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Show ALL Forums  > Off Topic  > How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news      Home login  
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 justinelle
Joined: 8/28/2017
Msg: 1
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake newsPage 1 of 2    (1, 2)
Propaganda is the new facts. The lessons of weapons of mass destruction lies, well to use a pun, they have been completely TRUMPED. For over 2.5 years of daily ear bashing of Russia is the cause of all evil. 35 million dollars were spent Mueller Report to prove that the **stard Trump was a Russian puppet, who should never have been elected in the first place. The result has been constant upgrading of sanctions by the USA and EU as the frenzy of Putin influence is everywhere. (the weather “the beast from the east”). All geared to change public opinion and prepare for war, as missiles and nukes have been deployed thought-out Europe to halt Russian expansion.

Trump has been proved right, it was all fake news, a constant narrative pushed by the ruling elites, where ny deviation from the official message of collusion, including European elections and BREXIT. The same type of people who voted for TRUMP (the inept uneducated dross) voted for BREXIT. Not one hour has passed where BREXIT has been determinedly undermined, trashed, regarded as ridiculous or dangerous. The relentless bias is now normal, the vote itself and the result are now accepted as a mistake, and has to be reversed at all costs. The identical media rant against TRUMP and BREXIT both wrong and both needing nullifying created by uneducated idiots. No suggestion of government corruption, collusion with media or Fake News. Corbyn is also a Putin puppet for good measure, as he too has been constantly vilified. So we know who and where the enemy within is, and externally.

The result of this HOAX is a censorship crackdown against people pushing an alternative message. Political correctness has gone into hyperdrive. The sanctions against Russia all obviously based on lies will remain and increased, and all this is because the wrong guy was voted into the US presidency and also to a lesser degree in the Labour party and BREXIT. The real fact is, the US cannot share power, despite the unipolar world slowly collapsing into the miltipolar reality. As for the discredited media, and security industry, well it never happened, as the lies will have to continue, as there are too many vested interests, and reputations that have promoted the new Cold WAR. The People were and are Wrong, cannot be trusted, while the rhythmic media drum beat for war with Russia, China and Iran continues to grow louder.
 kavapaw22
Joined: 10/3/2018
Msg: 2
How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/25/2019 8:05:12 AM
The nutcase you plagiarized is clueless. What Mueller found has nothing to do with how evil Russia is or whether it interfered with the us election, it merely showed the rule of law still stands strong in the us and that trump did not directly conspire with the Russians as concluded by a legitimate and necessary investigation.

You really need to find better sources justinelli, they all appear to be crackpots.
How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/25/2019 9:17:12 AM
alas, it also proved it couldn't exclude the president interfered in an election, sent 4 of trump's inner circle to jail, opened up new investigations of trump's business..and the dems no longer have to wonder how they're going to get impeachment past Senate Republicans. its more of a win than the fake news lets on.
 kavapaw22
Joined: 10/3/2018
Msg: 4
How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/25/2019 9:33:33 AM
^^^ Part of the problem is these people, like Justinelli, from England simply do not understand the way our Judicial Branch works, that is why you get the type of garbage opinions that Justinelli plagiarized in the initial post. The utter incompetence of people who go on and on about things they don't understand...it never ends.
 LeFouGamboj
Joined: 11/17/2018
Msg: 5
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/26/2019 4:28:55 PM
The real concern is that there countless citizens in this country who are gullible enough to believe the things that "Just" puts up..............there are many venues on social media for this kind of diatribe to surface............it should be obvious that these trolls are hard at work.......trying to sway over the most vulnerable who cannot discern truth from fakery!
 adventurejoe70
Joined: 3/1/2013
Msg: 6
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 6:13:01 AM

The sanctions against Russia all obviously based on lies will remain and increased


Actually you are mostly right with the above statement. Most of US moves against Russia stems from the geopolitical narrative of the Neo Cons. Problem is no political party is insulated against their cult like agenda, which has and always included the total destruction of Russia , if we can't control her.
 elphatas
Joined: 3/9/2019
Msg: 7
How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 10:17:09 AM

Actually you are mostly right with the above statement.


