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 nightlord
Joined: 1/24/2006
Msg: 6
Your thoughts on the Church of ScientologyPage 1 of 6    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6)
^^^
ROFL. Now THAT'S funny. Hubbard was just a man... true enough. But so was every other so-called "prophet" or "wise man" to ever walk the earth.

Don't blame him for coming up with a plan to better himself, or others. Name for me ANY other "religion" that doesn't suck money out of people's pockets. Does it change the fact that people feel better for following said religion?

Not to mention the fact, that of all the other religions in existence, as least his doesn't promote wiping the earth of those who don't follow.

Don't get me wrong, I think there are some pretty goofy people out there, willing to follow ANYTHING over their own minds. And maybe this "scheme" of Hubbard's is nuts. But the question comes to mind, "Who is the more foolish? The Fool, or the one who follows?"

P.S. I don't care for Scientology... but that doesn't make them ALL idiots, or Hubbard the Devil. Therefore, I fail to see the justification in bad-mouthing him or the people that hold his words dear for a belief which promotes self-affermation as opposed to prejudice slaughter.
 Simlasa
Joined: 10/30/2004
Msg: 7
view profile
History
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 5/8/2006 6:32:17 PM
I'm not sure what its original form/intent might have been but the way it is now it seems like a cult that has similar characteristics to 'pyramid schemes' such as 'Amway'... it keeps the followers trying to rise to higher levels... higher knowledge... and encourages them to recruit new ones.
There is a hierarchy of tests and such that you need to take to get to the higher levels... dealing with silly things like the 'E Meter'... as you rid yourself of the disfunctional energy holding you back from self-actualization.
Apparently these tests add up to a LOT of money... it's very expensive to reach the higher levels.
Once you get there you get to hear the big secrets of Scientology... centering on a story about Xenu the evil space alien.
By that time you've spent tens of thousands of dollars and would probably rather believe the malarky about Xenu than realize what a sucker you've been...
 Simlasa
Joined: 10/30/2004
Msg: 13
view profile
History
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 5/10/2006 3:49:53 PM
Yeah, The Process were those guys who went around in long robes with attack dogs... they were a scary group... and if you read about the woman... what she did later... it gets even scarier...
 MasterBart
Joined: 6/20/2004
Msg: 24
view profile
History
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 5/17/2006 9:05:52 PM
Well, here's a little thought of mine. The idea of having a "religion" is appealing to most people. When you take a place like Hollywood, where gossip is gospel; careers, fame and wealth are an unpredictable roller coaster; and reality is founded upon the superficial, egomaniacal and materialistic end of the spectrum... I'm sure religion is even more appealing, as people seeks "preordained" answers from supernatural sources.

Big-name celebrities can't exactly go to regular church. Kinda hard to pray and meditate while signing autographs. So, they need a place to go, where they can be with thier clique of household-name friends, while getting their God fix. That makes it like an exclusive club. It would be hard to determine who can join via an "are you famous enough?" rule. So the exclusion/inclusion factor becomes money.

Then comes in the challenge of creating a church that can justify charging huge amounts, so it has to come up with some extra-special things. It would be necessary to always need the latest and greatest high-tech tools, to run expensive tests and experiments, and have "religious" beliefs that only highly-advanced intellectuals could begin to comprehend.

As an added bonus, our beloved celebrities get to promote an image of themselves as these super-advanced geniuses. Downside is they have to display their super-abilities publicly in order to give their church a sense of authenticity. Thus pics of Kirsty and Tom hooked up to their cereboreal trans-plasmifiers and their anti-neutrineal subatomic holy positroners. Only 85 grand a pop, and it gives ya a great buzz. Who's next?

Catch is, for this "church" to retain members, it has to give them something. It has to provide some ruthless feel-goodies; to tell them that it can outdo Mizz Cleo, Dr. Phil and Ron Jeremy combined.

I truly believe that what this world really needs is a place where super-wealthy women can get worshipped, er, seduced, by MasterBart. For fifty grand a week. Each.
 LilNikki
Joined: 2/4/2006
Msg: 29
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 5/18/2006 11:14:04 AM
MoonWalrus,
Serious questions, as I'm very curious...why do you believe that Scientology is better than Hinduism or Celtic paganism?
And why do you believe Gandhi and Mohammed are in hell?
 nightlord
Joined: 1/24/2006
Msg: 37
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 6/8/2006 5:13:07 PM
*AHEM*

Right, because the Christian church has never been guilty of this. As a matter of fact, it still is. Just let your congregation discover some of these things you're doing. If they do not agree with your lifestyle, or just one act, they can turn on you like a pack of wolves. They can turn their children against your children. Ect.
Don't act like Scientology is introducing any new evils to the realm of religion.
 CountIbli
Joined: 6/1/2005
Msg: 39
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 6/10/2006 9:20:19 AM


Muhammad requires bodily mutilation of 12 year old boys (circumcision).


