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Joined: 10/23/2007
Msg: 3
What is the Nature of Reality?Page 2 of 4    (1, 2, 3, 4)
Negate every statement and the argument is still cogent?
I say unfalsifiable bafflegab.
Joined: 1/12/2008
Msg: 11
What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 2/21/2009 12:56:19 PM

Do you agree with it or disagree with it?

It's a conglomeration of words that means nothing, so there is nothing with which to agree or disagree.
Joined: 12/13/2008
Msg: 13
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 2/22/2009 12:01:39 PM
reality is an illusion caused by the lack of alcohol
Joined: 10/16/2008
Msg: 18
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 2/24/2009 2:22:22 PM
We live in the matrix, our bodies merely vessels for this 3 dimensional experience
Joined: 11/30/2007
Msg: 19
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 2/24/2009 2:51:14 PM

I cannot access that. If it sugeests that minds can somehow move physical objects without the intervention of muscles, however, then it is utter and complete bullshit anyhow.

It's "Non-Invasive Brain-Actuated Control of a Mobile Robot by Human EEG."

It requires the intervention of computers and synthetic muscle analogs.
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 22
What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 3/29/2009 11:44:41 AM
I just posted something on "existence" in another thread, which, if we define "reality" to be "that which exists" seems relevant to this thread. I'd be interested to hear some opinions on the implication that perhaps "reality" only exists as one of a series of probabilities. The following was my comment:

With respect to the multiverse, the only area where I have problems with the "many worlds" version of quantum theory is in the idea of conservation of energy or momentum. I think creating an entire new universe to accomodate a quantum-positional change of a single elementary particle is (intuitively speaking) a pretty expensive proposition with respect to energy (though when dealing with infinities, all bets are off). I think I have found a workaround that makes me more intuitively comfortable though. If we consider the total energy (or essential elementary "stuff" of which the universe is composed) totals "X" (which may be finite or infinite) and that X is conserved, it seems to me that there need only be one universe, whose total "existence" is the sum of all the probabilities of permutations of its configurations. Put another way, the "existence" of any one permutation of the universe is only the PROBABILITY of existing at all. Put yet another way. Nothing exists completely, or existence itself is uncertain and only a probability.

It may feel uncomfortable, but I think somebody could make a good case for the universe not existing at all! At least, not existing in the sense that we usually think of existence (as a certainty, or probability=1).
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 25
What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 3/30/2009 2:26:49 PM
I was about to post that reality might be the wave-functions that have collapsed, but the phenomenon of quantum erasure kinda screws that one up.

Maybe it would be fairer to say that reality is the sum of all possible events, the existence of which is commensurate with their probability of occurrence.

Yeah... I like that... I think I'll stick with it.
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 26
What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 3/30/2009 5:41:44 PM

Reality is a crutch for those people who can't handle their booze and drugs.

I wish I had said that!
How come you get all the good one-liners?
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 32
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 4/17/2009 10:58:17 PM
I like Simone Weil's idea of creation:

God creates by an act of self-delimitation--in other words, because God is conceived as a kind of utter fullness, a perfect being, no creature could exist except where God is not. Thus creation occurres only when God withdraws in part.

This is an original kenosis preceding the corrective kenosis of Christ's incarnation. We are thus born in a sort of damned position not owing to original sin as such, but because to be created at all we have to be precisely what God is not, i.e., we have to be the opposite of what is holy.

If creation is conceived this way as necessarily containing evil within itself, then there is no problem of the entrance of evil into a perfect world. Nor does this constitute a delimitation of God's omnipotence, if it is not that God could not create a perfect world, but that the act which we refer towards by saying "create" in its very essence implies the impossibility of perfection.

However, this notion of the necessity of evil does not mean that we are simply, originally, and continually doomed; on the contrary, Evil is the form which God's mercy takes in this world. Evil, and its consequence, affliction, serve the role of driving us out of ourselves and towards God. The extreme affliction which overtakes human beings does not create human misery, it merely reveals it.

More specifically, affliction drives us to "decreation," which is not death, but rather closer to "extinction" (nirvana) in the Buddhist tradition--the willed dissolution of the subjective ego in attaining realization of the true nature of the universe.

