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Show ALL Forums  > Politics  > Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World      Home login  
Joined: 11/3/2005
Msg: 2
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the WorldPage 1 of 2    (1, 2)

Gandhi is definitely a personal Role Model, even though I don't agree with his conclusions about Jesus (even though he studied the New Testament extensively, he finally denied the divinity of Jesus)

I do not believe Jesus considered himself divine either unless you speak of how he considered all of mankind the sons and daughters of God.

The Dalai Lama is considered in his religion to be divine and if you ask him just like I bet if you asked Jesus he would tell you. I am a man just like you.

You too can be great and be remembered for as long as man can remember. You too can give your life to the cause of freeing man from their sins. Many have and it is not the fact that some choose to worship them that makes a difference it is those who choose to follow them that does.

I respect greatly and believe all religions believe in the same God they just perceive it in different ways and due to cultural differences call it by different names or see it as a bunch of different manifestations. In the end like our muslim brothers and sisters say:
la ilaha ela allah = There is no god other than god.

We are all it's divine creation. Maybe we should remember this and start acting the part.

MG thanks for this thread man.


Joined: 7/7/2005
Msg: 3
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 9/12/2008 2:46:29 PM

The Dalai Lama is considered in his religion to be divine and if you ask him just like I bet if you asked Jesus he would tell you. I am a man just like you.

He wears a watch. I don't know why that struck me, but it did. And if truly divine, do you need a Timex?

I hear he's a big hitter... the Lama.
Joined: 11/3/2005
Msg: 4
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 9/12/2008 9:23:38 PM
Back on track here are a few of my favorite Gandhi quotes:

A coward is incapable of exhibiting love; it is the prerogative of the brave.

A weak man is just by accident. A strong but non-violent man is unjust by accident.

All the religions of the world, while they may differ in other respects, unitedly proclaim that nothing lives in this world but Truth.

An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it.

An unjust law is itself a species of violence. Arrest for its breach is more so.

Each one has to find his peace from within. And peace to be real must be unaffected by outside circumstances.

Each one prays to God according to his own light.

Faith... must be enforced by reason... when faith becomes blind it dies.

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.

Gentleness, self-sacrifice and generosity are the exclusive possession of no one race or religion.
Mohandas Gandhi
Joined: 11/3/2005
Msg: 6
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 9/13/2008 12:12:22 AM

But the good news is that each person who chooses to do so influences others positively, building to a critical mass.. and eventually.. a new paradigm shift

Joined: 10/27/2007
Msg: 7
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more Gandhi quotes
Posted: 9/13/2008 8:52:14 AM
“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.”

“An eye for eye only ends up making the whole world blind.”

“The best way to find yourself is to lose yourself in the service of others.”

“Earth provides enough to satisfy every man's need, but not every man's greed”

“The most heinous and the most cruel crimes of which history has record have been committed under the cover of religion or equally noble motives”

“Intolerance betrays want of faith in one's cause”

“An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it.”

“You may never know what results come of your action, but if you do nothing there will be no result”

“We must always seek to ally ourselves with that part of the enemy that knows what is right”

“The law of love could be best understood and learned through little children”

Let's shift that pardigm!

Joined: 5/26/2008
Msg: 8
more Gandhi quotes
Posted: 9/13/2008 9:03:39 AM
Sublime, MG!
Thank you for an oasis in the middle of the desert.

Another voice of gentle reason and encouragement is the poet, Rumi:
“Let the beauty of what you love be what you do.”
This simple edict can be applied to everything we do during our daily lives.
If we love Truth, then we must speak it.
If we love Peace, then we must live it.
If we love Harmony, then we must bend with grace.

Good stuff, all.
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 9
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 9/13/2008 10:02:03 PM

"Why do we depend on leaders for change, while casting a blind eye towards our own personal responsibility towards it?
How can a society change, if people aren't willing to change? "

Change itself is a controversial topic.
I think that sometimes people change tremendously in an attempt to keep things the same.
To uphold tradition, to protect a culture and a native tongue, to "save" what is already changing...

People who do this might consider that to save what you want, you might destroy it by letting the end justify the means. If you are willing to fight for what you believe in, what you believe in can't be Peace, then. Or tolerance of diversity. Or grace and forgiveness.

So then, you say, is there anything of value that is worth fighting for? Well, yes, if what you value is gotten during the battle for it. Sometimes you only learn what is important to you as you are fighting for it. Or fighting for something else.

