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 Author Thread: Do you put on a mask when you meet someone new, just to try to make a good first impression?
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 12 (view)
Do you put on a mask when you meet someone new, just to try to make a good first impression?
Posted: 6/10/2015 1:29:24 PM

Can someone help me! Pof has made me upgraded user and I didn't sign up to it or pay anymoney , please help me I don't want to be an upgraded user!!

I think Austin Powers did that. You're from the UK, so that makes perfect sense. ;)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 46 (view)
Why is it so hard for single moms to date?
Posted: 6/9/2015 11:06:12 PM

It seems like when I date single moms because that's my preference, they are harder to date then a woman without kids.

Uhhh, yeah, duh. They're likely working and juggling kids to take care of. It's harder on their free time of course. And you weren't the only dude jockeying for her lesser free time here in this sausage-fest rodeo we call POF. :)

I totally understand that moms are busy with the kids, work and school or etc. I feel that some single moms care about everything else and everybody else but don't take the time to do for themselves sometimes.

Then why is dating single moms a preference? A fetish? A hankering for a woman who wears Mom Jeans? :)
*SNL Commerical for 'Mom Jeans': "I'm not a woman anymore... I'm a MOM!"

Is it best suited for a single father to date women without children?

Oh, okay, that's why. Well, still... I can see dating a single mom as an Expectation... but as a Preference? Why? "Oh, your kids are grown up and out of the house? Sorry babe, I need someone who's a mom right now." Don't get it. I can understand women who are younger and haven't had kids less likely to date a guy with a kid(s). But of course, when they get older and don't have kids, they sort of have to expect running into guys who are single dads, too.

In the end though also -- they tend to have more custody (handling) of the kids than the guy. So statistically speaking, they tend to be less available than a single dad. I would avoid single moms with toddlers and the like, and who have full custody. That will expose you to ones with more air to breathe in the dating world.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 16 (view)
How long to wait for a meeting? Continued
Posted: 6/9/2015 10:49:37 PM

How long to wait for a meeting?

Assuming one's local, there really shouldn't be a "wait time" for the sake of waiting, if you've read each other's profiles and exchanged a few messages, to be honest. Thing is, at least 1 out of 2 of the people are going to have a life (whether it's a good one or not) -- so a conscious delay factor shouldn't enter into it.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 49 (view)
If you personally owned POF what would you change about it?
Posted: 6/9/2015 10:26:14 PM

When people receive a message, they have to pick a reason why they choose not to respond,

How about something different.... Prevent flooding (most) girls' inboxes with 1st messages (and repeated "1st" messages), by requiring a dual-party Yay selected off an embedded "Yay / Nay" marker to each profile? Much like making Meet Me if requiring a dual Yes in order for one to write another, but ridding Meet Me and making that embedded as part of the whole thing.

Saves guys time writing a message to someone who, statistically, is likely not to write back. Saves a gal time having to sift through inbox messages when writing back-n-forth to guys.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 10 (view)
Do you put on a mask when you meet someone new, just to try to make a good first impression?
Posted: 6/9/2015 9:07:03 PM

How we act around people is how we act, thus what ever we do it is "natural".

I pretty much agree. I think the whole "just be yourself" advice is more like "don't Consciously try and put a fake foot forward". But yeah, if you're actually nervous and come across with not much besides politically correct stuff coming to mind, lost a sense of creative sense of humor, etc -- that IS being yourself, even though that's not the same gear you'll be found to have when out with friends.

And also, to some extent you do Want to put a certain foot forward on a 1st date -- a true natural desire to. Much like (but to a lesser extent than) a job interview. You would like in a normal setting to kick your feet up on the interviewer's desk as you sit on the other side, but you're not Going to. You're at that point NOT going to want that concept, even though, outside of the situation you're in, sure, you like doing that.

That is why we Naturally shift gears. I think the best advice is to observe how you flow/act/roll in certain situations, and if it's not optimal -- whether it be acting too much like you're sitting at home alone watching porn, or acting too stiff/nervous/overly-polite/overly-PC -- work to make yourself naturally not roll that way.

But in the end, to some, "just chill out and be more laid back; don't fight to impress" -- may be that's all that's needed. I think that's why a good idea on a 1st meetup is to have a couple drinks. :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 33 (view)
Going Gray and loving it
Posted: 6/9/2015 8:35:01 PM

I decided to try going Gray, it seems to be pretty hot right now for young and older..

Ehhhh... rule #1: Don't declare something as looking good when a celebrity does it. It's a skewed lens. That's how really bad fashion catches on, too.

The gray/white "zing" look can be pretty cute with young faces. Not that it's going to look ugly with an older face, but it's going to look better than gray on an older face.

If the grays stayed on the head, I'd be ok coloring it.

Alas...they are everywhere :(

Well that's why you shave everything off. :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 211 (view)
Together forever, no marriage, separate homes
Posted: 6/9/2015 8:23:42 PM

It goes back to what I mentioned earlier about having no trust in a closer relationship. The question is: who is the one who shouldn't be trusted?

I think for many it's not a "who", it's a what -- being the comfort zone and the relationship on another scale. Not trusting that things would work out so well. I don't think it's purely about space, but the availability of space and a comfort zone of utilizing it, even if it's not utilized all that much. A bad negative association due to past history of "giving that up".

I guess an analogy would be a guy and his girl living together, but giving up his "man cave" in the house and opening it up as an extended laundry room. Or the same concept as someone not wanting to move in with someone else 'too quick' -- or how they feel is 'too quick', which won't be so quick if in the past they've done it too quick and err on the side of an extended period of time.... as in the past, the moving in too quickly kinda got things off on the wrong foot in many ways which was a root to a breakup (whether it should have been or not).

Of course, all that would have to rely on being 100% satisfied & "complete" NOT living with someone. So I guess the question is -- does/should someone feel incomplete not actually living with their SO?
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 27 (view)
Girl wants to hang out but has a boyfriend?
Posted: 6/9/2015 7:50:55 PM

On cheating: It makes me sad when people cheat on people. Plus, I don't really understand it. If two people are in a relationship, they care about each other, right? So why do the most hurtful thing they could possibly do to the other person? It's always been a hard one for me to wrap my head around.

Yeah. I would say that she is cheating. Granted, it's not a felony in the 1st degree (in levels of cheating), but it's clearly over the line and in the realm of cheating by the OP's story. But bad in another way is leading the guy on if she's taken without saying anything, when extending it beyond being social at work. When social at work, you would assume even some slight reference to a bf/gf would come up by default with no effort anyway. People will do this as they want the opp-sex attention and appear single to get that attention. In those cases, neither the guy nor the BF is going to like it.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 8 (view)
I'm on fire.
Posted: 6/9/2015 7:41:57 PM

So I'm wondering if I'm hitting my peak right now? Don't get me wrong I'm going to milk this brief run of success for all it's worth when reality comes crashing down again and it hurts inside

It happens in streaks. So milk a good run for all it's worth and bet high. :) Much the same as when you hit low streaks you don't deserve and you wonder "why?", you'll hit higher streaks than you thought should be rolling your way and you wonder "why?". Nature of the beast.

You'll hit your peaks & valleys. But also, at certain points of the year it can trigger streaks by more singles social interaction, etc. Just how the market operates. When you're in a low streak, that's when you (temporarily) change up what you do. Go out to different places, buy a few new threads, shake things up a bit -- it's not going to hurt. But when you're in a winning streak? Bet high, and keep rolling. :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 15 (view)
Distance with Dating and Relationships?
Posted: 6/9/2015 3:51:59 PM

So would i, i have had Long Distance Relationships but they generally fizzle for that exact reason, a computer monitor is no substitute for a person you can touch.

I dunno. There ARE some good porn sites. A computer monitor and lotion might do it, right? ;)

Now I am seeing this guy and he lives 50 minutes away and I again feel a bit bad due to our distance.

Seeing him or went out on a couple dates with? Difference there as to whether you still scope the scene. But if you live over 30 minutes away, it becomes a pain. Over an hour away, it's a bigger pain. You should continue getting to know him if things are going well... but IMO, you should think about Expectations. Don't have big expectations if they live about an hour away. Take a more casual approach to it. If they're an Amazing catch, roll with it if it's 45m-60m away, sure. But don't be surprised if that distance + schedules puts too much a damper on things with him.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 5 (view)
Short story: 'Lola
Posted: 6/9/2015 3:32:02 PM

Nah, I didn't invite Lola over, but I was glad she stopped by. I enjoyed her company

Even more of a reason that there would be no reason of you "horning in" on anything...

Nope, I didn't cross the line. I was a gentleman. Grrrrr.

The only line you would have crossed would be the platonic line -- and even that was on the border you hanging out with her twice 1-on-1 with that. You wouldn't have crossed ANY fidelity boundaries if you were single. Your nephew did Not have dibs on her going back home, to his GF. What you did do was c0ck-block your nephew (no sympathy for him there) when she was packing up to see him after his GF broke up with him. You would have done NOTHING wrong by fooling around with Lola. At all. The only argument you could make that you would have crossed any ethical lines would be if (a) Your nephew was single, and/or (b) She was like, barely 21, and not a full grown adult. She knew what she was doing. I know in the end you want to see "Well, at least I was a gentleman." Yeah, you were -- BUT you wouldn't have sacrificed that by going with the flow and hooking up with her after she brings herself over to drink & hang out. That's not ungentlemanly.

A guy who doesn't go in for a kiss on the first date. Sure, he could say "Well, I was a gentleman." Okay, maybe he was -- but he wouldn't have been ungentlemanly by going in for a kiss at the end of a good date with good rapport.

Actually there were 4 visits from Lola prior to her packing.

And since you didn't "bite" -- yeah. You did shoot yourself in the foot. Again, it wasn't out of being a gentleman. Your nephew had no official or unofficial ethical dibs on her, after going back home to his GF.

Lola wasn't his girl. And he never seen her again.

Exactly! :) What line would you have crossed? None on that front. You just chickened out in making a move when all the arrows pointed to open season. But hey, learn from it... no sense kicking yourself over it. You didn't do the "better thing" by not making a move that she had neon lights for you to make. Lesson learned...

You probably think she wasn't gorgeous. She wassss!

No, I assumed she was by your story, yes.

She wasn't seducing me. She could have. All she had was ask or wink or just a come to me finger signal.

You not even having to invite her over, her showing her breast, dancing, having some drinks, taking a joint -- doing all that 1-on-1, and hanging out more than once without you needing to invite her: Dude, what do you expect her to do? LOL. You are a guy, she is a gal -- I think you were too intimidated to make a move. :)

This being old sucks. (Blaming it on age.) I can't believe I didn't even try to hug or kiss her.

You were intimidated. A lot of guys would be at least up until a certain point. But you had opportunity right there. Open season. Oh well, again, don't beat yourself up over it. Learn that you should have made a move. Making a move doesn't require whipping your johnson out and saying "Babe! Go to town!" Far from it.

I haven't run into Lola again. Probably because I haven't been to my local bar at night in a long time. Their drinks suck, too weak & too much ice

When you're a recognizable guy at a bar (I'm not a hard liquor drinker and I know this), and you tip decently well while saying before if they could make it stronger (without harassing), they'll make sure to make it not weak. Even so, that's not the best reason to avoid the place.

Hunting for women in their 60's isn't as rewarding as the ones in their 30's, 40's and even 50's. You'll see some day.

