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Show ALL Forums  > Relationships  > Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 BelleAtlantic
Joined: 11/7/2012
Msg: 2
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.Page 1 of 6    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6)
I've always admired men that had the ability to only care about the time they spend with me, not worrying what else is going on with anyone else. After all, that's all that matters.

If you can't give it your all because you're too concerned with the competition, you won't win at dating.
 CaptainTeebs
Joined: 11/10/2012
Msg: 4
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/6/2013 10:37:54 PM
Dignity is sometimes-all we have, when we are older. Accept that you aren't first prize for her, and date other women. She'd lose respect for you if you accept fallback position. Your pride is something to behold.
 gcdeb
Joined: 4/25/2011
Msg: 6
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 12:10:48 AM
I would respect a man who didn't want to multi date. I would respect a man who was honest with me about what was going on in his life.

I like to think that I would not let my pride get in they way if the same man got back in touch a month or so later after the other woman didn't work out.

In the meantime though, I would not be waiting around for him. I'd be getting on with my life. If he wanted back in, it would have to be on an exclusive basis from the start. It wouldn't have to be a 'relationship' straight away, but I would need to know that he wasn't multi dating again. And there would be no guarantee that my interest in him would still be at the same level.
 Eric_Summit
Joined: 11/3/2009
Msg: 7
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 12:39:55 AM
TheUrbanMan...there is no need to exclude her from your life.
At the same time, there is no reason to put your happiness entirely on hold, either.

Continue to see this first woman for drinks, dinner, or coffee as time allows.
At the same time you should also meet others for drinks, dinner, coffee, shows, parties, and other events.

If another woman steals your heart in the meantime, so be it. If this first woman later comes around, you might be available or you might be with another person. That is why TIMING is so essential with affairs of the heart.
 IgorFrankensteen
Joined: 6/29/2009
Msg: 8
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History
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 3:45:15 AM
Important viewpoint to note:

This woman DID NOT tell this man to wait for her while she dallies with another. She did not do that, at least according to what the OP describes here. Therefore, declarations that she is this or that sort of selfish, presumptuous egotist are not supported. No judgments about her are.

What we have here, is a man who began to get to know a woman, who was in the midst of learning herself, who and what she cared about, and desired to pursue. At this point, she has decided to explore serious things with another man, and has gracefully let THIS guy know what she is doing and why.

That reads very positive about her, from my point of view.

OP, you know exactly where you stand. Your crude and demeaning title question is the worst part about your little story. If you take your negative emotions out of the mix, and calm down, and look at the way the entire world of humans works and has ALWAYS worked, you will see (unless you blind yourself) that every damn one of us are at best "sloppy fourteenth" or worse for each other. At least we are, if we don't get married at our parents direction, just after leaving convents and monasteries.

Your negative reaction is actually due to the fact that she spelled things out for you, instead of doing what most people do, which is to say nothing, and then switch partners when things don't work out. Just imagine this: instead of her telling you now what she is doing as she is doing it, she goes off with that other guy. You go about your life, feel sad for a while when you realize she's gone, mope a bit, and post a complaint about how some women just up and run off without saying a word. A year or six months later, she decides that the other guy isn't going to work out, calls you up, and gives you a shot, because she really did like you.

Then either things do work with the two of you, or they don't. But either way, simply because she DOESN'T tell you what she is doing as she does it, you feel LUCKY, instead of feeling like a "sloppy second," backup plan.
 dpwesu
Joined: 3/25/2013
Msg: 9
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 4:27:03 AM

my pride, says I am not going to accept being a fallback


I think you answered your question right here, OP.

Never, EVER make someone a priority who only views you as an option......or worse yet a last resort.

I can't tell you how many times I have been rejected by guys who thought they could "do better" only to have them try to come crawling back after several months, even years later wanting to give it "another chance".

My answer: - no way.....you couldn't give me a chance back then I can't give you a chance now, for I am NOT going to be anyone's last choice.

I deserve sooooo much better than that and so do you, OP.

For your own self respect, let her go and pursue what ever it is she needs to pursue. If you don't respect yourself, nobody else will.
 Walts
Joined: 5/7/2005
Msg: 10
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 4:27:41 AM
And here I thought I was gonna here something about a hot little thing with a gang bang lineup, and someone complaining about being number 2 in the lineup(sorry, it's as "un"crude as I could be.