Fighting for Peace might be an oxymoron, if there wasn't a non-violent form of political action such as Thoreau, Ghandi and Martin Luther King advocated.

Battle can teach the value of peace. Death, destruction, loss and grief can teach strength, resilience and the need for reconciliation, cooperation, forgiveness, mercy, dignity, tolerance and grace. Or not.

The time may come when the direct personal experience of the horrors of war is not necessary to teach us these things. In the meantime, we might find that our battles divide us by those that have learned these human values, and those that have learned their opposite--bitterness, resentment, hatred, vengeance, inflexibility, intolerance, fear and paranoia.
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 10
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 12/2/2009 8:57:17 PM
"The purpose of life is undoubtedly to know oneself.
We cannot do it unless we learn to identify ourselves with all that lives.
The sum total of that life is God."

~ Mahatma Gandhi

"How can a society change, if people aren't willing to change?"

Pushing against something you don't want makes the focus be "the unwanted." And thus more unwanted is brought into this world. If you think you must do what you don't want to do, or wouldn't want to have done to you in order to accomplish something, then you are inadvertently creating more of what you don't want.

Focus on what is wanted, walk in that direction, have fun doing it and people will join you.

Praise the good, appreciate those who are doing it, be grateful for everything and everyone that has part of what is wanted. Gratitude expands what is appreciated.

Love is the only thing that creates something out of nothing. People shine when loved. We all grow towards the light, the shadows are just that, only shadows. Peace comes from knowing that shadows are simply the unloved places.

Be the sunflower whose face follows the sun across the sky.

Peace on Earth
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 11
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 1/5/2010 5:17:14 AM
“Live as if you were to die tomorrow.
Learn as if you were to live forever.”

~ Mahatma Gandhi
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 12
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 1/5/2010 6:17:13 AM
True, change is the essence of life.
Be willing to surrender what you are for what you could become.

Growth means change and change involves risk, stepping from the known to the unknown.

If you don't create change, change will create you.

Sometimes it's the smallest decisions that can change your life forever.

Life is change. Growth is optional. Choose wisely.

"When you're finished changing, you're finished.”

~ Benjamin Franklin

“God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
the courage to change the things I can,
and the wisdom to know the difference.”

~ Reinhold Niebuhr

“The key to change... is to let go of fear.”

~ Rosanne Cash

“For everything you have missed, you have gained something else, and for everything you gain, you lose something else.”

~ Ralph Waldo Emerson

“Change is inevitable - except from a vending machine.”

~ Robert C. Gallagher
Joined: 6/7/2008
Msg: 13
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 1/6/2010 9:01:46 PM
I have Gandhi's, "Seven Social Sins," posted on my wall. When I googled the list to make the typing easier I got the bonus of an 8th by Arun Gandhi, his fifth grandson.

Seven Social Sins:
Politics without Principle
Wealth Without Work
Pleasure Without Conscience
Knowledge without Character
Commerce without Morality
Science without Humanity
Worship without Sacrifice
--Mahatma Gandhi, Young India, 22-10-1925

Rights Without Responsibility
--8th sin by Arun Gandhi
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 14
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 1/7/2010 5:36:48 AM
"A good question is never answered.
It is not a bolt to be tightened into place,
but a seed to be planted,
and to bear more seed toward the hope of greening the landscape of idea."

~ John Ciardi

You change your life by changing your heart.

"Growth is the only evidence of life."

~ John Henry Newman, Apologia pro vita sua, 1864

“The great thing is, if one can,
to stop regarding all the unpleasant things as interruptions in one's "own" or "real" life.
The truth is, of course, that what one regards as interruptions are precisely one's life.”

~ C.S. Lewis

"Faced with the choice between changing one's mind and proving that there is no need to do so,
almost everyone gets busy on the proof."

~John Kenneth Galbraith

"The only difference between a rut and a grave is their dimensions."

~Ellen Glasgow

"He who rejects change is the architect of decay.
The only human institution which rejects progress is the cemetery."

~Harold Wilson

"He that will not apply new remedies must expect new evils; for time is the greatest innovator."

~ Francis Bacon, "On Innovation," Essays, 1597

“People underestimate their capacity for change.
There is never a right time to do a difficult thing.
A leader's job is to help people have vision of their potential.”

~ John Porter

“All changes, even the most longed for, have their melancholy;
for what we leave behind us is a part of ourselves;
we must die to one life before we can enter another.”

~ Anatole France

If nothing ever changed, there'd be no butterflies.