Do you have some credible source that proves all of the US intelligence agencies are wrong or is this simply your assumption. We beat the Soviet Union by the way, when it dissolved. That we allowed it to reemerge in present day Russia is simply a failure of American Policy. When the Soviet Union dissolved, that was the time to reduce by 50% or more our defense budget, but of course we are always looking for wars and found what we wanted in the Middle East. Russia had nothing to do with it then, but it certainly manipulated the Trump supporters in the present...had crazy people believing Hillary murdered people and was running a pedophile ring from a pizza joint. Sure thing.
 rednwhiterider
Joined: 6/23/2018
Msg: 8
How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 12:45:17 PM
joe, do you think the average...joe/Jane views ruskies as a threat?

if I recall you have background worth while. lol

my Russian friends are mostly like american, mixed with irish,
mixed in 8 oz of woodka... per shot.
add 3 parts body builder,
uptight thong models
with a little red neck for seasonin'.

not to mention being their own insurance agent...

good folks.

I laughed so hard about the "Russian collusion"...
did he "collude" with North Korea too?


edit.vvvvv
you just popped off with that much info and civil discourse
in a hundred thirty...ish seconds!!!
hats off....

it might seem slight to you, but
does any rancor seep through?

none of my friends wouldn't want a crazy Russian hanging with us...
 adventurejoe70
Joined: 3/1/2013
Msg: 9
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 12:46:41 PM
Actually I am well verse in the study of US/Russian geopolitics. Speaking Russian I have dived deeply in both ends. Instead of reading just "fake news", I have read and studied the actual books on foreign policy. Read the fake news on both sides as well lol

It actually all goes back to Carter and his advisor Kazimierz Brzezinski. His foreign policy ideas have been followed by following administrations. The whole modern Neo Con , cult if you will , that stems from Project for the New American Century, is very much based on his ideas. Even Obama publicly stated how Brzezinski is a great guy! Obama also followed his teachings, although Obama isn't a neo con. Obama wanted Brzezinski as his adviser but he refused. Brzezinski is very fascinating, his ability to woo over both Dems and Republicans. Brzezinski also has a deep seated hatred of Russia( perhaps as a Pole?) that if you were ever to go to one of his lectures before he died, you could see it right on his face, and in his voice.

What is amusing is that even Putin and his own advisers know America has been following Brzezinski doctrine for decades(yes we even have a name for it.. Brzezinski Doctrine). He has often said so on Russian talk shows. You should read Brzezinski work one day, it might open your eyes. It pretty much discusses decades ago what has been happening now in the last 2 decades. A lot of the top US politicians and diplomats and top intelligence agency agents have studied under him when he was at Colombia and headed the Institute on Communist Affairs. His son even , if I recall, got an adviser position in NATO where he also spreads her fathers doctrine.
 Million_Reasons
Joined: 10/23/2018
Msg: 10
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 4:17:18 PM
^Joey is a Russian Bot. :)
 spectravision
Joined: 3/20/2019
Msg: 11
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 4:25:00 PM
^^ Putin's No 1 Henchman so be careful
 rednwhiterider
Joined: 6/23/2018
Msg: 12
How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 4:33:18 PM
in mother russia...


bees care for you.
 Million_Reasons
Joined: 10/23/2018
Msg: 13
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 4:39:52 PM
Here's Joey's story about how he got involved with the Russian mafia. ;) ;)


https://youtu.be/paG1-lPtIXA
 adventurejoe70
Joined: 3/1/2013
Msg: 14
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 4:57:49 PM
^^^
Henchman my A$$. He is my henchman. So is Hillary. Monica Lewinsky was a sleeper agent btw. We all knew Bill needed to get blown.

True story. In Russia you don't drive the bears, the bears drive you. When I was little in the seaport of Odessa, I once saw a Lada come to a stop and a guy got out of the passenger seat holding a bottle of homemade vodka. A minute later a brown bear wearing a military cap gets out of the driver side door to come get the bottle. The bear was driving! Only in the EX USSR!
(my mom said this was the norm)
 SS4544Spd
Joined: 8/31/2016
Msg: 15
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 6:39:15 PM
The thing is, though, is there are kernels of truth in what Justinelle writes. I don't know why folks can't understand that the MSM media, while not "fake," IS biased. And not conservative - liberal. Biased towards globalism, biased towards elites' interests, multinational business interests and biased for U.S. hegemony (war and global military expansion). Calling it "fake" news certainly makes one appear a crackpot, but anyone who believes we get unbiased news is the one who is bit gullible in my view. As in those who can't see outside the bipolar Dem-GOP straitjacket, which is designed to keep the rabble fighting while the above interests continue to be advanced. Party line debate is sanctioned debate, and it works as designed - creating arguments like a pair of squabbling parrots who are brought together after listening to their respective news sources and come to regurgitate their arguments, neither listnenig just both sqawking doctrinaire party line dogma past each other.

