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 Author Thread: Parents who have lost a child
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 41 (view)
Parents who have lost a child
Posted: 1/16/2013 8:01:23 PM
When I saw this thread, I wasn't sure I'd be able to answer it. Next month will be ten years since I lost my daughter. She was only a few hours old when she passed. She had a medical condition called polycystic kidneys. The doctors diagnosed the condition when we went in to have the first ultrasound. They said it would be fatal and asked us if we wanted to abort the pregnancy. We talked and my now ex-wife and I both voted not to do a parent, you never want to give up on your child and you always have hope they're wrong.

The day came when she was born. She was brought into the hospital room and I was holding her as she passed. Even now, there has never been anything that has happened in my life that has brought me to my knees like losing her did.

I have a son before her and one born after. However, like the other parents have said, it's a hole that will forever be in your heart. When I look at my sons when they are together, I sometimes see her face between them for just a moment. You will learn to cope with the grief but you never forget.

As for how it has changed my life, I hope that it has made me a better father. Paraphrasing another poster, I had never had a different thought than that my children would walk me to my grave. Walking your child to theirs is just not something you even want to contemplate, much less endure.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 11 (view)
fake Soldiers
Posted: 7/31/2012 8:22:43 PM
This is a very old situation. It pops up when people show support for the troops and dies out when the troops are tagged as being the bad guys in an unpopular war. Great examples would be the fakers who told everyone they were Green Berets early in VietNam, when the song "Ballad of the Green Berets" was a popular song, they were a sniper when sniping was at last coming becoming a big thing in the military, and a SEAL now that some of their exploits have come to light. Unfortunately, it will always be so. It's just another avenue for those with an agenda, be it criminal or just seeking attention, to try to use to get what they desire.

The Pentagon is working on trying to get an accurate database up and running for those who have been awarded high level awards ( i.e. Silver Star and above) but the cost is prohibitive to do so for all classes of awards. They're doing so because our U.S. Supreme Court recently gutted the Stolen Valor Act, saying this is just another form of free speech.

I don't know what others think about the issue, except for myself, family and friends. Since I have had a number of friends and family who have been maimed and killed wearing the uniform, this is a very sore point for me. However, I think the best that can be done at this point is just to out them at every opportunity and shun them forever more.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 137 (view)
Over 50 with younger kids?
Posted: 7/27/2012 9:08:04 PM
OP, I'm in the same situation. I'm 51 and have my two sons, ages 11 & 8, who live with me full-time. As other posters stated, most people our age have already raised their kids and don't want the demands again that come with young children. I can't hold it against them. They made their choices and I made mine. And in that respect, I have no regrets. And yes, I keep telling myself that hope springs eternal and I'll find someone who can accept the whole package.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 45 (view)
The One that Got Away
Posted: 7/27/2012 8:42:33 PM
Yeah, there is one. Twenty years ago, we were both recently divorced and I was recently out of the Army. Unfortunately, I didn't recognize that due to her divorce, she needed more attention and affirmation that she was an amazing woman than I was giving her. I know she later remarried and I heard they had a daughter. I moved on, remarried and had children too. However, usually about the time of year that we met, I sometimes have a few fleeting moments where I think of what might have been or where she is now, then I get on with life.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 25 (view)
Dating and the Army
Posted: 3/27/2010 1:16:03 AM
OP, I know this is several months after your original post and the situation has most likely resolved itself already, but I'll still throw my two cents into the pool.

I truly believe that you should give the situation the chance to develop. It will, of course, be a choice that both of you will have to make. Make your feelings known to her and let her decide whether that is something she wants to do.

Military or not, we all have to decide if someone else is worth taking a chance on. You'll never know what might have been if you're not ready to put your cards on the table.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 47 (view)
Men and self esteem
Posted: 3/3/2010 8:19:21 PM

But what about the guys? Aren't there self esteem problems in men?

OP, there's an old saying I remember. It goes like this.

"A poor, handsome man is a handsome man while a rich, ugly man is a rich man."

Do men struggle with self-esteem issues? Sure they do. I just don't remember a corresponding saying, like the above one, where women are concerned. I guess another way to say it is that society seems to be more willing to overlook a man's physical flaws if he has other redeeming qualities, while being less willing to do so for a woman.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 11 (view)
Do women want to have kids after 33-35ish?
Posted: 9/6/2009 11:23:35 PM
If you were to build a graph for this question, I think you'd probably find it peaking in the early-to-mid 20 range, then staying steady until the early 30 range. After that, I think the line would start falling substantially the closer to 40 people got, both male and female. The reasoning would be that the closer to 40 someone got, the more comfortable they are with not having kids or having any more. After all, children are a substantial investment in time, energy and money. There is also an increased factor of risk involved, too.

Having said that, I had my first child a month shy of being 40. Two more followed by the time I was 43. Even though I lost my middle child to a health problem she had, age of the parents had nothing to do with the problem. For me, the joy of being a dad has more than repaid me for the time, energy, money, and yes, even the heartache of losing one, that I've expended.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 28 (view)
Dealbreaker? How to handle in casual dating??
Posted: 8/30/2009 10:14:21 PM

I honestly did feel bad about the fact that he was honest with me and I was unable to accept him as a result.

Actually, he was not being honest. He has a drug problem. Period. Alcoholics also have an excuse for everytime they imbibe. You should not feel guilt at all for leaving that situation. In fact, I salute you for not letting his ploy of trying to dump a guilt trip on you keep you from doing the smart thing.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 5 (view)
Posted: 8/29/2009 9:18:38 PM
OP, just remember that it's illegal for a woman to shoot you just for saying hello. As others have said, look at it as practice to say hello to several women a day. Pretty soon, it will be much easier to relax as you greet the other person.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 32 (view)
Dads - how can a mother help a son deal with a bully?
Posted: 8/28/2009 8:26:32 PM
First, does your son really feel that the bully will make good on his threats? The reason I ask is because you've stated in your posts that this bully has been harassing your son for four years but apparently hasn't acted on his threats....yet. If your son does feel that the bully will strike sooner or later, then now is the time to prepare. If your son isn't really worried about being physicaly attacked, then he should just ignore the threats and move on.

