Notice: Forums will be shutdown by June 2019

To focus on better serving our members, we've decided to shut down the POF forums.

While regular posting is now disabled, you can continue to view all threads until the end of June 2019. Event Hosts can still create and promote events while we work on a new and improved event creation service for you.

Thank you!

Plentyoffish dating forums are a place to meet singles and get dating advice or share dating experiences etc. Hopefully you will all have fun meeting singles and try out this online dating thing... Remember that we are the largest free online dating service, so you will never have to pay a dime to meet your soulmate.
     
Show ALL Forums  > Science/philosophy  > Question about wire gague........is bigger better?      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 Beaugrand®™©
Joined: 3/24/2008
Msg: 3
view profile
History
Question about wire gague........is bigger better?Page 1 of 1    
A change to a thicker wire may not improve performance, but I doubt it would hurt, and it might reduce the risk of fire caused by overheated wire, so I can't see any reason not to upgrade; on the other hand, unless you have access to a sizable quantity of relatively inexpensive wire (really cheap or free), I don't see much benefit.
So:
Will it hurt?
I don't think so.
Will it help?
No idea. Maybe.
Is it worth the cost?
Up to you.
 father3
Joined: 7/11/2006
Msg: 10
view profile
History
Question about wire gague........is bigger better?
Posted: 3/18/2009 1:49:16 PM
To answer your first post, yes wire guage makes a difference. As already stated the heavier the guage of wire the less losses ie voltage drops across the wire and I^2R losses through the wire. What also makes a difference is the type of wire used, copper or aluminum, stranded or solid, and the connecting ends, whether soldered or crimped. I only mention this because you mentioned it was made in China.
Other then 12v 14 Ah and there are 4 in the box in series to make 48V total.
The motor it's self is 500W


At full tilt the motor should draw somewhere around 10 amps. The wires installed can handle this amperage, but like anything, cheaper isn't better because of what I've mentioned earlier. The wires should be #12 or #10 stranded copper with silver soldered connectors. Anything less will heat and cool and break down over time. You also should know what the charging current is. Typically, if it takes a long time to recharge the batteries, the charge current is low, but some batteries can be charged quickly, and this too will draw a significant current through those wires.

I had four 100 watt solar panels charging four 6 volt batteries in series by day, and discharging at night through an inverter. I can't tell you all the problems I had with the inter-battery connections. Eventually I upgraded the wires and connections and all my problems went away.
 notregme
Joined: 5/26/2005
Msg: 11
view profile
History
Question about wire gague........is bigger better?
Posted: 3/18/2009 8:44:44 PM
smallest too bigest, 26 ,22,18,16,14,12,10,8,6,4,2,1, 0/1 , 0/2. 5amps to 400amps
 Ahoytheredave
Joined: 8/29/2006
Msg: 12
view profile
History
Question about wire gague........is bigger better?
Posted: 3/18/2009 8:51:18 PM
Each time you go down two gauge numbers (thicker wire), you roughly cut resistance in half. That means less wasted energy in the same length wire. As noted in an earlier post, you need good connections or you will loose more from the connection than you gain from the wire. A good test is to drive your scooter hard for a while and then feel if the ware gets warm. If it does, swap to a thicker gauge.

Your "throttle" probably uses pulse width modulation to control power going to the motor. These pulses could have a substantial current spike that wastes power in several places including in the batteries. Adding "low ESR" capacitors across the power input circuits in the throttle controller will improve efficiency of the whole system. Putting them on the output circuits is probably not that wise it increases the current spikes. You can add or replace the cheap "catch" diodes across the output terminals with higher quality diodes provided your scooter is forward only. If it has a reverse, it gets complicated. The power FET[s] are probably not the highest quality and could use better devices with lower "on resistance". Most have grades of on resistance, threshold voltage, and maximum junction voltages.

There are lots of ways to increase performance and efficiency but in general, the improvements are incremental and each has some cost.
 notregme
Joined: 5/26/2005
Msg: 13
view profile
History
Question about wire gague........is bigger better?
Posted: 3/18/2009 9:11:26 PM
at the store I use too work at it was 19cense a foot for 18G and $2.99 for 0/2 ,1360 strand.
 Beaugrand®™©
Joined: 3/24/2008
Msg: 16
view profile
History
Question about wire gague........is bigger better?
Posted: 3/19/2009 8:14:51 AM
As mentioned above, the issue of most concern would be the connections. They should be kept tight and free of dirt and/or corrosion. Checking that should be part of routine maintenance.
Other than checking connections, I think my main concern on an electric vehicle would be the quality of the insulation of the wire. Some wire insulation is cheap thermoplastic that melts when the wire gets hot, and this becomes a source for vehicle fires. I think if I was contemplating doing a wire swap, in addition to the suggestions above about connections and wire selections, I'd look for "high temperature" insulated wire- yes, it's a bit more expensive for the same gauge.
 father3
Joined: 7/11/2006
Msg: 19
view profile
History
Question about wire gague........is bigger better?
Posted: 4/30/2009 1:12:05 PM

All else being equal, two wires of same quality and length, but different gauge will have the same resistance.


Absolute bunk!! Wire gauge is integral to resistance and vice versa. Just because you can pass a trickle currnt through both wires and read practically zero ohms for each doesn't mean they are of the same resistance. The ohmmeter isn't really reading resistance - ie - the metermovement - its reading the trickle current.


Only difference is the smaller wire can't carry the same amount of amperage as the larger gauge can.


The reason the smaller wire made of the same material can't carry as high a current without melting IS because of its resistance, nothing else. A single strand of -273 degree Kelvin superconductor can carry a theoretically infinite current. Theoretically only because -273K has never been reached.
Show ALL Forums  > Science/philosophy  > Question about wire gague........is bigger better?