Mosaic Law also required circumcision. In America (possibly elsewhere) it's common practice for Christians to have their sons circumcised. It's a horrible practice that should be stopped.



Muhammad said that the Moon creates its own light source. Idiot!


The Bible says the same thing.



nobody else has been able to create a new religion in the twentieth century.


Well there's Wicca that's going might strong. Dozens of other religions have popped up in the 20th century.



Jim Jones and David Koresh died and so did their religions.


David Koresh did not create Branch Davidianism. IIRC, it splintered off of the Seventh Day Adventists in the 1920's. The people who escaped the conflagration in Waco retained their religion.
 CountIbli
Joined: 6/1/2005
Msg: 40
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 6/10/2006 9:21:56 AM


Muhammad assumed the earth was flat!


So did the writers of the Bible.
 nipoleon
Joined: 12/27/2005
Msg: 41
view profile
History
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 6/10/2006 10:21:14 AM
I've tried to read Dianetics but have always found it boring, shallow, and unimpressive.
There's nothing there regarding religion or philosophy which can't be found in other and older sources and done much better.
I don't want to belittle anyone who follows any religion with devotion.
But in my opinion, Scientology is rather frivolous.
 DXinAZ
Joined: 2/21/2006
Msg: 43
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 6/11/2006 1:38:05 PM
Foxglove19...
I absolutely love your post! That is the attitude that everyone should have...and would have if they'd simply do a little research on their own instead of allowing themselves to be spoonfed information about Scientology by Scientologists.

In the case of Lawrence Wollersheim v. Church of Scientology of California, "Scientology's counseling practices were found to be dangerous in the first jury decision of the LA Superior Court. These dangerous counseling practices were also found to be the cause of Lawrence Wollersheim being driven to the brink of insanity. The court record further states that the severe bipolar disorder, which Wollersheim suffered, was a direct result of the dangerous nature of Scientology's counseling practices applied to Wollersheim."

Scientology is none other than a pyramid scam that utilizes a process of coercive thought reform to recruit and retain it's membership. Members are entitled to 15% of the money paid for courses and "auditing" by members that they bring in under them. The process of auditing is none other than authoritarian hypnosis which is combined with other tactics of coercive persuasion such as abridging the members' privacy, social relationships, correspondence, and phone calls. A very large portion of the Church's doctrine is not even shared with a new member until they reach the secret "OT" levels of training. By then, their self-concept, perception of reality, and social relationships have been so modified, and they have been so deceived, controlled, and manipulated that they either leave Scientology and spend a substantial amount of time in therapy attempting to deal with their anger over how badly they had been taken advantage of, or they stay in because of the threat that personal and potentially embarrassing information that was gleaned from them during their many hours of "auditing" might be revealed if they were to leave, or they commit suicide.

L. Ron Hubbard was a master stage hypnotist as well as an evil genious. He knew that hypnosis is a natural state of altered awareness. Under the right circumstances, a person can become addicted to the state of altered awareness that is induced by auditing in much the same way that a drug addict is addicted to the altered state of awareness that is induced by their drug of choice.

Hubbard also knew that in order for a subject to be hypnotized successfully, they needed to have 1) motivation, 2)expectation, 3) a belief system, 4) a good imagination, 5) conviction, 6) concentration, and 7) education, and he created a vehicle to ensure that this would be the case. That vehicle is Scientology, of which the main practice is auditing, which is not free. L. Ron Hubbard's plan worked so well that he was worth an estimated $40 million at the time of his death.

Once the truth about Scientology becomes common knowledge, his name will be placed right alongside Adolph Hitler's with the pain and suffering that he has caused as well as the countless lives and relationships that Scientology has destroyed. The only difference is that L. Ron Hubbard's evil survived him in death and even went on to get the stamp of approval by the U.S. government.
 So-Called Chaos
Joined: 6/16/2006
Msg: 44
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 6/20/2006 9:52:39 AM
The "church" of Scientology was founded by a science fiction author Ron L. Hubbard. He once said the way to get rich the fastest was to start a new religion.

If you look at the basic teachings of the system. We are all inhabited by aliens souls that must be released in order for us to live normal lives. This takes thousands and thousands of dollars to do.

Many people's lives have been destroyed by this brain-washing cult. One example was of a young man who threw himself to his death clutching the last twenty dollars he had. This was only 6 months after joining the "church".

If this cult was really interested in helping people, then why do these "cleansing" sessions cost a ridiculous amount of money?

Just something to think about.