If the threat is percieved as real, then you should attack the problem on multiple levels.

When you contact the school administration concerning the problem, make sure you note who you spoke with, when you spoke with them and what their response was.

Speak with the police. I can't comment on the laws are where you live. However, where I live, you can still be guilty of assault just by making a credible threat that would put a reasonable person in fear of being physically injured. If there is an officer assigned to your son's school, speak to them and make them aware of what is going on. They may be able to keep an eye on the situation and possibly nip it in the bud.

Speak with the bully's parents, make them aware of what is going on and that should your son be attacked, your will prosecute and sue to the fullest extent of the law. Since the bully is a juvenile, they are legally responsible for his actions in every state I'm familiar with.

Last, but not least, have a talk with your son. Tell him that bullies generally don't stop their actions until they decide that it's in their best interests to do so. Generally speaking, they usually do this only after they have been physically hurt or believe that will be the result of their actions. Sometimes it can be accomplished simply by the bully understanding that your child will not run away and will stand their ground, being prepared to defend themselves as they do so. Other times, it might actually escalate into a physical altercation. In that situation, most bully's will have some knowledge about fighting and will be expecting your child to use the usual move of a punch to the face or a kick to the groin. Your child will need to know where to strike on other parts of the body that will produce lots of pain or shuts down the body's ability to continue the attack, while at the same time he is avoiding those same types of blows. A blow to the kidneys, a kick in the shin, a shot into the solar plexus, a hard blow to the nose, a hard blow to the side of the neck or a jab in the eyes with the fingers can all do the trick.

I hope the last part won't be necessary, but it may come down to that. Good luck.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 83 (view)
What would you do if your daughter was being abused by her boyfriend?
Posted: 8/5/2009 9:28:53 PM
My family had an abuser, like your daughter's boyfriend, in it one time. My great-aunt's brothers found out it was happening. They invited the great-uncle to go fishing at a secluded lake with them. After they had a discussion with the great-uncle, it was explained to him that if there was ever a need for a discussion again, he would just disappear in those great big stretches of forest in the state. After that little discussion, AND he recovered from his injuries, he never even raised his voice to her, much less his hand, until he died decades later.

Now some will till you this action, on the part of the brothers, was wrong. They will most likely tell you that the police should have been called. They might even tell you how the police are much more responsive and the justice system is much more harsh on this type of offender in today's times than they were back then. What they mostly likely won't tell you, though, is that a leopard doesn't change its spots. An abuser will keep committing the abuse until it is in their best interest to stop.

For me, I've always believed that every action has and deserves a really good reaction, especially in a case like this. At this time, I'd like to suggest a little investment in a company called Hillerich & Bradsby, makers of the world-famous "Louisville Slugger."
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 70 (view)
Cant people like this be reported?
Posted: 7/26/2009 7:45:07 PM
After having looked at the pics on your profile, I'd suggest sending the poster a set of eye glasses and a dictionary, because it's obvious they can't see and don't know what they're talking about. On second thought, they're probably too dumb to know what either item would be for, so just block 'em and move on.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 38 (view)
Just For Fun - Top 3 What Not To Do On A 1st Date
Posted: 7/16/2009 9:22:24 PM
Great thread. Now all I have to do is print off the answers and show them to my date. That way, we'll both be able to laugh our butt off, even if a trip to the comedy club isn't on the agenda.

For me, it would be:

1) Talk negatively about a past ex or relationship. Negativity is definitely not a character trait I'm looking for. It also let's me know ahead of time that I'll be getting run down behind my back if things don't work out between us.

2) Go with me to a casino for a meal and a show, then not only expect me to fund your gambling excursion because you've fed your last nickel into a one-arm bandit and you just know it's about to pay off, but get rather tiffed when I don't.

3) Excuse yourself to go to the bathroom while we're dining but go into the bar to flirt with someone that just caught your eye, and which could be seen in the fortuitously (for me) placed mirror that you forgot about or never saw.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 29 (view)
So he has been in prison so what right?
Posted: 7/16/2009 8:08:00 PM

Home invasion 2nd degree, 3 years minimum sentence is what he served , released 1 month ago.......people change am i right?
but its not about what he DID its about who is now to me.......not sure how to go about telling my parents..........looking for advice on that not if he is a good guy or not.....

Whoa there, Nelly. You need to put the brakes on, and I mean fast. This man is out of prison after a 3 year bit for home invasion. That's not stealing a pack of chewing gum. Most home invasions involve the perpertrators being armed when they commit the crime, hence it is usually considered a very violent crime.

On top of this, you have known this person for only a month. Many, and I do mean many, people are able to pull a snow job on someone else for more than a year, sometimes years, before their true self is revealed. Not only should you not be introducing this man to your family, but you yourself should be keeping an eye out for the tale-tell signs that says that you're not in Kansas anymore, Toto.

Just a tip. Convicts learn to manipulate people. If after about two YEARS together, and he hasn't given you any reason to doubt him or his word, I might say you could start thinking about introducing him to the family. But before that, no way!
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 19 (view)
Have 50's era men become obsolete?
Posted: 7/13/2009 10:16:13 PM
Most of them are now too busy having to stop and think twice, or even three times, trying to make sure that they aren't accused of harassment, sexual or otherwise. I also seem to remember the term "Pig" being used by a number of women when they speak of the type of man you refer to.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 31 (view)
Difficult decision and wondering if anyone has had/have to make it
Posted: 2/17/2009 9:17:19 PM
Check with a local lawyer. They'll be able to advise you on what would probably be the father's chances of getting visitation.

