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 membrane
Joined: 8/12/2008
Msg: 72
Aliens and evolutionPage 4 of 4    (1, 2, 3, 4)
considering the size of the cosmos, i see the exsistance of aleans inevatable, and as to the idea of being humoniod like creaters elce where in the cosmos, i see this also to be highly probible, its called convergent evolution.. like how dolfins are simalar to sharks, but come totaly difrent branches of the evolutionary tree.. think about it, the humanoid structure is the almost perfect adaption to almost every enviroment... we walk upright, see 3rd dimentonaly, are able to manipulate or suroundings... to me, it just seem inevatable
 membrane
Joined: 8/12/2008
Msg: 74
Aliens and evolution
Posted: 7/13/2009 8:43:37 PM
good point... ive never heard of that equasion before... but it makes sence, but how long ago was the big bang? soo said science?... and what if....


well when looking back, human life, as the homo sapien is relatively new to the planet... the jump from animal to man happend soo fast, when looking at the time line of the planet... how many planets do they believe are capable of suporting life, do they only consider the ones equal distance from the sun as earth.. or do they take thicker atmopher and warm innar planet dynamics... can planet be warmer or colder within, or are then all simalar? and of those planets, wich ones do they think actually support life... i heard a theroy once that said life did not just spontaniously come to exsistance on earth... that a comet or astoriod brought basic life here, bring fungus, virus, bactreal, and single celled plant and animal life, and from that life evolved... but who knows for sure... but i allways thought if that wher soo, that it would have arrived from somewhere, evenif that planet was destoid sent peaces of itself threw the cosmos, that wouldent little rocks of life be raining down up many planets capable of suporting life, thus making the lickly hood of more life out there much higher, thus making complex life more probile.. and given enuf time, possibly intelegent life... true you say that we might be the visiter, considering how far we have come, but at the same time... couldent the chance be equal on the other side?
 Jiperly
Joined: 8/30/2006
Msg: 75
Aliens and evolution
Posted: 7/13/2009 10:31:54 PM
Yer just full of questions, ain't cha?

>>>ive never heard of that equasion before

The Drake Equation takes variables, like distance from the sun, age of the solar system, ect, to predict the chances of alien life in the universe, using the claim that, since the numbers are so huge, that its pretty much mandatory.

That been said, I personally oppose the Drake Equation based on the fact that all the numbers and varibles are made up- you can say that you have a 1 in 5 chance that a planet will have an atmosphere, or you can say it has a 1 in 5 Hundred Trillion chance, and neither would be closer to the truth, because we simply don't know the stats- so in reality, the Drake Equation is mental masturbation, where we invent likelihoods to reach our conclusions.

>>>but how long ago was the big bang? soo said science?

According to our observations of the Universe, the the Universe is approx. 14 Billion years old. And before you ask, Earth and our Solar System is approx 5 Billion, and life is approx 4 Billion. And if you wish to challenge these facts, by all means- but I do not believe you hold any new information that would bring doubt to the method we used to discover these facts

>>>the jump from animal to man happend soo fast, when looking at the time line of the planet...

If Life was represented on a 24 Hour clock, for the first six hours, Earth would only be inhabited by single celled organisms. In 1/10 of one second before midnight, humanity appeared on the scene.

And you wonder why I think its arrogant to assume the universe has other creatures like us when we appear to be such a hick-up on our own planet.....

>>>how many planets do they believe are capable of suporting life, do they only consider the ones equal distance from the sun as earth

Depends on who "they" are, but the fact remains that, from all our observations, we've yet to find a single planet that can besides Earth.

>>>can planet be warmer or colder within, or are then all simalar?

Nope- our solar system is an excellent example of that- Mercury has no atmosphere, and as of such the dark side is void and cold as space, while the sunny side is scorched. Venus, on the other hand, has too much atmosphere, and has created a green house effect, causing the planet to be amongst the hottest in our solar system, with acid raining from the sky- Mars doesn't have an electromagnetic shield, causing it to be blasted by solar radiation- Jupiter, Saturn, Neptune and Uranus are all too large, and any of their moons are undoubtedly blasted by radiation from these planets. It seems that every planet we discover has its own ticks- Uranus, for example, is actually on its side.

