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 AUTHOR
 Unfold
Joined: 4/22/2007
Msg: 26
Telling versus Hinting with MenPage 2 of 8    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8)
uglybetty
It's the thinking pattern of (most) women. They talk while they think, while (most) men think, condense, and then come out with one clear thought that covers the entire point.


DING! DING!DING! We have a winner



 sxyvirgo
Joined: 7/26/2006
Msg: 27
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/13/2007 7:19:57 PM
The only way someone could pick up on hints is if they know you. Then they have a frame of reference to work with. Straight forward communication is best, though.
To even hope that a near stranger would pick up on a hint isn't realistic.


Okay people....in my OP I said, "once in a relationship"....I'm not talking about a stranger understanding me....I'm talking about a guy having a clue as to, for example, the kinds of things that might be a good gift idea after we've known each other for a year. No way am I gonna give a guy a list of things I want....either he comes close (and close is good enough, I don't expect perfection) or I figure he doesn't care enough to try and remember the things I've liked or commented on in the past.

If you make a case extreme enough it's easy to reject it....and that's more fun I suppose?
 Vancer
Joined: 10/29/2006
Msg: 28
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/13/2007 7:20:35 PM
I'd like to think that maybe men are pretending to not understand us sometimes, and if they aren't pretending then I guess we've got a huge difference between us and them. I dated this guy and hinted around that he needed to work on his communication in all kinds of ways. I tried to be as nice as possible about hinting around. I truly wanted him to "get it". Then finally one day I just said...."I'd really like to hear from you more" , and he said quite simply, "okay". From then on he started emailing and staying in touch more. I thought was it truly that simply. Have I not been being direct enough? I guess I don't understand, because I can figure a hint out and I "get it " when someone is being direct too....Go figure....will the gap ever narrow between men and women? God I hope...I think since they wrote the book about Venus and Mars I want to believe men are pretending not to understand us that much when maybe they do...


Hey Jade. I think just as you guessed he probably did get your hints. But quite possibly through past experiences saw those hints as a form of trying to sublimally manipulate his personality. He could have caught on but thought.....
"I get what you are trying to do, but I'll just pretend I didn't get it because I want to subtlety hint back that I can't be manipulated like that!"

I have felt that way before because I have been subject to a lot of subtle manipulations by people in my past. I sometimes think it's best when I feel that way to just come right and say it. Although I'm worried that would just stir up trouble!
Subtlety is such an aggravating thing sometimes. If it's in any way meant to manipulate my feelings or behaviour it feels like an insult to my intelligence.
 haywiresue
Joined: 9/27/2006
Msg: 29
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/13/2007 7:43:30 PM
Vancer I agree about subtlety being aggravating. I dont like having to "tell" a man to do something - I would prefer to "ask" in a nice way. Like doing or not doing something - where I give him an opportunity to say what he feels like doing. We are judged by our actions and interactions with each other, so if no one is taking advantage of the other, simple requests should be willingly accepted.

Now for things like the example used earlier about rock climbing - immediate honesty from the woman who did not want to go, would be a definite assest to the relationship as it would provide the man with the opportunity to still do his activity with one of his friends who would enjoy it more. However, if I was that woman, I would have tried it at least once to share this activity with my man and see his enjoyment and passion while doing this activity. If I didnt really like it after I had tried it, I would not wreck the adventure, only admit afterward how greatful I was that he shared his passion with me, only it really wasnt my thing and I would prefer he do that activity with someone who would enjoy it more with him. Who knows, without trying something new, we never broaden our horizons. Many of the activities I enjoy came from sharing that experience and passion from someone who thought enough about me to share that adventure.
 jadegreen
Joined: 2/3/2006
Msg: 30
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Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/13/2007 8:42:46 PM
tee hee hee...there u guys go again.....caught ya!
 JDMETRO
Joined: 5/9/2007
Msg: 31
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/13/2007 9:21:32 PM
Hinting is just a communications shortcut that works between and among people who 'get it'. And as has been pointed out -- it is not an effective form of communications in general - so why insist on using it? People who rely on hints are perhaps insecure and afraid of just saying what is on their minds.

Most men do not have the patience for 'getting hints' - when just saying it plainly and directly works better.

Joe
 JDMETRO
Joined: 5/9/2007
Msg: 32
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/13/2007 9:35:58 PM
Spot On there realisticdreamer. Your explanation is text book quality.