"Continuity gives us roots;
change gives us branches, letting us stretch and grow and reach new heights."

~ Pauline R. Kezer

“Change starts when someone sees the next step.”

~ William Drayton
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 15
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 1/11/2010 6:29:45 AM
"When restraint and courtesy are added to strength, the latter becomes irresistible."

~ Mohandas Gandhi
Joined: 11/3/2005
Msg: 16
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 1/11/2010 11:10:25 AM

People fight.

There are more tools in the box of a warrior than violence. The struggle should continue. Gandhi never once said to surrender. In fact what he was leading people to do was far more courageous than acting out in violence. They stood up against serious "bad guys", whom cared little if they cracked nonviolent protesters over the head and killed or maimed them. Many were wounded many died but, the followers of Gandhi were able to end the cycle of violence with their courageous tactic of not using it themselves.

They faced evil with nothing but love and desire for change in their heart and the courage to stand up and demonstrate that through nonviolent civil disobedience and won.

That is the point. Not pretty quotes or your "good guy" "bad guy" dualistic analogy.

The road of violence is littered with cowards. The road of nonviolence makes a coward too afraid to even think about it.
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 18
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 1/11/2010 6:16:05 PM
"I do all the evil I can before I learn to shun it?
Is it not enough to know the evil to shun it?
If not, we should be sincere enough to admit that we love evil too well to give it up."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"Man's nature is not essentially evil.
Brute nature has been know to yield to the influence of love.
You must never despair of human nature."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"Strength does not come from physical capacity. It comes from an indomitable will."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"Morality which depends upon the helplessness of a man or woman has not much to recommend it.
Morality is rooted in the purity of our hearts."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is only temporary;
the evil it does is permanent."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"Interdependence is and ought to be as much the ideal of man as self-sufficiency. Man is a social being."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"Peace is its own reward."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"I know, to banish anger altogether from one's breast is a difficult task.
It cannot be achieved through pure personal effort.
It can be done only by God's grace."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"Non-violence is the greatest force at the disposal of mankind.
It is mightier than the mightiest weapon of destruction devised by the ingenuity of man."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"Power is of two kinds.
One is obtained by the fear of punishment and the other by acts of love.
Power based on love is a thousand times more effective and permanent then the one derived from fear of punishment."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"Non-violence requires a double faith, faith in God and also faith in man."

Mohandas Gandhi

"Non-violence, which is the quality of the heart, cannot come by an appeal to the brain."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"Let us all be brave enough to die the death of a martyr, but let no one lust for martyrdom."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"We may never be strong enough to be entirely nonviolent in thought, word and deed. But we must keep nonviolence as our goal and make strong progress towards it."

~ Mohandas Gandhi

"In a gentle way, you can shake the world."

~ Mohandas Gandhi
Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 19
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 1/16/2010 11:13:16 AM
“Nonviolence is the answer to the crucial political and moral questions of our time;
the need for mankind to overcome oppression and violence without resorting to oppression and violence.”

~ Martin Luther King, Jr.

"But what times is it needed and not?"

This could become a very important question in the near future in Afganistan.

One way towards peace is through education. I just watched this man interviewed on Bill Moyer's Journal. Moyer's said: "I asked him over to explain if he still believes it's possible to promote peace and improve lives for people in a war-ravaged country. I wanted to find out if the bombs aren't winning over books, if the bombs aren't turning his schools back into piles of stone and how war hasn't shattered his faith and peace of mind."

This man was actually kidnapped by Taliban and held for a week in 1996. He has worked for 17 years in rural Pakistan and Afghanistan building schools.

"Greg Mortenson, an humanitarian who probably knows more about Afghanistan than any other American. The book he co-authored, THREE CUPS OF TEA, has become required reading for our senior military commanders and Special Forces in Afghanistan. Generals David Petraeus and Stanley McChrystal, now America's top commander in Afghanistan, have read it. Admiral Mike Mullen, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, not only read it but enlisted Mortenson as an unofficial advisor."

THREE CUPS OF TEA has sold over 3.5 million copies in 41 countries. He has a new book that continues the saga, STONES INTO SCHOOLS: PROMOTING PEACE WITH BOOKS, NOT BOMBS, IN AFGHANISTAN AND PAKISTAN.

"My father ended up starting the Kilimanjaro Christian Medical Centre, which is on the slopes of Kilimanjaro. My mother started a school. So I have it in my background. And my father always said to practice your faith through action and not through talk. And, it's about what you do."

