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 themadfiddler
Joined: 10/16/2006
Msg: 215
Is there a god?Page 23 of 26    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26)


Doesn't Kabballah shed light on such a marriage of forces?

Albert Einstein commented on The Unified Field Theory which Kabballah terms Asiah?


You are dealing with two very different worldviews here. Asiah is not really a descriptive of the "unified field theory" but just a term to describe the material realm. It would be a pretty big leap of semantics to say that it specifically implied "the sticky forces that holds all reality together" when there are more specific ideas about that in Kabbalah but that is well beyond the scope of this thread and most of the readers here I dare say.

And really guys, discussions of Hitler's Christianity or lack thereof...talk about regurgitating the "No True Scotsman" fallacy. In any case, this secular site does a much better job of disseminating the history of Hitler's beliefs, warts and all, including a thorough examination of the "Table Talk" references and how this has been misconstrued in discussions of Hitler's beliefs.

http://www.nobeliefs.com/Hitler1.htm

Hitler was born a Catholic and was baptised as such. He was never formally excommunicated, sadly, despite the conference of German bishops excommunicating all Nazis in 1930 and his technical excommunication via breaking canon law. Much of his ideas on anti-Semitism however DID come from Luther's "On The Jews and Their Lies" as I am sure it did for many other Germans and other Europeans, and in general two millenia of general anti-Semetic hatred and blood libel against the Jews for the supposed crime of deicide. Basic hatred of Jews and the blood libelling of them is however a feature of "any" Christian theology so I guess you can both point fingers happily at each other for history's sins...but...

THIS IS WATER UNDER THE BRIDGE Can we all bloody well move past this nonsense now? I don't think there is anyone who can admit to being free of guilt in this regard. It is time to move forward past the bickering. It really really is tiresome, not to mention factually incorrect. But it is well and truly in the past and not worth talking about now is it???
 dreamboat333
Joined: 2/13/2008
Msg: 217
Is there a god?
Posted: 6/5/2008 6:42:18 AM
I am honored to finally be addressed by the one, the only, Plenty of Fish's Preimier Sensation (hows that for an intro) The Mad Fiddler!

Where you wrote:



Doesn't Kabballah shed light on such a marriage of forces? Albert Einstein commented on The Unified Field Theory which Kabballah terms Asiah? - - -
You are dealing with two very different worldviews here. Asiah is not really a descriptive of the "unified field theory" but just a term to describe the material realm.


You are absolutely correct. I realized it once I had posted it -but you can't unring a bell.

I was posting in something of a hurry and mis-stated myself. In fact it was Ain which I was thinking of. And in fact Ain Sof Aur (Limitless Light) was more true the my thought.

Whereas the Ain Sof Aur or Limitless Light prospoes that the creative element and indeed the creator Himself is exenteded throughout all of creationg (thus a unified or unifying field) it is the Ruach (meaning "spirit", "wind", "breath", or "air". The Greek equivalent is "pneuma" and the Latin is "spiritus" the word used to refer to what sustains the life in a nephesh.) which actively asserts this action.

The challange that believers of all eras have come up against in trying to express their transcendental experiences to others is that these experiences lie beyond the bounds of the rational (and even intuitional) mind on which human written and verbal communication is based. Countless methods have been tried, including allegory, antinomy, poetry and mundane approximation; but all on the fact that transcendental experience cannot be adequately conveyed through sub-transcendental means of communication.

This challange occurs in Kabballism especially in discussions of the higher sefirot on the Tree of Life, and becomes insurmountable in discussing that which lies beyond or above the Tree. The Tree of Life (indeed the floor-plan of the unified field theory) expressed through the sefirot in the Four Worlds is as much as can usefully be conveyed to the human mind through language, and Atziluth and even Briah are really beyond human conception, their "structures" being hinted at through the tangible expressions of the sefirot in the lower worlds.

