Notice: Forums will be shutdown by June 2019

To focus on better serving our members, we've decided to shut down the POF forums.

While regular posting is now disabled, you can continue to view all threads until the end of June 2019. Event Hosts can still create and promote events while we work on a new and improved event creation service for you.

Thank you!

          

Show ALL Forums
Posted In Forum:

Home   login   MyForums  
 
 Author Thread: My (near) annual update
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 1 (view)
 
My (near) annual update
Posted: 4/10/2012 9:51:01 AM
So, I've noticed I'm in the habit of posting on here about once a year, looking for advice on how to change my romantic life around, or whatever. Typically, it seems, I post in the Broken Hearts forum, but good news: Not this year! I'm not broken hearted really at all, which is actually a nice change of pace. Anyway, prepare for something resembling a rant.

I've spent a bit of my evening going over some of my old posts, and wow did they bring back memories. So, if you don't feel like reading up, here's the summary: I've been single for about 10 years. I haven't had much more than a date in about 6 or so. This, obviously, made me concerned, depressed, and it seriously messed with my self-esteem, self-confidence, and self-image. I think of myself as a really good guy. I'm smart, funny, articulate, somewhat charming, well-read, thoughtful, more humble than a Buddhist Monk on the verge of enlightenment (<-joke), blah, blah, blah... I generally don't think of myself as very attractive, and that has been a major insecurity of mine for my whole life. I've suffered from a very woe-is-me depression, and have had major self-esteem issues, all of which seem to stem from my odds-defying bad relationship with women-at-large. I went to therapists, I redefined my image several times, I went to bars and clubs, tried online dating (with miraculously horrible results that brought me to the lowest depths of depression), bought self-help books, tapes, and pamphlets, and anything else I could think of to change my luck...I was still consistently rejected for years.

I moved out to Seoul, Korea about 4 years ago. I'm a teacher, who just recently got a nice new job, and then a sudden promotion. I moved to a nicer neighbourhood, and got a nice new apartment. I sing and/or play guitar in 3 bands, and spend most of my evenings and weekends either playing music, or watching friends play music.

Somewhere in the past three years or so I've stumbled on how not to care about what women think about me. I don't care about dating, or relationships, or even meeting a girl when I go out. I'm not depressed at all, my self-esteem is high, my confidence is at what one would call healthy, moderate levels. I'm actually feeling good. Happy even. Not content, but happy. I would still like to meet a woman that I really like, get together, yadda yadda yadda, have a family. The idea of potentially falling in love still seems like an exciting prospect.

It seems I have a new problem though. As I mentioned before, I just don't care. I don't care about dating, relationships, or even meeting a girl when I go out. I just don't care.

Part of it is that I have become very comfortable with my lifestyle. I live alone, I eat alone, I sleep alone, I go to practices and gigs alone, and then I come home alone. For all intents and purposes, I'm still lonely. But after 10 years of being by myself, I can't imagine anything else anymore. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to be alone tomorrow, but I'm pretty comfortable being alone today.

Part of it is that I recognize that finally, at long last, I'm somewhat happy, confident, and with good self-esteem now that I don't care. Best of all (and I never realized how much I couldn't appreciate this) I feel like myself. I feel like I'm genuinely me. I don't need to wish I was someone I'm not (except on stage, and even then, I'm not far off). On the other hand, women, dating, and failing at dating women, generally made me depressed, sad, and angry, it killed my confidence, and stepped on my self-esteem with it's heel. I don't want that again. Essentially, I'm afraid of messing too much with things when they're seemingly going well.

But the biggest part of it is that I basically can't meet anyone I like. I meet lots of nice people, lots of attractive people, lots of smart and talented people, and lots of interesting people. I like, and in some cases love dearly, many of them. I just don't see myself dating them. I can't actually get interested in anyone. I push myself to be interested in people that are good people because they're good people, but find myself just unenthused. Even the one girl that I actually kinda like, and might be interested in, is in a situation where I just can't be bothered to get involved, or even make a stand. It's like I feel lazy, which would make me feel bad if I didn't know that I'm working so hard at so many other things. Also, when things are going well, I just don't feel like risking my good scene. I haven't really met anything worth risking anything for. It's like I really want to meet someone on the one hand, but I just want to be left alone on the other.

So, I'm looking for advice, comments, thoughts, questions, experiences, insults, counter-rants (that Buddhist Monk thing really was a joke), whatever you can throw at me. Bring it on.

Just one request: Please don't tell me again that my profile is awful, and will never attract anyone. I know it is, and I know it won't. It's an account that only works in Canada, and I'm in Korea, so it's a moot point. Please, no more.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 46 (view)
 
Mental Attitude and Dating Success or Failure
Posted: 12/1/2010 4:36:45 AM
Well that sounds marvy. Good for you.

Not what I want, or what I'm looking for though. Attractive women are great and all that, but what you describe is not so appealing to me.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 44 (view)
 
Mental Attitude and Dating Success or Failure
Posted: 12/1/2010 4:31:07 AM
Womaninprogress




More BS. No one is "undateable". I have seen some people date one after the other, and have been baffled at why. Bad manners, poor hygeine, things that should be off the radar like 5 kids, homeless, drunk beyond ability to function, etc. Most people (and you are no doubt one of them as am I) are not top of the pile or the worst ever - and it's our vibe, our attitude, our overall presentation beyond appearance that makes or breaks us. Sure some won't find us attractive no matter what we do. I truly believe though that when we start thinking we're no good, and that no one wants us that we start creating that reality for ourselves. And unless/until we TRULY come out of that mindset and become more positive, and REALLY stop caring who wants us - we can't say it's not our outlook on things that's keeping us from moving forward.


I essentially agree. I don't actually think I'm undateable, or at least I don't think I should be. I'm just echoing what everyone in the thread has said. I can honestly say to myself that those who have rejected me did miss out, especially seeing some of the guys they've wound up with. I'm a genuinely good guy, who deserves a lot better than I get. I have a hard time dealing with the disappointment of it, especially when a ready, realistic, explanation (my being ugly) is constantly made available, and reinforced. I should add that the person who said this about me, is someone that I think genuinely likes and appreciates me, and I would like to think thinks highly of me. That's perhaps why it hit home for me. People who appreciate me still just see me as that "ugly guy."

That being said, I totally acknowledge that a world where nobody can see past what they see on the outside is indeed my reality. How does one change their reality on their own? That's my question.

Muchas gracias for the thought!
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 43 (view)
 
Mental Attitude and Dating Success or Failure
Posted: 12/1/2010 4:12:18 AM
Who me?

I'm really not ignoring you, I just didn't see anything worth responding to so far. For starters, the whole idea of the thread is people who find dating pointless: That's me! Consider me the guinea pig for the thread.

Previously, you assumed I was just looking to get laid, have an "uncomplicated" relationship, and that going to a prostitute was a valid solution to what I see as my problem. It simply suggests that you don't quite get what I'm going on about, so I didn't really read much past those parts. I mean, honestly, paying a prostitute to pretend to enjoy my company? Not the solution I'm looking for.

By all means, if you have some some worthwhile advice, or ideas to contribute I'm happy to listen. If you have a great idea, I'm happy to consider it, and probably excited to attempt to implement it. I'm willing to change, but I'm skeptical of empty rheotoric, and hyperbole.

But honestly, that you posted this:



I have 3 adorable girlfriends. None of whom raise their voice, manipulate, leech, stalk or in any other way DEMAND from me anything except that I be me and have my own life which makes me happy.


...kinda suggests to me that you have just as negative a view of dating and relationships as I do, just coming from a different angle.

Nevertheless, hit me with your best shot.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 41 (view)
 
Mental Attitude and Dating Success or Failure
Posted: 11/30/2010 9:34:10 PM

um, first off, read your profile. Guess what? there's nothing there. Tough to sell yourself when you hide the brochure :)


Two things with that:

(1) I don't live in the same country as I did when I opened this account, and it won't let me change countries on my profile. I could put something in there, but it would be pointless as it would find people who live in my old "neighbourhood," not my new one.

(2) While I do have a functional profile on here somewhere, online dating has proved to be a less than positive experience for me overall, every time I've tried it. I'm not really in any hurry to give it another whirl. I just use the forum here annually.


Second off, I said it's tough to change things when you "know" that no matter what you do, nothing will change.