Secondly, make a journal. Try to remember all the dates when he became intoxicated and abusive. If you can show the court that he regularly gets intoxicated, or even just abusive, the court could order supervised visitation until he proves himself.

In my case, my ex proved my case for me when she was in the courtroom. Everytime we were there, she was glaring at me. The judge picked up on that, and with other testimony about her temper, even from her own mother, the ex was ordered to attend anger management classes and have supervised visitation.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 8 (view)
How do you get an ex to leave you alone???
Posted: 2/14/2009 12:09:22 PM
First, every state has gotten real serious about domestic violence. Each state also has their own definitions concerning what DV is. In my state, if you've ever been married, related by blood or marriage, or have kids together, you and the other person will always be considered to be in a DV situation. Now, if you live together as a married couple would or have had sex with the other person within the last six months, then you would also fall into the DV catagory. This classification would definitely enhance whatever punishment the other person would get, if convicted of a crime against your friend. However, as you can see by the above definitions in my state, if your friend doesn't call the police and report this behavior, your friend might lose some of the protections of the law because of the time factor from when they were in a relationship to now.

When the guy calls and texts in any way after your friend tells him she wants no further contact will usually fall into the catagory of harrassment, at the very least. Some states might even classify it as stalking. No matter what the classification would be, your friend should always call the police and have a report taken when it occurs. She should check what the law is about recording phone conversations, and if it's legal for her to do so, she should record his calls. Have her print out any e-mails or text he sends, if she can. Your friend should keep a journal listing all contacts he sends her, be they by phone, e-mail or text. In it, she should list the date, time and what was said. This is extremely useful to prosecutors in showing stalking.

Your friend should simultaneously seek to get a "restraining order," "order of protection" or "no contact" order. It is called different things in different jurisdictions. Most of these will, at the very least, order the man to have no contact of any type, even through third parties, with your friend. A conviction for violating one of these can, in most cases, get the man jailed.

Lastly, since you say that your friend has stated that this guy is the type to retaliate, your friend should take some precautions. She should vary the times and routes she leaves/returns to the house, especially for work. If it is legal where you live, she should get the strongest pepper spray she can find and keep it with her at all times. I recommend a brand called Fox 5.3. It is the strongest offered on the market, by far. Even most police departments won't issue it because of their worry over liability, should it blister a suspect's face. She should stay alert to what is going on around her when she is out of the house (i.e., out shopping, at work, out with friends). Again, if it's legal in your state, AND your friend considers all the ramifications, AND your friend doesn't have a knee-jerk reaction to them, she should check into obtaining the training and acquiring a firearm for even better protection.

It goes without saying, I think, that your friend needs to be willing to prosecute this man to the fullest extent of the law. It has been my experience that most of these types of men continue to do these things only when they have intimidated the women into not calling the police or prosecuting them. Most have ceased their actions when they found out the woman would prosecute each and every time he pulled one of his stunts.

Hope this helps.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 164 (view)
Men over 50 wanting children
Posted: 2/13/2009 9:27:09 PM
I've been reading this post with great interest. It has certainly hit a nerve with some, and as usual, not so much with others. Also, when I start trying to think of how this subject is any different from the "why don't women date men who are...." threads or "why don't men want..." threads, there doesn't seem to be any difference. The same answer still applies. Some people will want to and some won't. The answer as to "why" they should/shouldn't/could/couldn't/might want to/ might not want to is as individual as all of us individual posters.

My own personal opinion on this subject is that if a man wants to take on that responsibility ( you can include knowing it could happen and doesn't take extra precautions) and finds someone that wants to possibly have a child with him, that's his decision and hers.

I find all the arguments about the "older sperm isn't as healthy" and "they'll not be around when the kid hits their teens" and "no kid wants a father who looks like a grandfather" to be absolutely ridiculous. Every one of these "reasons" don't cut the mustard, when you look at it closely.

The "they'll not be around when the kid hits the teen years" reason. Really? I didn't know any of us came with an expiration date or were guaranteed a certain number of years on this earth. Over the years, I've read of quite a few men and women who just dropped dead in their 20s and 30s, with their unknown and undiagnosed medical condition only being revealed at the autopsy. Sheeew! Got this one beat, as I've made it to 47 now and expect to see many more birthdays. Maybe I will and maybe I won't. But what I won't do is wake up each morning thinking, "Well, why try to live life to it's fullest, I've only got a few more years anyway."

The "no kid wants a father that looks like a grandfather" reason. I've lived a hard life and have more than a few stray gray hairs. So sue me. I've even been mistaken for being the grandfather of my sons a few times. I laughed at the other person's embarrassment when I corrected their assumption and my sons thought it was hilarious, teasing me for hours. However, not once have I had them hesitate, or look embarrassed, or lied when introducing me to their teachers, other parents or their friends. As a matter of fact, each time they did so, they had a big smile on their face when introducing me as their DAD.

The "older sperm isn't as healthy" reason. Again, really? What, children with birth defects aren't born to healthy, young, "in the prime of life" couples everyday? Of all the reasons given so far, I have the most empathy with this one risk of becoming a parent. Several years ago, before the divorce came along, my wife became pregnant with our second child. When we went to get the ultra-sound, we learned that our child had poly-cystic kidneys. It is literally a death sentence before the child is even born. The doctors explained how this condition could happen and not once did they ever mention that "old sperm" might be a reason, even though I was 42 at the time. We were given the choice of aborting the child or going to term. Hoping the doctors were wrong and weren't able to "know" for sure, our child was born at term. They were right. My child died in my arms hours after being born. I don't tell all of you this for pity. My grief is my own. I tell you this now so that you can understand that I still elected to father a child later, because of the knowledge that these types of things happen to people at any age, younger or older. If you were to stop and say, "I won't have a child because this or that could go wrong," then you'll give up any chance to know the joys of parenting. The same could be said of risk in any other situation.

