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 starry_night
Joined: 8/15/2006
Msg: 2
Very High IQPage 1 of 13    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13)
You might try asking one of those boys to prepare and present the next lesson in some area they are very talented. Gifted kids need to be motivated to perform and engaged in their learning or they get bored. Give them a chance to teach you something and stretch your imagination! They sound like a challenging group. It should be fun.
 Verzen
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 3
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/11/2008 12:14:16 PM
I have a fairly high IQ and my problem is more so with focus. It affects my school work because I lose focus. Ritalin helps with focus, but it's synthesized speed which is obviously not good for the body.

What I would do it find their interests and focus on their interest. Find what makes them interested and focus on that.
 UrbanX
Joined: 10/26/2006
Msg: 6
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/11/2008 1:34:29 PM
1. They are teenaged boys. At that age they're pretty much indistinguishable from psychotics as you probably know. Try to let it go a bit.

2. Be blunt with them. Tell them that their brains won't help them succeed without hard work, and that you won't be surprised if they fail. It's possible no one has told them that. (Lord knows it gave me a kick in the butt the couple of times someone did.)

3. Maybe pick up Malcolm Gladwell's latest book on the subject. He says it takes about 10,000 hours to achieve mastery of something. That's five+ work years. Lots of good exemplary case studies in there.

4. Talk to them about work-life balance meaning 50% of your waking life being work. Which means that 50% has got to be pretty enjoyable otherwise your life sucks. They've got half the game to make it, but they have to get the other half: hard work.

5. Talk to them about the other half of work-life balance, and how in general in our society its better to have more money rather than less. Tell them that the way to get more money is to apply themselves. There are lots of intelligent losers out there.

Cheers,
Mike (thank you for caring about them; wish I'd run across a teacher that did)
 rockondon
Joined: 2/21/2007
Msg: 8
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Very High IQ
Posted: 11/11/2008 1:50:37 PM
They're bored.

Two approaches come to mind:

There's nothing more common than talented people that go nowhere. There's plenty of gifted people with genius IQs that pump gas and package groceries. Ask them what they would like to be doing in 5-10 years. Would they like to be burnt out smoking joints in their parents' basement? Or would they like to have a nice car/truck towing a jetski and heading down to the beach in the summer and snowboarding trips in the winter? If so, what would it take to accomplish that?

The other reason to apply yourself in the classroom is to pick up chicks. (At this point, wait for them to stop laughing at you). Seriously, girls like guys that are confident and confidence in the classroom is no exception. If you demonstrate how good you are at classwork they look up to you, they want to sit next to you, and who do you think they want for a study partner?
 Verzen
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 10
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/11/2008 2:37:08 PM
Avellane, like I said. I have been in that position. They need something that interests them. Find out what each person likes and contribute that into their learning.
If they like biology and genetics interpret that in with Math so they can be interested in that study and focus on it. If it's english, have them write a paper on genetics/biology (assuming that is their interest) Me personally? I hate reading. To me, it's the most boring thing a person can do. Right now I am in a literature class and it's hurting my gpa since I hate reading. If my class was about biology (which I love) I would be doing much better at it since I am more familiar with biology and genetics.
 Elizabeth023
Joined: 2/2/2008
Msg: 11
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/11/2008 4:15:44 PM
I find that I get bored very easily, if something isn't interesting to me, or grab my attention.. I can't stay focused on it. Any topic or subject I will not be able to grasp if it doesn't appeal to me.

 Vancer
Joined: 10/29/2006
Msg: 12
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/11/2008 4:21:55 PM
People saying it's a battle against boredom are so right!
I actually know of two 16 year old guys who are deceptively brilliant, yet they do nothing but goof off.
I've never met anyone their age, as clever as they are. They spend most of their time making everyone laugh. And I really think it's because to them that activity is the most challenging and engaging.
I get the impression some very clever people have very specific activities they find challenging and motivating, and if they need to crunch numbers or write essays it would have to have a twist thrown in to entice them.
 scorpiomover
Joined: 4/19/2007
Msg: 13
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Very High IQ
Posted: 11/11/2008 5:09:46 PM
I'm only about 135. But even I found the top class was not taxing my brain, and I could have done my high school in a 1/4 of the time. Instead, I just got got bored by most subjects, and became incredibly de-motivated.

I found that the biggest problem was that it would take me 1 minute to grasp the problem. So I was left with 2 options:
1) Conclude that I understood the material. So I was completely bored silly.
2) Conclude that the teacher wouldn't have taught us something so ridiculously easy. So then I assumed I didn't understand it, went over it again and again, looking for deeper meanings. Either I found much deeper understandings and conclusions than the teacher saw, or any of my fellow pupils, and confused them, or they thought I was seeing stuff that wasn't there, and thought I was a dumba** for saying such stuff, or I just got plain confused, looking for more than there was.

