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Show ALL Forums  > Technology/Computers  > downloading to outlook express      Home login  
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 Rythmn
Joined: 1/21/2006
Msg: 1
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i am seeking a way to assure confidential email. i have been using a local server, to date, for which i am charged $5/month. however, when i download my email or send an email offline, nothing stays online or goes online with this local server.

now looking into gmail and yahoo mail via att. i am advised to use these by my computer consultant as they are "free".

but, thus far when downloading both gmail and att yahoo into outlook express via pop, my inbox gets downloaded, but then copies of the inbox email stay online in "trash"-- unless i go online and manually delete these messages or instead, wait thirty days for the server to automatically delete them. this happens both with gmail and att/yahoo email.

furthermore, with gmail, if i send a private email from outlook express, even though "pop" and not supposed to be interactive with online, the dam-n offline message gets uploaded and when i go online there is the message i sent offline!!! one good thing: sent email from att/yahoo offline, does "not" go back up online.

so, is there something my computer consultant missed? he was flabbergasted and was not aware that all these messages from outlook express "sent" were going back online, let alone all downloaded messages to outlook express were being saved in online trash.

has anyone encountered and conquered this issue? i know many don't care, but i have certain legal documents that i don't want floating around on some "free" server--or a paid server for that matter.

or, is there another free email that downloads to outlook express and stays downloaded, aside from gmail or yahoo. thus far, i am thinking i should keep the private email and shell out $60 per year for peace of mind.

thanks, scw
 Larrytwa
Joined: 8/1/2006
Msg: 2
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downloading to outlook express
Posted: 6/29/2012 12:36:04 PM
SRW

1. Yahoo mail for POP service is not FREE and as far as I know is the only online mail server to charge for POP mail.

2. Gmail, Hotmail / Live, AOL, ATT, Comcast, all have POP / IMAP which so happen to be email service protocols in short special email communication signals.

3. Security is normally only an issue when you are in read mode, as the above protocols are normally encrypted and need to have some way to decrepit to read aka POP / IMAP.

4. Outlook Express was discontinued along time ago for what is now Windows Live Messenger. So how do these services work?

5. Online mail and that include all the mail service mentioned above actually use HTTP in short the mail is part of your internet experiencing. While it is true because your mail is opened in a HTTP format it could be caught in your cache on your computer. So reading your mail say at Gmail.com create a cache and all the mail is retained upon Google email servers nothing really is brought to your local computer except in cache or if you download picture / documents. Even your response to email is actually being done on their servers not locally.

6. Now Outlook Express or the current Window Live Mail, some other program similar to these have a different approach. These are local machines programs that actually go to one of the above email servers and request all the mail to be brought down to your local PC. All your mail is now kept in a secure file on your PC. Once the request has been completed you can read and respond to all the messenger often using word or better editor then the clumsy internet editors, and all this can be offline. Meaning if you have a portable you could get your mail go camping and respond to all your email and when you return to your house on first connection all your email responses will be sent. You can password protect your email services so nobody can just read your mail.

7. So what is better. Well the internet service holds all your email regardless of which way you go. The important part of using Outlook Express is to not allow this program to to the email provider to delete the mail off the server once it downloaded. Why, well if your computer hardware fails, or stolen you will have lost all your email.

8. I like the full feature Outlook. It is not free but provides so much tools like contact organizations, making rules to sort your incoming mail automatically, better filtering ect. This program does require someone with some knowledge to set the program up for you. Maybe import your contact list too. More important give instruction on how to compress and backup this data file. I have scene this file grow to Gigabytes and people cry when their hard-drive fails and they loose years of messages, contacts and data. The plus side is I can password protect my email so noisy people have to be a real hack to get into my email. I don't have to worry that my email password is cached on the computer and someone could walk up and simply open your mail that easy no problem at all, or worse if you were a professional email thief you would get in and change your password immediately so you could not get in but I could on any computer in the world until you figured out how to resolve it.

