Plentyoffish dating forums are a place to meet singles and get dating advice or share dating experiences etc. Hopefully you will all have fun meeting singles and try out this online dating thing... Remember that we are the largest free online dating service, so you will never have to pay a dime to meet your soulmate.
     
Show ALL Forums  > California  > Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 stratoman1
Joined: 9/19/2007
Msg: 39
view profile
History
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?Page 6 of 5    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5)
When I first saw this thread I thought to myself, "Oh another guy just like me, always finding that damsel to rescue and winding up hurt when she doesn't need him any longer or when she seems not to care about what good he has brought to her life."
All the stories are on pages 2 and 3. Seems that I am not alone. Seems that a lot of other people have spent countless hours sorting this out too.

Sock Puppeteer and Dofiagle, I just want to thank both of you for revealing yourselves in such a profound way. Some people think that men are impervious to pain and that we always just get right back up and keep plodding along looking for the next "Pizza". And, it's simply not true. Men do have hearts and they do have souls and they do hurt and they need to be able to heal just like women do. It is sad to me that so many women don't realize this, or at least they claim not to think so. If real women want to know the Hearts of "real" Men, here it is. Right here, in the posts made by you two gentlemen. Thank you for your eloquence and your honesty and your bravery.

It seems that many of us, rescuers and rescued alike, eventually end up with broken wings and as long as that is true, nothing will be right. We learn to walk one step at a time. Learning to walk "again" comes with the constant reminder of all of the falling and scraped knees and elbows one collects along the way.

In some ways we are all learning to walk again.
 MermaidSari
Joined: 2/4/2007
Msg: 40
view profile
History
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 9/11/2008 9:59:26 PM

If real women want to know the Hearts of "real" Men, here it is.


I was about to suggest the renaming of this thread...to the heart of man...but I'm careful not to push the embarssment envelope. <-- U.S. postal worker code

And my dear man -- as far as pizza...don't knock it or be overly offended. With angels there just might be a method to their madness and greater thoughts held.

I'm innocent I tell you--don't shoot!!
 o4
Joined: 4/7/2007
Msg: 41
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 4/25/2009 7:37:00 PM
I was thinking about this thread again Sock.

~ Nope. ~

There ya go.
 The Minister of Dudeness
Joined: 6/11/2006
Msg: 42
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 4/25/2009 8:54:00 PM
o4, ya big chicken.

(Now I'm hanging out here like laundry on clothesline...)
 o4
Joined: 4/7/2007
Msg: 43
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 4/25/2009 9:16:32 PM
Alongside "Running Man", this is one of the best threads that's been on here ever!

But after all this time, it hasn't been out of mind. Was just thinking about it again today. And while I wasn't clear in my own head about this before, I think now that the answer is that we each have to take care of our own wings. Others can "coach and cheer and comfort", but the actual growth starts with the blood that is pumped from the heart of the person themself. I just need to re-re-re-re-learn this lesson time and time again it seems.................
 AceOfSpace
Joined: 5/28/2007
Msg: 44
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/12/2009 12:25:20 PM

... why are you compelled to attempt to rescue? I have thoughts on that. If you are interested in hearing them let me know.


A man's gotta do what a man's gotta do.

Seriously. In my case, it's the 3-year-old who was told to be a good little soldier, who sensed just how precarious his family was and realized that if he didn't fix it, it would never get better.

Just one slight problem with that: a 3-year-old is not equipped to fix a dysfunctional family.

Nevertheless, the need, the yearning for stability, and the drive to get it is never satisfied and can never be. That's what's hard. We're each entitled to a safe, supportive, and secure childhood. At least in theory. When we don't get that, it distorts our emotional development. So yes, I am twisted. The 3-year-old is frozen and can't get past it. Doesn't mean it can't be managed. It means that it has to be managed.

Other capacities develop, but not the one that allowed me to recognize that well-formed adults are consistently competent and caring. I still have to remind myself that they are on a daily basis so that I don't continually offend them. People don't like it when their best qualities go unrecognized.

So how to choose from a twisted-up 3-year-old perspective? Competent and uncaring, or caring and incompetent? After all, when we pick mates, that's usually the perspective we're coming from--the wounded parts, the needy parts, the twisted parts.

