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 moon_breeze
Joined: 10/10/2012
Msg: 1
When to forgive someone's faults? Page 1 of 1    
I'm curious how your 'calculation' process goes and what kind of flaws or irritants you can overlook, and if that depends on the whole package, or how you measure your pro/con list.

I'm dating two guys, both of whom I've told that their actions feel inconsiderate. One is late or flakes out on plans a lot because of bad time management, but is pretty perfect in every other regard. Also he usually updates me about setbacks (after I initially stopped seeing him because of his flakiness)

The other texts friends (some female, most married) around me often. And entire conversations not just a few a night. He's literally addicted to texting, and it seems his friends always have "issues" they need to ask his advice on. This guy, however, is not as perfect in other aspects so I'm less likely to continue seeing him after 7 dates. In fact I ended it twice and he asked me to reconsider. So I did.

So what flaws are you willing to overlook and what makes you decide that though you might not accept it in one person, you might accept it in another?
 spot4username
Joined: 6/19/2007
Msg: 2
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 12:27:19 PM
I would have no interest in either one of those men.

I think at this particular time in my life I have no tolerance for stupid. I just can't stand to be around it. I feel like I have been dropped into that movie Idiocracy at times.
 LiliMarleen
Joined: 5/24/2009
Msg: 3
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When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 12:32:24 PM
Not the ones you mention.

Guy 1 is simply inconsiderate. Guy 2 has boundaries that I would find unacceptable.

Traits I accept in my partner mostly have to do with the fact that he's your typical absent-minded professor, and his life skills 101 are somewhat underdeveloped.
 daynadaze
Joined: 2/11/2008
Msg: 4
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When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 12:40:15 PM
If things about a man bother me, forgiving isn't the issue, that fact that things bother me would only fester and build into resentment, which would ruin any potential relationship. I may notice flaws, we all have them, but why would I need to forgive someone for not being perfect? The concept seems off to me. If I like being around someone and they don't bug me, then there's room for growth, but if they bother me, and that's my issue, then I move on along, no one should have to change for me, we should be comfortable together as we are.
 LiterateHiker
Joined: 11/30/2012
Msg: 5
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 1:00:55 PM
No one is perfect. Everyone has habitual little behaviors that can get on our nerves. I've learned not to fight over petty things, to see the good in people (a lifelong habit) and never hold a grudge. Deal breakers are most often character issues and serious communication problems.

Today I dumped a man who pushed me for sex, consistently ignoring my boundaries, feelings and clear wishes. If that wasn't enough he:

Often does not remember what he said, frequently right after he said it. While grilling me about my atheism, he commented that believing in a higher power comforts him. "Comforts you?" I replied. A few minutes later I asked why this comforts him. He denied saying it.

What's worse is the way he reverses his position, dissembling when he realizes his position is self-defeating. When he said sex is only physical to him and not an emotional experience, I was aghast. He saw my horrified face. I replied that sex is an emotional bonding experience for me. He immediately reversed, insisting that sex is an emotional bonding experience for him, too. I believed the first thing he said.
 moon_breeze
Joined: 10/10/2012
Msg: 6
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 1:02:23 PM
I have told one of them that I'm dating someone else-the other isn't far enough along to expect exclusivity.
 moon_breeze
Joined: 10/10/2012
Msg: 7
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 1:23:12 PM

So other than their flaws, what makes you keep them around?


Good point. The late but otherwise perfect one, there is just a connection. We seem to fit, after I stop complaining about him being late to pick me up. Last night we made dinner (1 hour late but he called three times updating me on timing-grabbing groceries, grabbing his dog), our dogs got along, it just felt natural, happy and we have a lot in common as far as background, views, compatibility and relationship expectations. And the chemistry is amazing. He has some past family issues which he seems to have moved on from, but I think that might be why his time management is bad.

The texter, well he's a good guy, with good family values, seems loyal to family and friends, stays friends with exes so he must be nice, good dad, funny and adorable. He's distant but will let me in on pieces of his psyche at times, breadcrumbs really-I pretty much know it's not going to work, I'm not that patient.

When I read the aquarius description, it pretty much says a lot of this, that until they're committed they're distant but are very loyal once they really get to know someone and choose them, so I kind of mark some of this off as their personality as they're both aquarius' and say it describes them pretty well. (And no I'm not a zodiac follower, but it does often tend to be a vague personality insight)
 moon_breeze
Joined: 10/10/2012
Msg: 8
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 1:27:14 PM

I wouldn't take you seriously either. I mean you are dating more than one man at time.


Ok, there are plenty of threads arguing multiple dating/one at a time dating. These guys are not my boyfriend...there has been no conversation on not seeing other people-the texter I saw four times in one week, but since then it has been about once every nine days.

After last night I am to the point where I'd only like to date the bad time management guy, but then again....he can't be bothered being on time so that makes me wonder if I even want to date him, let alone only him. Hence the thread. :)
 ForumFiona
Joined: 1/7/2013
Msg: 9
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 1:29:46 PM
Lateness is a boundary violation of your time. Texting women constantly is a boundary violation of your time together.
Meh, it's pretty evident to me.
 Walts
Joined: 5/7/2005
Msg: 10
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 1:35:23 PM

So what flaws are you willing to overlook and what makes you decide that though you might not accept it in one person, you might accept it in another?