Ain (nothing)
Ain Sof (limitless nothing)
Ain Sof Aur (limitless light)

To define negative existence clearly is impossible, for when it is distinctly defined it ceases to be negative existence; it is then negative existence passing into static condition. Therefore wisely have the Kabbalists shut out from mortal comprehension the primal Ain, the negatively existent One, and the Ain Soph, the limitless Expansion; while of even the Ain Soph Aur, the illimitable Light, only a dim conception can be formed.



And really guys, discussions of Hitler's Christianity or lack thereof...


I hear you, I hear you loud and clear. I made a passing statement based on factual data and the which I never intended to illustrate more than the fact that religeous tolerance is more that another glib cliche. Then my good brother took hold of it and lost his mind - bless his soul.


Much of his ideas on anti-Semitism however DID come from Luther's "On The Jews and Their Lies" ...THIS IS WATER UNDER THE BRIDGE Can we all bloody well move past this nonsense now? I don't think there is anyone who can admit to being free of guilt in this regard.


As I have stated, re-stated and am stating again, my pointing out Adolf Hitler's active involvement in The Lutheran Church was intended solely to convey the necessity of religeous tolerance. As I stated, nobody would dream of pointing the finger at Lutheran's for the Holocaust simply because Adolf Hitler was a registered, card carrying, Sunday service attending member of the Lutheran Church.

HOWEVER - no good Catholic should ever be expected to have someone make such insulting accusations that by merit of involvement in The Catholic Church we are somehow prone to hurtful behavior or clandestine cover-ups/

The point you refer to would have been dropped immediately, had it not been for my brother's need to further exume the matter for examination in an failed effort at support for his slur on The Roman Catholic Church.

I certainly won't be revisiting it as I am certain there will be bigger fish to fry presently.
 themadfiddler
Joined: 10/16/2006
Msg: 219
Is there a god?
Posted: 6/5/2008 11:51:40 PM


I am honored to finally be addressed by the one, the only, Plenty of Fish's Preimier Sensation (hows that for an intro) The Mad Fiddler!


Now I can't get my head through the forum door...just a second *poke BLAM hisssssss* there we go



You are absolutely correct. I realized it once I had posted it -but you can't unring a bell.

I was posting in something of a hurry and mis-stated myself. In fact it was Ain which I was thinking of. And in fact Ain Sof Aur (Limitless Light) was more true the my thought.


Nae bother! And some good information on the Kabbalah which hopefully will spur others to at least give it a look. It is, imho, one way that people have tried to puzzle out the Great Mystery by overlaying it with a deep symbolic framework. When I first began to study it, I had no idea how thick the brush was...now of course I have hit the first roadblock which is not knowing Hebrew.

Now there's a bit of work to get at...
 themadfiddler
Joined: 10/16/2006
Msg: 220
Is there a mod?
Posted: 6/6/2008 9:44:38 PM


Well sir, that was a seus of a comment if I ever saw one myself..


Seus?? I'm gonna regret it but....what is a seus? Here it comes...LOL
 freethinkingguy
Joined: 4/18/2008
Msg: 221
Is there a god?
Posted: 6/10/2008 1:32:43 PM
RAmen brother.....AAARRRRGGGGG
 Rythmn
Joined: 1/21/2006
Msg: 222
view profile
History
Is there a god?
Posted: 7/13/2008 11:15:59 PM
there is a higher power, some force greater than you or i. for me, that's enough. i have had signs of this to assuage my own need for proof, but these are totally personal. to me, different beliefs are the same as different languages. the latter allows our communication with one another. the former allows us to materialize and imagine or put to image, a very complex energy field or many fields in concert with one another in infinite varieties. in addition, there is a yin /yang to all things. order. balance. out of chaos comes order. order disintegrates to chaos. thus, energy.

feel any better? better still, think any better?
 verygreeneyez
Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 223
Is there a god?
Posted: 7/14/2008 8:16:00 AM

feel any better? better still, think any better?

serenity: ^^^^I do ~ made good sense to me! I tried to email you direct, I'm not seeing it in sent mail, you can email me direct now.

