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Show ALL Forums  > Politics  > Rick Perry -      Home login  
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 where4
Joined: 10/1/2008
Msg: 1
Rick Perry - Page 1 of 8    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8)
The quote in the headline (edit - quote was removed from the headline like magic..."one more loud and stubborn voice") is from a USAToday editorial about Perry and his views on Social Security. I thought it was a spot-on characterization. You can check out the context in the article:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/editorials/story/2011-09-11/Social-Security-no-Ponzi-scheme/50362684/1

I don't usually read USAToday, hard copy or online, but I was impressed with their fair treatment here. They also publish what Rick Perry (his campaign writers, more than likely) has written on the subject of Social Security. Perry & Co. aren't idiots and they certainly realize the effect of the candidate's inflammatory words in last week's MSNBC-broadcast Republican candidates debate. Here's a link to Perry's (campaign's) article:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/story/2011-09-11/Rick-Perry-Social-Security/50362610/1

(edit:
I thought it was funny that the article Perry's team published in USAToday is much softer and gentler than the candidate's rash words in the debate last week, as well as his 'doubling down' on the matter that came out afterward. My oh, my, can you spell
"b-a-c-k-p-e-d-a-l"?)
-------------

The more I learn about Perry the worse he looks to me. Let's discuss him in this thread, since he's leading in the candidates polls right now. I'll refrain from stating more in this initial post, just to keep things simple at the start. Have at it, my friends:

So far, do you like Perry? why? hate him? why?
 .dej
Joined: 11/6/2007
Msg: 2
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Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/12/2011 12:51:33 PM
The more all the candidates talk, the less hope I have. Perry is no exception. His election will set back civil rights a few years, set scientific progress and funding back, but it may provide the economy some much-needed relief, and it may allow for the chance to mend the relationship with the UK that Obama has thoroughly trashed.

Guess it depends where your priorities are.

I'll say this: I don't think it'll be very bad to have Perry as president as long as the Democrats have a chamber in Congress. Perry as president, with the House and Senate controlled by Republicans would be a very very bad thing. Just as Obama with two chambers of Congress was. Actually I think it may be worse (the Republicans). The Democrats from 08 to 10 acted somewhat aware that they would receive a mid-term election backlash, whereas the Republicans don't ever seem to think that far ahead.
 IgorFrankensteen
Joined: 6/29/2009
Msg: 3
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Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/12/2011 4:10:36 PM
So far, Perry seems to be playing to the crowds, rather than proposing any solid ideas or solutions. That makes me stay away from him, just as loud, but ultimately meaningless rhetoric from anyone makes me reduce them several notches on my respect scale.

Given a choice right now, I think I'd support Mitt Romney, because he's the ONLY existing candidate on ANY side, who actually appears to have a sense of balance, and MIGHT recognize that ALL Americans need to be served, and not just a few select support groups.

Perry seems to be closer to Bachmann, who epitomizes the sort of "Half of all Americans are Bad Guys" thinking that controls so much of what is claimed to be political "ideas" these days. I wont support ANYONE who declares that large sections of the country are enemies.
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 4
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Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/12/2011 5:10:25 PM
Perry is his own worst enemy. His recent book has really exposed him in what a lot of people do not like about him. Saying social security is a scam will not get him the 50+ year old votes and that's exactly what the Rep party doesn't need is for Perry to win and become their nominee, because the Obama admin will eat him alive on the Social Security issue. Romney is the Obama admin biggest threat out of any rep running for office. I mean they can't go after him with healthcare because he had a similar plan as gov of Mass in which Obama is pushing. They can't go after him with the economy, because both Obama and Romney has used the tax increase method to try to get out of debt. Basically what you have is two men with two very similar ideas when it comes to the two biggest issues facing this country today and that's the two biggest issues that Obama can't attack him on. It's going to boil down to defense and border security that will seperate them, because neither one of them can really go after anything else when they are almost the same when it comes to the 2 biggest important issues we are facing today.
 Ready4SomethingFun
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 5
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Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/12/2011 5:28:34 PM
As long as either the House or Senate (or even better, both) is Republican, Romney would be fine. But, if the House AND Senate goes dem again, we are in trouble with him. I think he would go right along with them and we'd be in a mess all over again. That's the main thing Perry has going for him, I don't think he would bow down down like Bush did. I could be wrong though, I would've have bet the farm on Bush not doing it, and damn, was I wrong. And Perry was a dem once, which I think explains quite well his tendency to flip flop at the blink of an eye.
 Bladesmith81801
Joined: 10/30/2010
Msg: 6
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/12/2011 8:39:30 PM
Actually, you're incorrect about one thing. Perry IS an idiot.