From my experience, there's two "shifts" in going to the bar, at least here in the midwest. Middle-aged and up are more often "day walkers" -- going to the bar during happy hour and almost all leaving at sundown. After sundown, then the 20s-30s crowd comes in and dominates the age ranges. So if you don't want to be up & out late at night, that's OK. Your age range is going to be more often found %-wise before it gets too late anyway!

You should run into Lola again. Not that anything at this point after all that would ensue between you two -- don't expect that. But she's definitely no wholesome cat, and you could at least catch up and have a little convo -- out of mutual curiosity, if anything.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 45 (view)
If you personally owned POF what would you change about it?
Posted: 6/9/2015 3:04:14 PM

Activity could "restart" the clock.
There are likely thousands upon thousands of profiles of married and even deceased individuals...for sure!

Yeah, but, who's going to be searching for someone who hasn't been online in over a week anyway, ya know? I would think most users ignore writing someone who hasn't been online "in the last 30 days" anyway...

'Steve, wife material has viewed your profile. Act fast!'

Adding... "Everything must go! Including her anal virginity!" That'd make a nice ringtone going off at work.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 387 (view)
Independence VS Interdependance
Posted: 6/9/2015 2:35:38 PM

Yes I do, I am a woman, complaining is what I do

That's basically conceding that point, but ok... :)

Ok, so Im out with the man chatting about our funniest on line date we've had and I just throw in that if we have sex I will expect it to be exclusive.

No... you talk about your likes/dislikes about dating, and you throw out there "If/when I have sex, even really early on, which can happen -- I expect it not to be BF/GF, but to be exclusive right at that point." If that's SO universal, and so "basic" as you claim, there's no fear in rocking any boat by saying that, any more than saying "I don't like dating guys who are married." :)

No no no no no. That is not what it is all about. You are too caught up with the looks thing. Just good looking isnt going to get sex. Its more than that.

I didn't say that. If a gal is way better looking than a guy, and they hook up right off the bat, and things don't pan out between the two -- who do you think is going to be the one crying foul and the baby-game of being 'used'? The guy, more likely. Statistically, the guy's more apt to hurry-up-and-hook-up with an uglier girl than vice versa.

If a womans goes out, gets so drunk she has sex, then no she can not expect anything from that at all.

Great! And if she doesn't get drunk, but has sex with him -- she shouldn't expect Exclusivity then either! :)

1) my universal rule does appear to be universal, its just that you do not want to accept it.

No, it's not universal. Otherwise you wouldn't have a problem mentioning it to a guy when out on a date. You're insane if you think that's "Universal", just because you hook up so soon on the first few dates, by That Alone -- you're "poof", Exclusive. Not just "we will see each other again" -- but Exclusive, drop all other options or dates you had in the works, shut down your online profiles -- although not some official BF/GF -- we're exclusive, we're an item.

There's a reason why you have it as a silent rule.

2) you should not be using a girl for sex because you felt bad, was drunk particularly as you didnt not think she was hot.

I wasn't using her for sex any more than using her for conversation. Or that she used me for sex or used me for conversation. Heck, for all I know, she wasn't that into me anyway (she outweighed me a bit). I didn't have sex because I felt bad. She wasn't Ugly. Just one thing led to another. Both parties are equally "responsible".

4) her friends are awful. This situation would just not arise in my own friendship groups. My friends would of stopped me before the event not moaned about it after.

Her friends were not there. She was a grown woman, too. Doesn't need nannies following her. :) And she apologized for her friends being that way, and we had good conversation about that and I bought her a couple drinks. Oh, and no, I didn't have sex with her. Nor was She crying foul about the situation. She was a grown woman and knew what was up (unlike her friends).

You missed the bits where I said it needed to be recipricated, I can tell the difference between a man whos just wanting sex and a man thats interested in me.

Well, there's those situations where one-thing-leads-to-another and there's interest in the time being, but one's not going to know about the other's interest or even their own sometimes. Not everyone puts sexual relations on some huge pedestal, therefore lots of forethought, etc.

In a nutshell: No, just having sexual relations off the bat with someone is not some universal rule to be Exclusive and to drop all dating options in their life for that person who they're just getting to know. If for some odd reason it is in your area within your age group -- then it would Not be awkward to mention it and it wouldn't have to be a silent rule.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 68 (view)
Interests of women over 50y/o
Posted: 6/9/2015 2:13:32 PM

so in the last five years or so, I've noticed a marked increase in the number of women (in Pittsburgh) who list motorcycles, camping, fishing, kayaking, hunting, etc, and other more physically traditional 'male' activities as being their primary interests. .......... I'm posting this to hopefully get some feedback as to "why" these have become so popular in a more mature age group.

Because all their kids moved out and have more apt to taking on the outdoors, as opposed to the indoors? I don't think it's rare that outdoor activities that guys tend to like more than girls can be of interest to girls online. Especially when they're addressing compatibilities, don't have to stay in the house -- they'll want to show men "Hey, I like going fishing" and things of that nature that they've taken on a bit. They're not a house mom anymore. I mean, we're not talking about weight lifting, are we? lol
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 56 (view)
Not Enthusiastic About Meeting
Posted: 6/9/2015 1:52:04 PM

Why do I get the feeling this could soon blend the interdependence vs independence thread with this?

Well, because you help changed this topic from interested in actually meeting --> interested in seeing them again because the two porked right off the bat. If one isn't interested in continuing to go out on dates with them after a hookup -- that's where the whole "cum dumpster" thing comes into play, right?

I'm saying it's inaccurate/unfair to accuse someone of just wanting to "cum and run" or "find a cum dumpster" because a 1st meet/date resulted in sexual relations and then nothing panned out after that.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 40 (view)
If you personally owned POF what would you change about it?
Posted: 6/9/2015 1:45:38 PM
Aside from better looks to the site itself:

- If you block someone, they don't come up in any thumbnails at the top. In fact, they're totally blocked -- not just in standard searches. Poor POF quality presently on that.

- Combining "Intent" & "Looking For" into one universal selection -- and also moving "Not Single / Not Looking" in Marital Status into one of those options. People can put conflicting selections in that stuff. A real mess.

- In that combined selection, selecting More than just 1 option, like OKC has. You can be open to something short-term, and you can be open to something longterm and romantic. It depends Who and What the situation is.

- Make the age-restriction range a requirement. By default, it'd go by the +/- 13 year difference (or whatever it is). BUT, you can manually change it to open things up more, or to constrict more.

- Restrictions by default are for visitor viewing, but not preventative to writing them, by default. Actual blocking/prevention would be an additional check-mark option in your settings, and only allowed if the system senses that you have frequent incoming messages. Mainly, well, girls. Age range though would be always blocking for girls off the bat.

- Adding more options to one's own restrictions like height and body type. Again, by default, it's just for visitor viewing if they don't check it off as true Restriction (and were able to due to demonstrated inbound messages coming their way).
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 24 (view)
Girl wants to hang out but has a boyfriend?
Posted: 6/9/2015 1:23:25 PM

She quickly replies back agreeing to go out. Then I ask her how her weekend was to which she replies "I spent time with friends, and my boyfriend".

Yeah. If I'm the BF, I wouldn't like it. She's crossing the line in what she was doing. I'd ask if that's why she was traveling out of state. If she was traveling out of state and had to resign because of it, to see her BF -- then she has a LD relationship and she wants another guy back home. You being that guy. She could Not like you in that way much at all, but wants a guy to lean on and get attention from and feels innocent about it (but it's not innocent to you, to lead you on). Or she Could like you and is thinking she's in fair territory doing this, and you could 'camp out' for a while and get in her pants sometime after having some drinks, etc. Drama/danger/etc there.

Basically at this point what you Can safely rule out is rolling off into the sunset with her. IF she does like you and isn't just playing you for guy-attention -- once you cross the platonic barriers, things will start to get dramatic between she and her BF. Even if he's a LD BF, her missing him and thinking about the possibility of breaking up and all will hit her head on... it's been 8 years, etc. Emotionally issues. You don't want to deal with it.

You're either:
(a) Going to be the "guy friend" who she knows likes her, and that's what she wants to make up for the lack of attention in her Relationship; innocent because that's all you are to her

(b) She's unhappy in the relationship, possibly an LD one, but you're not going to be BF/GF at any point in the forseeable future. You'll camp out and possibly get a little action going with her on and off or whatever. It will be dramatic between you and she if you want more than something physical happening at some point; and it will definitely be dramatic between she and her BF if/when that goes down.

Altogether, right after hearing it, I'd spend Little time trying to figure out any Actual Attraction toward me and assess things a bit. But after not too long of time, I would call her out on the situation with her BF, in a nice, thoughtful, insightful, but not-beating-around-the-bush sort of way. I'd tell her that it's no mystery I liked bonding with you at work and outside work because I'm Attracted to you, and like you more than just a friend. You know that too. Hellen Keller can read between those lines. So I'm guessing that your relationship isn't it's most ideal, but you guys have been going out for so long, breaking up isn't something you'd want so readily to do or have to grapple with and are testing the waters? Or are just looking for a guy-friend for attention you don't get? Hey, I'm on your side here, but I'm real. What's up?
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 48 (view)
Not Enthusiastic About Meeting
Posted: 6/9/2015 12:44:24 PM

and .....NG... pffht, semantics
Im merely speaking of a small group of certain type of men, nuff said. <----See how short that was?? :P :P ;)

Whether it's big or small -- if both people bang away on a 1st meetup/date, both are just as "guilty" as the other. And to the topic -- the (usually guys) do have interest in both cumming and running. In fact, if he DIDN'T have much interest, and she still put out on that 1st meetup -- that's even Less room to complain by her ("But if I get him to have sex with me, he still has to take me out right?!" Ehh, no).

- Guy will have interest in going out/taking her out with the possibility of sex in the air
- Guy and girl have sex in that first outing, both wanted it
- When one party lacks interest in following-thru on dating more, the other can't claim being Used/Manipulated.
- The other rolled with sex off the bat; she (or he) themselves are into "dumping the cum" right off the bat
- Just because you had a nice 1st date/meetup, does not Imply that you are in fact going to start seeing them
- Just because you do pork right at the end of a 1st date/meetup, does not Imply that you'll start seeing them just because you porked
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 383 (view)
Independence VS Interdependance
Posted: 6/9/2015 12:24:33 PM

If we have had sexual relations I expect exclusivity. I dont demand it, I dont do the talk.

The point is, you have nothing to complain about if you have sex earlier compared to when you'd be exclusive by default. It's a fact that no, it's NOT a given that you're Exclusive just because you had sex and sex alone. BUT it *can* be if you say "this is how I roll". No big "talk" required. In convo about likes/dislikes about guys & girls, etc. It's easy for you to say it. Just like saying that you don't like guys who or wear this-or-that, and like guys who do or wear this-or-that (which is common convo on early date) -- you just mention that if you get sexual in the bedroom with a guy even when real early, you expect 100% exclusivity. If that IS a "given" or anywhere close to it -- just like not liking guys who wear dirty shirts with holes in them -- then saying it isn't a mood buster! :) Problem is, it's not a given.

No, I dont bring it up because when I was dating prior to my ex most men knew if you had sex with a woman that most women had sex because they had feelings for you

When having sex off-the-bat, no, all women do not do so just because they're ga-ga about the guy and expect to be exclusive. Women will be more picky than guys comparatively to have sex, yes. But with enough drinks, and one-thing-leads-to-another -- no, it's not because she's super hot for him. You'll see that more when he's solidly better looking than she is. BUT ALSO, the other way around. You get an average Joe who gets a porking out of a Hot Babe really early on -- sure, he's going to have a lot of feelings for her, too. Because she's a catch that he can't catch so easily in life but seemed to. He wants that fish to stay in His boat! :) It's an "I can do better" thing that will tip the scales. And it's an emotional backlash for not being wanted enough that one will cry foul.

