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 Gideon_70
Joined: 9/9/2005
Msg: 3
Hooked on having a FWB?Page 1 of 7    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7)
My last wife had a FWB that she met before we married, and was still with after we divorced. Seems she didn't think that I should have been upset about it. After all, she was just sleeping with him and lying to me.

Now, if I hear that someone I date has been a FWB or hs one, terminal relationship, right then, right there.
 pdlop
Joined: 10/9/2009
Msg: 7
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/16/2009 7:33:40 PM
That depends on the guy and what type of relationship he want's to get in. A FWB is always a good idea until someone starts having feelings the other doesn't have and someone winds up getting hurt. The answer to your question is yes guys and gals like FWBs, they also like dating and LTRs. toodledoo
 IgorFrankensteen
Joined: 6/29/2009
Msg: 8
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/16/2009 7:49:14 PM
There are loads of posts on the forums that start from the assumption, or the allegation that men as a group, want sex for the sake of sex, and nothing more. Perhaps I'm blind, but I'm not seeing the proof of that, as I should if it were as prevalent as claimed.
This question seems to me to come from the same vein of prejudice. The only reason an FWB relationship would be better for a man than a woman, would be if the above assumption is a part of it. I'm skeptical of the validity of that assumption, based on observation and experience. Yes, I've seen plenty of hit-and-run guys in college years, and read plenty of posts and stories about guys running around after "free" sex on the side. I notice that in every case (the heterosexual ones at least), there's also a WOMAN in there, also getting some ya-ya's out. As long as that's the case, I think the "guys are just in it for sex, gals are all about the emotional fulfillment" thing is a myth.
That said, and assuming the study you are proposing is limited exclusively to guys who have CHOSEN an FWB situation, I think you'd end up with too much of a mixed result to make any fast conclusions. I've known guys who learned within the framework of an FWB, that what they REALLY want is the stability of an LTR. Others who went out and found another FWB as fast as they could. You will doubtless be able to find a tiny group of guys who are actually psychologically addicted to sex without commitment, but that's true of anything out there, including any ridiculous thing you can think of. Addiction to spitting on strangers feet, picking other people's noses, you name it, there's someone out there.
 rainman12
Joined: 10/18/2007
Msg: 14
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/16/2009 8:25:55 PM
I don't know that it's addicting - convenient, you bet. But most of the FWB arrangements that I know of have usually ended because one of parties has entered into a committed relationship and it was just as likely that it was the guy that entered into the relationship.

I dunno, I view FWB as a temporary thing. If neither are in a relationship down the line, why not revisit the idea, but I don't know too many people that go looking explicitly for FWB.
 OutMind
Joined: 2/13/2007
Msg: 16
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/16/2009 8:41:23 PM
In order to keep a FWB for any given time it requires a since of detachment that cannot be maintained for an extended period of time. At some point, one or the other will develop feelings for the other. At that point, the colder person or like people in the forums sometimes prefer to call that person, more secure, takes off. So eventually these type of relationships collapse.

Interestingly enough several of my friends have been players. They were very good at it, had a solid game with a constant influx of females. At times a FB, FWB or even sleeping with several women, all knowing of the existence of the other. All these guys right now, are in monogamous relationships right now. One of my buddies used to run a Strip Joint in NY. And you should see him now cutting the grass, talk about going to the in-laws, complaining about some little thing about his wife, yet also expressing a love for that woman that is wonderful.

Eventually we all yearn something that feel lasting. For starters, the sex with a person you love and have been with can be so much awesome when you understand where you've been, what you like and don't like, but also what you are bored with and want to experiment with. Also even though relationships fall into routines that tend to be mundane and seemingly boring, when you do not have them around, suddenly you realize that life is not about the big party, but about those little things, those little moments together. You miss her making you expresso and steaming the milk just the way you like it. You miss the way she folds your underwear. And she tells you that she misses your stupid jokes, or your cooking, or those lazy afternoons in bed with the rays of light filtering through the window.

