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 2hi-iq-4u
Joined: 5/29/2009
Msg: 86
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?Page 3 of 8    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8)
Why was her Scripture on Fornication seen as off topic? Don't you understand that Fornication is ANY sex outside of marriage except sex within marriage of same sex ties or marriages to animals also applies as fornication. .

You might want to read the whole thread instead of cherry-picking. My complaint was not directed at her posting "off-topic." It was the assertion that the word pornea in Greek, had the same definition 2000 years ago. My claim is that she and you are making an "exclusivity of truth" claim on the intended meaning of the word, and aseerting an "exclusivity of truth" claim that the word "fornication" is the correct translation of the word "pornea."

Many people contributed on that discussion, and though not conclusive, agreed that there is a discrepancy in the meaning. You simply preach your own meaning of a word defined in a dictionary that doesn't exist. Ancient Greek died more than a thousand years ago.

Preaching and exclusivity of truth are in violation of the rules. If you would like to join the discussion, be prepared to know of what others on the thread have said.
 2hi-iq-4u
Joined: 5/29/2009
Msg: 87
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/8/2009 1:44:20 PM
They just want to get laid with someone other than their wife or husband and will say or do anything to justify doing that. .


How would you know what they want? Are you a mind reader? Did they teach you how at your church? I would like to go to a church that could teach that. You could surely convince the heathens of miracles with those "works." Maybe they want you to know the truth, and liberate you from the lies of the church. More people would pay attention to the "truth" if they knew how to pick out the lies. Sex is a great way to get "MEN" interested in scripture. When you understand the extent of the mistranslation, you might feel differently, but I doubt that anyone of your extremely blindfolded faith based perspective would ever pick up a "heretical" work such as Plato, Socrates, or Aristotle, and consider the word "Porneai" (sp) in its non religious context. You are too busy waxing the brainwash.

They just want to get laid with someone other than their wife or husband and will say or do anything to justify doing that. .


At least they aren't going after the altar boys. (the actual meaning of Porneos, if my translations serve me well)
 kissmekindsir
Joined: 11/16/2008
Msg: 88
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/13/2009 12:10:08 PM
This should be evident that in the Laws of Moses sex was supposed to be for marriage only:

Exodus 22:16 (New International Reader's Version)

[ Laws About Social Problems ] "Suppose a man meets a virgin who is not engaged. And he talks her into having sex with him. Then he must pay her father the price for a bride. And he must get married to her.

And I'm only being Zealous, NOT stating absolutes but quoting scripture that pertains to the Argument!
 2hi-iq-4u
Joined: 5/29/2009
Msg: 89
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/13/2009 5:07:26 PM

the Laws of Moses sex was supposed to be for marriage only:


Have you read any of the other Laws of Moses, and do you obey those as well?

Shall an iota pass from the law, or do you keep ony the ones which suit you? I could probably find one or two on how to women that you will simply adore.
 2hi-iq-4u
Joined: 5/29/2009
Msg: 90
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/13/2009 5:46:24 PM
Oops, how to "treat women."

Suppose a man meets a virgin who is not engaged. And he talks her into having sex with him. Then he must pay her father the price for a bride. And he must get married to her.



By the way, this is the only verse mentioned regarding premarital sex which has any real credibility, and we have discussed it before.

So to recap, if you have sex with a virgin, you should marry her. Are there any virgins out there? In historical context, the laws of Moses made a lot of "common sense." I doubt that many "christian women" appreciate how they fit in today. Suppose you were the girl child sold into slavery? It was your father's right to do so under the Law of Moses. Do you suppose that under the "Inerrant word of God" there might be a few laws that wouldn't treat people as kindly as Jesus suggested? What did he really suggest? Love thy neighbor?

Welcome to my neighborhood. Won't you be my neighbor? Are you my neighbor? Who is my neighbor? So many people just seem to be near dwellers, and ne'er do well.
 lovinvixen
Joined: 9/10/2008
Msg: 91
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/14/2009 12:42:11 PM
Evidently in Judaism it was understood the spritual path of Chasity for it's wrote in Ruth the following from her future husband's comments to her:

Ruth 3:10-11 And he said, Blessed be thou of the LORD, my daughter: for thou hast shewed more kindness in the latter end than at the beginning, inasmuch as thou followedst not young men, whether poor or rich. And now, my daughter, fear not; I will do to thee all that thou requirest: for all the city of my people doth know that thou art a virtuous woman.