Well I dont think it is just my rule. I think a fair few people think along the same lines.

Well, here's my point: It's Not a Universal rule. It more becomes a rule when you Don't have sex early on, ie you started establishing yourselves otherwise. Too early, no -- it doesn't make you Exclusive. That's why you need to express early on that's where you stand in general (not with him so much, but with dating overall; along with many other things when feeling each other out).

Well again, are you confusing being exclusive to being in a fall on relationship?

I'm not saying it's a Relationship -- but one's treating it like one. I mean, people go Exclusive before they're officially boyfriend/girlfriend, sure. But they're DatING. By default, if you want exclusivity before you've demonstrated that you've been datING -- having gone out on many dates and it's a Given that you're going out on another date soon etc -- then the ball's in your court to announce it. Silent rules & regulations only makes things messed up.

I may have the appearance of options, I may have other men interested but if Im going to have sex Ive already chosen him as my no 1

And the gal could be my #1 too. BUT through history & experience, if I'm having sex with her quickly & off the bat, I also know that it's by no means a given that we'll be seeing each other doing sing-a-longs together. Too Early to tell. I'm not going to without any words spoken, ditch all other prospects Because we porked so early. Especially if I could only see her once every 2 weeks. I'd be an idiot to do that.

I dont know these types of girls. Thats not what I was like, Im still not, neither were my friends and they would not approve if I started doing that with men.

They're not doing anything Mean. It's just that just because one-thing-lead-to-another, doesn't mean she's going to go steady with you. Yeah, us guys would Love that if she was Hot and a rare catch. Hell yeah. You'll even find some guys crying foul over it when it is those situations ("WTF? I thought girls Wanted to go steady/exclusive if we fooled around." "No dude, she's real Hot. Just be glad you got to pork her. She has more options out there. You even know that just because you rolled in the hay, doesn't make you steady.").

I respect men, I expect them to respect me back. Its how it worked when I was younger, Id say some still do.

So not dropping all one's options and going steady with someone they don't know too well, right after they had sexual relations -- is Disrespect? No.

Many years ago I was at a bar I'd frequent and this one not-so-great looking gal who I've seen there before, was talking with me. I was on the rebound at the time, it was a slow night and I was there solo and so was she, and well, one thing led to another -- and we ended up hooking up. We never exchanged #s, although within just a matter of weeks we both knew we'd run into each other again there at some point. There were nothing expressed at all that it was some "big deal" entering the realm of dating because we fooled around. Well, fast forward a couple weeks and I saw her there, among a couple of her friends. I said hello and all that to she and others, nothing big. She was real shy at that point, no biggie -- wasn't that much talking. Same thing happened another time, said hellos, acknowledgements, etc. She wasn't pursuing me nor I her. Great. Well, about a month later, some of her friends cornered me in the bar and one went OFF on me.

I was like "WTF?" She said "You hooked up with my friend, you HAVE to take her out to dinner. But you never asked her out, you didn't even chase her at all. You have to go out on dates with her. You're a pig because you didn't even want to!"

I was like "Ummm, we didn't even exchange #s. It was one of those things. We were never friends at the bar and hardly ever talked ever before. If she was Hot, and me sensing her shyness and not hanging around her, you wouldn't be cornering me like this. She 'used' me for sexual relations just as much as I. She's an adult, she should greet and try and talk too. WTF?"

Friend said "Yeah, but you're a Man. You have to go out there and Get her. She's shy. She doesn't do that a lot. You have to be a gentleman, and take her out on some dates. Have some balls!"

I laughed and said "Again, if she was Hot and has tons of guy attention, you wouldn't even THINK about this. In fact, kind of the opposite route of 'Back off, you hooked up, it doesn't mean you own her you creep!'. I have not ran away one iota from her -- just not pushed convo on her. Or chased her as you say. So you want me to Chase someone I'm not interested in dating -- to TRULY lead on? WTF? No. I'd be happy to buy her a drink and chit-chat -- she's no stranger to me after that, but communication goes both ways, so if she's shy and we never exchanged #s -- she needs to communicate too."

OKAY, point being -- it's a silly emotional rule that actually is BAD to one's emotions. To have to go out on dates which is Really going to lead them on. And just because the gal wasn't that great looking and shy, does NOT mean she wanted me. Could be shying away from me because she wanted to keep a distance after a one-night hookup and not let friends know. Women are not children.

I went to the gal and said "Wow, why didn't you talk with me, etc? Here, let me buy you a drink, but..." and she interrupted me and apologized about her friends. She said they want her to find a guy and yeah, she likes me, but also is just shy and knows nothing's my fault, I did no wrong, and no she wasn't trying/aiming to date me, etc. She even said that she doesn't like her better looking friends assuming that just because she herself isn't all that great looking automatically equals her not having a sex drive and just wanting relationships. I did a cheers to that, we laughed, had good convo, etc.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 39 (view)
Not Enthusiastic About Meeting
Posted: 6/9/2015 9:26:01 AM

Let's stick with the topic here.

I think the OP's topic is not even meeting, though. No meeting, nor any meating comes into play. :) It's that he'd write but then back off from meeting. As we know in the forums, there's no shortage of that for Guys, either. They'll cry that they message a gal back-n-forth a bit, and express they'd be up to meet , but then when it comes to 1st date time or confirmation, she disappears or is always busy, etc. Why? Tons more options. Both parties play the apathetic interest game. It's NOT a mere guy thing.

Plain and simple They VIEW and USE these women they are not so enthusiastic about meeting as cum dumpsters.

Okay, this is on a different, but related topic. But this is not that they're not so enthusiastic about meeting per se -- the problem is that they're not so enthusiastic about Dating. If there's potential "fooling around" on said 1st meet, I don't think one would say there's a lack of enthusiasm for him... more that there's a lack of enthusiasm for following-thru Afterward. "Cum and run". The first part, there wasn't so much lack of enthusiasm. That's not the complaint. It's that there WAS interest, then "poof", it disappeared.

Now, with that, one thing must realize is that both genders will seem interested on/for a 1st date and do go on it... they seem interested when on it... but later on, they're always-busy, lack interest, etc. Did she use me for a free dinner and/or drinks?! Did he use me for sex?! People are going to emotively jump to conclusions on this.

Also -- if she had sex with him on the 1st meet -- no "acting lessons" required by the guy. She's an adult, she wanted to bone. It takes two to tango. Both had interest in doing so. She was wanting sex just as he did, by default in said scenarios. Just because they had sex doesn't mean or imply that he coerced her, made her promises that he'd see her forever and ever, or drugged her. It's POF. The complaint is that he had interest, but then later on didn't. Well, sex or no sex, you'll see that with guys And girls. Her mind was wrapped around sex in that moment, too... and if it was really deeper than that on a 1st meet -- she should have held off on having sex so early. She's JUST as responsible in having sex early as the guy, right?

A classic two-way scenario that I chuckle at is: Sally goes out with Bob. Date goes decently well. As it gets kinda late, they kiss enthusiastically in the parking lot, Bob suggests extending the date more, but Sally says she's tired but had a great time. In the other scenario, she agrees, so they go somewhere else, get another drink, then go back to Bob's place and have sex. But in both scenarios, Bob isn't all that interested in her in the days following up. He's busy, "yeah I'll let ya know", etc. OK. But he kind of blows her off. So Sally declares -- whether sex was had or not -- he just wanted sex. He ditched me because he got his sex and that's all he wanted, and in the other scenario, he ditched me because we didn't have sex and that was what he wanted, so he took his ball and went home. So basically -- *if* she's interested in follow-up dates and he's not -- it's because all he wanted was sex, 100% of the time. :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 381 (view)
Independence VS Interdependance
Posted: 6/8/2015 11:14:31 PM
In terms of expecting a guy to go exclusive with you if you can hardly see them often, you said:

I dont, nor do I expect a guy to want to date me

And also when I asked why would I be expected to go exclusive of I (a guy) could hardly see them, and you said because you click, etc. So you either expect it or you don't -- which is it? I'm guessing you do expect it, as long as he likes ya (as that's what everything else has pretty much said).

If he wants to see others then hes not really into me. He doesnt care for me and he isnt considering me. Do you really think that is a good option for me?

I disagree. If all he did was go out on a few dates, just because he doesn't want to go Exclusive doesn't mean he doesn't care about you or that he isn't considering you. It's just too early to go Exclusive, as lessons have been learned, and it's good to keep one's dating options at least open until things have established themselves somewhat between the two people and gotten to know them well. Again, merely fooling around doesn't automatically make two people getting to know each other really well. It can help move the process along a little quicker, but that's about it.

No. I dont want to bring it up because he should already know that.

It's not a RULE! In your bubble you believe it is -- it's not! Wake up -- just fooling around does not mean you're exclusive.

But being scared, yes, I do get scared. I get scared that I wont ever be the option. I cant compete and I cant do much about my lifestyle.

Yeah -- which is a main reason Why you don't bring it up. Most people Know that just fooling around real early on does Not make people exclusive. It's an outsider's little rule that's on them to announce if need be. You Know that many many people of many different varieties do not assume having fooled around real early = exclusivity. But you being scared as you describe is one of the reasons why you're not declaring your OUTSIDER point of view that fooling around early on = exclusivity.

Whats with the hightlighting? What are you trying to say? I dare you to say that you didnt know about the silent rule ever ever again!

I'm saying this "rule" that "fooling around within the first few dates = exclusivity" -- is a SILENT rule. You don't talk about it or announce it to a guy, hence, it's a Silent Rule to you, that you Completely Misunderstand as some universal rule - lol. It's not universal at all! It's just your Silent rule.

Exactly. Its has nothing to do being scared, options, being exclusive. The TALK is a passion KILLER!!!!

It doesn't have to be a big talk. In the early dates you can talk about a lot of things in relation to compatibility. But yeah, everyone's avoids certain things out of fear of ruining the mood. BUT if you have this silent rule, you have to at least announce it. "Hey, when I have sex with someone, even if within the first few dates and it happens really early on, I expect us to be 100% exclusive. He drops his dating options, his online profile -- I drop mine, too." You fear that ruining the mood there. *IF* that was some near-universal rule, it WOULDN'T be a mood killer; it'd be like a lot of things the two would say that would be pretty much common sense. But the thing is: It's NOT a common rule. THAT is why you avoid even mentioning it. But, OK if you don't -- but you can't hold them to it as if they broke some rule when it's NOT a universal rule by any means!

Only a crazy person would assume that just because one-thing-led-to-another and you went well past kissing that you're "poof" -- magically Exclusive.

And only a crazy man will think he can pull that off without her going CRAZY at him when he dates the options HE failed to mention.

"Pull that off"? No, it's just not being exclusive so soon just because they let one-thing-lead-to-another so soon. A crazy man (or woman) would assume that they're "poof", magically Exclusive, just because they hooked up before getting to know each other well enough that Exclusivity wisely by default would more or less require.

But your not making any distinction between whos special and who isnt.

I'm saying that if one-thing-led-to-another off the bat, it doesn't mean that person is their #1 dating prospect, but sure, can be a good one and maybe WILL be their #1 prospect down the line. It varies. And apart from anything bad happening in that process, even though they're not going to go exclusive by default, sure, said person is more up in the ranks than they were previously... but it's still Too Early to be Exclusive AND drop all other dating prospects that mean something too. Especially if he/she can only see you once every 2 weeks!

