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 mona_lena
Joined: 5/4/2005
Msg: 1
who are feminists? Page 1 of 9    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9)
feminism has its place of birth. It since has disrupted human instincts. It demolished marriages and families. It destroyed the natural role of men and woman. It destroys countries and the world at the end.
 Dell
Joined: 1/21/2004
Msg: 2
who are feminists?
Posted: 5/23/2005 8:19:35 AM
It wasn't feminism that disrupted the roles of men and women it was the advent of civilization. Read a book.
 Flynndanarra
Joined: 5/14/2005
Msg: 3
view profile
History
who are feminists?
Posted: 5/23/2005 7:25:10 PM
*shaking my head*

You know, I almost can't believe that I am bothering to respond to this because most people who think this way are either #1 looking for an arguement to entertain themselves, and/or #2 too stuck in their own beliefs to bother listening to what a feminist has to say.

I am a feminist. I was married for 9 years. My marriage did not end as a result of my feminist politics.

The feminists that I know are a diverse group. Some are married, some are not, they are straight, lesbian, bi, they are followers of various religions, etc... NONE of them that I have met have any problem with traditional marriage as a lifestyle choice. If a women chooses to marry a man and be a stay at home mom and she feels fullfilled and purposeful in her life, we all will encourage her and be happy for her in her choices! Feminism is about equality, and about the right to choose what we do with our lives.

Feminism has not demolished marriages or famillies. There were marriages and famillies in trouble long before feminism. Feminist run crisis centers and shelters HAVE allowed women to access the resources that they need to escape abusive marriages and to make a new safe, life for themselves. Feminism has given women more choices, so that it is no longer assumed that a little girl will grow up get married, be a mommy and maybe either a secretary a teacher or a nurse.

What may I ask is "the natural role of men and women"? Men and women hold different traditional roles depending on which cultural background you are looking at. The western view of traditional rols as determined by a patriarchal culture are not universal and never have been. Every man and every woman is born a unique being with unique interests and abilities. Taking this into account, should not our "natural roles" be determined by this things instead of the type, shape and size of our genitalia?
 hamnetsghost
Joined: 5/14/2005
Msg: 4
who are feminists?
Posted: 5/23/2005 10:34:21 PM
I can never understand why any woman would not want to be known as a feminist.
 Flynndanarra
Joined: 5/14/2005
Msg: 5
view profile
History
who are feminists?
Posted: 5/24/2005 7:18:39 AM
"most take things way too far"

On what evidence do you base this statement?
 Dell
Joined: 1/21/2004
Msg: 6
who are feminists?
Posted: 5/24/2005 7:52:29 AM
I don't like the word feminist soley because of the negative press it usually receives. I prefer humanist.
 lil8t
Joined: 4/18/2005
Msg: 7
who are feminists?
Posted: 5/24/2005 1:09:28 PM
Or men leaving their wives to make due when the times weren't reday for females in the work force.
 mona_lena
Joined: 5/4/2005
Msg: 8
who are feminists?
Posted: 5/24/2005 2:30:23 PM
here we go,


In no other countries has Politically Correct feminism gained such power as in the Anglo- American world, especially in the U.S. and Canada (which is itself interesting: why have European women largely declined to fight in the War Against Men?). As a consequence, we have here what is almost certainly the highest divorce rate in the world, a crumbling educational system, and a seemingly unstoppable spiral of rising crime and related social pathology. Recent studies demonstrate a powerful correlation between this social pathology
and the children of fatherless families

The breakdown in the family, therefore, forms a basic part of a generalized crisis in Western society that shows little sign of abating. The feminist lobby is intensifying its attack on the family and precisely those values.

Today in the West we live in what has become known as the "condom culture," where an Anglican bishop of London can pronounce adultery to be not a sin but simply an act of unkindness; where a number of Western countries legally recognize homosexual marriages and "homosexual parenthood," where the number of childless couples and unmarried mothers is soaring. Where all this can be accepted with relatively little protest, the antics of gender-feminists and their friends are regarded with tolerant amusement and even sympathy".
 GMCAcadia
Joined: 5/6/2004
Msg: 9
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History
who are feminists?
Posted: 5/24/2005 3:26:23 PM
Okay I need asprin for reading this whole thread... What does this have to do with being Single Parents???
 mona_lena
Joined: 5/4/2005
Msg: 10
who are feminists?
Posted: 5/24/2005 3:45:25 PM
Mopegunz,

Maybe you understand it better once you are divorced. Your profile did say that you are married! LOL
 GMCAcadia
Joined: 5/6/2004
Msg: 11
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History
who are feminists?
Posted: 5/24/2005 3:54:20 PM
Yeah I'm Married to a Feminist... So what of it??? Women have their place right along side of Men, not behind them...