If you own MS OFFICE consider upgrading to OFFICE PROFESSIONAL for a few $$$ more and get OUTLOOK 2008/2010/2012 product and then get some help setting up the program to work for you.

BTW... cute smile
LRT

20 years of Network / Desktop experiance
 robin-hood
Joined: 12/2/2008
Msg: 3
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downloading to outlook express
Posted: 6/29/2012 7:01:43 PM
I'm now using Windows Live mail, but most of the features are similar to outlook or outlook express.

Under your email account setup properties in the advanced tap there is a option (mine is a check box) to leave a copy of your email on the server. Just change the setting.

Each email account (name) has its own switch, so check them all.
 Rythmn
Joined: 1/21/2006
Msg: 4
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downloading to outlook express
Posted: 7/1/2012 9:49:41 PM
ms taken, i thought it was the other way around. what is downloaded is the copy. but whichever, with outlook, the setting stops the saving in the inbox online, but again it still sends what is taken from the inbox online into the trash online and i have to manually empty it. will investigate your “thunderbird” to see if any better. thanks!

larrytwa, i have to sit "offline" and really absorb what you are saying, as i think the answer might be there, although maybe not a solution but more of a paradigm shift for me. i get yahoo pop through my uverse (att) internet account. so, that is probably why it "appears" free. just included with the total package. i also don't have the full microsoft office suite and my version is about 6 years old. but, not really sure i even need it now that i no longer "work" (lymes disability)--nor do i wish to invest in too much new software. although, might change as i try to write this new book. not sure if word press that i am looking into will require other updates. we will see. also, thank you for your comment on my smile. i am equally good at grimacing:)

robin-hood. the box is checked as best as possible. as said above, the incoming mail "is" erased online but it still goes to trash online and i have to manually empty it. i think the reason for that is explained by larrytwa. but not being a techie, i cannot converse about it, until i absorb it "conceptually" and "visually". so i will be drawing a lot of boxes and arrows.

my consultant knows what he is doing. he just never had someone as paranoid about leaving mail online. he is not. so he never really paid attention until i showed it to him. he is now trying to deliver my gmail via the att server. that would at least stop the uploading of my sent messages that i write offline. but other than that , have no clue about what he is talking about and why he is doing it. most clients don't ask all these "why" questions. i was told by my mom that "why" was my first word. i need to know how things work! will try in a few days with my team viewer and my consultant and will report back.

yes, cowboy, i think you said it. most hackers are not interested in my email. but i guess having had credit cards and checking hacked into the past few years, i am paranoid. the more i can understand the better i feel. but i need to translate techie talk to more generic concepts to really get it.

the good news is that when i was working, i was the only lay person the techies in my field allowed into their office. that is because i was able to show them what i was doing with all their gyrations so they could save time and get straight to it!
 robin-hood
Joined: 12/2/2008
Msg: 5
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downloading to outlook express
Posted: 7/2/2012 9:14:27 AM
Ok, I see others are trying to accomplish the same thing. Instead of replying to POP delete, gmail moves them to trash. The auto delete trash 30 day value is fixed.

This could probably be handled with java scripting, but doesn't seem to much effort to empty trash. I just tried the keyboard shift in the trash folder and it works. You may already know this, but if not just select 1st email in trash and then go to end of emails, but select last one holding the shit key. All will be auto selected.

I don't think other software will be able to download and delete on gmail, as its the way google set up its email software.

You may want to set up 2nd account at gmail, thats used strictly for business. I do that myself, but I have my own hosted domain.