Hey Perry! How'd that prayer thing go for ya? Texas is a flame and smoke covered conflagration now, so looks like God gave you an answer.
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 7
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Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/12/2011 9:00:18 PM
Did anyone see the Debate tonight? Perry flat out lied and tried to cover his tracks about Social Security. He went from Social Security is a scam to saying that Romney was wrong in his interpretation about Social Security, instead Social Security needs to be reformed to allow states to control it and not the gov. His book says nothing about that and he was defending his position on it in the last debate. All of a sudden people are misinterpreting him in this debate? LOL Come on Perry do you really think that the American people are idiots. You made your bed on your view about social security so either defend it or admit what you said was an mistake about social security being a scam. Don't go around acting like people are misinterpreting what you said as if we are a bunch of idiots.
 where4
Joined: 10/1/2008
Msg: 8
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/13/2011 12:50:09 AM
Well, I just watched the CNN/TeaXpress debate on Youtube (no cable here).

Funny thing is, I found a couple of things to agree on with Rick Perry - although he is now under siege and on the defensive about these very things.

I think what he did for the young girls of Texas in getting them the Gardasil vaccine at the appropriate age to prevent cervical cancer later in their lives was quite admirable. I regret that he feels the need to back down on his action now. Michele Bachmann loves to grandstand and thump away at him over that one, for sure. It's funny to watch her perform for the Conservative Christian audience! Rick Santorum was a-thumpin' on that, too. If polio were a sexually transmitted disease and only males got it, I'd feel the same way - get the vulnerable kids the d*mn vaccine and protect them as early in life as possible! Who cares how a terrible disease is transmitted if it's so easy to prevent it??? (But it is funny to watch the Tbags being shredded onstage! )

I also agree with Perry on his stance for offering instate tuition to children of illegal immigrants. They're not getting anything for free. They're paying tuition. Would you prefer them to become criminals out of desperation since they have no other economic opportunities? Like it or not, they're here. If they're motivated to get an education and contribute to American society, let them!

@ msg. 6:
I had the same thought about those fires in Texas. Michele Bachmann made her sick joke about the east coast being visited by the storm and floods of Irene because her god was sending Washington a message. Right. Is she saying the fires were a similar punishment to Texas? Elmer Gantry lives in Rick Perry. His recent stadium revival show, where he shared the stage alongside the worst of the Christian bigot bible thumpers was appalling to me.

Please be assured that I won't be voting for Rick Perry if he does go on to win his party's nomination. His nomination would motivate me with a greater urgency to get out and campaign for Obama.
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 9
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Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/13/2011 2:51:11 AM
I think what he did for the young girls of Texas in getting them the Gardasil vaccine at the appropriate age to prevent cervical cancer later in their lives was quite admirable


I agree on that, but you know what's funny? What Perry did is not ok with these people that are arguing against it, but yet they don't say anything when it comes to children being required by law to get immunizations shots before going to school. If I was Perry I have used that as my comeback. He would have shut a lot of people up.


I also agree with Perry on his stance for offering instate tuition to children of illegal immigrants. They're not getting anything for free. They're paying tuition. Would you prefer them to become criminals out of desperation since they have no other economic opportunities? Like it or not, they're here. If they're motivated to get an education and contribute to American society, let them!


I don't have an issue with children of illegal immigrants getting tuition to go to college but they would have to required to take Citizenship classes and be able to pass the Citizenship test before graduating from college. I think that would be fair and it would help them on the path to becoming a US Citizen as well.

I mean, i agree with him on certain issues like the ones i mentioned, but when it comes to stuff like calling social security a scam and then trying to make people look like idiots by say people misinterpreted what he was saying, when that's exactly what he was saying in his book and what he defended in the last debate until tonight, just makes him look like a straight out liar and I can't vote for someone as a conservative that tries to portray American voters as an bunch of dullards.
 itechman63
Joined: 7/7/2005
Msg: 10
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Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/13/2011 9:31:54 AM
When times are hard, we do love our Cowboys don't we? Perry represents a perpetuation of why we're in this mess... Texas politicians on the teats of the investment banks and energy companies. We can't afford it any more regardless of how many rattlesnakes Perry spits on and how closely he can imitate John Wayne's swagger. It's comforting to us in hard times to see a Tuff Guy in Washington, but electing the President based on his number of pi$$ing contest trophies and continuing fundamentally tainted politics does nothing good for us.
 CountIbli
Joined: 6/1/2005
Msg: 11
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/13/2011 9:43:26 AM
I don't care for Perry. He's just your run of the mill neo-con who peppers his rhetoric with Ron Paul's ideas in order to appeal to the Tea Party.

