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Show ALL Forums  > Off Topic  > Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch      Home login  
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 theleathernun
Joined: 7/6/2014
Msg: 1
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Election 2014: Karma is a b!tchPage 1 of 90    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41)
It seems that many "on the right" are postively giddy about their election prospects. They seem to see "winning the Senate" as their "ticket" to undoing anything and everything Obama and stopping the "slide to hell" (as in 'liberalism').

I have to wonder if they have ever considered the phrases "Karna is a b!tch" and "Payback is a motherfvcker"?

In all their giddiness, they seem to be forgetting that even winning the Senate will still leave them with a gapping chasm between actual votes and "veto proof".

What this leaves them with is the reality that ANYTHING of importance to them that can't generate bi-partisan support will likely result in a Presidential veto that they have no hope of overturning.

There is no doubt that they will try to use a majority to pass all the legislation they could never get past the Dem Senate, everything from massive cuts to the social safety net to tax cuts for the 'top earners' to a repeal of Obamacare. Do they really expect the Dems and Obama to simply 'roll over' to their demands after better than 4 years of obstructionism and blatantly false attacks?

No doubt the Dems and President will have no issue with anything that can claim bi-partisan support, just as it has been for the last 4 years but, will they simply allow the right's agenda to 'run roughshod' over them otherwise. Somehow, I think not.

What I expect would happen if the right takes the Senate is no more legislative action than they have managed to put forward to-date, which is essentially nothing. All we will see is more of their 'my way or no way' approach, in fact, I expect they will deliberately be putting forth every bill they know would obtain no support from the Dems, for no other reason than to 'stick it to Obama'. There will be no 'moving to the center' to obtain bi-partisan support just as there has been no movement in that direction to date and the Dems will not simply 'give them the keys'.

I see another 2 years of a 'do nothing' Republican Congress that will be 'do nothing' for the very same reasons as it has so far, Republican intransigence and a complete unwillingness to compromise on anything (until after they shoot themselves in the foot for the umpteenth time). I see another 2 years of Republicans trying to 'stick it to Obama' and the Dems and President having no more to do with it than they have to date.

And, just as it has been so far, the Republicans will wear the blame, as they should.
 flyguy51
Joined: 8/11/2005
Msg: 2
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/15/2014 2:56:54 PM
I agree. I feel that our political system is largely broken, and gerrymandering and money in politics are largely responsible for the disconnect between the wishes of the American people and congressional (in)action. Also to blame for the 2014 predictions are an apathetic voting public. The GOP has had the most conscientious voters in my lifetime, and low turnout is their victory-- hence the voter ID laws they feel so strongly about. People need to realize that midterm elections also matter. Granted, the presidential elections are more exciting!

That said, I don't dread a Repub majority all that much because congress hasn't done anything anyway. It will actually be nice to see the GOP take ownership of something besides negation...
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 3
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Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/15/2014 3:21:28 PM
I'm looking forward to perhaps gaining more and more "independents" in Congress.

If we get enough of them it will be like having a third political party and they can caucus together and also vote as a unit to sway a vote one way or another. With something like that in place, even though they might be a severe minority, they can easily become the party that makes a lot of decisions.

Indeed then, Karma will be a b1tch!
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 4
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/15/2014 4:47:18 PM

What I expect would happen if the right takes the Senate is no more legislative action than they have managed to put forward to-date, which is essentially nothing. All we will see is more of their 'my way or no way' approach, in fact, I expect they will deliberately be putting forth every bill they know would obtain no support from the Dems, for no other reason than to 'stick it to Obama'. There will be no 'moving to the center' to obtain bi-partisan support just as there has been no movement in that direction to date and the Dems will not simply 'give them the keys'.


I don't see much in the way of bills coming out of the senate, regardless of who holds the senate majority, for President Obama to sign or veto. So, I don't think the republicans will stick it to our President any more than they've done in the past.

As far as bi-partisan sponsorship of bills....little will change here...and the same bi=partisan support of bills introduced will continue. I do see the republicans continuing to push through their agenda items-ACA repeal...marriage inequality...increased military industrial complex spending-while reducing funding for our actual men in the military....efforts to dramatically reduce WICK, SNAP, and food stamps...lower corporate taxes, lower taxes on the wealthy, higher taxes on the poor and lower middle classes....vouchers instead of medicare...no more social security...not one of these agenda items has a snowballs chance in heII of passing-yet, the republicans have to "appear" to be doing something...and they will call all these bills "jobs bills"-where the reality is none of them have a single thing to do with jobs.
 trinity818
Joined: 9/1/2006
Msg: 5
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Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/15/2014 5:21:05 PM

I'm looking forward to perhaps gaining more and more "independents" in Congress.