When I look around and see all of these "sperm donors" who've gotten the latest girlfriend pregnant, only to tell her it's her problem when he gets the news, I just have to smile and think that my sons have been much better off with me being their father than one of them. Now, I'll get off my stump and go check on my boys. I'll listen to their breathing as they lay sleeping in their beds and I'll be thinking, "D**n, there's nothing better than being a dad."
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 29 (view)
a question for all single parents
Posted: 2/12/2009 7:53:21 PM

Goodoleboy, I hear you about people not reading things though. Considering I just went through a custody battle in Massachusetts, you can trust my advice.

footballmom, I'm not sure why you'd high-light my comment other than you somehow thought I was directing this comment to you. I wasn't. I was simply trying to convey to the OP that since each states law can be vastly different from even a bordering state, he should check with someone who has continuous contact with his state's law, which is usually a lawyer working in this area.

I am glad that things worked out for you, both in court and with not having to use a lawyer. Hiring a lawyer can be a very expensive proposition, as everyone already knows. However, even if your efforts were recent, some states have laws that go into effect at different times of the year. Here in my state, most new laws go into effect on July 1. I have no idea if most laws go into effect on a certain date in Massachusetts or if each law goes into effect individually. A lawyer would know if any new laws had been added or old laws amended, resulting in my suggestion to OP.

I hope this clarifies any misunderstanding there may have been.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 79 (view)
Do guys feel intimidated by a strong, independent woman?
Posted: 2/11/2009 10:08:30 PM

The way to describe myself is i'm independent, strong, emotionally stable...I've been dating for about 8 mo.. Haven't found anybody that's really my type..Sometimes I wonder if i'm being too picky or I might come off a certain way that guys feel intimidated by.
I'd appreciate a man's perspective on this.

I am sure there will be some who are and some who aren't. Here's a suggestion to sort the wheat from the chaff, so to speak. Think of it as a starting point.

Start out by looking to date military men or former military. After all, if they've survived combat and still have their head on straight, how are you going to intimidate them when they've had people trying to maim or kill them? Just take it from there.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 24 (view)
a question for all single parents
Posted: 2/11/2009 8:16:54 PM
I will give you my perspective from my work in law enforcement. First, each state's laws concerning family law can be vastly different from even the state bordering yours, much less half a continent away. Your first step should always be to consult a lawyer in your state, preferably one that specializes in family law (which usually includes divorce, child custody, etc.). I can tell you that in my state, the law is very cut and dry. It reads that if a man and woman aren't married when the child is born, the mother has complete and full custody. It's automatic at birth and I have had to make many men turn their children back over to the mother on numerous occasions when they had no court order giving them any visitation or parental rights. As a matter of fact, in my state, the only "right" a man has regarding the child he fathered while he wasn't wed to the mother is actually a duty, in the form of child support. He has no other rights until he goes into court and the court grants them to him.

Again, depending on the laws of your state, if you can get into court and get some parental rights, you may have a shot at getting DCF to give you custody, if they do take the child from the mother. Otherwise, if your state is like mine, they will probably try to put the child into the custody of one of the mother's relatives (her mother, sister, etc.) before they'd give you a shot, if they even legally could give you a shot without you having some type of court recognized parental rights.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 34 (view)
Tick Tock, its so loud some times.
Posted: 2/11/2009 7:47:32 PM

My last gf dropped the b-bomb on me a couple years ago, and considering that we were both in our early 40s, I almost fainted. Seriously, there comes a point where it isn't realistic to become a parent, not only from the risks involved for the unborn, but that you no longer have the patience or stamina to be a new parent at middle age.

Niflheim, you are both right and wrong. When I was in my 20s, I raised a step-daughter and an adopted daughter. I loved them like they were my own, so I didn't feel that I had to have any more children in my life after the divorce. It wasn't until a month before my 40th B-Day that my first biological child was born. There are more risks involved for the unborn. I learned this the hard way when we lost the second child hours after her birth. A third child was born more than a year later. I can tell you that there is nothing in this world better than hearing "Daddy, I love you" coming from your childs lips. No matter how tired I am or how rough a day at work it was, hearing that always brings a smile and gives me a shot in the arm. As for patience, I don't just think, I know I have much more patience now than when I was in my 20s.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 32 (view)
Should I out a friend that cheats?
Posted: 2/10/2009 9:52:29 PM
You have a very good chance to decide what kind of man you are with this situation. You can either decide that you're okay with having liars and cheats around you or not. It's your decision and will speak volumes about who you are and what you believe in. As for me, it wouldn't take minutes to bust him out. It would be done in a NY second.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 76 (view)
Girlfriend has a GUY friend..... what do you think?
Posted: 2/10/2009 9:36:37 PM
Do I think men and women can be just friends, without a sexual attraction on either side? Absolutely. In that kind of situation, I think both of them could sleep in the same bed and nothing would ever happen. However, that is not the situation you have here. What you have is:

1. A man who is lying to his wife about having broken off his friendship
with you gf
2. He has told your gf in the past that he has more than friendship feelings
for her
3. He's invited your gf for a getaway weekend, even though he knows she
now has a bf
4. He's even suggested they share a room together
5. He didn't bother to invite you

