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Joined: 5/2/2011
Msg: 1
Dating Out of Your LeaguePage 1 of 7    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7)
I was just curious if most men here tend to try contacting women they have things in common with, or just the best looking women you see. If your education is minimal, do you try contacting women with advanced degrees? (I'm talking glaring contrast)
If you are an average looking Joe, do you approach really pretty ladies? I know this is bound to be highly controversial, but I really am curious. Do men tend to "seek their own level" or get what even they, perceive to be out of their league. I already know women are more flexible with this in general.
Ladies, please tell me if you think men are delusional or just testing. Do women feel pressured to entertain guys far less attractive or educated? (When I speak of less educated, I mean notably deficient. Some people thrive without an advanced education and the lack of it is not noticeable in conversation or writing.) About attraction, I am so sick of hearing "men are visual creatures". Women have eyes too.
Joined: 7/9/2011
Msg: 2
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/23/2011 12:35:07 PM
This subject is somewhat like other threads - attraction vs personality, education, et al.

I think it depends on the person. I know some men that think they deserve young beautiful females and complain they leave after all they've given them. They don't believe the toys, jewelry, bill paying....was what landed them in the first place.

I'm not saying a beautiful woman won't go for someone average. There are some very pretty ladies that are not selfish and into themselves.

Not all men are after the trophy either. Just a bit more searching involved for those.

But both sexes are visual. What is attractive to one might not be to another. For example: I don't think Brad Pitt or Tom Cruise are good looking. Other women think they are hot. I think Danny Glover and Peter Greene are handsome. My GF looks at me with big eyes.

I have an education but don't flaunt it. I receive messages from men that only have high school and their messages are full of errors...but I will give them a chance because lacking skills there doesn't mean they lack in integrity, morals, personality....maybe they had to go to work early on to help their family so education stopped.

Some men will use caps and admit they like using them. Not using periods makes a message hard to read. If you got through high school, you learned about using them. At that stage it's laziness.

I've had messages from men with master degrees (so they say) and their messages are so full of words not spoken in every day life it becomes boring. For some ladies, I'm sure it can be intimidating.
Joined: 6/30/2011
Msg: 3
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Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/23/2011 5:16:58 PM
I am speaking about my guy friends who in my opinion are very shallow minded(but very educated) and tend to pick the very pretty and busty woman. Then they cry to me that the woman only want their money, well duh. I tend to be my male friends wing man(woman) but it's useless trying to tell them to go for the overall package which they never do! As for me that is a very hard question(regarding education) because a man may not have gone to college but still can be very intellegnt and suceeded in life.
Honestly, I have never met anyone who hasn't graduated from some form of college.
Joined: 6/30/2011
Msg: 4
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Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/23/2011 5:20:33 PM
One more thing, you can't stereotype a person's education. My ex was a cardiologist and he couldn't write for crap?
Joined: 5/2/2011
Msg: 5
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/23/2011 9:17:03 PM
Steve. You are right. Many women do ideally want a man to make more than they do. It all goes back to the Prince Charming you mentioned. Most of us (women) by now don't exactly buy into that fantasy. This idea has long gone out the window for me.

A little slang and text abbreviations don't bother me at all. There is a difference between those messages and reading a message from someone who clearly has no command of the English language (despite being born and raised here.) Errors are a completely different story. I'm sure I have probably made a few in this posting alone. Well anyway, if a person is functionally illiterate, I just don't see why they would even think there would be a connection. You guys are confusing typos, and misspellings with functional illiteracy. I guess I did not clarify initially.

Now as for the looks, I guess no one is challenging the fact that most men tend to go for the girls that will make all their friends jealous- the Barbie- the "10" even if the man is a "3". Yes, I know Barbie is not a "1o" in everyone's book, but you know what I mean.

In contrast, I think most women are fine with a decent or average man. All bet's are off for men aiming for the materialistic Barbie type.
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 6
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/24/2011 8:41:59 AM
If you want to be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.

