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 AUTHOR
 orionids4ever
Joined: 8/14/2011
Msg: 1
Deep sleep nude photo shootPage 1 of 5    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5)
After having dated this guy from POF for three months, he tells me that he took nude pictures of me while I was sleeping. When I said that I am very uncomfortable with it and I feel this is a betrayal of my trust, he said that it isn't because he told me about it. When we broke up, I asked him to delete them and it turned into a big discussion because he couldn't just say o.k. will do, but defended it as something perfectly normal. I was very upset about it . I will never know if he deleted them, because he never had the decency to come to my house or make an appointment to meet with me so he can delete them in my presence. Any feedback on this?
 orionids4ever
Joined: 8/14/2011
Msg: 2
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 9:48:12 PM
Not really. However, in retrospect, I suppose his emotional detachment and unavailability could have been a sign that he would be capable of something like that. When I said that doing something like this is unethical because it violates my privacy, my trust, and it is controlling because now he has control over me with these pictures, he completely refused to acknowledge my feelings and refuted any of these points by saying "there is nothing wrong with doing this". I am so upset about it I even tried to get back together with him just so I can get my hands on his phone or have him delete them in my presence, but I had hinted that I would do that in an argument and he didn't go for it when I tried.
 _TALL_IQ2_
Joined: 2/10/2010
Msg: 3
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 9:57:16 PM
Any feedback on this?

We like the one with that butterfly tat on your backside best..

You are 48 and you still have to deal with this issue? What was HE, 24?
That's a whole nother thread..
IF you know his relatives/friends, you could say you will tell them about his behavior unless he shows you he deleted those pics.. (tho he still could have made copies anywhere)
 coastalmermaid
Joined: 1/23/2011
Msg: 4
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 10:03:49 PM
It's so obviously a HUGE betrayal of trust and invasion and violation of personal privacy. What a low-life. Maybe he was just making it up because he was angry about the break-up?

If he's telling the truth, there's absolutely nothing normal about his actions. Telling you about it doesn't make it normal or ok in any way. I don't think there's anything can be done except learn from the experience and be content with the fact that if he violated your privacy that early on...who knows what he would have been capable of in the future?
 orionids4ever
Joined: 8/14/2011
Msg: 5
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 10:09:02 PM
Lol, no it is a scorpion and it will sting you! I know his daughter, but that is obviously not an option.
 BoonDockSaint73
Joined: 3/29/2010
Msg: 6
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 10:11:09 PM
OP - ok, this dude was clearly weird...

there is nothign you can do other than to disappear from his life and do you own thang.
 TotalTexan
Joined: 8/30/2011
Msg: 7
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 10:11:58 PM
Definitely a betrayal, definitely NOT normal.
 CompletelyDone
Joined: 8/12/2007
Msg: 8
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 10:19:14 PM
In the same situation, I would be extremely angry. If he refused to hand over the pictures and delete the pictures from his camera where you can watch him do it, I'd be calling my lawyer about invasion of privacy laws in my area. This is a tough one because there may be an implied consent if you were sleeping nude at his house. Your lawyer could write him a demand letter or you might want to check in with the police.

I'd be nailin' his azz to the wall somehow. That you can be sure of but it's always good to check with the law to find out how much time you'd do on a first time offence for assault. Some things are just worth it!!! That's just SOOOO wrong!!!

(^Of course, I'm just kidding about the assault but I am NOT kidding about getting in touch with a lawyer and the police. Good luck!!!)
 southmeetswest
Joined: 4/26/2010
Msg: 9
view profile
History
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 10:26:57 PM
i am with silken fire on this one

consult an attorney. just getting a letter from an attorney may be enough to cause him to turn the photos over.

there are laws that protect people from taking pictures without consent, dealing specifically with sleeping or passed out people.

kaylee
 WreckLoose
Joined: 7/4/2011
Msg: 10
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 10:40:21 PM
Disclaimer: We, nor the operators, administrators, or any other persons involved with the making, developing, or broadcasting of media on this site , with or with out written consent or permission being issued by corporate authority acknowledge nor condone the following: But, that being stated ...we had an old fashioned way of dealing with predators such as this a-hole...it's called country justice: get yourself 4 to 5 or your biggest, strongest, and nasty friends you know and have them pay this guy a "visit" - so to speak. Hate to say it, but sometimes things just have to be dealt with.
 CompletelyDone
Joined: 8/12/2007
Msg: 11
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 10:59:37 PM
Florida Criminal Code:

810.145 Video voyeurism.—
(1) As used in this section, the term:
(a) “Broadcast” means electronically transmitting a visual image with the intent that it be viewed by another person.