The way I would put it is that I've tried everything I can think of to change as much as I can, and back again in almost every combination I've found. Self-help books, total make-overs, David D'Angelo's stuff, solo vacations, moving across the world, meditation, being sensitive, being a jerk, listening, ignoring, chasing, etc... Each time I go in thinking that I've solved my dillemma, feeling good, feeling confident and then finding myself right back where I started. All things considered feeling frustrated, and hopeless seems justified.


don't try and find people at bars, places like toastmaster or meetup (places where people with like interests can get together and network and socialize) or places where people talk and mingle regularly; meeting people with NO wanting to date; just get to interact more in a friend way so you can put yourself in circulation, and knock them dead in public so people can see you in your comfort zone...then once you are comfortable where you are "not" putting yourself out there right after your change.. you get comfortable, and just relax, you never know what might happne. But as long as you KNOW it won't happen? It won't happen.
and know you CAN have a different result.


I did Toastmasters years ago. I have since been in a wine club, book club, debate group, a cooking class, a karaoke club, and several sports leagues. On top of that, I still play in a regular open mic, and host a comedy night, and mingle with various groups of friends. I've met some people that way, but rarely available women.

And no, I'm not just looking to get laid. I'm looking for a partner, and something of an intimate (not necessarily sexual) relationship. I played a festival in my town over the summer with my band, and we had a great show. We played great, the energy was high, the crowd was into it, and we got a lot of praise for the performance. When it was all done, and we had all gone home, I had nobody calling to see how it went, and I had nobody to call to gush to. Nobody ever asked, nobody ever wondered. I'm not going to say that nobody cared, but nobody was actually interested, or realized that it was a big deal to me. I just remember being on a high at the beginning of the night, and feeling comlpetely alone and isolated from everyone at the end.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 32 (view)
 
Mental Attitude and Dating Success or Failure
Posted: 11/30/2010 4:12:56 PM
See here's where I play my part, and explain why I think you're wrong:


<div class="quote">First off, I'm REALLY sorry that person said that horrible thing about you. People can be cruel and thoughtless. Ironically, people can ALSO be, to another person, totally wrong.

Comparatively speaking, no, I'm pretty ugly. She's certainly right about that. I'm not talk dark and handsome. There are ugly people, attractive people and we can all pretty much agree on which is which.


<div class="quote">Some of the words I used were hostile and frustrated and angry. But another one that fits? Is resigned. "knowing" no matter what happens, nothing will change.

That's a really really tough mindset to overcome; and when things DO tend to pattern like that? It makes it incredibly difficult to expect different results.

Right, except I don't expect different results.


<div class="quote">So first off? Please don't feel accused by the subject; you are trying to have a good attitude about it; and you ARE tring to change yourself, and those are incredibly good things.

Yeah, but I'm also pretty confident that nobody what anyone here says, I've already tried it to no significant effect.


<div class="quote">Second off, NO one is ugly unless they believe they are. Find a style and a look that suits you (get a stylist, maybe get a personal shopper who finds clothes that can flatter and bolster confidence), and make sure you're healthy. If you are healthy, stylish and confident, you will be attractive, PERIOD.

Yeah, about two years ago I went on a shopping spree, spending almost $1500 on new clothes, shoes, and other such accessories. I'm losing my hair rather quickly, so I just cut my hair short. I lost 25lbs over that year, and realized that I don't look any different, because the reason I look fat is that I have a big barrell chest, no neck, and big shoulders. And then I'm short (relatively speaking). So with my friends' approval, and a new confidence, I'd go out and try to meet people, and still get shot down consistently. Normally, I wouldn't have stuck it out past about 3 or 4 rejections, but I did. I actually asked out maybe a dozen girls, and only had two agree...and they both stood me up. So now, that well is dry, and I could have used that money on a vacation.


<div class="quote">Poeple's features are an accident of nature; but what people do with those features? How do you wear your looks? Embarrasssed and feeling ugly? People will sense it and will see it. So stop feeling ugly. See teh beauty in yourself, and then more important, LOOK for the beauty in someone else.

I should point out, not the easiest thing to do. Especially, when people make a point of pointing out your physical flaws. Even now, I can look at myself and think I look good for me, but I'd still score about a 3 or 4 on the attractiveness score.


<div class="quote">I remember there was a period of time when I hit a string of line five or six dates in a row where I had first meets where they were convinced that I was not interested. At the time I figured THEY weren't interested and wondered why they didn't like me; only to find out all of them did, but they thought I didn't like THEM. I became aware of one action that I was doing (when I talk to people I don't think about like/dislike or anything; I just listen and try to make them comfortable and hear who they are; but this time I did it with open hands and not arms tucked under) and then all of a sudden from that one little movement; they did not make assumptions and I all of a sudden had the second date offered right from that one small change; every time instead of a string of none. One small thing I was doing; was making people feel put off or closed out.

Great, you fixed it! But, I can be pretty confident that when I ask someone out they realize that I'm at least somewhat interested, and that when they turn me down, or stand me up, that they're not.


<div class="quote">Is your insecurity making you pull into yourself?

Lately? Yes, absolutely.


<div class="quote">If so, you could be shutting people out. Biggest confidence booster is not "trying to not think of failure"... it's not focusing on yourself at all. THEY are who you should be focused on. THEY are the one you should put at ease... THEY are the one who is getting the opportunity to talk to you.

Yes, I agree. I am a smart, funny person, who is definitely entertaining to talk to. I'm just saying, that in my personal experience, that's not good enough.


<div class="quote">So make you the best, healthiest, stylish person you can be, then focus completely on teh other person. they aren't a "conquest", they aren't an end result; they are a living breathing person with wants, needs, and problems like anyone else, and when you see them that way; you can actually feel compassino for them. And compassion and interest? ARE positive drawing traits. If you're intelligent and like to talk? Go to places where people like it; intelligence is an INCREDIBLE turnon. Music is a turnon...ability to make someone laugh? HUGELY attractive; there are MANY attractions a person has when they are not focused inwardly; start to find the things in yourself that you are proud of, and start to love teh things in yourself that you think aren't lovable, because what one person considers "ugly" another person will see beauty in that same exact person. We ALL have someone we'll be beautiful to.

Yeah, that's all nice in theory. However, in my experience, in my reality this doesn't hold much truth. I am a smart person. I am a funny person. I am a surprisingly thoughtful, and considerate person. These things are good. But they're clearly not enough. I would say that these traits are only attractive in a person to the degree that the person is physically attractive.


<div class="quote">(one other thing to add: there is an organization called toastmasters that is all about projection, confidence, learning to speak and learning to express yourself in the best way possible; and i know several people who have attended and gotten a TON of good out of it. I would highly recommend it. It will take the self consciousness out; you will learn to express and carry yourself in the best way; you can network AND you might even find someone you want to talk to outside of the meetings. something to consider anyways; it gives if not full confidence; it takes away the self consciousness; and that is HUGE) :)

I used to be a personality on the radio. Now I'm a teacher, host comedy night, and have to address the crowd at every show I play. Talking is probably my one true talent. At least, talking to a group. Thanks for the thought, though.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 24 (view)
 
Mental Attitude and Dating Success or Failure
Posted: 11/30/2010 4:13:13 AM
By the way, on a second reading the OP, I want to add something:

I don't actually rant about this in every day conversation. I also happen to work hard to mask my insecurities in real-life as much as I possibly can, so talking about this kind of stuff with real-life people is somewhat counterproductive to that. I don't think I've ranted about "them darn women" in a few years outside of this forum. It just frustrates my friends, makes me look weak to them, and doesn't make me feel any better, so what's the point? I would think most of my friends are not aware of my insecurities, and those that would suspect it are only aware because I haven't dated, suggested dating, or shown interest in anyone in a year, not because I've brought it up.

On the other hand, they might reasonably suspect that I'm gay and in the closet. I'm not, but I'd understand the suspicion.

Also, I wouldn't say I'm getting worse. I'm not hostile, I'm not actually angry. I'm frustrated, but its like being frustrated at a storm when you're supposed to be watching a baseball game. Things are the way they are, I wouldn't say I'm hostile, angry, volitile or any of those dramatic words.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 23 (view)
 
Mental Attitude and Dating Success or Failure
Posted: 11/30/2010 3:36:37 AM
Fantastic! This was pretty much exactly what I wanted to talk about. You guys are way ahead of me.