If we get enough of them it will be like having a third political party and they can caucus together and also vote as a unit to sway a vote one way or another. With something like that in place, even though they might be a severe minority, they can easily become the party that makes a lot of decisions.


OMG. The day has come. I agree with cotter. (Is it gettin' chilly out?? I may have just seen a large pink object fly by.)
 Consensuality
Joined: 7/26/2007
Msg: 6
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/15/2014 7:57:34 PM
I'm not sure what Independents would look like. The democrats operate as moderate Republicans and the GoP is split between traditional and ultra conservatives. If the GoP gets a majority they will probably continue their civil war which is the main reasons for the deadlock. Traditional Republicans don't have a large enough block to push through moderate policy and tea partyers won't budge on anything because they'll lose their seat if they do.

Either way legislation is not likely to move forward unless the whole party shifts to the right or tea partyers are displaced by establishment republicans who then form a large enough block that they can shut them out. Democrats are unlikely to win much this year.

I suspect that Obama is unlikely to pass much TP legislation, though of course if they're clever they will tie it to important must pass bills like military funding, social welfare and the budget.
 bluemoon24_7
Joined: 4/18/2014
Msg: 7
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/16/2014 5:26:48 AM
I don't think I'd like a two party system but having half a dozen parties is weird. The Independents give a different take on things, I like that.

Is you Senate as useless as ours?
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 8
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/16/2014 7:07:27 AM
Regardless of the makeup of congress the republican agenda is very shallow-Repeal ACA! Why? Well let one senate candidate from Arkansas tell you:


FAYETTEVILLE, ARKANSAS—Tom Cotton, the Republican candidate for Arkansas’ U.S. Senate seat, has repeatedly denounced the Affordable Care Act as a failure and vowed to help repeal it if elected. But in his second and final debate Tuesday night against Democratic incumbent Mark Pryor, he went further, claiming the high-risk insurance pools that many states ran before Obamacare’s passage were better for people with pre-existing conditions than the current exchanges.

“Many people were happy with their coverage under the high-risk pool, before it was eliminated,” Cotton said. “They should have been allowed to keep that choice.”

Pryor shot back, saying his personal experience proved otherwise. “I am a cancer survivor,” he said. “I have been in the high-risk pool. I have lived there. It is no place for any Arkansan to be. If we go back to the high-risk pool, it’s like throwing sick people to the wolves.”

Many of the high risk pools Cotton praised were known for their sky-high costs, exclusion of many applicants, and strict limits on what care is covered. In Arkansas, out of pocket costs for patients in such pools could be as high as $20,000 and those with pre-existing conditions had an average 6 month waiting period for care.

From ThinkProgress
 oldfashmntman
Joined: 10/20/2009
Msg: 9
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/16/2014 11:38:53 AM
There isn't a nickles worth of difference between the two anyway, they ALL (with very few exceptions) intend to take us to the same place, just by different route.
 Yule_liquor
Joined: 12/7/2011
Msg: 10
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/16/2014 10:55:56 PM

Regardless of the makeup of congress the republican agenda is very shallow-Repeal ACA! Why? Well let one senate candidate from Arkansas tell you:


The GOP knows that they won't be able to overturn the ACA. This guy is an errand boy who carrying out his assignment that was probably handed down to him by GOP high command

They just say shit like this because their agenda requires that they stay connected with all the low functioning fools (all the non wealthy pple who vote for them on the basis of xenophobia, bigotry, misogyny, and other types of ignorance) in order to keep them all believing that Obama will soon turn the US into a Marxist state; and thereby try to garner their votes, come election time.


There isn't a nickles worth of difference between the two anyway,


Not from the standpoint of big business!
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 11
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/17/2014 4:17:06 AM


There isn't a nickles worth of difference between the two anyway,

Not from the standpoint of big business!


For the most part I would have to agree with this assessment. Though, I'm sure the two comments are miles apart in what they mean.