~OT~ Exactly as was stated, different beliefs are just that. They should be acknowledged, respected and encouraged. I'll never understand those who view life as "my way is the only way" and that includes religions/spirituality/sexuality/etc. Closed minds breed contempt.
 Rythmn
Joined: 1/21/2006
Msg: 224
view profile
History
Is there a god?
Posted: 7/15/2008 10:11:07 AM
i see. you want an answer that appeals to your cognition or five senses? i suppose if you've ever been really down and didn't think you would make it--and then, w/o reason or beyond coincidence, you were bailed out--bigtime-- by something that is tangible but very unlikely to have happened OR you "suddenly feel" you have the resources, both internal and external, to go on---you will EXPERIENCE something greater than JUST YOU.

the Higher Power that is an umbrella "concept" over all of these different opinions, is above and beyond "just you". that is why they say that G-d or HP, speaks through people. if s/he were a person, then HP would be "limited". we are limited with souls or energy that is contained by physical structure ( thus the brain and conceptual ablity is limited) and our own five senses (limited). this gets us by in a material world.

if G-d or HP took material form, there would be severe limitation. HP is all of it, beyond it, w/o time. it is the underlying cause of what makes it happen and keeps it all together. if we did not evolve, we would explode. yet, in each explosion or fire or decay or death is a contribution to fertilizing what will come next. if it takes eons, it does not matter. the energy or force finds something else to cleave to. it can be dormant for whatever period.

so, despite how brainy we all may or may not be: it's insufficient to explain HP. the fact that you cannot explain it, explains your limits. thus, HP. HP is the only explanation. why the big bang? you can ask why until you die. it was the first word out of my mouth, according to my poor mother, and it will probably be the last one.

i suppose to keep it simple, you can just respond: why not?
 qriosity
Joined: 1/10/2008
Msg: 225
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Is there a god?
Posted: 7/15/2008 5:09:09 PM
what came first?

Humans or god?

Hypothesis #1: we exist *because* god exists. We are proof of god's existence

Hypothesis #2: god exists *because* we exist. God is proof of the human's abstract mind.

Occam's razor, if applied, Hypothesis #2 is left standing.

Would god ever have been thought up if humans didn't have a critical, abstract mind?
 VVendy
Joined: 6/7/2008
Msg: 226
Is there a god?
Posted: 7/15/2008 7:41:54 PM
Is there a bike shop or can random bits of steel and plastic find each other and move as one under a tree?
Is there a place plastic comes from or does it just happen?
Is there a way DNA can just form into a strand out of a random liquid state?

Christians are not saying that any one who does not belong to our group will go to blazes. The last book states that all will be able to see Jesus and make a choice. All that at their core do not want to be with the creator of all things will go to blazes but it will be their choice as he would every one say sure I'll stay with you.
 qriosity
Joined: 1/10/2008
Msg: 227
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Is there a god?
Posted: 7/18/2008 2:35:00 PM

since these are the ramifications of the devil not being real, are you prepared for the ramifications if God doesn't exist?


Pascal's Wager - this is an appeal to selfish self-interest....not a 'good'/pure reason to thus, believe in god.
 VVendy
Joined: 6/7/2008
Msg: 228
Is there a god?
Posted: 7/19/2008 6:35:29 PM
Ah James you forget the Universe can only come from nothing or something. If it came from nothing then it can follow its own law but if it came from something that something most not be in any way like it. Take flying spagetti monster if he created this universe then another plain of exsistence where pasta has power exsist. He must have made beings who could make wheat grow so that pasta could be formed at a great rate. If you make a painting you made it you are not the object you made it is yours and you have control over it as long as you will. Even tossing paint you chose the color and speed.
My God existed before this universe and will after it is finshed and he makes some thing else. As I lived before I wrote this post and will live after the www is no more.
 WeAre1
Joined: 3/18/2008
Msg: 229
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Is there a god?
Posted: 7/24/2008 5:46:37 PM
Consider the word God to be synonymous with Spirit, Great Spirit, divine nature, love, light, energy, peace, consciousness, essence, higher self...highest self :)....