This just screams that he'd still like to get physical with her, at least to me. Now, what I'd have a problem with isn't him. It's easy to see what his agenda is. My problem would be with your gf. It wouldn't be that it took her three days to come to you with this, although that does suggest that she knew how'd you would feel about it, especially since she'd probably feel the same way if the situation were reversed. What would really make me wonder about the gf would be that she'd even entertain his idea, even if you weren't in the picture, but most assuredly since you are.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 11 (view)
Should we live apart or get divorced?
Posted: 2/10/2009 8:43:06 PM
You gotta be kidding to ask this question. Her every action is telling you that your marriage is over. Her telling you to move out and it's not even her home to say who comes and goes? Sounds like she and your "friend" have been doing a lot of communicating, in every way. You better wake up and not only smell the coffee but get you a few cups under your belt. If you don't get it in gear and start protecting your interest, which also includes your children's interest, you're about to find yourself in a run down one-bedroom apartment with your "wife" screwing your "friend," without your kids and your "wife" enjoying herself on your money. Forget the counseling, consult a lawyer....NOW!!!
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 7 (view)
Getting back together after court has started?
Posted: 2/8/2009 8:33:21 PM
I think this would really depend on why they were in court in the first place. Were they married and decided to divorce for some reason? Were they not married when the children were born and the dad decided to try for visitation? Also, each state has their own rules, but most do allow the process to stop for a while.

Now, I'd say if they were married when the kids were born, and the reason for the divorce was just irreconcilable differences, then I don't believe there would be a problem with trying to reconcile.

If they were married when the kids were born, and the split was for something like infidelity, then getting back together usually means adultery can't be used as grounds for divorce any longer. As a matter of fact, most times if infidelity is the reason for the split, if they continue to cohabitate, or especially if they have sex together, adultery can't be used as the reason for the split. The reason is that the courts usually look at this as acceptance of the infidelity, especially if they have sex after the agrieved party has found out about the infidelity.

As for the case of them not being married when the kids were born, your friend would have to check with a lawyer on whether the reconciliation would help the other sides chances of getting certain parental rights or not.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 9 (view)
Custody and military service
Posted: 2/8/2009 7:45:21 PM

Your career choice is in your hands and you can't have it both ways. If you want to do a job that means you can't care for your child, then you can't care for your child. And they absolutely should be with the parent who can care for them.

When 2 parents no longer parent together there will always be a sacrifices. If you are willing to give up caring for your child for your job, then that is up to you. It is not a "penalty". It is a choice.

Me Plus, I'm not going to knock you for your views. You are as entitled to them as anyone else. However, as another poster stated, the military is not a career that you can just quit whenever you wish to. If you are an enlisted person, there is a contract for a certain amount of years service. If you are an officer, you get commissioned with the understanding that you will serve, or be subject to serve, as long as you hold that commission. Even when your contract is up, or you have put in your commission resignation letter, you can still be forced to serve through stop loss or the military deciding not to accept your resignation.

Of course, it would be better that a child be with a natural parent if the custodial military member is deployed, and as you stated, if the other parent is fit. However, I still say that many military members are being penalized by the courts because the courts are taking the children from them for something that is beyond their control most of the time, as most cannot just up and leave right after the divorce. Most military members who gain custody just have to hope they can get out before they are deployed. Imagine how you would feel if you divorced and were granted custody of the children, had a job that could jail you if you tried to up and quit when you decided you didn't want to be there any longer, then had the courts strip you of your kids because your job sent you someplace you couldn't take the kids. Even worse, when you were able to return, the courts didn't want to give you back your kids. Now that I think about it, both "penalize" and "subject to an injustice" are appropriate.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 6 (view)
Custody and military service
Posted: 2/7/2009 9:29:04 PM
First, to understand this subject, you have to start off with a few facts. The first fact is that up until recently, as in the last 10 years, almost all divorce cases ended with the mother being awarded custody. The courts are finally realizing that men can be just as good as, and in some individual cases, even better parents than women can be. As a result, especially in the last 10 years, the courts have begun to give men custody in increasing numbers.

Secondly, up until the last 20 years, the numbers of females in the military was very small. This has dramatically changed. The last information I saw put their numbers in the military at the 15-20% level. Of course, this means there are a greater number of military females who wind up being single parents when they divorce.

The third fact is that the "Soldiers, Sailors and Airman Civil Relief Act ( SSAA for brevity) was enacted primarily to prevent creditors from winning judgements against service members who were deployed and unable to have regular mail service, thus unable to make payments on time, if at all. The SSAA had not been updated to keep pace with both the technological advances we have seen, nor the increasing numbers of military members who wind up being custodial parents.

Now, here is where we start mixing the ingredients. Men, including military members, are increasingly gaining custody of their children in divorces. More women in the military just adds to the numbers of single custodial parents when divorces occur. When the military was almost exclusively male, the ex-spouse almost always got custody, those females in the military were small in number and almost always in jobs that rarely saw them deployed AND the Reserves/National Guard was almost exclusively used for emergencies in their states, the inadequacies of the SSAA were not even recognized.

Here is how it comes down, usually. A divorce occurs, in which the military member is granted primary custody. The military member comes down on deployment orders or is deployed, with the non-custodial parent finding out that a deployment is coming or the member has already deployed. They file to gain custody. Many times the argument is they should be granted custody, at least while the member is deployed, because they are the other biological parent. The family court, which is a state court, completely ignores the SSAA( it's almost always ignoring as opposed to not having knowledge of) and grants the non-military non-custodial parent custody, sometimes supposedly until the member returns and sometimes permanently. The family courts ignore the SSAA because there have been absolutely no cases where the judge of the family court has paid any price, whether professionally or personally, for ignoring the SSAA.

