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 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 1
justPage 1 of 2    (1, 2)
x is just y iff x is equal to y, nonlinear dynamics isn't just algebra, rather it contains algebra, and builds higher concepts on top of it, it is a prerequisite not an equality.

just, to reduce, or simplify; just, when used in this context, is an indicator that the person believes the idea to be simple, and if simple ideas are not understood or unknown to an other, they may just be retarded
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 2
nihilism
Posted: 4/4/2017 7:40:44 PM
Nihilism, when there are no notes in the music, just a straight line on the entire 'symphony'. No alternation of sound and silence, no differentiation. Of course there is no reason to nothing, that is still a reason.
 gingerosity
Joined: 12/10/2011
Msg: 3
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nihilism
Posted: 4/5/2017 2:39:03 AM
Hey man. I see you're all grown up now. Man, that reminds me of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMIxnF_n4lk

x is just y iff x is equal to y, nonlinear dynamics isn't just algebra, rather it contains algebra, and builds higher concepts on top of it, it is a prerequisite not an equality.

just, to reduce, or simplify; just, when used in this context, is an indicator that the person believes the idea to be simple, and if simple ideas are not understood or unknown to an other, they may just be retarded

Commonly 'just' is synonymous with solely, as in your iff statement. However, there are some complications, usually to do with categories or sets.

Something can be said to be just something else if the something else is a larger set which containins it, even if it is not identical to other members of the set. 'A cat is just a mammal' is correct in that no cat is classed as being in another kingdom, but it is incorrect in that cats are specifically of the family felidae, meaning they have unique adaptations that differentiate them from other mammals within that kingdom. It is also incorrect in that parts of cats are shared with things from other kingdoms and domains, such as common genetic code sequences, biochemical pathways, etc. Similarly one could say that nonlinear dynamics is just algebra, which is to say that it is within the algebraic set. That may be true, however it may not be true that it is identical to all parts of the algebraic set or that it has no parts in common with members of other sets.

Such problems encountered with categorisation or reductionism in general are the origin of much of the struggle of humanity.
"The ability to discriminate is a precious faculty; by judging all members of one "race" to be the same, the racist precisely shows himself incapable of discrimination." - Christopher Hitchens
Understanding nuance takes significant investment of time and effort when we are beautifully evolved heuristic machines designed to optimise survival in a complex and chaotic world. Education will never dispense with such messy approximations as conceptual categories, but it will make us more aware of the dangers inherent in their use.

Nihilism, when there are no notes in the music, just a straight line on the entire 'symphony'. No alternation of sound and silence, no differentiation.

Sounds like it's a mute question then.
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 4
nihilism
Posted: 4/5/2017 11:11:41 AM
lol, funny video, and well said

if a 'cat is just a mammal' then 'a mammal is just a'? and so on



"The ability to discriminate is a precious faculty; by judging all members of one "race" to be the same, the racist precisely shows himself incapable of discrimination." - Christopher Hitchens



so, the racist is incapable of differentiating when within one set, they categorize them as the same but they contain differences, those differences may appear as equalities or traits of one set


Sounds like it's a mute question then.


ha, exactly
 gingerosity
Joined: 12/10/2011
Msg: 5
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nihilism
Posted: 4/5/2017 3:20:22 PM

if a 'cat is just a mammal' then 'a mammal is just a'? and so on

Nested categories are similar to the nested concepts described by the chain of signification in radical post-structualism.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6a2dLVx8THA

so, the racist is incapable of differentiating when within one set, they categorize them as the same but they contain differences, those differences may appear as equalities or traits of one set

Yup. Racists, sexists, homophobes, islamophobes, anti-semites, fascists, marxists... you name it. All make the same categorical mistakes as part of a process of identification with in-groups and vilification of out-groups. Now you will hopefully be thinking: is this characterisation itself making the same mistake? Is it just a mammal or are we missing some nuances here?

