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Show ALL Forums  > Technology/Computers  > 20 years and zero progress      Home login  
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 rsx11s
Joined: 3/28/2007
Msg: 1
20 years and zero progressPage 1 of 1    
Every time your computer gets faster Microsoft adds more features that use up all this new computing power. Now, things like games and video editing need all that power but what about real world things like word processing?

Here's an article that shows a 21 year old mac is no slower running word than the latest whiz-bang PC. Hysterical.

http://hubpages.com/hub/_86_Mac_Plus_Vs_07_AMD_DualCore_You_Wont_Believe_Who_Wins

I helped work on a word processor in 1979 and remember that the mid 80s macs were not really any faster if at all so it's actually worse than it appears from the article. Har.
 andyman35
Joined: 8/19/2004
Msg: 2
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20 years and zero progress
Posted: 5/31/2007 2:40:37 PM
Microsoft can never be accused of lean coding,the term bloatware was created just for them. The ridiculous resource requirements of Vista,most of which is unnecessary bells and whistles,shows this isn't going to change soon.
 Wrenchspinner
Joined: 10/19/2004
Msg: 3
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20 years and zero progress
Posted: 6/1/2007 6:59:12 PM
As a relative noob to the world of 'puters (10yrs online now, but the 1st 5 with WebTv!) and one who uses mine more for pleasure than function I truly am amazed at the marvels it avails me. Without all the bells and whistles and added system functionality all my whiz bang hardware allows me it wouldn't have near the appeal to me it does currently.

If all I wanted my machine to do was send/receive emails or allow me to generate documents like my automotive how-tos a machine from long ago would easily take care of that.

But ... I want it to serve up my music colection as a constant backdrop for my online escapades and truly I use it as a music system for the times I'm not online and I want it to do so with astounding clarity and precision, which it does.

I want it to be able to maintain a decent online presence with at times multiple browsers and tabs in each browser running simultaneously, have my email system runnin with the capability to DL and display any links/files or video clips attached to the mail I receive, and be able to also rip/encode audio or video files or burn CD/DVD discs all at the same time.

Now to be completely honest, is there a real need to be capable of doin all this at the same time ? The answer to that question would have to be a big NO. However, since I finally have a system capable of doin all this at once and do so on a fairly regular basis I really can't see why I shouldn't :>)

I can see how cats who've been in the IT industry or simply involved with computers in general can bemoan the use of all the computing power at our fingertips today compared to twenty yrs ago and how all the GUI driven bells and whistles in the OSes of today are so efficient at consuming all that power for nothing but our own pleasure and simplicity, but really, isn't that kinda just the real nature of "things" in general?

I can look at a Ferarri/Lamborghini/McLaren owner and complain about how they'll likely never use the machines they covet for the purposes I would if they were mine, but the fact still remains that their equipment will just flat out blow away my ride any time they CHOOSE to do so.

Is there a need for a car that is capable of hittin 200mph when there are truly only a few places on the whole planet where they could run them at such a speed ? Again, not really, but I sure wish I had one of those cars so I could mercilessly obliterate every speed limit I could find ! So .... there is at least a comparison that can be drawn, although in my mind it seemd more clear than once I hammered it out on the ol keeboard

Anyhoosal, I'll take all the bells and whistles I can get, but ONLY if they come with a "no cost at all" to my systems speed and versatility and the hardware/software folks just keep handin out tickets to an ever more impressive show .... and bein a good little consumer, I'm takin care of my part of the equation

Kim
 shryko
Joined: 10/21/2006
Msg: 4
20 years and zero progress
Posted: 6/1/2007 9:44:24 PM
I'm with Kim... I want some bells and whistles...

but unlike Kim, I want my machine from 5 years ago to be more than enough (except for the graphics-glory of the most recent games... which mean top-of-the-line is only at the "required" level, not "recommended" )

that in mind, I want to upgrade on my own at this point (as multi-tasking is starting to be a pain...)
besides, I've found I like Kubuntu, and as such, I only want windows in a virtual machine, so I can do my gaming ^_^

a 386 is a perfect home firewall/router nowadays... you can install linux on it, and configure it as you like, and it'll possibly have power to spare!
a pentium is perfect for a email server... or network attached hard drive space...

but if you want gaming, you pretty much need a middle-high end system every 3 years.

we're at the plateau in computing power, though, as quad core will be over-kill for most consumers, and they'll most likely stop upgrading as such... soon, only specialists will need to upgrade (after all, I don't know about you, but I don't do much video editing...)