After the military member returns, you would think it would be kids play to go into court and have these decisions reversed. It is most definitely not. Most times, the federal courts don't want to get into holding a fellow judge accountable for ignoring the law and squashes the lawsuit. In many states, this issue hasn't been addressed, leaving the military member to have to go back into family court and plead to have the child(ren) returned to them. The former spouse's attorney then usually puts forward the argument that the child(ren) have now bonded to the former spouse, there are no other compelling issues why the child(ren) should be returned and to do so now would only be for the military member and not because it was in the best interest of the child(ren). Of course, the former spouse's lawyer also usually either openly suggest, or does so by intimating, that the only reason the military member wants the child back now is so that the military member won't have to continue to pay child support. Believe it or not, most of the family courts are buying the bonded to/no good reason to argument and the military member loses custody, usually forever.

The reason I know this information is that I almost found myself in this situation as a member of the Army National Guard. My marriage was going down the tubes and I had filed for divorce when word came down that my unit was about to go back to Iraq for a second combat tour. I quickly found out that (a.) if I was awarded custody and my ex was able to have it changed, my state did not have a law that would force family court to return custody after my deployment, (b.) if I was in the NG when temporary custody was awarded, the ex would probably get the kids, (c.) the family courts were ignoring SSAA and the federal courts were ignoring them doing so.

Armed with the above information, I got very lucky. My luck was in the fact that my enlistment would be up shortly after we had our temporary custody hearing and I was able to convince the judge that I would be getting out to get custody of my kids. This fact, with the others we presented, convinced the judge to award me custody of the kids. I shudder to think what would have been had I just re-enlisted, as had been my plan until the divorce came along.

I'm sorry for the length of this, but there just isn't a shorter way to explain how military members are being penalized for their service when it comes to custody of their kids.

As a side note, I wrote both my state senator and my U.S. representative about this situation. The U.S. representative wrote back to say that Congress was updating the SSAA, specifically to address this area. I am also proud to say that after pointing this problem out to my state senator, he introduced legislation to change our state law in this area. After the govenor signed it into law, the senator was even gracious enough to send me a letter showing the new change.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 32 (view)
What position did you take in your divorce?
Posted: 2/5/2009 9:44:30 PM

For those of you who are divorced, what was more important to you when you were divorcing: that it be over quickly, or that you got your grievances aired?

In divorce #1, I had hoped to just call it quits and both of us use the same attorney. We made out a list splitting the assets, hired the attorney and thought it would be equitable. Found out later that she went back the next day and fired the attorney, got one of her own and filed. I still wanted distance more than anything else, so she got pretty much everything.

In divorce #2, things were much more complicated because children were involved. Since she was a compulsive liar, thief and adultress, I was seriously worried that even letting her have joint custody would cause real harm to the kids. The thought of the kids constantly seeing her lie and steal was bad enough, but the thought of them being left with just anyone when she wanted to go screwing around was more than I was willing to have happen. I told her I would sell everything I had, borrow every cent I could and would spend whatever was necessary to keep the kids. She wanted to fight so we slugged it out in court, to the tune of 2+ years. The capper came when my lawyer trapped her in perjury on the stand. The judge wasn't amused with the ex's antics.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 31 (view)
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/1/2009 10:02:46 PM
This is one of those "dam*ed if you don't, dam*ed if you do" situations that we men are put in sometimes. Unless the biological father is of another race, it's very easy for a woman to conceal who the real father might be of a child.

Some women will be totally insulted that you even brought the subject of a DNA test up, because it calls their honesty into question. However, without it, you have no sure way of knowing that a child really is yours. If the child isn't yours and you have played "Dad" for any length of time, even though you are the one who a fraud has been perpertrated against, the courts will almost always say that you will have to pay child support. They will justify this flagrant injustice because you, OP, have played "Dad" and the child has bonded to you. It won't matter that you played "Dad"because you were duped and didn't find out about it until much later.

There is a way to assuage your worries and not cause an explosion in your relationship. However, it entails just as much risk as asking for the DNA test does. You can take the child to have the test done when you have the child by yourself. If the test shows the child is yours but the mother doesn't find out you had the test, then your possible worries are put to rest without a possible blow up. If it shows the child isn't yours, and you even so much as have sex with the mother again, you lose any basis for claiming adultery in any divorce proceeding. You might also open yourself up to be slapped with child support for that child.

Now, no one can tell you what is right for you or the woman you are with. If your relationship is to the point where you want to be intimate, then you might also bring up that you'd always want a DNA test for any child born of your union. That way, it's already out there.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 50 (view)
Ever heard the saying....
Posted: 1/30/2009 10:40:34 PM
Putting it another way...."A leopard doesn't change it's spots." If you were able to allow it to happen once, even if you did regret it later, I think you would find it even easier if you found yourself in those same circumstances again.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 7 (view)
Mom won't give me paternity.
Posted: 1/29/2009 10:27:11 PM
First, you're going to need to consult a lawyer. This is no "ifs" and no "buts." Each state has different laws concerning custody and parental rights, along with jurisdiction. Most likely you will need to consult a lawyer in the state the mother is residing in now, along with filing there.

I can't tell you what other states are like but in TN, if you aren't married to the mother when the child is born, then the mother automatically has full and complete custody. If the state she is residing in now is like TN, if you were to just take off with your daughter, I think you'd find a felony warrant out for your person rather quickly. File in court for parental visitation, then as long as you follow the court's order, you're more than likely okay.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 28 (view)
**Poof** They're Gone
Posted: 1/29/2009 10:03:00 PM
mcv, I'd hope that you'd do the exact same thing again. Don't let that other person's actions turn you into them, someone with no class and no courtesy.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 35 (view)
Bullish or Bearish Dating Market ...
Posted: 1/29/2009 9:38:57 PM
Bear or Bull doesn't really matter. Maybe what put it into perspective for me was surviving combat while close friends didn't. The randomness of who lived and who died made me appreciate every day and every opportunity I get now. The only way a job would be a consideration is if they just wanted to sit on their rear and be taken care of. Makes me think they would just put everything else getting done on my shoulders too. That situation just has no appeal at all.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 22 (view)
Another question to single parents (being brutal here)
Posted: 1/27/2009 9:06:03 PM
OP, I guess it would depend largely on what the other persons issues are and how ready you are to deal with them yourself. I mean "issues" does cover a lot of ground. Are we talking about parenting issues, where the other person's ex is making life difficult by repeatedly changing plans at the last minute? Are we talking that the other person, or one of their children, has a physical issue?