"The third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority. The second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority. The first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking." - A. A. Milne
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 6
nihilism
Posted: 4/6/2017 12:21:38 AM

"The third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asdLy-_cezA
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 7
nihilism
Posted: 4/6/2017 1:45:25 PM
a study on differences, while ignoring the boundary as a potential difference:

http://oi63.tinypic.com/344a6o2.jpg

and this is what I call, abstract art; (to be continued)

note: the inversion of the picture is equal to its default
nihilism
Posted: 4/7/2017 3:57:56 AM

messy approximations as conceptual categories


Racists, sexists, homophobes, islamophobes, anti-semites, fascists, marxists... you name it. All make the same categorical mistakes as part of a process of identification with in-groups and vilification of out-groups. Now you will hopefully be thinking: is this characterisation itself making the same mistake?

I see our plight in such areas as one born of incomplete knowledge and insufficient information, a definitive of being Human: In any given instance, there is some kind of 'bad' or 'evil' which we want to rally against (or incorrectly believe that we need to), but we either won't have enough info by which to identify it differentiated from that which is not it, or we don't have enough understanding of what we believe to be undesired (when it may not be). So people sometimes make the decision to 'be safe rather than sorry' or 'throw out the baby with the bathwater'. And of course that's often unfortunate.

(G) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6a2dLVx8THA

I like that vid...kinda off topic, but it makes me wonder if this mirrors or represents a quantum-world dynamic of consciousness creating reality.
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 9
nihilism
Posted: 4/7/2017 9:30:54 AM

I like that vid...kinda off topic, but it makes me wonder if this mirrors or represents a quantum-world dynamic of consciousness creating reality.



For any such formal system, there will always be statements about the natural numbers that are true, but that are unprovable within the system.

the axioms are created/found by the observer, the only way to cut them down further, is to cut down the observer, in other words, does math exist if there is no one to think about it?


if a 'cat is just a mammal' then 'a mammal is just a'? and so on


this goes in the wrong direction(supersets), its suppose to go towards subsets, like the nervous system, etc
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 10
nihilism
Posted: 4/8/2017 11:44:11 AM
all heavier elements contain within them the lighter element, the hydrogen atom, and so on, the atoms that make up an object fall separately not together, because there is empty space between all mass, any object except the absolute constitute of matter is made up of smaller pieces that are separated by empty space.

An object that is 1 lb is actually made up of smaller elements that are all of equal mass, separated from each other by empty space, this is why heavier objects don't fall faster than lighter ones, because the object isn't one thing, but made up of many equal things that fall separately, not together
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 11
nihilism
Posted: 4/10/2017 2:51:14 PM
^ monads, thanks Leibniz :))

psychedelics, in differentiation, whether or not how delusional can be enlightening experience

why mathematicians marry other mathematicians: because if x can't relate to y with numbers arguments ensue,

which is similar to: dating someone who can't speak your language, (math causes communication problems in relationship), think of what spocks girlfriend has to go through
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 12
nihilism
Posted: 4/11/2017 11:41:32 AM
From the Corpus Hermeticum

https://youtu.be/P7_GQ8vSy8E?t=1m1s

"if then you do not make yourself equal to god, you cannot apprehend god, for like is known by like, leap clear from all that is corporeal, and make yourself to a like expanse with that greatness which is beyond all measure, rise above all time and become eternal, then you will apprehend god, think that for you too nothing is impossible, deem that you too are immortal, and that you are to grasp all things in your thought, to know every craft, and every science, find your home in the haunts of every living creature, make yourself higher than all heights and lower than all depths, bring together in yourself all opposites of quality, heat and cold, dryness and fluidity, think that you are everywhere at once, on land, at sea, in heaven, think that you are not yet begotten, that you are in the womb, that you are young, that you are old, that you have died, that you in the world beyond the grave, grasp in your thought all this at once all times and places, all substances, and qualities, and magnitudes together, then you can apprehend god, but if you shut up your soul in your body and abase yourself and say, I know nothing, I can do nothing, I am afraid of earth and sea, I cannot mount to heaven, I know not what I was, nor what I shall be, then what have you to do with god?
Would that it were possible for you to grow wings and soar into the air poised between earth and heaven you might see the solid earth, the fluid sea, and the streaming rivers, the wandering air, the penetrating fire, the courses of the stars, and the swiftness of the movement which heaven encompasses all, what happiness were that my son, to see these all born along with one impulse, and to behold him is unmoved moving in all that moves and him who is hidden made manifest through his works,