My best teachers didn't just teach us the core material. They taught us the hows, and the whys, and gave me lots and lots of homework, way above the requirements of the curriculum, to keep my mind occupied.

That's what I recommend. Teach them the basics, but give the advanced kids the opportunity to study more advanced stuff, stuff they can really get their teeth into.

What is also important is that every time you give them advanced stuff, then AFTER they've completed it, show them how the advanced stuff came from the basic stuff. That way, they realise that the way to get to the advanced stuff is through the basics, and they will be completely motivated to study the basic stuff incredibly well, in order to get to the advanced stuff.
 JuJuBee
Joined: 1/24/2004
Msg: 14
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/11/2008 5:59:27 PM
My 6 yr old is twice exceptional aka dual exceptionalities because his IQ is sky high for his age bracket and he has ADHD/ODD & Aspbergers. He bores easily & it is a constant forward move to keep ahead of him. The gifted program @ his school said they are trained in children of his capabilities more & more because many are twice exceptional & were never recognized as such.

If they have any of the above (ADHD etc...), it may go against thier grain to be told what to do. My son's mentality is that he either "already knows it all" or is equally bored because it's not science or computers. He's changed my admin privledges on my computer so many times I've lost count.

Have you read A Mind At A Time by Mel Levine? It is an excellent book & is one of my most well loved resources as I go further with my son.

Good luck!
 abelian
Joined: 1/12/2008
Msg: 15
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 1:27:25 AM
You don't get them to conform. That is the most detrimental thing you can do to someone. I've never had my IQ officially tested, but it's been estimated to be above 150. I consider myself fortunate that I had lots of instructors who were not like you. I would have never gone to college, much less graduate school if it had not been for instructors who were a little more flexible and allowed me to teach myself rather than sit in a classroom and sleep.

Consider the possibility that if those kids are so smart, they know better than you do what it is that interests them and how to learm it. Everytime I read something about making people conform, I want to strangle the person who wrote it. If you make them conform, you're really forcing them into mediocrity.

As for turning homework in on time, I never did that, even through graduate school. Don't teach kids to be point grinders. Learning something is important. Learning something the way someome else thinks it should be learned is not. You should read Richard Feynman's book, ``What Do You Care What Other People Think.''
 Leeanne
Joined: 10/14/2005
Msg: 17
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Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 12:12:08 PM
My daughter and I both have 154 IQ - I was totally ADD in school!! I remember not connecting because my mind was somewhere else - but I was lucky because teachers were able to give me extra work - let me use my imagination to come up with things to do etc. The curriculum now crushed my daughter - because the teachers did not allow her the freedom to learn outside of that curriculum. She quit highschool because of it!! Being intelligent in school is difficult - very boring and not challenging!!
It's amazing how many people view these kids as trouble makers or stupid - because they are not into what is available for them at school!
Another problem is others thinking you rude or condescending because you appear to others to be at a different level.
So what do you do with kids like that in school - be understanding - challenge them - allow them to pick things to study which interests them - expand their curriculum - allow them to show you what they know!
 fortran
Joined: 2/21/2004
Msg: 18
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Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 12:51:20 PM
I have a high IQ, but what it is, is a bit of a mystery. There are some parts of some IQ tests, where I don't get anything right. On other parts, I get everything right. So, for some particular mix of those parts I score 135 or so. It really doesn't say anything.

I'm 48. I was almost 41 before I discovered I had Asperger's. Explained a lot. Since then, it seem likely I am also Savant in some ways. Explains more. Nothing explains everything.

Going through school (grades 6 on to 12): yes, there were people that got higher grades than I did. They studied ALL the time, I studied nothing. I never needed notes, I just remembered what I needed to (around 75-80%, depends on the subject, English less than that). Girls were never a problem, they really never seemed to be interested in me (I have Asperger's, I can't tell if anyone is interested for the most part). I got hooked on Space early, probably age 4-5. I got hooked on nuclear physics in grade 5. I have no idea why an elementary school would have any nuclear physics books, but I am glad they did.

Having a challenge helps. To have a grade of X compared to everyone else (Y, Z, ...) didn't mean anything. Learning about space or nuclear physics did. For better or worse, I had philosophical differences with my grade 12 physics teacher. He was an idiot, and I got a conditional pass. It kept me out of nuclear physics as a career. I ended up in materials science and engineering (with a year hiatus after high school). The year off hurt grades, but all through university my grades were on a slope to max. I took notes, but they never really did help. I always used my memory for things technical. I still do. I went on to a masters degree in engineering.