It seems to me that what you need to do is find out where the person you are interested in is at on what I term the "moving on" scale. Are most of their conversations straying to the issue after just a short while, especially if there doesn't seem to be some type of trigger for them getting on the topic? This would find me being a little leery of getting involved until they resolved their issues, as it suggest that they might want to use me for nothing more than a crutch. If it's something that the other person has to deal with because, through no fault of their own, it pops up and they have to deal with it, then maybe I can see they are trying to live their life to the fullest, despite the problem, and I'm willing to take a chance.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 17 (view)
Posted: 1/27/2009 7:15:11 PM
I think you're going to need more information than you have to make an informed choice.

1. You say you've talked with "Sara." What did she tell you about their relationship, and in particular, about him? Anything ringing a bell? Anything like a birthmark or subconcious mannerism that convinces you that "Sara" does indeed know your b/f?

2. What did your b/f say about "Sara?" Did he say they dated or had a relationship? Or did he deny being anything more than just acquainted with her?

3. If he did say they had a relationship, what did he say was the reason they split? Did he suspect she was cheating? Did she suddenly come up pregnant, even though they were using protection?

There could be some good reason why he believes he's not the father of the child, even if your b/f and "Sara" had a relationship. As for the baby looking like him or not, or "Sara" going after him for child support or not, you can't read anything into those things.

I think the first thing you need to know is whether there was any type of relationship there or not, even if it was just a one-nighter. Talk to your b/f and tell him that the situation is bothering you, because it's calling his honesty into question. I think his reaction to that alone will tell you alot. If he understands your concerns and says he's willing to take a paternity test, that could tell you that he really does think he's not the father and doesn't believe he has anything to hide. On the other hand, if he blows up and tries to throw it back at you because you might have questions about how honest he's being, that might be a good indication that he thinks he's the father but he's just hoping the whole situation will go away.

As others have posted, if he knows he's the father but is denying the child, along with telling you lies, then you already know what to do...........RUN!
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 96 (view) young is too young?
Posted: 1/23/2009 10:18:35 PM
Okay, I'll give you my opinion on this matter. I'll give you a little background on myself first.

I was first taken shooting when I was 5 years old. Since that time, I've been a soldier, a cop, shot competitively as both and been in combat. I've been trained as an armorer, to work on weapons. I have qualified expert with everything from a 9mm pistol to a .50 caliber machinegun. Another qualification to comment is that I am the father of 2 sons.

When I started to train my sons about firearms safety, I have used a 2-pronged approach. As another poster wrote, I took my sons out to a place where I could set up a couple of melons to shoot. It is a very powerful lesson about what a firearm can do and will stick in the child's mind, if nothing else will. The second part of the approach is to demystify the firearm. By that, I mean that anytime my children ask to see a firearm, I reinforce that as long as they ask me first, I will stop and immediately show it to them, making sure that it is unloaded first. I also reinforce that they will be in big trouble if they don't come and ask first. As a result, even my youngest son rarely asks to see them anymore.

As long as your ex is the type who is very safety oriented, I probably wouldn't make too big a thing about it.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 14 (view)
Posted: 1/21/2009 10:21:07 PM
A lot will depend on three different things. These are the state you live in, the judge you draw and what went on/is going on that directly affects the child.

I say the state you live in because some states are more progressive than others when it comes to giving custody to the father. In some states, and among some judges, it is just assumed that the child is better off with the mother. This gets modified by the age of the child a lot of times, i.e. if the child is under seven, mom almost always gets 'em, under twelve it's a toss up and past that the child's wishes get top priority.

What went on/is still going on will definitely play a part, especially where the child is concerned. Everything else being equal, where the judge feels that the child has the best chance of thriving and being cared for will be the overriding factor. This is why it is so VERY IMPORTANT to document everything. This includes her behaviors around the child, how much and for how long she calls the child when the child is residing with you, whether the child comes back in decent clean clothes or do they have holes/are dirty all the time. This isn't just since she left, either. Try to document all behavior since the child has been born and even before. Also, document what you do with the child, what the child does during a normal day (such as what time they are learning while being at the daycare, what time they normally eat lunch there, what time they normally are at play there). You never know what might be useful. Some of these things might include how many times a person has changed jobs or residences before/while/after being a couple, how "hot-headed" a person is (really convincing when you can get it on audio or video tape) and the "friends" the SO hangs around.

The judge you draw will be the most important part of the equation. Most judges will try to be impartial and try to do what they feel is in the best interest of the child. However, each is an individual with their own values, feelings and life experiences. There used to be a judge I knew that almost never gave the man custody, no matter what the mother had done or was doing, and that judge was a man himself. It was even worse if you were both a man and a cop, as he wouldn't even listen to the attorney for the cop at all. He'd tell them that they could put on their case, if they wished, but he'd already made up his mind about what was going to happen. Luckily, this type of judge isn't in the majority.

My advice to you is to shop around (just don't dawdle doing it) and find the best attorney you can afford, that really has an interest in your case and get filed. Once you have filed, don't look back and document, document, document! If your once SO changes her mind (doubtful from what you posted but still possible, even if it's only as a tactic), don't give in and go back. The court looks at this as accepting the prior behavior, no matter what it was.