(b) “Imaging device” means any mechanical, digital, or electronic viewing device; still camera; camcorder; motion picture camera; or any other instrument, equipment, or format capable of recording, storing, or transmitting visual images of another person.

(c) “Place and time when a person has a reasonable expectation of privacy” means a place and time when a reasonable person would believe that he or she could fully disrobe in privacy, without being concerned that the person’s undressing was being viewed, recorded, or broadcasted by another, including, but not limited to, the interior of a bathroom, changing room, fitting room, dressing room, or tanning booth.

(d) “Privately exposing the body” means exposing a sexual organ.

(2) A person commits the offense of video voyeurism if that person:
(a) For his or her own amusement, entertainment, sexual arousal, gratification, or profit, or for the purpose of degrading or abusing another person, intentionally uses or installs an imaging device to secretly view, broadcast, or record a person, without that person’s knowledge and consent, who is dressing, undressing, or privately exposing the body, at a place and time when that person has a reasonable expectation of privacy;

(b) For the amusement, entertainment, sexual arousal, gratification, or profit of another, or on behalf of another, intentionally permits the use or installation of an imaging device to secretly view, broadcast, or record a person, without that person’s knowledge and consent, who is dressing, undressing, or privately exposing the body, at a place and time when that person has a reasonable expectation of privacy; or

(c) For the amusement, entertainment, sexual arousal, gratification, or profit of oneself or another, or on behalf of oneself or another, intentionally uses an imaging device to secretly view, broadcast, or record under or through the clothing being worn by another person, without that person’s knowledge and consent, for the purpose of viewing the body of, or the undergarments worn by, that person.

(3) A person commits the offense of video voyeurism dissemination if that person, knowing or having reason to believe that an image was created in a manner described in this section, intentionally disseminates, distributes, or transfers the image to another person for the purpose of amusement, entertainment, sexual arousal, gratification, or profit, or for the purpose of degrading or abusing another person.

(4) A person commits the offense of commercial video voyeurism dissemination if that person:
(a) Knowing or having reason to believe that an image was created in a manner described in this section, sells the image for consideration to another person; or

(b) Having created the image in a manner described in this section, disseminates, distributes, or transfers the image to another person for that person to sell the image to others.

There is much more in this section but as you can see OP, it IS against the law. Contact the police or your lawyer.
 orionids4ever
Joined: 8/14/2011
Msg: 12
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 11:04:13 PM
You are all awesome with the support you have provided. It really makes me feel much better to be so overwhelmingly validated with this. In one of our arguments I told him that he would have to search far and wide to find any man or woman that would agree that there is nothing wrong with doing that. Thank-you Silken for going the extra mile and finding this for me. I will sleep much better tonight : )
 CompletelyDone
Joined: 8/12/2007
Msg: 13
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 11:05:30 PM
Sorry.... Here's the URL for the above section of Florida's Criminal Code:

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0800-0899/0810/Sections/0810.145.html

Edit to add:

You're very welcome Gaby... Good luck! (If you do find it necessary to proceed, I'd sure like to hear how you make out if you would care to share it... by p.m. here if you like... )
 WreckLoose
Joined: 7/4/2011
Msg: 14
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 11:08:31 PM
I agree completely...Silken, you are one of the special people in this world.
 CompletelyDone
Joined: 8/12/2007
Msg: 15
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 11:24:52 PM
Silken... I'm gunna interject here... I think contacting the police will do nothing. Contacting an attorney might do the same. Remember the guy can just as quickly delete these images... Bottom line is it will cause the OP more trouble then its worth. Sometimes its best just to walk away...


Okay... here's how I see it Maffers... There's a HUGE difference in a person making this type of decision based on thinking there is no law to protect people from this kind of activity or alternatively, knowing that there are laws in place and opting whether or not to use them.

While it's certainly true that the police or the Crown (or both) may also opt not to proceed based on being unable to come up with the evidence, a letter from her attorney advising him that he faces criminal charges and/or a civil suit for damages would at least inform the jerk that she is prepared to take a legal posture.

I feel it's worthy to add that along with the legislatures in every country now having to create laws to deal with things like cellular cameras and computers, there is a concerted effort to have people understand their obligations where privacy is concerned. He may just wind up as an example.

No one should have to feel helpless because they trusted someone who turns out to be a complete puke!!!
 AintNoDeal
Joined: 2/3/2010
Msg: 16
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 11:34:52 PM
Lots of unanswered questions regarding the photos: (For you to think about OP, do not answer these here)
- How many did he take?
- How many times did he photograph you in your sleep?
- Did he pose/move you while you were sleeping?
- What was done with the photo files?