There is a ground-swell, if one can call it that, within the republican party of libertarian-teaparty philosophy. The ideology is government that fit's into a bathtub, a laissez-faire approach to regulating business, and extreme social conservationism. All throughout the country one can witness mainstream republicans running against a teaparty-libertarian candidate in a republican primary. (Please note that true libertarian's are not necessarily social conservatives.) Regardless, of whom these teaparty-libertarian-mainstream candidates are, a vast amount of their candidacies are funded by corporate funded superpacs...in large part, funded from Koch Industries-or the Koch brothers, if you will. The Koch brothers and Phillip Morris founded Citizens for a Sound Economy (CSE) in 1984, which was a precursor to Americans for Prosperity and Freedomworks. Interestingly enough, CSE was started with seed monies from Koch Industries and Phillip Morris, and that Americans for Prosperity, Freedomworks, and the teaparty oppose tobacco taxes. No stretch of the imagination there.

Along comes Citizens United and the perfect storm for corporate control of our political system is created.

Is the democrat party any different? Nope. There is no way to compete with corporate campaign funding other than to accept corporate campaign funding. Perhaps, there is one difference....democrats wish to repeal Citizen's United. Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, and others have made it a primary legislative goal.

So, is there a difference in the political parties from the standpoint of big business? Yes, there is! Republicans, libertarians, and teaparty support corporate control of our political process, while, many, if not all, democrats advocate for campaign finance reform. This mid-term election season highlights the obscene monies corporations throw at campaigns. Without campaign finance reform, we truly will have the best government money can buy.
 John255317
Joined: 12/28/2012
Msg: 12
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/17/2014 5:24:15 PM
"Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch"

IF the Senate is controlled by the Republicans OP, you and other libs will see some things actually getting done with Reid out of the way.

Here’s an undeniable truth that would flow from a fully Republican Congress. “Ironically,” says Don Stewart, a top aide to McConnell, “more legislation will actually pass, because we’ll just start passing things the House passed. Right now, Senator Reid’s main job is to be goaltender—to block President Obama from having to veto things.” To Stewart, Reid has prevented any number of bills that passed the House and could pass the Senate because “he wants the story to be ‘Republicans block.’ They’ve poison-pilled everything. We’ll take those out and pass things.”

Hillary for one is not looking forward to this happening if it does happen.

No, I have hope that CHANGE will actually happen for all of us.

Tight races and we may not know until after November how this all shakes out.
 theleathernun
Joined: 7/6/2014
Msg: 13
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Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/17/2014 5:48:40 PM

No, I have hope that CHANGE will actually happen for all of us.

So, what you are saying is that you hope the Democrats retain the Senate and toss about 35 Republicans out of their House seats.
 John255317
Joined: 12/28/2012
Msg: 14
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/17/2014 5:51:02 PM
No, we all wanted "change" the last 6 years and didn't happen. I believe you read my previous post correctly.
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 15
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/17/2014 6:03:13 PM
Atta Boy...a whole paragraph and a little more...I knew you could do it...and on topic too.


Don Stewart, a top aide to McConnell, “more legislation will actually pass, because we’ll just start passing things the House passed.


The majority of legislation that the house passed up to the senate were the 50+ attempts to defund and repeal ACA...we don't have to go back down that road again do we?


to block President Obama from having to veto things


I guarantee you that President Obama will veto very little if any legislation over the next two years-regardless of the mid-term elections.


Reid has prevented any number of bills that passed the House and could pass the Senate because “he wants the story to be ‘Republicans block.’ They’ve poison-pilled everything. We’ll take those out and pass things.”


Right...the house will now remove the "poison pills" if they win a majority in the senate...because this will increase the likelihood of legislation passing in the senate? What a crock of rambling BS non-sense...if there was any time for the house to keep "poison pills" out of legislation it was over the past 4 years so that some legislation might actually make it through both houses in congress....but, now there's no need for "poison pills" if the republicans take the senate majority....AND YOU BELIEVE THIS CRAYPE...to bad you can't vote for Obama a third time.
 theleathernun
Joined: 7/6/2014
Msg: 16
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Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/17/2014 6:08:25 PM

No, we all wanted "change" the last 6 years and didn't happen.

I think your sense of time is just a bit off. For the first 2 years of the last 6 we did see change, that is how the ACA got passed. There was significant change when the Democrats had control of the Congress.