I am definitely the synical, bitter, "dating-sux," guy y'all are talking about here. I haven't been on an honest-to-goodness date in about 4 years, and not for lack of trying...and not-trying.

For the past (xx number of) years I've gone through periods where I try to lay off and not look for someone with the "you'll find her when you're not looking" mentality, and periods where I put a lot of effort into finding someone, and then back and forth, and back and forth, and back and forth. Neither one has actually worked for me...like, at all.

Judging by my last forum entry here, I've been in the apply-absolutely-no-effort mode for about a year, and that has been fine. I'm part of the music scene in my community, I'm an amateur concert/comedy promoter, I play and sing in two bands, and a solo thing. I'm keeping pretty busy, and I can be reasonably sure that at any venue I play or promote at, there really isn't much likelyhood of any women to meet. I've kept myself in something of a sterile environment. Sad but true, but again, I've been cool with that. All things considered, it's been a nice, albeit lonely, 12 or so months. I have had a reasonable measure of happiness I think, but again, lonely. I realize it's a good temporary thing, not a way to live my life.

Then today, someone made an off-hand comment while (I assume) she thought I was out of the room about how I was "ugly," while telling another co-worker how handsome he is (although I don't think she realizes he's gay). When you get down to it, knowing that I am pretty much seen as the real-life version of quasimodo is my biggest, and maybe only, insecurity. For some reason, it sent me into that familiar spiral of how I was going to be alone forever, nobody would ever love me, blah blah blah, yadda yadda yadda. Don't get me wrong, I have a mirror, and I'm not delusional: I know how people see me. I've been actually working at not thinking about my date-less situation, and I was rather violently reminded.

So okay, such people are essentially undateable. That's not exactly a shock, that's why I've been a dating-hermit. Realistically, how do I fix it? Or can I? I mean, it seems to me that the antidote to a mindset brought on by a string of negative experiences would at least have to start with a positive experience...which by all accounts isn't likely to happen. Basically, I have my actual, personal experience: My own reality. How am I supposed to override that?

I think the word "damaged" was used above. Is that where I'm at now?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 52 (view)
 
Tall Men Speed Dating
Posted: 12/4/2009 12:14:51 AM

Oh please! You've never heard the term, "Gentlemen prefer blondes?"


Yes, but only because its a movie.


And the light blonde hair color is the overwhelming color favorite and it is just not because women happen to like it. Yes, there is variety, but the odds are that more guys will like blonde.


Actually, I don't think that's true. Among minorities it certainly isn't true. Realistically, even white men are pretty divided, so to say its the overwhelming majority isn't true. It might be the most popular, but in much the same way McDonald's is more popular than Burger King, Wendy's and Subway. Not the majority, just the most popular. Secondly, where I am (Korea) blondes are really not that popular, maybe because there are so few. Lastly, women can always bleach or dye their hair.


The same goes with weight. Yes, there are guys that like "some junk in the trunk," but the overwhelming majority like thin women. Some guys like small chests, but a majority like large chests. Some guys are into legs but a majority like long, shapely legs.


Actually, men certainly prefer women who are curvy as opposed to thin, or fat. And moderate breasts to either large or small. I think you're really underestimating how many guys stand with Sir Mix-a-Lot. Guys' preferences actually fall into something like a bell curve in most cases. Some of us like the extremes, or outliers, but most of us like somewhere in the middle. As has been mentioned here, women reject short, and go for a very small segment of the population between 6'1 and 6'4, and not just in our culture, but most cultures. Women's preferences are far more skewed than men's.


Both of the above have to do with cultural stereotypes and many times as guys we're driven by them. In other countries and cultures, other stereotypes are held. Guess what? Men's height is a stereotype as well. As mentioned in this thread, there are *some* women that like short men - but I'll agree that it seems the majority like tall men. Just like "on average" guys like large chested, thin blondes with long shapely legs. That's just society.


There might be some effect among white, suburban frat boys, and business executives, but guys are typically very diverse in their tastes. We're fixated on how women look, but we don't agree what the right look is. The idea that men prefer thin women is actually a stereotype that women have created themselves because they prefer to be thin. Men overwhelmingly prefer some curves. The stereotype that men prefer blondes has disipated since the 50's when blondes were only found among white women. As we become more racially diverse, we have found that hair colour is not the favorite among men anymore, and we're pretty evenly split. Today, women actually dictate much of what is deemed socially attractive for both men and women. That's why they're the ones who wear the "blondes have more fun" shirts.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 51 (view)
 
Tall Men Speed Dating
Posted: 12/3/2009 6:34:16 PM
Just move to nearby Mexico. The average is 5'4 for men there. Or if you're going all the way you can always go to Indonesia and you'll find the average man at 5'2.


That's another option. I simply moved to Korea. Average height is 5'5 for a man.


In fact, guys have to be the most shallow of the sexes when it comes to superficial preferences ... and in fact we've gotten women to buy into them. For example, how many times have you seen t-shirts on women saying, "Blondes are more fun."


Wait, women are wearing shirts that say blondes are more fun, and that's the fault of men? If it would promote myself, I would wear a shirt that says "short men last longer." I'm certainly not working from a preference women have put forth.

Yeah, I'm going to defend my gender here.

Men at least are diverse. As someone else on here once put it, women can come in pratctically any make or model, and there will be a guy out there for whom that is attractive, and even sexy. There are men who like blondes, brunettes, or redheads. Some like extremely thin, some with "some junk in the trunk", some BBW, some in between. Big breasts, small breasts, pale, tanned, athletic, cuddly, tall, short, whatever, guys' preferences are all over the map. Women are overwhelmingly attracted to just one type of guy, to the point where our society has named the ideal man "tall, dark and handsome."

If you put ten men in a room with 50 women, there would be almost no agreement among them as to whom the most attractive woman in the room is. If you did the same with women, odds are they would almost all agree on the most attractive 3.

As a test, ask five of your female friends who they think the most attractive celebrity is. I would be willing to wager that at least one of those 5 will say Johnny Depp. I've been hard pressed to find a female celebrity that men are as consistenly attracted to.

Maybe men are more superficial in their preferences, but at least guys have varied preferences. We're all attracted to something different. Women all swoon for the same guy.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 73 (view)
 
pee
Posted: 12/2/2009 8:35:31 AM
I just was caught by the thread title. That's way beyond my expertise...good luck though.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 42 (view)
 
Tall Men Speed Dating
Posted: 12/2/2009 8:25:56 AM
You just answered your own question--there ARE no other speed dating events (acc to you)


Okay. And grant me here, I'm just trying to understand the female psyche. If they were to offer open dating, regardless of height, women would not show. If dating were only open to men over 6', then women would show. I grant you its the only game in town. My question is why is it the only game in town? Supply is dictated by demand. Why this particular demand? I'm sure this company would have loved to get their hands on my money, but so far they are not particularly willing to take it. Why not? The answer standing at the moment is because women are in no way interested in men who might be under 6' tall.

Does anyone disagree with this assessment?

No, but those women are. So lucky you--you get to avoid those!!


Yeah, but its not just "these women" but indicative of women as a whole. This city is 400,000 strong afterall, and this is the only game in town. If women were interested at all in men under 6' tall, then there wouldn't be such a restrction, correct?

Look at it this way...according to this company, women are unwilling to spend money on such an endeavour if there is even the chance that one man will be under 6 feet tall, but when its guaranteed that all will be above that...game's on?! I'm just trying to understand what happens here. It's not "these women" once you have a sample of 400,000, but women as a whole.

The average is 5'9. Why is three inches such a dealbreaker?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 40 (view)
 
Tall Men Speed Dating
Posted: 12/2/2009 7:57:54 AM
However getting women to pay for anything dating-related, even potential match-making, is a much tougher marketing job. Therefore I suspect that this Tall Men event was an astute marketing ploy to bolster female attendance since one of women's top complaints is guys being too short for them when in heels.


That may be simple, but is that really the whole answer? Are women really that shallow? I should hope not, otherwise I'm in a whole lot of trouble. I'm kinda depending on my personality and values here. If I'm getting rejected because I don't wear extra soles in my shoes, that's kinda sad.