Kara
~Chaos
 Cell_Belle_vwilli35
Joined: 2/12/2006
Msg: 48
view profile
History
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 6/22/2006 2:24:54 PM
As everyone knows the "Church of Scientology disaproves strongly ...just listen to Tom Cruise ...of pychiatrists and drugs...why then was L. Ron Hubbard taking pych drugs before he died?
He also proclaimed that he could make a million dollars by inventing a religion. Guess the laugh was on the people that bought that hype.
 Cell_Belle_vwilli35
Joined: 2/12/2006
Msg: 49
view profile
History
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 6/22/2006 2:26:51 PM
Hey I just saw your post on India. I'm Buddhist and we do not worship cows or chickens but have regard for all life. Get your facts straight.
Metta
 amore_vita
Joined: 9/8/2006
Msg: 82
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 3/14/2007 8:32:31 AM
As I sit today in Clearwater Florida
the spiritual headquarters for the church
a day after the birthday of LRH March 13 2007
(actually the Scientologists will celebrate this on Friday 16th)
all is calm --
are they a Church or Self Improvement Class (aka Tony Robbins)
I have read it all in these posts
some good -- other cruel comments
most have been justified
as the Mormons were persecuted and chased across the country
settling down in Salt Lake
I see the same end result here in Clearwater
These is MUCH friction now
between ""conventional Churches" and believers
against those in Scientology
100+ years later Salt Lake City hosts the Olympic Games
maybe the same in the end will happen to Clearwater
just not the Winter Games
Clear --- a LRH favorite
I am in favor of the position against RIDDILIN (sp?) and other
type of pshycotic drugs
(without the antics even TOM CRUISE has made some good points)
and even though the IRS and Feds have classified Scientology
as a religious group.......... I may not fully agree
I will stick to my CHRISTIAN CHURCH where
we worship a GOD -- Creator and His Son Jesus our Savior..........
 rockondon
Joined: 2/21/2007
Msg: 83
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History
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 3/14/2007 8:51:05 AM
The core belief, told only to OT III members (upper level members), is as follows :(according to http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Spa/8412/gregg/21COSET.HTM)

Who is Xenu?

Once upon a time (75 million years ago to be more precise) there was an alien galactic ruler named Xenu. Xenu was in charge of all the planets in this part of the galaxy including our own planet Earth, except in those days it was called Teegeeack.

Now Xenu had a problem. All of the 76 planets he controlled were overpopulated. Each planet had on average 178 billion people. He wanted to get rid of all the overpopulation so he had a plan.

Xenu took over complete control with the help of renegades to defeat the good people and the Loyal Officers. Then with the help of psychiatrists he called in billions of people for income tax inspections where they were instead given injections of alcohol and glycol mixed to paralyse them. Then they were put into space planes that looked exactly like DC8s (except they had rocket motors instead of propellers).

These DC8 space planes then flew to planet Earth where the paralysed people were stacked around the bases of volcanoes in their hundreds of billions. When they had finished stacking them around then H-bombs were lowered into the volcanoes. Xenu then detonated all the H-bombs at the same time and everyone was killed.

The story doesn't end there though. Since everyone has a soul (called a "thetan" in this story) then you have to trick souls into not coming back again. So while the hundreds of billions of souls were being blown around by the nuclear winds he had special electronic traps that caught all the souls in electronic beams (the electronic beams were sticky like fly-paper).

After he had captured all these souls he had them packed into boxes and taken to a few huge cinemas. There all the souls had to spend days watching special 3D motion pictures that told them what life should be like and many confusing things. In this film they were shown false pictures and told they were God, The Devil and Christ. In the story this process is called "implanting".

When the films ended and the souls left the cinema these souls started to stick together because since they had all seen the same film they thought they were the same people. They clustered in groups of a few thousand. Now because there were only a few living bodies left they stayed as clusters and inhabited these bodies.

As for Xenu, the Loyal Officers finally overthrew him and they locked him away in a mountain on one of the planets. He is kept in by a force-field powered by an eternal battery and Xemu is still alive today.
 themadfiddler
Joined: 10/16/2006
Msg: 84
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 3/14/2007 11:36:11 AM
In my opinion, a "church" only for tax purposes. The German government has them dead to rights. It is a criminal money grabbing organization with a two-tiered system that draws celebrities for the empty-headed pop-psychology of Dianetics, which Hubbard cobbled together from plagarized material, and a lower tier for the rank and file drawn in by the celebrities they wish to emulate...they exist to fuel the money needs of the organization and don't get to attend the special resorts and clubs.

The beliefs? Bad B-grade pulp sci-fi so bad that Hubbard himself wouldn't have submitted it to a good magazine (hopefully) back in the 40's...then again there was Battlefield Earth (eurgh...chunder).

The best information clearinghouse on the nuthouse that is $cientology...they keep trying to get it torn down...but it ain't goin' nowhere...

www.xenu.net - in the words of Elvis "Clambake, gonna have a clambake!"

