption:

* . . . the forecast annual U.S. production of 11 billion gallons of ethanol translates into about 262 million barrels of that type of fuel produced over the course of a year. And I am not even adjusting for the energy density of ethanol, which is far lower, only 59.5%, than an equivalent barrel of petroleum. . . What appears at first to be an impressive number in terms of energy supply (11 billion gallons per year) is actually relatively small. In fact, it is almost in the "rounding error" of the nation's daily liquid fuel consumption of about 21 million barrels of oil per day.
 gentlepatrick
Joined: 3/26/2006
Msg: 95
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There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 1:40:29 PM
great idea - why doesnt everyone agree to go 6 months without buying gas - really show the **stards
 ffryan
Joined: 10/10/2005
Msg: 96
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There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 2:44:52 PM
I don't think this idea has been thought through enough. So we choose to boycott gas on May 15. A few days later when the oil companies see that there has been a drop in their profit they will raise their prices, as they have historically done. In the end we will end up paying more. Whatever money the oil companies lose on May 15's they'll make up within a few days.
 rescuebiker
Joined: 9/7/2006
Msg: 97
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There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 3:04:45 PM
Hey Waterfall,
Do you work for the Oil Company?
My son is in The Army and in a few days is going back to Iraq for his 3rd tour.
We took over that country and liberated for them(Not totally, I know). But We should either take and use their Oil or if what you said-The US has stock piles of oil, is true, then why are we being charged so much.?It goes back to the beginning of The War and still on people's minds now. Blood for oil, only we are not getting the benefits, only Body bags, of both female and male ,Our American Soldiers. And this is why Congress is having such a hard time getting extra money for this war. Those of you that don't have a son or daughter at war, it doesn't matter, as much. But, when one of them is over there, it is on your mind every day!!! And soo, is more and more soldiers dying, while our gas prices are still going up!When is this country going to wake up and get the politicians out of bed with the Oil Companies?
Not only will I not buy gas on May 15th! I think every American that thinks about our freedom, given to us by every American soldier, of All Wars. We should boycott on July 4th. After all isn't that our Independence Day?Remember The Boston tea Party?
Buy the way, I read an article, that if during the same time you only buy half a tank, at a time(If everyone did it, of course) It would back up the amount of gas being Delivered, Think about it!!!
Yeah, this country's ground was liberated to have the Americans Independence, So, let's celebrate it and gas up before July 4th.
Show every Oil Company we can have our Independence.
And I will ride my motorcycle on the 4th of July to Save Gas-Think About it-Folks
Not just My Space friends, Car, truck and motorcycle groups, PTA or PTO groups-Get the picture Folks. Another words Call and write everyone, not Just POF's
Have a Great day
Doc
 call me J
Joined: 12/13/2005
Msg: 98
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 3:33:51 PM
Rescuebiker... technically we did take their oil. A law was passed, giving 2/3 of the oil contracts to foreign companies for the foreseeable future, out of Iraqi hands. The oil has to keep coming into the USA from somewhere.
 wvwaterfall
Joined: 1/17/2007
Msg: 99
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There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 5:31:47 PM
Ok, I haven't been on much the last couple of days and come back to lots of abuse. Could you guys be a bit more specific which of the many things I've said is setting you off so?

I know I didn't say anywhere that Exxon would save the earth. I despise the way Exxon has funded the smokescreen on the climate change issue. I also never said the US had lots of stockpiled oil. Maybe when I said for the last few decades we'd been using the DISCOVERED oil from prior to that you might have thought I meant we had it all stashed in barrels somewhere. I meant that we'd been working off of already discovered oilfields all over the world, and they're under the control of all sorts of countries and corporations.

What makes anyone think I'm supporting oil companies? Sure, relatively speaking BP and Shell and Conoco-Phillips have put more money into alternative energy and they acknowledge the urgency of climate change, but they could sure be doing a lot more than they are.

I HAVE said that boycotting Exxon stations won't impact Exxon corporate, and that boycotting gas on the 15th won't hurt any oil companies. I've also said I think rising gas prices are a good thing - not because they give oil companies more profits, but because they help keep the pressure on for us to move beyond oil to some other way to move us about.

I'm no fan of oil company profits, and I don't even claim that the recent price bumps have anything to do with an oil shortage. Trying to predict gas prices any given day is like trying to predict airfares.

But I DO assert that we ARE consuming more oil than we're finding, and racing towards the day when supply outstrips demand. That's not the same thing as saying we're about to run OUT of oil, but when there's more demand than supply there WILL be really high prices and shortages, not these little bumps in price like we're seeing now.

So if anyone can give me something to work with other than claiming I'm full of it, I'd be glad to respond. But at the moment I don't even know what you guys are getting all crabby about.

Dave
 call me J
Joined: 12/13/2005
Msg: 100
There is a GAS STRIKE ON MAY 15
Posted: 5/3/2007 5:56:36 PM
RK, actually, to feed the USA demand for liquid fuel, would take virtually every bit of arable food growing land to grow the corn for the ethanol.

I find it absolutely ****ing hilarious that you, in a country that only produces half the oil it uses, you'd be so smug about everything. Do you know where you'd be without some countries sending you oil? ****, I pay more for gas here than you do in the states, and canada is the 2nd biggest exporter to the states.

Countries like Nigeria experience shortages and several hour lines to get gas, because it all gets shipped elsewhere to satisfy the countries where they think everything should be theirs, regardless of whether they actually have a claim to it or deserve it.

I hope that if things get bad, and shortages happen, it starts where you are and is worst there. You deserve it.
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