"I also agree with Perry on his stance for offering instate tuition to children of illegal immigrants. They're not getting anything for free. They're paying tuition."

In-state tuition is cheaper because it's subsidized by taxpayers. Illegal immigrants should not get this perk. However, if you're born in the US (whether your parents are here legally or illegally) you're an American citizen (whether people like it or not) and should get the in-state rate.

I think the whole Gardasil thing has been blown out of proportion. States impose vaccine mandates all the time. And contrary to the claims of Bachman and Santorum this vaccine was not mandatory, as there was an opt-out provision. When backed into a wall Santorum has grudgingly admitted this but then nitpicks and says there should have been opt-in clause instead. Santorum also admitted that it's okay to impose vaccine mandates for communicable diseases, but apparently that doesn't include STD's. Or maybe he and Bachman are unaware that 12 year old girls have sex.

On Social Security Perry was absolutely right. It is a Ponzi scheme.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4N-kIJVFcO4
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme

"A Ponzi scheme is a fraudulent investment operation that pays returns to separate investors, not from any actual profit earned by the organization, but from their own money or money paid by subsequent investors."

Of course it's not politically correct to say such a thing. At the very least it scares the old people and those about to retire into thinking that you're going to take it away. Obama would love to use such scare tactics even though that's simply not going to happen (even Ron Paul wouldn't do that). The reality, though, is that the middle class pays more into the system than it ever gets back in benefits so the system is a failure for the middle class. The other reality is that it's approaching insolvency (not as fast as Medicare though). There are only three options now:

1) Reform the system (which will extend its life by a few years)
2) Replace the system (not politically viable)
3) Do nothing and let it collapse (which is what will happen if the Democrats get their way)

None of the candidates, except Gov. Gary Johnson, has any realistic way of dealing with illegal immigrants.

http://www.garyjohnson2012.com/issues/immigration

The idea of spending billions of dollars putting up a border fence that can be defeated with a 50 dollar ladder is ridiculous.
 CountIbli
Joined: 6/1/2005
Msg: 12
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/13/2011 10:23:56 AM
"We've got to start with the people employing illegal immigrants. After a few hundred perp walks and a bunch of fines, those employers will stop hiring illegals. They're not going to leave their families to come here if there is no money to be made."

I've heard that illegal immigration is down because the US economy is so bad. Now that I think of it Ron Paul might be right about the fence. He said that it might be used to keep people in who want to leave. People laughed at him, but what if we build the fence and the illegal immigrants want to leave?

Gov. Johnson is right. Make it easy to get a work visa and give the illegals that are already here a two year grace period to get a work visa, as long as they don't have a criminal background.
 itechman63
Joined: 7/7/2005
Msg: 13
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Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/13/2011 10:30:45 AM

I think the whole Gardasil thing has been blown out of proportion. States impose vaccine mandates all the time.


I agree that for every vaccine taken that something good was done however in the context of their campaign and particularly with Perry's rhetoric, the policy was not consistent with "small government" and that's at least Ron Paul's problem with it. Bachmann and Romney are going after it to appeal to the Evangelical base so their issue is pandering.

And this has been my issue with the last many GOP campaigns... there's nothing wrong with moderate or centrist ideas and if you have them as a GOP hopeful, I think it's disgusting that they have to hide and deny that they have those beliefs because if the base doesn't believe that you're hard right, then they won't support you. Exactly why when normally admiring John McCain for his moderate ideas, I was disgusted with him in 2008 because he had to pretend to be somebody else.

I feel that if he believes there are times that it's okay to be closer to the center on some things then Perry should be saying so and challenging his base. Show me that you have principles that don't strictly pander and stand up for them. Otherwise don't tell me "small government" when you do "big government" things.
 .dej
Joined: 11/6/2007
Msg: 14
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Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/13/2011 11:11:20 AM

The idea of spending billions of dollars putting up a border fence that can be defeated with a 50 dollar ladder is ridiculous.

It worked for India.
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 15
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History
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/13/2011 12:26:01 PM
So this woman I have known on here for a couple of years took me off her face book page and blocked me last night, because I said having a Perry and Palin ticket is like having two chickens with their heads cut off running for office. I guess if you don't meet the status quo of agreeing with everything that a certain person believes you are no longer their friend. Sorry if I insulted her by having a mind of my own....

