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 AUTHOR
 markusmarkus
Joined: 2/20/2007
Msg: 4
Is A.A. useles ?Page 1 of 2    (1, 2)
For a addict whatever works works that is the simple part to recovery. A.A. can help if you are a person need to have many people around you all the time given you support.
 plentyofrick
Joined: 11/30/2006
Msg: 7
Is A.A. useles ?
Posted: 2/27/2007 1:52:26 PM

Shockingly, for a well established organization that's been around for over 70 years, A.A. cannot provide any data, or statistics to prove their system's effectiveness.


Alcoholics Anonymous: "Anonymous", get it, how could anyone get stats on an Anonymous organization? I'm pretty sure if they asked A.A to provide them they'd get a great big "sorry, we don't do that" (read the 12 traditions). I can't imagine how anyone could collect statistics on A.A, no records, no way to keep track (how do you keep track of people? first names?, last initials? since people are only referred to by their first name and initial of their last name).


Founded in 1935 and with an estimated membership of two million in more than 180 countries, one would imagine that there are reams of scientific data showing the effectiveness of the AA philosophy, or that AA would initiate clinical studies of its own to prove its value. Not so: No official membership or attendance records are kept at any level. An internal document, prepared in 1990 based on the last five of AA’s triennial surveys of a random sample of a portion of its members, showed that after one year, a mere five percent of people who joined AA remained with the program.


read the 12 traditions, it will explain why no official records are kept if you don't understand the term "Anonymous"

yet there are 2 million members in 180 countries. seems something is working.

your statistics SUGGEST, but don't prove a thing.

Spontaniously abandon their addiction? ever been addicted to anything? nothing spontanious about it.

seems that you base your judgements on stats which are questionable at best and no real world experiance.
 I like it real....
Joined: 8/27/2006
Msg: 9
Is A.A. useles ?
Posted: 2/27/2007 5:27:53 PM
^^^^ good for you honey! I completely agree!!!

I have a number of friends that work a recovery program EVERYDAY,
have have also had the pleasure of meeting many at dances, get-togethers
etc....that work a 12 step EVERYDAY.

Although I am not in a 12 step program, have been to many where ppl have had upwards to 30+ years clean and sober....it all has to do with WORKING THE PROGRAM
the way it was intended.

What I have found is that once the program basis is there, that it allows ppl to truley over come WHY it is they have the addiction in the first place. I find the majority of ppl with addictions are suppressing feelings...and mostly from their youth. Society has a difficult time putting "emotional" words to their feelings, and have also been told repeatedly NOT to show their feelings as well. Out of suppression CAN come addiction.

Not everything in life can have "stats"
Not everything in life can be based on complete science either.
Sometimes it's simply about faith and acceptance!
 Buh-Bye!
Joined: 10/21/2006
Msg: 10
Is A.A. useles ?
Posted: 2/27/2007 6:04:15 PM

It's a practical program based on anonymity and rigorous honesty. It works if you work it honestly.


Excelent point, Nicki, well said!
 plentyofrick
Joined: 11/30/2006
Msg: 14
Is A.A. useles ?
Posted: 2/28/2007 1:28:21 PM
the only people who actually can understand alcoholism are alcoholics.

Science gave us cures "better living through electricity(shock therapy)", "better living through chemicals (change their addiction from alcohol to Valium)" and my favorite, lock them up in asylums because their crazy.
AA is designed to work for anyone, as long as they are willing to be rigorously honest about it. That is where the failure happens , not everyone has the balls to be honest about dealing with their problems.
I've been through a few different "recovery models" and it's funny, but the last thing most tell you is find an AA meeting and attend regularly.

but hey thats only my opinion and experience (based on 25 years of drinking and 17 years of sobriety, thanks to AA.), which probably doesn't compare to reading a few articles here and there.


PS: you spell useless with 2 S' not 1
 I like it real....
Joined: 8/27/2006
Msg: 16
Is A.A. useles ?
Posted: 2/28/2007 6:39:08 PM
^^^^^ you were correct IMO in your previous post when you mentioned
using a 12 step whether you are an addict or not.

As I mentioned before I have friends in recovery......
from their craziness, can enlightenment for me.

Never realized I was co-dependent before....and I can SOOOOO recognize it when
I veer towards it again.

I have the "acceptance" verse on my front door...that way everyday I leave my
house I remember to ACCEPT things the way they are....and to try not to get
bent out of shape when things go differently than I think they should be.

I tell alot of my patients, if we were taught a program, such as the 12 step AA, when we were younger....I seriously don't think we'd have as many messed up people in society
as we do now. Accountability, and acceptance are a huge part of life...and there are FAR to many ppl who don't know anything thing about how to practice either one
 poppapump
Joined: 8/31/2004
Msg: 17
Is A.A. useles ?
Posted: 3/1/2007 10:24:13 PM
AA is a proven program IT WORKS IF U WORK IT they do not keep records that would be against tradition the second A stands for what u see here what u hear here stays here if u keep comming back u will get a mircule dont leave before it happen 20 years sober for this drunk
 plentyofrick
Joined: 11/30/2006
Msg: 21
Is A.A. useless ?
Posted: 3/2/2007 11:42:00 AM
^^^
so what your saying is the view from the outside is the same as the view from within. NOT SO.....If you haven't lived it, you will never understand what it's actually like to be an alcoholic. You can watch, and see the external traits/reactions but you will never gain the first hand knowledge of the battles that rage inside, that only comes with the direct experience of living it.
Oh and we are not talking cancer we are talking alcoholism, different kettle of fish, mine was not a generalization, it was a simple statement, no hidden meanings, pretty clearly written, "the only people who actually can understand alcoholism are alcoholics". see nothing written between the lines, no mention of cancer, broccolis, elephants, or even ferrets.
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