Feeder organizations like Narconon exist to prey on the weak and confused drug and alcohol addicted (even celebs like Kirstie Alley) serving as a court allowable alternative to AA.

http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Narconon/

The founder, a drug addled, failed Navy officer turned sub-par science ficiton writer/con-artist...not according to his Church of course.

http://www.clambake.org/archive/books/bfm/bfmconte.htm
The true story of L. Ron...

But then if you ask them they probably wouldn't tell you that they were convicted as an organization in Canada for breach of trust and have the stellar claim of being the only "church" with that distinction.

http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/malice.htm

And as one Keith Henson found out, they guard the copywrite to their "secrets" most fiercly...

http://holysmoke.org/kh/kh.htm

A list of written, radio and media accounts of Keith Henson's plight:

Electronic Frontier Foundation Concerned US Court Violated Free Speech Rights
http://www.eff.org/effector/HTML/effect14.13.html#II

LA Weekly Article on Keith Henson June 22, 2001
http://www.laweekly.com/news/news/unfair-game/4713/

LA Weekly Article Scientology, cont. By News Staff Wednesday, May 20, 1998
http://www.laweekly.com/news/offbea...ogy-cont/12105/

Unorthodox Arrest, Enzo Di Matteo, NOW Magazine, June 7-13, 2001.
http://www.nowtoronto.com/issues/20...s_spread_p.html

Scientology Critic Convicted -- Apr. 27, 2001 Wired article on Henson's conviction
http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,43420,00.html

Vince Daniels Show on K.C.A.A. 1050 AM Los Angeles February 3, 2007
http://yardtv.gotdns.com/kcaa-podcasts/vince/

US Scientology critic free in Canada, Article by The Register in June 2001
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2001/0...gy_critic_free/

On the run from L. Ron Hubbard, Article written by Salon.com in May 2001
http://archive.salon.com/tech/featu...nson/index.html

Scientology Critic Flees U.S. Over Usenet Posts, Pickets; Article written by Slashdot May 2001
http://slashdot.org/yro/01/05/17/0238223.shtml

Here is Keith Henson's main page
http://www.operatingthetan.com/

Here is a wikipedia page about Henson
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Henson

http://www.lermanet.com/index.html
notes on the Henson trial and its "irregularities" following a filed amicus

Enjoy?

 eternalknight
Joined: 8/19/2006
Msg: 85
view profile
History
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 3/14/2007 1:36:32 PM

The beliefs? Bad B-grade pulp sci-fi so bad that Hubbard himself wouldn't have submitted it to a good magazine (hopefully) back in the 40's...then again there was Battlefield Earth (eurgh...chunder).

Quite right.
Hubbard himself bragged that he could make people believe his nonsense, and make tons of cash in the process. For some inexplicable reason he has succeeded.
I think he played upon some people's desire to be privy to occult and esoteric knowledge. Their desire to be one of the chosen few, one of the elite.
He found this weakness in some people and exploited it.
Former scientologists report severe psychological problems such as recurring nightmares after leaving the cult. Something to do with the so-called "auditing" process, or just the harassment they incur from members that don't want them to leave, or maybe a combination of these factors?
 Isispriest
Joined: 12/27/2005
Msg: 86
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 3/14/2007 11:13:02 PM
Moon Man Your Profuse judgements about good humans is offensive and pompous. There is no need to make some holier than thow judgement about everyone with whom you disagree.
That off my chest...
Hubbard and his buddy Jack Parsons were both in the L.A. chapter of the O.T.O. , Ordoro Templar Orientalis, Alster Crowley's religion. Jack P. of course was a brilliant fellow who started the Jet Propulsion Laboratories. Jack P. also wrote some occult books. They were both what some might consider black or at least grey magicians. Hubbard and Jack P.'s "grieving" widow traveled to Florida together soon after Jack died in an unexplained and unsolved explosion in his J.P.L. shop/lab.
I figure Hubbard was a Thelemite black magician, and he was laughing at his devoted followers.
 themadfiddler
Joined: 10/16/2006
Msg: 87
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 3/15/2007 12:11:40 AM

I figure Hubbard was a Thelemite black magician, and he was laughing at his devoted followers.


There's no good evidence to suggest Hubbard was any kind of practicioner of occult magic of any note...while Parsons may have dabbled in OTO based rituals and talked a good game to Crowley through the mail it seems apparent that he soon fell out of favour with the Master Therion...probably, like many of Crowley's (ROFL)less than cagey "disciples", when the money dried up...

From "The Bare-Faced Messiah" at http://www.clambake.org/archive/books/bfm/bfm07.htm


According to Rogers, Parsons never made any secret of his interest in black magic or his involvement with Aleister Crowley. 'He had a voluminous correspondence with Crowley in the library, some of which he showed me. I remember in particular one letter from Crowley which praised and encouraged him for the fine work he was doing in America, and also casually thanked him for his latest donation and intimated that more would shortly be needed. Jack admitted that he was one of Crowley's main sources of money in America.