The young lady is telling the OP she is interested in another at this point in her life and will not consider dating the OP until she pursues this interest. I don't see a thing wrong with her actions, other than the OP wasn't number one on the list, which puts him down to number two at best on her interest list. As in, everything Igor ^^^^^ has stated.

Sometimes it is a biatch when people are honest and act accordingly. Sometimes people just don't understand or how to handle such actions. Well, OP, many of us will not be "number one" on the list at this time of our lives. Even if I was dating somebody today, pretty sure they were dating somebody else either last week, last year, or in the last decade. Tis true.
 Melannie1
Joined: 6/8/2013
Msg: 11
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History
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 4:36:44 AM
Hi TheUrbanMan! I would consider your statement with a slight change of a word "Or does a mature man forget about it and work it out with ANOTHER woman.... M.
 ladyc4
Joined: 2/14/2006
Msg: 12
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 6:21:28 AM
OP
I don't look at this as the lady in question "rejecting" you. I look at it as her being SCRUPULOUSLY HONEST and letting you know that there is a comparison going on. I agree with Igor, I did not get a sense that she was telling you to wait for her.
Look, you can stomp off in a huff and refuse any future contact with her. That way your pride and ego will be very contented, whether the rest of you is or not.

Now, I think to myself-"WTF did the woman say anything??? She should just have gone ahead and explored her feelings with this other guy, there was no committment to the OP and it was none of the OPs business what she did with her time when not in his company".
I'm fairly certain that the above statement will draw shrieks of rage from some posters-which will PROVE the point
I want to make.
Everyone makes such a big deal about being completely and scrupulously honest in dating, apprising a new dating interest of every facet of one's life including every little detail of social life...and then when scrupulous honesty is practiced-the result is that the "victim" of a new interests' honesty gets all pissy and butthurt.
How does anyone expect people to be truthful and honest when truthfulness and honesty are punished?
This is not a court of law, this is not about handling sums of money that belong to other people, nor is it about committing theft or business/financial deception.

OP, she has told you her intentions. It is up to you what you do with it. I agree with those who say, just get on with your life and keep your options open. It's OK if you continue to entertain a hope that the other guy turns out to be NOT what she wants, but do not let yourself get overly invested in that hope.
Only YOU can judge how big a part your pride, ego, etc play in the fabric of your life, whether catering to those at the expense of your heart is worth it.
I will not tell you that this is some kind of "game" or "test", I cannot give you any assurance that she will find this other guy to be unsatisfactory. I wouldn't DARE to speculate as to what she's doing. I admire her honesty in being totally truthful with you, but I think she'd have been better served to just date both of you and see how things shook out. As it is now, if you know about this other guy and he knows about you, I'm not sure how she expects to get an accurate assessment of your respective character/values/temperament. But that's not my problem, it's hers.
I do admire her honesty and complete candor, but I wonder if a bit of circumspection wouldn't have served her better.
Cindy O
 ForRumOnly
Joined: 3/16/2009
Msg: 13
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Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 6:41:26 AM
Move on with your life. If she decides the other guy isn't right for her, and comes back, give it a chance IF you haven't found someone else.

My take on things is that I want someone who chooses to be with me for all the right reasons. They may have to figure that out by dating other people first. That seems to be your situation. Choosing you right now would be a mistake for her, because she'd have lingering doubts. Maybe the other guy IS better for her, in which case you should be happy for her and find someone who thinks YOU are as ideal for her as you think she is for you.
 Proteaus
Joined: 6/9/2009
Msg: 14
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 6:44:32 AM
Perma dump her now and save yourself a lot of drama in the future . I would wish her the best of luck with her new boyfriend .More than likely she will pull same garbage with him . Then when women are like that and get older they wonder where did all the nice guys go . The nice guys were kicked to the curb so they can date more guys that are the reason they are single in the first place . Almost sounds like poetic justice .
 4ms4me
Joined: 4/24/2010
Msg: 15
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Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 6:52:45 AM
Igor and Walts, my today heroes! I agree with you guys ... Plus, OP, if she dumps the other guy and comes back to you, how would that make you "second best"? Seems pretty obvious to me that you'd become #1. And, if you two do get back together, surely you'd feel more secure knowing she'd already dealt with that item, and wouldn't be wondering if she ought to have before deciding on you. Plus, it could make an awesome romantic story to tell friends/kids/grandkids -" she didn't know a good thing when it was right under her nose, she had to go find out for herself. But I knew she'd be back, because I am the best."