If you want to avoid that, SAY something *IF* you're going to fool around before people would, by default, be exclusive -- OR don't fool around with them Until you've established exclusivity the Normal way.

I know, and thats cool. If thats what works for you thats fine. Its actualy quite sweet in some ways. But do you eventually become all in?

What I mean by going "all in", is emotionally or exclusively. Whether there was fooling around to some degree or not at all. I don't see how you see that sweet in some ways, based on what you wrote before. It's more being realistically-minded when it comes to the dating scene. Do I eventually go all in? Yes. When things of substance have established themselves between us. Which takes time getting to know each other. Fooling around can bump it up slightly as opposed to keeping it PG-rated, but it's Not a substitute for substance in getting to know each other in terms of exclusivity-worthy.

What? I dont understand this? How do you know she is keeping her options open? and whats with the protection of emotion?

By default, when meeting a social gal at a bar or a gal from online -- and they're pretty -- she's going to have a lot of options. Just because the setting was right and one-thing-led-to-another real early on does Not mean I'm suddenly her #1 dating pick and she wants to be exclusive. Only a complete fool would think she had no dating options before, or she'd drop all her dating options just because we fooled around so early on. In fact, to some people, guy or girl, they get turned off by the concept and have a little socially-based regret in fooling around so soon and it distances them (not me though lol). But anyway, the Protection is to prevent going "all in" just because you fooled around with a gal ya Really like (who is most likely a high prospect who has lots of guy-options), and ditching all your other options. In fact, you make sure to "protect" yourself in a sense to not be overly ga-ga about said gal so early on, and not to ignore communication with your other options, as said gal, who knows, could lose interest soon or over a little time, and leave ya with your pants down having to start from scratch.

So whats the longest you have ever dated anyone without the fooling around?

5.8 hours. ;) Fooling around meaning more than making out -- some sexual relations? Around a month was about the longest on more than one occasion. But in those situations we weren't "datING", but in the pre-dating phase and not able to see each other very frequently kicking things off.

yes of course you have :) Now which one of us was the stubborn one? Was that me or you?? Cant remember now.

What I'm explaining to you, in a nutshell is a simple concept: NO, there is no general/universal "rule" that because you fool around, you're Exclusive. Many times it could symbolize the tipping point of being exclusive, sure. But when you have sexual relations real early -- no, it doesn't substitute for being established. I know for you, you're not sacrificing much of anything when your options are limited and can only see a guy once every 2 weeks or something early on. But not everyone's that way.

I'm not being stubborn about it -- I'm just informing you that that's NOT a universal rule at all, but your own silent rule. And I say silent because you don't want to bring it up as that's how you roll to a guy, because it could only prevent one-thing-leading-to-another on a Great date -- and due to your lack of availability, you want to make the most of it. I'm just saying that By Default -- NO, there is no assumed/universal rule that hooking up = exclusivity so early on. Just reporting what is. :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 12 (view)
still not divorce
Posted: 6/8/2015 10:30:33 PM
So for 4 years you see the guy *2 weeks a year* and talk on the phone frequently. Even if he was divorced, that's a BAD BAD BAD situation to have any expectations. That's a really f'd up situation.

Basically, yes, they Can get a divorce over a long period of time. But they don't Want to because of the above-average hassles that will come that way, more money spent, drama for a while, etc. Mainly they ride on "Separated should be good enough!" which is fine if they're not looking to do any more than casual dating, or are looking To Actually Divorce in the not too distant future.

I would say to him: "Even if there is or ever was anything between us -- why are you holding on to being Separated but technically tied in marriage contract for SO LONG? After a long while, it's you Not wanting divorce for your own reasons, but you can't expect me or any gal you'd be dating to be OK with that over the long haul. That's a Red Flag that something's up."

I hope you don't have much emotion invested in him. A LD Relationship isn't worth it. Definitely not 2 weeks a year, even with the promise of that increasing some. You need to move on! :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 30 (view)
Is being a mature student considered to be undesirable to women
Posted: 6/8/2015 10:22:29 PM

I've been there before and I found a woman who was in the same situation as me. It's not like only men are unemployed and take college classes in their 30s. There are also women over 30 who have not been successful financially yet.

I'm not saying it's impossible or anything. Yeah, you'd want to hit the right demographic, even though your dating options are going to be limited. But it should be no surprise you'd find a lot of not-interested when in your Later 30s unemployed going to college from gals Later 20s-Later 30s who most likely are not in the same boat as ya.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 31 (view)
Waiting for someone in a relationship to breakup
Posted: 6/8/2015 9:49:28 PM

Have you ever been talked to someone, liked them, but either they were already taken when you met them, or they became taken because you missed your window of opportunity?

Yeah. But usually that "window" wasn't such a big window or any real much of a window at all, if they weren't taken and ya didn't make a move. It would have taken a good long while anyway if she didn't start going out with a guy. Usually it's because ya know your chances were Small, which is why you held off on making a move... but when you see she's going out with other-guy, you kick yourself for not at least trying. You think "Sh!t. What if she said yes?" and think your chances were bigger, mainly because you're Jealous. Anyway, that's one scenario I've observed and experienced myself.

For example, say you meet someone online and they are currently dating someone, how do you make yourself next in line?

Why are they online if they're dating someone? LOL. Okay, I'll assume you talked with them a bit and they said "I started dating a guy a bit ago and decided to go exclusive," while taking you up on the offer of being just-friends. OK. If I'm that guy she's dating I wouldn't want her making friends with dudes from an online dating website. He obviously likes you and that's what is fueling him wanting to be just friends.

Or is that energy better spent pursuing different people and completely forgetting about the people who are already taken?

It's best to do that. You're a CHUMP if you're going to camp out around her being "just friends". She's also An Idiot and not cool to any BF if she's going to be giving out consolation prizes of being friends with guys from online or the bar who have been chasing her. Don't be "that guy". You move on. You could be facebook friends or friends of friends, but don't let her occupy your time if you really dig her. Because the only reason you're wanting to be friends is because you really dig her -- which is Weird. At least let your crush shake off, and in the mean time, keep your distance.

One good question would be: What if your new GF made some guy friends who really liked her, but she doled out just-friends relationships with them? And not just facebook friends or anything, but social friends and also being 1-on-1 friends to some degree. Do you tell her to wise up and that you don't approve, and that it'll break the relationship if she does this sort of thing, risking breaking up and playing in the "new guy friend"'s favor? I was in a situation like that before. Felt like a catch-22, but he was a former ex. I could disallow her being friends with this "harmless" ex, but doing it to it's entirity would lead to a breakup or close to it between she and I (thus a high % chance of he and her at least trying something; he 'wins') -- or rolling with it with her knowing of not being a fan and wanting distance, but still having to put up with it? I chose the latter. What really got me is that you could tell in certain spots, she liked him to some degree in the back of her mind. In the end, it caused an underlying destabilization in the relationship between she and I... BUT how it unfolded and toward the end, it prevented him from being an option in her mind, waiting for her at the end of the tunnel. But overall, wasn't worth it, being drawn out like that. Ugh.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 126 (view)
You have to ignore a girl to get her attention?
Posted: 6/8/2015 8:12:47 PM

In what world would this work?

In a world more often where the gal has a lower self-esteem and is used to guys macking on them or at least reaching out for convo and ignoring her average or below-average Jane friends. NO angle is ever 100% or close to 100% to "get" a girl. But it's an angle, that yes, can spark some interest. To explain further in response to the OP's original question...

Okay, I have several guy friends who are very skilled at getting women. They all say the same thing, telling me, "Just ignore her" or "Act like she doesnt exist" etc etc. This makes absolutely no sense to me.

Basically, this what Usually happens: Guy(s) walk up to a group of people or all girls, and there's one Hot girl that sticks out. Guys don't have to be directly hitting on her or anything for her to know guys single or taken will be attracted to engaging with her over the others. She draws attention in general. Her friends notice this when around her too, and she doesn't even have to be trying. So yet-another-guy consciously or sub-consciously looking her up and down and soon into things trying to spark conversation because she's hot -- no, isn't impressive. In fact, she gets plenty of it.

So enter in another angle with Joe, who's decent looking but she is, well, still out of his league. Instead, he makes eye contract with her friends and purposely does not with her. Not out of angst. But much the same way guys will be completely lacking eye contact and engagement with at least one of her friends who she's out with. You pretend she's not one of their friends and not someone who's look garners any interest of yours. You're not out to be blatantly rude -- although it could err a bit on that side, just like many guys may make her friends feel it's rude that all they do is look and direct attention to their hot friend 75% of the time. So you do this, and her guard will go down as you being yet-another-guy, and sometimes intrigued -- why does he like my friend Kate? This doesn't happen very often. They usually go for her only until after they get the signal that I'm not interested in them. Hmmm. Not necessarily THINKING that so consciously & specifically -- but that's the vibe she may have in the back of her mind.

So as this tone is set for a little while when initially engaging with them, she's not going to be on-guard to keeping a distance from yet-another-guy. If anything, more open. What a guy can do after that if he reads the situation right (I know many of you will hiss at me for this) -- is in a Friendly Way, razz her a bit. Not in being mean, but, it's what she is not going to get with guys oggling her or directing their attention by default to Her all the time. It's friendly, not mean, but a bit of friendly razzing no big deal with direction right after pointed to her friends again. What he's doing is a small little preemptive strike that implies that he doesn't seem interested in her. Later on as things settle in, he can end up bantering with her without the vibe that he's really attracted to her like all guys are, but friendly and cordial & charming, as he was to her friends who were the initial/primary targets of attention. This girl rarely gets this. Guard down, and very possibly curious. If there is any Potential for her finding some attraction about him, that would maximize it.

It's very easy to screw up and be a jerk and non-friendly (some advice says to be like that). It's a delicate process.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 25 (view)
Don't like new GF's best friend
Posted: 6/8/2015 6:14:29 PM

Well, OP, BEING AS YOU ARE TECHNICALLY STILL MARRIED, perhaps that is why YOU THINK the BFF has an attitude toward you---that is if that fact IS EVEN KNOWN to the woman you are seeing or her BFF.................

Yeah, but he's Separated. That is an official thing. It's not a right for a BFF to get p!ssy at him about it, but it is a good topic to bring up to her (and his new girl) to try and make things cool.

When you've been Officially Separated for some time and are at the point of finalizing the final divorce paper work, it's not cheating. I can understand someone not wanting to date someone who's Separated because of high % chance of baggage and/or them exaggerating about how far along they are (or even truly Separated).

So unless there's red flags in the air that he's NOT truly Separated, the girl's BFF has no reason to be a b!tch.

After all, youre still married and you created a profile here a month ago looking for a relationship with someone other than your current girlfriend.

Good point. I could understand if he made a profile around the time he had some dates with the gal but they weren't exclusive yet and taking things slow, and at This point he didn't update his profile when being exclusive becoming more officially an item. But yes, the OP has some explaining to do on that. :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 33 (view)
Not Enthusiastic About Meeting
Posted: 6/8/2015 3:46:19 PM

Having sex with just anyone is not that interesting. I'm all for casual sex, but I still would only want to have sex with someone I was attracted to under any circumstances

Again -- *IF* they're wanting to have sex with someone, there's not going to be a lack of enthusiasm about having sex with them (which requires meeting, or shall I say meating lol). Sure, some people may have more enthusiasm than others -- but there's not a shortage of guys lacking enthusiasm about having sex with those they're interested in having sex with.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 17 (view)
Don't like new GF's best friend
Posted: 6/8/2015 3:25:42 PM

I've been seeing a woman for a couple months. It's going well so far.

