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 Tossed_Salad
Joined: 6/23/2007
Msg: 269
Sex with minorsPage 4 of 35    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35)

most of us when we lost our virginity I would assume was with someone within our age bracket.


ahh, according to some of the strident people here, it would not be OK for someone aged 18 years, one month to date someone aged 17 years, 11 months ?

18 years and a day with 17 years and 364 days? like THAT has never happened to most of you, or a littlemore extreme 'differences than that..18 & 16? 19 & 17, etc.??
 Tossed_Salad
Joined: 6/23/2007
Msg: 271
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/20/2007 8:11:27 AM
OK, but I still don't get why some people now area pparently saying it is WRONG fora nyoine over 18 to have sex with someone under 18

(becasue the under-18 doesn't know what they want, might be manipulated, etc.)

but it's OK for a 16 or 17 year old to get banged by someone the same age?

If they don't know what they want..and AS IF no 16 or 17 year old guy could "EVER" 'manipulate' ?

ummm, ok..

the people talking bravely about getting a group together to beat up any guy who was with their, or their friend's 17 y.o. daughter..sounds good & macho..things might have changed in the 25 or 30 years since you were that age, a lot of punks carry guns and might not hesitate to pop a cap into you..but you could still die macho..bonus!
 Tossed_Salad
Joined: 6/23/2007
Msg: 273
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/20/2007 9:18:25 AM

Parents always see their children as kids, whereas someone in their 20s and up probably doesn't have the same perspective, but from the parent's mind they should. "Sleeping with my kid" is more of the issue than "Sleeping with my barely legal kid".


YES, and I think that they forget what it was like (and what THEY were like), when THEY were 15, 16, 17 or so..

(too many years ago now, for many..)
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 276
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/20/2007 10:51:52 AM
It really depends on the society. In many societies , particularly muslim nations, people get married and involved as young as 12 . From their vantage point they may think we are nuts to have these laws because remember women start menstruating at 12 or so and sometimes younger. Thus thats natures way of telling them its time to reproduce . Afterall , last I checked human beings are part of the animal kingdom. In retrospect, I understand our laws in the west, because you would have even higher numbers of unwanted pregnancies and disease as well. I am just pointing out both sides. I do think our govt needs to have some common sense as well. ... For example, if a 22 yr old guy has sex with a 16 yr old it should not be a big deal. That to me is what is lacking in our society. Candid Camera Predator shows do not help either making it into a circus. Just my 2 cents worth.
 Tossed_Salad
Joined: 6/23/2007
Msg: 278
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/20/2007 11:16:15 AM

the grand majority of underage persons, (under 18) are not emotionally equipped to deal with the consequences of sex


and a fair number of people over 25 still are not..

so where do you draw the line? it seems a bit unfair to the "FEW" (you say) under 18 who ARE ready..

generalize people by chronological age..
 grizzelda
Joined: 6/25/2006
Msg: 280
view profile
History
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/20/2007 11:31:19 AM
Well the point is that a legal adult of 25 is having sex with a legal minor. Some call it splitting hairs and some are making the distinction of days vs years. the point is that we have to as a society protect those that are generally to young and inexperienced to make decisions that have lasting effects on their lives. Whether we are talking about sex, signing a contract, or anything else that generally requires a rational and mature approach to the issue at hand. There is no dispute that a number does not signify maturity in all cases, however with that number generally comes more life experience, the ability to see things with a wider perspective and a higher education that in theory gives a certain amount of skills to make these types of decisions.
Unfortunately the problem is that there are more than enough people that are happy to take advantage of an individual that can be manipulated and inexperienced at any age and young people that are looking to gain some "independance" and have a very naive view of reality are usually prime pickings. So to combat this we have a obligation to try and minimize this from happening so that is why I find the idea of a adult having sex with a minor wrong. I guess as an adult I believe that it is more important to look out for these people than it is to get a little on the side.
 Tossed_Salad
Joined: 6/23/2007
Msg: 282
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/20/2007 11:47:50 AM
^^

it is also against the law for you and your thug-buddy sports playing pals to gang up (3 or 4 or more of you?) and beat up somone for having sex with one of your 17-year old daughters, as you have repeatedly said you would do, wouldn't it be, tough guy?

do you think there might be a reason that action would be against the law?

sounds like a soft middle-aged loser trying to sound tough..?

most people get over the "tough guy" act after high school as well, certainly after 16, or hopefully 18 at the latest

I know some never do..it makes them a man, I guess..in their own eyes..?