that in mind, the new/cool factor will keep it going, as commercialism eats democracy, and society's overconsumption cause it to consume itself...... and fyi, I'm not just a raving nutcase, I got that from a thoroughly researched book... "Consumed" by Benjamin R. Barber
 Wrenchspinner
Joined: 10/19/2004
Msg: 5
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20 years and zero progress
Posted: 6/2/2007 10:53:49 AM
Really the analogy I was "attempting" to draw to was that super cars and super computers are both overkill in their ability to perform the functions they were actually designed for, yet car guys and computer guys still tend to enjoy 'em just the same :>)

And .... just for pure D kicks I decided to see just how long it actually did take for everything I have installed to boot up and load from a "power off" state on my machine : 33 seconds from pushin the button to the log in screen, and .... that's with "quick boot" disabled in the BIOS :>)

But .... I can take the above mentioned boot time and about $3.00 and head to Starbucks and get a cup of fresh joe

The real difference between the system I have today relevent to the one I started with about 5 yrs ago is that with my 1st system I could click on the power button and head to Starbucks, get that same cup of joe and get back just about the time it finally loaded everything and was ready to log in !
 rsx11s
Joined: 3/28/2007
Msg: 6
20 years and zero progress
Posted: 6/3/2007 11:35:31 AM
OS's today are written in C. C++ is not a suitable choice for this for a number of reasons. This doesn't stop some people of course.

One C statement translates into a small number of machine instructions. C++ has the nasty property, because it's just a preprocessor, that one C++ statement breaks down into a bunch of C statements when then...

VB is not an option for an OS any more than it was for process control stuff 15 years ago. It's just too bloated. And there's things you can't do that you need to.

Now, having said all that what is the OS? I suspect you may be thinking about the GUI here instead. Really only the kernel is the OS. The rest are just apps to a kernel programmer.

You can write an OS in anything. How big, fast and powerfull it is does to some extent depends on the language used.
 Wrenchspinner
Joined: 10/19/2004
Msg: 7
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20 years and zero progress
Posted: 6/3/2007 4:59:21 PM
I hear ya there buddy and it's all good I assure ya :>)

Ok, so as a fair test I tried exactly what you mentioned and discovered joy in opening a desktop file from "power" off to fruition in 00:01:18. I know this isn't stellar by some systems standards but it is a bit quicker than I was previously used to before rebuilding my machine recently.

I don't pretend to be smart enough to have a clue if the 360+ gigs of data on my drives really plays any part in how long it takes or really what all does figure in to how long it takes to finally get to a desktop file.

What exactly does figure into the equation ? My inquiring mind is always curious about such things

Kim
 obviousman
Joined: 10/17/2006
Msg: 8
20 years and zero progress
Posted: 6/8/2007 6:36:29 PM
Actually, we've made plenty of progress, mostly in the world of interconnectivity. Sure, apps run the same speed (I kn0w, the fastest computer I ever owned was a 10 megahertz 286 running dos 5), but the real change has been in the A/V realm, storage, and information availability. Video processors have to run all kinds of stuff; various internet connections, now so reliable we take them for granted, give us streaming video so we can have real time conferencing. I threw away all my reference material, all those cd encyclopedias. Everything's available on the net. VOIP brings new discounts in phone use. Calling overseas used to cost a fortune, enriching the phone companies. Not anymore. Information portability, sharing of documents, programs, music, films, the average person has many more options than we used to. Monopolies on data are disappearing even as M$ tries to put DRM into the operating systems. The average person can now create a dvd, burn it, and share it with everyone at pennies per disk. As fast as 'the establishment' creates ways to keep things from us, 'free range' hackers break it down. Pirated programs let us truly test drive programs before laying out cash for stuff that sucks. I haven't had to pay for 'shelfware' since kazaa. I try it, and if I find I can use it, I buy it. Before, I wasted hundreds of dollars a year on programs that didn't do what the box said it did. Online reviews and forums help us fix our own problems without idiots at 'tech support' who don't know their a$$ from their elbow. Thanks to the pressure from file sharing, the music industry has finally had to sell their 'hits' for a reasonable price individually, we no longer have to waste our money buying a cd full of filler music just to get one song. If an artist won't agree to sell the songs individually, their music shows up on the file sharing networks and gets taken for free. So yes, we have progress. I think you get the idea.
 rsx11s
Joined: 3/28/2007
Msg: 9
20 years and zero progress
Posted: 6/9/2007 1:28:29 AM
All good points, but look at how many people do video editing compared to how many use a word processor or perhaps web browser as their most complex application. I agree a 10 year old mac isn't for everybody. Just 90% of the computer using public.
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