Sorry if this was a little long. However, after having to go through this, I was lucky to have learned a few of these lessons before I got blindsided in court by them.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 13 (view)
Question for the men
Posted: 1/21/2009 9:30:38 PM
If you run into someone, where all cylinders are firing and you just "click," nothing else should stop you. Many people will come into and leave your life, but I really believe you only get so many chances to find the one you think is right for you.

Of course, in a short while, you won't have to tell anyone you're pregnant. They'll be able to see it for themselves. However, until then, I think you need to tell anyone, if you become interested in them, that you are already pregnant. There will be the chance they'll take off for the hills, of course. But if they don't, then you can concentrate on developing the relationship without the pressure of, "Will they accept me when they find out I'm pregnant?" being a consideration.

Now, I adopted a child that also wasn't my SO's either, so you can take what I wrote with a grain of salt and I won''t take offense.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 68 (view)
Can you be too independent for a relationship?
Posted: 1/21/2009 7:53:11 PM
I think you actually can be too independent for a relationship. After all, any relationship is based on compromise. The only way that it wouldn't be is if you found someone who didn't care whether their expectations and needs were fulfilled by the relationship.

To me, it sounds like you have reached a place in your life where you are comfortable with your life and aren't really ready to give up any part of it yet. There's nothing wrong with that. Some people just like being able to make every decision concerning their life without having to consult with someone else.

However, since you did start seeing someone, it also sounds like you would like to have someone to share life with at some point. Since you were comfortable with just seeing the guy once a week at the four month mark of the relationship, it reminds me of someone who starts to get into a japanese ofuro. The water is really hot, so you slip into it really slow to let your body adjust to the temperature. The guy sounds like he was just at a different point in that journey.

Good luck in
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 509 (view)
Any men over 35 seriously looking to get married?
Posted: 1/12/2009 9:25:24 PM
Yes, some of us do want that. However, the farther we get from our teens and twenties, along with adding failed relationships and marriages, the more we want to make sure that when we do take that step, it will be with the one who we will be parted from only by death.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 90 (view)
Do you feel comfortable dating someone who is seperated
Posted: 1/11/2009 7:50:47 PM
As many have posted, it's a case by case issue. If it's a fairly recent seperation, say within a couple of months, I'd be hesitant to. The longer the seperation, the more I'd be comfortable with it. If it's something that makes you wonder, ask the person why they think it's taking so long if the divorce papers have been filed. The explanation could be as simple as the judge just still hasn't made a ruling (they can be lazy like anybody else) and the other person can't afford to make them mad by inquiring why they haven't issued a ruling.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 401 (view)
would you marry for money?
Posted: 1/8/2009 6:18:56 PM
Ah, but you probably wouldn't walk out with what you came in with. Most states are either a community property state or have laws that say what ever is acquired during the marriage is marital property. This would include any interest accrued off those assets.

However, there is an old joke that covers this situation pretty much to a T. Ladies, understand this could also apply the other way. It goes like this:

A man was at a party and saw this woman he was very attracted to. He went over and began a conversation with her. During the conversation he asked, "Would you go to bed with someone for just one night if they gave you a million dollars?" She replied, "Well, yes." The man then asked if she would do the same for a hundred dollars. The woman replied, "Of course not, what kind of a woman do you think I am."
The man then said, "We've already established what kind of woman you are, we're just negotiating price now."

If you're getting married for any other reason than love, then you're a prostitute. The only question is how much has to be in the asset column for you to give in.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 8 (view)
To much information.....
Posted: 1/8/2009 2:59:17 PM
General info is okay...first name, likes and dislikes (hobbies, food or areas like that...not sexual), general beliefs. Those get the conversation started.

If the other person starts with the "you wouldn't be hesitant to tell me if you weren't hiding something" line, it's time to not walk but run. There are control issues at work there, at the very least.

Both parties have to be comfortable with giving out their information. Throw in the anonymity of the ethernet, where you can't really see the other person without a cam. Even with a cam, you only know what the person you're talking to looks like, not what they are really like. That can only be found out by being with them face-to-face. It can all be a scary thing, considering that there are more than a few scam artists and psychos out here in the world.
Joined: 1/3/2009
Msg: 45 (view)
what should i do?
Posted: 1/8/2009 12:09:28 PM
First, the marriage is over. It doesn't matter whether she has confessed to having an affair or not. When she said "I love you but I'm not in love with you anymore," it is the same thing as saying that I appreciate the memories but now I'm moving on. The marriage may not end today, tomorrow, next week or even next year, but it will end.
If she is telling you that BS line but hasn't said she wants a divorce, then it is because she hasn't gotten everything lined up the way she wants it before she pulls the plug. You may not want to face it but it is the truth.

Secondly, you have a choice. If the kids are of an age where they can speak for themselves (usually 12+), the judge will usually at least ask them who they want to live with when the divorce takes place. If they are between 7 & 12, the judge may ask them but will still pretty much make the decision based on what they feel is in the kids best interest. Under age 7, forget about it. The judge will almost automatically place the children with the mother, unless you can show a very good reason for them not to. Your choice here, based on the kids age, is do you stick around hoping they'll make it to the age where the judge may ask them who they want to be with or do you go ahead and pull the plug yourself.

The bottom line is that no matter what you do, be it trying marriage counseling, sitting down with her to talk things over to try to work things out or even if you told her that her infidelity was okay with you, she will leave at some point. If she just wanted sex from someplace else, she would not have told you about the affair or have told you that she still loves you but she was going to go out for sex with other guys and you could either put up with it or not. She didn't say that. She's already showing you that she's doing that. She included that she's not "in love" with you anymore. That right there is signalling you that she's outta there, not if, just when.
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