Consider the word God to mean everything - really everything in the universe...including all the solar systems, galaxies, planets, stars, moons, and all that resides on and in all planets - plants, trees, animals, mountains, seas, lakes, even guns, bombs, genuises and those slower of learning too, wonderfully compassionate people and closed minded angry and bitter too....

Consider God to be One with everything, with everyone, and eternal. (And not to confuse too much, but some then take that in all ways and say God is the Everything, which means it's the Nothing also.)

There are so many ways to consider God.....perhaps just consider it at all and something might come to you that makes sense.....or nothing will come to you, which will mean perhaps 'there is no God' makes sense to you.

I know, for me, I had such a blockage with the word - I used everything but, until I read the Conversation with God books and suddenly it's almost like they gave me permission to really let my blockage go and let in that word....finally. It did not change my ideas that go with the 'One with everything and eternal concept'....but now I could actually use the word.

Do I feel it in a religious sense? Well, I feel it in a spiritual one and who I am to say what is right for another? I can only feel what is right for me.

You want proof, OP? Well, that's like asking for someone to prove what's reality and what's illusion. We can't prove anything, but we know it exists.... (though I imagine there will always be the potential of total disagreement on which is which :) !!
 Wiccanwolf
Joined: 11/11/2007
Msg: 230
Is there a god?
Posted: 8/31/2008 7:02:02 PM
Yes there is and her name is Alanis Morristte. Seriously i believe god is a woman.
 THE-SELF-FISH
Joined: 8/21/2009
Msg: 231
Is there a god?
Posted: 8/24/2009 6:37:35 PM
Oh lord...thank you...the tears are rolling now...a million thank yous xxx

I am sooo happy...ah gad...i mean it!
 VVendy
Joined: 6/7/2008
Msg: 232
Is there a god?
Posted: 8/27/2009 10:04:11 AM
Alanis Morristte was a great god in Dogma. G,Burns also very good but my favorite is "Easy Writer" from Seasame Street who is now 70+ aka Morgan Freedman. I think the look all of them give to the charators who are so wrong about who they are and what god should be/do is the one that most of us will see when we go before Him.
God must klaugh at us a lot I do.
 Inicia
Joined: 12/21/2007
Msg: 233
Is there a god?
Posted: 8/27/2009 9:34:29 PM
IMO-- We have a deity when we have faith and not so much if we don't.


Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?
from epicuras(sp?)

further humble opinion---Just a response to epicuras' age old questions...
IF a deity is omnipotent it creates everything---would such a deity create lessor states of being-- to be "prevented"? or would every state of being be equivalent--- are we as humans with our societal beliefs capable of removing said deity from the box of binaries....good and evil? Would an omnipotent, creating, "SOURCE" differentiate between its creations allowing only favorite good ones or good behavior and squashing prejudged evil ones and evil suffering? If the deity differentiated wouldn't that make the deity unfair and unjust? or malevolent.. only an unbiased fair/just creator deserves the name God/ess .
 VVendy
Joined: 6/7/2008
Msg: 234
Is there a god?
Posted: 9/5/2009 8:56:14 AM
Epi's question "Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?"
Wendy's answer "From man."

Qoute from God"He is like us knowing good and evil"
and so we are clear on why your life is screwed up as the world around it is your fault not God's Let me give you a few more quotes from God "Let's give them dominion over all the Earth" "If you do what is right then you will be accepted if you do not sin awaits to consume you" "They can do anything""Behold blessing and cursing is put before you choose" "Look I give you power of all" "Nothing is withheld form you"

God made you so that you can be. The fact that you make choices that are lame and have to live with them are your fault. If you do not like your life change it. God gave you the power to do so but you have to master yourself that is the challenge of this life. to make a life for yourself that you are not ashamed of when you are presented before your maker. Enjoy your life try to improve the life of others and stop blaming God for not doing what he made you to do.

