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 Blackbry
Joined: 2/24/2006
Msg: 2
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Feminism and relationshipsPage 1 of 26    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26)
I guess it depends on whether the person is in actuality a "femisnist" or a feminazi."

Alot of modern feminists have taken their militant stances to the point where they dont want equality between sexes (which is what I always gathered feminism was), but instead want a complete role reversal of the "male dominant world."

I have a friend that married a woman like that. She insisted he take her name, as a hyphenate, but would not take his as a hyphenate. I have no problems with women that actually have a clue about the ideals they are espousing, alot of it I agree with, but when I see some of these militant ones yelling at me about how my penis and I are evil, I just have to turn around and walk away
 Fran_Gal
Joined: 2/20/2006
Msg: 4
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 2/24/2006 2:31:47 PM
I think of a self proclaimed femminst as I do a self proclaimed christain.
They are extremists and often take things out of context... BUT in the case
of real femminism, or that movement it was not based on man bashing or
any of that.
You can do a search on the orgins of the femminst movement and research that yourself
to gain a better understanding of what that was all about.

Often men and women do not really nderstand that and as you know many things in life take on a new and twisted perversion based on people wanting to manipluate the facts or others
for their own personal causes...
as the extremist christian men who tell their wives to "submit"... and using the true meaning of it to serve themselves.

and the guys who cry femnazi.. lol, same thing.... they are just trying to
manipukate something and name calling because they arent getting what they want.
fran

:)
 Fran_Gal
Joined: 2/20/2006
Msg: 7
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 2/24/2006 2:37:59 PM
not to get off topic here or into a religious debate.... but the submit goes both ways and according to christian theology the man is to be a husband ( traits of a husband are outlined in the bible) and he is to love his wife.... submitting to her.
So, all that is messed up as people have perverted it into control and mind games.
Any man "tells" me to submit he can kiss my azz and drop dead.

I personally do not know any women who have claimed themselves a femminst but I see on TV the biggest of that self proclaimed group of feminists are the lesbians... which there are many types of... some are the man basher kind and some the just into chicks kind.

all is good, people can do whatever they can get away wth I guess.
I dont like extremist of any kind.
 Fran_Gal
Joined: 2/20/2006
Msg: 9
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 2/24/2006 2:51:49 PM
^ then count your blessing if it has been like that.... there are many who ask before they are willing to offer and some renig
lol
 sparticuss
Joined: 5/9/2006
Msg: 12
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 7/9/2006 9:40:14 PM
Jumpypants

A lot of totally insecure little girls, who are trying to prove what mature, with it , womens they are, often try to hide under the skirts of the feminist movement.

And, when you dump them, their insecurity, not feminism, leads them to go stalking you.

Does this sound like your ex??
 verygreeneyez
Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 13
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 7/23/2006 3:44:44 PM
"Feminism" is yet another grossly overused term. The actual movement was a step toward some level of acknowledgement ~ subsequent extremists took a good idea and turned it into a bad deal. In this day and age, I find the term itself outdated and full of negative connotations. Why any self-respecting woman would call herself a Feminist is simply beyond me. Why attach a negative stigma to onesself unless getting negative attention is better than no attention at all. On a personal level, I don't need to be "partners" with the man in my life. I prefer to be the woman and I like him to be the man. I don't expect anyone to live their life as I choose to live mine, but I don't like the negativity that comes from some who have NO clue what an actual Dominant/submissive relationship consists of. To each their own, but for me ~ I definitely prefer a more "traditional" relationship.
 verygreeneyez
Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 14
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 7/23/2006 7:33:40 PM
^^^^^^^^^^Sorry posters ~~~ ARGH...my son was logged in. I don't think he has a clue about this particular topic. **** Note to self: log in, log out!!****
 Gwendolyn2010
Joined: 1/22/2006
Msg: 15
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 7/23/2006 7:45:15 PM
Gorshkov wrote: I don't care of you have boobies or dangly bits - we're all human.

I am not human and I take offense at that statement.

So which type of "feminist" are we talking about? The first wave of suffragettes who were willing to stand up to a patriarchal society and go to jail for advocating the rights of women to vote and wear "bloomers" in public?

The second wave who continued the fight for women's rights?

At its core meaning, "feminism" just means that some people think women are equal to men and should be treated so under laws. A feminist can be a man as well as a woman. The idea that feminists think men are inferior to women is a later fallacy started by a radical front and perpetuated by men who are scared shitless of strong females.

If feminism is sexist, then advocating the rights of minorities is racist.