Hmmm, uncaring isn't exactly right--more like emotionally incompetent. That puts a bit more clarity on it, says 3-year-old Ace. Glad I checked back in this thread!

Anyway, as soon as I was able get free of the outside trappings, I set myself up to re-enact the same old drama. Seems there are plenty of people out there who can play the part of helpless and/or uncaring.

And those who know me often marvel at how I can be so caring and at times and so emotionally distant at others. The switch from one mode to the other is startling to them. I suppose it would be to me too if I wasn't so used to it. But it's a crappy thing to have had to get used to.

Overachieving as a way to justify one's existence makes for a lonely life. I've been told by competent and caring adults that I really don't have to do that--that my existence is proof of my worthiness to exist, but somehow the kid in me doesn't buy it. Every once in a while, yes, and more often lately. However, there is a difference between working out of a desire to share the abundance of one's bliss and working out of a need to feel accepted and worthy. The former is a blessing for everyone. The latter is what it is.
 RockSteady316
Joined: 8/5/2009
Msg: 45
view profile
History
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/12/2009 4:48:50 PM
Wings heal themselfs through time and deeds. and of course tender loving care, We who have fallen have the best and worst of both worlds. We shine to those who know and are respected by most even if they dont, We can change a life with the wisdom we share, or destroy ones world with words unspoken, This subject is I feel about touching ones soul. and to do that one has to have been touched. Believe me as I share these words for the first time on the information freeway. And as I do Please know I am no saint. Far from it , Thats what its about. Fallen, Broken wings, No wings, does that really matter. No ! Its what were doing about it. To what? Shine ? Get our ticket?
to be respected ? For money? fame? What if I was to tell you You can go Home now. Would you? What if I ask you to stay and Help after you got your pass, knowing full well that you dont know how to or where to even help. Hell but you know as well as I do
"We" always seem to be where we need to be , right? The names you've been called may have been : physic, mesenger, witch, wizard, even fortune teller or profit. Strange
wierd, crazy, lost, not all there.You are not alone. and yes you just maybe all the above. I can share this only for now because as we who have fallen and been at it for who's to say how longKnows . we are here for a reason and there is fear. Soon and those who know will know and stand up to be seen and those they have touched will stand as well. Fear of the unknown ? Well Shine all ye Angels and it will be known The time is near to Show the way home.
With that said ;
I say ;
Untill then
Keep the light
Shinning Bright
 AceOfSpace
Joined: 5/28/2007
Msg: 46
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/12/2009 8:38:31 PM
How many healers does it take to change a light bulb?

Just one, but the light bulb must really want to change.
 MermaidSari
Joined: 2/4/2007
Msg: 47
view profile
History
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/14/2009 10:21:47 AM
^^it's how many 'psychologists' does it take to change a light bulb (never heard healers). :unsure:

People are not band-aids for others...and if we all were being honest, all are less than perfect and there is always 'something' another could do to better one's life. I still think it's better to come together for reasons beyond 'fixing' or being 'fixed.' (unless you are an appliance, mind you). *wink*

Sharing in the joys and sorrows in life is a given when love is perfected...and there is no fear.

I once had a handle on my life -- but it broke off is something that 'we all' feel from time to time in life. If a person is dealing with a 'chronic' issue...we bargain for more when trying to fix something that is long embedded into the other's pychy.

Flying away to get my medication now (they worry about me when I'm off of it...lol). *wink*
 fzrhusker
Joined: 10/8/2005
Msg: 48
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/14/2009 10:30:31 AM
Recognizing that we have these issue is not the same as fixing them, we took years to assume these roles and it make take the rest of our lives to undo it. Momanatrix had the best explanation I have seen yet.
 AceOfSpace
Joined: 5/28/2007
Msg: 49
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/14/2009 9:14:23 PM
... we can choose to lean on the crutch of faulty programming and repeat our mistakes over and over or we can begin the reprogramming process...


Well, we aren't Turing machines. More like growing plants. Prune off a faulty branch and it will try, try, try to grow back. Those old ingrained habits of thought--the unspoken beliefs--need to be kept after and excised whenever they pop up again, but they're deep rooted. In most cases they simply have to be recognized for what they are and dealt with as symptoms. It's hard to do when you're freaking out--even if you know that you're freaking out needlessly.