but he who presents all things to us through our senses and thereby manifests himself through all things and in all things and especially those he wills to manifest himself, begin then my son tot with a prayer to the lord and father who alone is good, pray that you may find favor with him and that one ray of him, if only one, may flash into your mind, so that you may have power to grasp in thought that mighty being, for thought alone can see that which is hidden in as much as thought itself is hidden from sight, and if even the thought which is within is hidden from your sight, how can he being in himself be manifest to you through your bodily eyes, but if you have power to see with the eyes of the mind, then my son he will manifest himself to you,

for the lord manifests himself ungrudgingly through all the universe and you can behold gods with your eyes and lay hold on it with your hands if you wish to see him, think on the sun, think on the course of the moon, think on the order of the stars, who is it that maintains that order? the Sun is the greatest of the gods in heaven to him as their king and overlord and all the kinds of heaven yield place and yet this mighty god greater then earth and sea, submits to having smaller stars circling above him, who is it then my son, but he always obeys with reverence and awe, each of these stars too is confined by measured limits, and has an appointed space to range in, why do not all the stars in heaven run like in equal courses? who is it that is assigned to each its place and marked out each the extent of its course..."
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 13
nihilism
Posted: 4/11/2017 4:36:12 PM
A quantum entanglement of minds: "Leibniz–Newton calculus controversy" the controversy ends here, these two minds were linked together and found them simultaneously together.
 CressB
Joined: 7/1/2011
Msg: 14
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nihilism
Posted: 4/11/2017 9:03:14 PM
LOL! wholly crap! Did the kid go to visit the wizard and return to us with a brain?
 CressB
Joined: 7/1/2011
Msg: 15
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nihilism
Posted: 4/11/2017 9:54:42 PM

"if then you do not make yourself equal to god, you cannot apprehend god, for like is known by like, leap clear from all that is corporeal, and make yourself to a like expanse with that greatness which is beyond all measure, rise above all time and become eternal, then you will apprehend god, think that for you too nothing is impossible, deem that you too are immortal, and that you are to grasp all things in your thought, to know every craft, and every science, find your home in the haunts of every living creature, make yourself higher than all heights and lower than all depths, bring together in yourself all opposites of quality, heat and cold, dryness and fluidity, think that you are everywhere at once, on land, at sea, in heaven, think that you are not yet begotten, that you are in the womb, that you are young, that you are old, that you have died, that you in the world beyond the grave, grasp in your thought all this at once all times and places, all substances, and qualities, and magnitudes together, then you can apprehend god, but if you shut up your soul in your body and abase yourself and say, I know nothing, I can do nothing, I am afraid of earth and sea, I cannot mount to heaven, I know not what I was, nor what I shall be, then what have you to do with god?


A fine sentiment. But what happens when we replace the ancient esoterism, and heavy handed poetics, with modern sensibilities and the attempt at rigorous knowledge. The eastern Tao makes many of the same observations across, what was at the time, a vast cultural divide. Currently such ideas are most fully embodied (in terms of "sensibility and rigor") by the a small but growing field of science surrounding the concept of "quantum consciousness". If you have not already looked into it, check out the works of Pinrose and Hameroff in regard to quantum consciousness -- also check into something called "the global consciousness project".

A good place to start with Hameroff: https://youtu.be/YpUVot-4GPM?list=FLOiyzn0Yi1UuMsXELa7tDSg

Start here for "the global consciousness project": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQXoMI130KY

If you already know of these works, I would ask "what is the point of sighting these ancient esoteric verses", but then I would ask this question regardless.
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 16
nihilism
Posted: 4/11/2017 10:20:27 PM
I am that wizard, and psychedelics are my magic wand, I could conjure up anything by mere thought.

I've always had an interest in altered states of consciousness, drugs, etc but of course be prepared to be made a fool of if you don't have the credentials to qualify as someone to study these chemicals, you just be seen as an imbecile with naive intentions. But of course, that's expected, just call me an alchemist chemist.


If you already know of these works, I would ask "what is the point of sighting these ancient esoteric verses", but then I would ask this question regardless.