I would suggest taking yourself off the market in your profile. If you've been allegedly seeing each other for a couple months already, and are still 100% single, you'd have to ask yourself whether you truly are seeing each other (and not just, say, FWB). Just thought I'd get that important thing out of the way...

I recently met her BFF.... and I can't STAND her. She's very negative and very rude. Just an overall nasty human being. .... I won't go into all the details here

You should! I think that's a key point. The devil's in the details. We don't know your perception of really rude, either. And what triggers in, in what way, how it's applied, what it's applied to, etc.

I'd first take your profile down to Not Single / Not Looking, and erasing what you wrote in it with "Taken - on here for forums only".... THEN I'd say talk to your GIRLFRIEND about it and go over it there. If her BFF is generally just b!tchy, lay it out to your girl -- have her see your side. Is she b!tchy to your GF? Again, you have to go over the details on this... how do I know her BFF isn't all that pleasant and great of a person but in the end it's really more anti your taste and taking an OCD perspective on it? Explain! :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 28 (view)
Is being a mature student considered to be undesirable to women
Posted: 6/8/2015 3:18:22 PM

From my experience, when I mention this on my profile, it feels that nobody want to take interest in me, for example when I go to singles night and speed dating events, when I mention this, girls want to end the conversation as quick as they can.

It's not merely being 30-something and taking college classes. That was never you problem. If you're UNEMPLOYED while doing that, yes, women your age in their 30s aren't going to be so keen on that. You're in a transitional point and haven't been successful yet. I'm sure they all see that as a GOOD THING -- but want a guy who's already past that point.

I mean, if a guy lives at his parents' house at 37 and is going to college and has no real job besides maybe a part time job for a little spending cash -- NO, he shouldn't expect, at that point, to do well in the dating scene with women his age. He "isn't there yet". He's playing catch-up at that point to get where he should have been a while ago. It's more like "Call me after you're done and have gotten situated with a real job."
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 31 (view)
Not Enthusiastic About Meeting
Posted: 6/8/2015 3:05:26 PM

i can't help it if certain men are 'unenthusiastic' about meeting certain women yet are willing to fvck them anyway.

If they're Wanting to have sex with someone, there's not going to be a lack of enthusiasm about meeting them to have sex.

almost all gals who just want sex would at least be 'enthusiastic' about it.

As with guys! :) Since when is there a lack of enthusiasm for guys about sex? lol Quite the contrary, I'd say.

she wouldn't be like meh you're not that interesting and i'd never date you, but all d1cks are the same in the dark.

Yeah, because not all d!cks are the same in the dark - lol. I hear they can feel differently! ;) But many women (And men) who are looking to just hook up are going to be thinking something along the lines "You're not interesting enough for me to date you, and I likely wouldn't ever date you, but I'm game for sex," because all they're doing is looking for a hookup. If all they're doing is looking for a hookup, they're not aiming to get with someone who fits their mold on Dating.

From my experiences in my lengthy single life? It's not so much a girl-guy thing, but a who's a better catch vs other -- when it comes down to one just wanting sex and the other person rolling with it but wanting more than just that 1-nighter or two. It's not a coincidence that of the gals who were "like guys" and that's all they wanted were the ones who were at least a bit out of my league. If one has a significant other with no intentions of breaking up, and/or is better looking than the other person -- generally speaking, they're not going to want to be dating the other person, and will want to cut it off after fooling around.

i hope it didn't hurt too much, but i'm very sure it wasn't involuntary.

As it wouldn't be involuntary for a girl who goes out on a meetup/date and bangs away on it, and that's about all that ever formulated between the two -- whether she was Only looking for sex and that's it, or she was someone who wanted more to develop.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 98 (view)
Affairs: Would you ever get together with a married person?
Posted: 6/8/2015 2:36:59 PM

norweiganguy123- If you don't know the person is married and they outright lie about it, of course it's their fault.

Yeah. But also, if they lie about the situation as you not breaking any seal, them both "doing their own thing" and are still married because of their kids (etc etc) -- that's their fault and not your fault either. And whether they're married or in a Relationship is quite moot, too. I would find someone in my position as bad (along with the 'taken' one) if I was manipulating/coercing/convincing them in any way To cheat. But if that ball's rolling by their own volition toward me, and I'm on some vacation -- the ball's not in my court to Assume that they have an otherwise happy Relationship, their SO has never cheated and is blinded by everything, and I'm someone breaking their seal. In fact, if said vacation was in Vegas, I would NOT bet that it is that way in most type of situations -- I'd be losing money on it.

Again, I wouldn't be Pushing for her to cheat or twisting any arms. It's when the gal is taking a liking to me from conversation->more and wanting to fool around. Doing so shifts the burden, IMO. I mean, it's not like I'm some famous hot stud that she'd have a rare chance of meeting that drew her in to wanting to cross that line, and it's just me due to my monsterous attraction as I'm God's Gift to women - lol ;)

Upon observation of said type of situations, the person they slept with outside their relationship wasn't the cause of it breaking. It didn't break the relationship, nor over time was the only cheating situation for them. Many times it aids in it, sometimes it doesn't, and few times it Is the reason. When it is THE central breaking activity, it's almost always going to be someone they know at work, a neighbor, a friend etc -- that over time built to something where they broke a seal. I'm NOT a fan of that, and I don't condone that.

But when on vaycay and them letting lose -- whether drinking a good amount when they had an agreement back home with friends & family that they really weren't going to drink much? If I'm not convincing them or twisting their arm to drink, and instead they are wanting to drink and break said promises -- I feel no guilt in buying them a drink. Because they themselves will, and some other guy will, too. I'm not speeding anything up or changing anything in the route they're going down. I'm just not going to PROTEST it in defiance, is all. Nor am I going to push them to if it's Not a route they're going down. But if it is? Sorry, but not My bad. If their friend(s) or family members who had the "don't drink this summer" agreement with them get mad at me, they'd be foolish, IMO. They wouldn't be taking the whole picture into account, and not knowing/feeling the difference between said person breaking that promise and having breaking that promise regardless of my existence VS me "wooing" them to and it being The reason why.

Jumping to that latter assumption would be the foolish/emotional conclusion. Same can be said in many situations applying to the person they hooked up with when cheating on their significant other.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 35 (view)
Paying big money on dating sites with little result....
Posted: 6/8/2015 2:03:41 PM
I've found a couple active Pay sites to bring in a better reward than freebie sites (OKC, POF), pound for pound. More balanced competition, IMO. Plus, women are more willing to meet if they paid money for a membership. On a freebie site they can either be looking just to fiddle around without Actually meeting or romantically meeting so much, so it gets in the way of a lot of activity... plus a gal on a big freebie site like this is going to have their inbox flooded far more quickly and you have a lot more competition.

I find half these guys that are in the top 10 forget the other 90 odd don't even have a full paragraph on there whole profile .. Wondering how these guys are attracting the women out there ???? ..I have no idea ...

Attraction is the main key. If they write very little, it's going to make a gal choose another guy in his league who Does write AND what he writes meshes well with her. But if he's notably hotter, he's hotter, so regardless of lack of writing -- it's not going to stop things. Plus, technically, writing A Lot can actually backfire, and chit-chatting will have more to talk about and discover VS just reading their profile. Less of a mystery & things to learn if the profile is full-boat.

In the end though, if you write 100 gals and like only 5-7 will write back and basically of those the chatting will dissipate quite soon anyway -- you're attacking the chicks online in the wrong way if they're in your league.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 10 (view)
Looking for Friends AND Lovers ... possible?
Posted: 6/8/2015 1:37:49 PM

And I am blown away by just HOW MANY FISH there are out there.

Plenty of fish looking to get blown, too. lol One big sausage fest, yep!

However there's a downside. I am lonely. My friends are mostly married and on their 2nd kid at least so I'm not a priority anymore. And with my broken relationship I also lost my activity partner. In short, I could use some friendship in my life right now.

What you don't want to do is take a path carved by Peer Pressure -- where you want a Relationship because everyone else has one and you feel lonely, even if said relationship isn't all that serious or anything. But what you DON'T DO is go on a *dating* website looking for Just Friends. Don't make that mistake...

On PoF the fish are all so colourful and screaming for my attention

Yeah, it's like the NY stock exchange. Lots of dudes, less women who are at least cute. They have to show effort to barrel their way in....

They all seem interesting to me with their achievements, hobbies and life stories. I feel like I need to get to know them ALL. But I also want THE FISH. And when it comes to THE FISH, one must be very particular, or so I've come to learn.

You don't need to get to know them all, that's silly. You're put in position where you'll have to side-step some otherwise good prospects. Just the nature of it. The guys ARE "the fish", so you want them all too? Well, that's not so easy -- feasibility isn't on your side. :)

Can I, as the expression goes, have my cake and eat it too? Do people meet on PoF and walk away being just friends (that keep in touch and meet for BBQs and birthdays)?

No, not for your initial Intention. That's manipulation. With a small % of them, depending on how you and he goes about things, sure -- can End Up being just friends in the end if dating doesn't work out. But not a high amount. And, they still would be up for banging you. Just saying.

From what you wrote earlier though -- you seem to indicate you just want a platonic friendship, get (flattering) guy-attention, and learn from it -- with no intention of actually dating. Tsk tsk. Don't go there. Bad idea.

It'd be like joining the sex personals site Adult FFinder, yet wanting to maintain virginity and not even kiss anyone. Sure, you could "meat" someone off Adult FFinder and in the end, be just friends with them. Yeah. But that being THE goal? No -- that's barking up the wrong tree, as it is here. Go to meetup . com or something and meet people. THAT is your best bet and fits the mold. And also, guys will still flirt with you -- but no, you won't get such an ego boost as POF mailbox filling up. :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 96 (view)
Affairs: Would you ever get together with a married person?
Posted: 6/8/2015 12:58:26 PM

The thing is, you don't know that you are breaking up a "good" or "bad" relationship

Ahh, but you're missing one important element. You don't know if you're breaking a relationship At All. You COULD know, as I stated -- I wouldn't want to be breaking that seal.

Let me say this though: Many times when we think of someone cheating, it's a friend or friend of a friend where cheating occurred. People we know. No, I'm not going to hook up with someone I know who's in a relationship, even if I'm not breaking the seal and she's cheating and so is he. For the same reason I'm not going to hook up with the gal right after breaking up and they're a mess. I don't want to get involved in any drama and being added to their fire ("... and on top of that, you slept with Norwegianguy! He has a huge penis, but come on! I fvcking hate that guy now..."), and would be stupid.

What I'm talking about is some gal you don't have any degrees of connection with. You meet at a bar, or on a vacation. She lures ya in, and explains that the relationship she's been in has been hell for years, but they have kids, blah blah, and they both haven't kissed in god knows how long, and she's quite positive he's fooled around before, and so she's been doing the same in keeping her options when she gets out, etc. Of course, that's Her representation of it -- but *I* am not cheating on him -- she would be. *I* wouldn't be twisting her arm, she's wanting to roll in the hay (even more evidence this is Not her first rodeo, and I'm not breaking anything up).

What if they are in a bad relationship? That justify's cheating or cheating with them?

If my LTR GF or wife went to Vegas and she slept with some guy (I obviously don't know), I would not be angry at him -- I'd be angry at HER. He didn't cheat on me. For me to be pissed at the guy, it'd require something Different added to the mix -- like him seducing her, twisting her arm, etc., and convincing that that's what happened. I'd be pissed at both, but the focal point would be on her. Otherwise, I wouldn't care about the random guy on vacation, personally.