When you reach my age you will completely accept this as transcendent wisdom. However, you will only really, really appreciate it after you've found out the hard way... with women out of your league.
Joined: 11/14/2010
Msg: 7
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/24/2011 10:49:28 AM
I don't see beauty or the lack of beauty as anything more than it is. A woman who has an elegant globetrotting lifestyle is out of my league, unless she wanted a guy in L.A. when she visits.
There does need to be some initial attraction, but after that stage, other factors come into play. The most "beautiful" woman I ever met is pretty average in looks, but there's much more going on under the skin.
Having bought and sold cars for most of my life, I can vouch for the fact that the prettiest cars are not always the best running!
Joined: 7/3/2011
Msg: 8
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/24/2011 12:12:42 PM
men are usually more shallow than women but in the last 10 years women have caught up.

Anyone dating just for looks is not going to have a good outcome. Why do you think so many older men get rid of their wives for younger ones. It's not about love to them; they are not as attracted and want a prettier woman.

Men are visual creatures. Eating a fatty diet is unhealthy and that's true too; so is it not true because people are sick of hearing it?

I don't believe in "leagues". if people are that shallow that looks are their main focus then I dont' want to associate much with them.

A mature adult realizes attraction is NOT about looks. it's about everything about the person.
Joined: 11/9/2010
Msg: 9
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/24/2011 6:34:03 PM
Ok lets see
Typing ; are you the greates typer on a laptop ? Iam not ! never took typing and sometime my fingers cant keep up with my brain!
Education; it would seem that women (and maybe men) with a higher education cant even respond to a sent message, Which is really funny because when they go out dancing its a guy like me ,that they will dance all night with and have a intelligent conversation with.
My opinon is that we all will go off looks first ! and ask question later !
Joined: 5/19/2008
Msg: 10
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/24/2011 11:56:45 PM
Maybe because I am a woman, I am only seeing it from one side, but I think by and large men are SHAMELESS when it comes to this.

I have learned that if I am INSTANTLY attracted to a guy's pictures I probably should not date him. It usually means he's bad for me. hahahah.

That said, there is a syndrome that I call the "According to Jim syndrome". Fat, ugly guy with no education (Jim Belushi) married to hot blond chick who is uber-educated and adores him.

Drives me batty. Yes, I get a lot of guys I wouldn't go out with (only because bald does not attract me and I try to stay within 5 years of my age and in the same general fitness range) . Then again, I get a lot of Tools who can't string two words together and want a supermodel with no IQ to speak of.

Personally, I want a guy who takes care of himself and can support himself because I don't want to be supporting anyone else. That has become my only criteria in the online dating arena. Support yourself and be fit with hair.
Joined: 5/2/2011
Msg: 11
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/25/2011 10:12:46 AM
Thank you SFGiantsfan. I just need one person to validate my perspective- so mission accomplished! Don't call it low self esteem...Call it, am I crazy or... I was beginning to think I was!

The guys that I instantly feel attracted to- I know I should not continue with. I think it comes with age and maturity. Not for others, but I speak for myself only. You too have learned the same thing. It means that if I "like" you like that- common sense goes
out the window. This is a guarantee for trouble. It seems many men have this same outcome but refuse to learn from it (according to some posts I have read)
It doesnt mean date only people no one else wants, or people you are not attracted to.

Right now I am TRYING to date guys that I am "ok" with as far as attraction and allow their non physical attributes and compatibility determine the course. Funny thing is- even many of those idealize what they consider perfection, even if they fall very short in an obvious way.

Give me a man living at home, 40 years old, beer belly, nose twice the size of what is symmetrically pleasing, laid off- and sick of looking, 2 kids- 2 diff moms, and a car that starts occasionally. ( I am NOT exaggerating- I will introduce you!) And I will give you a man that seeks Lauren London orMegan Fox and feels he shouldn't fall short of this.

I deeply and sincerely think and hope this is regional. Henceforth the premise of the show Hot in Cleveland.
Joined: 5/19/2008
Msg: 12
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/25/2011 10:35:09 AM
I do believe it is regional. I used to live in the SF Bay Area. By far, the SHALLOWEST (if that is a word) place IN THE WHOLE US (seriously, Rated #1) for dating. The men there were ridiculous. It was truly sad. Guys there would go out with these beautiful, successful women, sleep with them once, and then move on to "greener pastures" as it were. Guys that literally had NO business even dating these women and they were throwing them over. I could not believe it. And trust me, it does not go unnoticed. I believe that 90% of the men up there are players. At least down here (I just moved in June of last year) I'm seeing different men on dating sites. LOL.