--------------------^^^^Simone Weil------------- vvvvvv Me

To me, this makes reality like a sculpture that God makes by chipping away everything that is not a "thing" and leaving the rest to become some-thing.

The original universe is no-thing. The wholeness and unity that is called holy.

Reality is the All-One becoming outward into infinitely many.

As one of the many, we may only witness this as the infinitely-many surrounding us, no matter where or how we look.

We must pop out of the world, in our minds, to witness the wholeness. This is felt as a spiritual experience of holiness, yet it is as real as the world of the infinitely many.
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 34
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 4/17/2009 11:24:15 PM
If you study physics, and metaphysics, you can realize that the world has no more solidity than a soap bubble......

Pop goes the world.
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 47
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 4/19/2009 8:33:31 PM
I read this 25 years ago and after much study, I think it still applies and is even being corraborated by certain concepts and discoveries in physics. I think it sums up a lot of metaphysical concepts quite nicely without a lot of dogma.

Excerpts from

The Physical Universe as Idea Construction

"Energy is the basis of the universe.

Ideas are mental transformations of energy by an entity into physical reality.

Idea constructions are transformations of ideas into physical reality.

Space is where our own idea constructions do not exist in the physical universe.

The physical body is the material construction of the entity's idea of itself under the properties of matter.

The individual is the part of the entity or whole self of which we are conscious in daily life.

It is that part of the whole self which we are able to express or make "real" through our idea constructions on a physical level.

The subconscious is the threshold of an idea's emergence into the individual conscious mind. It connects the entity and the individual.

Personality is the individual's overall responses to ideas received and constructed.

It represents the emotional coloration of the individual's ideas and constructions at any given "time".

Emotions are the driving force that propel ideas into constructions.

Instinct is the minimum ability for idea constructions necessary for physical survival.

Learning is the potential for constructing new idea complexes from existing ideas.

Idea complexes are groups of ideas formed together like building blocks to form more complicated constructions in physical reality.

Communication is the interchange of ideas by entities on the energy non-physical level.

Action is idea in motion.

The senses are channels of projection by which ideas are projected outward to create the world of appearances.

Environment is the overall idea constructions with which an individual surrounds himself.

Physical time is the apparent lapse between the emergence of an idea in the physical universe (as a construction) and its replacement by another.

The past is the memory of ideas that were but are no longer physical constructions.

The present is the apparent point of any idea's emergence into physical reality.

The future is the apparent lapse between the disappearance of one idea construction and its replacement by another in physical reality.

Psychological time is the apparent lapse between the conception of ideas.

Aging is the effect upon an idea construction of the properties of matter of which the construction is composed.

Growth is the formation of an idea construction toward its fullest possible materialization following the properties of matter.

Sleep is the entity's relative rest from idea construction except the minimum necessary for physical survival.

The physical universe is the sum of individual idea constructions.

Memory is the ghost image of "past" idea constructions.

Each evolutionary change is preceded and caused by a new idea.

As the idea is in the process of being constructed onto the physical plane, it prepares the material world for its own actuality and creates the prerequisite conditions.

Evolution is energy's movement toward conscious expression in the physical universe, but it is basically nonphysical.

A species at any given time is the materialization of the inner images or ideas of its individual members, each of whom forms his own idea constructions.

At no point can we actually say that one construction vanishes and another takes its place, but artificially we adopt certain points as past, present and future, for convenience.

At some point, we agree that the physical construction ceases to be elements of the "past" construction and is already becoming the"next" one.

Though the construction of an idea seems to disappear physically, the idea which it represents still exists.

Sleep is the entity's rest from physical idea construction.

Only enough energy is used to keep the personal image construction in existence.

The entity withdraws into basic energy realms and is comparatively free from time since idea construction is at a minimum level.

The entity is in contact with other entities at a subconscious area.

After death, the entity will have its ghost images (memories) at its command, though their apparent sequence will no longer apply.

Memories are properties of the subconscious energy entity and,as such, are indestructible (though they may be unavailable to the individual under various circumstances).

The next plane of existence will involve further training in energy use and manipulation, since the energy of which the entity is composed is self-generating and always seeking more complicated form and awareness.

Each material particle is an idea construction formed by the individualized bits of energy that compose it.

*Each entity perceives only his own construction on a physical level.

