|dining scamPage 3 of 12 (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12)|
This is what I believe a real gentleman " circa 2007" should do....
At the beginning of the dinner, always make it clear about the bill and splitting it..... most women are very reasonable.... some will even offer to have you as their guest and, somme will tell you they put it on their corporate card..... others would be happy to go 50-50.....the ones who get offended....well, they are not for you.
That is NOT what a gentleman who invites a lady out does!!
I am in 100% agreement that a Lady should be prepared to pay her half of the bill ,
But a guy who asks a lady out and then tries to make up some kind of verbil contract before the date about who is going to pay for what, is not being a gentleman at all.
Posted: 8/19/2007 10:25:52 AM
|takes a memo to send bison33 a copy of "Rains personal opinion edition of gentlemen for dummies handbook"|
Posted: 9/20/2007 8:10:01 PM
|she's sorta like a food whore, minus the sex (?). i'm suprised she didn't put out, in the hopes of earning breakfast the next morning (at which time she could order her dinner!).|
amazing how blatant she was, though! once you get beyond being puzzled, i suggest you entertain a good chuckle...
PS. i have never ever in my life been on a date where i've paid half...in fact, i find men willing to pay my way AND my daughter's (don't get the wrong idea..we actually met thru our children's "playdates") i certainly offer, though! it is the classy thing to do, and i am fully willing to pitch in, but i have yet to have a "gentleman" take me up on it. then again, STILL SINGLE!!!!
Posted: 11/2/2007 6:58:14 AM
|I would spring for shrimp at Long John Silver for ... like ... $2.99!|
OK, back on topic. As one of the "non-gentlemen", I think initial meetings should be Dutch, and I will say so before we make plans. To me, we barely know each other, so everybody pays their own way, and you can order whatever you like.
Also, I'm sensitive to the concept of the roles I'm expected to play. If we are going to start out with "You need to pay for dinner, because that's what gentlemen do", then I can't help but wonder what other rules are to follow. If that is going to be an issue, I would rather get it out early and not waste our time. I don't see it as the "right way" or the "wrong way", but rather our expectations are not compatable with each other, and move on.
There's plenty of men willing to pay for everything, and plenty of women willing to go Dutch. I'm willing to be excluded by the women who expect the men to pay for everything.
Posted: 11/2/2007 10:20:24 AM
|I can just see a professional man or chuckle ....Donald Trump asking a woman out and then letting her know, he expects her to pay for her half of the dinner/date. I wonder if it is their mental attitude towards women in general that got them where they are or if it's that they still respect the differences in the sexes? |
IF one looks around at successful men in all layers of life, I doubt we would find one that could be so CHEAP as to ask for a date and expect their date to pay for the entertainment. Maybe its a mind set or is it just that they were brought up to respect women for being women.....the softer, gentler sex.
My father was a successful business man, my mother a stay at home mom, but my father always gave my mother credit for the fact he was able to preform his responsibilities and become a success, because he had the support of my mother. He said if it had not been for her, THEY would never have accomplished what they did. She never brought a dime into the relationship, but was a good steward of his efforts.
Posted: 11/2/2007 11:31:16 PM
but that is the risk you take when you meet someone off of the Internet.
You mean someone like you? You're on the internet.
Everyone is on the internet. There is no difference between people on the internet and anyone else anymore.
Blaming "internet people" for negative behavior is a flippant, outdated viewpoint for people who can't be bothered to think.
Posted: 11/7/2007 1:37:45 AM
|"Everyone is on the internet. There is no difference between people on the internet and anyone else anymore.|
Blaming "internet people" for negative behavior is a flippant, outdated viewpoint for people who can't be bothered to think."
I disagree with you....I do believe people in person are a bit more politically correct when dealing with others, but then they don't have a screen to hide behind. Bullies have the perfect venue on the Internet, you can't reach across and "silly slap" them when they behave badly and that makes them feel tough.
