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Show ALL Forums  > British Columbia  > Legalization of Marijuana.      Home login  
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 Dr. Gazebo
Joined: 3/24/2008
Msg: 101
Legalization of Marijuana.Page 5 of 8    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8)
I having worked with children youths and adults as a counsellor for the last forty years. I have seen the damage it does ..

Uh, thats a negative there social worker. This is the problem, your ideas are based on anecdotes, not research. I presume you are a Stephen Harper disciple. Stephen is TOUGH ON CRIME>>>TOUGH ON DRUGS...

Seems like straight people are always getting TOUGH on something.
 SoLongThanksForAllTheFish
Joined: 6/14/2007
Msg: 102
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 1/29/2010 11:13:59 PM
Actually it was on the CBC.


Not just the CBC. A group of doctors & scientists did a serious study on a wide range of drugs a few years back and wrote it all up for The Lancet. The BBC did a documentary based on their results, and doubtless the paper got picked up by a lot of other news media as well. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if every serious result quoted here points back to that one survey ultimately.

Among a bunch of interesting and counter-intuitive things they reported on, they were unanimous in concluding that marijuana is considerably more dangerous than most people think. Going from memory, what I remember of their specific points was: it rated #10 out of 20 for risk, above LSD and ecstasy. People think it's harmless because nobody dies from it, but in contrast to other drugs it has wide-ranging, non-specific and enduring effects on brain chemistry. Whether it causes schizophrenia is arguable at best (read: probably not), but the evidence for it causing paranoia is much more solid. There might well be lots of other ways in which it causes inobvious neurological conditions. It's quite different that way compared to something like ritalin, which has effects that are easy to trace and measure.

Perhaps that tendency to cause paranoia explains the large number of people around here with crazy conspiracy theories.

Anyone remotely interested in the subject should look up the study. The drugs they rated most dangerous (again, going from memory) were cocaine and heroin - no surprise. I believe alcohol clocked in at #3, though, and tobacco somewhere around #5 or #7. That just for fun and information's sake...

P.S. Found a few blogs which summarized the Lancet study. This one's good because it also has a link to the BBC documentary:

http://ironwolf.dangerousgames.com/blog/archives/458

Looks like a couple of the small details I tried to remember were a bit off - marijuana is #11, not #10. Anyway, the basic gist is right: they rate it less dangerous than alcohol and tobacco but absolutely clearly NOT harmless.
 velopedian
Joined: 11/4/2009
Msg: 103
view profile
History
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 1/29/2010 11:59:03 PM

Why would we legalize such a dangerous drug?

why is alcohol legal? why is tobacco legal? they are both much more dangerous.

for one thing, prohibition doesn't work. there are only three groups that profit from prohibition... criminals, lawyers and guys building new prisons. all of which are a severe drain on our tax dollars.

first- keep it away from kids.
second- educate people about the effects, without resorting to hysteria.
third- regulate and tax the hell out of it the same way we regulate and tax tobacco and alcohol.
 ritawayward
Joined: 4/17/2007
Msg: 104
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 1/30/2010 7:02:18 AM
^^^^ What HE said! And thanks for the congrats on quitting tobacco for over twenty years! ditto to you!

And thank you BE for the info about that doc airing again and where it can be found online. I was very disapointed to miss it on Thursday night so now I can still catch it and that is good news.
 literallydreaming
Joined: 12/7/2009
Msg: 105
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 1/30/2010 2:53:47 PM

The latest research on Marijuana indicates the young pot smokers have ah higher risk of paranoid schizophrenia.


No, the latest research says that those predisposed to schizophrenia are more likely to smoke pot...hence the reason unqualified journalists with no scientific training shouldn't report of science--they don't even know the difference between correlation and causation



Also research shows that one Marijuana cigaret does as much damage as twenty tobacco cigarets.


1-CIGARETTE
2-That study compared UNTREATED (as in not the usual tobacco, which has been treated with everything from cyanide to ammonia) tobacco in a filtered cigarette to an unfiltered marijuana joint---and the "study" actually said 4 times per weight, but nutters have expanded every year almost until it became TWENTY TIMES , oh my god, protect the children


Research also shows that it does damage to the brains of children and youth not to mention depression in adults.