And, who really cares about Russia meddling in Western elections. Really. I don't. Oh, the temerity! If Putin had a long waxed mustache, he'd be twirling it right now, laughing sardonically, pulling levers, pushing buttons, plotting again to foil the West!

Of course, the U.S. has NEVER, EVER, EVER stooped to such diabolical means to spread its power, right?!? Of course not!! LOL
 Million_Reasons
Joined: 10/23/2018
Msg: 16
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 6:48:15 PM
And? Your solution?


Btw....I am meeting up with someone in a couple of weeks who lives in and works in the globalist arena...got any questions you want me to ask?


Me? I have learned to be careful what you ask for. Make sure you really want to know. ;)


 SS4544Spd
Joined: 8/31/2016
Msg: 17
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 7:32:45 PM
KJ wrote:
And? Your solution?
Don't worry bout the other party, work on your own. Sometimes that means just not voting for them, or abandoning them. Vote third party. Inflict pain. Sometimes ya just gotta fall on the sword. As long as you support them unconditionally, they know “lesser evilism” guarantees your support no matter what. Thus they know they only have to remain marginally “better” than the “evil.”



Btw....I am meeting up with someone in a couple of weeks who lives in and works in the globalist arena...got any questions you want me to ask?
Sure. During your next presentation at Davos, why don’cha tell’em we don’t want their stinkin’ plans!
 Million_Reasons
Joined: 10/23/2018
Msg: 18
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/27/2019 7:52:33 PM
^The Republicans did.....Ahem...Trump!

And Davos? No. Ha! It was CFR. And good luck with that. Those at the top...like....the status quo. :)


Ps...I have it on good authority....they are not happy with Trump. Just sayin
 LeFouGamboj
Joined: 11/17/2018
Msg: 19
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/28/2019 7:56:31 AM
#15 says


I don't know why folks can't understand that the MSM media, while not "fake," IS biased.


because many of these folks are too obtuse to be able to think and research things for themselves.....they are virtually the same people who get con'd by shady salespersons, sweepstakes pitches, etc.


anyone who believes we get unbiased news is the one who is bit gullible in my view.


news has always been biased............that is because humans are biased..........its up to the individual who seeks truth to uncover it for him/herself.

The Mueller report is a good example............Barr releases a memo saying Trump is cleared of all alleged wrongdoing.......the Rightwing media accept it(just because Barr said so).........and those opposite wish to see the actual report before they draw their conclusion.


And, who really cares about Russia meddling in Western elections. Really. I don't.


heck, man....I do!

And I want us to take steps to guard against more egregious attempts to interfere..........No one thinks that these hackers have been sophisticated enough to actually alter the voting process (with software programmed to "rig" the outcome itself...........the vote you place is steered to another candidate).........but this is not too far down the pike.

Trump's WH has not taken any steps to protect us from any of this...........and all the intelligence agencies have sounded the warning that hackers & bots are ramping up their efforts.


If Putin had a long waxed mustache, he'd be twirling it right now, laughing sardonically, pulling levers, pushing buttons, plotting again to foil the West!


This ^ exactly what a con man like Putin wants us to believe...........that he just a poor scapegoat....with little ability to influence anyone and to think otherwise is LAUGHABLE (the quintessential "con" game)...............yet he has gotten Trump to believe him (over his own intelligence agencies)on more than 1 occasion.

Putin knows that the West's Achilles heel......is to DIVIDE each nation...anyway possible (mainly by supporting extremist political parties.............favorable to Russia)

I do not blame Putin's ambitions............he is doing what he feels is in the best interest of his country & his power...the question is at whose expense does that happen
 SS4544Spd
Joined: 8/31/2016
Msg: 20
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/28/2019 10:02:24 AM
KJ wrote:
^The Republicans did.....Ahem...Trump!
Who's Ahem? Barron's brother?