This DOES NOT glorify any promiscuios behavior *IF* this is one of the precepts within Judaism!
 2hi-iq-4u
Joined: 5/29/2009
Msg: 92
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/14/2009 7:17:24 PM
This DOES NOT glorify any promiscuios behavior *IF* this is one of the precepts within Judaism


Nor does it mention chastity, but you can surely create the illusion, or make an assumption that it does. You play tricks on your own mind. I will read the actual text. "Following after young men" could mean going to war, just as easily as it could mean promiscuity. If you want to show something, how about showing us direct references, and not beating around a bush? That is the problem with many preachers. They put the cart before the horse, and tell you that the verse means something before they quote it; whereas this simple direct quotation of Jesus pertains exactly to the same action of the typical preacher:"Beware the leaven of the Pharisees."

Jesus specifically tells you not to look at the making of bread, but to look for the curruption in the "verse" and "law," and to ignore or "beware" the speaker if they exceed the textual reference. Since the "textual" reference has been corrupted by 2000 years of poor translation, it is pretty easy to ignore the whole thing. You must become the "living word" and forsake the dead(word). To become the living word, you must learn the parables, riddles, and stories which Jesus spoke, and ignore the "embellishments" of the Preachers.

While Chastity is indeed a virtue, it is not the entirety of virtue. For a young girl to believe that she can reach the Noble stature of Ruth by simply remaining chaste is almost heresy. To "dumb down" the verse to that level creates allowances and pressures for gender bias. Virtue is something everyone shoud strive for, and mere chastity is no substitute.
 kissmekindsir
Joined: 11/16/2008
Msg: 93
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/15/2009 4:13:12 PM

..."Following after young men" could mean going to war, just as easily as it could mean promiscuity.


WHAT!!!!!!!!!!

Women went to war, as you say it possibly could mean that! REALLY I doubt there were any Zena, Warrior Princesses as the feminists would love. Where did you find the documentation for such a hypothesis that Ruth may have went to war?

The Point she is making is about chasity, and your right about virginity alone isn't nessasarily virtue, many christian wives whom were virgins til marriage latter became the worst kind of whore as they use their sexuality to get favours from their husband!

Ruth has been an icon in Judaism for generations; I doubt this scripture is pertaining to anything but being the 'true woman by God's design', including sexuality!
 2hi-iq-4u
Joined: 5/29/2009
Msg: 94
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/15/2009 4:27:25 PM
Women went to war, as you say it possibly could mean that! REALLY I doubt there were any Zena, Warrior Princesses as the feminists would love. Where did you find the documentation for such a hypothesis that Ruth may have went to war?


Something tells me you don't know how men went to war in those days. A troupe of women followed behind. The "rich young men" led, and the poor took orders, but the strong young men of the poor sought their fortunes with their strength at their young ages. They weren't a bunch of softies like the 'gamers' of today.

Stories make more sense when held within their contemporaneous references. The young men were more likely seeking glory on the battelfield than in a whore's tent. Yet I alone shall battle the heathen trolls for you my fair maiden. I shall stand and defend your honor from the wicked Atheists in this land of meager fishes. We shall truly see the nature of Ruth when I reveal the secret of the text. The land shall rejoice in the knowledge of THE LORD, and shun the worshippers of Ba'al forever more!

I might be a little agressive, but I am not Ruth-less.
 2hi-iq-4u
Joined: 5/29/2009
Msg: 95
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/15/2009 5:07:28 PM
Ruth, Chapter 1

"Elimelech, Naomi's husband, died, and she and her two sons were left.
These married Moabite women: one was called Orpah and the other Ruth. They lived there for about ten years. "

Ruth was married for ten years at the opening of the first chapter. Do we assume that her vows were never consecrated? I am sorry, we can't assume that. Without consecration, there is no "right of redemption."