Posted: 11/7/2007 2:07:40 AM
|Welcome to the millenium, it's high time you figured out a few extra ways to supplement that pension of yours if your going to be dating. If you cant afford it you might wanna just get some magazines & stay at home because that's how it is my friend.|
Posted: 11/7/2007 2:23:05 AM
|She was so blatant about her intentions that you should have ordered yourself a meal fit for a KING & then ditched her for the whole cheque. Then, if she had a vehicle out in the parking lot, took a steakknife & puctured a tire, perhaps a little sugar in her gastank... you gotta be creative man... |
Posted: 11/14/2007 8:18:08 AM
|Hmmmm Something doesn't add up about the original poster's story. If you have "done your homework" by developeing a little knowledge about your on-line interest before you went out then you would have already ask significant questions about her dateing habits. |
Since every pancake has two sides I am more inclined to think that someone having selective memory about the date.
Perhaps you made the invitation, insisted on a dinner date as a first meeting because you rarely can get anyone to go out on a date after an initial introductory meeting, picked the place, were trying to play the roll of traditional macho big spender. Not that the place you mention is exactly big spending most are over crowed mall eateries. You may have spent and enormous amount of time boohooing your previous dates, whineing about how unfair dateing is, bragging how you have it made, could easily afford pay for the appetisers, meals, drinks dessert blah blah blah. What is more likely is you bullied her into eating cheese sticks off YOUR appetizer which you may have wallowed in with your fingers or double dipped, offered then resented when she ordered her own, which she may have gotten when the meal finally appeared, and then were and insufferable whineing bore the entire long drawn out miserable meal that you probably ordered since you were trying to control the sitiuation beginning to end.
Does a lady take anything home from a date in a to go box. No. But my guess is you made such a big deal about it that she had the waiter put it in a to go box to shut you up.
Would a con artist tell you that she frequently ran such a scam? I doubt it. There is a much easier way to get a meal than getting dressed up, showing up at a set time and place that may or may not be near your home and routine, paying parking, maybe a sitter, and going through the drill of dateing a new person.
More likely your date was trying to reverse the " rub your nose in it" routine because she was sick of your self righteous behavior. That she succeeded and you are crying like a baby that didn't get his lolilpop over a cheap appetiser that she probably dumped in the parking lot garbage is probably more just than people who were not there to see and hear both sides of the story know.
ANY man that suggests that a woman is a "dinner whore" because she accepts and invitation to be a guest for a meal is a liar himself. Accepting a date is a short term no obligation exchange of her time and companionship not a proposition of sex or a relationship. Nobody holds a gun to your head gentleman if you don't want to chance a few failed attempts at dateing either improve your dateing selection process, BE better dates, or quit dateing.
Those of you who think it is funny to simply walk out on dates they find uncomfortable are simply theives who make invitations and then steal the date back. I think it is absolute cowardice to sneak out the back door. And also dangerous because you are quite likely to be confronted in the parking lot of some other place or time when they catch on. Believe me your reputation will eventually catch up with you. It is far better to say "Thank you, this is enough, goodbye." and leave with some dignity.
To suggest that you involve the resturant staff in the charade shows how irresponsible you are for your own decisions or the spinlessness you are for confronting your date. Nine times out of ten when a customer walks out on the meal the offended party does not pay for your meal the waiter does or the resturant eats it. Which eventually is added into the expense of meals for those of us who can go in and act like adults and pay for our choices.
Posted: 11/14/2007 9:06:38 AM
|Ive given this subject a lot of thought in the past. Not the quandry the OP presented but the whole Man provides meal - deal. I guess it has to have its roots in the past|
(damn those roots) man provider ,sharing with his woman. It does go far beyond that,
it is a matter of control and how that is to be shared.. some guys go the whole way and order ,perhaps a chance to display his knowledge of food ,wine etc. theres a degree of leadership (or lack of ) established , a fit of sorts tried on and accepted or rejected.
I know discussing it sounds so damn sexist, but the skillful handling of menu ,staff and potable spirits has its own effect that has an impact on the dating dynamic.
The entire experience offers many variations on the theme that to some degree offers a glimpse into future possibilities. Or its just grubbing down and that says something as well. I personally think goumets are annoying twits with an overly oral outlook, but its hard not to become some part of a gourmand after working so hard to improve in every other area - why should food and drink be excepted?