But Gorshkov, you are just so darned cute!
 Runs With Squirrels
Joined: 10/21/2005
Msg: 16
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History
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 7/23/2006 9:43:32 PM

There are two types of feminists, one was started in 1848 in New York State. It was carried by a long list of wonderful and influential women such as Susan B Anthony, and Elizabeth Cady Stanton. The belief of these feminists (which I call "Seneca Falls" Feminists) was that women should have equal rights and opportuinites as men. I am a Seneca Falls Feminist.

Unfortuneatley in the 1970s NeoFeminism became popular. I do not stand by neofeminism at all, since it often promotes females as being supperior to men, and this is no more right than saying men are supperior to women. Going into a relationship with a woman who is passionate about her own womanhood is no problem for me, in fact, I like it. Going into a relationship with a neofeminist is hard, especially for someone like me, who tries my best to value women and treat them with the dignity they deserve. Make a distinction between the two, one is good, one is bad, lol.


Wow . . . Well said!

I have to say though, I think it's sad that a word that originally had such positive connotations has become something that women are afraid to identify themselves with. If you ask a woman, "Are you a feminist?" it's astounding how many women will say, "Well, not really." But if you ask those same women, "Do you believe in equal pay for equal work? That women should be allowed to vote? That women should be able to report rape without worrying about whether people will say she asked for it?" those same women will answer, "Of course."

I just think it's sad that we've lost the definition of the word. So I'm taking it back. I'm a feminist, dammit! LOL
 verygreeneyez
Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 17
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 7/23/2006 11:16:06 PM

Been there, done that, bought the t-shirt. My knowledge is not heresay. Please don't assume that just because my opinion is (apparently) different from yours that it's based on ignorance.

I also didn't bring the topic to this thread - I was responding to a comment that another poster had made, and did not intend it to become the topic.

I'm happy to discuss it with you via email if you wish, but I'd much rather not pollute the thread with an off topic discussion, if you don't mind?


Based upon your post above, it is clearly obvious you are under a misconception. Possibly in your circle it was as you state, but having written my thesis on the subject, I can assure you ~ either your information is terribly outdated or you were basing your generalization upon a very very small percentage of the community as a whole. I appreciate that you did not throw this into the mix here, but you did promote the off topic conversation. My opinion isn't posted here in this forum, so my personal opinion is not important. I was merely pointing out an error in your post from a standpoint of information gathered over several years of research, interviews, statistical information from various agencies, etc. I don't think it's of importance enough to venture into private email ~ JMO

~OT~ I just had an interesting dialogue young ladies that know my son. They are between the ages of 20-22. I asked them their take on feminism. After explaining to them exactly what that word meant (LOL) they all giggled and said "Oh, when women burned their bras." A little more discussion basically told me that they have NO interest in being labeled or categorized into this particular group. I find that rather interesting. I wonder if anyone else has talked to women in that particular age category ~ I find their comments disturbing, perplexing and also a little alarming...has the entire movement been forgotten? Left out of history books? Or is it something else?????
 Gwendolyn2010
Joined: 1/22/2006
Msg: 18
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 7/24/2006 2:12:24 PM
"There are two types of feminists, one was started in 1848 in New York State. It was carried by a long list of wonderful and influential women such as Susan B Anthony, and Elizabeth Cady Stanton. The belief of these feminists (which I call "Seneca Falls" Feminists) was that women should have equal rights and opportuinites as men. I am a Seneca Falls Feminist."

BRAVA!!! Someone else who does homework. I love it.
 wurl
Joined: 7/2/2006
Msg: 19
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 1/8/2007 1:16:32 PM
I'm not into financial domination. As long as they pay their way, I'm cool with that.
 cedar77
Joined: 7/17/2006
Msg: 20
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Feminism and relationships
Posted: 1/8/2007 1:35:45 PM
I think the great irony in all this is that "feminist's" are actually anti-feminine. If your purpose is to masculinize women... does that not make you anti-woman?
Trying to make women into men implies that men are the ideal and women are lacking and inferior, in need of change and should aspire to the level of men.

In many way's women have lost power due to the "feminist revolution" ...now women are often just working stiffs trying to carve out a living in the big rat race.