I found 2 very short men on this site who contacted me and both were very competitive...competing with me and it totally turned me off. I'm 5'2 but prefer men 5'10 and taller.


Okay...That doesn't mean that all men under 5'10 are ultra-competitive. I'm 5'10, and I certainly am not. Why would that turn you off "short" men instead of competitive men?

And just for the record, said speed dating company has no record of what my height is.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 39 (view)
 
Tall Men Speed Dating
Posted: 12/1/2009 5:08:54 PM
Again, I just wanted to explain that this town is big enough that they host this, but all that is available is Tall Men Speed Dating.

In other markets they have other events (although no petite women events), but in London, only Tall Men once every 6 months apparently.

Why are women more going to the event where all the men are above 6', but not when there may be men below 6'?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 37 (view)
 
Tall Men Speed Dating
Posted: 12/1/2009 4:44:21 PM

I just binged it--three short men speed dating events out there. And as an additional bonus, two of the local [not short men] events were SOLD OUT for men, but still looking for women.


And where is that?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 10 (view)
 
Tall Men Speed Dating
Posted: 11/29/2009 3:37:57 AM
cracker31:


This is not about discrimination.


I never said it was. I asked if there was a double standard.


There are more speed dating events than there are chickens


I will challenge that in a moment.


- something went wrong in your registration and it's been four years and you still haven't sorted it out.


I don't see how. All they have is my name, my date of birth, my email, my city of residence, and that I'm a male. And yes, its all correct.


Why don't I help you out.


Oh, you don't have to, I'm not looking to do it anymore, and I don't even live in London now.


When I finish typing this, I will look at your profile, see where you live, "Google" speed dating (insert where you live here), then send you all the options.

God almighty, now I've heard everything.

Edit - The first page of google was full of speed dating organisations in London, Ontario. They will all organise events that cater for people your height, just make sure you register for the right events.


Oh well since you went ahead, let's have a look. The first one that comes up for me is the site I was talking about. The second one is actually just an offshoot of the first, and offers the same event(s). The third one just links to the first site, and various other matchmaking services. Then I have a few from Toronto. Then one more from London which has no upcoming events. Then two common, popular dating sites, one of which I'm registered on, so I took a look and there are no events organized for London in the forseeable future. Then last on the page, it's PoF. None of these "cater" to people of my height, nevermind all of them.

So, I decided to look for events in Petrolia, Ontario (a fairly small community near London that simply does not have the number of people, or really a venue to facilitate speed dating), and yes, most of the same sites pop up.

Sorry, gotta disagree with ya.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 1 (view)
 
Tall Men Speed Dating
Posted: 11/28/2009 9:23:50 PM
So about 4 years ago I signed up for a speed dating site. It was pretty sophisticated and made a lot of promises about creating dating opportunities customized for me. They set up these speed dates, or similar types of events in my town, and send me email invitations for the events to sign up for. Events are by invitation only, and cost about $80 per ticket.

About 3 years ago, I finally got an invitation to one such event, and bought a ticket. However, when I got there they informed me that I couldn't go in because it was a "Tall Men" event, and I needed to be at least 6 feet tall to participate. I am 5'10. I got a refund for the ticket, and realistically, I didn't read the email well enough, and that's my fault. But what the heck? You must be 6' or taller to go on this ride? Have I pointed out that being above 5'9", I'm actually taller than average?

Since that time I received another invitation for another Tall Men event, which I ignored, obviously. And today, I received my third invitation in 4 years to the same Tall Men event.

Maybe I'm being too sensitve, and giving in to a certain insecurity. However, I have not been invited to the "Buxom Ladies" event where the women must all have D cups. I did not receive my invitation to the "Lightweights" event where the women must be under 110 pounds. I know that I wasn't invited to the "Short Men" event where all the men must be under 6'. In fact, I have not been invited to the "Come Whomever May" event where anyone is allowed to come regardless of what they look like.

Isn't this a bit of a double standard?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 49 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 11/28/2009 8:41:38 PM
There's a big difference between genuinely not worrying about it, and acting like you're not worried to see if it changes anything.


I don't know. When I was in university I had a lot of other things to worry about (keeping grades high, finishing my thesis, working 3 jobs). However, I went back to school so that one day I would be able to provide for a family I plan to have. When I graduated I had a feeling of "okay, now where did I leave off?"

What you're saying is "stop wanting it." Honestly, I don't think I can do that. I want kids, and I want a family, and getting a date or two is a very necessary first step in that. Can I stop worrying about it and focus on other things for a while? Maybe. Can I stop wanting it? Am I going to forget that I want a family? I really doubt it.

All that being said: I might have been wrong. Maybe I am getting better at this. I went out Friday, and got rejected pretty hardcore. Then I realized that while I wasn't at my most confident, and still got burned, I was with it enough to try. And then last night I had a really good show, and I guess I feel energized again. I'm still a bit depressed, or maybe just disappointed, but I think I am going t get better.

Thanks (again) for all the responses. See you all back here again in three months.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 19 (view)
 
As you get older, are you more accepting of cultural differences?
Posted: 11/28/2009 8:14:18 PM
to fishnet10:

My dad married a woman from Mexico for whom English was a second language. Her English is very good, but not perfect, and she often has to make sure she has certain phrases correct, and ask the meaning of new words. They may have had less common ground, but on my dad's side at least he was somewhat fascinated by the differences in culture. As it turns out my dad has spent the years since they met learning Spanish, and how to cook Mexican food, which I see as embracing those differences.

I know my dad has loved all those things that are different, and that it gives him exposure to a whole new world that wasn't available before.

I am a Canadian living in South Korea, and I find that people are fascinated by my differences, although not all like them. That's fine.

Do people become more accepting as they get older? I think some people do. However, I think some people are always accepting, and some people never are. Of course I'm from Canada, and there may be certain cultural differences between where I live and where you live.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 47 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 11/27/2009 2:08:54 AM
To be honest, I've found that taking a break just doesn't work for me. I've been alone for 9 years. I've had periods where I just said I'm not going to worry about it, mostly during school. Nothing happened, nobody magically appeared. Taking breaks just means I wallow in loneliness, and I'll need something to pull me out of it, and start trying again. I have to work at it. The idea that I can accomplish something by doing nothing doesn't work for me. I understand this advice if you keep getting into bad relationships, but I'm not getting into any relationships, and they don't come looking for me.

Don't get me wrong, I'm good at being alone. I've been alone for as long as I can remember. But I'm sick of it, and if I settle for that, then that's where I'm settling. Doing nothing is a solution to nothing, and realistically, I'm running out of time.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 44 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 11/26/2009 4:54:17 PM
When you're ready, I think you may need to alter how you are interacting with the girls you meet. For some reason these girls are not putting you into the dating category. You say its the TDaH that are getting all the girls, but they are putting themselves out there are making their intentions clear. I mean I think it would be pretty rude if a girl I invite out and she knows I like her comes to see my show and leaves with another guy before I'm even done. Why would she think its acceptable to do that to you?


Okay, so what do I do to make my intentions clear? To be honest, I'm pretty sure I have, and can only think of one instance in the past while where I didn't.

However, I think I've clearly identified why I'm not being put into the dating category. For example this is more or less what set me off last night. We have a new male teacher at the school, and all the women had been checking out his Facebook page, and they were all excited. He's tall, and slim, and has long hair. However, when he does shows up, he's cut his hair, he's got acne, he's pale, and has no chin. You could actually see them shift him from the dating category to the no-dating category. And they hadn't even spoke to him yet. It was the difference between them moving to open up the circle of conversation for TDaH, while No-chin was standing outside it.

Then I spent the night people watching for something I've been trying to figure out. Another co-worker brought a friend who was a TDaH. Now whenever TDaH approached one of these women to talk, they would turn toward him before he sat down, or leaned against the bar, even when they were in conversation with someone else, sometimes stopping conversation. When no-chin did it, they wouldn't engage him until he started talking, one actually turned her back to him, until her conversation was done. Now to be fair, all of these women are perfectly nice, they don't mean to do this, but I'm becoming more aware of this. I mean for the TDaH this really is a huge advantage. All he has to do is not screw up, and he keeps their attention. No-chin, or for that matter, myself, has to work to get it.