As far as who pays or who benefits in the long run..
sometimes its easier to worry about a few bucks than the fact that it didnt go well
makes that sinking feeling a bit more bearable
Posted: 11/14/2007 11:04:30 AM
|Personally I find a gentleman that makes a polite dinner invitation and gives me a descreet idea of the place he is taking me to is good mannered and immediately engracioates himself to my attentions. Then I can accept or refuse the invitation according to the ability I have to fit in. Or offer a more workable counter. |
If it is in fact an upscale resturant where the host is expected to make the selections then hopefully he has the good manners to also descreetly ask my preferences before ordering. If someone is going to be my host I expect them to have had enough communication with me or my emmissaries to have some general notion as to my preferences before we enter a reaturant and avoid the whole what to order quandry.
If a gentleman invites me out for a steak dinner then I order steak . (Just as I would expect to serve steak if I invited someone to my home.) What knocks me out is the guy who invites you to a steak house and expect you to eat chicken or a salad. Now if he invites me to the abiance of a nice steak house for dessert and coffee that is of course fine also. I know the offer and don't try to upgrade it.
I assume any man who invites a lady to dine should expect to offer her a upper priced entree and not expect her to guess about his resources to accomodate the invitation. I believe if she is in fact a lady she will not abuse the privilege of being hosted and lean toward the middle of the menu. I do think it is rather insulting to assume that you must order the least expensive meal or play coy games about wanting to eat. It is exceedingly bad taste to over order or haul home "doggie bags". Your dog or your kids or your later lunch needs were not part of the invitation. If you have a small appetite; so be it, eat what is pleaseing, Thank your host, and leave what you can not eat on the plate. By all means if you are the host do not force feed the guest or act like a parent chideing a child or a miser that can not afford to let a bite pass.
Any man who makes me feel I have to share my meal has not only poor finacial skills but is overly familiar. (Have I been known to share a decadent dessert with a lover of course that is a different story.) What is acceptable in a mutual longstanding relationship is different from a date.
Do I mind a gentleman taking the responsibility to address wait-staff and see to it that I have a relaxing meal? Absolutely not. That will be the first gentleman to be invited to my favorite resturant or home for a reciprocal dinner invitation or some other pleasant experience and I am not necessarily suggesting sex.
I do think if you are trying to "learn by doing" on a date about wine, or ordering, or "copeing" with the nuances of a new social experience you have and obligation to at least ask the date if they are up for your little "education". I personally find having to coach or endure "schooling" as not particularly fun experience. I don't want to be my dates mother or his student. Leave your "Pretty Woman" fantasy for your dreams. I think a date is a time to share what you lnow not what you are trying to learn. Especially early encounters where you are suppose to be getting to know each other.
If you want to really streach your limits and wow someone do that when you know they are going to be around for a while and are up for the adventure.
Posted: 11/25/2007 4:38:31 AM
|sorry u had such an experience..please e mail me her name so i never chat with her...can't stand that double standard..most of the women i have met were not like that individual..one lady brought up the subject of going dutch on the first meeting..however, when it came time to pay up whe went to the bathroom & then quickly exited to her automobile.. i exited to my Harley Davidson & laughed all the way home .... bruce|
Posted: 12/9/2007 11:42:39 AM
|no, it's not fair|
Posted: 12/9/2007 1:16:05 PM
|OK gang let's think back real hard to the mechanics of meeting someone BEFORE the internet. For purpose of this discussion we will also set aside "fix ups" and "blind dates" arranged by allegedly wellmeaning friends or relatives.|
So you meet a person for the first time in some sort of real life setting.The store, a community meeting, the library,or maybe in a bar or at a party. For this discussion we'll stipulate that it's the guy who does the asking. Depending on where the 2 of you are what usualy happens? Daytime activity, guy asks lady if she wants to "grab a coffee". In a bar, he might buy her a drink and/or ask her to dance if there's music. Or you exchange phone #s and talk on the phone, maybe meet for COFFEE OR A SODA. Most of the time at least some basis of interest had been established BEFORE the guy shelled out for a dinner date. Guys didn't arrange to spend $50 on having dinner with a woman they didn't know from Adams off ox!
Guys, I am APPALLED to hear of women abusing "dating" to help out with the feed bill. ( I mean that! I'm not being sarcastic/smartmouth here)
But, why don't you make that first "date" for coffee, a soda, a drink, ice cream? You have to remember that we ladies over 45 are at this point sort of in the dark as to whether offering to split or go dutch will be appreciated, or whether it will offend the gentleman's sensibilities.
And I agree, it's easier to converse and get to know one another over coffee or a soft drink, rather than screwing up both good food AND good conversation by trying to deal with both at once.