That aside, think about these shows:
The Honeymooners
The Flintsones
I Love Lucy (Fred & Ethel)
Wizards of Waverly Place (I know, on Disney but the dad married WAY out of his league)
Sorry Charlie (Disney as well)
Modern Family

I could go on and on...

My ex-boyfriend (I don't know why POF says I joined in 2008, I just joined this year) held absolutely NO attraction for me on the first date, but we laughed ourselves silly. By the third date I was seriously attracted to him. Sometimes it takes a while. He turned out to be a cheating tool, but the point is, even if you aren't necessarily attracted at first, if you have enough in common and you have a good time, give it another shot. Sometimes getting to know someone makes them MORE attractive.
Joined: 5/2/2011
Msg: 13
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/25/2011 10:53:03 AM
Hiya Steve, I had to read your post a couple times. (My brain slows in the summer to allow cells to regenerate for the year.) The ladies going to England I can't speak for. There are 40 year olds who are attracted to Justin Beiber (spelling?)

As for the car scenario. That was a dumb test. If the SAME guy is in a beat up car then a nicer one, yes, that ups his points. Let me speak the language for some of you men--- push up bra/ bra without needed support ---makeup/ no make up---or better yet ---bikini/ large fluffy bathrobe and shower cap. Women can see through ALL of this, but this can take a "6" to a "10" in the opinion of many men.

Some of you nay-sayers will find fault, yes, we know some of you like natural women. The thing is some of you men are clueless how unnatural your "natural" women are. Some of you say one thing and do the opposite. I really appreciate the men here who are honest with themselves.
Joined: 9/17/2010
Msg: 14
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/28/2011 1:02:20 PM
I have found that a lot of the women on dating sites are trying to snag a well to do guy. Just look at their profiles: like to travel, fine dining, wine tasting, etc. I have not seen: love to watch TV, Videos, play with the dogs and eat home cooked meals. I am not saying that the guys are not any better...I haven't looked at mens profiles nor have I tried to date any.

I am starting to believe the type of lady I am looking for is probably not the type to go online. I admit I have dated a few women that closely fit the bill, but the chemistry wasn’t there. We have remained friends. Chemistry is not only about looks, it has to do with their compassion, how they treat others and their educational level does not matter. But the hardest thing for me to find is the spunky, happy, silly lady. It is hard to put it into words, but all I can say is I haven’t found the lady yet that has that special quality. May be I am being unrealistic, but I feel she is out there. “Patient’s is a virtue”
Joined: 8/11/2011
Msg: 15
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/29/2011 9:44:32 AM
There is no such thing as LEAGUE when dating

Models love hillbillies, Doctors love fat girls

Lawyers like pot heads

There's a saying Opposites attract and that is why people are so damn confused

You never know who you're going to be attracted to At first it may be looks with no soul, or personality with no looks

When online its a numbers game, you contact those your attracted to, those you have things in common with, those who just look fun and then wait to see what happens, what you think may be your soul mate may be insane and those you would normally never give a second look to may end up being the love of your life

However there are trolls on here who contact every single person in hopes of a quick hookup or financial gain but they are the exception not the rule

Me personality is important, looks are a door opener but not the most important, Id take a average honest faithful woman over a super model any day
Joined: 6/21/2011
Msg: 16
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 8/30/2011 9:04:33 AM
It may be true. I always see pretty girls with ugly dudes. Even I, myself, have always done pretty well for myself, I would have to say, but that isn't why I date them..
Joined: 3/11/2011
Msg: 17
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 9/2/2011 9:13:01 AM

Now as for the looks, I guess no one is challenging the fact that most men tend to go for the girls that will make all their friends jealous- the Barbie- the "10" even if the man is a "3". Yes, I know Barbie is not a "1o" in everyone's book, but you know what I mean.

In contrast, I think most women are fine with a decent or average man. All bet's are off for men aiming for the materialistic Barbie type.

if you're a female over 30 and you're not dating 50-60 year olds, you should be thankful if any guy willing to date you has a job and the ability to speak semi-coherent broken english...they're doing YOU a's biology...and society has set up all these false expectations...I don't know how many times I've heard an older woman tell a younger woman that she should stay out of relationships, meet people, date around alot, and have fun...really catty, jealous, and cruel advice as far as the big picture goes.

