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 Mr Bain
Joined: 12/6/2004
Msg: 1
Stereotypes against intellectualsPage 1 of 2    (1, 2)
After years of being exposed to pop culture and getting a crash course in social dynamics during my college years, its tempting to conclude that with regards to the dating world and most other walks of life, a superior education is viewed as distinctly feminine. That is to say, if you're a well-educated male, you will be viewed as immasculine and indecisive not only by women, but by society.

While it is true that there are a handful of celebrity male intellectuals, the fact that they stand out to such an extent illustrates how the contemporary American male is expected to be an imbecile and that any higher cultural development and education that he may possess is an indication of weakness and effeminate qualities.

This stereotype seems to have withstood the test of time. My question to you is, do you embrace it consciously or only because everyone else does?
 Commonsens
Joined: 4/6/2009
Msg: 2
Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/20/2010 5:58:42 PM

My question to you is, do you embrace it consciously or only because everyone else does?


I simply do not embrace it at all because the stereotype you stated is simply false!
According to YOUR stereotype: where do I stand? I have a PhD and I was in the military. hum! doesn't fit in your picture hey?
 aliveone1
Joined: 9/4/2008
Msg: 3
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Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/20/2010 5:59:12 PM
You are not leaving an option in your question for people who do not embrace this strereotype. I would fall into that category. In fact, this stereotype has never even occured to me. A more fitting stereotype (which I also do not subscribe to) might be that well educated people, male and female, can sometimes seem a bit too "tightly wound", and may tend hold too high opinions of themselves which make them somewhat hard to love.

Please Note: Feel free to angerily rant here:
 DIVISION77
Joined: 8/10/2009
Msg: 4
Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/20/2010 6:02:36 PM
I think you're dead wrong, Mr. Nubain.

Effeminite, indecisive, vanilla, metrosexual men are viewed as being feminine because they ARE.

It has nothing to do with intellect.

They are not mutually inclusive traits.

I think you need to get out more.

You've been trapped inside the recesses of your brain far too long.

Get some air........take a walk..........talk to a girl.


 Mr Bain
Joined: 12/6/2004
Msg: 5
Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/20/2010 6:04:33 PM
I have a basis, trust me. None of it is based on assumptions. Keep in mind, I'm not merely talking about the dating world, but society at large.

The election of a President who was patently incompetent and who had no intellectual capacity whatsoever.

The acceptance and subsequent profusion of hip-hop in our social psyche.

The increasing reliance on MTV and YouTube to get our information.

The print media becoming less relevant.

In the early 60's Richard Hofstadter wrote about how anti-intellectual America had become. I wonder what he would think now.
 aliveone1
Joined: 9/4/2008
Msg: 6
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Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/20/2010 6:19:26 PM
Maybe you are not looking for women in the right venues. Hang out in upscale coffee shops...meet them in classes while furtering your education....I dunno (yeah, that time the spelling mistake was intentional. ) , go to wine tastings? lol Art shows? Book clubs? Open mics? Poetry readings?

I live in a college town where many people are practically perpetual students including myself. Intellectual people come in all varieties, and at least where I live, are very easy to meet at social events. Maybe you just need to get out more!
 Mr Bain
Joined: 12/6/2004
Msg: 7
Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/20/2010 6:30:03 PM

Forgot which username you were posting under OP?


This thread was going to be under fire from the get-go.
 packagedealx3
Joined: 2/4/2006
Msg: 8
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Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/20/2010 6:44:28 PM
Um, maybe you encounter this because you go after the brainless women arm candy?

I know not one single woman who is not attracted to a male that exhibits intelligence and that has been educated unless he is utterly boring and otherwise unattractive to her physically. Most women I know would prefer a man that is intellectually challenging and as the mind is a huge part of sexual attraction someone that gets my brain is a huge turn on.

Don't know who you have been talking to but if someone is not an effeminate or physically weak person, no one is going to assume that they are because they are edjumacated. If they are effeminate and physically weak, do they expect to be perceived differently because they are intelligent and are educated?

Don't think life works that way.
 Mr Bain
Joined: 12/6/2004
Msg: 9
Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/20/2010 6:59:37 PM

I see on your profile, that you take drugs.


Everyone has had their lapses in judgment. Just because you have intellectual curiosity, does not mean that when you go off to college, you will have the discipline of a stable-minded middle-aged adult, who knows his limitations and is not susceptible to peer pressure. Nobody is a true square.

For everyone, no matter what their level of intelligence, they go through a period in which they learn the hard way, yes?
 MissNoWhere
Joined: 3/29/2008
Msg: 10
Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/20/2010 7:00:45 PM
I have nothing but total respect for anyone in the trades Jim ~ had to throw that out there. In my experience people who work in the trades are educated and continue their education beyond a trade school. I have total respect for the man who works on my car because I don't have the knack for it.

Back to the OP - intelligence does not make a man less of a man. Intelligence is sexy to me. I like to have an actual conversation with someone that doesn't involve celebrities or other such nonsense.
 rainman12
Joined: 10/18/2007
Msg: 11
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Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/20/2010 10:06:43 PM
I consider myself an intellectual, I might not have graduate degrees, but I know for a fact I'm smarter than most that do, in areas that really count anyway, such as LIFE and not narrow areas of study like Italian Renaissance Art History.