If you are poor because you spent all of your money on drugs and got fired it is your fault not God's. If you are poor because your boss went under and gave you a bouncer for a paycheck it was your fault for not having savings and working one job instead of two. If you are poor because you were born in poverty it is your parents fault until you are of age and able to ask God for his plan and follow it yes He has ans will intervene in such cases if you stay poor it is your fault.

I can go on but I do not think it will benefit.
 Inicia
Joined: 12/21/2007
Msg: 235
Is there a god?
Posted: 9/5/2009 5:20:41 PM
as we consider the purely "lame" choices that may or may not result in suffering>>> other suffering must be considered....when we see the suffering of the innocent do we say to that?? Amen>>>or do some find a way to accurse the victims of such suffering as willfully choosing there plight??
when there are starving(War, disease or starviation) orphans in Africa sent to the back of the line after waiting in line for several hours to recieve food>>and mind you they are not fed before being returned to the back of the line. and each time they make it to the front of the line they are sent to the rear by the Aid workers so that they starve to death because they do not have parents anymore. When we see a person born without limbs due to a non preventable birth defect or a soldier who comes home and is denied decent care and services after being handicapped by war>>> to what do we say of this suffering???
 jcrew617
Joined: 6/19/2007
Msg: 236
Is there a god?
Posted: 9/5/2009 6:51:22 PM
I believe in the Sun god, does that count? More of a natural earth believer, like the native americans.
 VVendy
Joined: 6/7/2008
Msg: 237
Is there a god?
Posted: 9/8/2009 5:24:19 AM


Why is it that your god chose to make the default nature of his creation (man) so negative?

I think your negitive nature has nothing to do with God. I have a friend and coworker who was raised in the jungle. she learned how to dress keep a house and now is in her sr year to getting her BS in education. As I said you must work to improve your life and the life of the world around you that is your job and I am doing my job to the best of my ability you are just being selfish and/or lazy if you are not working on the things that you know you can and should be doing.
 Inicia
Joined: 12/21/2007
Msg: 238
Is there a god?
Posted: 9/9/2009 4:12:12 PM
while I appreciate that a BS in Education may be a good thing if one is to live in mainstream industrialized capitalistic societies>> if one is to continue living in the jungle there might be other qualities more necessary than keeping house, dressing in the latest fashion and a BS in Education>> that mind you are no less valid, important or impressive and are not indicitive of laziness or slipshod character and have nothing to do with selfishness or whether or not there is a god.
the aforementioned do have a geat deal to do with the nature of our society and what each society finds value in and VVendy's post demonstrates a great deal of ethnocentricity and very little cultural relativism.
 VVendy
Joined: 6/7/2008
Msg: 239
Is there a god?
Posted: 9/10/2009 9:25:45 PM
We would be able to live as we pleased if other people would allow but that does not happen. It would be great if the people the UK just kicked off their island 7 years ago could just say no to living in the industrialized world or the tribe in Mexico that went for 100 years of peaceful isolation who are being killed and enslaved by drug traffickers thanks to the government could just say, "Could you not build your road here please." I'm sure the first guy who got HIV was just thrilled with France and its decision to build the road whorehouse and Diamond mine in his area that lead to making the SVP virus morph. I do not no if polio is man made but my father was in WRD and made some very deadly things. I could list some sicknesses the English French and Dutch developed in the 1700's germ warfare is nothing new.

You have not been following well if you think that I believe life in the jungle is better/worse than life at the Hilton. You missed the point. The point is it does not matter who you are only what you do with what you have to achieve what you ought enlisting God as a helper in it because As He is the author and editor of your life's story if you believe in the JCV of God.
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