Joe
 scorpiomover
Joined: 4/19/2007
Msg: 33
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Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/13/2007 9:38:21 PM

I wonder if women hint and hold back because we want the men we know (once in some kind of relationship) to UNDERSTAND us and not wait or need to be told everything.
There is a famous saying: Rome was not built in a day. If you expect to start with the roof before the walls are built, the roof will come down and the house will NEVER be built. You have to start with the foundations, then the walls, and only then comes the roof.

1) If you want anyone to understand you, you have to do things with them, then address them directly, then when they have shown you they get the message in the first 3 words, you can start hinting. Anything else is just ludicrous
2) Don't expect us to know the language you have been taught, without being taught as well.
3) Don't expect us to know you as well as friends you have been much more open with and known for longer.


The truth is that you will never ask your friend to go shopping for you, or fix the roof. Not because she cannot do it, but because you know she will not know exactly the way you want it. That's what happened when you lent her your mascara, asked her to return it to you when she was finished and she returned it all used up. You meant return it with enough left for you to use as well. So you'll never trust your friend like that. Don't expect it of your boyfriend until he has shown that he is willing and able to do that, either.

All of these comments come under the heading of: My wife doesn't understand me,
which is what men always say when they are looking to cheat.

You would never treat your friends this badly, or you would be a social reject. Why do you want to be a dating reject? Because that is exactly what you will be if you persist in this behaviour.

In a different way, when I was a kid, my parents would say "do something BEFORE you're told!". Why? - because it means you're thinking of what you need to do and you understand what needs to be done. You're thinking a step ahead rather than just reacting (maybe to someone nagging you!). By only reacting, you're doing the absolute minimum you can do....
Most men already do this with at work and with their friends. But both work and friends understand it takes time to learn the standards in each new situation. So do parents. Women expect not to have to explain the ground rules.

DON'T ASSUME. YOU MAKE AN ASS OUT OF YOU AND ME!
 haywiresue
Joined: 9/27/2006
Msg: 34
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/13/2007 9:42:37 PM
Zebra210 - there you go - you restored my faith - for a moment there I thought the men on this thread were different and above the neanderthal men we know are out there. Its so nice to see a contrast between you and men who are really interested in good women.

While reading your post, I spit coffee on my laptop, thinking - OK, this guy is the real deal - he is the visual of that joke...................................How do you know how to look after a man? Easy he is either hungry or horny - so give either give him a sandwich and send him on his way - or have sex with him. Actually I heard this a little different, but I dont think your behaviour would get you many "BLOWJOBS".

OMG you make me laugh............................thanks.........................
 Gideon_70
Joined: 9/9/2005
Msg: 35
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/13/2007 9:59:02 PM

Rather than saying to a guy "I don't want to go out with you" we're racked with guilt over hurting his feelings so we string him along, sending out mixed messages and wind up being more hurtful in the long run. At least that's how I see it.


My very soon to be ex wife (seperated for over two years, just getting the paperwork over with) was like this. She would hint and hint and hint, yet, never just tell me. THe problem was that she was always swaying between this and that, to the point that I honestly didn't think that she herself know what she wanted. Eventually she had dinner with me, had a really good conversation, enjoyed ourselves, then filed for a restraining order the next day. The judge was shocked. He said, Ma'am, you went to dinner with him, and asked him to take you home and he did? Did he argue with you? Fight you? Did he do anything?
As you can guess...

So I personally LOVE that a woman is up front and honest with me. ON THE OTHER HAND...

Some women (my ex included) were in really controlling and abusive relationships before they get with a fellow, and carry that "luggage" into the marriage and expect him to act and react in a certain way, when it is not the way he really is. To this I say from personal experience... I do not want to hurt you, or your feelings. But this needs to be said....

Please, us guys are tired of being victims of "hit and run" relationships with unstable, hurting and confused women. I would love it and many of the good guys I speak with also would love it, if you took a year, or two. Get your head on right. Take a few classes (good men want smart women) and even if you are not working towards a career, work towards a good hobby that will give you quality alone time and a private space that is productive and enjoyable. Get a counsellor, even in war where a soldier is never in combat, the stress alone will screw him up. Get a person that is paid and trained in helping you regain your balance and understanding. Then in a year, or two, you will meet someone that is good, solid and willing to make a lifetime commitment to you.