Yea, and drinking as a child does absolutely nothing...talking about underage drug use is a complete non sequitor

And again, correlation versus causation---

People who do extreme sports are more likely to commit suicide--I say we ban skydiving
 literallydreaming
Joined: 12/7/2009
Msg: 106
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 1/30/2010 2:59:46 PM

Spain apparently legalized pot many years ago. They have since had a 20% increase in youth usage


You do realize that most of the worlds usage grew by a similar proportion over the same time period.

Comparing countries that have fully decriminalized weed (like the Netherlands) have lower youth use rates, lower hard drug use rates, and lower levels of alcoholism...and more importantly their rate of increase relative to other countires has been far lower

Prohibition let organized crime get a huge foothold in North America---and drug prohibition is just making it worse
 mcalgary
Joined: 11/10/2009
Msg: 107
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History
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/2/2010 7:12:51 AM

Comparing countries that have fully decriminalized weed (like the Netherlands) have lower youth use rates, lower hard drug use rates, and lower levels of alcoholism...and more importantly their rate of increase relative to other countires has been far lower


While this may be true, the Netherlands does not rely on the United States for about 80% of it's exports and have millions upon millions of people, trucks and goods crossing over it's border with them everyday.
The US will not legalize pot and would put as through hell trying to cross the border if we did so we cannot. It is simple economics. Our economy would go to hell and the criminal element would still remain with the exporting of pot to the US (as most of what is grown here is exported there already).

The decriminalization of pot was a good thing and that is as far as we needed to go till the US is ready.
 Gibson67
Joined: 7/24/2006
Msg: 108
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/2/2010 8:49:18 AM
Ok Id like to know why you think Cannibas should be illegal..Do you know that Cannabis resin kills cancer cells and yes cures cancer?..Go to youtube and put in "Run From The Cure" on the youtube search thingy..Watch that film And you may just change your mind on this issue..Do you also realise that marijuana is only illegal because it actually works and kills cancer..Big Pharma companies are not interested in finding a natural cure for cancer as they cannot patent a natural growing plant..Big Pharma companies are very powerful and influence politicians so it will never be made legal as they have too much to lose..Medical Marijuana is a joke, they have removed all the good contents of the plant and its basically rendered useless..You probably also ran out and got your swine flu shot too when they said we were all gonna die without the shot a couple of months back..Do you realise what that shot contains?...well if not you will too late
 literallydreaming
Joined: 12/7/2009
Msg: 109
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/2/2010 12:38:26 PM
Maybe good ol' Bushie might have, but Obama completely shut down most federal drug cases not involving violence....

Also, the Dutch didn't legalize, they just had more decriminalization---grow ops are still hit regularly
 literallydreaming
Joined: 12/7/2009
Msg: 110
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/2/2010 12:43:10 PM
Hell I like the green as much as any twenty something male, but it doesn't "cure cancer." It has shown SOME effects against tumors.

How is medical marijuana a joke, I know for a fact that in BC and California specifically, the quality of compassion club stuff is considered top notch---you are talking about MARINOL which is a completely different thing

And just so you know, I know you are thinking about mercury. Which in your mind "causes" autism, which is as proven as the idea that drinking hydrogen peroxide cures you of HIV (yes there are seriously large groups of people on the net that believe this)
 Entzauberung
Joined: 2/12/2009
Msg: 111
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/2/2010 1:58:50 PM
Gibson67
msg 148


Do you know that Cannabis resin kills cancer cells and yes cures cancer?..Go to youtube and put in "Run From The Cure" on the youtube search thingy..Watch that film And you may just change your mind on this issue..


Do you actually believe everything you read, hear and see on the Internet?


Do you also realise that marijuana is only illegal because it actually works and kills cancer..


You don't say!?
Perhaps you could cite some references to support this statement, or is that statement based on your own research?


Medical Marijuana is a joke, they have removed all the good contents of the plant and its basically rendered useless.


Define "good".