A FWB cannot provide that. And when she/he does, she begins to move into that camp of emotional attachment.
 BlueEyes1712
Joined: 4/24/2008
Msg: 22
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/16/2009 9:06:27 PM
I think someone who has FWB is thier lifestyle. For some reason they feel anything more may jepordize the relationship. When you think of how much effort goes into a marrage or living together, its no wonder why someone who has difficulty coping with the pressures of daily cohabbitaing brings. One doesnt have to explain why or what they do to others, they get to believe in thier own reality what ever that may be. There are many advantages to it from that perspective, the downside would be the level of interpersonal ability one can experience.
 packagedealx3
Joined: 2/4/2006
Msg: 23
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/16/2009 9:46:29 PM
The answer to that probably depends on values as well as life stage. I could easily see someone in their twenties doing this, or getting hooked, but someone closer to my age that is starting to at least occasionally contemplate aging alone, something more than an fwb is desirable.
 daynadaze
Joined: 2/11/2008
Msg: 25
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/16/2009 11:21:31 PM
I don't know, I suppose it's kind of 50/50 depending on the person. I'm not interested in men who have been in FWB relationships because it goes against what I look for in a person, it' something that rubs me the wrong way. But it does seem that if someone will screw their friend(s) when without someone they want to date so aren't getting sex, that they just aren't the type of person who is going to find being faithful that big a deal, nor do they seem to be people who can manage to go without sex which is a whole 'nother problem. All my own personal problems.

Considering all the posts about FWB and the whining in them, I'm not so sure that a lot of FWB relationships are all frills with no headaches. They seem to be full of headaches and misunderstandings. But then again, I guess if people are having good FWB they probably aren't posting about it.
 packagedealx3
Joined: 2/4/2006
Msg: 27
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/17/2009 5:28:36 AM

I'd suggest that with the marketplace being what it is today, and comparing notes against what we see written here daily...is it really any wonder why men predominantly are looking for more FWB type situations as opposed to real relationships? I mean seriously...have you READ the sheer amount of antiquated entitlement threads going on? The ones where women still expect this archaic ritual of courting and men doing all the heavy lifting (so to speak) while they sit there and do nothing except make an appearance and assume that's "their part"?

You know, I love you BDJ but sometimes your posts leave me shaking my head. There are just as many women who feel like they are doing the heavy lifting as men, who make the effort to do nice things for a guy they are dating while he pretty much just shows up. So isn't the trick finding someone whether you are male or female, that wants to have an equitable relationship? Don't people need to take responsibility for staying in situations that clearly from the beginning, they were putting more into things than their partner?
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 28
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/17/2009 8:35:40 AM
^^^ I agree with Packagedeal here. There are a lot of women who take care of their own stuff and don't expect men to do everything. There are also some who don't allow men to do anything for them - which to me should be easy enough to find.

Basically (and I know BDJ that you are quite sharp when it comes to assessing what someone's about, so I have no doubt you can spot it) there are women out there with many different ideas about what dating should be about. It's really about finding someone that gets your mindset and agrees with it.

So my problem here is that I feel I am going to have to settle for FWB's and hope that she is the one developing the feelings otherwise I have to try again.

Why do you feel you have to go along with FWB unless you want to? Don't give me that crap about going without sex making you shrivel up and die either.

What do you suggest a guy like me in a situation like this to do about it? As long as there are an abundance of people that do this there will always be an incentive to continue despite whether it is harmful or wrong. I can't simply say "oh well I won't be like those thousands of people that do it that will show them!"

Actually, yes you can. Women do it all the time.
 ForRumOnly
Joined: 3/16/2009
Msg: 29
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/17/2009 9:11:58 AM
I believe in equitable relationships, of whatever kind.

I've been in FWB relationships, and then entered into a "conventional" long-term commited relationship. Why? Because I found someone who met ALL of my criteria for a relationship, rather than just many. As for that FWB? Now just a good friend, and the SO is fine with that, BTW. It's hard to comprehend all the drama people create around various kinds of relationships and past relationships, but that's just me, I guess.
 DIVISION77
Joined: 8/10/2009
Msg: 31
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/17/2009 9:23:59 AM
You're basing your question on a premise that isn't necessarily true.

Not all FWB are monogamous.

Some are, but not all.