Posted: 4/2/2008 10:05:18 AM
|Wow...What a great topic...|
Yeah, it's happened to me as well with a lady that I met on another site...Funny thing now, is that she's on this site looking (lives in NJ) for another meal...(I wonder if she ever washed her sweater that had the days befores breakfast/lunch or dinner stains on it)...
Posted: 12/8/2008 11:20:24 PM
|Hello , sorry to hear of such greed ~~Tropical your answer was the best and funniest Rofl, sounds like that woman is long over due for some payback. Never liked the idea of dinner on the first date for a lot of reasons and wasnt aware that people do that ?wow do I have alot to learn ...|
Posted: 12/9/2008 5:52:51 AM
|^^^^ Ironically, you have plenty of poorer-but-now-wiser-and-warier male "company"... |
Posted: 12/9/2008 6:51:27 AM
|that is just plane ole weird|
i suggest meeting her for coffee somewhere
A F T E R
you have spoken to her for a while
and feel comfortable that she is not some freak
i would never meet a stranger that i didn't know
take more time screening out the freaks
Posted: 12/9/2008 8:02:14 AM
Here is the deal. When I have offered to pay half the bill.. the gentleman assumes that I don't like him and that is why I won't let him pay for me.
When I don't offer to pay my share ..now it seems the gentleman will assume I am using him for a free meal.
The answer is... no more meals!
Meet for a cup of coffee in a place where they don't serve food.....I will arrive early enough to buy my own before you get there..
I agree with this poster.
Also, I don't see where a scam was happening. The OP went out with someone that ordered food at dinner. Perhaps he should of told her she was only permitted one course because otherwise he would feel he was being taken advantage of. Although his date was pretty ballsy about her dating for meals game play, I don't see how she was pulling a scam.
Also, if you can't afford a restaurant/activity etc, don't go and definitely don't complain when the bill comes. I don't do well with petty people ESPECIALLY when a bill comes. I actually deal with several friends like this who will nickle and dime a restaurant bill about who had what down to a single beverage. Which at that point, I just pull out my cc and just pay for the whole thing myself. But these are the same people that if you give them a ride home they won't give you gas money. But I've learned my lesson and just don't give them rides any more. I've found that cheap people are cheap with their own money, but when it comes to others they are more than willing to spend it for you.
Posted: 12/9/2008 1:41:25 PM
|Tropicalbliss, unfortunately for you, you met one of the women players. Unfortunately for me, she gives the good women a bad name... and makes it harder for good guys to feel comfortable with good women.|
In the future, be wary and pick meeting places more carefully.
Posted: 12/9/2008 3:38:52 PM
|I think most of us "been had" before. For my worse date, I sucked up $97. Heck, just learn from it & move on. I wanted to be the nice guy but felt kinda foolish afterwards.|
One of my friends was much, much smarter. He insisted that his date split the tab with him. Never even hesitated a second. And she was super hot. He claims to take care of the girl when it's his girlfriend. (many dates later after the trust is earned and he figures that she is worth dating) .......................Until then, if women want equality, they get equality.
Posted: 12/9/2008 6:48:54 PM
|I am quite amazed at how many think that she was not scamming the OP. Call it what you may, she clearly took advantage of the fact that he was buying dinner and out of disrespect and greed, she ordered food to take home.|
A respectful woman would not have done that. Period. The OP was not there to buy her food for the next day or support her weekly eating habit. Unfortunately there are men and women who both do this type of activity. She clearly took advantage of him and the situation.
I knew someone that did this all of the time. His claim to fame line was , "Oh..I must have left my wallet at home". We always gave him heck for it. Then, he happened to be on a filmed tv dating show that took place in the Hamptons. Ha....when the woman he dated was asked how she enjoyed her date by the show host, she was more than mildly upset because he used the same line on her and it was on tv! We laughed are a-s-ses off.
Fun and joke aside, the lady needs to be fed to the lions.
Posted: 12/10/2008 5:45:38 PM
" Just want to let you know, I didnt bring any money with me so if you want anything you'll have to buy it."
It didnt matter anyways cuzz the more he talked the more I noticed he had GREEN TEETH...ewwwww
Wow Casperella, a cheapskate with green teeth - and you let this one GO?