THC is the active compound that gets people high and is also what provided therapeutic benefits for glaucoma, cancer, etc so it would be pointless in prescribing/permitting the use of Medical Marijuana that did not contain THC
 literallydreaming
Joined: 12/7/2009
Msg: 112
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/2/2010 4:24:26 PM
He isn't totally off base---THC and various CBNs are useful against tumors, and so it isn't only THC but other cannabanoids

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/12/071226004546.htm

But then he goes off into a (weed-induced?) paranoid fantasy but that should not distract you from the fact that there is medical evidence supporting cannabanoids working against cancerous cells
 barefootkitten
Joined: 12/17/2009
Msg: 113
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/2/2010 6:31:32 PM

Do you know that Cannabis resin kills cancer cells and yes cures cancer?..Go to youtube and put in "Run From The Cure" on the youtube search thingy..Watch that film And you may just change your mind on this issue..


Go look up house hippos on youtube! If they're on a youtube video they must be real! lol
 mcalgary
Joined: 11/10/2009
Msg: 114
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History
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/2/2010 11:32:55 PM

Also, the Dutch didn't legalize, they just had more decriminalization---grow ops are still hit regularly


Exactly makes my point that the arguement that it would eliminate the criminal element is totally wrong. The Drug gangs would still be in full action.

Not saying you made that point but many others keep on trying it.
 literallydreaming
Joined: 12/7/2009
Msg: 115
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/3/2010 9:19:18 AM
...except gangs aren't the one running grow-ops in the Netherlands---they mostly smuggle hard (ILLEGAL) drugs, illegal immigrants, and do armed robbery, so it has at least worked AGAINST their profit machine
 flowerforce
Joined: 9/6/2006
Msg: 116
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/3/2010 12:58:04 PM
msg#141
My degrees are in psychology and if you had bothered to real my whole message you would see I vote NDP. Also do the research yourself that is if you can read which I doubt. I just do not want tho have to put together another broken youth or their families because s/he has used dope. If you want to mess up tour brain with dope go for it. I could care less.
 literallydreaming
Joined: 12/7/2009
Msg: 117
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/3/2010 2:12:10 PM
So are mine....and I do actual research. "Dope" (what is this the 50's?) is the least of the worries in family breakdown...or "messed up brains". Alcohol is by far the overriding factor and usually stats on weed conflate this because they double count families destroyed from a user of alcohol and weed.

Where in god's name did you get the "mess up your mind on dope" shtick? What research are you referring to? As far as I know no serious attributable mental side effects show up when users start post-pubescence---as a supposed expert in psychology you should really know the difference between correlation and causation, and factor analysis usually does not show much effect of weed use itself on morbidity---then again, I'm gonna guess you are on the soft side, social work and the like, and I doubt you do research with extensive statistical rigor.
 flowerforce
Joined: 9/6/2006
Msg: 118
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/3/2010 3:31:39 PM
dreaming,
You do the research that is if you can read at all which I doubt. Also look at what other posters have said about the harm mj does. Use it if you want to I do not care if you mess up your head. I have all I have to say on this issue and I do not have time for ignorance. BYE
 Gourmand123
Joined: 10/20/2009
Msg: 119
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/3/2010 4:05:16 PM
LITD: now that is funny! Are you trying to tell me you are a researcher!! Oh well, that explains why funding re correlation and causation are so f**k#d up LOL
I'm teasing.....cause you know you are full of it
And are you suggesting that flowerforce is in ignorance of the impact of marijuana on a young person's mental health, because she does not do the investigation of a researcher?? Oh please....there is nothing more lacking in reality than someone who bases their knowledge of an issue on a research report.... you can't take the results of Hard Science lol and assume superior knowledge......

I'd certainly be interested in reading one of your papers if you would like to provide a link
 literallydreaming
Joined: 12/7/2009
Msg: 120
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/4/2010 10:31:03 AM
Thanks for deleting my post, moderator. It's pretty easy to tell which side of the debate you fall into.