You see Vinny Low, that comment alone tells me something about you, you are either socially inept or you might be a piece of chicken short a snack pack


there is hardly any difference at all between 17 and 25 though

WTF, sorry Sport ,

I have teammates and friends who have daughters that age, who would throw you a beating if you were caught dating them.

Off topic, how many 17 years out there are playing for the Roughriders?
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 285
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/20/2007 12:57:44 PM
To msg 281 - You are knocking some complete muslim nations when you call those 'losers' that pursue someone under a certain age. Just because you do not understand does not mean people are losers. Yes I understand in our society we have laws and I abide by those laws. I also understand that in some societies sex with women 12 or so is common place and very accepted. They might think that we are losers because we are wasting fertile years in girls for reproduction. So you see its more societal than being a blanketed human acceptance thing of sex with underage girls or boys for that matter. Their is neither right nor wrong. Every society has the right to have the laws they want for their nation regarding age of person for sexual intercourse.
 Venari
Joined: 9/4/2007
Msg: 289
view profile
History
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/20/2007 3:12:54 PM
Wow! Why are there some of you still thinking this thread is a debate? This isn't a debate. It's law. What makes you think if you rant and rave on enough demanding your right to behave selfishly that the whole world will suddenly go, "Oh, ok, you're the only special person in this world and we all think you deserve to be irresponsible and selfish so go right ahead and destroy my child's life. Honestly, we think you are a God and we want to sacrifice our child's dignity, virginity, rights, and life to you."

And what's with the piddly excuses? I've heard it being said that, "If a child comes on to me that makes it right!" Err, NO, you're an adult and you're suppose to say to this child, "Stop! That is wrong." And the age makes no difference. Using the excuse that this child is 17 instead of 16 or 15 makes no difference. One year makes no difference. Saying this child looks and behaves mature for their age still doesn't make it right either. Who are you to judge what is mature or not? We've had hundreds of years and millions of people figuring out what is mature but you come along and say all of them people are wrong but you are right. Huh? ....And I've also heard it being said, "Oh, so since you say you'd do something against the law like hurt me for touching your child then I'm allowed to touch your daughter cos two wrongs make a right." Huh? Two wrongs make a right? I can't make any sense of that statement. That would have to also mean that if you justify touching someone's child because the parent said they'd hurt you then it WOULD be ok for the parent to hurt you if you touched their child. No matter which way you say it it's the same thing. Both ways are wrong but only one way you'll accept. Use that same excuse with a mother lion and demand you are allowed to take that mother lion's child. What do you think will happen? Then try and justify that it's your right to take the cub because the mother lion attacked you. Makes as much sense as the excuse you are using in here.

It's not a debate. It's law. Trying to debate it and argue it to us in here will not change it from being a law. It's your responisiblity to be an adult and not some selfish immature child with your fingers in your ears singing, "La la la la, I can't hear you. La la la la, you're not the boss of me. La la la la, you can't tell me what to do." Law is law and you can keep debating all you want in your prison cell.


You're right, the law is the law, regardless of how stupid or idiotic it is. Which means I shouldn't walk down Bank street here in ottawa on a sunday after 6 pm with an ice cream cone. Doesn't matter whether or not the law is stupid, just that the law is the law.


Yeah right.

NATURE's law states (as i've heard some people say) "old enough to bleed, old enough to breed".

But, then again, I'm in canada, we have different sexual age of consent laws, because we realize maturity of the individuals involved, not their parents, is the issue.


what were talking about is HERE in this continent
Refine that statement to COUNTRY, not CONTINENT. 17 is more than legal in most countries outside the US.