Chapter 2

"Ruth the Moabitess said to Naomi, 'Let me go into the fields and glean ears of corn in the footsteps of some man who will look on me with favour.' She replied, 'Go, daughter.'

Wonder what favor she was seeking?

She was to be married in a few more verses. Do you think she just layed at his feet under the cloak before he sent her away? Hmmm?

Is it ok then, that I should just have women who lay under my cloak? Is this how they set an example of Chastity? Can I join your church?
 kissmekindsir
Joined: 11/16/2008
Msg: 96
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/17/2009 11:26:06 AM

She was to be married in a few more verses. Do you think she just layed at his feet under the cloak before he sent her away? Hmmm?


Yep, that is what it says. You fail to understand this was a custom of the Israelites at the time. She was showing she was interested and willing to become his wife, and laying at his feet was symbolic of her humility and letting him rule over her as a true husband.

Sex did not happen according to scripture that night. Ruth is not a Jewish mentor of womanhood nor did she have the past of rahab, she had been a wife til her Jewish husband died til Boaz became her new husband.


Trouble is there are so many children born from tramps in this hemisphere contrasted to the Judeo-Christian tradition that they automatically think everyone else thru history had to be a tramp too!
 2hi-iq-4u
Joined: 5/29/2009
Msg: 97
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/17/2009 1:44:21 PM
Sex did not happen according to scripture that night.


Like I said. She laid "under his cloak" not just at his feet. I think you misinterpret the meaning, but I might have to ask a Rabbi, or Scorpio in his place.

Anyway, I still want to join the Church where laying under my cloak is a symbol of a young ladies chastity. I might even give her a few sacks of flour to lug home to mama.

The whole story kind of reminds me of my wife. She laid under my cloak one night, and we rarely parted for some time after that. I gave her a few sacks of flour, and then she "went to God."
 susan_cd
Joined: 5/16/2007
Msg: 98
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/24/2009 3:21:53 PM

Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?


Aren't we supposed to go forth & multiply?
 VVendy
Joined: 6/7/2008
Msg: 99
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/28/2009 8:43:44 PM


So to recap, if you have sex with a virgin, you should marry her. Are there any virgins out there?
never married.

If a father sold his child, his child would have a place with some one who had enough to buy her/him. Times were hard and there was no reliable birth control. Israel did not do child sacrifice so the kid could not be given to one of the "gods" like yellow black and olive kids, they could not be given to the woods or the winds like white and red kids were. What do you do with the extras? Remember that most slaves came to the door of the house they wanted to be the slave to and asked to be a slave please and pierced their ear by stabbing it into the door post of the house they want to be slaves in. If you were a female would you rather be in a country were you could own property, get educated, expect justice, like a woman in Isreal or a place were you could be raped anytime day or night beaten in pubic or killed for the fun of the ruler or idol as was common in the rest of the world. Egypt had some protections for women and a few other tribes.

Back to the topic
Sex is for a husband and his wife as long as they both live. Any other sex is not constructive it is destructive and may cause death. HPV, HIV, AIDS, vHep, GW, TSS....to name a few. The wage of sin is death. If people did not have sex outside of marriage none of the afore mention sicknesses would be. TSS comes from objects Ashtorth worship is believed by some to have morphed the virus into the present deadly form.
 daveincarson
Joined: 1/15/2008
Msg: 100
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/30/2009 12:56:55 AM
haha.. sooo kissmekindsir and lovinvixen are you telling me the two of you are actually virgins??? I find that very hard to believe.. especially having talked to both of you before.

If you are, then you are indeed a very rare and genuine catch for any man.

I've only known two virgins over 26.. One was over 300lbs and the other was absolutely georgous, but a very, very dedicated Christian.

I guess I'm asking you both outright, are you virgins?
 susan_cd
Joined: 5/16/2007
Msg: 101
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 7/31/2009 1:52:22 AM
I re-read the actual title of the thread, what is meant by the word "resticted", rather than prohibited?

I guess that means pre-maritalsex is resticted to people that aren't married.