You are right about the last 4 of those 6 years though, not one damn bit of positive change came with a Republican controlled House, unless you count shutting down the government out of spite and passing almost nothing significant.
 mountinmann
Joined: 4/1/2014
Msg: 17
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/17/2014 9:52:42 PM
The lack of knowledge here is stunning.
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 18
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/18/2014 5:09:02 AM
The republican agenda for the first half of the 113rd senate was to reject any nomination placed forward, by President Obama, to fill executive nominations and non-Supreme Court judicial vacancies regardless of how well qualified the nominee was. One only has to look at the votes before the "nuclear option" was exercised to see why the senate was on a record number of filibuster rate. Since the "nuclear option" was exercised almost the only passage of anything is nomination of executive nominees and non-Supreme Court judicial nominees, which are the only votes that can make it to cloture. Prior to the "nuclear option" virtually noting made it to cloture.

Interestingly enough a republican think tank scholar thinks it was actually the republican senate minority leader that forced the "nuclear option" in order that he may go "nuclear" to end all filibuster by the minority should the republicans ever take a majority in the senate:


Norm Ornstein, a congressional scholar at the conservative American Enterprise Institute, told TPM that Republicans forced Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) to "go nuclear" after his Democratic majority took the historic step Thursday and ended the filibuster for executive nominees and non-Supreme Court judicial nominees.

"For whatever reason, the Republicans decided to go nuclear first, with this utterly unnecessary violation of their own agreement and open decision to block the president from filling vacancies for his entire term, no matter how well qualified the nominees," Ornstein told TPM in an email. "It was a set of actions begging for a return nuclear response."

He also speculated that Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) secretly wanted Democrats to go nuclear so he could use the same tactic to end the filibuster entirely if and when Republicans take the majority.

"McConnell's threat, it seems to me, makes clear the strategy: let Dems take the first step, and we will then bear no blame when we entirely blow up the Senate's rules after we take all the reins of power," he said. "That other Republicans like Corker, McCain, Alexander, Murkowski and so on, went along, shows how much the radicals and anti-institutionalists now dominate the Republican Party. Which is sad indeed."

From TPM Livewire
 John255317
Joined: 12/28/2012
Msg: 19
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/18/2014 9:12:52 AM
OP, you so want this "karma" thing and to blame republicans. Actually, you are going to see something totally different. Wanting something to fail because it doesn't go your way at all is not karma when it actually betters the issue. If it was a different subject, it would be called jealousy. And jealousy has no place in needing the US to be a better nation then it is now. Real people want real action and "karma" definitely will not be a word they will use if the Republicans gain the Senate.

One huge topic is the democrats "war on women". A catchy phrase that is only a catchy phrase. Hypocritical would be a word I and millions of others would use.
_________________________________________________________________________________

Democrats Are Blocking Republican Solutions for Women and Working Families



By Sharon Day - June 24, 2014


Recent polling from Republican pollsters confirms what Republicans have said for years: women’s top priorities are the economy, government spending, education, and healthcare. Women are not single issue voters, and women are not happy with the status quo. We're looking for something better and something substantive.

Democrats have long tried to reduce women to single issue voters, and Republican have consistently called them out for failing to respect the fact that women vote on a wide range of issues. By relying on cynical political attacks like the “war on women” that lack substance, Democrats have failed to provide women with solutions to our top concerns.

For example, earlier this year when the White House was pushing equal pay legislation, and falsely accused Republicans of opposing equal pay. Republicans called them out, affirming our belief in equal pay for equal work and exposing them for peddling inaccurate statistics.

Not only did this expose the fact that they were misleading the American people, but it also showed that President Obama himself did not meet his own standard. On average, women in the White House made 88 cents for every dollar a man made. In other words, Democrats’ argument was not only misleading, it was hypocritical.

Similarly, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid’s refusal to introduce the dozens of jobs bills passed by the Republican-led House shows that job creation is not Democrats’ first priority. They only talk about job creation if they think it’s politically advantageous, but in reality the Democrat-led Senate is the biggest roadblock to job creation in Washington. Women list jobs as a top priority, and Democrats aren’t delivering. Republicans are offering real legislation that could get real results, but Democrats are dropping the ball.

However, it gets worse. Democrats are not just ignoring the bills passed by the Republican-led House. They also refuse to consider bills sponsored by Senate Republicans to help working families.

Senator Tim Scott is sponsoring the Supporting Knowledge and Investing in Lifelong Skills Act, or the SKILLS Act, which would transform our broken workforce development and training system into a more responsive and efficient program to enable workers to compete in the 21st century economy. This bill already passed the House in a 215-202 vote.