'I always found Jack's insistence that he believed in, and practised, magic hard to reconcile with his educational and cultural background. At first I thought it was all fun and games, a kick he was on for its shock value to his respectable friends. But after seeing his correspondence with Crowley, and the evidence of his frequent remittances to Crowley, I had to give him the benefit of the doubt.'[7]

...

On 6 March, Parsons sat down to compose a letter to his Satanic Master in England, apprising him of the momentous events that had recently taken place. 'I can hardly tell you or decide how much to write,' he began. 'I am under command of extreme secrecy. I have had the most important, devastating experience of my life . . . I believe it was the result of the IXth degree working [the class of sexual magic designed to produce a higher being] with the girl who answered my elemental summons. I have been in direct touch with One who is most Holy and Beautiful as mentioned in The Book of the Law. I cannot write the name at present. First instructions were received direct through Ron, the seer. I have followed them to the letter. There was a desire for incarnation. I do not yet know the vehicle, but it will come to me bringing a secret sign. I am to act as instructor guardian for nine months; then it will be loosed on the world. That is all I can say now . . .'[21]

Crowley, who was by then in his seventies, chronically addicted to heroin and facing death, was irritated by his disciple's secrecy. On 19 April he despatched a terse reply: 'You have got me completely puzzled by your remarks about the elemental . . . I thought I had a most morbid imagination, as good as any man's, but it seems I have not. I cannot form the slightest idea of what you can possibly mean.' On the same day he wrote to Karl Germer, head of the OTO in the United States: 'Apparently Parsons or Hubbard or somebody is producing a Moonchild. I get fairly frantic when I contemplate the idiocy of these louts.'

While Parsons fretted over Crowley's letter, his faithful scribe was facing more earthly, and much more familiar, problems. Having contributed his meagre savings to Allied Enterprises, Hubbard was badly in need of money. He had written virtually nothing since leaving

_______________
18. Book of Babalon, O.T.O archives, New York
19. ibid.
20. John Parsons, 'Magical Record', O.T.O. archives, New York
21. Symonds, op. cit.


124

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

the Navy and his wife was rapidly losing patience with his repeated excuses as to why he was unable to send any money home to support her and the children.

Polly recognized by this time that there was little chance of saving her marriage. Towards the end of the war, she and Ron had briefly discussed moving to California when he was discharged from the Navy, but Polly refused to uproot the children. She had a nightmare vision of trying to raise a family while trailing forlornly after her husband, backwards and forwards from one coast to the other.[22] Nibs and Katie were happily settled in Bremerton, enjoyed school, and had friends and family all around. Polly had left The Hilltop and moved in with Ron's parents to be closer to the facilities of Bremerton; it was an arrangement she found perfectly satisfactory. Both Harry Hubbard, who had retired from the Navy and found a job as manager of Kitsap County Fair, and his wife enjoyed having their grandchildren around.

But while Polly was content to live with her in-laws, she still needed money to feed and clothe herself and the children and, not unreasonably, she expected her husband to provide it. Ron's problem in this regard was not just that he was broke (nothing unusual), but that he had reached the limit of his credit with the residents of 1003 South Orange Grove Avenue, having borrowed from everyone who was prepared to lend.

In February, the Veterans Administration had awarded him a pension of $11.50 a month for a ten per cent disability caused by his ulcer. Ron did not consider this miserable amount to be nearly sufficient and on 18 March, two weeks after completing his duties as a black magic scribe, he lodged an appeal, producing a dramatic new disability which he had somehow neglected to mention on his original claim form. 'I have lost between sixty and eighty per cent of my vision,' he claimed in a letter typed on his distinctive initialled notepaper, 'and as my profession is that of writer, my present inability to read or use my eyes seriously affects my income. I cannot work either long hours or under the slightest adverse conditions. My income at the present time, due entirely to service connected injuries, is zero. Would you please advise me as to the steps I should take to gain further pension?'[23]

After his years in the Navy, Ron was well aware of the speed with which the wheels of bureaucracy moved and his need for money was urgent. His solution was to persuade Parsons that the time had come to activate Allied Enterprises. Towards the end of April, Ron and Sara [she was only called Betty at South Orange Grove] left for Florida with $10,000 drawn from the Allied Enterprises account at the Pasadena First Trust and Savings Bank. Parsons approved the withdrawal so that the partnership could purchase its first yacht in the

_______________
22. Letter to author from Mrs Catherine Gillespie, November 1986
23. Hubbard file, VA archives

east; it was agreed that Ron and Sara would then either sail it back to California for re-sale, or transport it overland, whichever proved to be cheaper.