I would say, you should seek to get them involved in something. If they are engineering oriented, maybe look at what good engineering schools are doing (or better yet, get a prof from there interested). I would imagine there are similar things for other interests like art, medicine or what have you. Doing science fair projects would be good.

If they are Autistic, look to see how they are at "sales". Finding a job means selling (to almost all employees). I am horrible at selling, and I suspect Autism is to blame. Having tons of skills and abilities, and never being able to find work gets to be a bit of a drag after a while. I still think about suicide. But, until my Mom dies (my biggest supporter, even though nobody knew what was going on for years), I won't take that route.
 Verzen
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 19
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 1:36:39 PM
It always interests me that everyone has an IQ of 150 or above. Leads me to believe what is little to be trusted.
 HO2
Joined: 10/11/2008
Msg: 20
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 2:04:31 PM
One thing the research shows for sure: much of the ability for
complex reasoning depends on the situation.

Researchers agree that, statistically independent, mental abilities, exist
—such as spatial, verbal, analytical and practical intelligence.

The setting in which we measure intelligence matters.
IQ has risen approximately 20 points with every generation.
The rise in IQ has been attributed to many factors, such as better nutrition,
more schooling, better-educated parents and more complex spatial environments ----
-- smart toys and computers
 chrono1985
Joined: 11/20/2004
Msg: 21
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 2:16:46 PM
I have a high IQ, between yours and the kids, and almost never did my homework. In fact I only did what little homework I could get away with for a passing grade. You see it's a simple matter of those kids are absorbing the information you present them with at an incredible rate, with your IQ you probably do the same with new information. The classes I was more motivated to do homework in (which I actually did at the end of class instead of at home) was the ones that presented information not as an exert from the book in front of me (I could read the books front to back in one or two sittings easily), but instead they presented it in a way that caught my interest, provided opinions on why some math function was significant, or why a dictator really was wrong in their methods, and in their own words (not to be confused with paraphrasing).

As an example of presenting the work in a way that interest the students, this example may be rather extraordinary of one but it's one I remember very clearly. My geometry teacher (whom surprisingly had the surname Ortho) presented functions of PI to us with a really cool graph formula. The formula when solved with 0 to positive numbers would create the right half of a heart, when solved with 0 to negative numbers would create the left half of a heart, that was when she grabbed all but maybe 2 or 3 out of 30 students attention with gasp of astonishment.

The truth is though, that those kids know that the vast majority of what your taught in school is of little help in the real world and are spending their time studying what they really want to study, probably something the school doesn't offer a class for. Like with me it was programming, I'd rather spend 8 hours after school learning to write computer programs than fill in the blanks on some questionnaire about a previous class session. When I told my principal that, he nearly kicked me out of school and tried his hardest to convince me that learning to write the small programs I was doing at the time wasn't going to help me make my way in life. Another teacher that was teaching us to build resumes in the middle of a basic computing class called me up in front of the class to try to disprove part of my resume that listed a game I had worked with a team of 10 people on, he seemed to know a good deal about the game except he never read the credits page of the game, even after showing him that, he wanted to kick me out when he figured out that's why I didn't do my homework for his class.

I guess I went off on a little bit of a tangent there, but perhaps it'll help you with some insight or something.
 Verzen
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 22
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 3:09:59 PM
Uh, HO2... you know how they determine IQ, right? If the IQ raises 20 points with every generation, then that means it must decrease 20 points in a different part of the country. So while we are getting smarter, another generation is getting dumber? That doesn't make sense.