In the meantime, get on with your life. Genuinely wish her well, and don't waste time pining. Remember that cute little saying: "If you love something, set it free. If it comes back to you, its yours. If it doesn't, it never was".
 Just_Bopping_Around
Joined: 6/28/2013
Msg: 16
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 6:53:56 AM
Listen to Igor and what LadyC4 said.

She's *not* rejecting you, just the timing is off somewhat. In the past, I've talked to two women and been very attracted to both of them, but decided that it best to see what developed with the one I started talking to first. That's pretty common. It doesn't mean the other was a 'fallback'. It's more a matter of timing.

You've got two problems from what I can see. You described it much better in your second post:

I've only been really interested in this one girl in 8 years...
Dating is tough for men my age as picky me. Not a lot of single English professors running around, you know.

There's a lot of very smart people that aren't college professors. In fact, there are a ton of women with graduate degrees or even Ph.D. or the equivalent that aren't college professors. They're doctors, lawyers, run their own businesses. Heck, a smart guy in his 40's can find *amazingly* gorgeous, educated, accomplished women in their 40's.

The problem is, most of them wouldn't have much to do with you. You're 43, you're longest relationship is 4 years and you're looking for someone from 18-35. See many 18 year old college professors in the English Department, do you?

I live in a small resort town and there are more than enough very intelligent, attractive women with graduate degrees for my taste and you can't find one in *Los Angeles* in 8 years? Los Angeles and there's no women that meet your requirements? Really?

Broaden your horizons, meet intelligent women that are out there and available. Get out of your college confines and see what the world has to offer.

The second problem is that you don't seem to have a lot of experience in relations. If things don't work out and the girl decides to date you, you're worried more about your pride than anything else.

Do you want to be happy in a good relationship with a wonderful woman, or would you rather stand on pride and principle and be lonely the rest of your life?

Sloppy seconds? Are you in grade school? That's a horrible term. If you're going to feel that way about the girl or yourself, then just ignore her and date someone else.

What you need to do is get out in the world and start meeting other people. Start dating other women. If she becomes available and you're available, see what happens. But don't sit there and pine for her.
 nubeginnings64
Joined: 4/8/2012
Msg: 17
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 7:02:26 AM
She blew you off & you should accept it. If it were me I'd be friendly if I saw her at school but wouldn't have any contact with her otherwise.
 Eric_Summit
Joined: 11/3/2009
Msg: 18
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 7:09:58 AM
^^^
Excellent commentary and feedback by Just_Bopping_Around above.
Didn't realize the OP is 43 y.o. and is seeking dates purely in the 18 y.o. to 35 y.o. span.
That is quite limiting. Changing to a 36 y.o. to 50 y.o. field would certainly help him.
 BorderCollieMix
Joined: 7/4/2013
Msg: 19
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 7:18:24 AM
"If it weren't for timing issues. . . " If it weren't for what? Seriously, what you wrote is, I'm too desperate to have dignity. I want the people in this forum to say it is ok, b/c she is sooooooo special.

Um, no. She is NOT that attracted to you and she wants a filler just in case. I don't care how brilliant she is in her field of study, this is just plain old immature, selfish behavior on her part, and you cannot see it that way b/c you are desperate.

Please take my advice and understand that her level of attraction to you will never be what you deserve, and you will always be at risk of losing her to some guy who makes her tingle like you cannot.

I know what I'm talking about--I was "that girl" before, and then I tied myself b/c of guilt to the guy who waited for me. Huge mistake. I never felt about him like I needed to feel about someone in order to be fully committed. Over the course of the relationship, we both did a lot of damage and got hurt, too. It was ugly and drawn out. I can only say in my defense that once I *finally* accepted the fact that I could not stay with someone out of guilt, I left--before cheating on him. But had I been a different person, I'd have been cheating my way through that relationship until he found out.

Stop seeing her, stop thinking she is so special (she isn't--she's emotionally immature and selfish if she is asking you to "wait to see what happens."

She will never, ever respect you, either, for waiting. She may feel grateful and then get into a relationship with you, but it will be one in which she knows she has the upper hand and one based on your attraction, not hers.