It seemed a perfectly simple and sensible business arrangement, although Parsons presumably did not know that on 1 April Ron had written to the Chief of Naval Personnel requesting permission to leave the United States to visit South America and China.[24] However, not many weeks passed before Parsons began to worry, for he heard not a word from either Ron or Sara. He realized, with mounting frustration, that they had gone off with $10,000 of his money and he had little idea of where they might be. He confessed his concern to Louis Culling, another member of the OTO lodge, and swore he was going to get his money back and dissolve the partnership.

The next day Ron telephoned from Florida, reversing the charges. Culling was at South Orange Grove when the call came through and he was amazed to find that Parsons was completely dominated by Hubbard. After what had been said the previous day, Culling expected Parsons to be cool towards his wayward partner at the very least. But Parsons made no mention of his disquiet, did not complain about being kept in the dark and said nothing about dissolving the partnership. He was soon laughing happily into the telephone as if he had not a care in the world and the conversation ended with Parsons saying, 'I hope we shall always be partners, Ron.'

Greatly disturbed, Culling took it upon himself to make some inquiries and on 12 May he wrote to Karl Germer: 'As you may know by this time, Brother John signed a partnership agreement with this Ron and Betty whereby all money earned by the three for life is equally divided between the three. As far as I can ascertain, Brother John has put in all of his money . . . Meanwhile, Ron and Betty have bought a boat for themselves in Miami for about $10,000 and are living the life of Riley, while Brother John is living at rock bottom, and I mean rock bottom. It appears that originally they never secretly intended to bring this boat around to the California coast to sell at a profit, as they told Jack, but rather to have a good time on it on the east coast . . .'[25]

Germer naturally informed Crowley, who replied by cable on 22 May: 'Suspect Ron playing confidence trick. Jack evidently weak fool. Obvious victim prowling swindlers.' In a letter seven days later, Crowley wrote, 'It seems to me on the information of our brethren in California that Parsons has got an illumination in which he has lost all his personal independence. From our brother's account he has given away both his girl and his money. Apparently it is the ordinary confidence trick.'[26]

While Crowley and fellow members of the OTO were already in

_______________
24. L. R. Hubbard navy record
25. O.T.O archives, New York
26. ibid.

agreement that Brother Parsons had been conned, Brother Parsons was painfully arriving at a similar conclusion and at the beginning of June he packed a case and caught a train East, determined to track down the errant lovers and get his money back.

In Miami, Parsons discovered to his astonishment that Allied Enterprises had already purchased three boats - two auxiliary schooners, the Harpoon and the Blue Water II, and a yacht, the Diane. It seemed that Ron had raised mortgages totalling more than $12,000 to buy the schooners.

Parsons traced the Harpoon to Howard Bond's Yacht Harbor on the County Causeway, but there was no sign of either Ron or Sara. The Blue Water was found at the American Ship Building Company docks on the Miami river; again, there was no one on board.

One evening a few days later, Parsons received a telephone call from the harbour. The Harpoon, he was told, had set sail at five o'clock that afternoon, with Ron and Sara on board apparently intent on making an escape. In his Miami hotel room, Parsons donned his magic robes and traced a circle on the floor with his magic wand. At eight o'clock, he stepped into the ring and performed the 'Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram', the preliminary to all magic, followed by a full invocation of Bartzabel, the spirit of Mars, whose help he sought to restrain his fleeing partners. In a letter to Crowley describing his actions, he was able to report a highly satisfactory result: 'At the same time, so far as I can check, his ship was struck by a sudden squall off the coast, which ripped off his sails and forced him back to port, where I took the boat in custody.'[27]

On 1 July, the magician sought redress through more conventional means: he filed suit in the Circuit Court for Dade County, accusing Ron and Sara of breaking the terms of their partnership, dissipating the assets and attempting to abscond.[28] A receiver was appointed to wind up the affairs of Allied Enterprises and a restraining order was placed on the defendants, preventing them from leaving Miami or disposing of any of the partnership's assets.

'Here I am in Miami pursuing the children of my folly,' Parsons wrote gloomily to Crowley on 5 July. 'I have them well tied up. They cannot move without going to jail. However, most of the money has already been dissipated. I will be lucky to salvage $3000 to $5000.'

On 11 July, the three partners signed an agreement, drawn up by Parsons' lawyer, dissolving the partnership. Ron and Sara handed over the Blue Water and the Diane and agreed to pay half Parsons' legal costs. For his part, Parsons allowed Ron and Sara to keep the Harpoon in return for a $2900 promissory note which covered his financial interest in the schooner. Jack Parsons returned to Pasadena satisfied that he had made the best deal he could under the circumstances and

_______________
27. Grant, op. cit.
28. Parsons v. Hubbard & Northrup

not too distressed at the loss of his former lover and his former best friend. He never saw either of them again.