Funny how someone effectively telling me I am an illiterate and mentally retarded for smoking once in a while is fine, but my comment in response actually looking at facts and asking for real evidence was deleted.
 Puckbetty
Joined: 10/23/2006
Msg: 121
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/4/2010 10:45:18 AM
The addition of anything into the body, legal not legal - natural or man made will have negative side affects as well as negative social repercussions. This whole debate should be like comparing Pot to Hookers ....
 literallydreaming
Joined: 12/7/2009
Msg: 122
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/4/2010 3:17:02 PM
So food and drink have automatically negative repercussions?

The "self finding" peyote spirit guide trips of the Navajo and Hopi are negative?

I would tend to disagree with such a dogmatic and simplified conclusion.
 ratherBgolfing
Joined: 8/10/2008
Msg: 123
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/4/2010 3:53:26 PM
I think I can speak for puckbetty in saying that she was discussing the intake of any mind-altering substances. I think you know that as well.

As for your peyote spirit guide trips of the Navajo and Hopi reference, if it involves injestion of peyote bud, absolutely it has negative effects, not the least of which is being strung out on peyote!
 Dr. Gazebo
Joined: 3/24/2008
Msg: 124
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/4/2010 6:11:44 PM
As for your peyote spirit guide trips of the Navajo and Hopi reference,

No, what we need is more Christians slinging back beer.
 winterfall10
Joined: 6/5/2008
Msg: 125
Legalization of Marijuana.
Posted: 2/9/2010 11:33:56 PM
I find this thread interesting, beyond the mud slinging and such.

It seems that from time to time a bit of news pops up which states some facts and people jump on it and call it true or false. Then those who voice an opinion end up being ridiculed. It is awesome, way to see the system working.

Anyway, I think the topic is much broader than just Weed. Are there negative repercussions from smoking up? Sure. However there are for Alcohol and Tobacco as well. Are the health concerns and side effects of Pot vs Alcohol or Tobacco worse? I cannot say, but let us say they are equal. Where are the people up in arms that after 20 years of repeated studies proving how harmful tobacco is, how much a drain on our economy via health care costs it causes, how much it generally fouls up our world?

I don't see the government making any fast strides to get rid of tobacco, and I don't see people raging for criminalization of it.

Alcohol has a ton of strict rules (as does tobacco) regarding its distribution and sale. Are we comfortable with how alcohol is made available? It may be harder to get prescription drugs, are we safe with how they are given out? Is there the opportunity for another product, such as pot, being made safely available for those who want it?

Why is there no regulation on one of the worst offenders in causing health problems, food? Childhood obesity, let alone the general overweight trend, has grown noticeably in the Western world. Yet we have little issue as a society for the garbage we feed ourselves and our families? Are people actually even aware of the effects of many commonly available legal consumables? Do people care about the money spent for medical expenses related to poor eating habits?

So, we have an issue here. Unfortunately, misinformation from both sides tends to cloud the issues and distract people from the bigger picture. Drugs, in this case Pot, are readily available to anyone from pre-teens to teens, from young adults to old adults. Saying no to legalization does not change this fact.

If a government wanted to privatize and legalize the growth, distribution and sale of of pot, is it really that hard to imagine they could? Would restrictions similar to those in place for Tobacco and Alcohol offer enough of a safety net to reduce the chance that say, people under 19 wouldn't be able to get a hold of it? If not, then, why are we ok with the ones for tobacco and alcohol? If it isn't enough for pot, then, why is it enough for them?

Saying you don't like the idea of having drugs legalized leads to two thoughts. Either A, people would like a system similar to the US where hundreds of millions of dollars of taxpayer money is spent to destroy something at minimal perceived return to the country (seriously, where are the returns on that?). Or B, people are ok with teenagers being able to hit up some guy on a street corner or in a back room for drugs.

It may be clear what side of the debate I lean towards, but, I rarely hear anyone opposed to legalization provide any plan to address drug availability in the short or long term.

BTW, I will add here that although I have experienced enough in my time, I am not a proponent of anyone using drugs for recreational purposes. People are generally just not responsible enough to deal with the repercussions of their actions when sober, let alone under the influence.
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