>>> evenif that planet was destoid sent peaces of itself threw the cosmos

Thats unlikely- life on Earth wouldn't survive such a journey, so I doubt alien life would equally survive, even if it could break out of our suns gravitational pull- and even then, it would coast through space for literally billions of years, with limited resources, only to burn up in some planets atmosphere- it would literally be the most perfect form of life to survive all that. The likelihood is completely off the charts.

Not to mention, again, that doesn't answer any actual questions- it merely exists to divert answers.
 scorpiomover
Joined: 4/19/2007
Msg: 76
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Aliens and evolution
Posted: 7/14/2009 6:45:07 PM
RE Msg: 76 by Jiperly:
The Drake Equation takes variables, like distance from the sun, age of the solar system, ect, to predict the chances of alien life in the universe, using the claim that, since the numbers are so huge, that its pretty much mandatory.

That been said, I personally oppose the Drake Equation based on the fact that all the numbers and varibles are made up- you can say that you have a 1 in 5 chance that a planet will have an atmosphere, or you can say it has a 1 in 5 Hundred Trillion chance, and neither would be closer to the truth, because we simply don't know the stats- so in reality, the Drake Equation is mental masturbation, where we invent likelihoods to reach our conclusions.
Don't forget that the Drake Equation just multiplies those numbers together. You can only do that in probability, when you know that all those factors are completely independent, and are all constant, requiring uniform behaviour over time as well, for all those factors. One of those constants, the number of stars in the galaxy, has been updated now, to be an integral, divided by the age of the galaxy you are talking about, because star formation is not constant over time. But if we were trying to make a reasonable estimate, we'd have to chuck the Drake Equation out entirely, because it makes sooo many assumptions, that even our common sense tells us cannot be right, like that all stars have the same probability to form planets that have the potential to produce life.

If Life was represented on a 24 Hour clock, for the first six hours, Earth would only be inhabited by single celled organisms. In 1/10 of one second before midnight, humanity appeared on the scene.

And you wonder why I think its arrogant to assume the universe has other creatures like us when we appear to be such a hick-up on our own planet.....
Can I just say: I agree?

>>> evenif that planet was destoid sent peaces of itself threw the cosmos

Thats unlikely- life on Earth wouldn't survive such a journey, so I doubt alien life would equally survive, even if it could break out of our suns gravitational pull- and even then, it would coast through space for literally billions of years, with limited resources, only to burn up in some planets atmosphere- it would literally be the most perfect form of life to survive all that. The likelihood is completely off the charts.
If the Earth exploded, then not only would the force probably heat up the planet to an extent that nothing would survive, but that the acceleration of each part would probably crush every living thing on it to death, and the pieces would not have a Van Allen belt, so they'd be subject to killer Cosmic Radiation, and they almost certainly would have no atmosphere to speak of, so nothing could breathe. Oh, and because they'd be far from a star, and the nearest star is a few light-years away, the temperature would drop so low, that nothing would survive.

The only things that could survive that, would be species that could survive extreme heat, extreme pressure, an atmosphere, no atmosphere, unbelievable cold, and cosmic radiation. Anything that could survive all that, wouldn't even need an Earth to survive at all. They could be launched into outer space well before the planet blew up, and just travel through space on their own. So they'd have spread across the cosmos already.
 scorpiomover
Joined: 4/19/2007
Msg: 79
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History
Aliens and evolution
Posted: 7/15/2009 8:58:44 AM
RE Msg: 79 by greg14229:
In my humble opinion, i feel that we are a precocious race. I think we developed earlier than most evolutionary processes would have allowed in the time we have had. I cant remember the name of the equation, but there is another equation that estimates how much time it would take for intelligent life to form after the earth formed. Based on this, we were early. Of course that is only an estimate. But as i've said before, the first time a species from another planet pays a visit...i think that species will be us.
I'm personally not too sure of this. That would be a bit too much like claiming that the Bible is right in saying that we humans are special in the universe.

But you could be right.

However, unless we get a more efficient system of working together towards common goals that help all of humanity, then I think it's going to be a very long time until we start visiting enough other planets, that we find intelligent life on other planet.
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