Senator Susan Collins has a bill to restore the 40-hour work week with her Forty Hours Is Full Time Act. The act would repeal ObamaCare’s 30-hour workweek rule, which has cut American workers’ hours and wages. It, too, has passed the House.

Senator Deb Fischer of Nebraska is working to prevent workplace discrimination with the Workplace Advancement Amendment. It would equip women with tools to fight discrimination in the workplace.

Senator Marco Rubio’s Rewarding Achievement and Incentivizing Successful Employees Act, or the RAISE Act, would amend the National Labor Relations Act to allow employers to give merit-based compensation increases to individual employees, even if those increases are not part of a collective bargaining agreement.

Senator Mike Lee’s Working Families Flexibility Act would help workers handle the constant challenge of work-life balance. It would allow private-sector employers to give employees who work overtime a choice between extra pay or extra comp time. This passed House in a 223-204 vote.

Senator Mitch McConnell’s Working Parents Home Office Act would fix a flaw in the tax code that penalizes parents who work from home. Right now, women and men can’t claim a tax deduction for a home office if that office includes a baby crib. This ridiculous provision punishes parents who work from home and care for their kids at the same time; the act would change that.

Sadly, it’s not surprising that Democrats only talk about helping working families but won’t work with Republicans to pass commonsense legislation. If Harry Reid let Republican solutions see the light of day in the Senate, voters would also see that Republicans are working on their behalf. Because Democrats have nothing to offer but false attacks, they won’t dare let Republicans get a vote on their solutions-oriented legislations. They only talk about women and working families when it’s politically convenient for them.

If Democrats were serious, they would work with Republicans in the House and Senate, not ignore them. This behavior is sad, but it’s what we have come to expect from Harry Reid and Barack Obama’s hyper-partisan leadership. They are so focused on winning elections that they will do anything to score a political point, including letting women and working families lose opportunities to better their lives.
 IgorFrankensteen
Joined: 6/29/2009
Msg: 20
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Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/18/2014 10:00:50 AM
Is this where people predict what Republicans will do if they win the Senate back and keep control of the House?

I tend to look to History for answers, whenever I can. And as it happens, we DID have full Republican control of both Congressional chambers, not all that long ago. For a while, they even controlled the Presidency and the Supreme Court as well, all at the same time.

What happened? Well, the one thing that stands out about that time, is that of all the Big Things that the GOP talked about BEFORE the elections, not one was actually on their agenda once they got in. Not one. Instead, they spent their time on a few revenge bills, and some political non-binding resolutions.

My favorite, was that before the elections, the chatter was full of complaints by Republicans that Democratic Lawmakers were never subject to any of the laws they passed. Once they had all three branches of government, they...decided that a non-binding resolution was enough. They used our tax money to debate and then pass an announcement saying something like "Gee, we should really obey the laws we make everyone else obey. Really Peally!" That's it.

I personally am hoping they will get rid of the ACA, since all it did for me was to raise my taxes with penalties (because I live in a Red state, which refused to expand Medicare). I know they wont do anything instead, because they've made it clear that they think large medical corporations should decide everything for us. But at least my tax bill will go down a little.
 theleathernun
Joined: 7/6/2014
Msg: 21
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Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/18/2014 11:18:54 AM

I personally am hoping they will get rid of the ACA, since all it did for me was to raise my taxes with penalties (because I live in a Red state, which refused to expand Medicare).

Isn't this really just saying "The Republicans screwed me in their efforts to screw Obama so everyone else should get screwed as well, at least then I might get something out of it."

Instead, they spent their time on a few revenge bills

I can't but agree with you on that as I pointed out earlier that this will be the big legislative focus of a Republican House, revenge (screw Obama, screw Democrats).

The difference here is that they will need Obama's approval to exact most of that revenge for at least the next two years. I'm not so sure they will get it.
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 22
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/18/2014 11:51:58 AM

I personally am hoping they will get rid of the ACA, since all it did for me was to raise my taxes with penalties (because I live in a Red state, which refused to expand Medicare). I know they wont do anything instead, because they've made it clear that they think large medical corporations should decide everything for us. But at least my tax bill will go down a little.


Just a few points here:

If you would have been eligible for medicaid under the medicaid expansion rules-then you make little money and your tax will be low...if you never would have qualified for medicaid under the medicaid expansion rules then you still had access to an ACA plan...if you didn't purchase a plan then you have to pay the tax.