So I kept watching. At one point, TDaH had two women laughing and engaged in a story about how drunk he was last weekend. While No-chin had another co-worker looking around the room as he talked about his trip to Vietnam from the week before (although she was very interested in that when she was checking out his Facebook page).

Then one of my co-workers commented that he seemed like a creep, and was pushy. When I asked what he said, she said they she didn't really talk to him. And I can see why he seemed pushy, he had to fight to get anyone's attention, even though he was a point of interest before people got a good look at him.

Now, I look at it from where I stand. Of course I can't compete with TDaH. He has their attention before he does anything. He keeps their attention no matter what he says. He's always going to be confident because they give him cues to be confident. Before I even sit down, I'm labelled a creep, and women turn away. They're looking around the room for something better. He doesn't have to try, and I have to work. That's why I can't win.

That girl who left my show with the other guy. She knew I was interested. I still run into her and she still thinks I'm interested. Something better came along, and she went for it. I can't compete with that.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 42 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 11/26/2009 8:25:40 AM
Well, I'm oh so proud to try to get this rather pitiful thread up and running again.

Help me out with the "don't put all your eggs in one basket" bit. I can't seem to do that. I tried it out. I had been flirting with a number of girls, but honestly, I wasn't all that interested in any of them. Then I met one who was great. She came out to a bunch of my shows, and we flirted a lot, even got within inches of a great kiss on a snowy balcony, and she freaks out. Then she tells me that she's a bit of a tease, and she just wants to be friends.

Alright, I get that. Whatever.

Somehow, I'm back to where I was when I first made this thread. These other girls I was talking to, somehow seem stale. And for some reason I feel like an idiot because of this, and have been avoiding talking about it with anyone.

I would be fine not putting all of my eggs in one basket, but I can't seem to find enough eggs to do that.

I also wanted to point out, that while wandering the threads here, looking for some optomism, I found a thread I was interested in, only to find out that I was the one had started it more than 3 years ago. And I joined PoF after years without any kind of human contact. I haven't so much as kissed a girl in 9 years. How sad is that? How am I supposed to feel confident with that looming over me?

I also want to touch on something else. Someone said get your confidence from something other than women. I do. I'm a teacher, and I'm a good one. I sing and play guitar in a band, and play shows every weekend. I'm very confident in these areas. I'm far more confident in these areas than most people. Being confident in these areas, just doesn't make me more confident with women, it only makes me confident in these areas.

Help. Anything new.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 3 (view)
 
Broken hearts? Heres an easy cure!
Posted: 11/22/2009 6:33:03 AM
Do I sense some sarcasm?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 38 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 8/9/2009 4:51:54 PM

Yes, stop putting all your eggs in one basket. By that I mean, have several women you are interested in and go out with (no sex, just hang out!). You should have invited several of them to the show. When you have all your eggs in one basket, it's easy to destroy your confidence.


Well, between not going after the wrong kind of girl, and keeping that basket full, that's a pretty tough line to walk. Our show was a last minute deal, and most people I knew already had plans on a Saturday night. There is maybe one other girl, but I'm pretty sure she's the wrong type. Then again, I don't think there's any other type...


Did you read "No More Mr Nice Guy" (Glover) yet? I'm telling you, it's the best $10 you could ever spend. How much is gaining normal level of confidence worth to you? Read the book and your problems will be solved.


I did read it, and just couldn't relate. Almost every example in the book relates back to a guy whose father was absent, abusive, or distant, or had a mother who was overbearing, and then talks about how to get past that. That just wasn't my life, so I'm having a hard time taking much from the book. Unless I'm missing something...


One last thing. Stop looking at women as being a prize and start seeing YOURSELF as a prize....


You know what? I know. In fact, I do think I should be the prize. I honestly do think I'm a great guy. I deserve someone great, and should I ever meet a woman looking for a guy with actual depth, and sincere charm I think I'll fit that. Right now, I'm just having a hard time believing that such a person exists, given what I've seen.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 35 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 8/9/2009 5:41:52 AM
Thanks vaude,

However, I just don't think that's the best idea. I don't know that all of this will be worth it. Everytime I get rejected, or let down, every year that goes by that I'm still alone, its all just a reminder that there's a very real possibility that I will never actually find anyone. Looking into the future is just not a good idea.

Thanks for the thought.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 34 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 8/9/2009 4:47:45 AM
To Leanco,

To be honest, I don't really know what kind of girls you're talking about. Truth be told, I know better than to go after the "hotties," and tend to go after the "plain Janes" as you put it. Honestly, I would have thought the same thing as you: Maybe the plainer girls will have more depth, and care less about physical appearance. Nope, not so far, if there's any chance of getting with TDaH then I'm a waste of time.

As for the book. Fair enough, tell me about boundaries...

And to be fair, I have never known an alpha male who was just themselves. To me they have always been practiced, insincere, calculated, and more egotistical than anything...
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 31 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 8/8/2009 11:20:57 AM
By the way, I did read Glover's No More Mr. Nice Guy, and leant it to a friend to read on my behalf to see if she could get something from it, and we just didn't. The whole book is based on the premise that I did not have a good relationship with my father...but I did, so all the advice it gives is sort of a moot point.

What's next on the reading list?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 30 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 8/8/2009 11:13:42 AM
Okay, so I'm bringing up this thread...yet again.

Here's my update. Someone said lose some weight...I've been going to the gym for about the past 6 months, and lost about 15lbs. I've also put on a fair bit of muscle and look a lot better, as well as cut my hair shorter to minimize the fact that I'm losing my hair. People have noticed a difference.

Someone on here said, do something you love...so I joined two bands where I sing and play guitar. Not to overstate myself, I'm not the greatest singer or guitarist, but I'm pretty good, I know people are somewhat impressed. And don't get me wrong, next Friday and Saturday, I'm going to go out and play again.

Someone said dress well...I spent the better part of my last two paychecks on yet another new wardrobe. And this time I went all out...tailored suits, vests, shirts, jeans, pants and some over-the-top stuff to wear on stage.

I was feeling pretty good, my confidence was finally high again, so invited a girl I was interested in to come out and watch me play. She came out, and seemed excited to see it. However, she went home with some talk-dark-and-handsome before my set was even finished.

Suffice it to say, my confidence is basically back to zero...maybe lower as I really don't think anything I do is ever really going to make a difference. I will always be short, no matter how much weight I lose I am always going to be big, and my hair will never grow back. Don't get me wrong, I still think I'm a great guy ,but let's face it, I just can't compete with the TDaH jerks out there.

Any other bright ideas?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 29 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 5/3/2009 4:07:28 PM

Nah you missed my point. If she picks him exclusively on his physical attributes without getting to know him then she's not the kind of woman you want anyway.


Well, I don't know. I know the one girl I was talking about earlier pretty well, she's one of my best friends. We have differences on some basic ideological views so we've ended up where we are. Realistically, I think she's awesome, and I think I'd be lucky to find someone similar. But she's only attracted to the TDaH, shoots down guys who are too short, and frankly has consistently picked losers in even the short time I've known her.


If I were you, do what I did. Get your butt to the gym (at least 3 days a week) and work out hard. You'd be amazed at how fast you can get into shape with diet and exercise.


Once again, I'm way ahead of you on that. I've been doing well, and lost a lot of weight just eating better, and hitting the gym whenever I can. You're right, I'm looking better in just a few weeks, and I can see that it will make a big difference in a few months.


All I am saying is think Cognitive Behavioral Therapy. (CBT). You will "project" to others externally how you feel about yourself INTERNALLY. Women have a keen sense and can pick this up. Stop thinking about what she's going to think about you and just ask yourself "How do I feel about myself?" Until you say "I'm great!" nobody else is going to think so.


I am great. What now?


Read it a couple times through (it's not all that long) then come back and let us know if you've picked up anything that will help rebuild your confidence. Can't tell ya how valuable that book has been for me :)


Then I'm looking forward to it.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 26 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 5/3/2009 3:07:33 PM
What you aren't understanding is these guys who meet their physical ideal haven't proven they have the right personality for these women. So what if their ideal guy is really tall or has some kind of facial features they want?


No, I do get that. It's kind of my point actually. If this guy's won solely on physical attributes, and not in any way on his personality, and all I really have to work with is my personality...it just seems like a lost cause.