In Miami, Ron and Sara were returned to their accustomed state of penury after their brief fling at the expense of Allied Enterprises. Their most immediate and pressing problem was how to maintain payments on the $4600 mortgage still outstanding on the Harpoon. Ron, who had never allowed money matters to worry him over-much, clung to the belief that he would eventually be able to wheedle a larger pension from the Veterans Administration. On 4 July, Independence Day, he had spent part of the holiday composing yet another stirring appeal against his pension award and introducing a further hitherto unmentioned disability, this time a 'chronic and incapacitating bone infection'.

On the claim form, he painted a harrowing picture of a veteran gamely struggling against disabilities which he rated at one hundred per cent. His original duodenal ulcer had mysteriously multiplied; his 'ulcers', he pointed out, had caused him to abandon his old profession of 'ship-master and explorer' and severely hampered his work as a writer. 'I can do nothing involving nervous strain without becoming dangerously ill.' As for his failing eyesight, he now found it difficult to read for more than three or four minutes without suffering from headaches, making it virtually impossible for him to do any research. His problems had begun, he noted, after 'prolonged exposure to tropical sunlight in the Pacific'. Furthermore, he was lame as the result of a bone infection in his right hip, contracted at Princeton University because of 'the sudden transition from the tropics to the slush and icy cold of Princeton'. He was unable to walk without suffering severely.

'My earning power, due to injuries, all service connected,' he concluded, 'has dropped to nothing. I earned one thousand dollars a month prior to the war as a writer. I cannot now earn money as a writer and attempts to find other employment have failed because of my physical condition.'

To support his case, Hubbard persuaded Sara to write to the Veterans Administration as an old friend to provide independent corroboration of his rapidly deteriorating health. She put her parents address in Pasadena on the top of the letter.

'I have known Lafayette Ronald Hubbard for many years,' she began, inauspiciously and untruthfully, 'and wish to testify as to the condition of his health as I have observed it since his separation from the Navy.

'Before the war, he was an extremely energetic person in excellent health and spirits . . . Since his return in December last year he is entirely changed. He cannot read because of his eyes, which give him
much pain. He is rather lame and cannot take his accustomed hikes . . . He has tried to work at three different jobs and each he has had to leave because of an increase in his stomach condition. He seems to need an enormous amount of rest . . .

'I do not know what he is going to do for income when his own meagre savings are exhausted, because I see no chance of his condition improving to a point where he can regain his old standards. He is becoming steadily worse, his health impaired again by economic worries . . .'[29]

In fact, a short-term solution to his economic worries was immediately and obviously at hand: the Harpoon. Faced with the impossibility of repaying the mortgage, Ron decided to sell the boat in the hope of clearing his most pressing debts. Solvent again, temporarily at least, he asked Sara to marry him. She accepted unhesitatingly. At the beginning of August the lovers left Florida and caught a train for Washington DC. On 10 August 1946, twenty-one-year-old Sara Northrup and L. Ron Hubbard were married in a simple ceremony at Chestertown, Maryland.

By a curious coincidence, Chestertown was only thirty miles from Elkton, where L. Ron Hubbard had married Polly Grubb in 1933. Sara knew nothing of Polly and had no idea that her new husband had been previously married. Still less did she know he had never been divorced.

Similarly, Polly, in Bremerton, had yet to learn her husband was a bigamist.

Back at South Orange Grove in Pasadena, Parsons sold the old mansion for development and moved into the coach-house with his scarlet woman, Marjorie Cameron, whom he subsequently married. It was to be a tragically brief alliance. On the afternoon of Friday 20 June 1952, Parsons was working alone in the garage of the coachhouse, which he had converted into a laboratory. At eight minutes past five there was an enormous explosion. The heavy stable doors were blasted from their hinges, the walls blew out and a huge hole was torn in the floor timbers. When the dust had cleared, a partially dismembered body could be seen still bleeding in the rubble.

Further horror was to follow. Police traced Parsons's mother, Mrs Ruth Virginia Parsons, to the home of a crippled woman friend in West Glenarm Street. Informed of the accident and her son's death, Mrs Parsons returned to the room where her friend was sitting in an armchair. She sat down in another chair out of reach, unscrewed a bottle of sleeping tablets and, watched by her helpless and appalled friend, rapidly swallowed the entire contents. Unable to move from her chair, the terrified cripple watched her friend slowly die.[30]

_______________
29. Hubbard file, VA archives.
30. Pasadena Star News, 21 June 1952 and 5 July 1952

The inquest found that the explosion had been caused by Parsons accidentally dropping a phial of nitro-glycerine. But because of his known interest in the occult, there were inevitably rumours of suicide or even murder; none of his friends could believe that a man so experienced in handling explosives would have dropped nitro-glycerine accidentally.