In that way, a monogamous FWB is actually the best of both worlds but I doubt most POF'ers who post about FWB have had that type of relationship.

There are still people on here who think NSA = FWB, which is ridiculous.

I gravitate towards LTR, but under certain circumstances with the right person, a monogamous FWB is actually equal or better.

For instance: The FWB I had was with a woman who had three kids, which precluded me from offering LTR, though I liked her enough to agree to a FWB because that is all there was time for, plus I wasn't willing to arrange my life around her kids and I told her that in the beginning.

It was probably the easiest relationship I ever had.........because most of our time was spent eating out or with her in the doggystyle position getting tenderized.

Ideally, I would like a LTR because it's more in line with my lifestyle and it's getting time to settle down, but I wouldn't rule out a FWB in the future if the situation arises.


 GrandmaBooBoo
Joined: 12/30/2006
Msg: 39
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/17/2009 3:27:16 PM

I've known guys who learned within the framework of an FWB, that what they REALLY want is the stability of an LTR.
What's the difference? Really? I have some neighbors who really surprised me recently when they said they were celebrating their 5th wedding anniversary. I had assumed for years that they'd probably been married for at least 50 years. It seems that they'd been "FWB's" for over 25 years! She told me that he gave up asking her to marry him some years before....they'd not lived together in all those years....but "visited" frequently. She asked him to marry her after he'd suffered some illness and she said she was afraid that his children would put him in a nursing home if he ever became too ill to care for himself. (He's in his early 70s, she's in the mid 60s). I've seen a helluva lot of marriages which lacked THAT level of commitment! What's the difference between a FWB and an LTR? Isn't it all nothing more than what people tell themselves to feel good? Aren't "marriages" which are rife with infidelity nothing more than "FWB"s? They certainly are lacking in that so called "commitment" that we all seem to think makes the difference between the good, the bad and the ugly.

Why do people think that the ONLY form of "commitment" is in some "marriage ritual" ? I know boat loads of people who have gone through the ceremony....and divorced in a much shorter time that a lot of "FWB" relationships last.

What about "marriages" which are devoid of physical intimacy??? Doesn't sound very "committed" to me....since the 3 elements in a "love relationship" are "Intimacy, Passion, and Commitment". Why do people feel that you can eliminate the passion and the intimacy...but as long as there is "commitment" it's an honorable relationship? WHAT exactly are these folks "committed" TO? What about a relationship that has only "passion"?...or only "intimacy"? Nope, those are evil right? (just say yes, you know you want to) So, as long as 2 people are COMMITTED to hating each other....Thank goodness it's not as bad has sharing intimacy without a committment!
 ladyc4
Joined: 2/14/2006
Msg: 45
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/18/2009 5:01:58 PM

accept legal consequences of shared domicile/goods

Hel-lo?? FwBs do not generally share domicile, intermingle finances or significant possesions. There is NOT an expectation of the guy giving gifts, dinners and trips...
But there IS an element of committment and responsibility...unless you are one of those people to whom the word "friend" means "someone I can use for MY benefit, and forget about if THEY ever need anything".
While living in separate domiciles,etc may not make for great spontaneity, genuine FwBs can help each other and have each other's backs.
People, a FwB is NOT some onesided deal where someone is "getting used for sex" or a conventional dating/courtship. A female FwB is not your 'mistress' who needs to be kept content with material goodies. While monogamy is not an entitlement, as far as sexual activity it's generally best if it's kept monagamous. It simply is an involvement that IS meaningful, but is not going to go to some higher level, or become a cohabitation or marriage situation. Sometimes during an FwB a genuine love DOES break out, but one should never go into a FwB thinking that this is gonna happen.