But you’re right..in a sense. I do applaud the election of Trump. Really. Not becuase I voted for him, or that I am a fan of our Chief Executive Orifice, but the fact thatTrump is a symbol of disruption, or rejection of “politics and policy as usual.” That I like. I will say though, I don't think things are going the way most Trumpers envisioned, really. Aside from the "Trumpconomy," which is really somewhat leftover from Obama's corporate/banking giveaways/rescues and the Fed's $4-5T printing party......I am dubious. But I don't think most Trumpers understand that. Not that most Dem supporters do either. And yes, there's the tax cut, which likely added a lil sugar high to a fundamentally unbalanced economy overdue to stagnate or tank...but that was a giveaway to the rich/elites/multinationals - precisely the group that populist Trump voters purport to dislike.

All that being said, now that you got your guy in, it’s only been unconditional cheerleading (not you specifically, but Trump supporters/GOP). Even though you do look like a cheerleader. That's the problem with tribal partisan politics. Once “your guy” is in, s’all OK. But not really. An example is Trump's "big government" move to ban bump stocks. GOP voters let that happen without a peep. Doubt that would be the case if it was Dems doing this, cuz conservatives would be screaming like it was the end of the world if it was Commie Obama issuing that order. In the end, though, Trump’s action provides a nice, neat precedent for this “ government overreach” to be used for the regulatory banning of assault rifles, etc…. Do you think Obama could have gotten away with that without screaming bloody murder by Fox, marching in the streets from gun owners/Tea Partiers, etc. etc. NO!!! So now that you got him in, you Trump supporters are dropping the ball a bit. And yes, Dems do thte same thing, and I am critical of that, too.

(Note: "Government overreach” - like those dreadful yellow “Don’t Tread on me!!” tshirts - is a term that’s pulled out and dusted off ONLY when it’s Dems in control, lol….and btw what ever happened to all those t-shirts ?!?! LOL....are they out of style? Of course, Dems aren't in control!!!.so those t shirts stayed in the closet for the biggest Federal gun-take-away action since Clinton's assault weapon ban.......Now DAT's some"big gubmint!!!" by your boy Trump.......)

BUT in the end, I do begrudgingly give GOP voters credit for voting in a significant change in direction. And if you're gonna win, I would rather have Trump, than a conventional GOP'er like Kasich et. al, or a nutcase like Ted Cruz.


And Davos? No. Ha! It was CFR. And good luck with that. Those at the top...like....the status quo. :)


Ps...I have it on good authority....they are not happy with Trump. Just sayin
Personally, it Davos…or the CFR….isn’t “happy,” that’s just fine with me. At least I can see that positive with Trump. Most of the rest of the package, not so sure though.
 SS4544Spd
Joined: 8/31/2016
Msg: 21
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/28/2019 10:57:20 AM
LaFou wrote:
because many of these folks are too obtuse to be able to think and research things for themselves.....they are virtually the same people who get con'd by shady salespersons, sweepstakes pitches, etc.
Sure I will agree, unless you’re saying it’s only Republican or Dem supporters that exhibit this “obtusity.” (If that’s a word)


news has always been biased............that is because humans are biased..........its up to the individual who seeks truth to uncover it for him/herself.
True. But back in the days of the Fairness Doctrine, when commercial concerns didn’t hamstring editorial focus…and when wealth was more diffuse……and thus less likely to influence news content……..it was less biased…At least imo.


The Mueller report is a good example............Barr releases a memo saying Trump is cleared of all alleged wrongdoing.......the Rightwing media accept it(just because Barr said so).........and those opposite wish to see the actual report before they draw their conclusion.
Typical and very predictable of today’s farcical media landscape. “Tastes Great!”…………..”Less Filling!!!”…for those of us old enough to remember that ad campaign.


heck, man....I do!

And I want us to take steps to guard against more egregious attempts to interfere..........No one thinks that these hackers have been sophisticated enough to actually alter the voting process (with software programmed to "rig" the outcome itself...........the vote you place is steered to another candidate).........but this is not too far down the pike.