With this in mind, clearly your trust has been violated. What would a reasonable person expect? Not to be photographed, of course. Unfortunately, what's done is done, and those pics could be on the walls of a 100 bookstores in Thailand by now.

I think the critical issue is What Did You Do When You Found Out? You tried to recoved the photos and have the content deleted/destroyed. That's good, but I agree with Silken in that this is also a legal issue, and if you'll pardon the pun, you've got to CYA.

I think you should have a lawyer send that request to cease/desist/destroy the photos. Why? It gives you a paper-trail and record that shows your INTENT and EFFORT at controlling your PUBLIC IMAGE and PRIVACY. This way if the images ever turn up you won't have to explain to a judge why you didn't do anything about it when you FIRST found out.

The bottom line is that you can NEVER VERIFY that all the files are gone. But having the legal record of your effort to contain the damage will be to your favor in the future.
 Giggles10000
Joined: 6/17/2011
Msg: 17
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 11:56:22 PM
All he has to say was that he was messing with her and no pictures ever existed...she hasn't seen them and has no way to know they are real or not.

My ex took pictures of me, not all nude but if I asked him to delete one he would refuse saying he had the right to keep whatever pics of me he wanted...I was tempted to just accidentally on purpose drop his Iphone in the toilet and let him swim for it!
 CompletelyDone
Joined: 8/12/2007
Msg: 18
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/5/2011 11:58:02 PM

Yes the guy is a complete puke not arguing that... I'm arguing what is the best interest of the OP. Walk away with what ever photo's video the guy has.. Your telling her to contact the police and/or consult with and attorney which I'm saying is pointless... Of course no one should feel helpless. I'm saying to the OP the path of least resistance... I'm only offering the the high road here... Just walk away despite the threats don't engage...


Maffers... have no doubt that my reading comprehension is pretty good. I know exactly what you are recommending and I personally think that forum brainstorming of options can be a real gift to a forum member. From those, he or she can choose what is best for her.

You have suggested she ASSUME apathy in the judiciary and that the "high road" is for her to just walk away, leave him with her pics and just hope her pics don't get around. I don't think that's the "high road" my friend. Even if all she does is file a report and all the cops do is actually file the report, if she comes away with a file number, they will note that in his file and IF there are further occurences, it will be factored in by whatever trial judge is adjudicating or sentencing the creep.

It isn't necessary that we agree and it's great that she's hearing ALL of her options. At the end of the day, the high road might be her own contribution to setting the example that this invasion of privacy is NOT okay to the kind of cretins who may be considering doing the same thing.
 CompletelyDone
Joined: 8/12/2007
Msg: 19
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/6/2011 1:35:09 AM

It wasn't apathy it was best not open up a hornets nest. We are only getting one side of this story. Her side... Remember that... Of course invasion of privacy is not ok, but is that what has occurred here? Think about it... Your threatening legal action and I'm saying phuck it... Don't give the guy the time of day...


Okay... you didn't use the word "apathy" but you did say that it might be pointless to go to the police or a lawyer because they likely wouldn't do anything. Well, correction... at first, you said that it was not against the law to do what he did. It IS against the law. Then, you said the judiciary would likely do nothing so it was pointless for her to discuss this matter with them. To me, that's assuming apathy in the judiciary. You told her to "take the high road and do nothing"... I don't agree with what you consider the high road to be in this case.

And now, you're saying, we don't know both sides of the story. That's SO RIGHT!!! That's WHY she should consult those who will take her side of the story and either wait for his side of the story to come back to them, head out and arrest him, take a report and do nothing more or do nothing at all... Since we can't get his side of the story, as is the case in 99.9% of these forum postings, and maybe we don't have the full story from her either (as is often the case in an OP's first posting here) so it just makes sense for her to make the INFORMED decision of what options are available to her from the professionals who do know. Just because she consults the police or an attorney, she is not then duty bound to proceed with charges or a civil suit. But at least, she'll know exactly what she's taking the high road from. To me, this is just common sense and being responsible to herself.
 RandomScause
Joined: 8/16/2011
Msg: 20
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/6/2011 4:29:23 AM
He is either stuppid or he is very moral.

If he is stuppid, then the opposite to his personality would be to make back-ups, and delete something in front of you.

If he is molar, then he was trying to teach you to never again sleep in the nude.

I mean, if he is moral, then he is trying to teach you that you can trust him. He is trying to show you that you can trust him because
1. He admitted something that he did not have to, and had no reason to, other than to make a confessional
2. He refused to lie to you by saying he deleted them, because he knows digitial stuff

He is trying to say you can alway trust him coz he never lies. He could have lied to you twice, and smoothed all ruffled feathers, but that's not him, he says. In so many other words, that you can't hear, because you are too concerned (very understandibly) with the issue of someone having your nude photos.