When you pop out of an abusive relationship, you carry all of the fears and training (yes, you were trained by the abuse) to another man, then in your eyes he is different, then the very first time he does something or says something that the abuser did, you will start to hate the new man. You will want to run from/hide from/hurt back/abuse/mistreat the new fellow. It just isn't fair. I know it isn't fair becuase I had a lady that I was very in love with... but by the time the relationship was over, she had fully painted me into the shoes of her ex boyfriend. She lost, I lost and a good marriage is now in the process of going away.
 Steve_Sandy
Joined: 3/19/2006
Msg: 36
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Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/13/2007 11:40:36 PM
very bad with hints, need to be told something or will often not realise that a hint was made

have to agree with browsing, i find what i want having a good idea it will be at shop 1, 2 or 3 and then buy it, wont spend hours wondering if shirt a looks better than shirt b
 Vancer
Joined: 10/29/2006
Msg: 37
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 12:38:22 AM
I hope it was a joke aikiman.
Subtle commands. That is a type of manipulation I was talking about earlier that I find aggravating.

I do in fact pick up on it, but totally ignore it, to send the message 'You failed at this passive aggressive attempt to control me. Now cut it out.', without starting a fight over it.

When a person is open and honest with me it doesn't come across as manipulative at all, and I'm much less prone to feeling defensive and resistant.

BTW, I'm not going to be assigning any gender blame here. I've had plenty people try this on me regardless of their gender and it bugged me either way. And I've seen friends do this to other friends of the same gender and could clearly see it irked them too.
People just do not like being told what to do!
But they will do it, if they are either asked nicely, or told to with good reason and clarity rather than in some sneaky gutless fashion that insults their intelligence.
 want to travel
Joined: 7/29/2006
Msg: 38
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Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 1:02:02 AM
definatly tell, women are so complicated, dont be shy, or play games, its the 21st cetury tell!
 spleetered
Joined: 5/8/2007
Msg: 39
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 1:16:53 AM
I always know she's trying to hint at something, but it's so damned vague, I just ignore it. I shouldn't have to be able to decipher a primitive series of vague suggestions and nuances. Honestly, I have wondered for years why women think this is an efficient means of exchanging information.

Ultimately, that's the goal of any man's conversation- to develop and deliver the most information and context, in the smallest amount of time possible. And why not? What does it accomplish when you go on for hours and hours, when the whole point could have filled two sentences?
 sxyvirgo
Joined: 7/26/2006
Msg: 40
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 9:45:05 AM

I believe in communicating during conversations shared that I like this or that but I'm not likely to say "do this for me" ---- There are ones, very special ones who know how to pick up information and run with it --- and they are PRICELESS!!!!


Thank you exuberant - THIS is exactly what I mean...

On the job, if someone had to tell you every single detail of what to do (once you'd been there for awhile), you would not last long - you're expected to LEARN.....why not in a relationship? You have a time where you're both exploring and learning about each other, then you take what you know and apply it on your own!!!!

Is THIS an analogy that MEN can understand?! lol Probably too damn logical! Oh well, you're FIRED!
 DevineDene
Joined: 10/12/2006
Msg: 41
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 3:06:24 PM

"Anyway my reason for not being direct it's not a game, it's just to see if there is a real interest or not.


Sorry OP and other ladies. I am a woman and I don't get this.
I have no difficulty knowing when a man is interested. He calls, he wants to be near me. He gives me gifts that he likes and wants to share with me. Mostly he gives me his time, and that tells me he is interested.
As I said in an earlier post, I had the most trick car in the car pool, because that is how my man showed me his interest. Trust me ladies a fella who loves cars and spends time and money on your car for you is interested.
I just don't get why your man has to ferret out that you love blue bunnies and only give you blue bunnies in order for you to know he cares.
Maybe I am the strange one here cause I found it incredibly romantic to watch him lovingly and carefully put on the pin-striping and chrome, to see him grin proudly as he buffed in that last bit of polish. Knowing him the way I did fancy restaurant's with all the trappings would have made him feel just that; trapped. Why on earth would I want the man I loved to feel trapped in order to 'prove' he loved me.
JMO
DD
 DevineDene
Joined: 10/12/2006
Msg: 42
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 3:30:57 PM
Piratress

That's why we be mates aboard the Pearl me hearty, kindred spirits.