* Because all constructions are more or less faithful reproductions in matter of the same basic ideas (since all individuals are, generally speaking, on the same level in this plane), then they agree sufficiently in space, time and degree so that the world of appearances has coherence and relative predictability.

The Fabric of Physical Matter:

All physical matter is idea construction.

We only see our own constructions.

So-called empty space is full of constructions not our own that we cannot perceive.

Our skin connects us to other physical constructions, and through it we are involved in the complicated fabric of continuous matter.

The action of each one of the most minute of these particles affects each other one.

The slight motion of one grain of sand causes a corresponding alteration in the distribution of the stars and in all matter's fabric, from an atom in a man's skull down to the slightest variation in a microbe's action.

All matter is idea construction, woven together; each construction is individual and yet cohesive to the whole.

The smallest particle is necessary to the whole, forming part of matter's design.

The Universe as a Physical Body:

The matter of the universe can be conceived of as a physical body, an organism of individual cells (objects) held together by connective tissue (the chemicals and elements of air).

This connective tissue is also alive and carries electrical impulses.

Within it, as within the connective tissues of the human body, there is a certain elasticity, a certain amount of regeneration and a constant replacement of the atoms and molecules that compose it.

While the whole retains its shape, the material itself is being constantly born and replaced.

This rough diagram (diagram omitted in this text file) "came" with the above material.
It was supposed to represent the energy of the entity as it flowed outward through the subconscious to the conscious, in order to construct the physical image and environment in response to the self's idea of what it was.
I was involved with the "pure" experience behind the diagram and words
with which I was left.
The revelation was that there were no real boundaries to the self; skin did not separate us from others but connected us in a webwork of energy; what we thought
of as Self and Not-Self were interrelated; and that, in this life at least, ideas were constantly being transformed into matter.
The ability of the entity to transform energy into an idea and then to construct it physically determines the entity's place on the physical evolutionary plane.
Simple organisms are capable of "picking up" fewer communications.
Their range is less, but the vitality and validity of their constructions is excellent.
In simple organisms such as the paramecium and amoeba, the few sharp ideas received are constructed almost simultaneously, without reflection.
The organism needs no other mechanism to translate ideas.
What it has is sufficient.
More complicated organisms - mammals, for example - have need of further mechanisms to construct ideas because they are able to perceive more of them.
Here memory is an element.
Now the organism has a built-in ghost image of past constructions by which to perfect and test new ones.
Reflection of some sort enters into the picture, and with it the organism is given more to do.
Slowly, within its range of receptivity, it is given some choice in the actual construction of ideas into physical reality.
The reflection is brief, but for a moment the animal partakes of a new dimension.
The shadow of time glimmers in his eyes as the still imperfected memory of past constructions lingers in his consciousness.
As yet, memory storage is small, but now the instantaneous construction is no longer instantaneous, in our terms.
There is a pause: the organism - dog or tiger - can choose to attack or not to attack.
The amoeba must construct its small world without reflection and without time as we know it.
Entities with still broader range need more complicated structure.
The scope of their receptivity is so large that the simple autonomic nervous system is not enough.
The amoeba constructs each idea it receives, because it is able to receive so few.
All must be constructed to ensure survival.
With man, the opposite becomes true.
He has such a range of receptivity that it is impossible for him to construct all of his ideas physically.
As his scope is widened, a mechanism was necessary that would allow him to choose.
Self-consciousness and reason were the answers.
Suddenly, time blossomed like a strange flower in his skull.
Before this he was transfixed in the present.
But memory produced another dimension in the animal and man carried it
No longer did memory flicker briefly and disappear, enclosing him in darkness again.
Now it stretched brightly behind him and also stretched out ahead - a road on which he always saw his own changing image.
He learned continuity.
And with his focused memory at his command, man's ego was born, which could follow its own identity through the maze of blazing impulses that beset him, could recognize itself through the pattern of continuing constructions and could separate itself from its action in the physical world.
Here you have the birth of subject and object, the I AM who is the doer and constructor, and the construction itself.
This new dimension enabled the species to manipulate and recognize its own constructions and freed it to focus greater energy in projecting some ideas over others.
In other words, conscious purpose became possible, physically.
Somewhere along the line, however, man began to divorce himself almost completely and artificially from his own constructions.
Hence his groping, his sense of alienation from nature, his search for a Cause or Creator of a creation he no longer recognized as his own."