I don't know how to define these "flaws" of which you speak. You see, some people can look at what one person defines as "flaws" and define them as a characteristic. As in, "my guy is great, just not expect him to be on time for ANYTHING!" If you value your time, this guy probably wouldn't work. If you are flexible enough with him being "late" all the time, it's not a "biggie".


I think at this particular time in my life I have no tolerance for stupid.


Agreed. Especially if they do not know how to "think",which kind of goes hand in hand. I really don't like people that mix ignorance and arrogance.
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 11
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 1:52:19 PM
to answer your first question (my calculation process), its pretty simple:

self respect.

however much you give yourself, is how much you want from others. If their flaws affect how they treat me, then why would I want to spend time with someone who doesn't treat me as well as if I was alone?

the less you want from another human being, the more you will put up with in order to get that one thing. That one thing is more important than the costs you pay for it.

if your time isn't micromanaged, then wasting it isn't as important to you as all the other things guy #1 gives you. guy#2, obviously, is enjoying being wanted by all his needy friends. he doesn't have what you're looking for, so you already gave him the boot. twice. that obviously speaks volumes, doesn't it? if you do something twice?

what's wrong for other people, or wrong in general...isn't wrong for you, if you aren't hurting anyone doing it. we all want what we want. if you can accept this, and won't be changing your attitude on what's important in life anytime soon...why not go after what you want?

what makes me overlook blatent flaws? the same three things any man needs...a pretty face and wonderfully shaped breasts :) again, her flaws are that she takes advantage of me, so hey, why not return the favor? :) lol
 jan1025
Joined: 3/23/2009
Msg: 12
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When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 2:05:47 PM
I realize everybody has flaws, and I don't have problem with that unless it involves games, lies and decent. I can never continue to see someone who is nothing but a liar.

I only date one guy at a time, I couldn't shuffle more than one. lol

If and when I decide to date again. To be honest, I don't even think about what I want in a man and what I don't want. let alone if I could forgive any man for what they are or not what they are......I am just happy doing my own thing and not dealing with any aspects of being in a relationship or putting up with another person's BS. It's just doesn't balance me and make me happy.

Who knows maybe some day I would met someone my age that isn't screwed up. In the meantime, I laugh, love and smile. Life is good.

Thanks for the thread, it was interesting.
Jan
 moon_breeze
Joined: 10/10/2012
Msg: 13
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 2:14:57 PM
Thanks everyone. I will definitely consider all of this. I do tend to have pretty bad taste in men, don't I? And the ones who show me absolute respect generally do not spark my interest in the least unfortunately. Not because they show me respect, but because the same guys tend to be boring. I have introspected and don't THINK that I equate respecting me with being boring, I think it's just coincidence.

As for dating one at a time, I will probably do that with bad time guy, because even though I value my time, I enjoy whatever I do with it-so last night I was almost happy he was late, I finished homework, browsed forums, hung out with my dog, and didn't even start getting ready until he was 'supposed' to be there.

For the most part though, dating one at a time makes me attach too quickly, and my view on it has generally been that while you're waiting for the one to not work out, you're missing others that could, which is why I typically date three at a time (less than three dates each). This is actually the first time I've had this many dates with more than one guy.
 lostnfoundluv
Joined: 1/10/2009
Msg: 14
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/20/2013 8:01:06 PM
looks like both these guys are dating other women too. the first one keeps juggling his time and so late . the second one finds it much easier texting two or three people or more women than talking to all at once. !
 Maleman999
Joined: 2/14/2010
Msg: 15
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/21/2013 2:21:41 PM
The only flaws I will tolerate is if someone is too rich and too good looking/too sexy. lol.
 4ms4me
Joined: 4/24/2010
Msg: 16
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When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/21/2013 2:38:32 PM

One is late or flakes out on plans a lot because of bad time management, but is pretty perfect in every other regard. Also he usually updates me about setbacks (after I initially stopped seeing him because of his flakiness)

I probably wouldn't dump a person for time management issues per se, if he was keeping me informed and the reasons were valid. If he was just disappearing with no explanation, that would be different. I'd understand if he broke a date to take care of a sick kid, or even a sick dog, but not to play videos or go out to the bar with friends.

The other texts friends (some female, most married) around me often. And entire conversations not just a few a night.

I wouldn't be dating someone who did this; the time for ignoring each other in favor of friends is sometime around the 5th year, not the 5th date. :)

So what flaws are you willing to overlook and what makes you decide that though you might not accept it in one person, you might accept it in another?

I'd not overlook the usual flaws, such as lying/cheating/stealing/addiction/etc. I think if I objected to a flaw in person A, but not person B, it would be because person B had more positives overall than person A.
 safebetinvegas
Joined: 7/26/2007
Msg: 17
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When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/21/2013 3:49:16 PM

The 2 men you describe do not have "flaws" they have a total lack of respect for you.