I seem to attract many smart and sexy women, they seem to appreciate that I'm not an idiot...maybe you're looking at the wrong girls?
 Mr Bain
Joined: 12/6/2004
Msg: 12
Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/21/2010 12:40:05 AM
I should clarify myself. I didn't exactly intend for this thread to provide insight into anything personal- much less the worst problem I have in life.

I created this thread, to not only touch on dating issues but on how we think of intellect as a society. Because, in my opinion, anti-intellectualism is better hidden today than it has ever been.

There is a stark difference between the inclination among amibitious people to go to graduate and professional school because it boosts their career credentials ("degreeism" as it called) and learning at a higher level for the sake of one's own intellectual enrichment. People who do it for the latter reason are decidedly in the minority these days. I refuse to believe that has always been the case.

This thread was not meant to be about me. There was a raft of issues that I wanted to bring to light. Evidently I failed miserably.

That being said, a day will come when hopefully, I will no longer have the habit that has been pointed out.
 arwen52
Joined: 3/13/2008
Msg: 13
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Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/21/2010 8:27:19 AM
I have a prejudice in *favor* of intellectuals, or at least very intelligent men. The men I've been most attracted to have had Ph.D.s. I find intelligence sexy and I find them to be better lovers because they are patient and observant.
 packagedealx3
Joined: 2/4/2006
Msg: 14
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Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/21/2010 5:59:23 PM
Madfiddler's post was one of the better on the thread. This whole thing is kind of a crock of shit because I think there are still many people in society that value education. I also know many people that have educated themselves without the benefit of "higher" education by reading books, articles, paying attention to current events, etc.

My parents were both school teachers. Our schools have declined significantly because parents don't encourage children to read and themselves eschew education and authority figures. Parents stopped being parents, went the opposite of the authoritarian parenting they experienced to the permissive parenting that started somewhat with my generation. Teachers were expected to raise the children but when they actually tried to discipline little Billy Mom and/or Dad were quickly up at the school preventing whatever disciplinary action had been posed.

Children are taught that everyone wins in sports so that their little self-esteems are supported but then in middle school they are taught that winning matters and consequently adopt the attitude that whatever is required to win is important. With school, even back in my day, kids dropped the honors classes in order to spike their GPA. Parents can obtain a non-timed status for their children in taking the ACT and SAT exams. It is so important for their child to get an education that they fail to make sure they actually get the education they need before college, getting into school is more important than learning.

Even with the way kids are graded, this sets up false expectations, entitlement attitudes and creates an environment within which it is possible to do well in school without knowing much of anything. I have had friends who had teachers that gave them good grades for papers that were barely intelligible because instead of expecting skills from other subjects to cross over, if they exhibited any knowledge of the content, their inability to express it was ignored.

Most teachers are underpaid so the top thinkers in our country tend to avoid going into teaching unless they plan on becoming a professor and in most cases, that doesn't pay particularly well either. People like W instituted the standardized testing that now occurs in Texas that requires that teachers waste precious class time teaching the kids how to pass the test rather than educate them.

But here's the thing. Look around you and in the media, Hollywood for example. The vast majority of people in the acting profession are intelligent, well-read, and have the benefit of voices that are heard by many people and many of them do not dumb themselves down during interviews and provide good role models. More athletes are actually getting the education and stressing to up and coming young people that this is what is important and that the entitlement attitude one can develop when he is talented in the end doesn't do much toward providing for one's future.

So many people buy into the dumb athlete thing, and that those kids have college easier. Maybe they do have the free ride so they don't have to worry about money and many do not belong there scholastically but these kids need to maintain a normal classload and a minimum GPA. So if they were not taught to read or anything else in high school they have a huge uphill battle to keep that scholarship that has nothing to do with their athletic ability. They are required to miss class time to travel for away games and have at least one practice usually daily during season, with two-a-days sometimes lasting into the school year, weight training commitments, team meetings and they are on top of this supposed to carry a fulltime course load when many will also be required to engage tutors in order to pass their classes. An average college student that does not work sometimes has trouble keeping up with the reading, so an undereducated athlete with a huge block of time committed to the sport he participates is somehow having an easier time of it?

Until more parents start giving a shit about how they raise their children, until more parents who see a kid whose parents don't give a shit and try to encourage that child, until people stop talking down to children like they are retarded and recognize that their example, reading, not reading, etc. is a heavy influence on their child, people will continue to be massively undereducated.

You cannot also equate entertainment choices as being indicative of the overall intellect of a society. My reading choices are very varied, some absolute drivel in terms of great literature as well as books on politics, history, etc. I can watch hideously stupid programs or movies and be entertained because I choose to suspend my connection with reality in order to do so. With my kids, however, even when watching farce, I choose to point out the life lessons, the kernel of truth in something funny so that they think about the world within which they live and how they wish to live in it.

Those sitting complaining about the deplorable lack of intellect in society volunteered at a school recently?
 Mr Bain
Joined: 12/6/2004
Msg: 15
Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/21/2010 6:05:23 PM

You cannot also equate entertainment choices as being indicative of the overall intellect of a society.


Uh, yeah I can actually. It's fair game.
 Strings6
Joined: 7/14/2007
Msg: 16
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Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/22/2010 3:06:45 PM
Being superior is a burden some must bear i guess..my favorite people are the pseudo intellectuals.
 daynadaze
Joined: 2/11/2008
Msg: 17
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Stereotypes against intellectuals
Posted: 2/22/2010 3:48:16 PM
I have never in my life thought of a well educated man as not masculine, that's the dumbest thing I think I may have ever heard. WTF????
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