Men age like wine, women age see alot of older men dating younger women because younger men can't afford to date as much...the younger women are fine with that, they just want to go out and have fun...then when they get older they want guys their own age....did you really think we wouldn't remember? Come on now...stop being bitter.

A mans value is based in large part on experience and accomplishment (waxing), a woman's on youth and attractiveness (waning), so it really doesn't make much sense, in fact it's just unrealistic to expect two 10's to end up together for any length of time.
Joined: 8/16/2011
Msg: 18
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 9/2/2011 10:14:47 AM
As long as you don't date any Little Leaguers. I believe you'd do some hard time for that.
Joined: 7/30/2011
Msg: 19
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 9/3/2011 12:32:04 AM
My aim is usually for someone who seems perfect for me...has all of the major qualities I look for in someone. I don't send messages to girls just based on their looks...I think this is what you're implying with your post.

Hell...I don't really send messages anymore...I mainly just e-people watch.
Joined: 4/11/2011
Msg: 20
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 9/6/2011 11:31:51 PM
Very well said.
I myself prefer MaryAnn to Ginger everyday of the week.

But like Steiner said to Kyle in "She out of my league" you can only date within two points, unless you're in a band! That movie is funnier than heck.

Here's my take on this subject and I use myself as the test case.

In high school women want the bad boys or the start jock or the popular, which is usually the bad boy or the jock. The average guy or nerd is caustic.

In college women want the bad boy or the pretty frat boy, the nerd and average guy are caustic.

The nerd and average guy though is the die-hard friend and is always there when the female is dumped brutally .... we chuckle to ourselves at their stupidity, but we all learn at our own pace!

Women get to their thirties and if they weren't blessed to find the solid guy early, all of a sudden the nerd or average guy has blossomed through life, and finds himself in demand.

Guys are like that too, I saw how my friends were with women .... I loved going back for the 20 year reunion and seeing who blossomed and which of the beauty queens were just sad. And when I say blossom, I'm talking personality and confidence wise.

I didn't date in high school, dabbled in the Air Force, but found my self in my mid 30's. I always gravitated to women whom experienced life like me kind of. But I sure as heck wouldn't have said no to Joey Lauren Adams if she had asked me out!


Who knows what each of us will find attractive and stimulating. I like a 6.5 with personality because that's what I am. They are my 10 :)
Joined: 3/24/2011
Msg: 21
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 9/7/2011 9:45:47 AM
The most important for me is lifestyle. I am very active, run, hike, swim (thinking of doing the Lavaman triathlon next April)enjoy travelling, nice dinners which I do with my girlfriends. I take care of myself and looking for the same in my partner. I am NOT interested in watching sports on tv eating potato chips, etc...don't get me wrong, i love going to football, baseball, hockey, and soccer games but not interested in someone who lives and schedules his life around the football season. To each his own but it is not for me. Hope this makes sense.
Joined: 3/24/2011
Msg: 22
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 9/7/2011 9:51:05 AM
Btw, I always pass the men who put fancy cars in their profile, if that is the only thing you can offer, NOT interested.
Joined: 9/22/2010
Msg: 23
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Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 9/7/2011 2:16:09 PM
I basically have three criteria, which I surmise from their profile:

1) They appear to be emotionally stable.
2) We have at least one thing in common.
3) I find her attractive

There would be more for forming a LTR, but being interested enough to message is another thing :)
Joined: 4/30/2011
Msg: 24
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 9/8/2011 12:39:12 AM
I only message girls if 1) they look like someone I could possible be attracted to and 2) we have something in common. I don't get many replies that way but then I think that's the norm. Funny part is if I message someone with whom I have nothing in common or better yet make the message really rude or disgusting I get a reply most every time. Confusing to say the least.
Joined: 7/18/2010
Msg: 25
Dating Out of Your League
Posted: 9/8/2011 9:21:54 PM
There is no such thing as "dating out of your league". That is high school play. You can date or attempt to date anyone who feels right.
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