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Show ALL Forums  > Science/philosophy  > The world needs a savior      Home login  
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 adamoof
Joined: 9/12/2011
Msg: 1
The world needs a saviorPage 1 of 2    (1, 2)
The world needs a savior, the world live in a state of chaos unprecedented in history.
Poverty, disease, unemployment, a collapsed economy, bankrupt states and countries close bankruptcy,
please. Give your opinion through the following points:
- Does capitalism still exist?
- Is it a good alternative to a market economy of capitalism?
- What are the prospects of the working class?
 GurugiGets
Joined: 6/1/2012
Msg: 2
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/11/2012 3:40:01 PM
That's why we have Mark Zuckerberg. Just give him a couple more years, he will make something up or steal a
few good ideas.
 adamoof
Joined: 9/12/2011
Msg: 3
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/11/2012 3:51:34 PM
or steal a
few good ideas.
what do you mean by steal a few good ideas?
 earthlingsRevenge
Joined: 10/30/2009
Msg: 4
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/11/2012 3:55:42 PM
It's hopeless.
Elites of the world are in full control of our fate.
Even if we attempt to try a new political or economic system,
the elites would oppose it in full physical force, and would make
sure it never gets off the ground.

We need event(s) that can shake up the entire world and derail the elites.
 adamoof
Joined: 9/12/2011
Msg: 5
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/11/2012 4:28:23 PM
I'm sorry,brains
You have a misunderstanding in the following terms
Capitalist production
Market economy
The concept of the working class
So your reply was far from the topic
You said : every thing in fucture on Robots, this thing does not create surplus value
Do you know what the meaning of surplus value and its importance in the capitalist economy?
 adamoof
Joined: 9/12/2011
Msg: 6
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/11/2012 4:33:08 PM
earthling
i agree with you ,but our fate is our rights . so why should 1% percent lead us to.......................
 Kings_Knight
Joined: 1/20/2009
Msg: 7
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/11/2012 5:20:17 PM

" ... - Does capitalism still exist?
- Is it a good alternative to a market economy of capitalism?
- What are the prospects of the working class? ... "


And this majickal invisible 'savior' would be [insert name of chosen redemptor here] ... ?

There are NO 'saviors'. There are only us. We're IT. 'Savior' ... it is to laugh ...

As for the 'Three Questions' game you propose: Your prior postings display your fascination with all things Socialist and your continuing dislike of all things Capitalist. It therefore becomes rather pointless to reply with anything defending the Free Market economy and the Capitalist economic system - and I won't waste my time in so doing.
 JustDukky
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 8
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/11/2012 5:47:02 PM

It's hopeless.
Elites of the world are in full control of our fate.
Even if we attempt to try a new political or economic system,
the elites would oppose it in full physical force, and would make
sure it never gets off the ground.


It's not really hopeless if people get off their collective keyster and straighten out their public servants who have the nerve to think they aren't. WE are the ones in full control of our fate...The problem is we aren't taking that control. It seems we'd rather fiddle while Rome burns.

There ARE places where the people have beaten the elite...Look at Iceland. It stands as a shining example to us all if we cared enough to look.

The elite only has the power we allow it to have.
 HayYager
Joined: 6/8/2012
Msg: 9
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/11/2012 7:49:14 PM

The world needs a savior


A combination of the alternative legal system of Van Vogt's Weapon Shop and a Star Chamber might do the trick.
 Panina
Joined: 7/6/2012
Msg: 10
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/11/2012 8:59:47 PM
Trailsman beat me to it. Well said, by the way.

Even right down to the excerpt from the Desiderata (and addendum) . :)
 IgorFrankensteen
Joined: 6/29/2009
Msg: 11
view profile
History
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/11/2012 10:08:49 PM

The universe is unfolding exactly as it should and precisely on schedule.


I think you completely contradicted yourself there, trailsman. The universe doesn't have either a schedule, or a "should be."


And in this thread, I'm with Kings Knight. It's clear you have a set agenda, OP, from which you are unwilling to waver. You contradict yourself in your own posts, because though you are certain you DO understand capitalism, it is clear from what you say, that you don't recognize it unless it's of the exact, very negative archetype spelled out in whatever pseudo-socialist handbook you are following.

There is no single version of capitalism in the world, just as socialism is also only a general term ( very often misapplied, to what are actually variations on capitalism).
 adamoof
Joined: 9/12/2011
Msg: 12
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/12/2012 8:08:43 AM
kings_nights
who told u that i do not like capitalist things!
even capitalisim gone sense 1970 , but i do believe that capetalisem is very important gape in the world
 Gwendolyn2010
Joined: 1/22/2006
Msg: 13
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/12/2012 2:13:11 PM
I plan to start the next big religion.