I still don't see what Feminists have to do with Single Parents???
 shore66
Joined: 5/23/2004
Msg: 12
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/11/2005 6:29:39 PM

Hmm femnazis




I think this term should be banned from the forums. It is deeply offensive. It trivializes the death and suffering of millions at the hands of an evil regime. And it insults the efforts of women to gain for themselves the freedoms and opportunities that men accept as their birthright.
 shore66
Joined: 5/23/2004
Msg: 13
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/11/2005 10:47:26 PM

Also I am very against any form of banning and will fight tooth and nail any one who wants to impede my right to free speech.




Racial and personal slurs are not allowed on here, and I feel this term is equally offensive. Nazism is no joke, and I don't think your right to free speech (which on here is at the discretion of POF anyway) would be compromised by not tarring people with such an ugly brush.
 shore66
Joined: 5/23/2004
Msg: 14
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/11/2005 11:05:00 PM

However, what the word is trying to convey is the shocking similarity between the WAY the Nazis thought and the way ***HARDCORE*** feminists think. I don't know anyone who has used this term in reference to women that want to pursue a career, vote, gain equal pay etc.

The people like those I mentioned before show all the signs of Nazi-type thinking. The find a population to blame for their problems and incite hatred towards that group using intimidation and manipulation. Not very nice stuff. ['quote]



I find this type of extremist comparison difficult to understand. First, just who do you identify as "hardcore" feminists? Where have they proposed concentration camps and wholesale murder? Are they armed and dangerous, and thus able to use "intimidation and manipulation" against whole populations?

The Nazis and the war they inflicted on Europe caused the deaths of millions, and suffering for millions more. THAT is the "evil regime" of which I spoke. Tell me what feminists have done to compare with that.
 shore66
Joined: 5/23/2004
Msg: 15
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/12/2005 8:41:43 AM

I am saying that they use similar tactics to Nazis, and hence cause a rather natural comparison to be formed.





Yes, you see jackbooted feminists everywhere, goosestepping down the boulevards, forcing innocent people onto trains to death camps.




The term you are talking about is characterizing an attitude and approach that certain people have that has very real parallels between another group of people.




This is done all the time, without the perpetrators being called Nazis. Look at the hysteria around gay marriage. "The find a population to blame for their problems and incite hatred towards that group using intimidation and manipulation."



Personal slurs are attacks on people that have no justification or relevance.




I think calling someone a Nazi is an insult of the worst kind . Nazism is not just a "way of thinking," it represents a historical reality of evil of the highest order. When someone promotes genocide, then perhaps the term can be justified.
 shore66
Joined: 5/23/2004
Msg: 16
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/12/2005 9:27:41 AM
Did you read MY posts?


And you still can't see why being compared to genocidal murderers is cruelly offensive?
 shore66
Joined: 5/23/2004
Msg: 17
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/12/2005 9:44:00 AM
As I asked before, I would like the names of the "hardcore" feminists you mention - and perhaps a reference or two to some specific speech or article that you object to.
 ManeRider
Joined: 5/22/2005
Msg: 18
view profile
History
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/12/2005 9:54:12 AM
SHore

WE've met before..

Those hardcore feminist's that seem to be ruining things for the rest are, as mentioned, M. Burk, G. Steinham, M. Dowd, although Dowd has incredible writing skills (Nobel winner).

Feminism is gone ummuck. Nothing is gender neutral, anymore, it's all about me, and feminism, not women wanting the vote or a chance to earn my own way. It's a power grab, and it's become a nasty habit of degrading the other gender. I believe you read my post on feminism, which was scratched, but when feminism has brought on disgusting t-shirts for children to wear, denouncing their opposite gender, children who don't even know what a gender is.,...and no gender equivalent for the boys...it's gone ummuck. Yuck. Feminism is not equal to humanism.... "a woman without a man is like a fish without a bicycle"....this is truly a degrading remark, typical of classic Steinham theory.
 ManeRider
Joined: 5/22/2005
Msg: 19
view profile
History
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/12/2005 10:00:49 AM
SHore (or anyone interested)

Check out

www.humaneventsonline.com/article.php?id=7713

What have feminist done to American Fathers, Phyllis Schafly

read it and weap
 Goddard
Joined: 2/17/2005
Msg: 20
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/12/2005 1:20:55 PM
Are they armed and dangerous, and thus able to use "intimidation and manipulation" against whole populations?

Let's see. Have you seen their last attempt of jailing people because of what they call "hate speech" (Status of Women Canada (SWC) - Proposed criminal prosecution of people who talks against feminism under the "Hate Speech" law)? I'd say it can be classified as intimidation and manipulation.

The Nazis and the war they inflicted on Europe caused the deaths of millions, and suffering for millions more. THAT is the "evil regime" of which I spoke. Tell me what feminists have done to compare with that.