Who is going to tell you they love their spouse, but you are just really attractive/hot, so they will then 'uck you, just for lusts sake?

Oh, they all do. They all do. (Polishing knuckles) ;) Kidding. No, they're pretty much not going to -- although something close to that can happen, but yeah, don't expect it. Just as if they're recently broken up or divorced -- it's going to be exaggerated making them look more of a bad guy than they are (and vice versa), while both most likely did bad things. But the burden's not on me, it's the other way around... to where they'd have to say some things over some time where I put things together realizing that they Aren't established as a broken couple. When on a vacation meeting new people though, and having a hookup -- there's not a lot of time of things like that able to soak in and put together though.

The effort that is put into an affair could be effort put forth to save a marriage.

I disagree. In many situations, no, it's not. Again, the burden of proof is on them to provide info that indicates that I'd be breaking a seal. Plus, a cute gal on vacation out with gal pals looking for c0ck -- if it's not me, it's going to be someone else. And either way, she ain't saving the marriage or relationship at that point at all -- much the other way around.

If someone has truly given up and there's NO hope, that's when they should ask for a divorce.

I agree. Again, I'm not their relationship counselor or marriage counselor. They're 'taken' -- whether it's marriage or not -- and THEY are cheating, not me. If I'm not twisting any arms, and in fact I'm getting My arm twisted (being reeled in), sorry -- *I* am not breaking any relationship -- especially when said relationship is most likely Broken already and the burden of proof that it's Not lies on them, not me at that point.

A measuring stick to this would be: Would I be Pissed at the guy? Where would it be where I wouldn't want to strangle the guy? Well, if an GF/wife went to Vegas as was reeling in a guy or two and they banged -- no, I wouldn't be pissed at the guy. That was all her doing. She broke the relationship, not the random guy "Jim" from Idaho who was out in Vegas for a vacation, too.

I'd be lying to myself in thinking I am a moral person to intentionally have an affair with a married person, knowing the effect it could have on their spouse.

Well first, You wouldn't be having an affair (in the sense of Cheating) -- they would. Now, you would be cheating a friendship's situation if you knew them -- whether they recently broke up or were still together. But of people you don't know, and the burden's on the other person? I can understand not wanting to be a part of a concept you don't condone. Whether that person says they have an open relationship or not doesn't matter. You don't know For Sure, right? See, I don't take that angle. I don't think I'm doing something immoral if by one's actions or words implies that the relationship Has Been likely broken for some time.

I've been in situations before of a gal in an LTR (or married) where I haven't chased her even though there was some flirting and she was out to get porked, etc. Come to find out in many of them, her getting porked wasn't the 1st time (no sh!t), and it in and of itself had no bearing on the process of breaking up that was already in motion. For ME, I would feel like doing something wrong if *I* was having a REAL hand in breaking the relationship apart. But from my POV -- that burden of proof is on THEM (being a stranger) to point that out, not I, as they are open arms reeling me in.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 24 (view)
Not Enthusiastic About Meeting
Posted: 6/8/2015 11:37:08 AM

All you men here saying it ain't so, well maybe you aren't that kinda of guy. Pat yourself on the back.

I like to pat myself in other places. Usually at a medium pace, but okay... I'll try my back. (....) Ehh, I'm not feeling it. Wait, did I lead my back on? ;)

But this is OLD. There are HUNDREDS of men.

I WISH there were only "hundreds" of men. There'd be far more women than men -- it'd be a much more fruitful experience if that were the case! ;)

Do not be deluded into thinking that there aren't men that treat women like cum dumpsters.

Yes, there are. OLD is a highly popular cum dump site.

But going back to the OP's concern -- it's about not being enthusiastic about meeting. Not about lack of enthusiasm of seeing them again after porking them on a 1st date. Her issue is, they don't even want one as a cum dumpster. Of course giving the vibe that they WON'T be anything close to that, yes, will make them less enthusiastic to meet if he feels he "could do better".

But I don't think liking someone merely as a cum dumpster is the main case for that lack-of-interest-before-meeting. It could be a reason underneath it all, sure. But unfortunately, there's many others -- and it isn't restricted to guys lacking interest before meeting. Guys could only WISH that when women do the same, that they themselves just wanted a cum dumpster - lol. Much of the time, it's just lack of interest -- before any thoughts/game-plan about cumming or dumpster diving would have been had. :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 22 (view)
Not Enthusiastic About Meeting
Posted: 6/8/2015 11:21:11 AM

Some guys were saying that they ask women out they are not enthusiastic about meeting, and then decide not to meet with said woman because something better comes along. For me, that does not compute, so I'd be more interested in hearing about this.

How does that not compute? It's a pretty basic concept. :)

Like in sports -- many will "take what the defense gives them". If they're online and mining for dates, after a while, a gal who's a 5/10 is worthy of talking -- why the hell not, he thinks. She has a couple good attributes. Not my "type" per se. Even though she's overweight, she has a pretty face or other attributes that are attractive. I'll roll with her. Haven't had a date in a while. Maybe some action will be had. Etc etc.

Then it sinks in: "Naw, don't want to do this. I'm not that into her."

It's not just guys who do this. Girls, too. Many times a guy will be at the bar, and exchange #s with a gal. They mingled well and seemingly flowed pretty well, smiled, had a good time with each other. His friends could read interest off of her when observing. He possibly even gave her a kiss. But he texts her the next day but she doesn't respond -- or does but she's always busy and whatnot -- and nothing formulates.

Why is this? Because one's interest level is not going to the be the same at all times. Even on looks. One can be in the gray-zone, but after it sinks in -- ehh, not interested Enough to change my plans and make room for them. Or they put a few things together and be less interested given this-and-that about them, and remember that to actually start dating someone, they'll need more. But when at the bar, or casually scoping online? Yeah, in that pocket of time there's SOMETHING. But not enough to actually start Seeing them.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 168 (view)
What's with recently separated men online dating?
Posted: 6/8/2015 11:08:08 AM

I am separated and have been for a while, lots going on to get thru this, but we are done.

Lots going on? People don't want baggage...

My situation is for medical issues and finances ..... My wife has a boyfriend and lives separate from me.

At some point, if you expect to be a fully-fledged dating option, you gotta get the Divorce, man. You signed up for this with a marriage contract. SO many people will have their reasons for an on-going separation for years. Yes, many times they are not a couple -- true. But that's not the ONLY issue. Potential Baggage dealing with it. It's not one's duty to sit down and analyze you for a long time to make sure it'd work out to be a couple with you.

Sure, if a gal said to you "I'd bet $1,000 you and she are still a couple and/or there'd be helluva lot of baggage I'd have to deal with," then OK, they're an a-hole. :) But they don't have to be much sure at all -- they aren't obligated to deal with it. A gal instead could say "I'd bet $1,000 that if I take 5 random guys from online who have are separated and aren't in position to sign divorce papers, there's going to be a lot of issues & baggage with several of them; hence, I don't got there," ya can't blame them for that. :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 27 (view)
spontaneous v premeditated dating
Posted: 6/8/2015 10:54:23 AM

Spontaneous dating has to me, been the most intense experiences, lots of passion, but lots of game playing.
Premeditated gives me the nerves, I want to get over it and try, but keep the passion and ditch the games.

Premeditated dating -- going to a dating service or online site, or being set up by others. I understand that it operates in a different gear in the very beginning. The best way to get rid of your fears/nerves is:

- Realize there's No Big Expectations

- Meet QUICK. Don't talk much online before meeting. Shed the premeditated aura to it that way.

- Realize it's actually not any more "premeditated" than meeting someone at the bar. He premeditatively walked up to you, feeling out your interest & dating status if you met him at the bar. He knew what he was doing, you're still going to go thru those initial dates weighing the pros & cons to see if he's worthy of being an item with (or a quick hop in the sack)... Same Thing! It's a premeditated move when a guy comes up to you at a bar or an event where people mingle. If he has 'game', he'll make it Feel like "Oh, one thing led to another and viola, we exchanged #s and I'm going to take her out." But no, he was eying you and picturing you naked -- and it was all a premeditated goal.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 141 (view)
Another cheap tipper
Posted: 6/8/2015 10:46:59 AM

that's what a beautiful woman with an appealing personality and a hypnotizing rack will do to me.

So are you reneging on your position of paying for a low-key 1st-meetup date, even if the gal is taking the concept of the guy paying for granted? That's what happened in that situation. With your real estate agent, you paid a Huge bill on a glorified date-LIKE experience. I assume she had a very hypnotizing rack as well? lol
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 91 (view)
Affairs: Would you ever get together with a married person?
Posted: 6/8/2015 10:26:15 AM

I do not think I would ever have an affair with a married person.
I would be lying to myself as well as to others.
I could be hurting myself more than anyone else.

Lying to yourself? Like imagining that they aren't married? That's not a requirement. :) And hurting yourself More than them? I think there's more potential for the couple to be hurt, although if it's at the point where the wife is on an online dating site or at the bar looking for dudes to pork her -- it's already crumbling and is Already Cheating.

One may ask, "what about her innocent husband?" I've actually given that some thought and decided that he is probably better off either divorcing or distrusting his faithless and disloyal wife from here on out.

Well, he was better off divorcing her before the point of pumping her vag. But there's also a good chance he's cheated on her to some degree by that point where she's going out on the prowl and you run into her.

IMO, I wouldn't feel Guilty in most situations. For me to feel guilty, I would have to know or feel that their marriage or LTR was generally decent -- and she wasn't ever going to cheat if it wasn't for me -- all while her husband/boyfriend was not cheating, nor has there ever been any cheating between them. In essence, if I'm "breaking the seal" in cheating by either party, in what has been an otherwise OK relationship. Thankfully, the chances of that are small.

If it's not me, it's going to be someone else if I'm meeting her from online or I'm in Vegas whooping it up. If they are taken I'll flirt and all, but I won't be laying out any seductive gameplan or expecting anything to formulate. If She ends up reeling Me in -- all while there's no rarely held knowledge that they have a great relationship and she's shaking it up -- I would feel No Guilt. It's not her first time at that rodeo, she's going to be cheating on him whether it be by me or someone else -- and I'm in no position to assume that her husband/boyfriend is some innocent victim who hasn't been running his own gig once in a while.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 378 (view)
Independence VS Interdependance
Posted: 6/8/2015 9:58:04 AM

Read EB White

That's such a short name! I need more words, man! ;) Okay, I see the blogosphere that this turned into is making some eyes roll, so I'll try to cut mine down and narrow the scope to the core of it... (But no, it doesn't mean this is going to be a Small post lol)

why would I go exclusive if I could hardly see them?
Because you click, because you want her and not a lifestyle

So why would you expect a guy to go exclusive if you can't see him much?
I dont, nor do I expect a guy to want to date me

Two conflicting answers to the same question, generally. Which is one of the important parts of this whole thing. After all, if both people had tons o free time and no rugrats, hit it off right off the bat and saw each other just a day or so later and then shortly after that, etc -- and were like peas & carrots while having no other worthy options on the table -- sure, I could see an exclusive Agreement had quite quickly. But if one's not that available to see each other, the other shouldn't Be Expected to roll with it no questions asked!

You don't want to bring it up, because you're scared of it rocking the boat, so to speak.

Hmm? Now is it Im scared or is it you want to get away with more?