Trump's WH has not taken any steps to protect us from any of this...........and all the intelligence agencies have sounded the warning that hackers & bots are ramping up their efforts.
I do too. I have a big problem though, with U.S. citizens being agitated by the media to Russia’s medding when we do the same thing. So what does that mean? The US can do this cuz we’re “exceptional?” But they’re not even saying that….our doing the same thing is just swept under the rug like it never happened, cuz OUR foreign policy objectives are ALWAYS noble and altruistic, right?!?! LOL


This ^ exactly what a con man like Putin wants us to believe...........that he just a poor scapegoat....with little ability to influence anyone and to think otherwise is LAUGHABLE (the quintessential "con" game)...............yet he has gotten Trump to believe him (over his own intelligence agencies)on more than 1 occasion.
I just wonder bout the ultimate objective of “boogeymanning” Russia. I see China a much more of a rising power and threat than Russia. Yet, til recently (mostly under Trump) China isn’t ever hardly mentioned as such. I think it’s because Russia isn’t playing all with Western financiers and multinationals and of course, supports countries who do the same. I’m very skeptical of the “boogeymanism” of Russia. Yes, and Iraq had WMDs.


Putin knows that the West's Achilles heel......is to DIVIDE each nation...anyway possible (mainly by supporting extremist political parties.............favorable to Russia)
Like we’ve done in the past in plenty of places all over the world.


I do not blame Putin's ambitions............he is doing what he feels is in the best interest of his country & his power...the question is at whose expense does that happen
Probably it’s at the expense of the “Washington Consensus.” But whatever. I just have problems with the outlook that we can go meddle everywhere, anywhere…even on his borders…while the same actions by him are taken as “Evil Autocrat!”

I think most of this is to create more reasons to build yet more military bases and sell more guns and bombs everywhere for future economic "growth" and profit taking by Wall Street.
 BaldwinMotionPhaseIII
Joined: 10/15/2018
Msg: 22
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well, Fox sold Trump to his supporters since the birther days
Posted: 3/28/2019 3:02:43 PM
"It actually all goes back to Carter and his advisor Kazimierz Brzezinski."

>>>actually...it goes back further. When Ford pardoned Nixon but not his neocons, there formed a Team A and B. Team B, staffed by the same clowns who brought you fake WMD in Iraq, claimed that russia wasn't building deterrent weapons for defense, but for offense.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Team_B

this would lead to not only Mr. B, but also Reagan's Strategic Defense Initiative, the ruination of the rubble under Yelt'sin, etc. when a dem too over the white house, one of the stones these vermin crawled under was that Project for a new american century (apparently thousand year reich was already taken).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_for_the_New_American_Century

no, go ahead and look it up, if you want to know why people think 9/11 was too convenient to be anything but a conspiracy.

but before you think chump is any different from this Republican Establishment, he has both John Bolton the neo con, and Blackwater, the people who made a killing in Iraq, whispering in his ear about foriegn policy as he gives Israel every cover it needs. next week your local public library will have the movie "vice" to rent out. i dare you to take a look at what the conservatives have done to create a real Deep State. i know its tough. but hey, even chump thought the russians were hackers, he asked them to hack HRC during the election. wait, where do most hackings of the pentagon and energy plants come from, anyway? oh yeah, russia, china, and north korea. oh well, we must just be paranoid :)

MSM is biased towards making a profit thru advertising, certainly. What is Faux News bias? as for russians meddling in our politics, well, sure we do it to others when invasion just won't do. so we should just accept our punishment gladly? so much for MAGA. also, if you wish to talk about the Council on Foriegn Relations, the bilderburg group, the trilateral commision and suggest they would have no interest in recruiting a wealthy new yorker who invests around the world (yet somehow he's not a globalist, even tho he banks at Deutschebank?)...you aren't paying attention :)

https://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/politics/item/25475-some-of-trump-s-picks-have-troubling-links-to-globalism-cfr

https://chuckbaldwinlive.com/Articles/tabid/109/ID/3582/CFR-Members-And-Bilderberg-Attendees-Appointed-By-Donald-Trump-Taken-from-the-CFR-membership-and-Bilderberg-participant-lists.aspx

how about the bozo who ran sears into the ground rather than make it the next amazon?

https://www.salon.com/2018/12/21/steve-mnuchins-path-of-destruction-leads-from-wall-street-to-trumps-treasury_partner/

the biggest trick the devil pulled was making people believe he didn't exist :)

"An example is Trump's "big government" move to ban bump stocks. GOP voters let that happen without a peep. Doubt that would be the case if it was Dems doing this, cuz conservatives would be screaming like it was the end of the world if it was Commie Obama issuing that order. In the end, though, Trump’s action provides a nice, neat precedent for this “ government overreach” to be used for the regulatory banning of assault rifles, etc…. Do you think Obama could have gotten away with that without screaming bloody murder by Fox, marching in the streets from gun owners/Tea Partiers, etc. etc. NO!!! So now that you got him in, you Trump supporters are dropping the ball a bit."