I don't know actually, specifically anyway, besides an accumulation of knowledge, perhaps I could use it later, perhaps just in conversation or maybe for nothing. Then again I could of just sat around watching the TV pixels oscillate RBG.
 CressB
Joined: 7/1/2011
Msg: 17
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nihilism
Posted: 4/11/2017 10:44:05 PM

I am that wizard, and psychedelics are my magic wand, I could conjure up anything by mere thought.


*Somewhere a door has been opens* "welcome to the party pal."

!!!BREAKING NEWS!!!: https://youtu.be/EBl8b3x-EJw


I don't know actually, specifically anyway, besides an accumulation of knowledge, perhaps I could use it later, perhaps just in conversation or maybe for nothing.


I am not condemning the knowledge, on the contrary, I find the subject quite fascinating, but I am a bit confused as to why you have brought it up. As I have told you before "I am a simple man, who prefers simple conversation absent allusion."
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 18
yes man!!!
Posted: 4/12/2017 4:10:24 PM
the benefit of being a follower: the output z of path x taken by taken by y, allows one to further weigh the outcomes at a point w
yes man!!!
Posted: 4/12/2017 4:43:36 PM
(yer vid cress)

Makes me think of something I still contemplate...

...at the quantum level, time kinda sorta doesn't exist - I think that's the deal. Someone in here once said that death isn't real, and I scoffed at it. But...in a sense, maybe there's truth there. Time is an emergent phenomena. It just seems to be real to us. Is something we experience as what we are. But at some basic level of everything, it just doesn't matter? Isn't a reality?

Also...when I think about how some things work in this realm, I think that if everything indeed were an actively sustained simulation from another realm in the way that we conventionally think of something being a simulation, then what's going on at the quantum level is exactly what we'd find if this were true? No?
 manreason30
Joined: 3/26/2017
Msg: 20
yes man!!!
Posted: 4/13/2017 6:09:25 PM
if one doesn't study quantum mechanics, one will always get someone else's interpretation of the material;

for example: I could accept as fact the earth is a sphere, but is it not just another belief if I don't understand the reasoning, trigonometry, etc as to why the earth is a sphere, like those who blindly accepted the earth was flat, but there were valid reasons as to why the earth was perceived to be flat.

Does seeing with your eyes, that the earth is a sphere, necessarily mean that you understand it to be a sphere? I think not. Seeing is only believing, reasoning is understanding.
 CressB
Joined: 7/1/2011
Msg: 21
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yes man!!!
Posted: 4/13/2017 6:41:47 PM

...at the quantum level, time kinda sorta doesn't exist - I think that's the deal.


Have you ever heard of the idea of quantum immortality? There was a show on Netflix (Netflix original) recently that touches on the idea. The show was called "OA". I really enjoyed this series. The concept itself is very interesting as well, if we take our philosophical Qs from the many worlds interpretation and other multiverse philosophies that have cropped up in its wake.

Check out this twenty minute lecture on D-wave computers... WOW!

https://youtu.be/PqN_2jDVbOU
yes man!!!
Posted: 4/16/2017 3:57:05 PM
(the vid) Yea that's kind of a trip.

Seems like they'd be tapping into "some other place", such that we'd accidentally literally create god.
 CressB
Joined: 7/1/2011
Msg: 23
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yes man!!!
Posted: 4/16/2017 5:45:12 PM
^^^ If there is a universal quantum consciousness, what if they are making a machine that is tapping into our base consciousness stream? That's kind'a scary. Are they collapsing universes in on one another as they use this thing. Could explain Mandela effect. Or could it be used to manipulate the collective perception of reality?
 CressB
Joined: 7/1/2011
Msg: 24
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yes man!!!
Posted: 4/16/2017 6:08:30 PM

Also...when I think about how some things work in this realm, I think that if everything indeed were an actively sustained simulation from another realm in the way that we conventionally think of something being a simulation, then what's going on at the quantum level is exactly what we'd find if this were true? No?


Here, one of the speaker talks about the possibility of something that looks a lot like computer code that has been found at the quantum level. If I remember correctly the particular speaker's name is Prof. James Gates.
 CressB
Joined: 7/1/2011
Msg: 25
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yes man!!!
Posted: 4/16/2017 9:42:48 PM
^^^

Oops forgot the link:

https://youtu.be/wgSZA3NPpBs
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