“I really think that fighting terrorism is based in fear, but promoting peace is based in hope... Peace is about hope, it’s about compassion, it’s about love. It doesn’t mean we just go around the world holding hands and drinking tea and having peace. But I really do believe that there’s a lot of power behind love and compassion and respecting and listening to people. Obviously there are atrocities happening, and we witness and hear about them daily. One thing I noticed, having met some former Taliban, is even they as children grew up being indoctrinated. They grew up in violence. They grew up in war. They were taught to hate... One thing we do is hire former Taliban to teach in our schools... They’ve become now our greatest advocates for education. They’re willing to go out into the most volatile areas and promote education.”

~ Greg Mortenson, author of THREE CUPS OF TEA and STONES INTO SCHOOLS. Quoted from Bill Moyer's Journal

One thing I noticed in the interview is that he was influenced by reading this book, "Reverence for Life" by Dr. Albert Schweitzer, who was a medical missionary in Congo. You might find some answers there.

Here's another quote from this interview specifically about the military issues over there:

GREG MORTENSON: "In tribal culture, the-- Afghanistan is different from Pakistan in that I see it somewhat as a warrior culture."

BILL MOYERS: Afghanistan?

GREG MORTENSON: Afghanistan. For 2,000 years they've been through war. The Ottomans, Genghis Khan, the Mongols, the Greeks, the Russians, the British, and now the Americans.

BILL MOYERS: Yeah, exactly.

GREG MORTENSON: Afghans have always won every battle. I was talking to Commandant Conway, who's a Marine Corps commander. And he very strongly, emphatically mentioned at the end of a talk that no military has ever won a battle here. And he said, "We are not going to win a battle here either. So we've got to be much more broader in our solution." I can also say, having spent quite a bit of time with Admiral Mullen and Petraeus and McChrystal, they will all tell you to your face there is no military solution in this country. And the solution has got to be a much broader solution.

BILL MOYERS: So what are our soldiers dying for there if there's not going to be a victory?

GREG MORTENSON: Well, whether we like it or not, we're there. And I think we made somewhat of a promise to the Afghan people. The first was after the Soviets withdrew and we totally abandoned them. And what happened is Osama Bin Laden came around. And then there was 9/11 and, the tragic thing that happened here in New York. And then we went into Afghanistan. But then a year and a half later, the media, the military, we all ran off to Iraq. And, again, we abandoned the Afghan people. And now we're kind of around to the third time. You know, three strikes and you're out. But I really think-the military has-it's very difficult to be in the military now because they've had to have the role of being humanitarian, diplomat, and warriors. And they have to wear three caps. And there's, there is criticism because the DOD is getting a lot more funding now. And the second-

BILL MOYERS: The Pentagon, the Department of Defense, right, yes.

GREG MORTENSON: The Pentagon. And their funding is--

BILL MOYERS: It costs us a million dollars a year to keep one soldier there. That's $30 billion for the new 30,000 troops.

GREG MORTENSON: And ultimately--

BILL MOYERS: How many schools could you build with that?

GREG MORTENSON: Well, $1 million we could build 30 or 40 schools. And in one generation we could have over 20,000, 30,000 kids educated. But I do think, the worst thing we can do is do nothing. And, like Vice President Joe Biden and columnist George Will, the conservative columnist, have both recommended pulling out the troops but doing more selected targeted bombings. And I can tell you, of all things that the elders say is, please, do not bomb and kill civilians. That is the number one way to antagonize people. And the other thing is, I've seen in the military a huge effort to spend time with the elders. I've helped facilitate several dozen meetings now between the elders and General McChrystal's team and many other commanders. And I got very excited to see that because finally people are starting to listen to the people who I think really understand their country and can be part of the solution.

BILL MOYERS: But then how do you explain the phenomenon of a CIA station in Afghanistan being infiltrated by a suicide bomber? What is it we don't know about Afghanistan after eight years that makes that makes that happen?

GREG MORTENSON: Well, war is, it's a horrific thing. It's something that none of us want. In order to get information or work with the people, the military has to be exposed. And the guy, this actual incident, the suicide bomber happened to be an informant. And so they were working with the people. And in the forward operating bases, which are remote bases that started two or three years ago, the U.S. military, their primary mandate now is to build relationships with the people, embed, kind of walk the beat with the cops. And the problem with that, though, is our casualties are going to go way up. There's no way around it. One thing that the military has done under pressure from our political leaders is start to pull our forward operating bases because-

BILL MOYERS: Pull them, you mean bring them back?