The above is a nutshell in the nutshell. Simple and to the point.

Just because these guys have other "good/great" qualities does not make up for disrespect in my view.



I am to the point where I'd only like to date the bad time management guy, but then again....


I'd stick with the "...but then again..." and not look back.

Like another poster said, you'll eventual but surely resent this behaivor over time and God forbid it gets worse after wasting month upon month with this guy only to say "I should have moved on long ago". Again, he may be "nice" but that is not enough in my opinion...lots of "nice" guys out there.

Also, you've already got a nick-name ("bad time management guy") for this guy that is the opposite of endearing.

Remember that REO song ? It's time for you to "fly". Enough of a "...worn out relation..." before it really ever began.
 safaa30
Joined: 3/1/2012
Msg: 18
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When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/22/2013 1:51:00 PM
I dont see why some guys have an issue with the OP dating two guys at the same time. As long as they havent mutually agreed to move on to the' exclusive dating' stage then they are ' casually dating'. Which means going out or hanging out with any number of partners. Expecting one to drop all their dates just because they met you is abit selfish and arrogant in my opinion.
 TuMuchFun
Joined: 9/29/2008
Msg: 19
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When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/22/2013 2:27:25 PM
From my stand point both of those are unforgivable, especially in excess. These actions are telling you that they are not seriously interested in you and are taking advantage of you and your time by showing you that their time is far more important.

But you, dating two people at the same time also leaves the doors open, kinda like an all bets are off situation. If I know you are seeing a few men I would not think in the slightest about returning a text from a female friend as long as its quick. The dating world is fast and furious and if your splitting your time between two I will not sit on my hands on those nights your out with #2 and if I don't respond timely to another I could end up sitting on my hands.
 moon_breeze
Joined: 10/10/2012
Msg: 20
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/22/2013 6:41:03 PM
Well, I don't think I'm plan B for time management guy, I think his life is just hectic. Last night our date was postponed due to his son needing a ride to a MRI-I kinda said I didn't believe all this crap keeps happening so he had me come down there on my way home from work. Our date was sitting in a parking lot-and I met his son that is the main reason for most of his reschedules.

I might have been plan b for texting guy, but really he was slightly undesirable in a few ways and insecure, and mentioned always getting friend zoned. So my thoughts were that he was 'friend zoned' by some of the girls he was texting and maybe he was hoping one of them would change their mind. Anyway, third times the charm, I told him I didn't see us going anywhere, he "texted-really, why?" And I told him I didn't think him texting non-emergencies so much around me was a match for me. Then I linked him a pof thread about texting on dates lol.

PS. Not to pull the zodiac card entirely but they're both Aquarius and flakiness/distance/even ignoring is a common Aquarian trait.
 moon_breeze
Joined: 10/10/2012
Msg: 21
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/23/2013 2:16:51 PM
Well his son is 20 years old-but that's why I've let it get this far. Other excuses: car broke down, teachers candlelight vigil, all things that are understandable, or he'd be gone-but after a lot of them it seems like excuses, lies or just a hectic life or bad luck on our timing.
 safaa30
Joined: 3/1/2012
Msg: 22
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When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 1/24/2013 4:42:02 PM
He was replying to a text when you got up to use the bathroom? You weren't at the table? Surely that can be overlooked???
 MiaIris
Joined: 4/30/2010
Msg: 23
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 2/8/2013 4:43:27 PM
I'll be honest and say, I would look out for myself. When the faults can possibly affect you or others I would be less forgiving. IF they are faults that could affect him (ie tardiness), I would bring it up for his benefit.
 deere_rancher
Joined: 4/4/2012
Msg: 24
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When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 2/8/2013 5:09:22 PM
I would overlook a lot of faults
as long as the qualities, values,principles and chemistry I 'm looking for are there.
 moon_breeze
Joined: 10/10/2012
Msg: 25
When to forgive someone's faults?
Posted: 2/10/2013 6:20:58 PM
Ugh-well it's happened a couple more times but we were seeing each-other daily or every other day when he got out of class (I had to come to his house though and bring clothes for work in the morning) but two days ago was the last straw.

We decided I'd come over after work and after a party I was attending. He had to stay late hfor homework help but said he'd be done at 10-then we'd hang out Saturday too. So 10 rolls around and no word. Keep in mind I'd told him I'd had a bad day and could use his cheering up. I never have drama or a bad day so it's not like I'm dramatically sucking his energy.

I texted a couple times joking about it, but heard nothing until 11:30- 1.5 hours late! He said he's drunk! So he lost track of time-I'm sorry he was supposed to be doing homework....I have no issue with him going out with classmates instead but he could have cancelled with me or something... When I go out to have a drink it rarely is a short trip and I feel he should have known that since he's 44 years old he's not a kid anymore. He said he just lost track of time and has been alone for too long but had been doing better-I ended it :( but was more attached than when I started this thread-so moral of the story don't expect people to change, and don't think you can 'accept' disrespect as a fault when it drives you nuts. And he does this with others in his life too it's not just me so I don't think it's that he's not into me-but it's not something I can deal with---back to the drawing board :(
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