Now let' us go find some men we can do for and be done too
 bucsgirl
Joined: 5/13/2006
Msg: 43
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Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 4:17:35 PM
Communication is vital to all relationships, not just the romantic ones.
The earlier you establish good patterns of communication, the better a chance both people have of being satisfied and happy with each other.
If you don't communicate well, you don't really have much of a relationship at all.
 ~Juggernaut~
Joined: 4/30/2007
Msg: 44
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 4:49:25 PM
We men don't think on the terms of hints ladies !!!!!!! know this !!!! men say what they mean and mean what they say ? it's our language !! reality ! If you want something speak up !
 JDMETRO
Joined: 5/9/2007
Msg: 45
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 5:04:58 PM
I often pick up some parts of the 'Hint' or hints - but it just seems to come off as a form of nagging. And nagging is one the most negative aspects of a relationship. Too much nagging - whether by hinting or direct statement and I Exit Stage Right. . .

Joe
 Vancer
Joined: 10/29/2006
Msg: 46
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 6:45:25 PM
This is in response to an above post about nagging.
Nagging isn't about someone being direct and honest.
It's about someone being excessively critical.
If a person is bothered by so many little things in a relationship they shouldn't be in that relationship.
If someone says "I REALLY like so and so, but cannot stand this, this, this and that", then it matters not whether they are open and direct about it, laying subtle hints, or keeping it bottled up....they are not truly compatible and should move on, regardless of how much it hurts.
 JDMETRO
Joined: 5/9/2007
Msg: 47
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 6:56:53 PM
Dear Goddess - (Diosa in Spanish)

Question: Do you get a big sign on a pole with that one way street you live on?

"Damn if I do damn if I don’t" No, I'd say you just don't get it.

Straight out communication applies in the first messages - first meetings or in a long term romance and marriage.

There is no obligation to learn how to detect, understand or decode hints at any level of a relationship. Say what you mean - mean what you say.

You cannot communicate with a man as if he were a woman - it will NEVER WORK!

Joe
 bucsgirl
Joined: 5/13/2006
Msg: 48
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Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 7:38:35 PM
"so I'm just gonna go back and listen to the game. " I'm guessing the game he's referring to is a sport....baseball, basketball...a GAME.
What do you think listen to the game means? For me it's football, I WISH it were football season, if there was a game I'd be watching it.
 DevineDene
Joined: 10/12/2006
Msg: 49
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 7:55:15 PM
goddessofdreamsandvalues
That is not what some of us women are talking about.. How unintelligent would a woman be if she doesn’t get that someone is interested? That is more than enough. That’s gorgeous that’s beautiful. Does he have to write it in the sky? Well if a woman who can’t get all that interest then probably when it’s written in the sky she wouldn’t get it either.

Of course written out the way I have it any one could see the interest. Way back at the beginning of my relationship with him, there was no long list of things he did to show interest. It started with one thing only.
The point I was trying to make is that I didn't need to hint to him that if he did a,b,c, then I would know he was interested in me. I accepted what he WAS doing, not what I thought he should be doing. At the beginning, in the middle, and even near the end.
Yes, there were times when I thought it would be nice if he did certain things; however, I did not take it as him not loving me if those things that I wanted were not done. I learned to see what he shared, I showed my appreciation for that sharing. That is why after all that time, the list became long and obvious.
Hope that is a bit clearer to you now.
DD
 JDMETRO
Joined: 5/9/2007
Msg: 50
Telling versus Hinting with Men
Posted: 6/14/2007 8:08:39 PM
Talk about communications problems there Diosa . . .

Ms. Goddess, I have read both your very long posts from end to end -- and I find that less than 10% of what you wrote is understandable.... You should read what you write - it jumps around all over the place.

Bottom line - you just don't get it. You want a man to read you mind from the first POF message all the way through marriage. Good luck . . . . You'll need it...

I personally feel lucky I don't have to listen to you go on and on and on and say practically nothing but -- just repeat yourself.

Goddess - I am not attacking you -- you just do not make sense in much of what you say (at least to me) and I cannot respond to all the stuff you write - I'd be here all night trying to figure it out.

Communications between any two people is nothing more than as series of clear statements.

Joe
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