There are probably people who would be much better served if they participated in a well chosen FwB, ESPECIALLY those who may be struggling with post divorce or bereavement issues, while they got their emotional feet back under themselves. Then maybe we wouldn't see so many "rebound" relationships, or relationships driven by sheer loneliness/despair, that DON'T hold up and end up with hurt, angry bitter people cycled back into the dating pool, to do the same damn thing over and over...
Hooked on FwB? Nah, what I see is people hooked on attaching to a member of the opposite gender and "MAKING it BE a relationship", only to have the thing fall apart, because they really weren't ready to be in a relationship, or maybe they just really aren't good with hipjoined 24/7 committment. But they can't stand being alone with themselves, and/or they have some shibboleth that physical intimacy MUST be confined within a 'committed longterm relationship'. Understand here I am not advocating or promoting casual sex, promiscuity, totally "no strings sex" liasons...but suggesting that people might want to really try to understand that in FwB, the very first word in that description is 'friend
Cindy O
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 46
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 11/19/2009 9:00:45 AM

Understand here I am not advocating or promoting casual sex, promiscuity, totally "no strings sex" liasons...but suggesting that people might want to really try to understand that in FwB, the very first word in that description is 'friend.

That bears repeating.

It's essentially supposed to be an arrangement between TWO consenting adults who have an already established friendship, and don't want a relationship but want someone they trust and can sleep with.

If that's not what someone is in, then they are in some other thing that was labeled an "FWB" either because they don't understand what one is, or because they wanted it to sound more involved than it really was.

If BOTH people agree to an FWB, this means that no one is being used or decieved. They should both want it equally for it to work. If one is nodding and agreeing but hoping it will be more, that person takes the risk in their own hands.
 farscapeprincess
Joined: 4/28/2008
Msg: 48
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 2/3/2010 8:17:25 PM
Posted by oas500:
Dont women enjoy sex too? Or is it really just to get that marriage liscence?
To some yes, to some no.
Seems like more often women over 40 want to have more fun than the 20-something crowd?


Yes, we do enjoy sex. I know I do.

I've read this thread and see one thing that sticks out is that the FWB usually ends when the other partner develops feelings and want more from their FWB. Ouch! That's why I won't be someone's FWB. Too much risk and not enough reward, imo. From what I'm reading here this type of relationship (if you want to call it that) really benefits men because there is great sex, but no hassle of a relationship as they see it, they don't have to be monogamous if they don't want to be. Personally, I wouldn't believe someone would be monogamous if all we are to each other is FWBs.

I know developing feelings for the other goes both ways and that there are some guys who get hurt because their FWB doesn't share the same feelngs. But I'll bet there are many more females in that position who have been hurt when their FWBs walked way.

I've turned down FWBs because I know myself and I won't put myself in that position because I know a) it is highly likely that I will be on the receiving end of being hurt because of developed feelings and b) being honest with myself, I know I'll never feel satisfied with that type of relationship and will want more than what he has to offer. I want more than just being done doggy-style or maybe dining out now and then. If he is basically contacting me when he wants to scratch an itch and not much communication in between that is not for me.

So as to whether FWBs relationships are addicting, I think they can become a lifestyle for some (men and women). People get comfortable with what they are familiar with and all that.
 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 50
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 2/3/2010 8:33:44 PM
I actually believe that fwb can be a healthy thing, for many, and at particular times in their lives, but I have to tall ya, BigDaddy, your post smacks of someone who engages in such relationships out of fear, not healthy at all! Avoiding a relationship for fear that it may end is simply classic, and has little to with a thoughtful decision that one may be in a particular place in life where they are not willing to commit to a "real" relationship. Open eyes seems the key to me. Decisions made based on self knowledge are not gender based, nor need they be affected by past experience. btw, equality is not "across the board", it is give & take, each when warranted, not merely convenient.
 GeneralizingNow
Joined: 10/10/2007
Msg: 54
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 2/3/2010 9:49:12 PM

I have a manfriend who has had FBs/FWBs over the last few years. Basically he did not date or have sex with others, but he did make it very clear to his 'special' friends that his feelings did not run to love, rather he felt friendship for ladies he was involved with.

I know this man very well, and he has expressed to me many times his deep desire to find the 'one' the woman he can love.