~ Seth/Jane Roberts
--"Dreams, Evolution & Value Fulfillment"
Vol. 1, Session 891, Notes.2005,
Robert F. Butts.
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 49
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 4/24/2009 6:00:00 AM

"Who is Robert F. Butts?"

He's dead.

In memorium:

I feel the same way about the material as the person who wrote that...

It's completely ok not to "believe" in it. There are way fancier stories about how creation works, and way more logical views of how the universe works. I'm sure you have found one or two that suit you.

The universe that I try to describe is the point at which existence becomes from non-existence. This is the most interesting point, because it is at this point that religion and science converge. It is also the reason esoteric knowledge has limitations of language with which to describe it. Symbolism, archetypes, myths work well for indicating truths that cannot be conceptualized with our language systems. Most descriptions of this part of creation or the beginning of the big bang, or the meaning of life, or whatever, are filled with these things...that's why I like the Seth material for not relying heavily on those.

I agree with Wittgenstein on this...language is inadequate. That is why personal experience is helpful, and even essential. To do some of the things described in the Seth material helps, there are also other forms of mental exercises that are good for this. This is the beginning of knowing.
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 50
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 4/24/2009 3:14:52 PM
Some quotes from David Bohm, Theoretical Physicist:

"The word "reality" is derived from the roots "thing" and "think." "Reality" means "everything you can think about." This is not "that-which-is." No idea can capture "truth" in the sense of that-which-is."

"The ultimate perception does not originate in the brain or any material structure, although a material structure is necessary to manifest it. The subtle mechanism of knowing the truth does not originate in the brain."

"There is a similarity between thought and matter. All matter, including ourselves, is determined by "information." "Information" is what determines space and time."

--These are excerpts from a physics lecture given by Professor David Bohm to students at Berkeley, April, 1977, and another lecture given to professional physicists at Lawrence Berkely Laboratory.

David Joseph Bohm was an American-born quantum physicist who made significant contributions in the fields of theoretical physics, philosophy and neuropsychology, and to the Manhattan Project.

Another quote:

"Description is totally incompatible with what we want to say."

~D. Bohm

I think that the universe is an information medium...

it is, at one level, composed of a substance that is receptive to, reveals and reflects information.

We already know that matter = energy. And energy = matter. With motion (speed) as the main variable relating the two. I think it goes beyond that to being the substance through which consciousness creates its own awareness of itself...."self-awareness"...through action and observation (perception.) Pure creativity.

Time separates created from creator, but time is an illusion/artifact of perception.
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 51
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 12/16/2009 8:44:43 PM
Seth on the Vibratory Nature of Existence

"Now the behavior of atoms and molecules is involved here, for again these are only present within your universe during certain stages.

Their activity is perceived only during the range of particular vibratory rhythms.

When your scientists examine them for example, they do not examine the nature, say, of an atom.

They only explore the characteristics of an atom as it acts or shows itself within your system.

Its greater reality completely escapes them.

You understand that there are spectrums of light.

So are there spectrums of matter.

Your system of physical reality is not dense in comparison with some others.

The dimensions that you give to physical matter barely begin to hint at the varieties of dimensions possible.

Some systems are far heavier or lighter than your own, though this may not involve weight in the terms with which you are familiar.

Probable actions emerge, then, into matter systems quite as valid as your own, and quite as consistent.

You are used to thinking in single line thoughts, so you think of events that you know as complete things or actions, not realizing that what you perceive is but a fraction of their entire multidimensional existence.

In greater terms, it is impossible to separate one physical event from the probable events, for these are all dimensions of one action.

It is basically impossible to separate the "you" that you know from the probable you's of which you are unaware, for the same reasons.

There are always inner pathways, however, leading between probable events; since all of them are manifestations of an act in its becoming, then the dimensions between these are illusions.

The physical brain alone cannot pick up these connections with any great success.

The mind, which is the inner counterpart of the brain, can at times perceive the far greater dimensions of any given event through a burst of sudden intuition or comprehension that cannot be adequately described on a verbal level.