It was a very bad day when I finally realized that my own warped judgment was the root of my problems. It was also a very good day for a new beginning.

I was in my 30s when my Mom finally gave me some dating advice. She said, "Don't date anyone with more problems than you have." It's very good advice.
 fzrhusker
Joined: 10/8/2005
Msg: 50
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/15/2009 10:18:03 AM
Old one
You are what you think you are.
If you think you are right or wrong you are right either way.
 MermaidSari
Joined: 2/4/2007
Msg: 51
view profile
History
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/15/2009 10:24:34 AM

Recognizing that we have these issue is not the same as fixing them, we took years to assume these roles and it make take the rest of our lives to undo it. Momanatrix had the best explanation I have seen yet.


I like Mom's thoughts as well...much wisdom this lady holds. :-).

FZ -- About your comment though: at what point in our lives do we recognize we are whole, regardless of events and hardships in life? Do you truly consider a life time? Life is 'sooooo' short to hold on to what is not beneficial for us...don't you think? So at what point does healthy 'mourning' over any event turn into 'unhealthy' grief, 'and' is it 'another' that will point this out to us? What about getting fed up?

When my dad was murdered...I had to learn to accept this. It was not a matter of 'healing' or being 'fixed' of my extended period of mourning (twas joking above about needing fixed and trying to be cleaver in my point being made*wink*). Those who helped me the greatest was those who 'loved' me versus 'trying' to fix what was not broken and could not be fixed. I could at that time claim 'brokeness' or take what occured, accept it and recognize all the mourning in the world could not fix what occured. I 'had' no choice but to accept the later 'eventually.' Rescuers bothered me worse than those lacking sympathy during this time. Why? because compassion would hold 'understanding' and with this acceptance (not trying to fix me).

Events occur in life that are individual and unique to each of us and 'alter' our lives (it need not be for the worse though -- unless we ourselves decide this for ourselves). It doesn't mean we require fixing unless we ourselves decide this is the case (with this we would decide that we 'lack' some capability or ability to handle our own life/problems/ or whatever).

I made a thread once asking 'what is normal?' We are all individuals and will cope with things in an unique way. It doesn't mean anyone is broken -- we all just deal with a matter in a unique way. When greater psychoses are apparent -- a person might require professional help versus 'a rescuer.' It's not as simple as feeding a seagull with a broken wing that has difficulty feeding himself (or taking care of basic needs in otherwords if dealing with another's self fullfilling prophecy of 'lacking' abilities to handle one's own life or cope or whatever ails the person).

Emerson's thoughts...as a man thinks so it shall be (or so he shall become). What we 'dwell' upon in thought (whether it's sunsets or death) can consume us and we can loose control if we allow what is bad versus good in life to overcome us.

Being a rescuer myself for the majority of my life -- I had to realize I was getting my own self-worth from other's lives and not my own. It was 'me' that needed rescued. Do I still rescue stray cats and place them in homes...yes. Do I fix people anymore? No. I love them 'as is' and let them be who they are or disassociate myself if I recognize a need for professional help in another (allowing others mental drama to take precedence in one's own life is destructive to both, imo...codependency or an interdependency built on something 'wrong' has never led to a healthy relationship that I've witnessed personally) . We all have our own cross to bear and burdens and with this capabilities and abilities to make sound judgments/decisions that work for 'us' individually. If a person decides to become a basket case or decides they can not work or care for themselves (provided they are able bodied) -- there is a reason for them theirselves. Is it a sound decision to live one's life that way? It's up to them...for me it is not though. For me it is not something I'd coddle anyone over today. I realize I'd hurt more than help to coddle a bad decision.

Sometimes the greatest compassion given is stating -- you require help beyond what you expect or ask from another if you believe yourself incapable. It's maybe then that the person might account for having the capability themselves over their own lives and actually learn they are strong and they are capable and only then in truth will the tears pass.

If you encourge 'incapability' -- you will have someone dependent (and a codependency perhaps formed). Admittedly in my years of rescuing -- I formed my own self-worth this way. I was in err. It's not 'tough' love that I believe in today, but I do believe in other's capabilities to 'fix' themselves and hopefully it not taking a life time to overcome what one is capability of overcoming today....by merely recognizing they can (like the little steam engine that could) overcome anything 'if' they have the will to.