Next: ACA insures about 10 million people who were previously uninsured. While you, as a individual may not have purchased a plan and have to pay the tax-which isn't good for you-the fact that there are 10 million newly insured people is huge.

Next: ACA in it's present form was a compromise to the dixie democrats that threatened to sabotage the passage of ACA...for whatever reason dixie democrats wanted insurance companies to play on a level playing feild without having to compete with a government option which would have driven down insurance costs, thus driving down insurance company profits.
 IgorFrankensteen
Joined: 6/29/2009
Msg: 23
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Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/18/2014 12:11:23 PM
The ACA doesn't insure anybody. Get that right, to start with. It set up PART of what was needed to deal with the huge mess that medical access has become in this country, and because it only addressed PART of the mess, is why it ended up upsetting a lot of people. In my case, all it did was to see to it that the exact same coverage cost I was being offered before by individual companies, can now be accessed via a single government website. The prices are identical, and just as unaffordable as before. I know people in other states, "blue" ones form what I can tell, who did indeed get affordable coverage for the first time because of the combination of the ACA and their states willingness to take advantage of federal help. The Republicans worked hard, and with great success, to see to it that the ACA was crippled at the outset, so that they could undermine it as it went forward, and the lunk-headed Democrats let them do it.

I have nothing all against the people who have benefited from it. Personally, I think that the Republicans should be the ones pushing for universal government sponsored health care, because they CLAIM to want to help businesses compete with international competitors more easily, and to remove burdens from them, and that would accomplish both. Unfortunately, the GOP seems to be stuck in a mode where no matter how good or logical an idea is, if a Democrat suggested it first, they will shoot it down without consideration.
 theleathernun
Joined: 7/6/2014
Msg: 24
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Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/18/2014 12:32:14 PM

The Republicans worked hard, and with great success, to see to it that the ACA was crippled at the outset, so that they could undermine it as it went forward, and the lunk-headed Democrats let them do it.

I have nothing all against the people who have benefited from it. Personally, I think that the Republicans should be the ones pushing for universal government sponsored health care, because they CLAIM to want to help businesses compete with international competitors more easily, and to remove burdens from them, and that would accomplish both. Unfortunately, the GOP seems to be stuck in a mode where no matter how good or logical an idea is, if a Democrat suggested it first, they will shoot it down without consideration.

So then, wouldn't the logical alternative be to amend those lost elements back into the legislation rather than "throwing the baby out with the bath water"?

The Republicans aren't going to even consider that alternative, they want the "baby" aborted and I doubt very seriously that Obama will withhold the veto when they try.

Personally, I'm for waiting it out. The Republicans will reach the snapping point of desperation within the next two years whether they win the Senate or not, that is when they will either become a rump party as moderates defect or toss the radicals. Either way, some sense of sanity will return after that and these problems stand a better chance of being fixed.
 Yule_liquor
Joined: 12/7/2011
Msg: 25
Election 2014: Karma is a b!tch
Posted: 10/18/2014 1:47:33 PM
^


So then, wouldn't the logical alternative be to amend those lost elements back into the legislation rather than "throwing the baby out with the bath water"?


The GOP will never let that happen (they'd rather swallow a cyanide pill before that happens)so as to help improve the ACA in any way.


The Republicans will reach the snapping point of desperation within the next two years whether they win the Senate or not, that is when they will either become a rump party as moderates defect or toss the radicals.


The GOP will still continue to thrive as long as they remain the "go to party" for the mega wealthy (so that they can do their nefarious bidding), and so long they can keep on convincing enough of the middle-class morons to keep pulling the lever for them come election time.


Isn't this really just saying "The Republicans screwed me in their efforts to screw Obama so everyone else should get screwed as well, at least then I might get something out of it."


^ agreed.


Personally, I think that the Republicans should be the ones pushing for universal government sponsored health care, because they CLAIM to want to help businesses compete with international competitors more easily, and to remove burdens from them, and that would accomplish both.


Not only concerning healthcare but in Y2K, GwB pledged hard during his campaign to enact tort reform
(ie; product liability, etc) so that small and medium sized Business would be allowed to reduce litigation costs and thereby be more competative on the national & international stage. However, that all evaporated once he got in; not once did he get forceful about it with the Dems (even when he had both houses). GwB (and rest of his minions in both houses) didn't champion anything that they campaigned about. This proved to me (and many others) that the GOp was ALL about themselves, and big international enterprise. They had little impetus to help the small business person in any meaningful way.
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