As I have said frequently, time as you think of it does not exist, yet in your terms, time's true nature could be understood if the basic nature of the atom was ever made known to you.

In one way, an atom could be compared to a microsecond.

It seems as if an atom "exists" steadily for a certain amount of time.

Instead it phases in and out, so to speak.

It fluctuates in a highly predictable pattern and rhythm.

It can be perceived within your system only at certain points in this fluctuation, so it seems to scientists that the atom is steadily present.

They are not aware of any gaps of absence as far as the atom is concerned.

In those periods of nonphysical projection, the off periods of fluctuation, the atoms "appear" in another system of reality.

In that system they are perceived in what are "on" points of fluctuation, and in that system also then the atoms (seem to) appear steadily.

There are many such points of fluctuation, but your system of course is not aware of them, nor of the ultimate actions, universes, and systems that exist within them.

Now the same sort of behavior occurs on a deep, basic, secret, and unexplored psychological level.

The physically oriented consciousness, responding to one phase of the atom's activity, comes alive and awake to its particular existence, but in between are other fluctuations in which consciousness is focused upon

entirely different systems of reality; each of these coming awake and responding, and each one having no sense of absence, and memory only of those particular fluctuations to which they respond."

~ Seth, Session 567 (Author, Jane Roberts)
Joined: 4/4/2008
Msg: 52
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 12/16/2009 9:24:57 PM
The nature of reality is:

Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 53
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 9/11/2010 2:18:58 PM
“What we think determines what happens to us, so if we want to change our lives, we need to stretch our minds.”

~ Wayne Dyer

"If you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change."

~ Wayne Dyer

"The most important decision you'll ever make is whether you live in a friendly or a hostile universe."

~ Albert Einstein
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 54
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 9/12/2010 12:22:41 PM
A particle can't create another particle. It comes into existence with each moment, from no-where to now-here.

No where is the "place" where time doesn't exist, (because in essence, it doesn't, it is an effect rather than a cause) and location hasn't happened yet.

So this world is the Now Here; all that is left is Now, and Here is the only place Now can be.

So Being Here Now is all we really CAN be, and that is why people who live in the past, or only live for the future, miss most of what they can experience in being alive.

This is what is called Presence, and being fully present to someone when you are with them is the best gift you can give to anyone; your full attention, because it is all we can truly give of ourselves.

Being present is the antidote to many of the ills of society today. Being real is better than imitating an imitation of something that isn't "Real" to begin with.
Joined: 1/12/2008
Msg: 55
What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 9/13/2010 7:00:33 AM

No where is the "place" where time doesn't exist, (because in essence, it doesn't, it is an effect rather than a cause) and location hasn't happened yet.

Actually, there are such places. In general relativity, time ends at the singularity of a black hole.
Joined: 1/16/2008
Msg: 56
What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 9/13/2010 7:44:01 AM
Actually, Albert Einstein said it best:

"Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one."
Joined: 10/22/2006
Msg: 57
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 9/13/2010 11:47:50 AM
actually in the diamond sutra buddha
said everything and its opposite exist, so i take it to mean reality is

an illusion but also not an illusion at the same time
Joined: 4/1/2010
Msg: 58
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What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 9/14/2010 10:40:25 AM
"I have known many gods. He who denies them is as blind as he who trusts them too deeply. I seek not beyond death. It may be the blackness averred by the Nemedian skeptics, or Crom's realm of ice and cloud, or the snowy plains and vaulted halls of the Nordheimer's Valhalla. I know not, nor do I care. Let me live deep while I live; let me know the rich juices of red meat and stinging wine on my palate, the hot embrace of white arms, the mad exultation of battle when the blue blades flame and crimson, and I am content. Let teachers and philosophers brood over questions of reality and illusion. I know this: if life is illusion, then I am no less an illusion, and being thus, the illusion is real to me. I live, I burn with life, I love, I slay, and am content."

— Robert E. Howard
Joined: 6/25/2006
Msg: 59
What is the Nature of Reality?
Posted: 9/19/2010 10:18:10 PM

Actually, Albert Einstein said it best:

"Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one."

This quote is often horribly misunderstood.

What do you think Einstein means? Do you think he is actually revealing something about reality?

What is the Nature of Reality?

To know itself, obviously... for who is asking the question?
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