Whatever the truth, no black magician could have wished for a blacker departure from the world.


Yeahhhh...so there we have it. Con man screws over friend for girlfriend and life savings, is mutually described by Crowley al0ng with Parson's as "American louts." Then Parson's "accidently" drops the nitroglycerine...then mom suicides with sleeping pills...

Some years later we will find L. Ron's drug riddled bloated corpse as the vultures move in to take over the business he founded but was now to addled to run...

If that's an example of an occult success story, I'll pass. I'd say the operation was NOT a success, unless they meant to fall under the swift sword of Horus...in which case, job well done. Watch that Abyss edge...sometimes they leave banana peels lying around.
 Isispriest
Joined: 12/27/2005
Msg: 88
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 3/15/2007 1:29:24 AM
Thank You Mad Fiddler. So greatful for your literate input.
Seems to give some creedence to my theory.
 eternalknight
Joined: 8/19/2006
Msg: 89
view profile
History
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 3/15/2007 9:09:32 AM

If that's an example of an occult success story, I'll pass. I'd say the operation was NOT a success, unless they meant to fall under the swift sword of Horus...in which case, job well done. Watch that Abyss edge...sometimes they leave banana peels lying around.

L.Ron had dabbled in black magic it seems to gain money, power, fame,....
This could explain his ability to effectively lie, cheat, steal, and generally con people into giving him money to learn the "secrets" of scientology, and the apparent spiritual influence and hold that the cult seems to have over it's followers.
Very informative, thanks fiddler.
 themadfiddler
Joined: 10/16/2006
Msg: 90
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 3/15/2007 11:12:59 AM


L.Ron had dabbled in black magic it seems to gain money, power, fame,....
This could explain his ability to effectively lie, cheat, steal, and generally con people into giving him money to learn the "secrets" of scientology, and the apparent spiritual influence and hold that the cult seems to have over it's followers.
Very informative, thanks fiddler.


Don't read too much into Hubbard's participation...you can see from his scorn of Parsons' and his swift use of Parsons' money and girlfriend that he was more interested in the peripheral lifestyle than the actual practices. If you read the actual article this becomes clear. He lifts what little he wants - mostly the use of hypnosis - but no actual magical practice remains in Scientology. The only advantage Hubbard likely saw to magic was the ability to use it to encourage some of the wives of the JPL swingers into what they might view as kinky sex because it could be under the guise of a "spiritual practice". Parsons' was clearly serious, if misguided

His ability had nothing to do with black magic...just being a fast talking con man. This persisted from his early years to his death as a viewing of his extant documents and review of his biographies makes "clear" - and how I love using that word in reference to him when he was anything but clear. People's willingness to buy into it are more easily explained by the Barnum principle.
 themadfiddler
Joined: 10/16/2006
Msg: 96
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 7/30/2007 9:34:51 PM

I thought I'd drop in let the silent readers know that if they are tired of these kinds of attitudes in forum, they might reply - not to argue and get in the mud with them, but just drop a response to let other readers know that they are only a small handful and not the majority by any means.


So what you seem to be saying then, is instead of replying with some form of cogent argument and supporting it with some kind of documentary evidence to back up a point, it's just easier to tar the lot with an ad hominem attack, calling it rumour and innuendo and trash, and then appeals to the majority, emotion, etc.

The very reason freedom of speech is so important is so that one can hold and make an unpopular assertion and attempt to defend it in an articulate way. What you seem to suggest runs counter to that by littering the field with logical fallacy.


Freedom of speech is too often abused for the purpose of harming others with lies and protecting those who would so harm.


Not dissimilar to $cientology's misrepresentation of psychiatry, pharmacology, and medicine?

Why do you suppose the German legal system, noted for it's monolithic precision and meticulous examination of law decided to ban $cientology with it's borders? Pique?
It is a fact, not an opinion that this organization was convicted of criminal offenses in Canada...it has the distinction of being the only "church" with that record.
 Vancer
Joined: 10/29/2006
Msg: 99
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 5/25/2008 2:13:09 PM
Apparently it costs roughtly $20,000 US to reach OTIII, and start hearing about this Lord Xenu and his hydrogen bombs.

I like this video too.
http://www.xenutv.com/
 whitegold765
Joined: 12/26/2007
Msg: 101
Your thoughts on the Church of Scientology
Posted: 5/26/2008 12:55:26 AM
People keep saying "it works" and "it's powerful" but as best I can see it's complete nonsense.

I mean... the whole "thetans" thing makes no sense on its own, and how can you not ask or want to know what engrams are? The science behind it is so shonky until "explained" by the full Xenu story.

I have actually been to a scientology office once. They were doing IQ and personality tests. They're actually pretty good at that stuff. Their tests revealed that I'm highly intelligent, and with a great deal of unfulfilled potential.

lol, I could have told them that.
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