I think women and men are equal but different and it's the difference that is/was a great thing.
 Gwendolyn2010
Joined: 1/22/2006
Msg: 21
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 4/22/2007 6:58:42 PM
Charming Secret, brava!
 Terrible Flirt
Joined: 5/13/2006
Msg: 22
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Feminism and relationships
Posted: 4/22/2007 9:46:50 PM
In response to charmingsecret: I hate to break it to you but boys are girls, and men and women are different at a level deeper than the anatomical. The fact that societies the world over, through all of time recognize this and structure themselves accordingly is not the product of a fantastically disciplined conspiracy by the boys to hold down the girls. It's just a product of the acceptance of the facts of life.

Now, the expression of those differences in the structure of a society can vary widely, radically, for the good or bad of both sexes. That's where we all need to work together, to make a world where, despite our differences, we all get fair treatment (perhaps we agree on that last part). We don't need to pretend, though, that there are no real differences between the sexes other than those secured by the "patriarch".

As for not liking to be objectified, you have a major problem, as do we all, I suspect. Because, once again, you are objecting to human nature. Men are objectified too, by the way. I guess I don't speak for all men but, as for me, I ignore it, to the point that it really doesn't even register. I don't, however, demand that the rest of the world stop doing what comes natural.

I make no apologies to anyone for my manhood. I am not, despite feminist dogma insinuating otherwise, a rapist, or even a potential rapist. I am not an abuser or exploiter of women and no amount of feminist brow-beating will alter that reality. In truth, I love women. I don't apologize for that either.

And charmingsecret...you're hot!
 that sam i am
Joined: 10/27/2006
Msg: 23
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 4/22/2007 11:31:24 PM
You can't go after someone of German ancestry for the crimes of WW2. Likewise you can't hold a modern day Japanese for what his forefathers did in WW2. But Femnazis go after men for what society did years ago. What I like to say to FemNazis when I have to deal with their angry rants is "Holy Cow Woman, like who lit the fuse on your tampon." hahahah
 Kramer111
Joined: 5/19/2005
Msg: 25
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 4/23/2007 3:55:23 PM
A strong confident assertive woman....I would question why you seem to be threatened by that. hmm
 cedar77
Joined: 7/17/2006
Msg: 26
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Posted: 4/23/2007 4:17:23 PM
IMHO , this is why there are so many guy's who are not big fans of "feminism" ...and let's keep in mind this is very mainstream stuff...



V-Day twists holiday into male-bashing event

By Christina Hoff Sommers

Saturday evening, thousands of women will gather at Madison Square Garden in New York City to observe "V-Day."

The sponsors of this "Violence Against Women Day" intend to transform Valentine's Day into a "holiday" that deplores men's brutal treatment of women. "V-Day," say the planners, "proclaims Valentine's Day as V-Day until the violence stops. When all women live in safety, then it will be known as Victory Over Violence Day."

One might expect strong resistance to the idea of changing a charming and well-loved romantic holiday into a day of outrage. In fact, V-Day now is in its fourth year, and its popularity is growing.

V-Day originated in the mind of Eve Ensler, author of the off-Broadway hit, The Vagina Monologues. This play is loosely based on interviews with more than 200 women on the subject of their intimate anatomy. Theatergoers find some of the comments amusing. But its more serious preoccupation is exposing male insensitivity and violence. It offers a rogues' gallery of oafs, brutes, adulterers, rapists, child molesters and vile little boys.

An information sheet assures us that "it isn't the style or substance of V-Day to bash anyone." But apart from this disclaimer, V-Day, like The Monologues, appears dedicated to the proposition that women are from Venus and men are from hell.

Dozens of luminaries, among them Oprah Winfrey, Brooke Shields, Winona Ryder and Calista Flockhart, are scheduled to participate in Saturday's gala. Activities will include speeches against rape and battery, "empowerment" workshops and dramatic readings from The Vagina Monologues.

Jane Fonda, who just donated $1 million to the V-Day campaign, is honorary chair. Celebrity acolytes refer to themselves as "Eve's Army."

An unassailable goal?

V-Day supporters justify their movement to redefine Valentine's Day by pointing to the high purpose this serves. How, they ask, could anyone possibly object to a holiday dedicated to diminishing battery and murder?

The first thing to say is that choosing Valentine's Day for any such purpose is grossly inappropriate. Why pick the one day that celebrates all of the good things that happen between men and women and turn it into a day that focuses on the bad things? By this twisted logic, we should be working to turn Mother's Day into a "holiday" condemning all of the vicious things some mothers do to their children.

V-Day's sponsors portray the United States as one of the most repressive and barbarous places on earth for women. One "fact sheet" they distribute says "22% to 35% of women who visit emergency rooms are there for injuries related to ongoing abuse."