Intelligence should NEVER be based on how educated you are. Bush went to Harvard. He was very educated but he was also a dumb ass and he wasn't very intelligent. Intelligence is deemed from how quickly you can learn something. Not by what you know.
 Snapington
Joined: 7/29/2008
Msg: 24
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 4:36:16 PM
First off I have to ask what test did all of you take as there are two frequently administered Stanford-Binet and WAIS-R. Stanford gives a higher number than WAIS-R. I also was bored to tears in school and I moved frequently being a military brat 18 schools. Like scorpiomover said, I lack motivation, and spent years getting the old "could be A student speil". I don't put much faith in these tests as I have known many people claim to be genius's that fail to exhibt it. I also do very well on some sections and not so on others and I am left handed. It's tough having teachers who are not able to understand because they are not on your level, this was very discouraging to me as well as always being the new kid and bully's punching bag.
I am completely self taught in my interests and never got to attend college but so many dummies seem to have. No use crying over my wasted potential.
 Ahoytheredave
Joined: 8/29/2006
Msg: 25
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Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 6:10:42 PM
Everybody has wasted potential. That's life. We all have some bumps in life. Were those bumps something "bad" that happened to you are something to learn from? One should not forget that intelligence is the ability to learn and every moment of life is a learning experience.
I will gladly match my bumps against those of others but very few of my bumps were my doing. In reality, I have been pretty successful although I have erred in defaulting to trust when mistrust would have been the better choice. Perhaps that is why I am not trusting enough to find this site successful. I need to unlearn lessons I have had about the other gender.
Classical education is intolerant of creativity. Teachers equate creativity with the ability to interpret something they have presented, not something absolutely new to the teacher. If an intelligent and creative student finds himself subordinate to a teacher who is intolerant, that student will apply his mind to other more imaginative pursuits, even if that is daydreaming or creating disruptions in the "ordered" classroom. Since the educational establishment embraces order and discipline, those that live by following this narrow academic path often become the captains of the classroom themselves. We can only hope they can find respect for true creativity and steer it to more productive challenges.
 HO2
Joined: 10/11/2008
Msg: 26
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 6:17:44 PM

If the IQ raises 20 points with every generation, then that means it must decrease 20 points in a different part of the country


Absolutely NOT.
My comments had nothing to do with geographical references.

Each generation builds upon the knowledge of the prior generations.
There is so much more info available to children in todays world.
The ability to read plays a huge role for a child in developing a superior intellect.
 AAuroraAA
Joined: 8/18/2007
Msg: 27
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 6:27:45 PM
School was boring to me as a kid. The out-takes from the boredom were by teachers who brought passion to a subject & went outside the proscribed lines of the curriculum. I still like that.

I would blow off doing any serious work to learn something new until someone could show me why I needed to know a thing. As high as my IQ was as a kid, I didn't learn to tie my shoes for a really long time. I got hugs from my Mom (3rd of 4 kids) which was not readily available,...when she would tie my shoes for me. My logic was that if I never learned I would continue to recieve the small bit of extra attention. It was illogical to bother learning to tie my shoes when it clearly meant I would relenquish something I wanted. Pretty much the same thing with time. As a kid I didn't give a rat's arse what time it was & couldn't see a good reason to care what time it was either. My motivation for learning that was that I would get a nice watch if I learned how to use it first. Seeing the Cinderella watch my older sister got was something to look up to, but I wanted the Sleeping Beauty watch instead. LoL The key word in all this??? Motivation! Find what motivates them & go with it!
 Verzen
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 28
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 6:33:27 PM
HO2. Either you are not explaining things properly or you have no idea how IQ is determined.
100 is always the average number compared to others who have taken the test.
You cant say that if you have an IQ of 100, then in 2 generations they will have an IQ of 140. If this statement was true, then the reverse would also have to be possible. You would have to have a generation who has an IQ of 60 which is mentally retarded or two different generations of an IQ of 80 which falls inline with red neck mentality.


140 + 80 + 80 / 3 = 100 (average)

140 + 60 / 2 = 100 (average)
 Verzen
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 30
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 6:46:23 PM
thunder - the reason is simple. When someone asks if anyone has been in this position... they answer that person with an.. answer.
 HO2
Joined: 10/11/2008
Msg: 31
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 9:47:33 PM
sorry Verzen, you are indeed a genius and your reading comprehension is awesome.

You don't really think that 4 or 5 generations ago people were learning
organic chemistry, quantum mechanics and artificial intelligence robotics ?

I'll take it to the lowest common denominator for the math wiz.
Each crop of newborn babies learns from adults who lived before he/she was born.
Hence the quantity of learned material available increases...progress, evolution, etc.
 Snapington
Joined: 7/29/2008
Msg: 32
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/12/2008 10:24:24 PM
Ho2 are you saying that Leonardo DaVinci had a negative IQ? Because by your theory he did, he lived like twenty generations ago. Human IQ has not increased, only the knowlege base. And what about the ancient greeks? Do you get my point? That's just not a statement someone with a high IQ would make. Hawking is no smarter than Archimedes or Newton ect. Advanced tech is due to refinement of ideas not smarter people.
 Verzen
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 35
Very High IQ
Posted: 11/13/2008 1:06:20 AM
HO2 - That is called knowledge and education which has NOTHING to deal with IQ. IQ is intelligence Quotent which means the average IQ of EVERYONE on earth is 100. If you have an IQ of 150, then you are more intelligent then the majority of earth. My IQ is only 135-140.

If you had an IQ of 140 during Plato's time, it does not mean that his children's children etc now have an IQ of 2,600. That's just silly.
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