I am taking applications for acolytes--you can get in on the bottom floor.
 ruckus123
Joined: 6/7/2005
Msg: 14
view profile
History
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/12/2012 2:56:45 PM

I plan to start the next big religion.
I am taking applications for acolytes--you can get in on the bottom floor.


Oh Oh Ohhhhhhhhhh Can I wear the big hat and maybe a cape?
 adamoof
Joined: 9/12/2011
Msg: 15
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/12/2012 3:21:46 PM
gwend2010

there is No need to talk about metaphisics in our subject
No place for religion in the materialist philosophy that I believe in
If you have applications for acolytes , i have applications for full profets jobs
 earthlingsRevenge
Joined: 10/30/2009
Msg: 16
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/12/2012 5:40:11 PM

There ARE places where the people have beaten the elite...Look at Iceland. It stands as a shining example to us all if we cared enough to look.
The elite only has the power we allow it to have.


Dukky
I do not think Iceland has a media as powerful as ours. Our media are owned by the elites.
The media have been shielding the elites and keeping the truth from us for the last 5 to 6 decades.
If the average Americans know the truth, they would be out on the streets right this moment.

We , the people, have let this happen because media betrayed us, now it's too late. Elites are
too powerful, an average SAVIOR can not defeat them.
OP, what qualities do you expect this mythical SAVIOR to have?
 Aristotle_Amadopolis
Joined: 12/8/2011
Msg: 17
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/12/2012 5:53:23 PM

The world needs a savior, the world live in a state of chaos unprecedented in history.

Really?

So when Mount Vesuvius erupted it was not as bad as it is now?

When the Black Plague killed an estimated 30-60% of Europe's population it was not as bad as it is now?

When a drought affected India in the 1900's and killed some 250,000 to 3 million people it was not as bad as it is now?

Etc....


The only thing unprecedented happening, is people thinking what is happening now, is unprecedented.
 Gwendolyn2010
Joined: 1/22/2006
Msg: 18
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/12/2012 6:36:09 PM

Oh Oh Ohhhhhhhhhh Can I wear the big hat and maybe a cape?


Since you asked, yes.


there is No need to talk about metaphisics in our subject
No place for religion in the materialist philosophy that I believe in
If you have applications for acolytes , i have applications for full profets jobs


First, what are "profets"?

Then perhaps you should use terminology that better suits your "materialist" philosophy. While "savior" can denote anyone who "saves" others, it is most often used in relation to religious heroes such as Jesus.
 JustDukky
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 19
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/13/2012 9:13:25 PM

...what qualities do you expect this mythical SAVIOUR to have?


The qualities a saviour should have are compassion, guts (the will to do the right thing) and an inner knowledge that whether or not somebody is going to come down from the clouds to kiss the boo-boo and make it all better, the job of cleaning up our own mess is really ours to do. A saviour is one who accepts the responsibility and gets busy getting the job done.

Seems to me that almost anyone can be a saviour, and I can't help but marvel at the fact that there are so few of them around.

How is it that almost 7 billion people can't defeat an "elite" handful of economic parasites who rule the world by fraud? The only answers I can come up with tend to validate the elitist assumptions that people in general are stupid two legged beasts that are easily led and controlled like the cattle they are. Born to serve, not to rule; they have to be taught a lesson every now & then when they start getting too "uppity."
 JustDukky
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 20
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/13/2012 11:13:11 PM

That guy will NEVER get elected.


Obviously. Why would the elite allow someone who works against their interests to come to power? We'll NEVER find a saviour in an elected government, because the system is deliberately set up in such a way that elections are a sham. The politicians only pretend to work for us when in fact they do the bidding of the moneyed elite.

A saviour will not come from the political arena. He will be one of the "slaves" who frees himself when he realizes that he is the true governor of the "government" and starts acting accordingly by giving it orders to do the right thing.

I think when the servants realize that the "child of the state" has grown up to become Lord of the Manor, they will snap to attention and start obeying. Of course the servants are pretty corrupt now and are inclined to kill their boss rather than go back to polishing the silver (as evidenced by the deaths of people like Gandhi & Martin Luther king…and of course the mythical Jesus), so more than one saviour is required. I think we need at least a few thousand to make killing us all off kind of impractical.
 JustDukky
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 21
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/14/2012 7:17:03 AM
Thinking a little further on this saviour business and wondering why most people are not the saviours of humankind, even when it is in their own self-interest (as well as everyone else's) to take charge of the governance of the human race (thus taking it out of the hands of the worthless parasites who enslave them), it occurs to me that a saviour is ruled by love, not fear.