I hope that is enough to make you wake up and stop sounding like a love-sick school boy.
 JoeBnD
Joined: 3/23/2012
Msg: 20
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 7:38:08 AM

Any guy would be crazy not to try to keep her, ...


Then just call me crazy!
 BelleAtlantic
Joined: 11/7/2012
Msg: 21
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 7:47:03 AM
She says it might not work out, and she's not married and she would like to know me.


That's what stood out to me. Where in that statement does it say she is rejecting you or not wanting to get to know you (in spite of the fact that she has expressed interest in someone else as well).

Here's an example of second fiddle, real life experience:

I had a FWB arrangement going on for a few months. In the beginning, I was interested but not really to the effect of a relationship. He had considered someone he had been with in another relationship, the love of his life. In fact, I had to stay with my sister for a day, because she was coming into town and he had offered her to stay with him (we were roommates). She leaves the next day, he somehow gets the impression that nothing will happen with her, and it would take some time for her to even fathom the idea of taking him back. He starts getting all chummy chummy with me and proposes that we date exclusively, but understand that if she (the love of his life) decides she wants to give it another try, then he would opt for that in a heartbeat. So the conversation went like this:

Me: So what are you trying to say? That we can be in a relationship in which I already know you won't love me to the same or higher degree in comparison to her, and if she decides to come back in your life, you would just drop me like I never meant anything to you?

Him: Well, you have to understand that she is the love of my life, while I don't see anything happening in the future, I do have to warn you of the possibility. Who knows, she may never come back in my life, and you wouldn't have anything to worry about. We can give this a try.

Me: I'm sorry, but I'm not going to be the standby person, I deserve to also be the love of someone's life (and them mine), not second place to another person. By way of you proposing this, I already know you don't give a f*ck about me or what I feel, if you think something like this is acceptable for anyone. You are outright telling me someone comes before me and always will, how do you propose I make peace with that idea?

The next week, I met the person that became my boyfriend for 8.5 years.

I'm not suggesting you give up on her, you can get to know her, and meet other people at the same time. It's about what actually happens (which interaction leads to something meaningful), not about speculation. You are not being made second fiddle, she is simply exploring her options, as you should too.
 MutedEnthusiasm
Joined: 7/8/2011
Msg: 22
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 8:01:14 AM
I've only been really interested in this one girl in 8 years…
And if it weren't for the timing issue, and difficulty in my meeting girls that get me and I get them, I would write this girl off…

I see a scarcity problem here. She’s the winner in a field of one. That doesn't necessarily translate into a compatible match-up for intimate relationship. If things don’t work out with her – then what? Another eight years? I know this isn’t the issue you came here with but I see it as an underlying problem. You’re not meeting enough women. Come down from the tower, my brother.

A part of me, my pride, says I am not going to accept being a fallback, especially to a girl who jumps at her 'instinct'.

I see a potential problem here too. Be not a lover of words, bro. Specially not your own. It’s not really pride, you’re not really a ‘fallback’, and it’s not really instinct. Beware how you frame the issues. Don’t believe everything you think. You may think your way out of being fully alive. And that would be a waste. When you point at the moon, see the moon. Not your finger.
 BorderCollieMix
Joined: 7/4/2013
Msg: 23
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 8:35:16 AM
Oh, for god's sake, people, read more carefully. She is dangling him. She already put him off by saying they could hang out more "later," but now she has someone else she's fixed her eyes on.

Really? You want a woman you have expressed in to tell you, well, now isn't a good time, maybe later. . . oh, wait, I've just met someone I'm really interested in. . . maybe it won't work and I will end up with you afterall!

Thems the words of a woman really interested in ya. Sure. I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell, if you are interested.

If she was interested in him, she would not be talking about "later." If she is working elsewhere (which might be the case, otherwise I cannot figure out why she is so busy she can't see him at all during this summer), she'd be inviting him to visit. She would be doing what she could to move the relationship forward. She would not be talking about "later" and "never say never." Those words are intended to keep him on the hook--she should just say, "I'm not interesed in you in that way," because THAT is the message her actions give, not this "coy" never-say-never crap.

He knows he is being put on hold. He's just looking for our permission to say it is ok, that it is not evidence of her lack of strong interest, that he is not really 2nd best.