Because you haven't learned how to be happy and content with who you are, that sends off a NEGATIVE vibration to women. And trust me, they can pick up on this. Why WOULD they settle for someone like you? Someone who doesn't love himself and someone lacking confidence?


I either have to disagree with this, or get some clarification. I know some of these TDaHs who consistently pick up girls, and with most of them I wouldn't say that they even particularly like themselves. They have ego, and confidence, sure. But when they did get rejected, they were far worse than me. The trick was they rarely got rejected. I literally know a TDaH (I won't say he's a friend) who got down on his knees and beg a girl for her number. Another started spreading rumours about a girl who turned him down. So, keep that in mind when I say I don't understand what you mean by "loving yourself." Unless you mean in a narcisstic way, I don't see how these guys are any further ahead in the game than I am, but these guys almost never get rejected. As for lacking in confidence...well, that's why I started the thread.


Just be yourself, find something funny (not offensive) to say and take it from there. Try not to put expectations on them. Learn to be immune to rejection and keep trucking. When you do this over the course of months you'll start to become more confident.


Well, I could try that. I'd just think I'd be pretty immune already, but I'm not. I mean, I'm not expecting anything right now, but/because I don't feel particularly confident.


I'd also suggest reading "No More Mr. Nice Guy" (Glover) because the book is really good at helping men become confident, well balanced and good. (Not jerks or door mats).


Well I hope so, because I've already ordered it. I'm just waiting for it to arrive.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 24 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 5/3/2009 9:38:15 AM
Once again I've let this go for a week with nothing to add, and then return. Sorry. But in reading back over it, I'm confused. From people I've gotten the advice (as paraphrased by another poster) "Suck it up," or "keep swinging"...at the same time I'm also getting advice which essentially says don't go out expecting a date because I'm trying too hard. Now, it seems to me that these sort of conflict (don't really try vs. keep trying because of the law of averages). I'm hoping someone can clear this up for me. I mean not trying to get a date doesn't strike me as particularly different from what I'm doing now, which is simply to attract some sort of attention. Realistically, I'm not the guy who just attracts attention simply by being.

That being said, I kept a pretty low profile this weekend. I went out with my friends, a couple of nights, and just hung out with the boys another. I basically, took the "don't worry about it and just go out and have fun" approach. So I wasn't expecting anything, and lo and behold nothing happened. That's fine, frankly I didn't meet anyone interesting anyway, so it worked out great for me.

However, I spent a good deal of my weekend nights watching people interact, and I can't help but notice that the Tall, Dark and Handsomes (TDaH's) out there seem to have a serious advantage over me.

I watched a guy, right in front of me come to a table where we were sitting, and frankly was funny, and sincere, and interacted well with everyone. While most everyone else at the table was impressed, my 29-year old friend whom he was actually hitting on shot him down. Why? Well there was this other guy that she was interested in, who was really cute and she was hoping he'd come over instead. And the guy we liked was too short anyway (said the girl who was 5'0).

I then listened as a girl (who shot me down about 4 months ago because she likes "taller, thinner men") literally cried because the TDaH she has a crush on, but has never actually met, went home with another girl that we know. (I admit, I did take a certain amount of satisfaction from this particular non-encounter. I'm a bit ashamed of it though.)

My point is this: This is why I have problems with confidence. These guys have won the girl over just by being there, and being the physical ideal. They haven't even said anything to the girl, and they're turning down other, seemingly good guys in the off chance they'll come over, or start crying when they don't. Now, I grant you, these girls seem to me to be somewhat immature, and these examples (albeit from a single night when I was paying attention) are a bit extreme, but its seems to be true, or common even with the less extreme, everyday girls. Seriously, how do I compete with that? My only weapon is that I'm actually funny and charming (and talented, and sincere, and honest, and smart, and obviously humble, and just a little abstract), and for some reason, I have to hope that that's enough, and fight my way just to get noticed. These guys just have to show up.

I mean, everyone says "just be yourself, " and just be confident, and I believe them...but I can't get past these guys who aren't actually anybody yet, who haven't even said a word, who have no identity whatsoever that we know of, and they've already got the girl. I mean, I don't see how the two concepts go together.

I know I'm just sounding negative, and what I'm saying goes agaisnt what everyone is suggesting, but I can't get past this. This is reality as I see, and experience it. All the qualities in myself that I admire, and that I feel others should appreciate don't seem to come into play. They don't seem to matter as long as the guy is not Tall, Dark, and Handsome. Again, I hope I'm wrong, so by all means tell me I am. I just don't see how I'm wrong. Why would anyone settle for me, if they could get me, but 2 inches taller, 15 pounds lighter, a perfectly symmetrical face, and better hair?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 20 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 4/26/2009 6:18:19 AM
Okay, I've left this alone for a little bit as I've had a bit of a rough go at work this week, between report cards, meeting parents, and watching more hockey. But here I am back again. And thanks for all the replies.

Now, I've had so many people tell me to listen. Not to continue to sound negative, but I do listen. In fact, that's usually about all I do. Believe me, part of me would love to talk about myself (because when you get down to it, I'm a pretty interesting guy), but I just tend to try to avoid it.

I should also add, that at the moment I'm in Korea, and meeting people who speak English in places other than bars is rare. That being said, I've never just tried to "pick up," as I generally meet people through people I already know, it just happens that we socialize a lot in bars.

That being said, I made friends with two more couples this weekend. The one couple apparently "adores" me. I also had two of my girls suggest that they want to set me up with friends. Obviously, at the moment I have to little to no confidence about either one...it is the title of the thread afterall.

I should also add that I've been working hard the past two weeks, and I've lost about 5 pounds. I've got a long way to go, but its a start.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 10 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 4/19/2009 4:39:21 PM
Well firstly let me add this: Failure is also a necessary step on the path to complete and utter failure. And something else that's good to learn from? Actual success in some shape or form.

But the problem is that with each failure I learn stuff that contradicts what I learned from each previous failure. (1) Be yourself...okay. (2) Be confident...okay I did that. (3) Be overtly confident (apparently I can't use the word I want to here)...well that's not really being myself, but okay. (4) Be vulnerable...well that's being a little less than confident, but okay I'll do that too. (5) Be aloof, and pretend you're not really interested. (6) Make sure she knows that you are interested...wait, what? (7) Be direct. (8) Be aloof. (9) Be aggressive. (10) Be patient. And then this continues until everything I've learned, and everything I do all contradicts rule #1, and saps from what I need to follow rule #2.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 8 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 4/19/2009 4:17:34 PM
Doesn't self confidence refer to Confidence in yourself?

Let me put it this way:
I have a friend who is constantly late for work. As a result most people at work do not give her work that needs to be done first thing in the morning. Why? Looking at past experience, we just don't have confidence that she'll make it in on time.

I have a friend who always says "I'll call you with the info," and then never does. As a result whenever we try to plan something, I call him. Why? Looking at past experience, I just don't have confidence that he'll call me before things just fall apart.

Now my turn. Women just don't seem to be interested in me (or at least single, available women don't seem to be). Nevertheless, I still go out and fail over, and over again. Looking at past experience, I just don't have confidence that they'll be interested in me.

This "just have confidence in yourself" stuff just eludes me. Simple psychology says that we have confidence in ourselves while doing things we do well. We don't have confidence in ourselves while doing things we don't do well. I apparently, really don't do this well.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 6 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 4/19/2009 3:10:55 PM

just take it slow man i think your stepping in to the plate way too fast. Get to know her be her friend and what not.


To be fair, I've been talking to this girl through texts and emails for a while now, and while I've been doing my best to show that I'm interested, I'm also skating being relegated to just being her friend.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 5 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 4/19/2009 3:04:32 PM

Many guys think they women want to know "all about them". They go and and on about all of the interesting things they do any what they have won, etc. Women are polite and will listen but typically they are not looking for the life of the party.


Yeah, I really didn't do that. I barely spoke about myself at all. In fact, by the end of the night, the only things she really knows about me are things that we have in common (i.e. we're both hockey fans, I used to live in her neighbourhood, we have similar jobs, we're both amateur film critics), and that only came out as I was learning about her. That being said, the general discussion at the table that I starred in basically revolved around movies (which I had already learned she was interested in), and had very little to do with me personally.

And for the record, from someone who generally doesn't like being the centre of attention- yes, women do in fact look for the life of the party more often than they don't.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 3 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 4/19/2009 8:23:00 AM
That sounds great, but I can't even get a date.