Rambling thoughts on something I have held a lot of experience at 'failing' in (fixing others). *wink*
 fzrhusker
Joined: 10/8/2005
Msg: 52
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/15/2009 10:30:45 AM
Mermaid the only way for me to answer this would be from my dad. He just turned 96 last week and said he learns new stuff about himself everyday.

To me there really is no good answer to this, you have to find what works for you.

Any shrinks here?
 MermaidSari
Joined: 2/4/2007
Msg: 53
view profile
History
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/15/2009 10:51:37 AM
FZ -- I thought you were taking about 'issues.' I must have misinterpreted what you wrote then as far as issues taking a life time to correct.

Good for your dad that he keeps 'growing' at 96.
 fzrhusker
Joined: 10/8/2005
Msg: 54
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/15/2009 11:13:07 AM
No mermaid you are right I do believe we may spend a lifetime trying to correct some of our issues. Other than therapy I don't think we truly have the ability to correct them our self.
One of the best things I ever did for my self was to get far away from the people that crated those issues in me. I still love them but not having daily contact with them let s me grow with out that constant programming while I deprogram myself.

I will admit this, when I go back home all the insecurities seem to come to the surface. Part of that stems from the fact when I go back home people and family still look at me and treat like the person I was 23 years ago when I left.
 fzrhusker
Joined: 10/8/2005
Msg: 55
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/15/2009 2:47:02 PM
I wonder if they affected my spelling too.
 fzrhusker
Joined: 10/8/2005
Msg: 56
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/15/2009 3:41:47 PM
Leaving:
your story sounds like my 2nd wife who bailed on me when we lived in Europe, could not cut mommas apron strings. Momma had her brainwashed.
They best part is my kids all recognize this about the family and all want to come live with me as they turn 18, don't want to be any part of grandmas control paradise.
 AceOfSpace
Joined: 5/28/2007
Msg: 57
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/15/2009 6:22:49 PM
and/or they've got you to worry about their worries.


Or, if they can get you to carry their shame or guilt, then they can run off and play. Parents were supposed to do that for us when we were very young. If they don't, some of us try to find others to make up for that lapse.

Some of us tried to get past that deficit in our development by taking on the role of parent as we imagined it should have been. But without the maturity to understand what parents really did, we got it wrong. We became rescuers, not well-formed adults.
 AceOfSpace
Joined: 5/28/2007
Msg: 58
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 8/15/2009 6:33:56 PM
at what point in our lives do we recognize we are whole, regardless of events and hardships in life?


I don't think it works that way. I think we recognze that the hand we were dealt is the hand we have, and make the choice to play it to the best of our ability. Rock bottom honesty.

We don't expect people who've had a leg amputated to run marathons. The occasional ones who strap on an artifical limb to do it are exceptional. We do expect those who can to strap on a prosthesis and walk. But we don't expect them to grow new legs.

Those of us whose emotional responses have been crippled must recognize that we have a limited reportoire, that we always will, and that we must therefore figure out what assistive devices we can employ to cope before we can excel. That doesn't mean we can't ever excel, but being "whole" just sounds like the same sort of wishful thinking that keeps us in the rescuing game. Temple Grandon will never be "normal."

Some conditions cannot be cured. That doesn't mean they cannot be managed. But for me, the idea that my issues could be "healed" kept me looking for that blessed state of bliss when I could have been enjoying the moments I had for what they were--imperfect and beautiful.
 MermaidSari
Joined: 2/4/2007
Msg: 59
view profile
History
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 9/6/2009 11:35:28 AM
Ace --


at what point in our lives do we recognize we are whole, regardless of events and hardships in life?



I don't think it works that way. I think we recognze that the hand we were dealt is the hand we have, and make the choice to play it to the best of our ability. Rock bottom honesty.


Why and why not take the route in life that works better and is shorter? The hand we are dealt in life can be looked at many ways as well (opportunities/negatively or positively provided we are holding the correct reality and we are honest with ourselves).