Fear is what enslaves us. It is the lever of control used by the elite. We don't take our proper place as rulers because we fear unpleasant consequences for doing so. (e.g. We're afraid to tell our public servants what to do because our fearful slave mentality sees them as our masters and we are afraid of what they might do to us if we get "uppity"). We then consider it in our own self-interest not to "make waves". Something that doesn't seem to occur to people is that we (collectively) currently endure the very unpleasant consequences of NOT taking charge and doing the right thing.

The self-centered, the apathetic, the lazy and the fearful will never be saviours, for these are the exact opposites of the qualities required to be one, so if you are one or more of these, forget about saving the human race.

An omnipotent God is not required to save the human race, only love, empathy, guts and a little elbow grease.

The world is currently recruiting saviours. Do you have what it takes to sign up?
 colt8301
Joined: 10/25/2006
Msg: 22
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/14/2012 8:04:57 AM

Fear is what enslaves us. It is the lever of control used by the elite. We don't take our proper place as rulers because we fear unpleasant consequences for doing so.



This reminds of when a guy told me that, what can a state trooper or a few of them actually do if "everyone" on the highway was going over 100 miles per hour? yeah they will catch a few and make harsh examples but if everyone is doing it they couldn't stop it. He also said we give other people, possibly "weak" people our power.
 Kings_Knight
Joined: 1/20/2009
Msg: 23
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/16/2012 9:48:55 AM
Colt ... would you want to risk being one of the 'harsh examples' doing 100 mph ... ? Not me ... just sayin' ... Besides, one good roadblock would bring all that to a screeching halt real fast ...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Yo, Dukky ... try this on for a saviorin' audition:

Come hither, children - join my church. It's 'The First Church Of The Rude Awakening', and our motto is "When the Lion lieth down with the Lamb, 'tis only the Lion which can be certain of the Morrow." ... everybody likes that one, right ... ? We got preachin' and music and crawfish boils 'n baseball games and every Sunday we got the 'politician du jour' who's gonna come speak at y'all from the pulpit - or just wander amongst the faithful eatin' crawfish - or catfish, whatever's on the menu ... after that will be the 'service', during which I'm gonna have the ushers make two collections and pass the plate among y'all faithful types ... first collection will be for - umm - 'foreign missions', and the second collection is the 'Free Will Love Offering Building Trust and Pastor's Retirement Fund' take-up ... yes, Lord, we will be down here doin' your work according to the directive of 'Render unto Caesar' ... which just happens to be my middle name, y' know ... I love that 'rendering' stuff ... Workers of the world, UNTIE! To quote that great Populist Huey P Long: "Don't tax you; don't tax me ... tax that feller behind the tree." Free lunch for everybody ... !
 JustDukky
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 24
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/16/2012 12:32:03 PM
@ King's Knight

I wouldn't want to be a saviour if getting elected made me a lame duck, and I'd need a pretty good-sized flock to help ensure I didn't become a dead one. The last thing I want is to just get added to a list of martyrs.

While the crawdads are tempting, I think this little duck needs a bit more if he's gonna save humanity. I mean I have nothing invested in it; you guys have been shooting at me & destroying my habitat for ages. What do I owe humanity? Good riddance I say!…The world will be a much better place for us ducks once you humans wipe yourselves out.

You know I'm just pullin' your leg, right? I care for all living creatures, even humans, so I'll probably run in the election; after all, what have I got to lose? You guys have been shooting at me from day one and haven't hit me yet, so odds are that I'll probably survive if I get elected. I might even live long enough to save humanity from itself.

I can see it all now:
"Hey did you hear that duck (whatsisname?) actually got elected?"
"Well aint that just ducky!"
"Yeah…that's him."
 JustDukky
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 25
The world needs a savior
Posted: 7/16/2012 12:37:40 PM

I think we need to be careful, very careful what we wish for and a demagogue is the last thing we need.

I couldn't agree more. It is our herd mentality that has made us a race of followers. We have to drop that crap and grab the bull by the horns in any way that we can. We should ALL be leaders (or at least as many of us that are still capable of leading in some respect, even if only by example). Followers will inevitably get led off the cliff. Leaders go where they want and aren't apt to do anything so stupid.
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