But the rub is that because he engages in these really easy "relationships", he doesn't have the biological urge/need to form a union in a better relationship. His basic needs are being satisfied: he gets sex, he gets female energy, he gets a friendly face in a place that smells nice, someone to talk to, AND has permission to leave if it gets "heavy" and he just doesn't feel like dealing with it. All without guilt or responsibility! If she gets her feelings hurt, well, that's too bad, she knew the rules--he doesn't have to care! Rarely do the men look within themselves and notice what's missing--a true connection to something bigger than "just here and now". Men are geniuses at escaping responsibilities of the heart by just ignoring their feelings.
 EvilLolli
Joined: 12/7/2008
Msg: 55
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 2/3/2010 10:02:17 PM
Honestly as humans aren't we all looking for "friends with benefits"?

Friend=someone we can trust, be open and honest with, let our hair down with, be our worst and best with, lean on and be leaned one. Laungh and cry. Some one we love and who loves us for ourselves(platonic or otherwise).

Benefits=intimacy, honesty, sexual compatibility, fun, humor.

So whether we call the other person a FWB or a GF/BF or wife/husband. We want someone we can have it all with. Unfortunately, there are different kinds of/levels of love. We love different people in different ways. Just because we label someone a FWB doesn't always mean there aren't feelings involved. It is probably why so many get hurt in these situations.

Getting hooked on an FWB? I think we are chasing after the ultimate FWB. The friend we have great sexual compatibility with that we can spend a life time with. The life long friendship that involves the romantic love we want.
 DIVISION77
Joined: 8/10/2009
Msg: 57
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 2/3/2010 11:25:29 PM
I would disagree with your assertion that FWB are "non-monogamous".

How many guys do you know that are OK with sharing a woman with other men?

I definitely wouldn't. I look down on men who share a woman with other guys. It's not something a dominant guy would ever do.

The majority of my relationships have been LTR, only had one FWB.

I am about to consider a monogamous FWB and yes, I do think they are definitely less hassle than a LTR. It's like having all the benefits of a LTR without some of the negatives. Limited time available means a limited relationship and often the majority of the time together is spent having sex which is definitely a plus. It's monogamous because there is an understanding between us that STD's will not be an issue and as long as the relationship runs smooth there's no reason to look elsewhere.

There's not a whole lot of difference between a FWB and a LTR, at least for me.



 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 72
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 2/4/2010 4:52:13 PM

Yanno, why is is every single time a man implies that he ain't interested in the "real" relationship, it's suddenly "fear based"?


Just to clarify, it wasn't your disinterest in pursuing a relationship, it was your allusion to the breakup that hinted at fear. I do not seek to judge you one bit, I would much prefer that one be honest enough to admit that they are not interested in finding a "real" relationship. Just as I don't know you, neither do you know me. I certainly do not equate an aversion to drama with fear.

There is nothing wrong with anyone who doesn't need a relationship. There is also nothing wrong with seeking one. To each his own. I was merely making an observation, and while your tone implies bitterness, I'll not take it to heart. I will continue to live my life, giving more when those about whom I care need me to do so, and taking more when I am in need from those who care about me; equal doses, with those whom I see fit to do so, and I will continue to sleep well. May you do the same.
 ladyc4
Joined: 2/14/2006
Msg: 75
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 2/4/2010 5:16:50 PM

What...women don't like sex now?

Unfortunately,BDJ, among women who grew up in the 60s and 70s,the only sex education girls got was being taught to avoid sex until there was a wedding ring on her finger,at which time sex would be a chore to be performed as part of taking good care of her husband.Fear was often the teaching tool of choice...fear of pregnancy, ostracism, that no decent man would want a girl/woman who 'did it', but that boys/men were devious creatures who would try to get sex without any kind of honorable committment or intent...
In short...IT WAS AWFUL. And many women have never gotten past it. Sex is that 'icky' chore you have to do to get and keep a committed relationship. And the parents were simply doing the best they know to keep their daughters from "getting knocked up" "getting a bad reputation","ruining her life"
Back then,in middleclass midwest small towns and suburban neighborhoods,parents would just about rather have their daughter identified as a terrorist,than to hear about her having sex and liking it.

Or simply don't understand that many women love sex, and love having it with men, as opposed to other alternatives.
And that many women get multiple orgasms. Sometimes many, many more than men.
Seems that sex between men and women is a great experience for women.

As I related in response to BDJ's post,unfortunately,many women who were teenagers/young women pre-birthcontrol pill,women raised in very conservative/religious/traditional families,know as much about orgasms as a hog knows about Sunday School.