Too many, but not that many

These numbers are egregiously wrong. The Bureau of Justice Statistics reports that about one-half of 1% of women who visit emergency rooms are there for injuries related to domestic abuse. That still translates into distressingly high numbers of victims. But the true numbers are apparently not high enough for V-Day proponents. They are determined to implicate the average American man in an ongoing social atrocity and to place the United States on a moral par with countries that practice genital mutilation and bride burnings.

A holiday based on hysterical overstatement about the plight of American women is a bad idea on any day of the year. But "V-Day," say its supporters, "is a fierce, wild, unstoppable movement."

It certainly has momentum. This year, V-Day will be observed in 50 cities and 300 colleges worldwide. Organizers expect 20,000 women at Saturday's event and believe it will raise millions of dollars for the cause. Ensler herself is a formidable asset; her celebrity followers revere her. "She's giving us our souls back," Glenn Close told CNN.

Can Valentine's Day withstand the V-Day assault? It can and will. The millions of women and men who quietly celebrate the day in the traditional manner are its best defense. Their tender sentiments, expressed in flowers, heart-shaped boxes of chocolate and half-serious little poems, give the lie to Ensler's grim way of looking at the world.

Eve's Army may be marching in the name of women, but it certainly does not represent them.

Christina Hoff Sommers is a resident scholar at the American Enterprise Institute. Her latest book is The War Against Boys: How Feminism is Harming Our Young Men.







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 cedar77
Joined: 7/17/2006
Msg: 27
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History
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Posted: 4/23/2007 4:32:16 PM
~enceladus~
IMHO....you are completely correct...but , don't expect others to get it , unfortunately ..people often believe only what they want to believe and nobody likes to feel like they have been manipulated... especially at such a personal , core level .



Feminism was promoted for the purpose of de stabilizing society, and creating dysfunctional people. Stunted people can be brainwashed and manipulated.

Feminism masquerades as a movement for women's rights. This kind of deception is typical of subversive movements of Communist origin. In reality, feminism is ruthlessly opposed to femininity, masculinity, heterosexuality, the nuclear family and children.

Exactly .....
If thing's were as people precieve them to be... "feminism" would never have gotten to the socially destructive proportions it has come to today.
It's only with the support of very powerful , elite , socialist, control freak men that "feminism" is such a huge ,one sided, radical and destructive social movement that hasn't had a healthy balance.
 cedar77
Joined: 7/17/2006
Msg: 30
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History
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 4/24/2007 12:52:23 AM

And some would argue that the fact that "women's choices"--specific to women as a sex--has this kind of enormous impact on relative salaries is itself an "issue" rather than an "answer."




Incomparable Nonsense
by Carrie L. Lukas
8/17/2005


The feminist left's attempt to tar Judge John Roberts as a fan of abortion-clinic bombers failed, so they need a new angle to convince women that he's a threat. The latest crop of memos released by the White House provides a new opening: Roberts doesn't believe in "equal pay" for women.

At least, that's how the mainstream media characterize his sentiments. USA Today's headline warns, "Roberts scoffed at equal pay theory." On Good Morning America, Jessica Yellin described Roberts as having "urged the White House to oppose an effort by some in the women's movement to equalize pay between women and men who do comparable work."

But Roberts's reflections on the danger of the government micromanaging wages were plain common sense. Comparable-worth theory assumes that wages set by the marketplace are unfair to women and that the government will better decide the just compensation for a given job. New York's Senator Hillary Clinton introduced legislation based on this concept earlier this year: Her bill would require that employers pay equal salaries to "equivalent" jobs. While bureaucrats would ponder how to define "equivalent," employers, fearing a flurry of lawsuits, would likely regiment their salary practices.

Women would be the big losers from this new regime. Women tend to want flexible employment arrangements: Many women -- particularly those with children -- willingly trade higher pay for the ability to leave each day at 4 p.m. to pick up the kids from school. Employers may hesitate to offer such options under a new "comparable worth" regime, since bureaucrats thumbing through their records could question why the female manager makes less than her male counterpart.

True comparable-worth advocates aren't just concerned about pay discrepancies within offices or even industries. They want to "correct" the unfair system that results in industries dominated by men, such as truck driving, paying more than those dominated by women, such as elementary-school teaching. Implicit in their logic is the snobbish belief that jobs like teaching deserve more compensation since they require more education, while truck drivers just mindlessly drone from one highway to the next.

The marketplace, however, takes many factors other than education into account when determining compensation. Dr. Warren Farrell, a former board member of the National Organization for Women's New York chapter, details the many criteria that affect pay rates in his recent book, Why Men Earn More. He concludes that men tend to make choices that maximize pay, while women opt for lower pay but a better quality of life.