As for your finance hacking. Some advice, use a strong password. A length of at least 18 characters. You can combine words and numbers with + = to form it. Sometime a list of old pet names or their names with maybe old street address where you grew up, or school mascot. But you get the picture.
 Larrytwa
Joined: 8/1/2006
Msg: 6
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downloading to outlook express
Posted: 7/2/2012 9:39:39 AM
Robinhood, with all due respect I agree with most you have written about. Gmail in the advance settings will allow proprams such as Outlook, Endura, and other offline email and PIM programs to fully control Gmail mail. That is they have a IMAP / POP advance features to allow these program to get and properly handle email such as deleting mail. These programs often control how the email server handles read and deleted mail to the server. I personally prefer these programs and disable their functions to delete the email from the email server as a minor backup if for some reason my mail program failed. However the draw back is if you don't delete the email off the server or archive locally there is a very good chance one could go over the email data space and hence your inbound and outbound services stop until you clean your mailbox up.

So in short. All email service provider have a data limit check your provider for details.

If you need long term email archive 1-500 years get Outlook, Endura, Live, or some other off the server email program. Just remember this means your email data is now located on your workstation / laptop and backing up that data is your responsibility.

If you use long term email do not forget to have your program routinely clean old messages from the email server to keep sufficient space available for future messages.

If long term archive of messages are not necessary then just use the ONLINE email programs they are free and work OK, will automatically delete mail regardless if you read or not in a set number of days.

Security is always an issue of never saving passwords on a computer for any reason. Never answer any email which appears to be from any banking firm even your own. Never click on a link that appears to be a message from your bank that a problem exist banks will never back link you to sign in. Never give out passwords. Change password frequently.



Now have fun and GO fishing.
 robin-hood
Joined: 12/2/2008
Msg: 7
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downloading to outlook express
Posted: 7/2/2012 10:47:30 AM
Yes Larry, I think the idea of leaving email on the server, at least till you have a copy downloaded is good. But the OP didn't want that option. On my domain I can do either, but just prefer POP, and delete off server. What OP wanted was just to have it deleted also. I just gave her a method to select the trash all at one time. If your not at your computer, one can find it convenient to just read your email remotely with out using POP. On my domain I have some filters just dump email from some domains names or using regex on headers and selected words.

As for your advice I totally agree. If you get an email from your bank that looks official call them, or just log on as you usually do, but don't use links in your email. This goes also with email from people you know with subjects not normal for the person.

As for passwords I keep them in Keepass portable, but that may not be safe in near future with some low end vector computers. Guess will need 512 bit encryption by then.

If one can afford it, buy a 2nd computer for around $400 with Win 7 installed, and only use it for your finance and personal business. Even at that password protect administrator, and log in as guest.
 Larrytwa
Joined: 8/1/2006
Msg: 8
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downloading to outlook express
Posted: 7/2/2012 11:42:10 AM
Robin:

I agree, the problem I do not like about HTTP service mail. The potential of leaving your mail open and being called away for some reason. I know I have had people do this. Total invasion of privacy and not COOL.

As for 2nd computer maybe. However, you can make yourself less that administrator rights and thus protect the system under Vista / Win7 and for most XP.

Yes, protecting email is harsh if you using those free services. Best is still pop programs, password protected to remove all HTTP type mail. Also, screen save set quick like 1 minute with password protected. Computer and keeping things private is so hard. :)

The other option is pony up the money, make a 2008 server, enable your personal POP server and become your own email server. Not option for most people at $$$. LOL

The best privacy tactics is simple...........FOCUS and never leave your PC on.
 Rythmn
Joined: 1/21/2006
Msg: 9
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downloading to outlook express
Posted: 7/12/2012 12:17:40 AM
ms taken. yes, we did all that and read all the directions. still goes to trash. by save they mean in one of the many versions of their inbox. they take it upon themselves to decide where you need "copies". if they don't save, they put in trash. not sure how else to say this any other way. i am pretty thorough before i seek forum help, as is my consultant. so far, seems like there is no answer, because it does not exist!

larry and robin, yes i know how to delete my email from gmail. although now disabled with lymes, i did run a 20 person consulting firm in my "past life" and did do some of my own reports and editing. although, i admit, did rely upon my more computer savy (and younger) staff to tackle these sorts of roadblocks.