But very, very clearly, he is.

People who wait while someone explores another interest (whether asked to wait or not) are just wasting their time. If the person you want, wants you, things move forward. That person does not take a side street on their way to you of they are strongly attracted. "Waiting" for that person to discover that you are really "the one" after they have finished their exploring is called, waiting to get the person who didn't choose you first. And it is about attraction, which most women know darn quickly. Coming back to a patiently waiting guy does not mean the attraction has increased--it means no one is available to whom she feels a stronger attraction, so she settles for hm.

She has clearly said things to keep him waiting even if she didn't use those exact words. She is not being honest--not with him, and maybe not with herself. She's acting like a teenager and he's considering buying into it.

She's being selfish while trying to appear honorable ("Well, at least she is being honest and sneaking around behind his back." No, she's being coy and misleading) and he's trying to rationalize it.
 Kellticman72
Joined: 1/5/2013
Msg: 24
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 8:43:12 AM
Never make yourself feel like nothing to make someone else can feel like everything. If you want to wait around then fine, but at least date other women in the process.
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 25
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 8:47:01 AM

A part of me, my pride, says I am not going to accept being a fallback, especially to a girl who jumps at her 'instinct'. Our correspondence is well reasoned but essentially she feels this is something she must do.

I know many relationships begin with couples not liking each other initially, or one was dating another partner. In this case, I am the fallback. Does dignity require I reject my rejection on principle, and forfeit happiness since she can never be trusted? Or does a mature man forget about it and work it out with a woman.

What do you think?

I think that we are all fall backs after the person dates for the first time - even if she chose you instead, you're still a fallback from her last guy, so what's the difference? Let that go, that's silliness...hey, she's being honest with you, respect that. Date around for a bit, and if things don't work for you or her see where it goes. Pride is a pretty useless thing to throw things into the context of.

Why can't she be trusted?
 Whisky_River
Joined: 9/12/2010
Msg: 26
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 8:49:21 AM
IMO...Op..has really no say in the matter of waiting for her or not.
I think, she was honest with him and really has no interest of "anything" in the future happening between them.
She may have been trying to soften the blow or hurt with another "imaginary" interest...who knows?

Carry on with your life and like Belle says...We all deserve to be #1 with someone....
I would not be waiting on the side lines for anyone.
You need to be a little more open to women closer to your own age and move on...
 ladyc4
Joined: 2/14/2006
Msg: 27
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 8:56:53 AM

People who wait while someone explores another interest (whether asked to wait or not) are just wasting their time.

I don't think anyone here has told the OP to do that. He is ASKING for suggestions/advice/thoughts/whatever!-as to what his course of action should be.

We have given our OPINIONS.

I stated that I admired the woman for her scrupulous honesty when she could have just kept stringing BOTH men along.
I also agree with posters who suggested that the OP needs to get out more!

I GET being a limited match, etc...I do understand what he is saying. But IF he chooses to wait this out, then what the HELL is he gonna do if she decides to make things permanent with this other guy?
Now, being single is not a defect or failing, but it would be a shame if he never explored what else might be out there because he has it set in his mind that she is the "one and only".

OTOH- maybe the woman's intent ISN'T scrupulous honesty. Maybe she's trying to "let him down easy", or maybe she does want to keep him on the back burner...
We can each only give our own opinions based on our personal experiences and observations. mone of us live in this womans' head, we can't KNOW what might or mightn't happen down the road.

OP, I still say that you should keep an open mind, both to the possibility that this gal IS "the one", but also to getting out more and meeting a greater variety of people.
I agree, usually good relationships start off with both people wanting one another in a fairly equal degree, but there are also plenty of good, solid longterm relationships that stumbled coming out of the gate or floundered at some point.
None of us can TELL the OP what to do/how to feel, all we can do is offer our opinions.
Cindy O
 christ on a crutch
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 28
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History
Sloppy Seconds: Acceptable or no? For older daters.
Posted: 8/7/2013 9:22:37 AM
if you take away the hopefully interpretable talk, she's pushed you away twice - once because she was busy, and once because of someone else. in my book, two such incidents always equal lack of romantic interest.

the only possible mitigating factor i see is your 'electric' interaction. if that was sex, that makes things tougher to parse. did you and she have sex?
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