Abortion on demand? More than 40 millions of human beings aborted only in the US? Demand for last trimester abortions, where the child's head is drilled and its brain sucked? That's more human beings dead than what the Nazis did. In fact, the word feminazi may be offensive...for the nazis.
 Goddard
Joined: 2/17/2005
Msg: 21
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/12/2005 1:26:35 PM
About references, there are "The SCUM Manifesto" by Valerie Solanas, or any of Andrea Dworkin's ramblings, or the last proposal "The Sperm Stops Here" from Kim Gandy.

This last one is a proposal stating that every man over 14 should be clinically castrated, and only allowed to have children if they can present a request signed by a woman willing to have a children -and if granted, such permission will be valid for one year or until the woman is pregnant, being the man immediately re-castrated after it- is something that not even the most evil Nazi would have thought.

And who proposed it is not any "fringe, extremist, not-representative" feminist, but the president of the National Organization of Women. I'd say that's mainstream enough.
 Flynndanarra
Joined: 5/14/2005
Msg: 22
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History
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/12/2005 3:01:00 PM
oh for goodness sakes tango, that last one is comedy. It is not meant to be taken seriously. It is very dark humour and is meant to make a point but seriously, feminists do not want all men castrated!

I have not read the SCUM manifesto and will have to look it up.

I do beleive that Andrea Dworkin was a great woman and she will be sorely missed among her friends and fellow feminists.
 Goddard
Joined: 2/17/2005
Msg: 23
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/12/2005 3:13:30 PM
I suppose that if I wrote an essay about how every woman should be made available to every man since she's 14, and if she doesn't want to put out, she should be raped until she learns her place, and then I say that it was just a joke, you would laugh the same.

What she wrote wasn't a joke. It was a "feeler". It means, make the proposal, and when people cries their outrage, just say it was a joke. But the seed is already planted. Sorry, no.

About "All sex is rape" Dworkin, yes, she will be missed among feminists. Only among them.
 HalftimeDad
Joined: 5/29/2005
Msg: 24
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/12/2005 4:52:38 PM
Dworkin never said " All sex is rape," or "all penetration is rape," or any such nonsense. Just a bit of propoganda put out to discredit her and it worked. I don't agree with Andrea Dworkin, but she wasn't the fanatic she's often portrayed as. Successful women may not identify themselves as feminists, but they couldn't be successful women without feminism. I've encountered feminism taken too far - remember the "all men are potential rapists" crap that was around in the 80's - but feminism is a vital element of the human rights movement.
 Goddard
Joined: 2/17/2005
Msg: 25
who are feminists?
Posted: 6/12/2005 5:21:07 PM
"Men are rapists, batterers, plunderers, killers; these same men are religious prophets, poets, heroes, figures of romance, adventure, accomplishment, figures ennobled by tragedy and defeat. Men have claimed the earth, called it "Her". Men ruin Her. Men have airplanes, guns, bombs, poisonous gases, weapons so perverse and deadly that they defy any authentically human imagination."
Pornography: Men Possessing Women - Andrea Dworkin
"The traditional flowers of courtship are the traditional flowers of the grave, delivered to the victim before the kill. The cadaver is dressed up and made up and laid down and ritually violated and consecrated to an eternity of being used."
- Andrea Dworkin
"Men renounce whatever they have in common with women so as to experience no commonality with women; and what is left...is one piece of flesh a few inches long, the penis. The penis is the man; the man is human; the penis signifies humanity."
- Andrea Dworkin
"I want to see a man beaten to a bloody pulp with a high-heel shoved in his mouth, like an apple in the mouth of a pig."
Ice And Fire - Andrea Dworkin
"On the Left, on the Right, in the Middle; Authors, statesmen, thieves; so-called humanists and self-declared fascists; the adventurous and the contemplative, in every realm of male expression and action, violence is experienced and articulated as love and freedom."
Pornography: Men Possessing Women - Andrea Dworkin
"Heterosexual intercourse is the pure, formalized expression of contempt for women's bodies."
- Andrea Dworkin
"The cultural institutions which embody and enforce those interlocked aberrations - for instance, law, art, religion, nation-states, the family, tribe, or commune based on father-right - these institutions are real and they must be destroyed."
- Andrea Dworkin
"Marriage as an institution developed from rape as a practice. Rape, originally defined as abduction, became marriage by capture. Marriage meant the taking was to extend in time, to be not only use of but possession of, or ownership."
"In a patriarchal society, all heterosexual intercourse is rape because women, as a group, are not strong enough to give meaningful consent."
- Andrea Dworkin

Yes, in all those quotes I can see that she wasn't the fanatic she's often portrayed as. I also can see how it is a vital element of the human rights movement (specially of unborn human babies). I suppose they should be grateful.
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