GREG MORTENSON: Bring them back.

BILL MOYERS: From the mountainous regions and--

GREG MORTENSON: And garrison them in compounds with big walls. But that doesn't do any good because you're just holing up troops. They're not interacting with the people. Maybe reduce the casualties a bit, but-- so if we are going to deploy more troops, I really think they're going to have to put them out there, expose them, get them in with the people and help them out. Or otherwise, it doesn't make any sense to just put troops in a big walled castle and tell them, you know, you need to set up a McDonald's and Starbucks and, okay, so they go out and do some raids and come back. It's just, that's not a way to bring peace or anything.

BILL MOYERS: So help me get my bearings here, Greg. On the one hand, the news out of Afghanistan is consistently grim. The CIA blown up, the U.S. soldiers under attack, civilians being killed. But then I read about you, opening one school after another, some of them smack in the middle of the most lawless and dangerous areas of Afghanistan and Pakistan. I mean, should we think there's progress or should we think of things going to hell there?

GREG MORTENSON: I tend to be an optimist. So here's the good news, Bill. The first thing is the number of kids in school has gone up ten times in the last decade to 8.5 million children. There's a central banking system in Afghanistan since 2006, which has been huge. There's a road building program, about 80 percent of the roads have been built now from north to south and east to west. It's like building a road from Minneapolis to Dallas and D.C. to-- or New York to LA. Now, that's maybe 70 percent of the way done. There are 80,000 troops trained now, the Afghan Army. The goal is 180,000. And some more interesting things are if you go into the district courts, you'll see the number of women filing titles and deeds for land ownership is skyrocketing. And I think that's a real important thing to note. I think the U.S., we're-- we've been far too busy in the last two decades trying to plug in democracy in the world. And you cannot plug in democracy. We have to build democracy."
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 20
Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 1/18/2010 9:05:22 AM

It's extroidinarily easy to die for your cause, not too easy to kill for it.

I'd say it's the other way around. We are fighters by nature and find it easy to kill. It is natural to try to survive, and therefore not so easy to face death for the sake of honor. If we expect to end war, we have to appeal to our highest authority (our conscience) and resolve not to kill preemptively, simply because we perceive some imagined threat, or because some "authority" orders us to. "I was only following orders" hasn't been a legitimate defense since the Nuremberg trials.
Joined: 1/5/2008
Msg: 21
Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 1/19/2010 5:17:55 AM

Any two-bit idiot can die for his country. Glory, honor blah blah blah

I want you to remember that no **stard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb **stard die for his country-- General George S. Patton
Joined: 11/3/2005
Msg: 22
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 2/3/2010 8:57:46 AM
The power of nonviolence is oft underestimated.

The people standing up nonviolently for what is just and correct, engaging in acts of civil disobedience, and nonviolent protest, is what makes beneficial change throughout the peoples history.

Violence only seems to solve one problem and yet, creates five new ones.

This is a fine example of violence, and racism being defeated by the power of nonviolence and civil disobedience in bring beneficial change about.

enjoy and thank you democracy now! Well done.

We are still being blessed by Gandhi and his movement for, it was his message that inspired our movement for civil rights in this country.

Just another example of the power of nonviolence and civil disobedience.

Joined: 9/23/2007
Msg: 23
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 9/27/2010 7:35:26 PM
“That's all nonviolence is - organized love.”

~ Joan Baez

“Nonviolence is a powerful and just weapon which cuts without wounding
and ennobles the man who wields it. It is a sword that heals.”

~ Martin Luther King, Jr.

“Non-violence is not inaction. It is not discussion. It is not for the timid or weak...

Non-violence is hard work. It is the willingness to sacrifice. It is the patience to win.”

~ Cesar Chavez

“The evil the enemy may do never expresses all that he is.
Nonviolence is a wager-- not so much on the goodness of humanity-- as on its infinite complexity.”

~ Robert Inchausti
Joined: 3/13/2008
Msg: 24
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Gandhi’s Top 10 Fundamentals for Changing the World
Posted: 10/26/2010 8:19:26 PM
One thing I admired about Gandhi was his openness to changing his mind. I can't quote exactly, but he said something to the effect that he was not committed to consistency, he was committed to truth. If there was a lack of consistency between something he said earlier and something he said later, the later statements should be the ones paid attention to because, as his understanding grew, it might change. He was willing to change his mind in response to new information.
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