I just spent a night where at the end I felt I had charmed everyone except anyone who mattered. All of the guys, and all of the married, or coupled ladies walked away thinking I was this great, funny, charming guy. I literally got 3 guys' phone numbers to play cards, or golf. I was smart, I was funny, I was the life of the party. The lone single, approachable woman who came out was more interested in tall, dark and handsome who couldn't even seem to put a cognicent thought together, and barely spoke to me. And that's fine, if this was a one time occurence, but this is basically the story of my life. What the hell am I doing wrong, except avoiding plastic surgery?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 1 (view)
 
Losing Streak/Self-Confidence
Posted: 4/19/2009 7:55:34 AM
So, I'm on a hell of a losing streak right now. Basically, my question is, when you strike out every single time you go to the plate, where are you supposed to get self-confidence from? Every time I lose, I lose a lot of what little confidence I have left. I'm not even sure how I manage to get up in the morning.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 11 (view)
 
Working or waiting?
Posted: 4/9/2009 2:45:52 AM
Just as a bit of an update, I sing and play guitar and just committed to an open mic night nearby. Don't know if that's worth anything.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 9 (view)
 
Working or waiting?
Posted: 4/7/2009 5:47:32 PM

I agree with Landra here, you're trying too hard, and you're also most likely giving off negative vibes "I'm not good enough, but please give me a chance anyway". You have to believe in yourself first and foremost, and you don't. Sure, you've written that people tell you what a great guy/catch you are, but you don't believe it yourself, and until you do, women are going to pick up on that stench Landra speaks of.


Honestly, I would say I believe I'm a great guy. Where I get conflicted is that in our culture, I don't think that matters very much.


You seem to be looking at this as a situation of either doing all these social activites in the hopes of meeting a mate, or returning to the recluse life. It shouldn't be one extreme or the other. You should be doing activites that you enjoy doing, and if you meet someone that would be a bonus, but you'll also feel in better spirits because you're doing something you truly enjoy, which will naturally attract others.


I think the problem is that a lot of the things I enjoy are by their nature very solitary. I mean, I've been alone a long time, and I've adapted my lifestyle to that. The truth is, I worry that I got too comfortable being alone, and that its only because I want to meet someone that I socialize at all. I'm not sure that's true, but it is a concern for me.


I looked at your profile, and here's another idea. You state you're a few extra pounds, do you exercise/workout? I'm not saying this to offend you or to say that you need to lose weight to find a partner. I say this because consistently working out, weight training and cardio, are great mood elevators and stress relievers, it's something to consider, as well as yoga and meditation.


I was working out, and sort of fell behind (that's to say stopped going). I have a friend who knows a good gym nearby, and I'm just waiting for her to show me where it is (its honestly hidden).


There's also no shame in seeking therapy/counseling to help with your self esteem issues and depression, you're human and sometimes we need a little help when we stumble and fall.


It's funny. As you brought this up, I had to stop and think how long I was in counseling for, and it was over 5 years. I initially started going to get over my shyness, which I did to an extent, but not entirely. Being in a foreign country now where English is not an official language, counseling isn't readily available. This forum is essentially my counseling.

But the one breakthrough I could never make was my belief that generally, when trying to meet people my age, having a sense of humour, being intelligent, being well spoken, having good character, etc., none of it matters if you're not physically attractive. I know someone is going to disagree with me on this, and honestly I'm hoping someone can convince me otherwise (but believe me, I will defend this belief), but I know with self-esteem this is my big stumbling block (which is funny because it's not actually a self critique). And to be fair, experience is backing me up on this one.

Thanks for your ideas though buckeye, I am going to head back to the gym.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 8 (view)
 
Working or waiting?
Posted: 4/6/2009 4:35:11 PM
It's because you're trying too hard...My advice is to get a hobby you enjoy and forget trying to Meet Someone.


Thanks, but this is essentially the advice that I received to begin with. I crept away for nearly six years, and in all honesty became a recluse. Whenever I went out with people I always got that lonely-in-a-crowd feeling, and eventually just stopped socializing. That was a tough habit to break, and I know it hurt my confidence with people so much, the only way I got over it was to flee the country to where I knew people wouldn't know about it.

But on top of that, I'm approaching 32, and have had no physical or emotional contact from anyone in 9 years. For a guy who wants a family, and especially kids, and whose dating/relationship/sexual experience is practically nothing, going back to being a hermit, and not trying to fix whatever I'm doing wrong, is going to be a waste of time, and I think really damaging.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 5 (view)
 
Working or waiting?
Posted: 4/6/2009 6:08:44 AM
Thanks toyoux for the kind words. As it is I don't really know what I would find exciting right now, but then again I am recognizably depressed today. Exciting for me is going to a concert, or even a movie, but with my current situation those tend to be a little more difficult. I moved to Asia to teach English, and I find for the first time in my life, I really love my job. It does seem to help when making new friends, but I'm just not meeting anyone that I can click with, which is all I really want right now.

Also, thanks to GWSmith as well, as it seems I forgot to earlier, and probably came off a bit like a jerk. I've seen your posts around, and wish I had that positive attitude right now. I seem to have misplaced mine.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 4 (view)
 
Working or waiting?
Posted: 4/5/2009 4:23:22 PM
I feel like a failure right now because I've failed a lot, without any success. I'm not sure what else you'd call that. I'm not trying online. I did that for a year and a half. I got reviews and critiques on everything from pictures, to profiles, to letters out. After a boatload of emails, winks, flirts, nudges, and pokes, I didn't get even a single response. I'm done with online.

Truthfully, I'm apparently not desireable to anyone so I don't see how that could be the problem. Maybe my standards are too high except that I've had people tell me that I'm too good for some of the girls I've been interested in, and have had a constant chorus of "you deserve better." I even had one friend scold me because he thought I was only chasing the "unattractive girls" in the hopes that they'd have low standards.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 2 (view)
 
Working or waiting?
Posted: 4/5/2009 3:46:49 PM
I kind of think I just described what it was all about. I have tried everything I can think of, and nothing works for me. Everytime I change strategies, or try something new I do so in the hope that things will turn around for me, but they don't. It seems that there are almost no single people out there, and those I meet, just aren't interested in me. That I've essentially fallen back on wait and see, which has never worked for me in the past, doesn't instill a great deal of hope in me. Of course I have doubt. Nobody can fail this much and not have doubt. If I didn't have doubt at this point I would certainly be delusional.

I look at other people, and this part seems so easy for them. I don't get why it's been so impossible for me.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 1 (view)
 
Working or waiting?
Posted: 4/5/2009 10:29:20 AM
Before I get into this, let me preface by saying a few things:

I'm a really good guy. I'm smart, funny, honest, sincere, and just a really good person. I know this to be true. I really don't question myself in terms of character, value, and integrity. I'm not a great looking guy by any means, but I really am a top tier guy. I've also been single for almost 9 years, and I'm 31.

After feeling upset that my last girlfriend dumped me, and complaining how I couldn't seem to meet anyone my friends told me that old adage "someone will come along when you're not looking for them." Okay, so I went back to school, got a degree, and while I was busy between school and work, didn't date anyone, and didn't really try to. Admitedly I was somewhat content being by myself, especially while I was broke, and always busy. But once I had that degree I realized that my whole reason for getting it was to get a better job to support a family, which I still didn't actually have. Basically, I decided that the whole "not looking" thing was stupid, passive, and really not getting me anywhere. I mean, I was really good at being by myself, but I realized that I was getting too comfortable with it, and just waiting basically was useless.

So knowing that I wanted to meet someone, but not wanting to go back the clubs, my friends told me to try the "meet people in grocery stores" strategy, where you go to those "target-rich" areas where people you might find the type of person you'd like to meet. I went to concerts, movies, museums, cultural festivals, volunteered for a cancer charitible foundation, and the Memorial Boys & Girls Club fundraisers (I know, its tacky), I even got talked into a comic book convention (I take pride in being a geek, but I'm just not geeky enough to feel comfortable at a comic book convention, and let's face it the boys to girls ratio was not in my favor), all in the hopes of meeting someone interesting. I also tried speed dating (although I was too short to play), and online dating sites. Of course, I also did the usual social gatherings, parties, set-ups, and a few too many weddings to be good for my ego. And when none of that worked, I actually moved clear across the world, in the hopes that I'd meet other travellers to strike up conversations with.