Why would you be offering something that you didn't want to do, and weren't desiring to do with him, in the first place?
Again, because in more cases than I care to think about,women WERE taught that sex is a commodity,a bargaining chip, a means to an end.

You shouldn't exchange sex, for anything other than sex. Otherwise, it's prostitution.

Understand that I am NOT disagreeing with you,but in reality, women are taught, and often the teaching is reinforced by her peers,that sex should ONLY be exchanged for a "committment". Allowing herself to ejoy sex just for the hell of it, would be allowing herself to develop a bad habit,and impair her ability to drive a hard bargain,so to speak.

I think a man would eventually end FWB and leave that person if he has found the right woman for him.

And that is a perfectly permissible, understandable and acceptable end to a FwB, for EITHER gender.

FWB is horrible. All you're having is sex, sex and more sex. I don't know how you can live like that.

I dunno, son. From all I ever heard, most men in that circumstance would think they'd died and gone to Heaven.

Unless she falls from the sky and lands in my lap
now that would be an interesting sight...

Well, then... why did you let her get away??

Sometimes, even in VERY GOOD relationships,sh*t happens.Not realizing what you had,until it's over, is a fairly common breakup scenario,as well. That good ol'20-20 hindsight can be an absolute b*tch.
Cindy O
 GeneralizingNow
Joined: 10/10/2007
Msg: 76
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 2/4/2010 7:16:47 PM

You shouldn't exchange sex, for anything other than sex. Otherwise, it's prostitution.

Understand that I am NOT disagreeing with you,but in reality, women are taught, and often the teaching is reinforced by her peers,that sex should ONLY be exchanged for a "committment". Allowing herself to ejoy sex just for the hell of it, would be allowing herself to develop a bad habit,and impair her ability to drive a hard bargain,so to speak.

In fact, it is reinforced by I'd say HALF the men and women on here ("you had sex too soon so the guy lost respect for you"). If THAT isn't telling a woman to wait for a "commitment" (albeit not quite marriage), what is it? If telling women to "respect themselves" rather than (OMG!) have sex (!!) isn't reinforcing the old ways, what is?

I have a question:
It seems that most of those who are pro-FWB are ANTI-marriage. So, are any of your FWBs married? I mean, if marriage is meaningless, it shouldn't be off limits.
 Cat*Eyes
Joined: 9/13/2006
Msg: 81
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Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 2/5/2010 1:02:03 AM
What do the actual letters FWB mean? I understand what FWB means, but what do the letters FWB mean.
What do the letters OP mean? I know that means thread statrer, or person asking the question, but what does the letters OP mean?
In answer to the question of this post, I have tried meaningless shallow sex, just to have sex in the past, after my ex left, but I could not feel any pleasure or enjoyment, in this boring shallow meaningless activity. If I want meaningless sexual release, I have my colbalt blue, that takes 2 C batteries and gives me 20 to 40 "O"s. I can not relate to sex with a person, just to have sex anymore. I want to have sex with a man, who I am really attracted, who really appeals to me, and who knows what to do turn me on and be mutually involved in a SANE, loving caring relationship. Unless it is in a real relationship, of which I have not had for 5 years, I do not feel any sexual or any type of pleasure.
In answer to the thread, starter, questioner, go do your shallow one night stands and eventually you will learn, that that is not very enjoyable and definely not worthwhile, and very shallow and meaningless.
 blue450
Joined: 7/24/2009
Msg: 84
Hooked on having a FWB?
Posted: 2/5/2010 9:46:01 AM
....FWB works for me at this point in my life....I can cook, wash my own clothes,clean a bathroom and maintain my vehicle. Don't care to watch sports on t.v. although the scandals are of some interest LOL. I believe that you can have the same range of feelings & emotions for many and not just "one". I like to wake up & leave the house at 3 a.m. if i feel like going to a diner or just take a drive to nowhere. When I am with a woman I want to enjoy her company not particularly meet the family etc & so forth...I want to experience pleasure and give her pleasure too...My profile is direct & to the point. Some are intimidated. I have had some success online in what I seek and anticipate more....
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