Also, what does the age of the people involved have to do with the older person being a loser? What if he/she didn't fit in simply because they were fat, or had a birthmark on the face, or maybe they were crosseyed. Has nothing to do with "who they are", and yet most high school kids will ostracize you for any reason at all. I might've been seen as a loser because I never smoked weed or got plastered during lunch hour. Why a person was a "loser" has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 290
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/20/2007 3:14:11 PM
Who are we to say what is acceptable in another nation? Thats my point. I understand our laws and respect them and know why they are there. That does not mean that other nations are wrong that have a different standard of what is acceptable. Some nations eat insects , we find that repulsive but it does not make them wrong . Remember folks we do not want others pushing their way of life on us and it has to work both ways. In the eyes of these other nations mostly 3rd world but not all [Saudi Arabia is not 3rd world] , when women are bioligally ready to reproduce than they are able to marry and have sex. In fact early days of American History early teens got married, I am talking 14 or so . Again I try not to judge other nations and at the same time I respect the laws of my nation and understand the need for those laws.
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 293
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/20/2007 3:42:43 PM
^^^^ If an American guy is 80 and dates someone 18 or even 17 in some states, where its legal. I have no problem with that . I mean why should I???, They are not breaking the law. Same thing for an 80 yr old lady so I wont play the double standard lmao. We have enough in each of our lives than to worry about others that are NOT breaking any laws .
 SAIUN
Joined: 5/23/2007
Msg: 297
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/20/2007 5:46:56 PM

Any mature person wanting a real relationship would want to be with someone that understands and enjoys the same things they do.

This is what some of us have been trying to say. An 18 year old guy could easily have similar interests to a 17 year old girl. For some people, you still "understand and enjoy" the same things at 25 that you did at 18.

Then again, I should just stop posting. I used to think trying to convince XBox fans that PlayStation is better was futile, this is just as bad!
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 299
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/21/2007 7:08:31 AM
Arugula I do not care what others think of me , thats a losers attitude. I am simply bringing up the fact that other nations see things differently than we do and that its a societal thing. I am not a phony so if someone does not want to date me because I have a 'mind', which is really what it comes down to than thats ok. If I am wrong about Saudi than I am wrong but the point is that women do start to menstruate at 12 or so and according to the laws of evolution she is ready to reproduce. Going strictly by the laws of nature that means she is ready to have sex. Other nations , believe that as well and that is their right to run their nation that way. I did point out that I recognize the laws [in my country]and if you read my profile I ask for a pic because I would not want to even make the mistake of talking to someone underage. I am not an arrogant American to go around and putdown how other nations run their nations, because quite frankly its not my business.
 Tossed_Salad
Joined: 6/23/2007
Msg: 300
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/21/2007 8:16:41 AM
yes, yes, there are many here who have firmly established their "moral superiority" over the rest, without really rationally discussing any points.