Men assume more high-risk jobs: 92 percent of occupational deaths befall men. Men take on endeavors that require braving the elements outdoors and are physically grueling. Women avoid jobs that require a great deal of travel or relocation. Even those women who work full-time on average spend fewer hours on the job than full-time working men. And, of course, as Roberts noted, women tend to take more time out of the workforce entirely.

Statistics that show a "gap" between men and women's earnings aren't evidence of discrimination since they fail to account for these factors. Of course, that doesn't stop the feminist movement from trumpeting such numbers to promote the perception that women are members of a victim class in need of big government to save them.

Instead of accepting the feminist claim that they're victims of discrimination, American women should consider the choices that they've made during their lives. Have you always sought to maximize pay? Both men and women likely recognize their career decisions have been more complicated than that. Women in particular are likely to find that salary is often not the driving force behind their employment choices.

This isn't to suggest that there's no such thing as discrimination against women in the workplace, but the statistical differences between men and women's wages alone aren't evidence of discrimination. Moreover, empowering government to "fix" wages so they are more "fair" is a recipe for disaster, particularly for women for whom flexibility is paramount.

Regardless of the mainstream media's spin, Judge Robert's skepticism of the push for "comparable worth" legislation isn't evidence of sexism. It's evidence of good sense.

This article appeared at National Review Online

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 cedar77
Joined: 7/17/2006
Msg: 31
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History
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Posted: 4/24/2007 8:26:34 AM

Feminism raises women up by bringing men down.

IMO..."Feminism" (as we know it )... brings men , women and children down in order to empower big government.
 cedar77
Joined: 7/17/2006
Msg: 33
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History
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Posted: 4/24/2007 8:51:34 AM

Every society in history has had different gender roles for men and women. In fact some cultures have had the male as the primary care giver and the female as the primary "bread winner" if you will.
As long as you can view feminism in the broader idea of gender roles I don't think it should be threatening to men.

I don't know if it is saying it best as "threatening to men" ...it's more like men often see "feminism" as just plain selfish and destructive.
Is the truth threatening to "feminism " ? .....


The Myth of Matriarchal Prehistory: Why an Invented Past Will Not Give Women a Future (Hardcover)
by Cynthia Eller (Author)




Goddess Pseudo-History
Unable to find any "Matriarchies" in the present day, many feminists resort to inventing an idyllic Lost Matriarchal Paradise in the dim mists of pre-history. Even though there is no acceptable scholarly evidence for this, it has become an accepted fact in "Womens Studies"


Supposed 'Old Matriarchal Village' at the U.N.
Fourth World Conference on Women, Beijing, 1995
My debunking of The Goddess Remembered, a pseudo-historical documentary widely seen on PBS during 'pledge weeks'. (Hint: If they're broadcasting this garbage, Don't Pledge!. Instead, call them up and explain why you won't pledge)

Read Charlotte Allen's piece demolishing feminist/neopagan "Goddess History" in the January, 2001 issue of The Atlantic Monthly.

Detailed sources debunking the Goddess Garden of Eden myths promoted by Marija Gimbutas, Riane Eisler, etc. These are unscholarly claims that are routinely taught in "Womens Studies" classes as if they were established fact. However, the newly-online Encyclopedia Brittanica article on "matriarchy" refutes these claims, and states plainly that "the consensus among modern anthropologists and sociologists is that a strictly matriarchal society never existed."

The best book debunking the Goddess nonsense is Goddess Unmasked by Philip G. Davis. Read my review of the book.

How historically accurate are the "Goddess" claims made in the best-seller The DaVinci Code? Not at all, as we see in this article from a Catholic magazine.

The Myth of Matriarchal Prehistory by Cynthia Eller. "Why an Invented Past Won't Give Women a Future."

Faces of the Goddess by Lotte Motz.

The Pagan religions of the Ancient British Isles - their Nature and Legacy. by Ronald Hutton. Scholary refutations of wildly-inaccurate contemporary neopagan claims.
 cedar77
Joined: 7/17/2006
Msg: 34
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Posted: 4/24/2007 9:31:01 AM

My motto is live and let live....And I am still a feminist...Dont lump us into the category of an extremist, who I think is harmful no matter what they stand for

Yeah ...
I don't think I've ever heard any woman state she is a radical feminist....