Skoochie, Perry is completely ignorant when it comes to knowing anything about the US economy. Yeah he touts about saying well in Texas we have one of the largest economic growths in the country. Ok lets leave out the fact that Texas is the largest oil producing state in the country! Not hard to have large economic growth, when you are producing large amounts of oil in an oil reach state like Texas is. That would be like saying i'm the greatest Bass fishermen in the world when you are fishing in a pond that's filled with nothing but Bass.
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 16
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History
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/13/2011 7:46:29 PM

I think the whole Gardasil thing has been blown out of proportion.
What I don't get is why only the girls have to be immunized. If it's spread sexually (ie an STD) then why not also immunize the boys?

Why not help totally prevent it by immunizing the spread of it as well? I found information that states since mid October it has been recommended for boys as well ... but you sure don't see any one pushing to have all boys immunized as well ... eh?

I wonder why Rick Perry didn't push it for boys as well?
 CountIbli
Joined: 6/1/2005
Msg: 17
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/13/2011 10:30:30 PM
"What I don't get is why only the girls have to be immunized. If it's spread sexually (ie an STD) then why not also immunize the boys? "

As near as I can tell Perry's concern (which I think was genuine) was about the cervical cancer that the STD could cause. Obviously that wouldn't be an issue with boys. On the flip side I've read that it can cause penile and anal cancer in men. If that's true then there would be no reason not to have boys get the vaccination too. But then again, it's not like any of the candidates besides Ron Paul and Gary Johnson have consistent political philosophies.
 woobytoodsday
Joined: 12/13/2006
Msg: 18
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/14/2011 2:51:47 PM

It worked for India.


The Great Wall of China's in India? Who knew?

 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 19
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History
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/15/2011 1:02:54 AM
How is social security a Ponzi scheme? Tell that to the men and women that busted their ass for 30+ or more years working every day paying taxes into the system. People like that deserve something back for putting money into the gov all those years So therefor the gov credits you once you reach retirement age for putting all of that hard earned money in taxes that came out of your paycheck towards the system over the years. Now i do agree that certain elements have gotten corrupt with social security over the years and need to be fixed, but the concept of social security itself is certainly not a ponzi scheme by any means.
 itechman63
Joined: 7/7/2005
Msg: 20
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History
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/15/2011 4:29:49 AM
I think that if Perry was using any logic in his analogy, it is based on the fact that we pay in as a victim in a Ponzi would and then the administrators of the scheme... Congress in this case... steals the money. I don't think Perry's come out and said it, but I think this is a push to privatize SS. And of course Wall Street is licking it's chops to get their hands on more to gamble with on the next bubble.
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 21
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History
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/15/2011 5:53:05 AM
You're right corrupt politics has turned a once good system into a corrupt system over the years, but that's the fault of politians not social security itself. Which is why i agree that there needs to be social security reform to correct those issues where politians aren't able to corrupt the system like they have in years past. I'm not too concerned about Perry he isn't going to win the nominee. He has damaged himself beyond repair with the social security issue and many 50+ year old conservitives aren't going to vote for him because of that no matter what he says now from here on out. They aren't going to trust his position on something that effects so many of their lives.
 Bladesmith81801
Joined: 10/30/2010
Msg: 22
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/15/2011 6:25:13 AM
Face it Steel, we need to clean house politically before we can reform anything. We don't get the big unrestricted money out of the peoples business, nothing will change.
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 23
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History
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/15/2011 7:36:26 AM
By politically meaning end ear marks and lobbiesm in which both parties don't seem to want to do. That would put a stop to a lot of corruption right then and there.

Boggles my mind how lobbiesm is some how legal ,but if i told a cop I'd give him 50 dollars in cash to get me out of that 150 fine he is going to write me up for speeding I'd be thrown in jail for bribery.
 CountIbli
Joined: 6/1/2005
Msg: 24
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/15/2011 8:12:44 AM
"How is social security a Ponzi scheme?"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme

"A Ponzi scheme is a fraudulent investment operation that pays returns to separate investors, not from any actual profit earned by the organization, but from their own money or money paid by subsequent investors."

The investors in this case are the taxpayers who put money in the system. The people collecting today are not collected on any profit that SS has made but from the "investments" that current taxpayers make. That is the essence of a Ponzi scheme.
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 25
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History
Rick Perry -
Posted: 9/15/2011 12:59:17 PM
It's corrupt now in many areas, but i wouldn't say the concept of social security itself is a ponzi scheme. It was designed around the concept of the gov crediting those that put money into the system by paying taxes all those years that they worked.

The only Ponzi scheme i see is Perry and his lying based on his misconception in his words in regarding to what he said and now what he means with the social security issue.
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