No. See, if I have a date that rolls well with a new gal, and one thing leads to another and we do more than just kiss at the end of it, and she cries foul or gets pissed in the not so distant future that I'm not as interested as she wanted (or 'demanded') me to be because we had sexual relations of some sort... or upset that no, I don't consider us Exclusive so quickly and she does Because we fooled around to whatever degree -- that's all on Her. Her "silent rule".

A guy will run into that type of crazy woman if he has a lot of dating experience. Her problem is that she Expects, no questions asked, that if you physically entangle with the other, you're an item or something. Heck no! Her head's in the clouds! A guy can be that way too (notably when she's out of his league). Why didn't she say something earlier? Well, BOTH people many times really wouldn't LIKE to talk about it, as it could be a bit of a mood ruiner -- but the ball's in HER court. SHE is the one to declare something -- not me. Only a crazy person would assume that just because one-thing-led-to-another and you went well past kissing that you're "poof" -- magically Exclusive.

But also -- why not talk about it? For the same reason there is NO such 'rule' by default -- it's Too Early.

Because if you have had sex, this is really the main option or should be. Why jeapodise it for options that you have no idea if they would be good or not because they are just options

But they're not really that much more of "just an option" than the one you let one-thing-led-to-another with.

Whos history?

Those with enough dating experience. Or even 2nd-hand living vicariously thru active dating friends. :)

Ok, my rule is, I enjoy sex, Im happy to engage in sex and see where things go, but it needs to be exclusive. If you want options then have them, dont have sex with me.

No, what you need to do is Declare that. There is no assumed, silent 'rule'. The ball's in Your Court to announce it -- not the other way around.

Then I would question whether or not you are actually into these girls if your easily swayed away?

I'm not "all in" (analogy of playing poker with chips) so Early on usually, no. OR I actually may be TOO into a gal, but for preventative protection of my emotion, I will still keep my options open as she is doing too by default. Fooling around early on, by default, does not make you exclusive. If you want exclusivity really early on (sex or no sex had), the ball's in Your court to announce it and make a deal.

That's really what this boils down to. You hold a belief that it's Such a Given, that if you fool around really early on, you Are Exclusive -- no talking about it required. And I have the position of common sense: No, you're not Automatically Exclusive. Whether you went well past 2nd base or only kept things to a goodnight kiss for the mere few dates -- it's of no difference -- there's no assumed exclusivity by the sane. Wanting exclusivity may be asking too much, but if one wants it so early on, they have to step forward and declare that if they want any level of exclusivity.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 21 (view)
Why set up dates with no follow through?
Posted: 6/6/2015 5:11:06 PM

What type of woman do you feel is out of your league? Do you ask women out that you're not enthusiastic about meeting? Why?

The type of women that it'd At Least be hard-as-hell to get a "Yes" from (based on her looks & status). It's not an exact science or observation, but it's good to do. When people find out they never get asked out by those they "hint hint" to get asked out by, or won't say 'Yes' to a date .... when a pattern emerges, you either have egg on your face that ya didn't know about, or they're out of your league.

I'll ask women out that I'm not Enthusiastic about at certain points in time. Why? Hormones. But then, ehhh, what am I thinking? I'm not that interested (hormones wearing off a bit)... or she says something that makes me realize that it'd be Relationship-or-nothing for anything physical to happen... or better options come along!
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 555 (view)
What I am looking for is a man who has a slim/slender build
Posted: 6/6/2015 5:04:36 PM

1. Being unfaithful: you either get over it or you don't, details won't provide relief.

Well, you would talk about it though, right? I would say the positive of not talking about it (mentioning it) would be to avoid disaster. As in -- don't tell the wife that you banged the babysitter if the babysitter's going to keep her mouth shut! :)

But once it's known -- yeah, I think they should talk about it. Some forms of cheating are more forgivable than others. Not all of it is simply banging the babysitter (although that's a common fantasy lol).

3. Mentioning the loss of a child to their mother, why the shanking?

You're right. Last time I was babysitting I lost one of the mother's children. I am NOT mentioning that ever again. Instead of me saying "Yeah, I don't know where Timmy is. I brought him back here from the park. I figured he just went to his room...", I mistakenly told her I lost him at the park. Boy was she mad! Ain't talking about what happened the next time it happens! :)

I think communication about a problem is a good thing. I think talking about it too much after it's hit a certain point is where it's run out of steam.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 367 (view)
Independence VS Interdependance
Posted: 6/6/2015 2:49:13 PM

I would consider my options of getting out, dating and meeting people to be on quite a low scale, but it would still only take me two weeks

ONLY 2 weeks? Being able to go out ONLY every 2 weeks makes it sounds like you're treating it as going to an amusement park! :) Going out every 2 weeks is extremely bare bones! I would be a fool to go exclusive with a gal when I could only really experience a good amount of time with her every two weeks. I understand that as you become bf/gf, you'd be seeing each other more on non-'date' affairs, but until I would be able to see them in QT more than once a week normally -- why would I go exclusive if I could hardly see them?

Its not so much Im expecting the world to revolve around me its more about being aware of my limits and trying to make the best of the situation.

It think a good amount is expecting guys to go that route though. You see merely having sex off the bat as exclusivity By Default, no questions needed. You scratch your head and raise an eyebrow at those who wouldn't. Even if you can't see them very often, or aren't in position to see them that often.

I think the marker for going exclusive is when you don't need any 'dates' to see them, and you don't make any Plans to see them -- and you can see them a lot.

Yes I know, its not appealling. I get frustrated with it too.

So why would you expect a guy to go exclusive if you can't see him much? Because sex was had? I can understand a "Hey, we had sex. I don't like people having SEX with more than one person at a time." OK. Only 1 bedroom visitor within the same time frame, generally speaking. That's something one can understand, even though when it's early And you can't see them much, there could be some technical exceptions people may bring up etc etc -- but in a nutshell -- yeah, I can understand that being something Reasonable. But that's far and away different than "Yeah I know it's only one of our first few dates and we can't see each other often -- but because we had sex -- you have to drop all your options. Not that I'm asking something unique out of you.. this is how it SHOULD be, otherwise YOU are the weird one." :)

Firstly, I dont ask as I dont discuss it I just expect it so he would not be aware of it.

You should! That's the point. Otherwise, you're expecting the world to revolve around your ideals. You have to recognize Your Way is out in left field. Thus, you need to bring it up to him. You're not because you're SCARED to (it ruining the mood or hearing something you don't want to hear, etc).

Your friend with the ga ga girlfriend can, Im confident that you would as well?

She wasn't his GF. They were nearing that point, which is why I told him NOT to *start* having sex if he wasn't into her, since he held that off. Second, can do what? "Detect" whether someone can manage casual sex and those who can't? His issue wasn't about juggling people. He never had enough luck in dating to deal with that anyway. In that story, his was about Starting sex with someone who he was seeing but wasn't that into.

If someone has an active social life the 2 week wait to establish the relationship should be easier.

But their prospects aren't just throw-away toys. I mean, it could be at that point. But also -- why throw away all options because you hit it off on a date initially and/or had sex real early? Nothing concrete's been established! It's EASIER for those who don't have any other options readily available at the time. Nothing to sacrifice.

I get Im not an appealing option for dating

And I think that's what pushes your staunch belief that if you do have sex with a guy "early" -- that he should be exclusive, no questions asked. Your schedule & restrictions makes you a not so appealing dating option -- so you not just want, but EXPECT and DEMAND that a guy drops all other options and such because of that. Never mind the availability to see each other and where you're at in the real dating timeline -- it's all about if you did the deed in the bedroom? No. Again, I can understand not wanting one to be consistently swapping 2+ people in and out of the sheets in a given timeline. But dropping all options and becoming Exclusive? Too little to gamble on.

Yes I agree. But then how many times do you see in forums 'I thought we were an item but he still has a profile' and everyone saying 'hes a player, dump him'.

Exactly. Many times they're fools thinking they were an item just because they had sex! OR they never even made it past 1st base hardly, but went on G-rated "dates". OR of course, they Were bf/gf and he's a cheater - lol. Many different reasons for that.

Bummer, damn thats hard. So exactly how long did it take to pick up again? I need a time frame, months? years?

Again, the lesson learned is that he shouldn't have done it in the first place -- even IF they worked out for an LTR, it would be unnecessary at that point. If one has a potentially good prospect, they don't ditch them because another POTENTIALLY good prospect and he did more than making out in the parking lot and foolishly thinking they're going to be BF/GF riding off into the sunset. Only a fool who has good potential prospects would light them all on fire MERELY because they had a good date and action had early.

Ok, but you know a gf isnt a ball to be passed around the team, that may only apply to sport.

That's not how the analogy goes. Not a ball. A person. It's WHO you're "covering" when man-to-man. Zone is covering an area where people are. For instance, when 100% single and online, newly single -- 99.9% of men & women play or expect others will be playing ZONE. Meaning, they'll be writing to multiple people at one time who they never met. MOST people also let that extend when it comes to Initial dates! And when you and someone else have started to Truly Establish something (no, JUST a roll in the hay doesn't count) -- THEN you go man-to-man (exclusive).

The rest arent really options because you really want that one, anything else your just settling for the 'lesser option' IMO.

SOMETIMES. But many times, there's more than 1 good prospect you're juggling. The one I'm on a date with -- wow, she seems great. There's another one I had a date with before who seemed great too. Not a rarity.

How would this work? [be an item/exclusive and not be in a BF/GF relationship]

What YOU have been proclaiming! Just because you have sex and hardly been on any dates -- you want to go Exclusive! No, you're not BF/GF that early on, but sure, you can set up RULES at any point, even before meeting.

your calling it a childhood crush, Im calling it two adults who want to each other.

Just because I really like a girl, doesn't mean it's a crush. A crush is something that strikes a chord. It doesn't at all require us to have gone out on a date with them or even really knowing them. Just a "Wow." A different chord strikes. It's strong, but it just by itself doesn't have a lot of substance underneath it all. However, if you are going out on dates with them the amount of substance will build of course... and it becomes less a crush over time, too.

I dont understand what you are saying here. Are you saying you have experienced a lot of dating and a lot of dating has turned out bad?

No, not at all. It's going off topic about how a crush is technically different than (merely) genuinely liking someone.

Yeah Ive heard this a lot, Ive never really seen it. Usually groups of both women and men are of similar attraction levels.

Not every group has a DUFF. But it's somewhat common. Certainly not rare. Bigger the group, the more apt to be a DUFF. Most of the group is on the same level of attraction, but one isn't. She's chubby while the others are thin/slender. Others are real cute, but she has a big schnoze of a nose (not so pretty face). Kind of like 1 sticking out as the Attractive one, you'll many times see 1 sticking out as the Lesser attractive one. They don't have to be ugly! They can still be kinda cute. It's just compared to the others.

A classic case is the "Mamma Bear". She plays "momma" looking out for her girls. She drinks less keeping her security-guard wits up, but man, you can tell she eats more! :)

But, if your really into her, drop your options else she's likely to dump you and be another one of those you wished you hadnt let get away ;)

Having other options is Rarely going to make a girl "get away". I guess if you live in a small town where everybody knows everybody else, OK. Of course rumor mills run rampant in those parts, so you'd also have to watch out for that, but I digress. I certainly wouldn't want to drop good options for a gal who I hit it off with. That's where HISTORY comes into play. You can't help it that sometimes you have more than 1 good option at once. Or while maintaining 1, another newbie comes along. Shoo'ing away newbies and sticking to just that 1 because of a great date and/or roll in the hay so early on -- I've shot myself in the foot doing that. Because she's going to have a lot of options, too. Better ones than me. :)
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 206 (view)
Together forever, no marriage, separate homes
Posted: 6/5/2015 4:00:43 PM

Living apart and only seeing each other on weekends / vacations keeps the relationship fresh and more exciting.