>>>thank you, SS454. those who hate the CFR, bilderburgs, etc, fear a government grab of weapons. apparently when a black man or a woman tries to take away their penis, its The New World Order. when its the dude they think is anti establishment (he gives tax breaks to the rich, and they think he's not part of the old game book?) they roll right over. oh well, at least he got rid of TPP--oh wait, that was going to lock the chinese out of trade deals. why wouldn't a globalist want to get rid of that?

it ain't paranoid to think the russians are out to get us--i mean, we've treated them so well since 1917. two world wars, we never sacrificed millions of them to keep the germans busy, oh no. and if you really believe the russians are willing to get back their old empire, just ask the ukrainians and the dead spies in london--they'll be sure to set you straight. but why pick on them instead of china? uh, that's pretty simple. where does Ivanka Trump and her ilk have their factories?

(hint: not russia)

so we have a candidate who Faux News and Jeff Sessions sold to the GOP and its voters. He's a rich global investor with ties to the Saudis (who are tied to the Bushes) who banks in germany yet he's supposedly not George Soros' level. He's got a cabinet full of CFR people, he's initiated a gun ban, he's given the rich a tax break and will end funding for health care and special olympics to pay for it, and he listens to neo cons for foriegn policy advice (hint, they love bibi too!)...but he's a man for the people, and everyone else is part of the Deep State.

oh boy does he have you snookered :) but hey, who really believes this conspiracy crap anyway?
 N2U18
Joined: 3/16/2018
Msg: 23
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well, Fox sold Trump to his supporters since the birther days
Posted: 3/28/2019 3:37:06 PM
I always found it interesting how the CIA used Boris Pasternak’s “Doctor Zhivago” novel to undermine and discredit the Soviet Union. It’s been a long time since I’ve watched the movie, but it’s always been a favorite and I love the history.

https://www.biography.com/news/doctor-zhivago-facts-50-anniversary

https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/csi-publications/csi-studies/studies/vol-59-no-2/zhivago-affair.html

Msg: 19 – LeFou

because many of these folks are too obtuse to be able to think and research things for themselves.....they are virtually the same people who get con'd by shady salespersons, sweepstakes pitches, etc.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1j_Djv4Q74Q&index=24&list=WL&t=0s
 LeFouGamboj
Joined: 11/17/2018
Msg: 24
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/29/2019 6:08:51 PM
#21 SS says


I have a big problem though, with U.S. citizens being agitated by the media to Russia’s medding when we do the same thing.


yeah, we do those kinds of things, sure.......but wearing the mantle as "leaders of the free world" and finding out that there are no rules to the "game"........we have just done, that which those around us expected of us to do............when we meddle with a despotic regime, we do it to steer it away from the arms of our opponents.....and to hopefully gain an ally of some sort..............of course, things don't always go as planned.

The Russian meddling has a different ring............we have a despot interfering with a country whose leadership is (supposedly) elected by its citizens............thus making a mockery out of our electoral process....this undermining process is what stings a bit!

Again, I don't blame our opponents for pursuing their interests.............but rather I blame those among us, who are entrusted with safeguarding our hard fought rights....and are not doing it, for their own nefarious reasons.


The US can do this cuz we’re “exceptional?”


we do it because......of the exceptional situation we were thrust into in the post war era................once it was established that isolationism didn't work too well............we decided that Globalism was the way to go...some came willingly, others had to be nudged (or dragged in), but everyone in the free world had a seat at the table and ate well; the end result was less fighting and greater prosperity.....those that chose not to play ball, were dealt out.............and hence the cold -war, and you know what that entailed!


I think it’s because Russia isn’t playing all with Western financiers and multinationals and of course, supports countries who do the same.


correct...........China has shown that they are willing to play the (western) game...and found it fun when they beat us at our own game..........................not only does Russia not want to play...........they want to disrupt the game altogether.........distrust is a deep seated trait within the Russian Psyche............in a way, you can't blame them....they were invaded by Napoleon....Germany twice...........and paid a stiff price for their existence.............for Putin, the status quo is not enough........at this point, he since learned from Stalin's misteps (as he waited for Hitler to make the 1st move), and now knows he has to be Pro-Active all the time!