Not sure what you mean by rock bottom -- but many quit bad habits before getting to that point and have more to show from this and less suffering/scarring/drama/etc., imo. Call me a blonde if you will (*wink*), but I think life is too short to hold on to what doesn't reflect us as 'whole' and 'overcoming' versus stagnant and lacking.
 GolfCoast
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 60
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 9/6/2009 3:54:26 PM
Lot of words to read so I apologize in advance if I am repeating some other poster, I fell asleep twice and forgot what I read so I'll just give pull out the driver, tee it high and share.

I think it has become conventional wisdom that people must heal themselves first, love themselves first, blah blah, before they can, or should try being with another. Excuse me for suggesting that sounds like a full employment act for mental health professionals.

Can an event change a person for better or worse? Certainly an event can. If you haven't seen it happen, or had it happen, hold on tight because it will eventually.

So if an event can, could a person not change you? Could a person not provide an insight, provide a door or window not previously available that changes everything?

Although I seldom follow my own advice, I'm reasonably convinced humans were not meant to live alone, that underneath all our actions is a search for "the other", that missing element that completes us. The amount of alienation most of the single people I meet wrestle with compared to coupled people is almost enough by itself.
 MermaidSari
Joined: 2/4/2007
Msg: 61
view profile
History
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 9/6/2009 6:55:27 PM
Golf -- have you ever thought though it is what people obsess or dwell on in thought...that matters to them personally (yet it's not the reality that others might see for them). Take famous/the wealthy, etc. people who are terribly miserable. Others might see their lives differently and do (some even envy them).

So in thought...and for example if someone wants a Mercedes and believes the Mercedes will change their life...something is missing.

The same is true of the single person who thinks a mate will 'fix' their whatever is ... again something missing. When married you have a partner in whatever is the 'same' about you. You, yourself are the same person (whether broken or whole). You bring another into whatever exists...much like buying a car...people are 'as is.'

Heros and villians exist in movies...such as the damsel in distress actually being rescued (yet all of us women have our fantasies just like you men...sweep me away and allow me to live a life of luxury traveling and living in a mansion).

In real life, people are where they 'want' to be. Struggling and trying to obtain something believed to be 'missing' is not the same as 'truly' loving another (imo)...albeit I agree nobody was meant to be alone and we are social creatures.

What about all the millions of miserable marriages. So having another is not the 'get all' of life for many (abeit it might be for those who obsess on this and believe it will fix everything for them, that is 'for a while.') It's why so many marriages fail (it's all that sciencetology guy and his 'you complete me' line in a movie. lol [joking]). Prayfully we are still growing whether married or single and not reliant on anything/anyone else to recognize our worth as people.

To sum up this whole mess about rescuing others: healthy people create healthy relationships...the truth can be said of the opposite.

That is my story and I'm sticking to it. Is this what the topic is about anyway? Sorry if we took a deter in some other direction (maybe a sand trap)? :-p
 GolfCoast
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 62
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 9/6/2009 7:07:41 PM
There are no guarantees. There are no formulas. There no two people alike. No two situations are alike. Material possessions are not people.

So for example when they take these therapy dogs to a hospital, do the people become warmer, happier, does something brighten in them? Do pets in general give people purpose and happiness?

Why then would one imagine close human bonds of a romantic nature not do this and more?

Now if you're asking me about probabilities that's quite a different argument. I once waded into the ocean of mankinds souls and did not get the bottom of my shoes wet. But the basic premise remains, what can break a heart, can quite likely heal a heart. Unless of course one is invested in the current state.
 AceOfSpace
Joined: 5/28/2007
Msg: 63
Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?
Posted: 9/7/2009 5:39:21 PM
Why then would one imagine close human bonds of a romantic nature not do this and more?


There are many cliches that true. That's why they get repeated often enough to become truisms. The problem with seeking out another person for relief is that there is a tendency to unconsciously pick people with whom we can repeat our dysfunctional patterns of relating. Some people have the same unhappy relationships over and over and over again--only the faces of their partners change.

The odds of developing a better relationship are much higher for people take a litle time to step back, critically assess their own part in their unhappiness, and figure out how they can do better in future.
Show ALL Forums  > California  > Can an Angel With a Broken Wing Ever Fly?