my question was a lot simpler. it has nothing to do with outlook express or the full outlook and i'm still in windows xp. no need to upgrade as not longer working. so, it has to do with how gmail and yahoo operate--nothing else. i want pop and not to synchronize online and offline. i don't travel anymore for work, so no need.

for now, keeping my old local internet provider email for five dollars a month which downloads and "immediately" erases whatever is downloaded from their server. i only switched internet providers to get a greater download speed. this email will be for banking, important documents et al. sure, i have a great password system, but if my email remains on the server, i just don't feel comfortable.

kind of like locking the door but leaving my window open, even though on the second floor, they can still climb up and steal my mail from my desk. well, that's how it feels to me. but yes, even if locked, someone can always break open the door in both virtual and non virtual worlds. the odds? probably low. but then again, a lot of strange things have happened to "me".

i think having had credit cards hacked, and not sure if done on site or via internet, it gives me some peace of mind, even if illusory, to do the very best i can.

as for not putting "anything" online, i think still safer than the mailbox down the street where our local post office deems we should keep it. with a good hammer, anyone can break into it! and, in fact, they have done so in the past. plus,the post office has many times delivered bank statements to neighbors and mail has been "lost".

AARGH!!!
 dimitri24
Joined: 12/9/2008
Msg: 10
downloading to outlook express
Posted: 7/13/2012 2:02:09 AM
well i can say i have used thunderbird for years, even on windows, it's a great email client, but since i dont really do much with email i don't need a fully featured client and have started to use opera browser as my email client most of the time.

having stuff synced to remote servers is a little unnerving but i use imap for convenience. all my inbox's stay synced and drafts are accesible anywhere i can get to a web browser but obviously you don't want that. you need to use pop3 though you already know that., thunderbird should have all the features you need and more, plus it's free. it can be set to save deleted messages locally, on the server in "trash" or deleted all together, you can set it to empty the local trash folder on exit, bassically you have full control over how and where your mail is handled as long as you know how to use the settings. what you might be interested in if you are that concerned with security but want convenience of always having your stuff on hand is to use portable apps, thunderbird is available this way, basically it installs to a flash stick so that's where the mail is stored, then you have it anywhere you have your flash stick and it's not backed up anywhere on the computer you used to download it, it's even possible to encrypt the flash drive in case you lose it. http://portableapps.com/

but i have to wonder if you are just plain paranoid. when it comes down to it even in the case of pop you no longer have access to the mail online once it has been downloaded to your pc the servers can have the stuff cached or archived for who knows how long. and i mean if you fear sombody can access it on a remote server after you download it who's to say they can't sneak a peak before you download it and it is cleared from the server? the most important thing is a good password that you don't need to write down, easy to remember but hard for computers and friends to guess that is unique to the email account. never reuse passwords. actually i wonder if you can get one of those password manager applications in a portable version??

some wise words on password selection:
http://xkcd.com/936/
http://xkcd.com/792/
 Rythmn
Joined: 1/21/2006
Msg: 11
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Posted: 7/17/2012 2:57:38 AM
thanks dimitri, will look into "thunderbird" this upcoming weekend. it's been a bit hectic.

funny, right after my posting, my eye dr. was hacked into on yahoo and i got some real screwy stuff as i'm on her private email list. so screwy, it clearly was not legit, so emailed her right away. she has changed her entire mailing list. the hacking was on local tv. not sure if it went national. glad i never really set up that "free" att yahoo account:)
 dimitri24
Joined: 12/9/2008
Msg: 12
downloading to outlook express
Posted: 7/17/2012 3:42:44 AM
the only thing you might not be able to set is sent messages might be saved in the gmail sent box. drafts will be saved locally if you chose that in thunderbird but with sent messages you are at the mercy of google. but there might be a gmail setting for that. you really have to be thorough if you want to keep private these days :/
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