But since King Solomon supposedly had 700 wives & 300 concubines then pre-marital sex among other peole probably balanced out.


And if pre-maritalsex is a big no-no, who married Adam & Eve? If God did, who were the witnesses?
 heartofsnow
Joined: 6/18/2009
Msg: 102
view profile
History
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 8/4/2009 7:33:57 PM
it says fornication is a sin repeatedly. look up fornication. it means sex outside of marriage, and always has. there is much more to point to this, but case closed.
 heartofsnow
Joined: 6/18/2009
Msg: 103
view profile
History
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 8/4/2009 7:36:24 PM
sex = marriage in the bible as well. it is a lifelong spiritual bond in itself, whether you want it to be or not. that it one reason. it should be in love and commitment. sin is why Christ died. Solomon was not to do what he did as well, sigh, not all the people in the Bible were perfect by any means, nor are we. God is:).
 susan_cd
Joined: 5/16/2007
Msg: 104
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 8/5/2009 11:42:52 AM

it says fornication is a sin repeatedly. look up fornication. it means sex outside of marriage, and always has. there is much more to point to this, but case closed.


Case closed? I don't remember anyone apointing you judge ( judge not lest ye be judged)...

Here's the dictionary definition:


fornication  /ˌfɔrnɪˈkeɪʃən/
–noun 1. voluntary sexual intercourse between two unmarried persons or two persons not married to each other.
2. Bible. idolatry.


So by that definition ( voluntary sexual intercourse) I guess oral and anal sex are OK between unmarried persons.
 susan_cd
Joined: 5/16/2007
Msg: 105
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 8/5/2009 11:44:51 AM

sin is why Christ died.


Didn't he die because god created a bunch of faulty humans then blamed them for his mistake? If he's omnipotent he'd know Adam & Eve would eat the forbidden fruit so why place it there/
 lovinvixen
Joined: 9/10/2008
Msg: 106
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 8/5/2009 2:20:46 PM
Not just any man, there are many males whom are the sons of tramps in the good ole U.S.A., but the facts of so many legalizing brothels tells us all how many men there really are!

Praise God the more righteous and dignified beat us in Naum, and soon Armagadeon will give a bitter taste to the sons of blatant whores on this continent whom do not seem to even get it!

Prostitution doesn't run rampant in Asia and those of Islam; they unlike our meagar males beleive in something!
 daveincarson
Joined: 1/15/2008
Msg: 107
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 8/6/2009 12:40:15 AM
Sooooo... your NOT a virgin?
 kissmekindsir
Joined: 11/16/2008
Msg: 108
textual support?
Posted: 8/7/2009 12:09:01 PM
As all my female relatives say 'good sexuality comes from a positive relationship that keeps building.......the rest is learned and communicted to the other, sex that is'. Most of the time our genitals work with the other, but 'good sex' as you say is WAYYY TOOOO emphasized in that everything else in the marriage may be going wrong and who is stupid enough to think sex alone will keep two together.

The trouble I have with most from Hugh Hefner's crazy state and the state I live in that has the audacity to legalize brothels is most males don't have a clue how to communicate, they just look for a Barbie doll to poke.....Really Losers you know!
 susan_cd
Joined: 5/16/2007
Msg: 109
textual support?
Posted: 8/8/2009 11:45:57 PM

and the state I live in that has the audacity to legalize brothels is most males don't have a clue how to communicate, they just look for a Barbie doll to poke.....Really Losers you know!


What, they only legalized brothels that employ women to "service" men? Is it still illegal to have brothels with men employees there to "service" women? That'd be a very sexist law.

And what about women that want a woman brothel employee to service them?


... or are you suggesting that women don't occasionally want some no strings attached sex ??
 susan_cd
Joined: 5/16/2007
Msg: 110
Where does it say - in the Bible - that pre-marital sex is restricted?
Posted: 8/8/2009 11:49:11 PM

Prostitution doesn't run rampant in Asia and those of Islam



How much traveling have you done in Asia? Thailand is part of Asia, prostitution is very common there ( and in Japan, also part of Asia).
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