It is invariably objected that the kinds of positions and doctrines objected to above are those of "the extremists", and that "reasonable" feminists and feminist organizations do not hold them. The critics of feminism are accused of concentrating their attacks on so-called "extremists" such as Catherine Mackinnon and Andrea Dworkin. , But Mackinnon is the inventor of the legal concept of "sexual harassment"; do "reasonable feminists" reject that concept as 'extremism? Of course not; this line of argument enables them to "savor the fruit" of Mackinnonism while "cursing the vine." If Andrea Dworkin is such an "extremist," why has she been praised so lavishly by Gloria Steinem? (And if Gloria Steinem is not 'representative of feminists', then who is?)

The question I next ask is: just where are all these "reasonable feminists"? The answer invariably is that they are sitting next to me, or in the office down the hall; yet somehow these supposed voices of "moderation" manage to play absolutely no role whatsoever in the formulation of major public policy. Some more-or-less reasonable, yet politically ineffective, feminists defend their roles by pointing to minor success where 'good feminists' like themselves were able to slightly mitigate the harmful policies (coercion, censorship, etc.) of the 'bad feminists'. My response is that if all that the 'good feminists' can accomplish is to oppose, with less than 100% effectiveness, the harm done by the 'bad feminists,' then society would be better off without feminists altogether.
 cedar77
Joined: 7/17/2006
Msg: 35
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History
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Posted: 4/24/2007 10:33:54 AM
^ re. msg 101.....
"Feminism" unfortunately, is probably more about man bashing than the benefits you enjoy.
Men do everything you list above plus more of the dangerous/deadly harsh environment ,long houred jobs in our society. Men certainly contribute just as much...if not more .
Men are very supportive of women by nature ....they have an instinct to protect women ..."feminism" has taken advantage of men's good nature......



Various feminists proclaim that women are 'under siege', that a monstrous social bias against them, if not a virtual war, is going on, that women have little respect or power (Steinem, Faludi, Tavris, etc.) Yet the notion of the American woman as a powerless "victim" is one of the most absurd notions ever foisted upon anyone. American women live, on average, seven years longer than men. They control 86 % of all personal wealth [PARADE Magazine, May 27, 1990], and make up 55% of current college graduates. Women cast 54% of the votes in Presidential elections, so they can hardly claim to be left out of the political decision-making process! They win almost automatically in child custody disputes. Women suffer only 6% of the work-related fatalities (the other 94% are suffered by men). Women are the victim of only about 35% of violent crimes, and only about 25% of all murders, yet because of our society's exaggerated concern and respect for them, special legislation has been passed to punish "violence against women" as if it were a more heinous crime than "violence against men". (Feminists claim to want "equality", and this is an example of what "equality" means to them, i.e., preferential treatment to address their concerns). Two out of every three dollars spent on health care is spent on women, and even if you don't count pregnancy-related care, women still receive more medical care than men - yet feminists still holler that womens health is being "neglected", and far too many of us credulously believe them. Of the 25 worst jobs, as ranked by the Jobs Related Almanac based on a combination of salary, stress, security, and physical demands, 24 of them are predominantly, if not almost entirely, male, which might explain why men commit over 80% of all suicides. (Most of these statistics come from The Myth of Male Power by Warren Farrell.)

Now, if it were really the case, as feminists claim, that men have selfishly arranged everything to be wonderful for themselves, absolutely ignoring womens' legitimate concerns and needs, would the above be true? Of course not. It is much more realistic to suggest that women have cleverly seized the upper hand by pretending to be helplessly trapped below! Looking at the full picture, and not the tiny, distorted one that feminists and those they have duped present, we see a very different picture: The American woman emerges as perhaps the most privileged large group in history, enjoying a never-before- seen level of affluence, power, leisure, and health, supported by the work, discipline, and self-effacing, life-destroying exertions of a group they have bamboozled - their men - into believing their cries of "victimization". The links below will help you to start finding your way out of the familiar maze of feminist lies.
 cedar77
Joined: 7/17/2006
Msg: 36
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History
Feminism and relationships
Posted: 4/24/2007 10:51:05 AM

I wouldnt give up my health and self esteem as well as all the things Ive benefited from feminism because it makes some insecure men defensive and uncomfortable looking at their baggage and issues

This is typical selfish , hearltess "feminist" mentality....if a guy points out the lies , manipulation , distortions , hypocrisy , double standards, hatred ,
destructiveness of "feminism"
....then he must have baggage and issues ....
Nope, but thanks anyways , I don't believe I do...
..on the other hand :
"feminists" are world champions at having baggage and issues !!
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