Yeah, I'll try to convince the next gal I start becoming an item with that rationale. That way, I'd have time to see multiple women! ;) [Joking of course]
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 43 (view)
Foul language and the over 40 age group
Posted: 6/5/2015 3:48:27 PM

I don't mind "shit" or "bloody" but the c word and others, total turnoff.

I heard cvnt is more an American thing. Kind of like "bloody" isn't a bad word here in America, but "cvnt" is like the biggest "Oh no you didnt!" remark ever devised by mankind. I have no idea why. I many other places it's taken on the same level as calling someone an a$$hole (just mildly 'bad').

It's weird how certain words are Sooooo "bad". Thing is, they become bad IF they're shyed away from, which is exactly what conservative folks want. It makes them Worse to shy away from them. Just like "sh!t". That USED to be a really BAD word. Now, they can do it on regular cable TV here, where it used to be banned. Why? It has less "sting" to it because over time people used it more frequently.

So actually using a bad word frequently makes it LOSE it's negative pizzaz. It should be the foul-mouthed people who should be telling other people NOT to use such strong terms -- because if it becomes too common, they themselves will lose their schtick!
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 86 (view)
dating whilst having a FWB
Posted: 6/5/2015 3:37:15 PM

But the main thing here is that your hopefully protected sex is with someone you have the potential to develop a relationship with in the near future. Having sex with an ex or other fwb is very harmful because it desensitizes oneself to sex

I think protected sex desensitizes oneself to sex. Seriously! Every time I whip out the mini lawn & leaf bag and wrap it around my johnson, the more sex just seems like watching a movie outside in a tree thru binoculars looking into someone's window. Yeah, I'm experiencing it... but I'm living vicariously thru the lawn & leaf bag! ;)

I smell a troll.

Do trolls have a certain scent, tho? Do they have wings? Or fangs? Doesn't using the term "troll" offend midgets?
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 123 (view)
Second page and still no answer??
Posted: 6/5/2015 12:57:26 PM

We haven't been regular texting since he blew me off last weekend. I ignored the one text he sent. Saturday night I will just be blocking and deleting him. I don't have time for his headgamws anymore. Hopefully I find someone decent here soon :/

Don't delete him quite yet. Find a guy on POF, put your sexy/seductive hat on, and have hot sex. Take pictures & videos of it. You'll be using this guy for sex, but trust me -- he won't mind. Get a guy from out of town if need be. Maybe from Olney perhaps -- and tell him to bring a white squirrel with him too - lol.

Then send the pics & videos to the chump. Caption them by saying "You missed out on this. I enjoyed every tasty minute of it." After you send some over to him over time via Snapshot (ensuring he's seen them), Then delete & block him. He'll be sitting there thinking "WTF? I could have had that. Even the white squirrel's getting action that I missed out on!"
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 365 (view)
Independence VS Interdependance
Posted: 6/5/2015 12:32:04 PM

Well see, my reason for thinking this as I have explained is that if it doesnt work its easy enough to get someone else.

Yeah, that's nice & fitting if one didn't have any other options they were in contact with leading up to the 1st or 2nd date hitting it off... PLUS not that socially available in going out so there's little to no chance any more good options may come their way. A classic example is a working single parent who, by their own schedule, can only feasibly go out once every two weeks with maybe a short lunch outing embedded in there. It'd be an extremely Biased view to think the whole world should revolve around their limited way of (social) life. If I'm in that position, Yeah, I would totally Prefer that if I hit it off on one of the initial dates with a gal that she shut down all other options and push away any that come her way, while only being able to see her 1.333 times every 2 weeks (saying a lunch outing roughly equaling 1/3rd of a full fledged weekend 'date').

Again, blowing off all other options (this is why people complain online -- why did he/she just disappear?!) should happen only when things have truly solidified with someone. Someone asking the other to do that just because they hit it off on a mere initial date is asking too much, if said person has at least a somewhat active social life.

Now, there is still a chance that it wont work but if it doesnt, its easy enough to get another?

There's a decent chance things won't work because an initial date went well. Is it "easy" to get another? Maybe maybe not. But the key point is, you're asking someone flush away all other dating options for You so early. I can understand not "mining" for new options... although new options may come one's way. And when it isn't so "easy" for everyone, that's something to not just ignore. It bears more weight. Just as you want to look out for Yourself and wish that guys would not be juggling to any degree any other gals if you merely had a great date with the guy -- the guys are, and should, be looking out for Themselves and not ditch all existing potential suitors because they had a great date with one. Why? History. History tells us that we can hit it off with a gal early on, but when we drop all other options, it many times comes to bite us in the a$$.

Also, how has anyone got enough time to date multiple people?

That's the key point to this mismatch of ideals. Yes, some people do. Especially when one gal's a single mom, does fitness classes, tends to her parents house, etc -- and you could only see her once every 10 days when you're not any BF/GF, even tho you seem to be hitting it off quite well. Same goes with another gal who may be an option of his. He can have time to date many who aren't so available, while he doesn't have kids, little custody time, or kids grown up enough -- all while he doesn't work a ton or have structured hobbies/activities soaking up his clock. Some people don't even have enough time to date at all! Some have a lot! Asking someone to conform to theirs to "make it fair" isn't fair if it was just a great date.

Can I ask, if you had a girl you was ga ga about and she you. Then you kept your options open and she ended it because of that. Wouldnt that bother you?

If she asked right from the get-go? To be honest, I'd lie. Not a bald-faced lie... but knowing that my focal point would be on her anyway (me being ga-ga about her and seeing it the same way from her) -- I would think that's kind of unfair and too much to ask. It would also dampen my ga-ga-ness about her in some way for at least a little bit. I would tell her that history goes both ways -- dropping all potential options that exist or may happen to come one's way can work out for you if the other person does it, but not work out for you if you do it, etc. I would tell her I'll put everything else on hold though because I really like her. Where the "lie" comes in -- I would hold off on the dating site I found her on, or the place(s) she goes to where I found her from in terms of approaching girls -- but I would make sure keep the "funnel" churning as protection. I'll explain in a second...

Ah, you friend is sounding like a nice guy, Im liking him a lot.

Yeah, he's a classic Mr Nice Guy. But with him and I talking about dating, I've had to remind him and he's got burned by "dropping all options". How many times do you see in the forums someone talk about hitting it off with someone then Poof -- they disappear, are always busy, or lose interest with no real reason to peg it on? That happens. He's been burned the same way, and had to "start from scratch" because he ditched his potentials leading up to it, avoided a 2nd or 3rd date with a gal here or there -- and I would remind him, which accepted: "PLAY ZONE, *not* MAN TO MAN!" It's a sports reference in defense. You don't defend just one guy -- you cover a zone. You don't just stick to one girl because a date went well. It's going to suck More if she blows ya off after you hit it off when you Don't have at least Any Potential options in the mix somewhere. Plus, you also regret losing out on the ones you had brewing before but ended.

Ok, well I dont think Im saying it [sex] ensures a relationship.

Well, you can be an item/exclusive and not be in a BF/GF relationship. One will mistakenly think they'll be an item (ie exclusive) just because they had sex. A small few will think they'll automatically be BF/GF, but that's rare.

What Im saying is, if I have sex and he wants to continue dating others then I would end it, definately. I would expect him to know that, its a respect thing.

I understand that when you're on the cusp of Dating. But if on the 2nd date that was a week and a half after the 1st date -- whether you stop it at kissing in the parking lot, or get naked and you two pork away -- it's still too early to drop all other options altogether and go 1-on-1. That's WHY some people advocate "don't have sex too early". Too early? Too early generally means Before you've established yourselves enough where it's reasonable/understandable you wouldn't be seeing other people. Substituting what you establish between you two, over time & things marinating between you two -- with sex -- is the mistake.

Really? [Crushes being uncommon for me] is that because you are always aiming for the most attractive, the best option, the perfect relationship?

No. I think it's because I'm more of a realist. Not a pessimist! But it takes a lot for a childhood crush feeling to set in after lots of dating experience. When you experience many of those either turning bad or just not working out so fantasy-land -- yeah. The least experienced one is in dating, the more True crush feelings they'll get. I'm not calling really Liking someone a crush. That's different. A Crush is different & more intense.

I also get the impression you may go for insecure girls?

No, not attracted to those. If she's hot, it'd be good for a roll in the hay, but no -- Definitely not for continual dating, let alone a Relationship!

What I have seen is a small group of girls, usually four, of around about similar attractiveness (this indicates confidence). Now one will be predominately better looking and will bring in the men, she will get her pick but often its her looks she relies on not her personality.

If we're going by people-watching -- there'll many times be a "DUFF" in the mix of a group of gals. The "Designated Ugly Fat Friend". A recent movie called DUFF came out. Check it out. The DUFF doesn't have to truly be Fat. It just fits the acronym well. It's that she's comparatively not nearly as attractive as the others. She can talk to the other guys for them, or guys can talk to her as the go-between. The DUFF can also c0ck-block guys getting her hot friends. Also can be known as "Mama Bear". :)

But many gals who are hot don't lack personality. They can, but social myth (to make lesser looking people feel better) that exaggerates it. Plenty of Good looking gals who aren't lacking in anything that average to homely looking gals have.

But bottom line: Especially when you hit it off pretty well with someone on a 1st or 2nd date -- play "ZONE", not "Man to Man" (1-on-1), to avoid being too invested on too little. Many times one WON'T have any other real options, though. But don't Expect being 1-on-1 with someone just because you had an awesome date and/or had sex. The necessary ingredient for an Assumed By Default 1-on-1 situation with someone is having Established yourselves thru many fruitful dates & communication in-between, etc. Sex isn't a substitute for that, in an ill attempt at making one an item/exclusive super-quick.
Joined: 10/27/2014
Msg: 37 (view)
2nd Date no kiss...Update!!
Posted: 6/5/2015 11:19:13 AM

Letting a little tension build was once normal behavior, and still is for some, at least the people I date are aware not to get physical too soon. Slowing it down is not only an art form its wise to let emotions catch up and to also not get physically attached and find out you aren't compatible. Too much t.v. and instant gratification has programmed our culture to be a bit lacking in finesse these days.

It's the "art form" of Playing Games, actually. I can see on a daytime 1st date/meetup, or a small initial coffee date in the evening not positioning oneself for a kiss or anything. That's fine. Said person may be going on a lot of 1st dates and doesn't want to be kissing every guy as even though they're attractive enough for one, they don't want to give them the wrong impression since things are still up in the air, juggling all their dating options while said initial date itself was just a quick or daytime one.

But you're treating a kiss like it's an 8th-grade-makeout-jam-session at a drive-in! It's just a kiss. It doesn't have to be all-out french kissing, hands groping, etc. Sheesh. It can be the kind of kiss that you'll see couples do when one's on their way out the door to work.

Those who hold off from any kissing for several dates are just shooting themselves in the foot if they're actual dates. There's no better "honor" in not kissing. Not kissing doesn't make one on a higher plane at all. In fact, holding an anti-kissing rule covering the first several dates is on a Lower plane, if anything (not counting that does & should nix otherwise decent opportunities). It's playing games -- not for the sense of self-control over things "getting physical"... but for the sense of Feeling in control over the other person and/or the situation.

Because such a tone set is putting/pushing things into the "friends first" Game-playing mode. Such role-playing games are for those who want control, free dinners, attention for their esteem, etc.
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