So... you two speak two different tongues in moral reasoning. Good thing you split up, I applaud that decision.
 RandomScause
Joined: 8/16/2011
Msg: 21
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/6/2011 4:34:45 AM
Silken fire... please help me out. I am not arguing, not intend to, I am out to find the facts that it is illegal what the guy did.

Is it illegal to take pictures of a sleeping person?

Or is it illegal to take nude pictures of someone without her knowledge?

Or is it illegal to refuse to give up nude pictures of a person when he or she demands to have them given up?

What IS the illegal thing here? Is that covered by a statute? I am totally lost here.

Please help me out. I really don't know this law. Could you cite the law? or at least the point at the illegal thing in this event. I am interested in law, I am writing a book about the spirit and system of law in North America, the British System, so it would help me. So help me god, I am not writing to you to ask you so I would need to give up the 1000's of pictures I took each of my sleeping beauties. (haha. N o t true.)
 CompletelyDone
Joined: 8/12/2007
Msg: 22
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/6/2011 4:52:51 AM
Silken fire... please help me out. I am not arguing, not intend to, I am out to find the facts that it is illegal what the guy did.

Is it illegal to take pictures of a sleeping person?

Or is it illegal to take nude pictures of someone without her knowledge?

Or is it illegal to refuse to give up nude pictures of a person when he or she demands to have them given up?

What IS the illegal thing here? Is that covered by a statute? I am totally lost here.

Please help me out. I really don't know this law. Could you cite the law? or at least the point at the illegal thing in this event. I am interested in law, I am writing a book about the spirit and system of law in North America, the British System, so it would help me. So help me god, I am not writing to you to ask you so I would need to give up the 1000's of pictures I took each of my sleeping beauties. (haha. N o t true.)


Please see what I think may be the relevant section of the Florida Criminal Code under msg. 15 in this thread. As is always the case in criminal law, each case is adjudicated based on its own circumstances and various other things factor into it as well. The onus would be on the prosecution to prove its case "beyond a reasonable doubt".

I understand that invasion of privacy may also be considered a "tort" (a wrongdoing) and trigger a civil case where the onus is on the defence to prove his liability in the matter and her damages as well. The case is decided on "the balance of probabilities" which is a far wider measure.

The O.J. Simpson case where he was found "not guilty" (which is not the same as innocent but did set him free) in criminal court but he was held to be liable and to pay damages is a good example of what I am talking about in the foregoing paragraph.

I am not a lawyer and this is not legal advice. I am a paralegal of several years experience with a bit of common sense thrown in for good measure. In life, I don't make decisions without FULLY informing myself of my options and where they are likely to lead me. It pisses me off to find out later that I had rights no one told me about. Thus my suggestion to this OP under the circumstances.

I hope I've helped...

Edited to add: When cellular phones first had cameras, the wireless mobility companies were mandated to ensure that the phones would emit a noticeable sound when the camera was taking a picture so that people would have some knowledge of it.
 RandomScause
Joined: 8/16/2011
Msg: 23
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/6/2011 5:27:22 AM
Thanks, silkenfire!! This was good.

810.145

There is no reason to believe that video voyeurism dissemiation occurred ((3) and (4)).

(2) is dismissed as the woman did not wear an undergarment device (c).

Furthermore, (a) and (b) of (2) can be dismissed as the woman can not possibly show, in light of the evidence presented, that the man contravened this part of the definition: " privately exposing the body, at a place and time when that person has a reasonable expectation of privacy".

The woman had no reasonable expectation of privacy. She went to sleep naked, with a man. She was fully aware at the time of going to sleep, that she was not going to have privacy during her sleep. When she woke up, naked, after her sleep, she found it quite natural that there was the man around still. Her lack of surprise or protest to not being private at that point when she became conscious after her sleep, proves that she was reasonably expecting to not be in privacy. Therefore she had no resaonable expectations of privacy.

The man did not break the law.
--------------

I am not a lawyer, either. No legal advice given here.
 Greatcatch12345
Joined: 5/2/2011
Msg: 24
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/6/2011 5:46:41 AM
hopefully we will see them on playboy.com shortly....u are a hottie, right?/
:-)
 orionids4ever
Joined: 8/14/2011
Msg: 25
Deep sleep nude photo shoot
Posted: 9/6/2011 6:34:08 AM
I think you are missing the "key idea" here. The operative word in this entire debate is PERMISSION!
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