just emotionally fly off the handle, state their own emotional superiority, and suggest that anyone that questions prison time for this is a 'pedophile'..or 'obsessed' with 'young girls' themselves..or a member of NAMBLA, etc..
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 301
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/21/2007 8:57:18 AM
^^^^ Exactly. I am merely stating the differences in other nations as opposed to our nation and coming at it from an objective point of view and showing their side , which many people can not do. I get the fact that people let emotion rule out logic and can not discuss this intelligently. The fact is I am just going with the thread title and thats what its all about. I do think its funny that some people in here think I care what others think of me and that it MAY RUIN MY DATE CHANCES lol.
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 303
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/21/2007 9:42:18 AM
I do not see anyone condoning sex with minors. I am just stating the fact that other societies view things and believe differently than we do and that it is their right to govern as they see fit. As a dad I can not blame you for wanting to take out a 'lawbreaker' violating any part of your family. The predator show has proven though to be agenda driven just for a money grab and many peoples constitutional rights are being violated , as came out in the Texas cases, where all were set free.
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 305
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/21/2007 10:12:38 AM
This is the topic of forum. Its not a question of whether I agree or not. I am just openminded enough to realize that every nation does not see everything thru 'american colored ' glasses. Unfortunately , most people do not have the ability to grasp that everyone in the world has different laws. I do and I respect that. I understand the reasoning why they are ok with their laws and I understand why America has its laws. Does not mean one country is right and another wrong. By the way I have no problem with law enforcement trying to catch peds , I do have a problem when tv shows with an agenda do it and make a mockery of the system , which has been proven in a court of law.
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 308
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/21/2007 10:38:50 AM
I was enjoying my little banter with you artistme but once you throw in the word liberal I know who you are . One of those right wing talk show host listeners where IM RIGHT , everyone else is wrong. This is simply a discussion no need to throw in the word liberal . In fact I would venture to say that the nations that are ok with child bearing women able to have sex and get married are anything BUT liberal. I will take it a step further. In early Americana it was the bible belt that was ok with 12 yr olds and 13 yr olds having sex and getting married. To throw the liberal word is way off base . Oh yes those pedophile priests voted for Ralph Nader lmao . I think not . By the way I respect our court of law and since Texas dropped every case from Catch a predator I see it as a good thing because it truly is a show exploiting a serious problem. Let law enforcement do their job . Media should not get involved in law enforcement.
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 312
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/21/2007 11:26:18 AM
Ahze I understand your point and I agree. Be law abiding. For parents raise your children correctly. In this new Showtime series[Californication] one of the main characters has a 16 yr old daughter and he thinks shes the perfect child, meanwhile she had a tryst with David Duchovny, another character in show , whos like 47 or something like that . Bottom line there needs to be communication. I bantered with ARTISTME a bit but I can see his point about his kids. If a ped was doing something to them , I understand his rage to take law into his own hands. I am sure though the law for the most part would sort it all out. I just wish they would give the lady peds the same sentences they give men... You want to talk about unfair.
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 316
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/21/2007 11:58:30 AM
Ahze thats still not fair. If something is against the law , the punishment should be the same for both genders . Women basically can go around molesting boys and get a slap on the wrist , meanwhile a male that does it gets locked up for a minimum of 3 yrs . Something is surely rotten.
 Tossed_Salad
Joined: 6/23/2007
Msg: 317
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/21/2007 1:38:27 PM
I think maybe the most self-righteous (in public!) are often the true abusers, pedophiles..

recall Sen. Craig? railed "AGAINST" homosexuality..

right up until he was caught with his pants down in a men's washroom trying to pick up an undercover cop..

to label anyone who questions your logic as a 'pedophile' as so many of you have done is an hysterical cheap shot.

as if "real" pedophiles would openly proclaim such on a site like this.
 lovableladywanted
Joined: 5/14/2006
Msg: 321
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/22/2007 2:42:00 AM
Tossedsalad you make a lot of sense and I agree. Its usually the people that are supposedly so adamant against pedofilia that are the peds ,like the hardline right wing politicians, the priests, the bible belt for much of early Americana, certain Utah sects etc. Yet someone in this thread blamed the 'liberals' lmao go figure. Its always the liberals fault , as if these people even know the dictionary definition of the word.
 Venari
Joined: 9/4/2007
Msg: 324
view profile
History
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/22/2007 8:06:16 AM
that was such a run on sentance. Oddly enough, i ran out of breath just mentally reading that post. Don't ask me how or why, i did :(
 lie to me
Joined: 9/17/2007
Msg: 340
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/25/2007 12:37:30 AM
Vinny, here in this country, once you've reached a certain age, you are considered an adult - for all intents and purposes. No one is saying you actually ARE an adult - that's your own individual issue - but LEGALLY you are. That's all that's of concern. A 25 year old individual knows the law. The law states 'stay the feck away from minors'. It's very simple. It does not matter how inmature you are, or how mature the minor is. Plain and simple, cut and dried. Leave the minors the feck alone.
 fingsuperwoman
Joined: 5/15/2007
Msg: 363
Sex with minors
Posted: 9/25/2007 9:42:43 PM

.....it's a fu cking internet dating site we are all losers if we wern't we wouldn't be here.

Speak for yourself buddy.
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