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N2U


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1j_Djv4Q74Q&index=24&list=WL&t=0s


what gall by the Dems................as they try to "hood-wink" their dimwitted followers in supporting a concept that ensures clean water, clean air...and renewable energy................who dare they !!!!
 adventurejoe70
Joined: 3/1/2013
Msg: 25
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How to make fools of ordinary people....through fake news
Posted: 3/30/2019 8:07:49 AM

there are no rules to the "game"........we have just done, that which those around us expected of us to do............when we meddle with a despotic regime, we do it to steer it away from the arms of our opponents.....and to hopefully gain an ally of some sort..............of course, things don't always go as planned.


We meddled in Russian,first, unfortunately and they don't like it. I don't know if Putin had anything with disrupting elections. If you want I can give a few facts about Putin that would prevent him from doing it the way it "supposedly" happened according to our western media. I will tell you that he hates Hillary. He had an issue with Bill when Bill basically made Yeltsin a puppet. It was many of the mistakes Bill made(backed by Hillary probably) that has caused the rift we have with Russia today. I mean the way NATO handled the whole Kosovo/Bosnia thing is basically the breaking point that made a rift bigger between Russian people and Yeltsin.


The Russian meddling has a different ring............we have a despot interfering with a country whose leadership is (supposedly) elected by its citizens............thus making a mockery out of our electoral process....this undermining process is what stings a bit!

I don't think Russia is as despotic as you think. I have family members who gladly voted for Putin. Russian politics is very populist orientated. Trust me, Putin doesn't do ANYTHING, that might be unpopular. I would say popularity is even more important there than here. This even includes the leadership.That is reason POLLS are more widespread in Russia. The leadership uses polls for everything.
You might not believe it but Putin is criticized very often in Russian media. Sure the Western media has presented a picture that the gov't controls all the media, but that was never true. There are still independent regional news papers and Russian interneyt news as well as small radio/tv networks that aren't controlled. The problem is MOST of them are actually more nationalistic than Putin cronies are. You should read the abuse Putin got for not appropriately backing the fighters in Eastern UA. They were constantly saying "he let them down" and they were even printing that the so called "Moscow backed rebels" (the extent of how much backing they got is even disputed in Russian politics because there was money being funneled from non gov't sources))would march into Moscow for being betrayed and kill Putin. Seriously, if you actually read internal Russian media you would realize the west isn't exactly honest. They even have cartoons of Putin in a bad light.

Believe it or not but the Russian Duma operates very similar to congress. A lot of trade offs for support. In fact I always rolled my eyes when the American media criticized Putin about some law about gays in public(more so because some western countries had similar written rules that weren't enforced) If the Western Media got its facts together, they would have realized that the law was present in many of the provincial provinces(mostly the Muslim centered ones) for decades and that a very old christian conservative women in the Duma proposed the bill be bought before the Duma for Federalization. It was discussed and voted by the Duma, after "traded favors,etc" just like in the west. Putin really didn't have much to do with it at all. In fact, I could be mistaken but it was when Putin was president and if anything the prime minister(who was once president when Putin was PM) is the one who would have more to do with it since PM is responsible for domestic issues. PM was liberal even for a Russian.

If the west finally wanted to WIN, they would realize Russian mentality is very different. USA isn't going to win by offering "liberal" ideas. The average Russian is terrified by instability and too much liberal freedoms. Historically, revolutions, including social ones, have hurt the avg Russian and they have learned from history!

As for my possible theory about the so called Russian election tampering, I will only say that if he did it for payback for Hillary then I understand. Payback is a dish best served cold. But in doing so he hurt his hand.For a chess player, NOT a great move. Too emotional .

However, Putin knew Americans don't like him and he even stated in talk show will Oliver Stone years ago, that if he endorses a US candidate that it would be wrong and he joked that Americans will vote for the opposite candidate. In light of Putin's awareness of this point, it means if he really wanted Trump to win, by his own logic, he would have to show Hillary support. Once has to wonder why he would make a move that goes against his own logic.
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