Not only did none of this work, but I still felt very passive about it. I mean, I'd go to a party, and literally be the 17th wheel (8 couples and me), and then feel I was wasting my time. I volunteered at a charity, and found that everyone else volunteering was 20 years older than I am, and then felt guilty because I felt bad for not meeting anyone, when I should have just taken pride in doing something worthwhile. In the end, most of the time I just felt like I was "waiting for something to come a long." I know that's not true because I was putting effort into it, but it did often feel almost as passive to me as not looking at all because I so rarely met anyone.

So, one day I was complaining to a (much younger) friend about it. He invited me to go clubbing, and voila, I became a club junkie. Now granted, I'm not really into it, but at least I feel a bit more active about it. I went out and spent $2000 on new clothes and shoes. I hated my hair, so I decided to cut it short so it at least looked neat. I've been going to the gym again tp try to lose a few. I spent $300 so far on David DeAngelo, and other such programs (which still sort of disgusts me), and have been trying some of it out. Now I have improved since my early clubbing days, and I'm not the stereotyped slimy guy in the club. I'm classy, polite, and not drunkenly aggressive. I get some phone numbers, but everything just dries up before I can even get a date. Let's just say, this has not been working too well either. However, at least it feels like I'm doing something. It feels like I'm working at it. I'm being pro-active.

But tonight, after realizing that this girl (the most recent among a number of girls) is never going to return my call, and once again feeling hopeless, and I was telling my friends I was just going to take it easy and more or less give up. All of my older friends are married, or in significant relationships. My more recent friends hook up with people, or are dating. I can't even get a date, it seems no matter what I do, I'm out of ideas, and I just feel lost.

My friends keep telling me what an awesome guy I am (and not to sound immodest as well as repetitive, but I really think I am, and I really believe that they think I am), but I find that makes this feel even worse. My friends say I deserve someone great, but that doesn't mean I'm going to find such a person. I'm not looking to find a wife, or even a girlfriend, I just want to make a connection with someone so that I know that I can. I just want something to show me that I can still hope for someone great.

I know its a rant, but seriously, where do I go from here? Where do I find hope in this situation?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 4 (view)
 
Do I still call?
Posted: 1/23/2009 9:13:00 PM
if she's casually porking some guy and you didnt know about it, and she didnt mentioned it( or even tried to justify it by saying she was seeing him)


To be fair, if the shoe were on the other foot, I probably wouldn't tell her about some girl I had previously been sleeping with in the first little while.


you have a gut feeling but you cant put your finger on it, I err on the side of caution here, actually no I would runnnnnnnn.


Actually, my gut feeling says to give her a chance (hence the dilemma), its just that walking away would be a whole lot easier, safer, and justifiable to boot. Nobody would really blame me for walking away. People might see me as a moron for giving her a chance. Most notably me.


she's going away to the islands and im not saying anything but Island trips can be lets just say what goes on in the islands hopefully should stay on the islands.


Yeah that's a doozy, and the one that really bugs me. However, I don't know what's happening, and I can't start assuming things either.


I say let her go and when she returns , see if she calls you, if she does , just taking casually dont seem desperate, just chat and keep it friendly.


I know she's not going to call because I said I would, and like I said, I'm not going to be the guy who says he's going to call, and then doesn't.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 3 (view)
 
Do I still call?
Posted: 1/23/2009 9:03:27 PM

I think you should listen to your friend if he's always looked out for you. He probably does have your best interests at heart.


Well, to be honest, I'm not sure my friend has always looked out for me. This is a first. I don't often ask these guys for advice. Actually, I've never asked this guy for advice, mostly because he's been a bit of a bonehead with the girl he's dating. I don't really know what his reasoning is for "don't date her."


However, I also think you should judge this girl for yourself and not because of what your friends say. It's always possible she's in love with this other guy and she may have allowed herself to become a booty call because of that. It's surprising what people will do if they fall for someone, especially if they are hurt or lack confidence. If that's the case, then she really does need someone who is not a user like him.


Yeah I'm sure I'd be good for her, but I can't reasonably make that part of the equation. I can only really consider what will be good for me.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 2 (view)
 
Do I still call?
Posted: 1/23/2009 7:17:40 PM
You think I should persue her?
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 137 (view)
 
Why does it seem that men dislike intelligent and witty women?
Posted: 1/23/2009 6:11:22 PM
Frankly, I wish I could meet more single, witty, intelligent women. Out of curiosity, where do you go to meet men? I think I should start finding a place like that.

(by the way we call the shallow, sexpots "woo girls." If you've seen that episode of How I Met Your Mother, you'll know what I mean.
 thebigid
Joined: 8/7/2006
Msg: 1 (view)
 
Do I still call?
Posted: 1/23/2009 6:07:37 PM
Someone help me out here, because I really don't know what to do.

As a backstory let me say that I really believe I'm a genuinely good guy. I've always been really overweight, and I've always been a bit insecure about it. However, in the past year and a bit, I've lost a lot of weight, and I'm feeling more confident. I've been going out with friends and I've been doing really well at meeting, and talking and interacting with women, which realistically I've never been able to do before. The problem is that I have a really hard time meeting someone I actually like, or want to even see again, which is great for my friends because I'm pretty much a permanent wing man. In fact, after going out twice a week for the past 8 or 9 months, I've only met two girls I've been interested in. The first girl basically shot me down very harshly, and my confidence was shot for a few weeks. But I actually got back up, and out, a tried again, and I'm actually kind of proud of that. In fact, a lot of the reason I was able to do that was because of the advice, and ideas of the posters on here, so help me out again, as I describe what's happened with the second girl.

This past week I went out with my friend (I'll call him Denny), this girl he's dating (I'll call her Margie), and some of her friends. Anyway, long story short I really hit it off with one of Margie's friends (I'll call her Allie), and got her number. Now honestly, I don't date a lot, I don't meet many girls I like, and don't get many phone numbers, but I actually like this girl, and I was pretty excited about it.

So, I call her up and we talked for a while, and we agreed we should go out for drinks. However, she's just about to go on vacation with some friends for a week (which I knew ahead of time because she's going with Margie), so I said I'd call next week after she gets back to set an actual date.

So she's on her way to the islands with her friends, and I went out for drinks last night with mine. Denny takes me aside and warns me that he knows that Allie had been casually sleeping with this other friend of Margie's, and just a week earlier they had a big blow up because this guy wants to sleep around with other women, and Allie's really upset at him for it (which frankly, suggests that it was more than casual for her). Anyway, within a few minutes Denny's warning turned from "I just thought you deserved to know what's up" to "I think it's best that you don't see her." When I had the chance to look back on the night we met, that guy was essentially sitting across from us for most of the night, and Allie may have been putting on a show. I then also realize that this guy is among the friends Allie and Margie are on vacation with.

Now, I take my friend's advice seriously, because it's what we do for each other. I'm the guy in the group who's giving out advice behind the scenes on how to react to things, what a girl might be thinking, and generally helping out my friends (God only knows why they take advice from me, or why it's good advice, my experience is almost nil), and nobody has really had the opportunity to do the same back.

So here's where I don't know what to do:

On the one hand, I'm already feel hurt because I feel like I might be being used to get back at someone, or I might be being set up as a rebound guy, neither of which I'm particularly thrilled about. I also don't want to get brushed off should they decide to hook up again. And frankly, that she is, or was this guy's booty call doesn't impress me much either.

On the other hand, I know that because of the particular circumstances we're in, even in the best case scenario we're never going to have any kind of long term relationship. The truth is I really like her, and have had fun talking with her, and I can't actually say that she's wronged me thus far. And to be honest, I just want to connect with someone and I felt that I had with her, even if I'm not sure now.

Right now I'm sort of inclined to walk away, although I can't put my finger on why. At the same time I still feel obliged to call her next week simply because I said I would, and all things considered I still don't want to be the guy that says he's going to call and doesn't.

Do I call, or not? If I do call, do I make an excuse to brush her off, or not? Do I take a chance on her, or not? Right now I honestly have no idea what to do.

Once again, your advice is appreciated. I'd like to think this is the last time I ask for it, but I think we all know that's not true.
 
Show ALL Forums